Silent Star 1: Lunacy

[beeboy]

[beeboy]

I am waiting for someone to say hey hey back before I play >:(

[beeboy]

None of those are Hey heys but I'll read up.

[beeboy]

I am waiting for someone to say hey hey back before I play >:(

Hi!!!! you remind me of some pokemon games!

The Radja ones or something else o:

[beeboy]

My hey heys have been satisfied.

By nature Dunnstral is a very reserved scum. I have only seen him play scum once since my return where he matched that playstyle I expected. So I want to say he is town even if his skitter push is a bit odd

[beeboy]

I miss Radja games he was my favorite mod =[

[beeboy]

I didn’t get that vibe from scum!him at all, iirc he picked a lot of fights in the one game I saw him in

What game? my point of reference is MariaR's latest mini theme.

[beeboy]

I disagree with Dunn's Skitter read but the nature of the thread is making it difficult to get that read. I also am not a huge phone poster and I am trying to play while on a road trip right now

The posts look so much longer right now!

[beeboy]

i dunno. anti-town play most often comes from town. but i suppose dunns play wasnt really anti-town. i just see that sort of bad push coming more often from overzealous town trying to get day 1 moving than from scum pushing a mislynch. if dunn is scum then im tempted to say skitter is also scum and this was a distancing play.

But why are you still voting him then?

I see your logic and even if I don’t agree with it, I can understand it - but keeping your vote on him after you’ve put forth this logic makes 0 sense

This post from Lilith makes her my first town read. Having awareness while pushing on someone to follow the alignments of people working along side you is a very good look.

B)

[beeboy]

I'll be honest I don't like reading into 1v1s themselves I've always found that to be kind of garbage but things surrounding 1v1s like the post above tend to be very alignment indicative. Scum tend to not be concerned about players outside said 1v1.

My thought on Lilith goes together with her push on Dunnstral being relatively acceptable as well

[beeboy]

I'll be honest I don't like reading into 1v1s themselves I've always found that to be kind of garbage but things surrounding 1v1s like the post above tend to be very alignment indicative. Scum tend to not be concerned about players outside said 1v1.

My thought on Lilith goes together with her push on Dunnstral being relatively acceptable as well

how do you weigh that against lilith kinda playing both sides in the 1v1. like i agree with your reasoning, but im still getting pings from lilith stirring stuff up on both sides of the fight.

I don't see Lilith as doing this. I don't think Dunnstral being scum makes you town given it was initially Skitter doing the push. So I dont view it as prepping the follow up scum read on you. Rather it's just 2 independent reads


Unless I am mistaken on the order of the events

[beeboy]

Hey MT o//
How are you doing?

[beeboy]

Hey MT o//
How are you doing?

hia beeboy ヽ(^ω^)/

i'm a little sick today and i may be in too many games, but im doing alright! how's it going for u?

On a road trip right now! Very fun times!

[beeboy]

Clover leaf parsing your posts I can't tell what you think of Lilith. I see your points about her but I can't really tell if you think she is tunneling like town or scum in particular.

[beeboy]

Like how does what I’ve said constitute “stirring up both sides”?

@Votato @MT I spoke about why I disagreed with you on this and I am wondering why you think she is playing both sides.

[beeboy]

Clover leaf parsing your posts I can't tell what you think of Lilith. I see your points about her but I can't really tell if you think she is tunneling like town or scum in particular.

I think she's town!

Ok I agree, was getting a tad mixed vibes on what you thought but I won't press further. What so you think of MT and Votato thinking she is "playing both sides"?

Pedit: I don't disagree but the last time I didn't give midway space he was town choked and tunneled all game.

[beeboy]

I'll be honest I don't like reading into 1v1s themselves I've always found that to be kind of garbage but things surrounding 1v1s like the post above tend to be very alignment indicative. Scum tend to not be concerned about players outside said 1v1.

My thought on Lilith goes together with her push on Dunnstral being relatively acceptable as well

how do you weigh that against lilith kinda playing both sides in the 1v1. like i agree with your reasoning, but im still getting pings from lilith stirring stuff up on both sides of the fight.

I'll be honest I don't like reading into 1v1s themselves I've always found that to be kind of garbage but things surrounding 1v1s like the post above tend to be very alignment indicative. Scum tend to not be concerned about players outside said 1v1.

My thought on Lilith goes together with her push on Dunnstral being relatively acceptable as well

how do you weigh that against lilith kinda playing both sides in the 1v1. like i agree with your reasoning, but im still getting pings from lilith stirring stuff up on both sides of the fight.

I observed lilith sort of playing both sides -- She chimed in against both Dunn (34) and skitts (47) but I can easily see town lilith acknowledging different parts of the 1v1, it's not like you have to solely agree w/ one person. On the surface level maybe it's scummy but i didnt interpret it that way

Also did she even really do it past that point anyway? seems like you're making a big deal out of it but i mightve missed what you were referring to

[beeboy]

beeboy looks around at the surrounding trees. Despite the lack of breeze, the leaves sway gently side to side...

The weather is nice all things considered

[beeboy]

Why do you think I would believe a singular person saying "hey hey" would derail the thread? There are points to be made like I could have been stalling but why derailing the thread in particular?

I don't see that argument at all.

[beeboy]

Why is there a 25 minute gap between your initial read and the elaboration to it without new information? I don't mean to nit pick time stamps but it's just odd to me.

I have seen Dunnstral play scum approximately 3 times, 2 of which were 2 years ago. We have 10ish games together overall.

[beeboy]

Why are you assuming I am supporting my case on one game anyway? Basically what I am getting at is your retroactively justifying a read based on my thread opening. And I am trying to identify if this is cond bias or scum play.

[beeboy]

Why are you assuming I am supporting my case on one game anyway? Basically what I am getting at is your retroactively justifying a read based on my thread opening. And I am trying to identify if this is cond bias or scum play.

Then I do feel better about the reason for your defense. I got the impression it was based on one recent game though.

Why is there a 25 minute gap between your initial read and the elaboration to it without new information? I don't mean to nit pick time stamps but it's just odd to me.

This feels like a stretch to me. I made my point, and then explained with my evidence when Votato didn't see what I saw. What would be scum!me's play here?

@Tuxedo; wrt to your points on beeboy, why is that *scummy*? what is your theory, that beeboy/dunnstral are a team?

Could be a team, could be white knighting. Just what I feel is the game was moving fast and revolving around Dunnstral wagon. Beeboy comes in and really try to pull the conversation off game stuff, and then hops in with a defense of Dunn. Neither of these things on their own would have pinged me, but together it feels like a good place to start. Like if Beeboy posted fluff and then hopped on the Dunn wagon I wouldn't feel they were trying to derail, or if they just hopped on with a defense of Dunn it probably wouldn't have stuck out, but the two together feels calculated(?).

@Dunnstral how do you feel about Beeboy?

I think it's just an incredible leap of logic to say my fluff posting was an attempt at derailing the thread. All while not holding a scum read on the player you think I am defending? Do you think I have a large steak in defending a town Dunnstral as well?

VOTE: tuxedo

Your case just doesn't add up

[beeboy]

I wouldn't be voting you if you were vocally scum reading Dunnstral. It's just without that step I think an already iffy case just has a clear logic error you seem to want to avoid.

[beeboy]

This feels like a stretch to me. I made my point, and then explained with my evidence when Votato didn't see what I saw. What would be scum!me's play here?

This would be the play, find a hole then build a read around the hole you saw. That hole was me fluff posting post RVS but I think as town you wouldnt make multiple assumptions to scum read me.

Due to the uncertainty of a chunk of your arguments I think it wouldn't be such a strong read.

You say that the case is due to the fact I chose to defend Dunnstral but you don't think Dunnstral is scum vocally and you don't have a reason for me to want to manipulate the thread of his lynch as scum.

I just don't understand that argument.

[beeboy]

Why would I as scum derail a thread through fluff to try and save a townie.
Your accusing me of an indirect defense but saying Dunnstrals alignment doesn't matter because I could gain cred for a defense you can't see.

You're saying it's OMGUS but I am trying to engage you about the flaws in what your doing and I still feel you are talking around them :/

[beeboy]

If Dunnstral being town doesn't matter because I could be trying to gain cred.
Then it doenst make sense your accusing me of using fluff to derail the thread to achieve that goal because that is indirect.

[beeboy]

I don't think these are complex thoughts either yet they make your argument come across as incredibly flawed. And now your centering all your content around this 1v1.

[beeboy]

Tux I give you permission to ignore me and change the subject line to talk about other reads if you feel that way. If you don't want to manage both id rather you talk about other reads.

I don't think your 1 or your other 1 works together so 1+1 doesn't equal 2. I don't think it makes sense a fluff post is me derailing the thread. And I don't think you can say I am scum for defending Dunnstral without a read on Dunnstral.

You moved to say I detailed to soften the thread rather then distract Dunnstral which feels like you moving goal posts rather then look at this objectively.

I truly just cant wrap my head around how you are coming to the logic to misread me here idk. It's not misinterpreting information it feels like your deliberately not thinking things through.

[beeboy]

beeboy this feels like a huuuuuuge stretch. i actually agree with your initial assessment of tuxedo mask's case but you engaged Tux; why is it scummy for him to focus on responding to you?

No your right it isn't, I am getting upset and tunneling him because I see things clearly other people arent. Sorry I'll give him space.

[beeboy]

...who isn't seeing it?

I mean I am just getting heated in debates and expect some level of support, I am at a cottage right now and drinking constantly is prolly negatively effecting my post clarity and perception of how severe this actually is. (Idk how to post this without going hehe I am drunk XD cringe posts, although I guess I just made one woops.)


Before I quit mafia I got slack for playing too aggressively and I am trying to balance that right now hence why I am just going to back off. That is more an overall stance then a stance of just this game. Basically I am in a playstyle discovery phase atm.

[beeboy]

Anyway I love you guys this player list is super exciting for me!
I am going to take a break from the thread for the night gl guys B)

[beeboy]

im getting weird vibes

was there gonna be any followup to this

@dunn asked you a question earlier. do you still stand by the reasoning you gave for the early skitter push? is there any more context?

Nahdia why do you think that post by me was scum?

uhhh actually i misread it. i thought it said you were getting no pings on anyone, not that you were townreading them. my impression was that you were excusing yourself from forming reads

VOTE: beeboy

Why?

[beeboy]

Besides all that.
I have town pings from MT, Lilith, and Kanna.

Votato and Nahdia aren't sitting right with me.

Why do you scum read the person pushing me and town read the people pushing you. Excluding Votato obviously

It's just rather odd that you seem to be ok with that. Can you elaborate on this a bit?

[beeboy]

@Votato my thing is for someone that enjoys this style of game I feel like you aren't engaging in any of the "battles" that are going on. I don't think there is anything wrong with being a more passive player or taking a passive approach to the game it just seems odd earlier you hyped yourself up for it.

[beeboy]

I'm mind melding with tux on his other reads and that is bothering me a lot. Outside Nahdia I think their push on me is realistic but wrong, their opening matches a 1 note DM where we agreed our old playstyle were overwelming. Neither of which make Nahdia town but they both justify what they have done.

But we both agree Kanna and MT are playing like town and we both are getting pings from Votato without overly getting a scum read. And we have similar meta pools on all 3 players. Albeit I could be giving Kanna needless space due to noughts and crosses and I may just get slapped one day because of that.

[beeboy]

@Votato my thing is for someone that enjoys this style of game I feel like you aren't engaging in any of the "battles" that are going on. I don't think there is anything wrong with being a more passive player or taking a passive approach to the game it just seems odd earlier you hyped yourself up for it.

thats interesting. someone else called me out for scumreading all the wagons. i feel like ive been pretty active.

pedit: a townread on kanna? i feel like kanna hasnt done anything yet. explain that?

Kanna stalls as scum and revs her engine real fast as town.

[beeboy]

Also I feel like you are just lacking a certain level of aggro compared to the rest of the playerlist. If this is the style of game you like I think your reasoning and pushes should be more like leading the charge yourself I guess? I am not basing this on meta and more just your comment on the game relative to how your playing. Like to put it the best I can I think your adding on to what is going on / analyzing the field. While i feel like you implied you like the more leadership approach people are taking to the game.


I am not voting you because I am not sure I have enough yet but that is what is going through my head.

[beeboy]

What do you think of clovers "I can't form scum reads" typically that's scummy because scum just know everyone is town so it can be hard on them.

But they are also pretty open and frustrated about which is a better look.

Pedit: I did earlier the short version is I expect more aggro especially given his comment on liking the game but I decided I was fine giving him space we are what? 3 days into the game?

[beeboy]

That post was too votato

[beeboy]

I meant I wanted your thoughts on it. I used the wrong to!

But thank you, it's something I've been thinking about regarding clover and they are lower half of your POE. I want to call them town for it tbh. I really think they are pushing this frustration hard. Although a lot of this depends on the "pushed scum read" follow up they do.

[beeboy]

Why is there a 25 minute gap between your initial read and the elaboration to it without new information?

Basically what I am getting at is your retroactively justifying a read based on my thread opening.

do you think the elaboration was due to your/votato's reaction to the original post?

You know how sometimes you state a thought and read an ISO to check your memory and try and justify it?

As town you go "on review it wasn't as bad as I thought" but as scum you have to spend a bunch of time fluffing a read.
It has more to do with that it has nothing to do with mine or votatos post.

At the time I felt he was justifying a read rather then elaborating on a thought he had.

[beeboy]

This is better posting by Tux. I specifically like how he calls Nahdia's elaboration since better (rather than just give a blanket statement that nahdia is scum, especially when many have expressed suspicions on Nahdia recently). I also see what he means with votato

how do you feel about tuxedo mask disengaging from both votato and beeboy?

Was there more to talk about with regards to beeboy? I recall Tux wrapping that up since it seemed most people disagreed. It didn't seem like it was going anywhere to me

With votato hmm. Do you mean 286? votato had just said "well i townread you now lets townblock" and tux replied "We'll see" and asked a question. I don't think i see what you're getting at

I agree with this, why would Tux continue to fight me especially when we are both expressing doubt after going in kind of hard. The progression is natural and if they disagree they are not commenting on the aspect they thing is too easy / bizarre

[beeboy]

Link to VC on this page.

it was too me? haha what does that mean?

Drusilla why did you ask that question in particular I find it relatively odd?

[beeboy]

Idk how that was quoted oh well

[beeboy]

Link to VC on this page.

it was too me? haha what does that mean?

Ok so start off with a classic beeboy town read.
Then the Lilith town read is another good one.

Spice it up with some Kanna and MT bam you already have 4

[beeboy]

Votato get out of my multiquote

[beeboy]

Oh midway I think Dunnstral is town as well so you have 5.

[beeboy]

why is Dunnstral town? Just because he isn't as passive as last game?

That is such a dumb scum opening to me.
Why just make that entry push as scum for literally no reason.

I've never seen him do a weird play to just get shock factor town reads so I don't think he is scum here. The Mason fake claim was a calculated mid-late game play. This is just him running out of the gates doing something weird as scum "because it look town" if he is town. Which isn't a realistic read to me.

[beeboy]

If he is scum×

[beeboy]

@Drusilla what do you think of Tux disengaging? Is more the question I wanted to know why you asked. Sorry that was unclear. What is your answer to that question?

[beeboy]

I was about to give my Lilith town read but I guess i wasn't asked smh

[beeboy]

Votato is pinging me but I am sucker for AtE and he said he was apathetic due to being scum read (in particular by tux tbf) so I wanted to give him a bit of space before I just doubled down. I was the mod of the lovers game and.read his frustration in kill switch by being a player. So maybe it's just real emotion he would feel as town?

So you could reasonably be scum right now this could just be a general thought he has and he could just be bound to roll scum eventually. I also feel he is doing what he is accusing you of which the basis of my pings on him...
Hmm idk I'll get back to you in the morning I am not ready to choose now but those are my thoughts

[beeboy]

i dunno. anti-town play most often comes from town. but i suppose dunns play wasnt really anti-town. i just see that sort of bad push coming more often from overzealous town trying to get day 1 moving than from scum pushing a mislynch. if dunn is scum then im tempted to say skitter is also scum and this was a distancing play.

But why are you still voting him then?

I see your logic and even if I don’t agree with it, I can understand it - but keeping your vote on him after you’ve put forth this logic makes 0 sense

This post from Lilith makes her my first town read. Having awareness while pushing on someone to follow the alignments of people working along side you is a very good look.

B)

I also really liked this early on to add onto that town read Dunnstral I don't think we should pursue that one today

[beeboy]

actually im generally more apathetic as town. i get excited by being scumread. but i have some apathy bleeding in from outside this particular game. did you think i was apathetic in lovers?

I am thinking your apathy would be caused by treatment due to winning Lovers. So I think it might just be external and not alignment indicstive. My pings are related to nature.of how you decide to push people although I could be open to giving you space.

Excluding the idea of your clover push being kind of weak. I am just not sure that is enough to vote you yet. Because it feels weak.

Regardless Tux is improving even if I am not adjusting to you after

What are your thoughts on clovers take on your read do you think you elaborated / have additional reasonings that are unclear atm?

unvote

[beeboy]

maybe i should reframe. it's not so much that beeboy is faking it as i have a feeling it's not how town!beeboy would react there. the aggression can be both real and also scummy. i maintain the "I see things clearly other people arent" is out of place tho.

a slight problem i have is i don't know how beeboy can otherwise react? he was replying to tux's push on him which is just...as you would do in a game of mafia. how do you think town!beeboy would react?

although on readback, i'm not sure what he meant by "see things other people aren't seeing" either.

@beeboy; can you elaborate on that?

External things were riling me up and I was expecting a faster reaction for ?????

I don't actually think "external things" is a very good justification which is why I don't want to press Nahdia for pushing me like this. It's up to them to decide if they want to believe me or not and if they don't want to then oh well I can prove myself later.

[beeboy]

Low hanging fruit.

I think Drusilla is asking questions that I don't believe are particularly helpful for them solving people and I don't really understand the story they are trying to tell within their posts.

[beeboy]

I'm mind melding with tux on his other reads and that is bothering me a lot. Outside Nahdia I think their push on me is realistic but wrong, their opening matches a 1 note DM where we agreed our old playstyle were overwelming. Neither of which make Nahdia town but they both justify what they have done.

But we both agree Kanna and MT are playing like town and we both are getting pings from Votato without overly getting a scum read. And we have similar meta pools on all 3 players. Albeit I could be giving Kanna needless space due to noughts and crosses and I may just get slapped one day because of that.

Why is it bothering you? Are you no longer scumreading Tux because his reads line up with yours?

It's not that simple. I feel like the self doubt he expressed was making me think he could just be having a rough time with bad reads. It's not the first time I've been tunneled by town for bad reasons.

I don't think he is town yet but I am moving towards being unsure because I am getting pings elsewhere from Votato and Drusilla

[beeboy]

What pinged you about votato? was it just the incongruency between him saying he was excited for the game and then not really taking much of a lead on pushing people?

His town bloc pushes with both MT and Tux were very bizzare to me. Had a slimy mix of being both tactical and presented as for fun.

I just don't think it was accomplishing anything outside giving himself a safety net given he isn't working that close to either Tux or MT. Not to mention Tux was getting pinged by Votato so it doubles as a "please back off"

You don't see me appeasing to Nahdia because we are friends,I am just playing it out.

[beeboy]

Idk if it’s really as easy as raven/nahdia but that’s kind of where I’m at

which is it. do you need more content from our slots, or do you think we're scum?

VOTE: lilith

Stop voting towns :'(

[beeboy]

VOTE: votato

[beeboy]

UNVOTE:

[beeboy]

I just got home from my friends cottage, maybe I'll get around to playing today but I am kind of tired.

[beeboy]

@Drusilla I came up with that concern around the time I asked you about an individual question you asked, again you did it again with some other questions which is why I stated it more directly similar to Lilith. Which I think if you are trying to profile my progression on you, you would notice / try to remember that point? 352 and 353 in particular is when that concern actually hit my mind.

Honestly if someone else voted you I probably would have, but you have a solid point I should just do it anyway.
VOTE: Drusilla


Will read back the pages I skimmed earlier and see if something stands out.

[beeboy]

The second instance was me stating a read you, I can see how you'd interpret it that way although you'd be wrong and I don't really see how I'd communicate my read in another manner? I expressed how I had that opinion before Lilith, and at the time of Lilith's post I would have the knowledge of both Kanna and Lilith being open to me voting you. So I don't see what I'd be scouting out support for?

The first instance was just me pushing you to some form and I don't really think I need to debate that?



In regards to Kanna why do you think she is scum for playing in that manner? I read it as hesitation or hedging from a player confidence standpoint over a scouting you out stance.
I still feel as though Kanna is town, do you think your read is from your bias of being in your slot or would you hold the same belief from an outside slot?

[beeboy]

Btw, I am not actually feeling anyone's Raven read, I don't really see where that read is coming from.
Someone help me with that, they just read as null for me.

The only thing is she called Nahdia LHF, which I agree even cutting out all knowledge from outside this game just isn't true. Although I just don't think this game has LHF, even the newer players like Tux are perfectly capable of defending themselves.

[beeboy]

I went to visit my grandmother today, will be here tomorrow

[beeboy]

I am going to be honest here, this game is a solid balance between being very content dense and me not actually being able to get any solid reads. I am not sure if that says more about the game or me as a player.

[beeboy]

Alts are so trendy nowadays. Shiki is a good choice for one, I need to mod fate mafia one day B)

[beeboy]

I am going to compile my town reads since I haven't done much recently.
Imo I think I can solve this game if I go from a POE approach, I feel like scum hunting isn't doing me as many flavors as I'd like, I am not getting as many pings as I like?

Drusilla and Nahdia are the only ones actually pinging me right now. I think Drusilla hunting for me as a partner with other people isn't actually townie and is just the thoughts she can present to the thread. I just don't think it's a reasonable approach to the game right now. Nahdia just feels to complacent with the state of the game for someone with totally contradictory opinions from everyone else? I just feel like they would be approaching this game a bit differently from how they are now. It could have to do with her opening post but I think in general Tux's has some total garbage opinions but he is presenting emotions and his aggression matches someone who actually believes what he is saying.

pedit: @Tux to further elaborate I think a set of questions she asked earlier in the game felt like going through motions and commenting on things as you go rather then questions that come organically and have a function. I don't think their is anything I've seen since then that makes me want to reevaluate this read. In fact the partner reads make me think the opposite.

[beeboy]

I think Drusilla hunting for me as a partner with other people isn't actually townie and is just the thoughts she can present to the thread.

that post by nahdia seems so unlikely to just happen to happen to me. like i know going down this road has caused me problems before but if you said skitter and i were mafia right now, and nahdia replied that she thought skitter was towny for her townread of me, what would you think?

People are capable of being wrong and you just are over thinking it??? I don't know, you just don't recognize me giving Nahdia space because we are friends and are I don't really get the other parts of your read. I don't see how this early you can be making partner associations especially given I think Nahdia is flipping scum, so it feels like you are just prepping for the flip given after she fought me it's unlikely people would wolf read me. I don't think it's a reasonable thought, and I think there is an agenda behind in for the world in which Nahdia is scum with you.

Not mention I think your posts are scum isolated for things I have already gotten into. I guess we can worry about the Nahdia flip though before getting into this. I just want to put these thoughts on the table now.



VOTE: Nahdia, sorry I think this is the correct thing to do.

I found your vote on Skitter to be more like you jumping onto to something then an actual read and the same applied for your read on me.
You also just aren't approaching the game like someone with incredibly contrarian opinions. In addition to me just not seeing myself getting movement on Drusilla right now. I want to give you space but I think that just involves a garbage lynch on Skitter or Lilith.

[beeboy]

Bleh Drusilla's reads just don't feel right to me. I just don't see how a reasonable individual just keeps pairing people off, rather then just targeting me as an individual.

Maybe she just has this insane bias against the mannerism of my posting which is why she paired me off with both Kanna and Nahdia since she has having trouble vocalizing a read in another way? Maybe I just have a bias against being tunneled which is making me wolf read her.

Skitter I just don't understand what you want me to like here.

[beeboy]

Onto town reads.


Lilith, I liked the way Lilith is keeping tabs on players around her as she makes her pushes. She was also been relatively consistent while doing it. I don't have any super spicy elaboration I can make here for her? I just think she has solid town play this game and I am comfortable just locking her as town as a result.

Dunnstral, I liked his opening i don't think in this player list without any real lynch bait or at the very least a small number of them he would open the game in that manner as scum. It feels like you are putting a target on your back as far as discussion is concerned even if he didn't think he would get so wolf read for doing that. It's a weird thing to double down on while Skitter was giving him an out, why not just back up and move on? Why commit so hard when this list is unlikely to give you an easy way to adjust to another player? It just doesn't make sense to me as scum play.

Tux, had his opening that was kind of garbage but I think the way he backed off was relatively genuine. I think his frustration with himself has been very rational and consistent. Emotions like that can be kind of hard to fake especially when you are only 1.5 months into your mafia carrier. Not to mention after the reaction to me getting pissed being poorly received I don't think he would look and be like "AH YES THAT IS THE LINE TO TAKE" staying calm and just pushing me along side Nahdia would be the immediate reaction. And even if he doesn't want to do the latter I still just think he wouldn't take that line, between both his ability to fake it and how this list would perceive it.

Kanna, has some posts I just think come from town. From my past few games with Kanna I find as town she tries to feel out games and level of emotion just comes through in her posting. 622, in kill switch she read me as scum for similar reasons using the same methedology due to how she thinks I would approach her, its consistency with her town game. Throughout the scum game I saw her play it was purely fluff and no actual explanations and I am not saying my bar is just playing the game in the first 5 pages makes her town but I think in combination with her other play I've seen with her town game that I don't particularly want to touch her. Particularly I find she is spending a lot of time taking issue with arguments people are making which is her trying to see in other peoples eyes and how they are solving. IDK I just dig it.

Clover Ebi, his read on both me and Dunnstral show a consistent solving method and I find that comes from town. It's a locked in mind set on how to approach a given game based on recent experience. Scum tend to pull from a wider range of experiences to make up the most convenient stance while town will stick what they think is right even if that puts them under more heat. I find the "everyone is town i need to reevaluate oh no" comes from town more often then scum. While scum will town read more aggressively they are self aware before they actually do it. While Clover Ebi is doing what he thinks is right while having awareness that he could be doing something wrong.



^ I will literally fight to defend these players.

[beeboy]

Starbuck hasn't saved the Votato slot but I also want to give them space to catch up.

Which leaves:
{Skitter, Morning Tweet, midwaybear, Raven Branwen}

As my remaining POE assuming that one or maybe even 2 of my scum reads are wrong.


pedit: I don't know, people tend to be stubborn, he knows Skitter wouldn't back down ever and it creates a perpetual battle around his slot. Seems so unideal for scum when his best scum trait is his raw awareness of how this game functions.

[beeboy]

VOTE: Nahdia I trust Skitter and Morning Tweet enough to go here, and it's half past time we got a serious wagon rolling.

@Beeboy if you don't have a town read of MT or Skitter what do you think of them both voting Nahdia?

I think in general Tux's has some total garbage opinions

God, I think I need to take a break because I feel this is a reputation I'm gaining.

@Starbuck I don't mean to be rude, but is there a reason your catch up is taking so long?

@Midwaybear why did I have to ask you to vote? What is it you don't understand about the Nahdia case? Where do you think Dunn stopped scum hunting?

Why are you voting with me and asking that question?
I don't particularly care, I don't scum read them and it's not like I am ever going to find this perfectly pure wagon, I don't even town read enough people to get a majority.

Also the thing is you can't get better without trying your best and having garbage takes, I have garbage takes all the time I just convince people they don't suck B)

[beeboy]

if im being honest, i think i approached this game with the wrong mindset. the wrong framing. i have sort of coasted. as a result. things have thrown me off this game. i believe it was votato who said that he was gettin g"weird vibes" and i have also been the receiptient of said vibes. it is a shame he is gone without elborating terribly on that (well not really LOL fuck him) but i digress. i apologize for coasted, and will now Solve this Mafia Game for you all, as your Elder Gamer.

i am unsettled by my vote on skitter! i think, frankly, that i am right that skitters posting is indicative of some funny business. as i explained: reading myself/raven as a patnership, but not also individually reading raven, is scummy because scum are predisposed to be thinking about partnerships. i accept that people perhaps do more partner reading before any flips nowadays, but she admitted to not individually reading raven. so to push that associative while not also trying to check her work is Bad.

beeboy, you call a skitter lynch garbage. why must you besmirch my wonderful vote?

i did not finish writing about skitter before i hit submit. i was talking about unsettlement. in mbos, skitter was pushing me for a reason i felt was... kind of strange and bad, though maybe not entirely invalid. it turns out, she was scumthere and was being opportunistic. in this instance, she is pushing me more on meta, which i actally think is, perhaps more believable. and as i have said previously, her actual content i hve townread. but in mbos i came around to thinking her content was towny too, and it was not to be...

The way you've jumped onto votes this game was wack, me, that time you voted Lilith, Skitter. It felt like you just jumping onto people when the opportunity presented itself then you sort of just fell into the background. Skitter is the read I think you had the best follow up on, so shading that read in particularly is bad on my part it's more the Lilith read and the read on me that gave me bad vibes.

I'd have to reread your skitter vote to dig into why I don't agree but I am half awake right now and kind of lazy. I think Skitter is covering her bases as she approaches this game and hasn't done anything overtly scummy. But she still is in my POE for not doing anything overly townie yet either?

I think Drusilla is also a bit more guilty of doing some of the things you called Skitter out for like reading into partners without individual reads, which makes them my focus but you don't really have a take on her which is also odd!!!

[beeboy]

beeboy i am concerned that i and two of my townreads are in your PoE!!!

I am trying my best over here!!! Just hold out until I flip all my reads again for the 3rd time.
This game is harddd

[beeboy]

That's a bad look for when my mlg reads end up being correct and she flips scum!!!

[beeboy]

i think my vote on you was fine????????? i entered the thread, looked at the last page (lol), and saw you were oding a Very Strange Thing! so i voted you. i still feel it was strange, but u since said u were on edge for irl reasons, and i dont really think ur the sort to fake that. i have liked most of your reads, as i say. so i grant you this Pass.

lilith i think was justified too. i truly did not comprehend her raven read. on her like, third time explanaing it, i actually got it. and though starbuck's recent point about scum flooding the thread eing possible willstick in my mind, i am less inclined ot vote for her atm than i was.

skitter is a good vote. you should vote for it.

In fairness I'd be just as intoxicated as both alignments, I just found you dropped the read on me kind of easily.
The Lilith read felt jumpy because you just saw a whole in the questioning and sort of just pounced, Lilith feels like one of the more obvious town slots in the game so I think you were just replicating the Dunnstral play.
I don't know if I am ready to vote Skitter yet, they provide lots of content and they don't seem too terrible. I think I can sort them with time!!

What other fun reads do you have right now?

[beeboy]

@Beeboy, why am I in your PoE? The other day you said something along the lines of that I’m claiming something that doesn’t exist: LHFs. Why? What game have you been in/ spectated where they didn’t exist?

I scum read Nahdia, Votato/Starbuck, Drusilla to varying degrees.
I town read the 5 listed, the rest is people I am trying to sort. I can't just call everyone who puts effort into this game town I don't think I am going to solve the game doing that >_____>

I said this game doesn't have LHFs, at least compared to a typical player list, I think everyone in this game is capable of defending themselves. The 2 new players Tux and Midway are probably among the better 2020 users on the site. Tux can defend his stances even if you think those stances are easily attack-able and Midway pulled some crazy WIM in the last game I played with him. I stand by this statement I think this is a relatively strong player list.

[beeboy]

reading isnt fun, beeboy. this is deathly serious.

what kind of reads do you want? i looked at drusilla, who you voted, and found the thing that gavem e pause. which i said. did you notice that?

I am more asking what compromise lynch you'd want to do. I don't really like playing the I yell at you until you make a post I like game. I find that tends to just drive one player to the edge and that isn't particularly productive. I'd know I've had friends do it to me before trying to do me a favor and it wasn't fun

That's a bad look for when my mlg reads end up being correct and she flips scum!!!

So why aren’t you voting her rather than Nahdia?

I’m not currently sr Drusilla just to be clear, I just don’t understand why bee is insisting she’s scum while voting Nahdia.

I can hold multiple scum reads at any given time!!
That is basically the extend of my reply to this. I also don't see much momentum heading towards Drusilla so I moved my vote if you want my particular tactical reason. If I ever see votes move onto Drusilla that makes them viable I will move onto them.

[beeboy]

i think we're pushing the goalposts on who/what qualifies as LHF. i agree that everyone on this playerlist is a capable player more than able to defend themselves and throw their weight around! but scum will still naturally seek out the "easiest" players to push in any playerlist, both based on the players themselves and also the context of the game. it's all relative.

I think we reached the tipping point though? I don't see scum driving in this game due to the lack of overly easy pushes. That would result in a different play pattern where scum tend to be more buddy like and just work as a group with specific townies like votato did. Rather then going aggro piling on Tux. Thanks for getting me to think about this because I think the scum mentality changes due to how this game is being played out.

This is a very good revelation!!!!

[beeboy]

Nothing otherwise I would be voting her right now given my strong read on Votato.

Starbuck is fine so I will continue to let her play out the game for the foreseeable future. I just also believe catch ups are relatively easy to fake as scum so she isn't even into the real 'sauce' yet.

[beeboy]

talk to me about drusilla. 818

I am going to be real that post is the definition of a dense post I am too stupid to be able to read.

They reference a conversation they have in another game but i don't think they are overly applying that comment to how they solve the game it's kind of just there to back something up? Which drags it way back into the realm of being highly fakable to me. Also as scum if you have decided you want to apply that to your game play it would be easy to fake.

Idk it's not the same as a meta conclusion or some sort of other conclusion from another game. It's just a mantra on how to play mafia, that's a lot of scums bread and butter talking about how to play the game because of how easy it is, not like what you think is good play changes or is game specific. So like it's not scummy but its also like.... super easy???

If your asking about the questioning to kanna or something else then I am blank because I just see a standard sequence.

[beeboy]

I agree with Starbucks this content density would be a lot easier to manage if the response to a lot of reads wasn't. "I GOT MY META AND MY META TELLS ME YOU ARE WRONG"
When a lot of that time that meta isn't even explained. It's making this game needlessly hard to solve because it cuts a lot of engagements short.

[beeboy]

I might have a bias, a lot of things I do in a game of mafia are dictated before I receive a role pm? I buffer my scum game a bit slightly to avoid a level of panic since I already know what I am going to do.
Certain gimics, my opening post in the weakest link game I literally got town read for. I read the setup and planned that post before I got my role pm. I wouldn't think about faking a paint diagram planning alongside my scum team, but it was something I felt like doing anyway?

So tells like that I am more willing to just write off especially when my definitive answer is, to some degree I agree with you but I don't think it's enough to outweigh what I believe makes her scum. That's my more serious answer then "scum can fake that".

If I was sitting here null reading Drusilla killing them for POE, I'd agree that me dismissing your argument would be shitty but I do have reasons to scum read Drusilla that I believe are stronger then that point in support of them.

[beeboy]

I can keep talking if you'd like later but I want to avoid clogging up more pages going back and forth between the 2 of us.
A) So I can sleep and B) To avoid creating 4 more pages.

Gnight thread o/

[beeboy]

@Beeboy you mentioned you prewrite your entry. I wish that was something you mentioned earlier. What parts of this game were preplanned from you?

Uh, not much this game I just had that one hey hey meme....

I am testing out a few tells right now which I guess would make it easier to fake a read if a townie ends up doing them, but that's just the fundamentals of playing mafia. I am interested in cutting down my post quantity recently!! I used to post oppressive amounts, I remember one time I was 1/3rd of the posts in a large theme.... I think I am doing alright.

Right now I think it would be best if we all just settle down a bit while we wait for opinions from some stragglers who aren't caught up right now. Since we are nearing EoD.

[beeboy]

I don't think Starbuck is town, I was voting Votato before he got banned, but I agree with the above.
Feels weird lynching a slot that caught up just recently.

[beeboy]

Sorry to spam but @beeboy, you were in TWL, so I don’t understand how you think Star is playing differently here. Dunn was too and I’d like to hear his read on Star.

Meta doesn't really work based on a sample of one. I don't really know what similarities or differences to look for.
Starbuck could be playing in an entirely different manner and I wouldn't actually be able to call her scum for it.

That's my read if you are asking for my opinion on meta.

[beeboy]

I don't think Starbuck is town, I was voting Votato before he got banned, but I agree with the above.
Feels weird lynching a slot that caught up just recently.

Caught up recently is charitable. I don't know, just like it's not like they replaced in yesterday. So I don't really see the hesitation there.

Is it irrational to worried Midway might be a role that wins by being voted out?

@Starbuck I'm still confused, can you explain how my late entry into the game has any bearing on what I said about Beeboys entry?

I wouldn't worry about 3rd parties, typically letting them win doesn't harm town anyway.
Maybe I am being charitable then, I'd have to review Starbucks further but I am already open to voting them if push comes to shove anyway.

[beeboy]

beeboy, lilith, Clover, Tux, Dunn, midway, drusilla, MT

3 of you need to pony up and vote skitter!

or! alternatively! we powerwagon midway

"hey guys im gonna ignore everything going on in the thread oh golly oh jeeze why i dont have any reads"

bear. if there enough people actually active and willing before deadline, i would actually consider that!

VOTE: midway

Oh boy I sure do love repeating the mistakes I made in TWL

[beeboy]

I'd vote Starbuck but I feel like they won't be lynched as they've been a topic for a very long period of time.

I am not voting Skitter or Dunnstral.

[beeboy]

VOTE: Starbuck

well if you all insist

[beeboy]

I really don't want to setup an alarm for this game.
So if you guys want to grab to midway then please just set that up now.

I'd really rather not no lynch and idk if I should stay up late or go to sleep early for this game lmao.

[beeboy]

I'd rather vote Midway, because I forgot he was frozen on Dunnstral for literally the entire game.

TWL Midway changed opinions at complete random and was getting himself killed as a result of it. Literally as that dude got the chain he changed his read for 5 seconds in order to do something out of nowhere. This game it feels like that game traumatized him so he just decided to stick on Dunnstral and never move. Basically TWL midway was running to his death but Midway in this game is being swept away by the tide.

Clover, Starbuck do you 2 believe we can get momentum for a midway lynch today?

[beeboy]

Tbh I've been skimming towards the end of this day phase because this game has too many walls for me to stay sane reading and responding to everything but I like Nahdia so I'll reply to them in particular.

@Nahdia I saw a post on if my read on you has evolved since my initial vote. I think you had some sequences you like. I found when you came in and fought for you to not be lynched it was part of the needed fire I was asking for earlier in the game when I basically said you weren't playing like someone who had heavily controversial opinions and was also being pressured. And I do think your play now makes a lot more sense relative to your position in the thread.

I am not sure if I like the Skitter 1v1 yet and I wanted to read it in more depth since I am technically null/scum on both of you. But I was really hoping you 2 would split focus a bit more to help me improve my read but you both have been stuck in a 1v1. I think in general I am just not going to move to either of you today and hope that going into day 2 I can further establish my read.

pedit:
VOTE: Midawy

I feel like your bias since my vote is on you, but if I am going to stick to a lynch I want it to go through since I personally don't have needed info to sort nahdia/skitter today.

[beeboy]

Beeboy is Starbuck towny enough that you want to give her a chance and we should do midway? Or do you want to get the Nahdia wagon going. I'll admit I wouldn't be keen on Nahdia but since that'd mean you skitter and Lilith all seem good on it I'd join
pedit: Oh

yeye I don't want to drop Nahdia anymore. I don't know if it was a deliberate choice to play the way I stated I wanted them to. But they are doing it and I don't want to drop someone who has been stuck in a 1v1. People in those situations tend to be atrociously hard to read, any experienced player can play along with a 1v1 and I don't think Nahdia or Skitter would be among players who couldn't.

At this moment in time I am resolved to lynch either Starbuck or Midway. I don't want to push one if it means opening the door to let people lynch someone else if you follow?
Are you fine with doing this with me or did you have someone else in mind you wanted to see drop today?



side note: Use drop and exile in place of lynch more often. Those are the 2 words I am choosing between for my modded games and future language

[beeboy]

@Dunn do you have any other scum reads outside of midway?
And is there any wagons that you wouldn't be willing to vote?

I am trying to figure out a good resolution for this day phase, it is just incredibly difficult when only 5 people are here when our deadline is basically 3 hours away given people have to sleep.

pedit: That's a fair take lmao, I really just don't like the way Votato played he was buddying everyone and voting the other half without real commitment/ reasons. Hopefully if your town and live today we can see eye to eye tomorrow.

p-pedit: credibility??? lmao who needs that

[beeboy]

@Tux

Can you case Starbuck for me?
Because I very strongly agree with you about Votato posts.

Starbuck just did a very standard catch up to me and I feel close enough on the 2 of them that I don't particularly mind waiting? It's not like I am giving them unneeded leeway and shooting myself in the foot while they null post. I still do want to flip Midway this game. I think leaving Starbuck alive gives us higher odds of realizing we are wrong and giving us better information post flip to find scum #2/#3

[beeboy]

What part of midway sticking to Dunnstral all game makes you want to defend him?

[beeboy]

I feel like town flips resolving group fights is kinda a myth? So I don't want to lynch in a certain group of people to resolve a conflict unless I am very sure someone in that group is scum. The whole "this 1v1 can't be TvT!!!" doesn't actually ever have the proper accuracy to make it worth it. Scum could easily just be egging on that fight because they don't care.


Star could be scum but I still think Midway has coasted the entire game voting Dunnstral without any real other opinions. I want to ride on the high of catching scum tyvm.

[beeboy]

@Beeboy do we flip to Star or no?

Watch as I show you my magical power called DEFLECTION

@Nahdia do we flip Star or no?

[beeboy]

This is a perfect take of that 1v1.

[beeboy]

@Beeboy any response to my case on Starbuck?

I am working on it!!!
I just think the amount of time she spent catching up is reasonable?

I am coping with this games length by skipping 20% of the posts

[beeboy]

VOTE: Starbuck

Sorry

[beeboy]

Oh so we all thought we were scum... that's kinda wack.
I was kind of tilted when I thought I bussed Starbuck.

[beeboy]

yes absolutely.

we were told we "forgot" how to nightkill, so i thought maybe we would remember it at some point?

Ditto

[beeboy]

@Nahdia I am sorry for parking my vote on you.
I was too scared to move my vote so many big posts was making me scared

[beeboy]

In hindsight when me and clover dumped accountability for the d1 lynch onto you was a really good meme now that we both ended up both being scum.

[beeboy]

I thought Tux was scum but all my reasoning kinda pointed towards me being scum
We had super similar games at a lot of points I deem matter.

[beeboy]

So how do we adjust from our day 1 not being useful at all?

[beeboy]

Ya pretty much.

3 scum.
10 town.

Doesn't make sense he got left out.

[beeboy]

When the full moon comes out are you guys cool with me feasting on Midway?
I am kinda hungry.

[beeboy]

If no one claims a group of 3, or another single player.
The numbers straight up just don't add up.

I am really just waiting on that.

[beeboy]

VOTE: Hectic

I am just getting my generic bastard check out of the way. Flavor doesn't make this seem impossible.

[beeboy]

The flavor insinuates the Mayor is scum more then once.
It's either lone wolf midway or Hectic himself.

Can someone with a kill shoot Hectic for me?

[beeboy]

Every year, the Silent Star emerges anew. Do not be deceived by its beauty... it only spells calamity for all unfortunate enough to gaze upon it.

Welcome to the town of Lunacy! I'm Mayor Top Hat, but you already knew that because you live here!

It's a switch. On the back is engraved Melt with Lava. What could this possibly mean?
Your thoughts are interrupted as a flaming demon emerges from the flames, heading straight towards the crowd of onlookers!
But you quickly realise it's just your Mayor, wearing a fireproof suit.

Good job, everyone. You make me very proud to call myself your Mayor. With luck, the gift of Starbuck will stop the deaths that plague this town.

The Mayor bursts into laughter and sends you all home to get some rest.

I think scum is just Hectic tbh.
Every time a kill occurs he is always this weird demon figure.

[beeboy]

When Hectic doesn't count my vote on him I am just voting midway.

[beeboy]

Midway if you were a lone wolf who did you think knew about you / who are you told are your wolf buddies?
Lone wolf is a legit role.

[beeboy]

Ok so I am going to vote park Hectic. because I am really proud of my theory that is relatively insane.

So the question is are scum pairs we thought we had all confirmed T/T.
Or are scum going to be scattered among our original pairs and we should potentially point our gun towards our partner.

One way should involve a mass claim where we justify how we played relative to our scum buddy and no one else day 1.
If we can assume our partner is town then we should hide that information at all costs.

PEDIT: I AM ON TO YOU HECTIC

[beeboy]

Because we can either assume this game is full of masons or scum are scattered in our initial pairs.
The difference between scum and town in this case is people who had loyalty to multiple people over just 1.

[beeboy]

So the question is are scum pairs we thought we had all confirmed T/T.
Or are scum going to be scattered among our original pairs and we should potentially point our gun towards our partner.

One way should involve a mass claim where we justify how we played relative to our scum buddy and no one else day 1.
If we can assume our partner is town then we should hide that information at all costs.

Basically how we scum hunt depends on the answer to this question. I don't think day 1 is useless anymore, we are just missing a piece of info.

[beeboy]

Ditto

[beeboy]

Do you guys really think the game is as easy as midway + an individual pair?

[beeboy]

Why is it town and not an upper form of scum that goes even above us?
Everyone should have some kind of pair outside midway yes?
Meaning even the scum should be aware our pairs exist.

[beeboy]

VOTE: Kanna

[beeboy]

UNVOTE:

Meh people don't fake cop guilties anymore.
I am going to ask my mason buddy for thoughts.

[beeboy]

Idk why we didn't claim partners before you outed that guilty.
I think your approach is sloppy but my gut reaction is it's sloppy town.

[beeboy]

Idk why we didn't claim partners before you outed that guilty.
I think your approach is sloppy but my gut reaction is it's sloppy town.

[beeboy]

I think we shot ourselves in the foot by outing the guilty this early tbh.

VOTE: Nahdia

[beeboy]

And Kanna did you ask what result you would get if you targeted yourself with your alignment cop?

[beeboy]

I want pairs claimed tbh.

[beeboy]

I agree with Dunnstral, I've scum read all of Clover Ebi's day 2 so far.

[beeboy]

There's no way I could play my day 1 like that if I was scum though. Although I don't know why you thought my today came from scum?

What are you even claiming then?
Not a werewolf?

[beeboy]

If we kill Nahdia, they're mafia, and all the paired people claim, then all the pairs should be innocent unless there's like 3 mafia or something

Don't we need Nahdia's werewolf partner they claimed to have to claim?
I really don't think this game is consistent of mason pairs.

I think my partner is werewolf with me because of all our tinfoiling and funky plays we did together. But that's a read based on play.

[beeboy]

Nah I still heavily advocate pair claims right now.


@Nahdia start, you should reasonably have claimed to your partner and I want them to back you up.

[beeboy]

So you think me who has the same implication we are factional werewolves togethher is also a masonry.
And the game is just broken because we have a bunch of masonries.

I think the game is bastard for a reason and I don't trust that.

[beeboy]

My role pm explicitly states I am a faction, my factional topic explicitly states my partner is a werewolf.
I just don't think Hectic made a game with 5 masonries.

Just doesn't make sense to me.

[beeboy]

If no one admits to being Nahdia's partner we mass claim.
If someone admits to being Nahdia's partner and they did or did not claim alignment cop we proceed as normal./

World 1 is the we are just a bunch of masonries world so we should figure out nahdia's partner by force before we lose the chance.
World 2 we can either clear the cop claims much faster or move forward with the game knowing pairs likely aren't just scum/scum.

[beeboy]

I want partner claims, Dunnstral has a solid point about the game balance
The standard thing to do as scum is claim your role.

Both Kanna and Nahdia should have someone to back up their claim.
Or they should have someone to basically confirm they are aren't werewolf overlords like us.

[beeboy]

I want both Kanna and Nahdia's partner to claim.
Kanna shouldn't be left off the hook if you think about it in more depth.

[beeboy]

To save us the effort of waiting for Tux, did you claim cop to Tuxedo man?

[beeboy]

I am taking MT's post as "they claimed cop page 1"

[beeboy]

This claim is the first I'm hearing about Nahdia being cop. They never mentioned it in our PT.

Nahdia is the above true?
Did you guys claim VT or anything in your hood though?
Or did you guys just go blind for some reason.

VOTE: Nahdia

[beeboy]

Yes yes it's what I have been saying!!!
5 Masonries makes no sense!!!

[beeboy]

T̴͔͙͘h͎̘e̢͚̩͕̙̼̖̫ ̵͕͔͚͍͠ͅn҉̞͎̩̭̫i̴̢̘̭͍g̛҉͎͚͉̮͔ͅh̡̳̣͕̜̀͞t͚̩̳͈̫̺̫̀ ̖̫͕̦̹͝ͅś͔̖̜̱͢͡ͅk̮̗̭̺̫̝͙͚y̻̖͕͚ ̵͚̳͠i҉̪̙͎̫ş͈̻͍͎̱͕̫̝ ̛̗̟s̥̜̬̹̼͙͉͜o̜̮̦̟̗ ͈̬͉̳̳̠̤͈͍b̧͈͔͟͢e̝̱̘͖̩͢a̸͉͕͉̫̗͍̥̯͎u̡͉̗̟̞t͍̳̘̪i͙̠̤̫̩̟̥̺̝f͕̭̦͔̻̜͓͇̕u̡̠̦̪͇̼̣̯̝ͅl͇̖̦̩̲͠.̳͇̩̞.͎̣̗͖̟.͠҉͔̲̦̲̰ͅ

VOTE: Nahdia

Sayonara

[beeboy]

Me and my partner are werewolves B)
Ain't that right?

Partner: Hell yeah.

[beeboy]

Yeah that's my thing, it's not a masonry because Nahdia got our post 1 wolf flavor.
It just doesn't make sense and it's probably why we aren't getting full flips.

[beeboy]

I am not lynching Dunnstral literally ever now this it is outed.

[beeboy]

The only person I am surprised had a wolf role pm was Lilith, good job Lilith that's why you're dead I guess!

[beeboy]

Everyone betting their partner is a WW sure is great (^:

[beeboy]

Ah... I get it.
Tuxedo is scum and they were paired with the 2 dead players not each other.

[beeboy]

I guess I can't scum read Drusilla using my day 1 read.
Given they were just scum.

Although I don't really like that team as a whole? They are the only ones proclaiming their day 1 play is town because they'd know it's single ball and not multiball.
It's just such a weird thing to harp on IDK.
But 2 of them are doing it.

[beeboy]

I mean I thought Starbuck was genuinely scum.
I pushed Votato because I seriously scum read him. I didn't call Skitter town despite my "town reads" doing that because my gut didn't feel right and I had a few town reads I really believed.

It's just I am not proclaiming if I knew it was single ball my play would be noticeably different, because it really wouldn't be. Feels more like something I'd think if I knew I was trying to fake "scum playing multiball like town".

[beeboy]

Tux/Mid/Raven hm

If you and Drusilla are town this is what I think.

[beeboy]

Raven is ww

Why?

pedit: Mid is playing like a WW

[beeboy]

Bodyguard and Watcher don't just happen to be paired up together.
I just don't buy it.

[beeboy]

I remember this suggestion a while back, but explaining our play with our partners in mind could be useful. Morning and I worked solidly as a team

Ye I said this.
I defended Dunnstral literally all game and lied about his meta, I can go find a game where I explained his meta completely differently (2 years ago though)


I don't think I have interactions with anyone else that are that egregious, lilith I town read loosely but is now dead. Clover Ebi, who I am now scum reading also Tux (this one isn't my best look tbh).

[beeboy]

Dunnstral also does that hammer knowing I am not going to defend him the following day phase.

Leave werewolfstrall alone!!!!

[beeboy]

Idk I feel like my day 1 and 2 play are drastically different myself.

Also me and Dunnstral have a way stronger friendship then you do Kanna/MT.
+ we aren't getting shot tonight :^)

[beeboy]

Why don't you two talk out here?

In fairness we already caught all the scum and are just holding back because it wouldn't be fun for everyone else.

[beeboy]

Dunnstral literally tin foiled me as scum in thread.
+ You really can't see our PT, we really did have way too many theories on what was going on.

[beeboy]

I absolutely refuse to let you guys touch Dunnstral.

Beeboy = Scum, whatever idc, I don't think as mafia I can fake reading all the flavor to try and figure out what is going on then concluding the mod is actually scum.

But you aren't just misyeeting me then going "ah must be dunnstral"

[beeboy]

I actually just refuse to let you guys kill Dunnstral literally ever.

[beeboy]

I think bee/dunn are town

I am a werewolf don't make me morph on you.

[beeboy]

If your reasoning is role based I kinda want it claimed sometime tomorrow?
Dunnstral brought up a theory earlier on Kanna which is why I pushed for both to claim when i originally only cared if one did.

You claim a negative result on someone, you get your partner to push it.
You then shoot your partner so they can't out you.

Which if that is happening I am sorry for you guys.
I also just don't see how you think mine and Dunnstral's dynamic wasn't very much wolfing yesterday and towning now idk.

[beeboy]

Dunnstral also went from lurking many stages of yesterday to getting a burst of energy that is made his post total above mine.
Dunnstral openly admitted to lurking to me in our PT yesterday. Well he said he was "not following along" which is the same thing.

Keep in mind I am not looking for town interactions in my PT I am looking for interactions that make me think he wasn't doubting me and could say literally anything he wanted in our PT.

Not only is this shift super obvious town, it also is backed up with things he did in our PT that shows he doesn't have a "real scum team".

[beeboy]

I don't believe beeboy and Dunnstral are this unaware, but Skitter says I'm wrong so I'm still probably gonna lynch Tux

Unaware of what?
Also I think my last post points to dunnstral being obvious town yes yes?
Does someone with a second scum PT just start talking about the really wolfy things they are doing to me that don't even benefit me?

[beeboy]

See my issue is I think someone in your pair is setting up to pile drive our pair the following phase.
I just can't tell if it's you Clover or Drusilla, because it has to be one of you.

And unlike day 1 I am no longer content just sitting without good scum reads lol.

[beeboy]

None of what your saying makes Dunnstral obvious town. The whole point of this game is to shift from your scum meta to your town meta so this burst you're speaking of fits right in line with what I would expect scum to do here. Plus your fake interactions you're on about don't help either because they can easily be SvS.

See the issue is, to avoid arguing about the SvS stuff. I am just pretty ok dying as long as no one ever kills Dunnstral.

Dunnstral told me not to say this to avoid altering how people play but I think we've all committed to something outside exactly Raven.
People are going Scum -> Town.
Others are going Scum -> Scum.

So I am aware Dunnstral knew what I wanted since I explained it to him, but I also know I am not SvS since I am town and that he really was tin foiling the game state with me.

You can dismiss the argument of what is going on in our PT being clearing in terms of us being SvS but those are 100% real interactions that is why I am saying it's TvT. I am willing to accept a stance of you think we are either TvT or SvS but that's not exactly what I am seeing? I think you're willing to take anything that involves killing both of us to get 1 or 2 scum.

[beeboy]

Honestly in regard to Dunnstral flipping his play day 2 not being town indicative because "that's what scum want to do".

I feel like you just said my expectations out of town don't work because scum want to play like town. Idk I feel like my point still stands?

Why do X, "to look town".

I made that argument when I was scum to push Drusilla.
And do you know who was defending Drusilla? Nahdia the only person we know is actually scum.

W a c k

[beeboy]

Honestly in regard to Dunnstral flipping his play day 2 not being town indicative because "that's what scum want to do".

I feel like you just said my expectations out of town don't work because scum want to play like town. Idk I feel like my point still stands?

Why do X, "to look town".

I made that argument when I was scum to push Drusilla.
And do you know who was defending Drusilla? Nahdia the only person we know is actually scum.

W a c k

[beeboy]

I hate this site, I double post way too much

[beeboy]

But honestly thank you for the news flash.
When I was pushing Drusilla yesterday it wasn't you who was defending them, it was Nahdia that was getting me to back off!

[beeboy]

Honestly in regard to Dunnstral flipping his play day 2 not being town indicative because "that's what scum want to do".

I feel like you just said my expectations out of town don't work because scum want to play like town. Idk I feel like my point still stands?

does my play seem the same to you today as it did yesterday?

I stated in the PT to Dunn awhile back that the people who followed that tell and gave me a result were.

MT, Midway, Skitter. All had very dramatic tonal changes to me that made me feel they were town.

[beeboy]

See my issue is I think someone in your pair is setting up to pile drive our pair the following phase.
I just can't tell if it's you Clover or Drusilla, because it has to be one of you.

And unlike day 1 I am no longer content just sitting without good scum reads lol.

I can't read your PT I don't know which one you is egging on the other to push us.
It's one of you but I really don't know which one it is.

[beeboy]

Ok so if the swap upon realizing your town isn't AI then what is?
The fact me and dunnstral aren't participating in the day 2 mass claim is what makes us scum?

You can't just dismiss the most alignment indicative thing that is occuring.

[beeboy]

It tells me one of you doesn't realize the other is adjusting around the others play?

[beeboy]

I don't fault you for not town reading us, because I have my PT and you don't.
My most key piece of info to think Dunnstral is town is information you don't have.

I just don't see how we could possibly be a scum scum pair, because our entire approach to day 1 is sort of wide out in the open and I feel like we are playing like a wolf pair with no other scum buddies? If I had a 3rd scum buddy I knew about and it was single ball, I am not ever going that defensive of my buddies since I think I'll die and ruin the game for them. A lot of my play was dictated by fear of another scum team trying to shoot me.

[beeboy]

Me appearing comfortable yesterday (if I even was) is indicative of experience. I very much am not confident in my own scum game enough to defend Dunnstral that hard if I had a 3rd scum buddy.

[beeboy]

Ok so tell me in your follow up post, would my town flip and knowing everything I said about our PT being true be enough for you to call Dunnstral town? Because the main vibe I am getting is your pushing Dunnstral as a team but are comfortable with us being TvS as well.

And that's my biggest red flag right now, because I think you really need to be pushing one or the other based on what I am arguing.

[beeboy]

My theory I am basing literally on my play on is being expressed by at least 3 players. Me, MT, Dunnstral.
With Nahdia that means one town player has to think that's the correct approach based on the last 1.5 pages alone.

I feel like I am wasting thread space, I think me and Dunnstral are far more clear then you are giving me credit for especially with me and Nahdia pushing each other very early in the game.
And I very much believe my town flip confirms Dunnstral as town.

Or do you think you have something new to add because I think we are just rewording our arguments and obviously we aren't getting to each other since clearly you can't convince someone they have a scum role card.

[beeboy]

I never said you guys were TvS once because I wouldn't make that statement.

You didn't but I felt you did when you chose to not reply to my statement that basically said, fine flip me but don't go after Dunnstral.
I said that a solid 4 times by now.

[beeboy]

Also Nahdia truly did defend Drusilla when I pushed them.
It still doesn't feel like a WK to me, and I need to find that post.

[beeboy]

Also I was arguing we can't reasonably be SvS?
Which is what I believe, because I don't think I go that deep to defend Dunnstral while having to explain to one of Lilith or Starbuck why I am doing that.
Both of which are strong players who would wonder what in the world I was trying to do.

[beeboy]

I find it hard to believe that you can't see why people would think you're both SvS with the way you're playing this phase.

Multiple players have agreed with my theory about alignment swapping changing a player's tone and you said you don't understand why I am applying to you?
I can make this exact same statement towards you.

Idk I think to establish us as SvS you have to deem me playing along side Dunnstral with a 3rd buddy (Nahdia) yet I bus one and hard protect the other.
I don't think my treatment of who you know is scum and who you think my scum buddy is, isn't even slightly consistent.

That's why I don't think I am SvS and I don't think you are humoring that world and are tunneling down just how I am approaching this 1v1.
I am expanding my thoughts on the very least Drusilla to how she interacted with Nahdia.

[beeboy]

The bolded is the most important. I think in terms of me saying something that was potentially unclear before?
Idk I am really trying my best here believe it or not

[beeboy]

im sobering up. my power wanes.

i was mostly referring to that first thing. it reminded me of how you read clover, so i was curious if you had thoughts on it, but i can see the line you're drawing between them. it's fakable, but it struck me as something scum would just be less likely to think to fake, you know?

frankly, i'm not sure i like hearing "fakable" in response to stuf like that! sure, virtually everything is fakeable. but it can still be more likely to come from town than scum for xyz reasons. it just feels like a catchall way to dismiss reasons to townread people so options stay open.

idk. town can also be dismissive of that stuff. i just think more stock should go into that sort of tell.

i have also looked at drusilla again, as requested, but i am unconvinced. i would vote there if need be, but it is not my top choice. beeboy you make the point that i should be looking at her partner reads similarly to how i read skitter. but idk, i feel they are different. i disagree with how drusilla is reading the game, but i

can

follow the logic step by step to meet her. so the things that give me pause, even if they could be faked, actually do outweigh other concerns?

[beeboy]

I'm waiting for this post about Drusilla that you haven't showed me yet. Don't think I'm unaware of the fact that I gave Drusilla a very clear way to clear both of us and she got rid of it just as soon as I presented it. I'm not stupid
I don't see the issue with you bussing partner A but not partner B nor how it is clearing how you treat 1 scum vs another unless I'm missing the point

I think I'd treat my partners in a more consistent way tonally, I was pushing Nahdia as scum while creating engagements with them constantly about players.
Dunnstral I just wrote off as town for meta and left him their. Both players were under pressure, both players are around equally competent for the sake of me evaluating what they can handle.

Drusilla posts can be found above.

[beeboy]

im sobering up. my power wanes.

i was mostly referring to that first thing. it reminded me of how you read clover, so i was curious if you had thoughts on it, but i can see the line you're drawing between them. it's fakable, but it struck me as something scum would just be less likely to think to fake, you know?

frankly, i'm not sure i like hearing "fakable" in response to stuf like that! sure, virtually everything is fakeable. but it can still be more likely to come from town than scum for xyz reasons. it just feels like a catchall way to dismiss reasons to townread people so options stay open.

idk. town can also be dismissive of that stuff. i just think more stock should go into that sort of tell.

i have also looked at drusilla again, as requested, but i am unconvinced. i would vote there if need be, but it is not my top choice. beeboy you make the point that i should be looking at her partner reads similarly to how i read skitter. but idk, i feel they are different. i disagree with how drusilla is reading the game, but i

can

follow the logic step by step to meet her. so the things that give me pause, even if they could be faked, actually do outweigh other concerns?

I'm waiting for this post about Drusilla that you haven't showed me yet. Don't think I'm unaware of the fact that I gave Drusilla a very clear way to clear both of us and she got rid of it just as soon as I presented it. I'm not stupid
I don't see the issue with you bussing partner A but not partner B nor how it is clearing how you treat 1 scum vs another unless I'm missing the point

I think I'd treat my partners in a more consistent way tonally, I was pushing Nahdia as scum while creating engagements with them constantly about players.
Dunnstral I just wrote off as town for meta and left him their. Both players were under pressure, both players are around equally competent for the sake of me evaluating what they can handle.

Drusilla posts can be found above.

Nahdia wasn't interacting to town, they were interacting with scum they needed to manipulate me off them and onto another "town" player.
Why defend Drusilla like that when I am playing like scum trying to get my vote off them? They literally weren't letting me adjust to avoid voting Drusilla.

Sorry if you think I am being unfair in your treatment over these last 3 pages, those Drusilla posts took me an incredibly long time to find because they don't reference Drusilla by name btw I also know you don't have the information I have as well and I am having trouble keeping that in mind.
Dunnstral is far more resolved you are scum then I am which is why I feel bad with this engagement, I just don't think your pair is TvT, and there is only so much I can do about that even if I do feel bad.

[beeboy]

Raven is a werewolf, nice.

[beeboy]

I have day talk in my werewolf factional PT, feel like the mafia have it as well.
Anyway yeah just end the day.

[beeboy]

I have day talk in my werewolf factional PT, feel like the mafia have it as well.
Anyway yeah just end the day.

[beeboy]

That was the hammer!
See you in the morning zzzzz

[beeboy]

VOTE: Drusilla


pedit: o?

[beeboy]

UNVOTE:

[beeboy]

pedit: o?

i know who visited kanna last night.

Was it you or Clover Ebi?
Because I am still not positive I trust your team tbh and I don't want one of you to fake a guilty on behalf of scum.

You can say it's scummy I am asking you this but a guilty that makes town mislynch twice is a pretty tempting play for any scum.

[beeboy]

Not what I was asking, more if it was Clover's claim, but Tuxedo/Chara was my compromise vote if I couldn't lynch you so whatever don't answer anymore.

I still think you should have holstered that result, but as soon as the words "I have a guilty" exit your mouth then....

[beeboy]

You ever get pushed for trying to lynch the actual scum day 1 by the other scum.
Then someone is still going to tin foil me :^)

[beeboy]

Nahdia hands down pushed me to make me back off Tux to look town.
I refuse to believe that isn't obvious that at this point.