SIR Disease Mafia - Game Over!

[Blair]

Greetings! This appears to be the largest game I've participated in for a while now.

I'll do my best to catch up but good lord is this a long thread already. Judging from the most recent vote count, the preeminent wagons so far today appear to be Quick, Jake, and Not Voting.

I would greatly appreciate if representatives from those wagons could post a concise summary of why those fellows are abhorrent, lecherous scum - especially those of you voting for this Not Voting fellow. I haven't read anything yet but I have a firm townread on Not Voting so that will be a particularly tough sell.

I'll start my catchup with the but Oka recommended (thanks, Oka). If there are any other particularly juicy bits, please direct me to them.

[Blair]

Damn it now I have to read all of Quick's posts on Day 1.

[Blair]

Update: I've read Oka's recommendation and I checked my own slot's ISO to figure out why I was voting for mastina.

Unfortunately, my slot was dumb and its reads make no sense.

Jake wagon makes a LOT of sense, although I kind of agree with what others have said about it being a pretty disappointing reason to flip a slot.

VOTE: Jake

As far as I can tell, Jake was pretty plainly lying about a verifiable game mechanic - which might be forgivable if it weren't for the fact that

he also lied about having verified the verifiable game mechanic.

That's so cut and dry that I feel like anyone voting for someone other than Jake not only needs to explain why the person they're voting for is scummy, but also how on earth they could be scummier than Jake.

With that in mind: Why is Quick scummier than Jake?

[Blair]

Please don't read any of Mastina's wallposts either!

[Blair]

Quick, go back to voting Oka for a sec so I don't feel like I'm wasting everybody's time when I ask, "Quick, why are you voting for Oka? I read your vote-post but I didn't get it."

Once that formality is behind us, resume lynching the caught scum. Kthxbye

[Blair]

Quick is voting in his top townread bloc btw

Meh. Quick hammered me out of his top townread bloc once. Not sure what's even real anymore.

[Blair]

Mastina's push on Aristophanes is good. I'll add that to the pile Good Things That Happened™

[Blair]

I was also scumreading Creature before I remembered I am Creature

[Blair]

"Quick, why are you voting for Oka? I read your vote-post but I didn't get it."

[Blair]

There are a lot of bad votes in this game.

Is this one of those, "We're only taking it half-seriously," games?

[Blair]

1. Please spoiler massive quote walls.

2. That was a pretty weak vote. Thank you for moving it.

[Blair]

Hi Aristophanes!

I won't bother asking why you're voting for Quick - you said enough for me to get the gist. I will ask why you aren't voting for Jake, though.

That one seemed pretty cut and dry, what am I missing?

[Blair]

This is one of the worst catch-ups I have ever seen.
FOS

Say more.

[Blair]

Blair is new Creature

*and improved

[Blair]

I mean

Do you think people shouldn't be compelled to take a public stance on Jake?

[Blair]

Question: Is the distinction between original mafia and infected something that should be factoring into whom we ultimately vote for?

If I am understanding the setup correctly, we don't really win by lynching infected, right?

[Blair]

I remember asking when I first sub'd in why Quick and Jake were wagons.

The Jake wagon was explained.

I don't remember the Quick wagon being explained. Is it the usual "He's spamming the thread with ambiguous, intentionally enigmatic questions and he doesn't explain or take any personal responsibility for his reads?"

[Blair]

VOTE: TrueSoulEnergy

Vecna's ISO is 95% reactive IIoA noise and TSE's posts have done nothing to improve the slot.

Jake's deal makes the most sense to me if he's infected. I'll go ahead and claim my role now because it doesn't seem like it will be very useful if I don't telegraph my night actions publicly, and it will be an insignificant loss if I'm killed.

I'm a Frail Partygoer.

Frail = I die immediately if I'm infected. Partygoer = I have to visit one player each night. If I visit an infected player I become infected and die. I asked the mod what my Night 1 visit was and it was Jake, so at least we know he wasn't infected when I visited him Night 1. I'll visit him again tonight.

Of course, scum could infect me tonight so I die and frame Jake, but... I think it will actually be more telling if that doesn't happen.

I also asked the mod if I become infected by visiting members of the original three mafia and the answer was "No."

This concludes my TedTalk™.

[Blair]

Vecna's ISO is 95% reactive IIoA noise

and TSE's posts have done nothing to improve the slot.

I believe the opposite - that there's a lot of gamesolving in his posts. Detail to me how he was IIoA-ing and not solving.

I'm not sure how to "detail" it for you without a giant multi-quote wall, and I'm on mobile so that's going to be a hard-pass from me. Basically, I see a lot of Vecna commenting on site meta, speculating that some things might be TvT but maaaaybeeee nottttt and a lot of goading on interactions between other players without meaningfully contributing to those interactions. Early Day 1 was especially Stark in this regard.

I'm confident if you skim Vecna's ISO with the above in mind, you'll see where I'm coming from. I suspect you had a particular interaction with Vecna at some point that gave you the impression that he was game solving, and I can respect that, but I do not believe that is the case in the big picture.

[Blair]

I'm a Frail Partygoer.

Frail = I die immediately if I'm infected. Partygoer = I have to visit one player each night. If I visit an infected player I become infected and die. I asked the mod what my Night 1 visit was and it was Jake, so at least we know he wasn't infected when I visited him Night 1. I'll visit him again tonight.

Do you know if it would trigger if you visit someone who is infected that night? As in, are you certain Jake wasn't infected night 1, but you visited him before that in action resolution?

Good claim btw.

I'll find out.

[Blair]

95% was hyperbole.

It was a lot of fluff, though.

[Blair]

I'm a Frail Partygoer.

Frail = I die immediately if I'm infected. Partygoer = I have to visit one player each night. If I visit an infected player I become infected and die. I asked the mod what my Night 1 visit was and it was Jake, so at least we know he wasn't infected when I visited him Night 1. I'll visit him again tonight.

Do you know if it would trigger if you visit someone who is infected that night? As in, are you certain Jake wasn't infected night 1, but you visited him before that in action resolution?

Good claim btw.

I'll find out.

Update: My role resolves before an infection, in the event they occur on the same player in the same night.

[Blair]

Are you going to continue to push this?

Stay tuned!

Seriously, what was the aim of this question? Was I supposed to say "Yes" or were you hoping I'd say "No, my scumhunting is fake, you have caught scum, here is your scumhunting tiara"?

[Blair]

Tchill, lynching lurkers is good but lynching scum is better.

Vote TSE with me as we march steadfastly toward a resounding town victory!

[Blair]

I would suggest you ask the mod anyway.

[Blair]

Mastina is prob-town for picking this hill to die on, by the way.

[Blair]

Or maybe your role specifies that interaction because that interaction is exceptional in the setup?

[Blair]

EBWOP: @mastina

[Blair]

^ Bad post is bad.

[Blair]

I'm guessing specific interactions (other than visiting an infected player and immediately dying, which WAS mentioned) were left out because my role pm was already so long due to my role being compulsive, which required a long explanation of the system by which my compulsive visits were guaranteed.

[Blair]

You think Mastina 1v1s me here as scum, Quick?

[Blair]

Mastina is arguing that my role and her role are mutually exclusive.

When I flip and my role is verified, Mastina has placed herself in the unenviable position of walking back her own argument to avoid scumreading herself.

[Blair]

scum!Mastina does not place herself in that position willingly.

Unless she's infected and the infected don't know the scum team, I guess, but even then she risks outing original scum with arguments like this. Plus we don't want to prioritize lynching infected.

Mastina is prob-town for this push.

[Blair]

Pretty sure it's TvT, Quick.

Mastina is assuming that everyone's roles are formatted similarly, which is apparently false - unless a bunch of scum just outed themselves unnecessarily.

[Blair]

mastina I think you should drop this.

listen to ur scum buddy!

This is a hot take.

[Blair]

Blair, why was it important to roleclaim?

1.)

I'll go ahead and claim my role now because it doesn't seem like it will be very useful if I don't telegraph my night actions publicly, and it will be an insignificant loss if I'm killed.

2.) Because I thought at the time that it would illuminate something about the leading wagon on Jake.

[Blair]

Role PM is a PM in relation to your role. Clarifications to your original role are still role PMs--just not the ORIGINAL role PM.

[Blair]

Someone cure mastina tonight pl0x.

[Blair]

I'll go ahead and claim my role now because it doesn't seem like it will be very useful if I don't telegraph my night actions publicly, and it will be an insignificant loss if I'm killed.

2.) Because I thought at the time that it would illuminate something about the leading wagon on Jake.

What did you think it would illuminate on Jake?

That he was not infected.

[Blair]

mastina is kinda LAMIST rn.

Any thoughts on that anyone?

She's literally all-capping it at us so yeah

Three points to Griffindor

[Blair]

mastina is kinda LAMIST rn.

Any thoughts on that anyone?

She's literally all-capping it at us so yeah

Three points to Griffindor

I was really hoping anyone but you would react to that...

Today I learned I'm not "anyone."

[Blair]

Can confirm mastina and Blair have not played together under those names.

P-edit: Yes, Nero. I do not believe mastina was original scum.

[Blair]

Question to everyone in this game:

Would you infect me Night 1?

Reasoning would be appreciated, but not necessary.

I’m just seeing if what Quick says actually holds up.

I probably would.

Reason being it would be hysterical.

[Blair]

Mastina, are you accusing Nero of being scum?

If you are not, then what is the purpose of this exchange?

[Blair]

I don't want to know your role, but could it not be possible you -say- KILL the infected? If so, kills resole AFTER the infection, while Visiting resolves before the infection. Come on!

So, uh.

Almost50.

Where'd you get this information from? Because per NAR:

Copy
Hide
Bus Drive
Block
Redirect
Protect
Miscellaneous
Kill
Recruit
Inspect

Kills resolve before recruitments do--and recruitments would be the type of action I'd classify 'infection' as.

Yes, the mod did say they weren't using NAR specifically, so using NAR to say kills come before infection isn't reliable, but I'm using it to say that your information cannot come from NAR.

So where did you get that information? It wasn't from NAR.

New page for higher visibility because this be important.

You seem to have missed his, "If so."

Also, not matching NAR would explain why your role pm made a side note of this particular interaction.

His internal logic is consistent.

[Blair]

For one, you have zero reactions to things you should be reacting to. Why am I Scum? Is it legit what I think because of what I said about the setup (that you contradict, which is actually contradicted because there has only been 1 infected)?

... Quick, you're Quicking again.

Pretend I am an alien lifeform whose only relevant knowledge here is how the internet works, how forum mafia works, and a rudimentary grasp of the English language. How would you explain this to me?

[Blair]

I wouldn't ask if I understood it.

[Blair]

I wouldn't ask if I understood it.

No, you understand me just fine... You just have difficulty believing me or not.

It was a run on sentence with a nested run on sentence inside it and no direct articles.

No one understands it.

[Blair]

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This has been a test of the emergency Blaircast™ system.

[Blair]

Will it hurt your feelings if I say none of those posts look like town tells to me?

[Blair]

Also, where did mastina go and why did she ignore my question?

[Blair]

Somebody test that.

For science.

[Blair]

Quick is establishing a tradition of incorrectly scumreading me in 100% of our games together.

I'm pretty sure he just dislikes me and doesn't understand how that subconsciously impacts his voting patterns, because I am also never the person his "system" suggests he should be voting for.

[Blair]

Lime green is my fav color. Reads soon.

Don't hammer me until I give my info.

Aren't there only four votes on you?

It takes 11 to hammer, you're at L-7. Why even say something like that?

[Blair]

Wait why am I being voted?
I’m legit the only player in the game that can’t be converted.

I'd say, "Reading is hard," here, but you actually quoted my role claim so you evidently did read it.

... Lying is hard?

[Blair]

Scum have the ability to kill an infected player each night.

I'm not sure why he's assuming they will actually do it, though.

[Blair]

It's a pretty unapologetic counterwagon to TSE.

[Blair]

It's a pretty unapologetic counterwagon to TSE.

TSE was a dumb counterwagon to Quick and/or Jake.

If you really believe this, wouldn't it be more prudent for you to be voting for Quick and/or Jake?

[Blair]

Quick, you're doing something in this game that you weren't doing at all in the last completed game we played together.

You were town in that game.

Therefore: Something is different with you in this game. If the variable here is not your alignment, what counter-theory would you propose?

[Blair]

Quick, you're doing something in this game that you weren't doing at all in the last completed game we played together.

You were town in that game.

Therefore: Something is different with you in this game. If the variable here is not your alignment, what counter-theory would you propose?

Let me know when you figure it out.

You know answers like that are the main reason you get lynched all the time, right?

[Blair]

I'm trying to get you to answer a direct question, actually.

Surprisingly difficult, I have to admit.

[Blair]

I'm trying to get you to answer a direct question, actually.

Surprisingly difficult, I have to admit.

That's because there isn't a question there. How many games have you played with me? Different game combinations means I come across differently. You are chasing the wind here trying to resurrect a wagon on me.

I got what I needed from this, thank you.

[Blair]

Party at your place, Quick?

[Blair]

TSE was a dumb counterwagon to Quick and/or Jake.

If you really believe this, wouldn't it be more prudent for you to be voting for Quick and/or Jake?

TSE was a dumb counterwagon to Quick and/or Jake.

says the guy voting not Quick or Jake.

[Blair]

5c. Mafia/Infected Win Condition: Gain parity with the town.
6. Twice per game, mafia may kill any player that they choose. Aside from those two instances, mafia possess the ability to factionally infect a player and to kill an infected player each night.

I'm not convinced that the "slip" is even true. It sounds to me like killing infected players is

optional

for the mafia and, given their win condition, it seems like maybe they wouldn't even want to?

[Blair]

Infected will be pushing randomly and may fail to align with scum, so a bunch of infected people in thread may not allow a favorable outcome (since they can end up lynching each other as well and it feels better for scum to lynch town over infected).

Do we actually know this to be the case?

The idea has been floated a few times by a few different people but I thought that was all setup speculation.

P-edit: I'm sorry to hear that, mastina. For the record, I wasn't complaining about your absence in general, but specifically that I'd asked you a question and then you had posted in the thread directly afterward without answering. I do not wish to give the impression that we are owed your undivided attention when you clearly have other issues on your mind.

[Blair]

Mastina, are you accusing Nero of being scum?

If you are not, then what is the purpose of this exchange?

[Blair]

Why is Aristophanes' vote out of play (again) when they have so many scumreads?

[Blair]

Why is Aristophanes' vote out of play (again) when they have so many scumreads?

Because reads require reformulating in light of new info and discussion, and I have not had a chance to do my Tchill/Quick/Jake deep dive, which I have lost some confidence in since my Jake read has changed anyway.

Would you rather I throw my vote ariund wildly? I can do that, but I see no point in it.

You recalculated enough to unvote but not enough to apply pressure elsewhere.

Would I prefer you "throw [your] vote around wildly?" No. I would prefer you didn't throw your reads around wildly and you used your vote to dig for scum.

I find scum have a higher occurrence in the "Not Voting" column. I would never scumread someone for appearing in that column once, but a pattern? I remember you were one of the only people not voting when I subbed in. Now you are not voting again.

It's a small thing, and I wouldn't exactly call it a "tell," but it's definitely... telling.

VOTE: Aristophanes

[Blair]

Why are you the way you are?

Love you, too.

[Blair]

Thank you for your poignant insights.

[Blair]

Art is what you can get away with.

[Blair]

Like those "reads."

[Blair]

Jake is the one who pretended to be confused, but you vote for the one-liner.

Love it.

[Blair]

How do you manage to only have null for TSE, Quick?

[Blair]

(Or mastina, for that matter)

[Blair]

Isn't that kinda how the scum win condition works, too?

[/unapologetic shade]

[Blair]

"I'm unreadable because I'm not actually playing, I'm following a 'system' that feeds me my reads. Oh, by the way, it's totally normal and expected for my system's reads to be erratic and unreliable until LyLo. No, you shouldn't lynch me, because what I just said makes everything I ever say or do in this game mechanically null. No, that's definitely not a convenient shield for my scum meta."

[Blair]

Sell me on A50 and Gobble.

[Blair]

I'd agree with your read on the Gobble post.

I'm not really feeling the A50 read, though. That last line of his was very weird, I'm just not connecting the dots for the scum motive.

[Blair]

i literally saw a vote on aristophanes earlier today dude

and then before that i saw a pisskop vote

kinda bewildering to happen this close to deadline>

Probably Blair. Their shade on me is pretty obvious.

That shade was literally labeled "shade."

You're a real Sherlock Holmes.

[Blair]

Oh yeah, Nero, talk to me about Nahdia, too. I keep going back and forth there.

[Blair]

Oka, I can see where you're coming from, and I'mma let you finish, but Aristophanes is one of the greatest wagons of all time.

[Blair]

Quick, hardcore buddying doesn't WIFOM itself into a towntell for me.

[Blair]

Quick, hardcore buddying doesn't WIFOM itself into a towntell for me.

I never buddy as Scum. What exactly did you think I meant by that?

On multiple occasions you have strongly opposed an Aristophanes wagon.

(Did you think I meant you were buddying me? Your voting pattern across multiple games suggests you vote for me disproportionately to your actual reads - in other words, I know there's no love there)

[Blair]

A d2 lynch on an infected forces scum to no kill or use up one of their two infection free night kills. This sort of begrudged vote doesn't really make sense from town, IMO.

I love your shading of everything I do.

"Presumably", Jake is infected. I also assumed that Infections resolve before kills, and thus I would also assume cure takes place before the kill as well. Leaving Jake alive means scum will either kill him AFTER he gets cured = exhausting one of their 2 kills on the uninfected (which is what you want) OR risk him being cured (and thus presumably immunized). My milkshake is still better than yours.

I would much rather be fake-cured to prove I'm not infected than to be lynched by an idiotic town who doesn't want to lynch actual scum, and instead wants to lynch disposable infected.

Who are the actual scum, Jake?

[Blair]

Does this question even need to be asked? It's pretty clear (by my standards) that Jake is Town here.

I'm asking him for his scumreads, since he said everyone wanted to lynch infected players "instead of actual scum."

The real question is, why did you feel the need to step in between me asking Jake to give some reads.

[Blair]

Scum can only kill uninfected players twice in the game. They can kill an infected player every night.

It's Day 2. There has only been one night phase. Therefore (we assume), only one player has been infected so far. If we lynch that player, there is no one for mafia to kill tonight (unless they want to use one of their two free kills).

He's saying lynching actual scum is better, but we shouldn't use that as an excuse not to lynch someone just because we suspect they're infected instead of scum.

[Blair]

Ok, I felt bad for you before but not anymore.

VOTE: Jake