Silent Star 2: Menagerie

[Isis]

I like Kanna

What made you change your read on her?

She keeps saying the things I would expect her to be thinking about if I were in her position. It could be good emulation, if so she's doing good. It's a win-win because she would have to believe she's good at scum then heehee

[Isis]

I guess fooling one person isn't everything but I savor the irony

[Isis]

You've had different experiences with shiki than I have, generally she makes brilliant posts and then we all ignore her

[Isis]

But in any case a wine swapping exercise doesn't rank as highly for me as a bayesian scumtell I find reliable so I'm just not super deterred.

Going up against RC directly is a pain so like 20% of the time that's why you should do it. Mafia is wifom etc

[Isis]

I was saying kanna is fooling me

[Isis]

It's a hard sell to me that shiki's play just this game is so so threatening you wouldn't fight her

[Isis]

I love Kanna

[Isis]

I thought shiki wasn't confident though? She hasn't even committed to voting pooky over her former loyal doublevote

[Isis]

drusilla is dropping for me because (soulread) i don't think she would be this confident in something based on this shaky evidence. shiki is so smart, she should be highly bopped. if things she's saying doesn't add up to us, she's probably just scum

to elaborate on this, i mean evidence for pooky being scum

They are very shady. But they don't seem overconfident he's scum. "I'm not ok assuming you are town" is pretty obviously several degrees from strong certainty on a scumread

Shading hard and scumreading hard aren't quite the same thing, it can often mean you think something's scummy but if that thing did flip town wow will you be mad about it

[Isis]

Hm
I think the pictionary was weakly town indicative. Do you really think it's fully equal probability to be posted by town and scum?

[Isis]

yes

but what i had in mind was the actual argument that that *is* somehow town indicative. that's the important bit

I disagree with an answer yes, I think it's a weakly town indicative thing

[Isis]

I don't understand what 857 is saying for what's it's worth

[Isis]

There's no no-execute.

Are you saying Kanna is scummy for not realizing that dru is townier because dru mistakenly thought scum knew extra about the setup, and if dru was scum she would know that extra information doesn't exist?

That is such a complicated sentence to write.

Pedit: seems to be what you're saying

[Isis]

Kanna if you were scum you would tell me right?

[Isis]

Kanna you are making my heartstrings wiggle

You wouldn't be evil enough to post like that as scum would you?

[Isis]

With Ydrasse and pooky also in this game I think I am going to have lots of emotional wrestling

[Isis]

If I was scum I wouldn't tell you cause I love you and I know you like mystery games with democratic eliminations and secrets in them

[Isis]

My heart is shaped like a harp with strings that go wiggle wiggle when someone is acting like an earnest bucketheaded townie incapable of wrong

[Isis]

873 is logical but I think there are townie things about the slot that override it

[Isis]

I'm melting

[Isis]

i skimmed pretty fast because preview-editting posts is annoying, I'm unsurprised if I made an error

[Isis]

unless i misread an older post too idk

[Isis]

I quoted one of Kanna's posts in the post immediately before that one so that's why I assumed it had some relation to Kanna, I was in error, sorry
I want Kanna and dru to both be town now

[Isis]

Sure, I guess that can be an incentive? Again, I don't think the explanation is that important. I've played mafia over a decade and have noticed scum care more about being right than town does. There's an RC quote that's something like "It's a lot more effective to hunt based not on what it seems like scum should do often, but instead on what they actually do often". It's something scum do often

[Isis]

yes what appear to be other buddying gifs to isis and taylor swift.

are those ones somehow game related?

This is the most alignment indicative post in the game for me atm.
This post is sarcastic ay ef.

Which is a feature that pops up in shiki's towngame, but not her scumgame.
She made similar sarcastic jabs, or half-rhetorical questions in Reservoir Dogs as town.

And it's a level of prickliness that is different to the only scumgame of hers I'm familiar with, which is this one.
When I reviewed her iso there, sarcasm did pop up after all - in a scum vs. scum interaction. And it makes plenty of intuitive sense why the quills would come out for that occasion but most of the time her scumgame would be softened. So there is an asterisk on this if Pooky is scum.
It's hard to townread anyone without insulting their scumrange but I see it less likely for drusilla to know in the back of her mind she is castigating actually upright behavior and still bring the barbs out when her approach does a lot more to build rapport with one person at a time as scum.

I'm probably townreading Kanna more than shiki now anyway but emotional manipulation has unfair outcomes

[Isis]

oh, huh.

i guess i'll keep that in mind. honestly i think a lot of people just wanna be right regardless b/c of pride but it makes sense that it's probably... easier to be right?

with a lot of tells you have to modify the confidence level based on personality. Individual users that project Survivor tell as VT are a pain where you have to rely on associative reads instead, or lack of content.

if someone had a track record for always wanting to be right you would have to dampen the tell as applied to that person but like if you base it on the average person in average conditions it works
I don't know of Pooky being excessively preoccupied with being right

[Isis]

drusilla is dropping for me because (soulread) i don't think she would be this confident in something based on this shaky evidence. shiki is so smart, she should be highly bopped. if things she's saying doesn't add up to us, she's probably just scum

i don't have any sort of experience playing w drusilla so i can't speak to the bop thing but the confidence that she's shown thus far has been offputting to me. i don't have a great amount of confidence in anyone anymore and seeing someone exhibit it feels weird because i can't make myself believe in anything that hard this game.

i'm struggling to figure out how to phrase it but it feels like drusilla has already made up her mind, to some degree, and is instead going through the motions of acting out a way to reach the conclusion she already has? which feels worse than the confidence part because that is maybe just game experience?

Confirmation bias is fundamentally town indicative even though it has a strictly negative effect on decisionmaking, so it's sometimes something that feels wrong/bad even though it applies to a slot that is town.

[Isis]

isis, how confident are you that this is drusilla's towngame?

I don't like percentages, but more confident than any one else's alignment in this game

[Isis]

Loki Doki are you saying you think drusilla/Pooky is T/T or Isis/Pooky is T/T

[Isis]

it is fascinating that the two players everyone agrees are the most recruitable are precisely the ones that got gladiated. I guess everyone agrees recruiting would mostly be conducted in an unwise fashion

[Isis]

It's just a funny coincidence. Taylor Swift doesn't know anybody. I don't know how much you know anybody. Not_Mafia has enough site presence that he ought to know everybody, I think. PlusJOYED I presumed hadn't played much since his recentish joined date since I haven't noticed much of him but Kanna snapped at me that Ydrasse knows more people this game than she does so I figured PlusJOYED must have played with Ydrasse so that comment can make sense?

When I say "knows everybody" I'm kind of exempting Tayl0r who just joined the site and you who I think was fully inactive before this game started.

The general notion that if it feels like the Pooky/Isis gladiate is TvT then it's doubled probability to be one of the players unfamiliar with other players seems like, not an illogical tilt.



I idly wonder whether Not_Mafia never recruits me here because I don't prefer his playstyle or always recruits me here because I don't prefer his playstyle. He was a pretty cooperative scumpartner the time I rolled scum with him but on the other hand I've been on record saying I think playing the way he does makes mafia less fun for me, so I wish he wouldn't.

Not_Mafia who would you recruit if you rolled scum this game?

[Isis]

I think when I said I felt more sure about shiki than any other slot I forgot Loki cause I'm just like not even mentally sorting him at this point lol

[Isis]

anyone who does not wish to townlock this slot into eternity has an obligation to talk to me before Pooky makes me tiger food rather than try to do so just after

[Isis]

Hectic, did the scum know, at the time of recruiting, that it would be broadcast to all players that recruitment occurred?

[Isis]

It's just a funny coincidence. Taylor Swift doesn't know anybody. I don't know how much you know anybody. Not_Mafia has enough site presence that he ought to know everybody, I think. PlusJOYED I presumed hadn't played much since his recentish joined date since I haven't noticed much of him but Kanna snapped at me that Ydrasse knows more people this game than she does so I figured PlusJOYED must have played with Ydrasse so that comment can make sense?

When I say "knows everybody" I'm kind of exempting Tayl0r who just joined the site and you who I think was fully inactive before this game started.

The general notion that if it feels like the Pooky/Isis gladiate is TvT then it's doubled probability to be one of the players unfamiliar with other players seems like, not an illogical tilt.


I idly wonder whether Not_Mafia never recruits me here because I don't prefer his playstyle or always recruits me here because I don't prefer his playstyle. He was a pretty cooperative scumpartner the time I rolled scum with him but on the other hand I've been on record saying I think playing the way he does makes mafia less fun for me, so I wish he wouldn't.

Not_Mafia who would you recruit if you rolled scum this game?

While the conventional wisdom is that scum would pick what would seem like more obvious choices, why couldn’t the opposite also be possible, if not probable? So we’re essentially focusing on who is the most logical recruits based on whom would be most likely to recruit whom but what if whosever’s scum here either isn’t that familiar with the playerlist or maybe is but deliberately selected a partner that no one would expect? Because my reads seem to be pointing that way.

When you say your reads are pointing that way, who are your top scumreads?

I think everyone could be scum so it could maybe be harmful to stay on the recruitment guessing topic too long.

[Isis]

PlusJOYED assumed that this was a setup where essentially the mafia are lovers and all the townies are also secret lovers and there is only one elimination, from among the gladiated players. Going off of that assumption, if Pooky and I were both town, Hectic would end the game early and announce that it was a scum victory. He would similarly need to end the game early and declare one faction the winner if Pooky and I were both scum, which could be viewed as a scumslip for plusJOYED not including that possibility for the sake of completion.

So he wasn't saying anything about the condemning process was guaranteed to offer a choice between a town and a scum, but that he thought the fact the game had not been concluded early indicated that it was a choice between a town and a scum.

[Isis]

932 is not a joke

[Isis]

PlusJOYED assumed that this was a setup where essentially the mafia are lovers and all the townies are also secret lovers and there is only one elimination, from among the gladiated players. Going off of that assumption,

if Pooky and I were both town, Hectic would end the game early and announce that it was a scum victory.

He would similarly need to end the game early and declare one faction the winner if Pooky and I were both scum, which could be viewed as a scumslip for plusJOYED not including that possibility for the sake of completion.

So he wasn't saying anything about the condemning process was guaranteed to offer a choice between a town and a scum, but that he thought the fact the game had not been concluded early indicated that it was a choice between a town and a scum.

so is plus assuming then that two town being nommed would end the game somehow??

i don't understand this explanation

The game would end early because town loses no matter who they eliminate.
If I was moderating a closed setup, and two goons nightkilled untill all that was left was a VT, an innocent child and a 1-shot town gladiator and the gladiator fired on the VT, I would declare the end of the game.

of course PlusJOYED's assumption that we are currently in eLo because of a bastard mechanic that makes the next elim decide the game is a really bizarre assumption. But the conclusion does follow.

[Isis]

Ydrasse is not dumb

[Isis]

you're a mage mages are smart

[Isis]

PlusJOYED assumed that this was a setup where essentially the mafia are lovers and all the townies are also secret lovers and there is only one elimination, from among the gladiated players. Going off of that assumption, if Pooky and I were both town, Hectic would end the game early and announce that it was a scum victory. He would similarly need to end the game early and declare one faction the winner if Pooky and I were both scum, which could be viewed as a scumslip for plusJOYED not including that possibility for the sake of completion.

So he wasn't saying anything about the condemning process was guaranteed to offer a choice between a town and a scum, but that he thought the fact the game had not been concluded early indicated that it was a choice between a town and a scum.

i never said/assumed that. What is a secret lover? I did think this was the final phase here but people convinced me otherwise, mainly by bringing up silent star 1 which i didnt know about

lover is a role that makes connected players all die together if any of them die. A secret lover would be someone who was not informed that they were afflicted with this condition

[Isis]

You said in one of your posts you thought the game would end after Pooky or I was eliminated, so it's just a rephrasing of your position

[Isis]

I didn't break down the townslip into its nuts and bolts because I think most/all the players would follow but you said you thought scum recruitment would happen day 2, and a scum could not possibly think that, because they would already have chatted with their new partner during day 1. My transition in my read on you was based on that being a strong evidence you were town and not based on your vote/pressure being cast on me and wanting to relieve it. I'm now at a juncture where it's important to figure out whether you were lying about thinking the scum teammate was recruited after day 1 because if it's not a lie you're 100% town and if it's a lie you're 99% scum (some people very few people lie as scum please don't be one of those people I beseech everyone)

pedit: drusilla posted something but I'm addressing PLUS

[Isis]

drusilla should I townread you for being sarcastic?

[Isis]

if i die townlock dru and loki and sort the other slots

EZ game

[Isis]

Maybe I'll just use the snowy one on days I feel happy.

I don't feel happy today.

[Isis]

why did your sig change.......

I was picking a game to play and I saw "kanna_sig.txt" on my desktop, and remembered, oh that's where I stored my sig for when I probably change it back sometime
And having just changed my avatar it seemed like a good time

it's a nice sig that demonstrates Kanna's inherent desire to bulli me.

[Isis]

¶

Votecount 1.15

[1] Isis:

PlusJOYED

[0] PookyTheMagicalBear:

[8] Not Voting:

Isis, PookyTheMagicalBear, Kanna, Ydrasse, Tayl0r Swift, Not_Mafia, Lokie Dokie, drusilla

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to execute. If there is no majority by the deadline, the mafia will choose who to execute.
The deadline is in (expired on 2020-09-20 19:59:58).

Joint Mod ISO.

Hey guys, what are we going to do if I’m right - which I think I am - on both Pooky/Isis being town? Like how do we even decide this?

Few things less fun then deciding which probable townie to whack. If there was ever a good time for a no execurz, this would obviously be it but unfortunately that isn’t an option.:/

You either pick who you are more likely to be wrong about, or pick the person you are more like to change your mind about later and decide should be eliminated after all. Those are pretty similar selections.

[Isis]

it's a nice sig that demonstrates Kanna's inherent desire to bulli me.

only because you bulli me first :I

it's ok, at the end of the day, i still love you very much

That's my smile for today

[Isis]

i also feel like plus/taylor have possibly dumbtold and there's a lot of dumbtelling that i don't believe all of it is legit. but that's something else

plusjoyed's "dumbtelling" about dumbtelling itself, like, being slow to pick up and accept that I would have a rapid read change based on dumbtelling, actually gives me better feelings and seems to have more reliable realness than the original dumbtell. Though still not foolproof. But I think it's funny that the dumbtell inception is even stronger.

[Isis]

Kanna I already smiled for today

[Isis]

I think scum will probably want to eliminate whichever townie is townreading scum, if we're both scum

[Isis]

it makes the little sound effects pop into my head

[Isis]

I would prefer you want to go pooky because you can see my townie heart

[Isis]

nyao nyao

this is a townpost

[Isis]

I think Pooky is still in the middle of my reads

[Isis]

drusilla why do you seem different this game?

[Isis]

would you recruit Pooky if you drew mafia, dru?

[Isis]

drusilla why do you seem different this game?

i don't think i can judge why i seem different this game to you. like i could theorize if you want. or walk you through my thought process and how it may differ this game from other games, but why i seem different to you feels like something you'd have to answer.

this post makes me visualize the shiki avatar because it seems so not-different to me, ironically.
hm
you passed me the ball back but I'm not sure what I want to do with it.

[Isis]

no, i would have recruited loki dokie because i was upset with myself during signups because i wanted skitter to play so i felt sad when loki got un-wotm-ed and that was like really really unfair of me because i don't know loki dokie.

10,000,000,000 times unfair because i could have /outed so skitter could have played, and had it been pretty much any other game i probably would have.

but if you outed I wouldn't get to play with you

[Isis]

would you have recruited me Isis?

My original answer is still my best estimate, I think I would have used a randomized system that subsidized some of my favorite picks, including you.

[Isis]

shiki you know if I did the Reservoir dogs playerlist over again I'd still want you as a teammate even though we lost, right?!?!? you have fun posts you're fun to play with. You're on my favorites list.

[Isis]

Loki Doki that made me look at your iso. Are you an alt?

[Isis]

if you don't want to say whether you're an alt it's o.k...but I meant I noticed that your join date is Dec 20, 2019, but your first post anywhere onsite is September 18, 2020, so you're probably an alt

[Isis]

teach me an animal fact

[Isis]

That's a very pretty piece, but it seems like a somber one?

I did not know that big cats sleep like that. I also like to sleep.

[Isis]

Kanna I have a confession

[Isis]

I beat the game but I didn't do all the routes but I'm catching up now

[Isis]

Alice is not being very grateful about my completionism right now

[Isis]

I'm playing it again for soothe

[Isis]

Hm
I had an emotional response to Kanna's post that I then tried to describe and I don't know if I would have even had the emotional response as mafia. At least not that intensity.
I don't like to believe I have a limited scumrange though so I try to think of ways. Maybe I could remember posting it as town in a previous game and mimicking

[Isis]

That seems like pretty high praise for someone with such an old join date

[Isis]

Kanna and I have a beautiful bond ^^

[Isis]

Ydrasse, Not Mafia, and Tayl0r Swift rank below you.

Ydrasse - it's more likely to have trouble getting footing in a game as scum compared to town. It feels mean when you have to scumread someone who is struggling if they are actually town, but that's how it is.
N_M - I felt like he didn't meme in any phase of the game as much as he would if town.
Tayl0r - being irritating in condemn phase is very weakly town indicative, I'm underwhelmed now. People have pointed out some possible inconsistency in her condemn phase mind set

[Isis]

Good night Pooky

[Isis]

I forgot to comment to Pooky about Loki and PLUS, I think Loki is much more townlock than PLUS because he's been consistent and showed his mindset. For example it wigged me out when PLUS said he wants to simplify the gladiator phase but didn't volunteer what is making him feel that way

[Isis]

Kanna rolled town. I remember this one time town!Same posted something AtEish and then said he doesn't think it's in his town range to use AtE in quite that manner as scum.

I think Kanna couldn't do quite what she did here as scum.
I want that to be couldn't, not wouldn't, because she knows I like social deduction games with people killed by majority decisions so I would want her to trick me because she loves me.

[Isis]

She couldn't AtE or she couldn't trick you? I'm a bit confused about what you are saying she couldn't do ?

She could AtE, the same posts may each be AtE posts in the universe where she is scum, they just couldn't be done as well.

It's like, if a boxer was boxing his brother because they had both gotten so far up the tournament bracket they had to fight, he could punch. But he wouldn't be able to really throw a haymaker. So when you see the haymaker when you watch the fight. You know hm actually maybe they happen to have the same last name

[Isis]

I think I never understood that song before Kanna explained. Sadly I have never cried from music, only books and film and plays. It is a sweeter song now that I understand it is about memorable moments

[Isis]

i want to ask isis yttd questions but so many spoilers

i'm really happy i rolled town so i can buddy isis to OBLIVION

p-edit: ?!?!?!

Would you not buddy me if you were scum?

[Isis]

I don't think I'm a very high AtE player which makes it hard to measure whether I AtE more as town or scum. I think I maybe AtE a little bit when I'm well positioned as town and not at all when I'm well positioned as scum, and not at all when I'm poorly positioned as scum and some when I'm poorly positioned as scum, and it always gets me killed anyway, but I don't resort to it until it's so late it's pretty much lolcatting so it doesn't matter that much.
I did this random thread of consciousness wallpost as town recently in response to Farren voting me, which wasn't a terrible position but the game was so evenly balanced at that point it was bad. I'm not sure if it would qualify as AtE.

I would definitely trust someone else's opinion on this over mine

[Isis]

She's scummy even without using any meta though

[Isis]

Oh no I accidentally flipped my avi

[Isis]

Wait does this mean it's wrong that half of why I paranoia Kanna is a marathon she destroyed me in?

[Isis]

I woke up with pandora in my lap so my day started right

[Isis]

+1

[Isis]

I find plus tough, there is a little bit of threads of what feels like possibly genuine paranoia that makes me think maybe town. Aside from the slip or notslip

[Isis]

shiki made me a mixtape

[Isis]

Hmm

[Isis]

I think this is scum but I wish I knew it was scum the way Loki seems to

[Isis]

It's just flavor that acknowledges the vote. Actual game mechanics wouldn't be conveyed in flavor only.

[Isis]

Loki wants me to feed him should I do so

[Isis]

Taylor do you think Loki is scummy?

[Isis]

her lack of commitment and detachment is very scum-indicative. Mafia usually do feel detached in these nomination scenarios when they do not have anything at stake.

Especially when in those towngames I referenced, she played 180 degrees differently. And think about this, we all choose our respective animals because we actually LIKE those animals and therefore try to find the images we like the most but what does Tayl0r post? diseased sickly dogs. Do you think when she signed up for this game, she was enthusiastic to post those types of grotesque pictures? But she would very likely be upset if she got a red role PM and that very possibly could have affected the images she selected. Kanna managed to find cute bat picks but Tayl0r couldn’t even find one cute doggie?

And her growling and barking at Isis and me for liking one of her posts was strange and then she topped it off by voting for her both days, so hiding behind the Isis is a cat thing, how isn’t that antitown? But had she then not claimed it was “random”, at least it would be consistent but then she claims it wasn’t random, it’s because Isis was a cat. Now, if she was actually doing some solving here, making reads etc., I’d ignore all of the above but we have an important decision to make and Tayl0r apparently has no opinion on it and isn’t even putting a good faith effort in actually trying and when I contrast that with those three games of hers - marathon or not - the difference is clearly striking.

THIS IS SO MANIPULATIVE. if you know me youll know that i very much enjoy pushing buttons and posting images like that. i was having a blast. and had i rolled scum i probably would have done the same thing, and had even more fun doing it. youll see beaucoup shitposting in all my games (marathon games excepted somewhat because marathon games dont really allow time for that)

This is another contradiction... you said you were in a rush to get to the phase where you could post unrestricted, and it's intuitive that collective tolerance for posting images would drop at that point. Now you say you were loving the post restricted phase

[Isis]

yiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiikes

[Isis]

her lack of commitment and detachment is very scum-indicative. Mafia usually do feel detached in these nomination scenarios when they do not have anything at stake.

Especially when in those towngames I referenced, she played 180 degrees differently. And think about this, we all choose our respective animals because we actually LIKE those animals and therefore try to find the images we like the most but what does Tayl0r post? diseased sickly dogs. Do you think when she signed up for this game, she was enthusiastic to post those types of grotesque pictures? But she would very likely be upset if she got a red role PM and that very possibly could have affected the images she selected. Kanna managed to find cute bat picks but Tayl0r couldn’t even find one cute doggie?

And her growling and barking at Isis and me for liking one of her posts was strange and then she topped it off by voting for her both days, so hiding behind the Isis is a cat thing, how isn’t that antitown? But had she then not claimed it was “random”, at least it would be consistent but then she claims it wasn’t random, it’s because Isis was a cat. Now, if she was actually doing some solving here, making reads etc., I’d ignore all of the above but we have an important decision to make and Tayl0r apparently has no opinion on it and isn’t even putting a good faith effort in actually trying and when I contrast that with those three games of hers - marathon or not - the difference is clearly striking.

THIS IS SO MANIPULATIVE. if you know me youll know that i very much enjoy pushing buttons and posting images like that. i was having a blast. and had i rolled scum i probably would have done the same thing, and had even more fun doing it. youll see beaucoup shitposting in all my games (marathon games excepted somewhat because marathon games dont really allow time for that)

This is another contradiction... you said you were in a rush to get to the phase where you could post unrestricted, and it's intuitive that collective tolerance for posting images would drop at that point. Now you say you were loving the post restricted phase

like holy shit if i were scum i feel like id have a better story about my posts than that, or id just effort. if you think this is a scumslip you must think im very very very stupid. thats pretty disrespectful honestly.

I'm not sure how scum indicative it is but I don't think pointing it out is disrespectful

[Isis]

I don't think Ydrasse is town

[Isis]

Loki doesn't seem as towny when he's being reactive rather than proactive but that's probably situational and I will probably stick with my early read

[Isis]

VOTE: PookyTheMagicalBear

[Isis]

it was just a feel, I see where you're coming from.
she's not playing in a way that's particularly townreadable

[Isis]

1112 felt like assimilating to a consensus viewpoint without sharing independent reasons for getting there and 1123 without much a preliminary view of Tayl0r struck me like a feigned interest.

Not sure either of those are her most recent post or the one you're referencing

[Isis]

I agree that dru is obvtown, she's my second highest read

the gladiate situation seemed to have a more townie effect on her play compared to tayl0r I think? And compared to Ydrasse, something about Ydrasse's complain felt off to me, even though there's a pretty wide view that the gladiate is likely TvT

[Isis]

yeah by complaint I mean I think she's overstating the extent to which it is frustrating to need to choose to vote me or Pooky today. Pooky and I don't find it so so frustrating. I think it's an emulated feeling. I'm not slamdunk on that.

I've only played with Ydrasse when she was scum, here: viewtopic.php?f=51&t=83971&start=3200

[Isis]

I want to note that N_M isn't hammering here and no majority gives mafia control

[Isis]

No, I wanted to point out something that in 3 hours I won't have the posting privileges to point out. It has a collateral risk of incentivizing N_M to hammer but from my PoV that's not strategically negative, only maybe emotionally negative
pedit: yeah I am suspecting him as scum.
It works even if you're town but especially if you're scum

[Isis]

I gave you a list of three and NM was featured, it's not a large distance of shift. His disengagement this game has looked bad

[Isis]

it's probably more likely we're both town nand N_M just wants to invert the democracy and condemn you later

[Isis]

if he doesn't hammer here I will die. Ydrasse doesn't usually log on in the next two hours.

N_M is killing me here and I want everyone to pay attention that he has been onsite during this time

[Isis]

well, shouldve peditted, but don't you scumread me taylor?

[Isis]

I gave you a list of three and NM was featured, it's not a large distance of shift. His disengagement this game has looked bad

Yes but what you said about NM/me being S/S and him not hammering me because he's S with me is a large shift from TS/Ydrasse and it doesn't make sense because NM already hammered me once this game..

it's irrelevant N_M hammered you because it's NM. I saw him hammer his partner before they could post day1 of a micro with mild suspicion once

[Isis]

if you read my posts on this page i've been primarily concerned with what it says about N_M's alignment, and the secondary impacts of what it says about your alignment has only been drawn out by your asking me leading questions about it

[Isis]

Did you mean "hammer as town also"? I think it is extremely scummy that he isn't here to hammer

[Isis]

Like he would normally be checking this game to see if he would get to hammer the other wagon, as both alignments, but the way this game has gone disinterest makes more sense if he's scum, and he cares about winning a fifth of his games based on some kind of random function so wanting to do the scum control the vote thing could explain the deviation

it's actually probably more likely he's just very afk disengaged scum actually though

[Isis]

why would I not want someone to vote the same person I'm voting?

I feel like we're talking past eachother or am I missing something about what's upsetting you. You know there's two hours left before the mafia control the vote, right? There's actually colorable arguments for self hammering actually

[Isis]

if this actually makes me more miscondemnable I should maybe selfhammer with taylor

taylor does this page make me look a lot scummier than pooky?

[Isis]

because there is a 100% chance I get eliminated here, Ydrasse awol, Taylor preferring to vote you (until finding out just now she doesn't care) -> 3 hours expire -> Hectic has

written into the game mechanics

that time expires and then mafia PM who they want to eliminate, and I think it would always be me.

[Isis]

I would prefer to ask my townreads but I don't think any of them will be available in the next 3 hours

[Isis]

are you using the term "shot" to refer to controlling the vote decision? That's confusing so you need to clarify

[Isis]

Why would it "conftown me" if they eliminated you with the controlled vote?

[Isis]

If I scumread someone in a 2/8 that means I think the chance they are scum is like 35% instead of 25%. I do not have strong confidence when I play mafia and I keep in mind that my townreads might be scum and my scumreads might be town.

Even if Taylor is scum, being asked the question to commit herself to a read she has to stick with if she doesn't want to look scummy which could make it harder for her to win the dayplay.

[Isis]

Why would it "conftown me" if they eliminated you with the controlled vote?

It wouldn't - that's why the POE would be wider if I get executed by the mafia today - hence why I think it would be me dying either by lynch or by mafia today.

i don't understand why the POE size isn't the same either way, except I'm even more townread than you so I'd be less likely to backslide into the red part of PoE

[Isis]

Does my posts on this page and the last really fully invert your strong read from the other 48?

[Isis]

Could you explain why you think I would try to bait N_M into hammering instead of just letting the deadline expire if I'm scum

[Isis]

just to cut off the possibility Ydrasse logs on and votes me and then Tayl0r swift does, I guess?
I don't think N_M is even reading this thread though

[Isis]

Hmmm

[Isis]

drusilla! Do you think I should selfvote?

[Isis]

Kanna and dru you are both town! <3

[Isis]

This is like, such a neat micro

[Isis]

yeah no posting restrictions, we got a daystart PM, Hectic would remember to precede the daystart PM with the restrictions

[Isis]

you break my heart PlusJOYED
I don't think Pooky was like obvscum but I think he definitely should have seemed shadier!
also drusilla is a beacon of brilliance

[Isis]

i gotta say, me and taylor were probably on the scummier side this game, I don't get why we would have been chosen to be confirmed

Tayl0r didn't get confirmed town, you can stop townslipping now you are actually confirmed town lol

[Isis]

at a macro level, we can win the game by deciding that either {Not_Mafia}, {Tayl0r Swift}, or {YDrasse AND Loki Dokie} is town.

[Isis]

I really would prefer to win the game by deciding that Kanna is town
Hectic fix it

[Isis]

over the night phase I finished all the routes through YTTD that I am aware of

[Isis]

Kanna and dru you are both town! <3

You’re actually shocked by that? The only flip that actually shocked me was Pooky’s.

No, nothing about the exclamation has to do with my expectations being contradicted.
I wasn't particularly surprised by Pooky's flip either, not that it matters.

[Isis]

Loki Doki why did you choose to be lovers with Ydrasse?

[Isis]

I was trying to see if I could bait a townslip
I don't know why I bother, you're not the scummier part of your lovership right now

[Isis]

I rly wanted to paranoia plusJOYED getting conftowned over Loki
but like geez look at this

[Isis]

I was trying to see if I could bait a townslip
I don't know why I bother, you're not the scummier part of your lovership right now

You can’t possibly play 180 degrees differently as town than you’re doing here and not be scum.

I didn't follow this
does it mean you think I'm towny?

[Isis]

Loki's posts make me laugh.
I considered selfhammering maybe.
My level of consideration was at like 10% though

[Isis]

if Tayl0r is scum why didn't she pretend to be akf and use the deadline to eliminate me?

[Isis]

*afk


she showed up to cast the vote we needed to reach e-0

[Isis]

NM is paired with me because I was scumspecting him for not hammering Pooky. He's probably actually town.

[Isis]

I don't think that's AI

[Isis]

Ok, it is a little AI. Just not a ton

[Isis]

town can be disengaged too

I looked at Ydrasse's posting schedule and confirmed she would be due to log in a couple hours after the deadline-drama time period. If she actually showed up to hammer, it would have been the first time she posted during that part of a 24 hour cycle this game

[Isis]

there's like a really good chance of ydrasse and pooky recruiting eachother because they knew it would be fun

[Isis]

I almost want it not to be true because Ydrasse isn't having more fun

[Isis]

I think it was WIFOM

[Isis]

I would like to feel more confident betting the game on N_M town but I don't feel that confident on it.
seeing as how he has not done all that much

[Isis]

I don't know! This is like NK WIFOM and I hate it >_<
I prefer the kind of mafia where I find slips and stuff

[Isis]

i am glad I am not the only confirmed town DRU AND KANNA HELP ME I AM OUT HERE STRUGGLING

[Isis]

Why isn't your confidence shaken more when Pooky surprised you and flipped scum?

[Isis]

VOTE: Isis

[Isis]

Loki if you think it's taylor and you think Ydrasse is a less likely partner than N_M, why are you ok with flipping Taylor and eliminating you if that's wrong?

[Isis]

UNVOTE: I'm going to subvert the treestump mechanic by not voting how I want to. I'm going to proxy my vote to Kanna. PlusJOYED I suggest you proxy your vote to drusilla. Then we flip upside down which people the scum wanted to be voting. We can be tree stumps and Kanna and drusilla can be the voting ICs instead.

Kanna is voting nobody therefore currently I am voting nobody.

[Isis]

I do think you might be irrationally tunneled and it's worrying how a dramatic bus just didn't even register.

Subverting a scumread for a nitpicky reason like game format seems like it would come out of a veteran scum playbook even when the target is town just because of how it can confuse the game state, that's why I don't think that's a slam dunk

[Isis]

How did swift treat her partners in the games you read? Did she harshly betray them as scum like she would have had to have done here?

[Isis]

But drusilla what if I'm trying to abdicate responsibility and stress-shakes and not actually trying to develop a winning strategy X_X

[Isis]

But you thought Pooky was super townie. So did PlusJOYED. Why would she bus a partner who could endgame when she could just pretend she hadn't seen the thread

[Isis]

But drusilla what if I'm trying to abdicate responsibility and stress-shakes and not actually trying to develop a winning strategy X_X

uneasy lies the head that wears a crown

Am I a queen now

[Isis]

This game is too many smiles

[Isis]

I think maybe you missed something if you didn't see the thread develop in real time
Like it felt like me and Pooky were talking and no one else was showing up
And then suddenly there were enough votes for a hammer

[Isis]

Why would we lose

[Isis]

Each lover pairing has at least one unconfirmed player. So there's two executions until we lose. Tomorrow it's possible a confirmed townie has to self vote if they believe their partner is scum, today confirmed townies can put that unpleasantry off if they prefer

[Isis]

But PlusJOYED drusilla isn't voting for taylor

[Isis]

I was addressing Loki, I'm not sure he has his head wrapped around it quite yet

[Isis]

Taylor why didn't you invite me to self vote yesterday

[Isis]

loki dokie votes pookythemagicalbear in 1.6 putting to E-1; why if mafia?

I already had him as locktown but I guess there can always be more chains and padlocks

[Isis]

Ydrasse could have put an unconfirmed player with herself for wifom


this would kind of explain confirming PLUS as town instead of confirming Loki as town, maybe

[Isis]

I would love if I could figure out that Ydrasse was set up to be first execution due to Ydrasse coming to the thread and townspewing

[Isis]

I didn't interpret it that way and I sure hope she was not

[Isis]

What do you find scummy about NM, T?

[Isis]

I would love if I could figure out that Ydrasse was set up to be first execution due to Ydrasse coming to the thread and townspewing

does this:

@Ydrasse

I told myself I was going to write you beautiful poems when I saw you in the list of players for this game.

Some crazy things happened that kind of derailed these plans.

You see I was turned into a Tiger, and then a Dolphin and neither are very conducive to writing poetry - our moderator has a wicked sense of humor.

By the time I could speak again, I had been condemned and had to deal with a trial of sorts and I think I'm going to die now.

It's almost surreal this feeling - how death gives you a sharp focus on what's important in life - I love you and will miss you dearly - I wish we did not have to say goodbye so here's a song for you;





Maybe next time we play together things will turn out a little bit less tragic - you have my heart always <3 - now and forever..

read more like 'hey come to the thread and vote for isis' or 'you are my mafia partner'?

you're giving me more indirect reasons to townread her when I want to do so directly!

[Isis]

I think drusilla was trying to side with you on that thought, Loki

last time I played with scum!Ydrasse everyone but me had a very easy time catching her

[Isis]

sleep well Ydrasse

[Isis]

Loki I promise not to blame you if we lose this game you had above average play through the game imo

sometimes I just don't always agree with someone and that's part of mafia

[Isis]

I might vote for Taylor today or tomorrow

let's keep sorting we have lots of days to play here

[Isis]

drusilla you are good at mafia

[Isis]

Loki I promise not to blame you if we lose this game you had above average play through the game imo

sometimes I just don't always agree with someone and that's part of mafia

Let’s say we vote NM and game doesn’t end and Ydrasse is town, then we freaking lose.

If you convince PlusJOYED to vote Taylor and Ydrasse agrees, then you win the final day

[Isis]

Kanna is in a different timezone from us I think. I look forward to her inputs

[Isis]

drusilla, do you think NM recruits Pooky? Because I don't think Pooky recruits NM

[Isis]

shiki when are we gonna roll scum together

[Isis]

ok but what is the logic behind Pooky/PlusJoyed.

Do you think I would recruit PlusJoyed or do you think PlusJoyed would've recruited me? Either scenario IMO is a long shot since I've basically never played with him.

can you please explain why you wanted to put PlusJOYED as the 2nd condemnation?

plusjoyed made sense in various worlds to me and their play individually seemed the scummiest out of the non-you players to me, and isis who i was townreading voted there. would you have chosen plusjoyed? somewhat unlikely. would plusjoyed have chosen you? quite possibly.

Why would PlusJoyed choose me? He's literally never played with me before. and then we open up as the first 2 posters? I mean cmon really?

THIS Is WHY PLUSJOYED Was CONFIRMED.

could you explain

[Isis]

I have an announcement

[Isis]

This is the announcement

Spoiler:

[Isis]

That's exactly why it's a 9d chess move though

[Isis]

I would have bet the game on this progression, Kanna. Possibly even if drusilla was unconfirmed, but definitely against anyone else.
When Pooky highlighted it I felt even surer rereading it

Spoiler:

857 relates to specifically this part of this post

i think it's still right to consider pooky town for the second condemn phase because if he was, we would have a better chance pulling down scum if we went with what he wantedyet if he was scum, he would pull us town but we would already have one scum caught

a lot of this is why i attempted to ask him 'where do we go from here?' which was apparently lost in animal sounds.

i said "we should consider pooky town for c2 because that gives us the best chance to find scum"
dru agrees here and apparently she had also been thinking something similar during c2 (that's why she was asking pooky where he wanted to go)
but when it actually came to the execution part of it, she goes plusjoy

it seems weird to me she got to the point of knowing what pooky wanted was important, and seemed to care enough to try and find that out, but then ignored it when she got the answer

the tmi thing is also relatively nai, just saying. dru/isis are all good players and i think the best way to catch them out is finding what their motivation is

i think drusilla's motivation today has clearly been to advocate for a pooky elim and looking at the reasons, i find them p shaky. she's better than this. which means it's possible she's covering for isis so we should GO ISIS

like i'm feeling slightly iffied because i can't be more convincing because some of this is soulread but i'm trying my best and i just really want this

Kanna you are making my heartstrings wiggle

You wouldn't be evil enough to post like that as scum would you?

what does it mean to have your heartstrings wiggle?

this is like my townie heart at it's peak

[Isis]

!!! i think it's amazing how much work went into it that the choices you make matters in the game! i'm also curious what choices you made the first time but i suppose that's spoilery

I think you know enough about me to know what one of the choices I preferred was

[Isis]

It's pretty easy to overthink N_M play.

[Isis]

I want to hug Kanna

[Isis]

I had the same paranoia about Loki not being confirmed and how narrow his focus on Taylor is right now. But his thought process itself still seems town to me. On a macro level he is pushing the chess pieces the way they would need to be pushed if he is scum, but I feel like he is still wiggling them into the corners of spaces like a townie as he moves them.

It does feel a little like throwing not to clear Taylor for the hammer. I want to continue to play to maybe nail down that read.

[Isis]

i lean town on her today so far

[Isis]

Who do you want to eliminate taylor

[Isis]

Which alignment reveal surprised you the most and why?

[Isis]

Why did you vote him instead of selfing with me then? I didn't understand your first explanation

[Isis]

Lol
Loki you're pretty towny but not townie enough to get sarcastic about.

Mafia is naturally subject to lots of conflicting interpretations

[Isis]

Mafia is a lot more fun to play if you expect to be scumread and just get pleasantly surprised when you're townread

[Isis]

1489 seems like a townpost to me and Ydrasse seems pretty scummy so far

[Isis]

i think if NM is mafia hed vote me today. so i think the scum is in loki or ydrasse.

does that make sense?

No, I very rarely and cautiously try to predict the way miltank plays