Open 797: Bus Service [Game Over]

[MiniVirgo]

Sup fam, it's ya boi. I've gotta jet for work now but I'll post later.

Obligatory since shelly is there and they're always wolf
VOTE: BigElephant

~ JV

[MiniVirgo]

"*Casts vote*

Oops that might get pushback

*here's a dumb reason*"

Thought process of a page 1 scum

This is a stretch

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

"*Casts vote*

Oops that might get pushback

*here's a dumb reason*"

Thought process of a page 1 scum

hey I have a question: is scumreading the mod funny? personally, I do not think so.
~redados

It’s not funny, it’s hilarious

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

i have an even better question: who scumread the mod?

They’re in the Mafia PT so they’re mafia, trust me on this because I’m in there

[MiniVirgo]

i have an even better question: who scumread the mod?

They’re in the Mafia PT so they’re mafia, trust me on this because I’m in there

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: MiniVirgo

I played JV twice, and they were scum both times. This hydra is obviously an attempt to channel the funding for their terrorist organization without being detected by the IRS.

And you’ve read me correctly both times owo , one I claimed an impossible role but that game doesn’t exist to me anymore lol

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Also yes I am attempting that
- JV

[MiniVirgo]

no one scum read the mod my dear derp
~redados

so are u townreading the mod?

har har har
VOTE: derp

Who posted this

- Jv

[MiniVirgo]

Should we be hypo claiming in this setup considering there’s a cop a silent bus driver

[MiniVirgo]

Should we be hypo claiming in this setup considering there’s a cop a silent bus driver

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Also a Cop is only 50% reliable due to the scum bus drive

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

Obligatory since shelly is there and they're always wolf

gamblers = confirmed bad
OMGUS! VOTE: MiniVirgo

Should we be hypo claiming in this setup considering there’s a cop a silent bus driver

imo, im not good at mech but I think town bus driver should *avoid* driving nulls (cop invest nulls) and drive townreads with scumreads to outWIFOM the nightkill
I think hypoclaiming is a good idea

-shelly

We should never tell the Cop who to check, as scum have a bus drive and it has higher priority than the Town one.

We should really just hypo who we "bus drive" and who we "copped", although still iffy on the latter as it might give away the cop via some non-cops being wrong etc.


pedit: Hypo'ing cop is not as important as the bus drive, as the latter can mess with the former if unaware.
- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Also like ass that was an accident, you did that to egopost on your main didn't ya


And yeah scum can self bus drive
- JV

[MiniVirgo]

A couple things for this setup

One, I don't think it was ever played before. (correct me if im wrong) So we're in uncharted territory
Two, mafia will try to mess with cop results with their factional bus. Will most likely happen they think cop will check one of them. This means reduced cop effectiveness, that said, town should still aim to maximize cop's effectiveness
Three, town BD *should* try to protect the most pro-town voice

1. Oofers
2/3. Scum has their own bus drive, that happens before Town's meaning that protective the most pro-town is semi-useless and we shouldn't

ever

tell the Cop who to check. Not even in a given poe, they can decide on their own.

[MiniVirgo]

A couple things for this setup

One, I don't think it was ever played before. (correct me if im wrong) So we're in uncharted territory
Two, mafia will try to mess with cop results with their factional bus. Will most likely happen they think cop will check one of them. This means reduced cop effectiveness, that said, town should still aim to maximize cop's effectiveness
Three, town BD *should* try to protect the most pro-town voice

1. Oofers
2/3. Scum has their own bus drive, that happens before Town's meaning that protective the most pro-town is semi-useless and we shouldn't

ever

tell the Cop who to check. Not even in a given poe, they can decide on their own.

This was from JV

[MiniVirgo]

UNVOTE:
Light early TR on yessiree for thinking about setup and solving, and same for JV (though JV is very good scum)

pedit: thats a spicy theory :eyes

Is my theory true

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

just dont give results for the "copped" and let the real cop soft somehow? or just have very good reads and be a great scumhunter
or just claim innos as hypo

btw where is mini
-shelly

I think we should just do something like

Bus Drive - MiniVirgo/Big Elephant
Cop - Big Elephant (inno)

That way we have a 50% clear on any town that the real cop hypoclaimed, more or less chance depending on who and when it was.

Also mini is busy, but they'll post soon.
-JV

[MiniVirgo]

yes

i'm smort

[MiniVirgo]

- JV

That's gonna get really annoying until I get into a habit lol

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I'll send a few links soon, but in general when hypoclaiming NEVER fake a guilty and if a Cop does get a guilty, they should claim and out it most likely
Also scum will almost likely just yeet their scummiest or towniest member to not get caught by the Cop.

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

Hello everyone!!

-Mini

[MiniVirgo]

*cries in shouldn't say who the cop should check but you do it anyway*

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think Yessiree, Elephant is town.

Shelly's overall tone is vastly different than scum!them, although I'm not unvoting

[MiniVirgo]

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

2/3. Scum has their own bus drive, that happens before Town's meaning that protective the most pro-town is semi-useless and we shouldn't ever tell the Cop who to check. Not even in a given poe, they can decide on their own.

not really imo, but i need to think about this more but at first glance i think scum would try to use SBD to make sure their kill doesn't get interfered with TBD(?)

im trying to think if this is really a disadvantage for the SBD to resolve before TBD but just to make sure

@MOD if both bus drives choose the same 2 targets {P1,P5} and the kill is sent to P1, is the kill directed to P5, or re-directed to P1?

P1 -> P5 for the scum transport meaning the kill goes to 5
P5 -> P1 means at the end P1 will die.

[MiniVirgo]

@Not_Mafia, do you not see how it would benefit us? If you can't can you explain?

[MiniVirgo]

@Not_Mafia, do you not see how it would benefit us? If you can't can you explain?

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think shelly and I are both super paranoid of the other, shelly's really good at pocketing people so beware lol

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

Self townbloccing is kinda eh

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

But seriously, hypo claiming is a bad idea IMHO, because Scum also have a factional BD.

I thought hypo-claiming was saying it the day after


N1 - Bussing X and Y
D2 - Hypo: Bussed X and Y



- JV

[MiniVirgo]

IF that's what you meant, then I guess it's fine. The problem was with people suggesting we hypo claim BD beforehand and then the Cop decides where to check. I don't see a major problem with the hypo claiming after the fact.

Yeah I see the issue with beforehand but afterwards would be benefical, if the town!BD dies. We put heavy salt on a claimed Cops result.

[MiniVirgo]

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

She draws some undeserved scumreads. I recently replaced into a game that lost it's whole first day to Shelly vs. The world shenanigans and then she flipped town

That’s nai for them, they attract heat as either alignment.

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

Also nice avi

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I am not even "scum" hunting at this time. I am more "town" hunting and will ry to solve via PoE. Neither Elephant nor Prof made it to my TRs list, so I guess you're entitled to SR them both.

Does that mean I have

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think both Johnny and MWNN are easy town. Elephant is a light TR since they haven't full aggro'd yet but that's a bias read.

Redados, do you follow the same reads as shelly. Either answer could you explain it.

[MiniVirgo]

I think both Johnny and MWNN are easy town. Elephant is a light TR since they haven't full aggro'd yet but that's a bias read.

Redados, do you follow the same reads as shelly. Either answer could you explain it.

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

btw, MiniMegabyte, do you follow the same reads as JacksonVirgo. Either answer could you explain it.

-shelly

Why did you copy my exact question

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I'll respond to the other's soon

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

btw, MiniMegabyte, do you follow the same reads as JacksonVirgo. Either answer could you explain it.

-shelly

As a matter of fact I believe I follow the majority as JV is my better half haha.

The only thing I would say is I’m not as quick to put a slight TR on your slot not just yet I’m too paranoid for that

-Mini

[MiniVirgo]

I think both Johnny and MWNN are easy town. Elephant is a light TR since they haven't full aggro'd yet but that's a bias read.

why is johnny town
tell me how shitpushing, fluffing and providing meta without analysing the current game is town-aligned

also redados been gone
-shelly

It's the start of the game, shitposting is nai. Their general tone is townie to me, but when they post content that may change.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Shelly, do you try and pocket people as town?

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

It's the start of the game, shitposting is nai. Their general tone is townie to me, but when they post content that may change.

fwiw tone is not the most accurate way to read people and the easiest thing to fake as scum
-shelly

Incorrect, I'm not really good at faking tone (at least from my perspective) and I find it much easier to do mechanical things like claiming and/or trying to mech-clear myself as scum, ignoring claiming PGO in a normal lel

Tone reading early game is where my most accurate d1 reads come from, I can show you a newbie game that I scum-read both scum D1 because of it if you really wanna see.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

i wouldn't use the word pocket but im liberal with TRs (and SRs) as town, so it can be perceived as pocketing.
-shelly

So in other words, yes you do. Could you link me to a game/post from another game in which you were doing so?

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Why did you copy my exact question

- JV

good artists imitate, great artists steal
mini being paranoid is slightly town!AI (I think) same thing happened in newbie 2032
-shelly

That is a terrible motto to live by holy shit lol

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Spoiler:

i claim town

and this guy is mafia
VOTE: Not_Mafia

Mod confirmed scum for not being bolded correctly

Why provide reasoning in a second post? Town aren't afraid to RVS
VOTE: mwnn

that sounds like a reason

VOTE: vote JohnnyFarrar

i have an even better question: who scumread the mod?

i have an even better question: who scumread the mod?

I feel like it always happens and it's the least funny thing ever. I don't care if this puts a huge target on my back, obviously now the mafia has to nightkill me for standing up and being so brave
~redados

u didnt answer my question my dear elephant. who scumread the mod?

no one scum read the mod my dear derp
~redados

so are u townreading the mod?

Voted initially and changed immediately, then started shading a joke. I think Johnny called that vote switch out as well, which is town-points from me I guess.

Ima be a shelly and go

+ 5 town points to RM.. I mean Johnny.

I like their posts which say that mech-talk is easy to do as scum, which it 100% is as it's called iioa. Which I completely doubt shelly overlooked considering they've been a wiki-book worm.

aw come on take back ur sr on derp as well

u should just tr me its free town cred

i promise u that u can trust me i am a decent guy

Derp's posts about reading them as town feels extremely gross to me, as it makes me think they're being super self conscience but we'll see.

VOTE: Derp

- Mini (jkjk it's ya boi jv)

[MiniVirgo]

Big Elephant is sounding increasingly scummy, I think the TR on MiniVirgo is a deep pocket, and they're just generally agreeing with stuff and throwing out forced reads instead of solving.

I think mech talk is a bad way to TR people fwiw

VOTE: Big Elephant

Professor Mafia hasn't got much atm but what they do have I agree with so that can be a TR.

[MiniVirgo]

225 (or the last post) was from ya boi, JV

[MiniVirgo]

Like hell that was me mini

[MiniVirgo]

Like hell that was me mini

Duders, stop dun foolin' everyone

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Big Elephant is sounding increasingly scummy, I think the TR on MiniVirgo is a deep pocket, and they're just generally agreeing with stuff and throwing out forced reads instead of solving.

I think mech talk is a bad way to TR people fwiw

VOTE: Big Elephant

Professor Mafia hasn't got much atm but what they do have I agree with so that can be a TR.

no JV you are at opposite ends of my solve
do you think im scum, if you do, why arent you voting me.
-shelly

I think you're trying to pocket me, but I also think you do that as Town. As why I am asking those questions

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

It amazes me how much Shelly hates pocketing but yet does seem to do it a lot...

- Mini

[MiniVirgo]

I like their posts which say that mech-talk is easy to do as scum, which it 100% is as it's called iioa. Which I completely doubt shelly overlooked considering they've been a wiki-book worm.

I mean, it's not the talk itelf that gives JV and yessiree townpoints, it's the proactivity, it's how they suggest solutions to solve this game and furthering the game out of RVS, and how they engage each other in a very genuine tone

I don't remember that post at all uwu

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I might have to just look through your town games to see if you pocket or not, which may change my reads.

I'm super tired so I might try and sleep, probably won't but I'll give it a shot.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I might have to just look through your town games to see if you pocket or not, which may change my reads.

I think I only have two completed ones and bth I got almost insta-elimmed.

I just need your d1 as we're in d1

[MiniVirgo]

I might have to just look through your town games to see if you pocket or not, which may change my reads.

I think I only have two completed ones and bth I got almost insta-elimmed.

I just need your d1 as we're in d1

From JV

[MiniVirgo]

Why do you continue to copy me

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Cause it seems as tho she can’t think for herself

-Mini

[MiniVirgo]

Why do you continue to copy me

- JV

is that forbidden or something tho
-shelly

Yes, it is now against forum site rules uwu


pedit: Oh no we're dead :c
- JV

[MiniVirgo]

congrats on overtaking mith
MiniVirgo has died and must stop posting immediately.

serious talk: kinda actually think A50 might be red here
-S (im lazy and will forget signing if I type my full username)

Why do you think A50 is wolf?

[MiniVirgo]

Conclusion let's play the game as a mountainous!

Also feels like shutting down mech talk when it's clearly protown to try and find optimal strategy imo

idrt anything about A50 has reeeeally townpinged, and GTH I can see the solve being *exactly* A50/Prof Mafia/Johnny
-S

Not even going to lie, I was either going to suggest to ignore PR's all together (like what a50 said) or everyone hypo-claim as any other play will just confuse town.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Meaning, SRing them from saying that means you SR me for saying that.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think A50 is town for saying that ngl, but that read only just came RN they were null-town beforehand.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

no you suggested hypoclaiming, they suggested playing it like mountainous, and at the time you didn't say anything about playing like all-vanilla.

that's quite clearly two different things
-S

I never said I said that. I said I was thinking that we either play like mountaenous or we play via hypo-claiming. I decided on the latter so I said so.

Read my post but slowly, or maybe I screwed the wording

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think A50 is town for saying that ngl, but that read only just came RN they were null-town beforehand.

like... why

why is shutting down the finding of optimal strategies in open setups town!AI
I just don't get anything from you atm
-S

I'll try and explain the contrast between the two players.

Hypoclaiming

- This way if a BD does not die, we have a 50% shot for the Cop check to be reliable.

Mountanous

- Playing as if we don't have PRs which makes scum's PR's useless and the Cop is unreliable anyway.

Both have it's reasons but I like hypo more. But I seriously did consider the other which makes me TR A50.

pedit: Some people don't like hypoclaiming, I think your read is a stretch ngl.

Also, context is a wonderful thing

Spoiler:

But seriously, hypo claiming is a bad idea IMHO, because Scum also have a factional BD.

A couple things for this setup

One, I don't think it was ever played before. (correct me if im wrong) So we're in uncharted territory
Two, mafia will try to mess with cop results with their factional bus. Will most likely happen they think cop will check one of them. This means reduced cop effectiveness, that said, town should still aim to maximize cop's effectiveness
Three, town BD *should* try to protect the most pro-town voice

In other words, best scum strategy is to swap one of them with a townie each night (the same one) to guarantee the Cop will always get a clear on that person. That coupled with holstering each night to avoid shooting themselves if they are swapped with their target by the Town BD.

Conclusion let's play the game as a mountainous!

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Can I ask the other reasons then?

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I'm not entirely sure what is mean/the context of the first point so I won't adress it but the latter I think that your reasonings to SR them aren't really reasons to SR in the first place, you are the only one really that I can remember that has explicitly gave a readlist/town-block.

I often start to SR them and then take it back after seeing a post and/or actually thinking about what I said after I said it and change my mind on it.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I often start to SR them and then take it back after seeing a post and/or actually thinking about what I said after I said it and change my mind on it.

ehhhhhhh

but immediately. note that there were no posts in between the johnny progression.

What do you mean? I meant like right after I pressed submit sometimes.


- JV

[MiniVirgo]

It's also possible a50 posted that to try and get them to post or get reactions or something

- Mini

[MiniVirgo]

Yeah that's nothing to really go on, scum would even likely just stick to it as they're self conscious on how flip floppy they may look.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Shellgal

For what reason would a50 retract a SR on lhf like that, honest question btw I am curious.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

It's also possible a50 posted that to try and get them to post or get reactions or something

if I see someone flip-flopping like "shelly is town" 3 mins later: "shelly is scum" im pretty much gonna hard SR there

idk what reaction it gets other than garnering SRs
-S

Reads are very dynamic, sometimes a single post can send someone riiiight down in reads and I know this first hand. I remember TRing scum early D1 (in my game where I got both scum d1), and they made very small posts which dropped my read on them to a SR.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Yeah that's nothing to really go on, scum would even likely just stick to it as they're self conscious on how flip floppy they may look.

If there is no motivation for a townie to post something, it does not come from town.

I kinda think if you're town, you're pretty much confbiased in your world and ignoring my reads?
-S

pedit: Johnny is SCUM and not LHF for outlined reasons
ok fine scum!A50 town!johnny
if they retract they're accursed of flipfloppiness, which could be translated to re-evaluation
if they don't retract they're accused of opportunism

Gosh darn. Also yes Town has more reason to post BS than scum does as one needs to keep a self-image and the other does not. Not sure where you got that from but probs the wiki knowing you lel.

I might be confbias'd right now but I see no logic to tell me otherwise. I think you're more confbias'ed than I am. But we need a third maybe tenth opinion to know for sure.

Also how the heck is Johnny confirmed scum in your eyes this early, I've only ever seen you this confident as scum in the large normal just closed. Also wouldn't scum try and justify their unvote if they were trying to feign re-evaluation to protect their sweet hide.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Reads are very dynamic, sometimes a single post can send someone riiiight down in reads and I know this first hand. I remember TRing scum early D1 (in my game where I got both scum d1), and they made very small posts which dropped my read on them to a SR.

but johnny hasn't even responded to the reaction test yet...

did you explain the *why* and outline which posts that changed your mind in that whatever game
-S

Don't fully remember but it's a player per player basis. I'm not exactly sure what A50's meta is but someone that knows them could shed light.

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

Changing themes really does help, I did that for my joke alt in my home site.

[MiniVirgo]

From JV

[MiniVirgo]

I often start to SR them and then take it back after seeing a post and/or actually thinking about what I said after I said it and change my mind on it.

That's an outright lie. You usually SR me because I FoS you (correctly). Period.

I wasn’t talking about anyone in specific, lmfao. I was making a point to shelly

[MiniVirgo]

Big Bird?

Spoiler:

Oh god

Also I’m out so I’ll post in more detail soon

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think A50 is town for saying that ngl, but that read only just came RN they were null-town beforehand.

- JV

OK, so Town!You TRs me and Scum!You SRs me (that's what I got from our mutual experiences so far)

Sounds about right lol, I was told your reads are generally accurate so I didn’t want you around long in that game uwu

[MiniVirgo]

You know, no lie I actually think its prof maf + derp +?

Get those 2 first and then we just throw darts in the rest of the playerlist

VOTE: prof maf

damn u got us, well done lad

Exactly the reaction i thought they’d make. Acting confident so I think that derp is more likely

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

You know, no lie I actually think its prof maf + derp +?

Get those 2 first and then we just throw darts in the rest of the playerlist

VOTE: prof maf

damn u got us, well done lad

Can you believe that I wanted to be big bird (from Sesame Street) but shelly shot me down, so now we're Big Elephant.
~redados

Big sad

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

still rather sold on A50 scum, JV being A50's lawyer somehow doesn't sit right with my gut

-S

Actually I’ll come back to this but I think this might be AI, I cannot say why do you’ll have to either trust me read until a certain time comes or ignore a future post that I make regarding this.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

still rather sold on A50 scum, JV being A50's lawyer somehow doesn't sit right with my gut

-S

big elephant is hardcore omgussing. MWNN/A50 are probably both town

hot take: I have a mild SR on MiniVirgo. Trying to defend A50 sounds a bit like a buddy attempt imo.

i think a lot of scum are inactive

I don’t buddy until late game

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I hate mobile

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: Big Elephant

why are we voting big elephant?

We’re not

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Not yet anyway



- Jv

[MiniVirgo]

Yeah alright I looked into a specific something.

VOTE: Big Elephant

- Acts OMGUS'y as all heck as a scum-tell.
- Refuses to see my logic and bases a SR around my logic against it, and then continues to shove me in the SR pile because they have no other way to deny my logic.
- Thinks their SR is absolute and there's no way they can be wrong, similar to how they feigned confidence in the large normal.
- Continued to copy and pocket the living daylights out of me when I TR'd them, but I refused to push that because mini and I had a plan to test which I'll explain below but they switched instantly when I expressed any sort of scum-read on them and/or call them out on false logic.


Initially I brought up to mini that I thought a shelly scum-tell would be their super OMGUSy and pockety behaviour depending on how you act towards them. I wanted to test that initally by having Mini SR them and myself TR them. See if they reacted much differently to me than to her (although mini didn't post much). As SOON as I started disagreeing with her, she immediately switched their read on me. It was ticking exactly like I expected it to, if that

is

their town-meta as well they should probably learn to actually accept that they're not always right on their reads and shouldn't ever push anyone that stands against them.

I'll probably have to read through Redados's specific posts as I could be super biased. Also mini brought up that shelly being lynched D1 is a town-tell lmfaooo.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I'm not entirely sure if using a hydra in that way is not allowed but I thought why wouldn't it be. Also Derp is my second biggest SR aorn

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I'm working a lot tomorrow so hopefully mini will become my backup for tomorrow, if she remembers to post lol

[MiniVirgo]

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

big elephant is hardcore omgussing. MWNN/A50 are probably both town

hot take: I have a mild SR on MiniVirgo. Trying to defend A50 sounds a bit like a buddy attempt imo.

i think a lot of scum are inactive

I read this like 3 times and I cant see this coming from town

yessiree you're literally my soulmate

sr on JV is making something out of nothing
townbinning mwnn + A50 without reasoning
omgussing is labelling me as scum without explaining or intent to make it a wagon

VOTE: Professor Mafia
-S

You literally said it

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

Jackson you've played with me as scum, you know that im very self aware and i'd never ever omgus as scum
are you telling me to stop townreading people whatsoever
I actually TR'd you for reasons, that you're proactively engaging and solving (and still are) but you're just terribly wrong at this
-S

This is a straight lie, but I don't have any means to back this up atm and you know that.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

- Acts OMGUS'y as all heck as a scum-tell.
- Refuses to see my logic and bases a SR around my logic against it, and then continues to shove me in the SR pile because they have no other way to deny my logic.
- Thinks their SR is absolute and there's no way they can be wrong, similar to how they feigned confidence in the large normal.
- Continued to copy and pocket the living daylights out of me when I TR'd them, but I refused to push that because mini and I had a plan to test which I'll explain below but they switched instantly when I expressed any sort of scum-read on them and/or call them out on false logic.


Initially I brought up to mini that I thought a shelly scum-tell would be their super OMGUSy and pockety behaviour depending on how you act towards them. I wanted to test that initally by having Mini SR them and myself TR them. See if they reacted much differently to me than to her (although mini didn't post much). As SOON as I started disagreeing with her, she immediately switched their read on me. It was ticking exactly like I expected it to, if that is their town-meta as well they should probably learn to actually accept that they're not always right on their reads and shouldn't ever push anyone that stands against them.

I'll probably have to read through Redados's specific posts as I could be super biased. Also mini brought up that shelly being lynched D1 is a town-tell lmfaooo.

- JV

- I never, ever SR'd you, I said your logic was INCORRECT, not that you were scummy, can you quote where i SR'd you, this is a misrep.

This is a plain lie, which is also a slip since you said you never SR'd me but you actually did clearly. Meaning you're fabricating your reads now and they're not actually what you're reading me as.

- I refuse to see your logic because you refuse to see mine.

You've given me reasonings as to why A50 is scum and I've countered each point, and you kept saying the same stuff with different wording (unless I am misremembering)

- I have confidence as either alignment??????

I cannot confirm or deny as I've only played with scum!you.

- im omgussy as town with bad logic pushes BECAUSE I'm an extremely self-aware scum. tell me where i omgussed in that large normal; in fact I probably did the opposite of it

I'll go through it soon, but also *insert mad words sicne I can't speak*.

- I've got reasonable confidence in my reads because i know that they're probably correct.

That's just plain stupidity if you're Town here.

- you're sr'ing me for tr'ing you???????? which doesn't make sense at all. there are differences between pockets and TRs and it comes down to reasoning

Nopers. I'm SRing you because of all the reasons I posted, not just that one so stop misrepping me like you say I'm doing to you and make your case on me.

YES GETTING LYNCHED D1 IS A TOWNTELL FOR ME. the reason why I get elim'd d1 is that because I have weird and (CORRECT) reads and this is exactly the same
my playstyle is naturally scummy because I'm bad at OBVTOWNING AND I JUST COMPLETELY FAIL AT IT
im gonna take a break from this thread because this is frustrating as fuck

No that isn't why you get lynched, it's because you're easy miselim material when you're Town. You pushing that you always have correct reads is a reason for me to believe you're bussing somewhat if you're scum and/or too cocky of Town. Also nice ate

-S

[MiniVirgo]

Jackson you've played with me as scum, you know that im very self aware and i'd never ever omgus as scum
are you telling me to stop townreading people whatsoever
I actually TR'd you for reasons, that you're proactively engaging and solving (and still are) but you're just terribly wrong at this
-S

Completely flopped on that read of yours, with no explanation just like you were SRing a50 for

[MiniVirgo]

-S

can someone, someone actually give a reason other than "POCKETING" to SR me, because im clearly not POCKETING and I should be liberal with my TRs

-S

Again, misrepping like you said I was doing. I've said many points outside of pocketing

[MiniVirgo]

All those were from ya boi JV

[MiniVirgo]

"People who have really out there reads, stick out too much, don't agree with the established townblock, and want to do their own thing which people don't largely agree with get lynched incredibly consistently. They also incredibly consistently flip town." - RadiantCowbells

Thanks for telling us that you're actively trying to fit into what the wiki/players say is townie.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Shelly, read the quote. You literally said you SR me

[MiniVirgo]

big elephant is hardcore omgussing. MWNN/A50 are probably both town

hot take: I have a mild SR on MiniVirgo. Trying to defend A50 sounds a bit like a buddy attempt imo.

i think a lot of scum are inactive

I read this like 3 times and I cant see this coming from town

yessiree you're literally my soulmate

sr on JV is making something out of nothing

townbinning mwnn + A50 without reasoning
omgussing is labelling me as scum without explaining or intent to make it a wagon

VOTE: Professor Mafia
-S

You literally said it

-JV

[MiniVirgo]

Oh, loooool nevermind ignore me

[MiniVirgo]

(I feel dumb)

Also my other points still stand, but I'll let it slide for now (out of shame)
VOTE: derp

[MiniVirgo]

Shelly, do you copy+paste the quotes? Or why the hell does the bbcode just like, nope itself

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

^ always has been a thought on the back of my mind

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

i just press the quote button + highlight where I wanna quote

I HAD NO IDEA THAT WAS A THING HOLY FUCK THAT'S COOL AS HECK

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

ALso I thought it was really strange that you completely forget you SR'd me, my bad. But I still have suspicions on you as you have not satisfied my other points.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: Big Elephant

why are we voting big elephant?

ah, the classic vote and questioning the why of the vote

elbirn thoughts on professor mafia?

I don't think much about anything sorry

UNVOTE:
VOTE: minivirgo

Would this be AI of sorts, I'm not sure of their meta or if they even have one.

[MiniVirgo]

minivirgo is obvscum for saying basically what I said earlier about Giant Pachyderm being mis-elim bait, and then casing/voting them for.......being mis-elim bait I guess. I asked for an explanation on why we were voting for BE and the closest to a response I got was that and it felt like scummy content/timing

Are you actually being serious? I've said many points and yet you ignore them all and shoot at my integrity.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

- Acts OMGUS'y as all heck as a scum-tell.
- Thinks their SR is absolute and there's no way they can be wrong, similar to how they feigned confidence in the large normal.
- Continued to copy and pocket the living daylights out of me when I TR'd them.

General copy+paste from my post where I explained myself and yet everyone keeps putting words in my mouth.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

In my defense I didn't know you were gonna post a better catchup. I like your point on mini, tho.

VOTE: mini

It's fucking weak as hell

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

- Acts OMGUS'y as all heck as a scum-tell.
- Thinks their SR is absolute and there's no way they can be wrong, similar to how they feigned confidence in the large normal.
- Continued to copy and pocket the living daylights out of me when I TR'd them.

- OMGUS = towntell for me, because I am self-aware as scum
- Has confidence in their SRs for a good reason and articulating my thoughts
- copied JV as a meme and TR'd JV for good logic

response

First point is wrong, still unsure if I can say much further without breaking the site rules.
Second one I said that I don't know your town-meta but you feign serious confidence in your reads as scum, referencing the large normal here.
You copied my question first, which was highly likely not a meme. The second time was likely to cover your hide as scum to push for it to be a meme, not sure what that would be as town because that's one messed up meme.

pedit: I am not arguing against SRing me, the logic is just weak

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Shelly do you know what I am referring to with the first point or not

[MiniVirgo]

Is there really a negative to getting rid of a person who is admitting to doing OMGUS, early on, though?

Day 1 reads are generally just... less than accurate. I don't see a net negative with that, though, either we are hitting scum, or we are hitting town that's going to play anti-town when we have the most miseliminations available.

I may have railed against policy eliminations in my younger years, but, let's face it, I'm a shitty player anyway so I was probably wrong.

I can see one scenario where OMGUS would be townie in a newer town like shelly (since they role town a lot less) but I'm going to choose to not say anything about that.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

what is this buzzword obsession that omgus = scum or anti

also I never admitted to omgussing

You 100% admitted to OMGUSing

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

So, where are we now? Let me check

I think we're on the mafiascum forums, could be wrong


- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Day 1 reads are generally just... less than accurate.

How dare you? I always peg the whole scum team on D1

provided I am one, it's single-ball and we have no traitor nor am I a traitor myself

I repeat: ALWAYS!

Nice

[MiniVirgo]

Is there really a negative to getting rid of a person who is admitting to doing OMGUS, early on, though?

Day 1 reads are generally just... less than accurate. I don't see a net negative with that, though, either we are hitting scum, or we are hitting town that's going to play anti-town when we have the most miseliminations available.

I may have railed against policy eliminations in my younger years, but, let's face it, I'm a shitty player anyway so I was probably wrong.

I can see one scenario where OMGUS would be townie in a newer town like shelly (since they role town a lot less) but I'm going to choose to not say anything about that.

- JV

But that isn't the case.

I feel cringe because I said "role" instead of "roll". Also dude lol

[MiniVirgo]

big elephant is hardcore omgussing. MWNN/A50 are probably both town

hot take: I have a mild SR on MiniVirgo. Trying to defend A50 sounds a bit like a buddy attempt imo.

i think a lot of scum are inactive

Okay so there is some sort of contradiction here...
First you say A50 is probably town and then the next line you are saying that you have a mild SR on us because it seems like a buddy attempt with A50???

How does that make any sense??

[MiniVirgo]

Btw that was from Mini as is this one

[MiniVirgo]

Nobody respond to that exact post until they do btw, I have a reason

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: Big Elephant

why are we voting big elephant?

Why vote them if you have no reason to?

[MiniVirgo]

That was me mini btw

[MiniVirgo]

@Mod

, just a random question that popped into my head. Does scum have day-talk?

pedit: Mini get into a habit of doing "- Mini" lmfao or it's gonna trip everyone out.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: Big Elephant

why are we voting big elephant?

ah, the classic vote and questioning the why of the vote

elbirn thoughts on professor mafia?

-S

yessireee thoughts on johnny slot? im SR'ing there rather hard
-S

Shelly why do you have to have others thoughts on the slots you scum-read?

-Mini

[MiniVirgo]

That seems like shelly is poking around to see where they can and cannot push a ML, although as a counter-point it could be that shelly does that as Town but I'm unaware.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Wait I'm seeing a neat scum-team I'll wait for a little bit before outting it

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Spoiler:

VOTE: derp sounds derpy
~redados

no one scum read the mod my dear derp
~redados

so are u townreading the mod?

har har har
VOTE: derp

I find it hard to believe that both heads of the hydra lulvoted the exact same person.

i have an even better question: who scumread the mod?

I feel like it always happens and it's the least funny thing ever. I don't care if this puts a huge target on my back, obviously now the mafia has to nightkill me for standing up and being so brave
~redados

This post is LAMIST and I've never seen this type of logic come from town!redados (going off my doggo game they played in)

I think shelly and I are both super paranoid of the other, shelly's really good at pocketing people so beware lol

imo, one of the highlights of playing as scum is getting to eventually townblock with people

I do genuinely think you as my strongest TR atm, scum!JV coasts around a whole lot more, while you're engaging yessiree, you're trying to engage N_M

Weird perspective shift for town!shelly to make. Town shouldn't be thinking fun things that happen as scum. I'm thinking that's a possible perspective slip from scum!shelly.

"People who have really out there reads, stick out too much, don't agree with the established townblock, and want to do their own thing which people don't largely agree with get lynched incredibly consistently. They also incredibly consistently flip town." - RadiantCowbells

Self conscious quote to back up their own logic.

Would this be AI of sorts, I'm not sure of their meta or if they even have one.

its AI
we don't need meta to read people
this is scum!AI
it's discrediting townies

I don't see how it's discrediting at all, I was talking about them sheeping like that when someone who they voted screamed back at them.

- Acts OMGUS'y as all heck as a scum-tell.
- Thinks their SR is absolute and there's no way they can be wrong, similar to how they feigned confidence in the large normal.
- Continued to copy and pocket the living daylights out of me when I TR'd them.

- OMGUS = towntell for me, because I am self-aware as scum
- Has confidence in their SRs for a good reason and articulating my thoughts
- copied JV as a meme and TR'd JV for good logic

response

It's fucking weak as hell

- JV

omgus isn't scum indicative
i might be projecting but this is omgus and NAI

what is this buzzword obsession that omgus = scum or anti

also I never admitted to omgussing

Claimed that they OMGUS as town only, never as mafia which is a lie. Then to back up their logic they are forced to say that they don't SR me for OMGUS in the most awkward way possible and then lied saying they never admitted to OMGUSing

[MiniVirgo]

The double derp is reasonably compelling, assuming that was the two different heads. Perspective slip, maybe? But by the end of your post we get into Shelly bein' Shelly.

Still better than voting someone who isn't here

VOTE: shelly/elephant/whatever

Keeping an eye on that prof maf slot tho

You weren't voting someone who isn't here but aight.

Also still waiting on PMafia to respond to that post earlier

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: Big Elephant

why are we voting big elephant?

Why vote them if you have no reason to?

I mean it was all good back when I was still doing it but you're questioning it now? I joined the game the way I know how, vote the big wagon and see what happens. you reacted poorly.

That was mini posting it, not me and if you've been paying attention they haven't posted in a while

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

also to all of the hydras: please present a united front on your reads and pushes. I'm not gonna do this shit where one of you says up while the other says down and then no matter what happens you throw your hands up and go "well we didnt believe that"

I'm not saying it's happening, but if it does I will scream hellfire. I presume yall got a hydra PT please utilize it

Oh yes, we're definitely the same person that has the exact same reads as the other. Seriously? Also we don't have a hydra PT we communicate in person

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Our reads are generally the same and the only real reason we said otherwise was to test shelly, even if we don't I really don't care that you feel upset about that and if you want to SR one of the heads, you SR both I don't get why you're so butthurt about it.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

This might be drawing the wrong conclusion from that but I think that's a genuine fear that a Town would have from a hydra, considering their wording revolving around not being held accountable or whatnot.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I find it hard to believe that both heads of the hydra lulvoted the exact same person.

no it was same head

Why would the same head vote the same person twice, I'll have a look back at the context.

[MiniVirgo]

Goddamn, why...

Spoiler:

no one scum read the mod my dear derp
~redados

no one scum read the mod my dear derp
~redados

so are u townreading the mod?

har har har
VOTE: derp

Obligatory since shelly is there and they're always wolf

gamblers = confirmed bad
OMGUS! VOTE: MiniVirgo

Should we be hypo claiming in this setup considering there’s a cop a silent bus driver

imo, im not good at mech but I think town bus driver should *avoid* driving nulls (cop invest nulls) and drive townreads with scumreads to outWIFOM the nightkill
I think hypoclaiming is a good idea

-shelly

There's no way to tell whether or not shelly's claim is legit or not. Even the post time is way different either way. Maybe the vote on me is telling of it being redados but why would they doublevote like that.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

and besides, all this back-and-forth between you and shelly is dominating the pace of the game which is allowing potential scum to coast and fly under the radar

This is extremely hilarious to me considering, but again I can't say anything about it.

[MiniVirgo]

@Mod

, just a random question that popped into my head. Does scum have day-talk?

pedit: Mini get into a habit of doing "- Mini" lmfao or it's gonna trip everyone out.

- JV

Factional communication:

Each night

, you may talk with your partners

Oh epic Indidnt even see that anywhere

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

@Mod

, just a random question that popped into my head. Does scum have day-talk?

pedit: Mini get into a habit of doing "- Mini" lmfao or it's gonna trip everyone out.

- JV

Factional communication:

Each night

, you may talk with your partners

Bus Service replaces Sesq and Bingle replaces arachnidsGrip. Welcome!

That’s ironic as fuck lmfao
- JV

[MiniVirgo]

-shelly

why is this so hard

Nice sign from shelly here. I like the stylistic choice of signing the post right at the start. Ensures no one will miss it.

I think that's them correcting their last post where they forgot to put it lol

Oops, my shitpost:content ratio is going off the rails. GET IT TOGETHER, Bus Service, you need more content or they'll probably policy you.

Self-conscious

[MiniVirgo]

I'm all caught up. shelly is probtown, although I can see why MiniVirgo is seeing elements of her scum play. The confident solve in particular is one of the things that's a little iffy.
shelly, where did you get this sudden surge of confidence in your reads? In other town games, you're more hesitant and aware that you could be wrong.

VOTE: Bus Service

Too confusing a name to keep around

So is yours. How'd you get an underscore in your name?

Shift+-

NotShift+-Mafia

Nice

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Subject: [Setup] Bus Service

Starting with scum strats:

Variable definitions:

n= # living players
x= # living scum

Spoiler: Strongman only

Scum swaps two town players. Shoots one to kill the other.

Percentage chance bus driver redirects kill to town: 2(n-x)/(n^2-n)
Percentage chance bus driver redirects kill to scum: 2x/(n^2-n)
Cop survival if unclaimed: (n-1)/n

Cop results always trustworthy.
If redirect successful, +1 conftown.
If redirect onto scum, +1 conftown, -1 scum.

Spoiler: Investigation Confusion only

Scum swaps scum and town and shoots their target directly.

Percentage chance bus driver redirects kill to town: 2(n-x)/(n^2-n)
Percentage chance bus driver redirects kill to scum: 2x/(n^2-n)
Percentage chance cop False Innocents: 1/n.
Percentage chance cop False Guilties: 1/n.

Diminishing return on cop results.
If redirect successful, +1 conftown.
If redirect onto scum, +1 conftown, -1 scum.

Spoiler: Both

Scum swaps scum and town, nightkills scum swap.

Percentage chance bus driver redirects kill to town: 2(n-x)/(n^2-n)
Percentage chance bus driver redirects kill to scum: 2x/(n^2-n)
Percentage chance cop False Innocents: 1/n
Percentage chance cop False Guilties: 0.
Percentage of Innocent results that are False: 1/(n-x)
Percentage of Guilty results that are False: 1/x

Diminishing return on cop innocents.
If redirect successful, +1 conftown -1 scum.
If redirect unsuccessful, +1 conftown -2 scum.

Cop claimed: Scum tries to kill cop, Busdriver can't generate additional innocents.
Busdriver claimed: Scum tries to kill Busdriver, Busdriver can't generate additional innocents.
Both claimed: Scum tries to kill Cop, Busdriver can't generate additional innocents.

Chance of successful protection:

n % To Scum To Town
4 67 17 50
5 50 10 40
6 40 7 33
7 33 5 29
8 28 4 25
9 25 3 22
10 22 2 20
11 20 2 18
12 18 2 17

Hypoclaim chance to out either PR without the other being outed is negligible.
Hypoclaim chance to out Bus Driver with the cop being outed doesn't matter, as the cop is the priority kill for scum.
Hypoclaim chance to out as not cop with Bus Driver claimed: 50% per individual per day.

Hypoclaim unlikely to get cop killed any earlier than not hypoclaiming, therefore all players should hypoclaim both cop and redirections.

Claims should happen on run up or on the day before LYLO.

My only concern with the setup now is that it looks like a win more setup (If mafia is winning, they're likely to continue winning, but if they lose one player their odds decrease dramatically.) Otherwise, this looks balanced.

I'm not gonna bother writing a program for expected win rates, because there's too many subjective values for them to actually mean anything important.

Oh so the setup has been done before? I tried mech-done-didding the game earlier but without math. But yeah I agree with your conclusion about hypo-claiming. I didn't understand all the math but I have trust uwu

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Neither bus driver nor cop should publicly hint at their targets before the night, nor should we as a group try to target them. Bus driver should focus on being a vig because changing a kill is very much so positive utility.

Exactly what I've been saying, let the Cop choose their own targets.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I don't even get that double vote thing btw. What scum motivation is there to fake that? There's none. The second head just happened to RVS-vote the same person without realising their other head already did, which means nothing alignment-wise.

Uncoordinated Hydra scum both independently targeting someone like derp seems odd to me. Either he's bait or their partner and they didn't want it to seem like they were ignoring him

Honestly I read it as both individually wanted to distance from their partner and ended up linking more to them. Although we'd have to yeet shelly first to see if that logic holds any weight

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

My vote is either on derp or shelly and I forget which

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I feel we yeet derp first, and since shelly would survive d1 that means they're scum.

Glorious

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Did everyone other than me, A50 and N_M just create a dumb alt for this game?

unfortunately this is my main and I am simply like this

I was gonna say this was my main but it's not, I forgot I was a hydra lmfaooo

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think Johnny is acting fairly opportunistic but I think they're also Town, I'll have to read back on their ISO

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Spoiler:

Big Elephant is sounding increasingly scummy, I think the TR on MiniVirgo is a deep pocket, and they're just generally agreeing with stuff and throwing out forced reads instead of solving.

I think mech talk is a bad way to TR people fwiw

VOTE: Big Elephant

I shittily try to end RVS but THIS gets no vote? /salty

VOTE: ProfMaf

Didn't really explain what's bad about the post but says it's bad. I personally do not see the issue with that post and I somewhat agree with it.

She draws some undeserved scumreads. I recently replaced into a game that lost it's whole first day to Shelly vs. The world shenanigans and then she flipped town

Thanks!

Also I know she gets that regardless, I guess I'm saying I don't take early scum leans from Shelly too seriously

Read up.
Pretty sure this is town Shelly posting.
Would be willing to vote Elberin.
Yess seems really cautious to me?

Those are the prevailing thoughts upon a reread. Is this a micro? I feel like there are only like 6 players

In my defense I didn't know you were gonna post a better catchup. I like your point on mini, tho.

VOTE: mini

Y'all are missing the part where Shelly is just like this.

The double derp is reasonably compelling, assuming that was the two different heads. Perspective slip, maybe? But by the end of your post we get into Shelly bein' Shelly.

Still better than voting someone who isn't here

VOTE: shelly/elephant/whatever

Keeping an eye on that prof maf slot tho

The progression here is a sharp 180 though, and it seems really opportunistic as a wagon on one person isn't happening (on me) they switch to one that is (shelly). Whether that be a possible scum!johnny town!shelly or SvS I am unsure. I am still thinking this is town though so I think it's just their reads changed to scum!shelly off that double vote catch.

I liked minis catch on the double vote, it didn't reek of the normal "Shelly is scum i mean just look at her" I've seen in previous games

Although this is probably actually a real train of thought as mini kinda does that kinda thing with shelly

I think the slot is town just from gut mainly but I wouldn't be shaken up if they get scummier, probably a town-lean aorn.

[MiniVirgo]

Did everyone other than me, A50 and N_M just create a dumb alt for this game?

unfortunately this is my main and I am simply like this

Same

What group is that?

[MiniVirgo]

I think Johnny is acting fairly opportunistic but I think they're also Town, I'll have to read back on their ISO

- JV

I don't like how he voted for shelly despite constantly bringing up experiences about her being town, dying d1, and acting just like this, or "shelly being shelly" I think it was.

Also, two posts in particular pinged me. Hang on, I'll go find them.

Yeah that's what I am talking about regarding them being opportunistic

[MiniVirgo]

I think Johnny is acting fairly opportunistic but I think they're also Town, I'll have to read back on their ISO

- JV

I don't like how he voted for shelly despite constantly bringing up experiences about her being town, dying d1, and acting just like this, or "shelly being shelly" I think it was.

Also, two posts in particular pinged me. Hang on, I'll go find them.

oh good you see it too I dont have to do the work you'll do the work

wait

I thought this was about minivirgo

d a r n

Doesn't mean you can't put effort in yourself lol

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Big Elephant is sounding increasingly scummy, I think the TR on MiniVirgo is a deep pocket, and they're just generally agreeing with stuff and throwing out forced reads instead of solving.

I think mech talk is a bad way to TR people fwiw

VOTE: Big Elephant

I shittily try to end RVS but THIS gets no vote? /salty

VOTE: ProfMaf

Explained this one. Think scum have more reason to be salty here.

Either way, I'm feeling ok with this push on Shelly (or at least parts of it).

Might change my mind when she responds.

The highlighted pings me, but it's hard to articulate why.

First point may just also be from cocky town and the latter pinged me earlier as well, but again that leans into a possible scum!johnny town!shelly world which I do not see.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think Johnny is acting fairly opportunistic but I think they're also Town, I'll have to read back on their ISO

- JV

I don't like how he voted for shelly despite constantly bringing up experiences about her being town, dying d1, and acting just like this, or "shelly being shelly" I think it was.

Also, two posts in particular pinged me. Hang on, I'll go find them.

Yeah that's what I am talking about regarding them being opportunistic

but you did the same thing
these same posts literally confused me as to which of you two were being discussed

Oh? Could you find them I don't remember doing as such

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Big Elephant is sounding increasingly scummy, I think the TR on MiniVirgo is a deep pocket, and they're just generally agreeing with stuff and throwing out forced reads instead of solving.

I think mech talk is a bad way to TR people fwiw

VOTE: Big Elephant

I shittily try to end RVS but THIS gets no vote? /salty

VOTE: ProfMaf

Explained this one. Think scum have more reason to be salty here.

Either way, I'm feeling ok with this push on Shelly (or at least parts of it).

Might change my mind when she responds.

The highlighted pings me, but it's hard to articulate why.

First point may just also be from cocky town and the latter pinged me earlier as well, but again that leans into a possible scum!johnny town!shelly world which I do not see.

- JV

Wait, didn't A50 say that there was no day-talk? Or am I confusing two games

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Wait, didn't A50 say that there was no day-talk? Or am I confusing two games

- JV

Because if so, SvS with johnny shelly is even more likely but I still am unsure if I see it fully.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Can we have a VC please fam?

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

UNVOTE:

on God there was minivirgo posts like "shelly is bait" and "I townread shelly" and then suddenly "heres a case on shelly after elbirn replaced in askin' about the shelly (bigelephant) wagon"

but now we're in a reality where those posts don't exist so I just look like I'm full of shit, or I'm too tired to sift through the noise that is minivirgos iso I dont wanna vote here until I think better

No I definitely made those posts regarding the bait+townreading shelly not the latter one iirc, but please read 390 as that may help understand why I switched quickly because I don't think you actually read much into that post which keeps getting brought up.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

@mod is there daytalk in this game

Not sure there's anything to respond to here. Lemme know if you have any direct questions homies.

Dude I just told everyone, it's in the OP lol

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Yeah I'm voting derp, aight

VOTE: shellyc

[MiniVirgo]

Oh so in other words, yeet NM next if they hammer. Gotcha

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Jacko pls, I think shelly is town here being mislaunched day 1 as town!her usually is. I don't understand why you don't also see this.
Her play here is light and day from her scum game in more than a few ways:

• She is more wordy and wishy-washy
  
• She is less abrasive and blunt
  
• She is not pushing people for terrible reasons
  
• She is not doing obviously fake reaction tests
  
• She has not lied about anything

She has indeed lied about the OMGUS thing. But I do have to agree that it's really different than her scum games, yeah maybe I'll start pushing derp again. Though the wagon is fairly clean afaik.

Them copying and pocketing me is my main issue and their response to when I asked if they pocketed as town was lackluster and seriously just getting gut pings from them.

I may do an ISO comparison soon

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Oh so in other words, yeet NM next if they hammer. Gotcha

- JV

ya ever hear the story about the scorpion and the frog?

it's not the scorpion I'll be mad at

I feel this is an epic metaphor I am missing the point of

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Have I said that I think Elbirn is town yet? Cuz I think they are. I doubt scum would be pushing me considering my position, also I am slightly paranoid of being pocketed by Nandor but that's negligable for now.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: Derp

Shelly will of course be one my priority reads, but I do agree that I think I've been falling into confbias

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Derp would be such as easy push for scum to make yet nobody except me is pushing it. Either that makes me scum or makes derp scum uwu

Mainly a joke but perhaps holds some weight.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Oh so in other words, yeet NM next if they hammer. Gotcha

- JV

ya ever hear the story about the scorpion and the frog?

it's not the scorpion I'll be mad at

I feel this is an epic metaphor I am missing the point of

- JV

so the gist of the tale is theres a scorpion and a frog sitting along a riverbank, savvy? and they both want to cross the river, but only the frog knows how to swim.

the scorpion says, "yo homie lemme get a ride"
and the frog says "breh you're a scorpion you'll sting me"
and the scorpion says "no way my guy, if I sting you we'll both drown"

so the frog says okay, and the scorpion hops on the frogs back. halfway across the river, the scorpion stings the frog. the frog asks, "why?", and the scorpion says something along the lines of "it is my nature. how could I have done anything else?". the frog dies and the scorpion drowns.

That's depressing as fuck but cool at the same time

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I don't see how prof_mafia is scum personally

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Nandor is far from lock-town. ProfessorMafia is also likely Town. Can anyone actually explain the SR on them thank

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Also if you won't mind, if you're addressing JacksonVirgo (me) specificically use JV or JacksonVirgo and if you're referencing MiniMegabyte please use that name or Mini.

If you're talking about us in combination, or this account use MiniVirgo or MV. Thank you, because I remember Nandor (I think) referencing Mini finding the double vote thing when it was me and I want to make that clarification.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

dear derp still believes this is likely to be scum hectic but dear derp is now also good with yeeting shelly for betraying my trust

so you SR everyone that SRs you

this, my friend, is truly omgus.

This is hilarious comin' from you my dude

[MiniVirgo]

From JV

[MiniVirgo]

And now I can officially bring this up. Shelly is a lying sack of lies for saying they don't OMGUS as scum.

Proof is this game viewtopic.php?f=2&t=84419

I was SRing them D1 and they literally OMGUS'ed everybody that ever scum-read them.

[MiniVirgo]

And now I can officially bring this up. Shelly is a lying sack of lies for saying they don't OMGUS as scum.

Proof is this game viewtopic.php?f=2&t=84419

I was SRing them D1 and they literally OMGUS'ed everybody that ever scum-read them.

From JV

[MiniVirgo]

Wait I think I'm out of the loop, who's alt are ya Nandor?

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Hectic

That's pretty hectic bro

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Do you have a list of your alts? If so that would be literally epic to see like 20,000,000 of em in a row.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I think you'll find I have a huge ego, Miltank. I even lended part of it to Flavor Leaf, because it was starting to weigh me down.

Most of them are on here: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Hectic

Oh lmfaooo YOU were Donkey Kong.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

The ProfMaf cases both suck.

why does it suck tho, i wanna know the why

It has no real solid case on it, and it hasn't swayed my read on them at all. I know the question wasn't to me but I'd like to answer as well

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

A big storm is coming so I won't be able to post for a bit, neither will mini.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: professor mafia

I'm gonna miss poor innocent derp

This speed wagon right on day-start I do not like but I think both of you are town so I'm not sure. If one of you had to be scum I would say you for that derp remark, pings me as slightly LAMIST

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: professor mafia

I'm gonna miss poor innocent derp

This speed wagon right on day-start I do not like but I think both of you are town so I'm not sure. If one of you had to be scum I would say you for that derp remark, pings me as slightly LAMIST

Oh I forgot I have to tag things

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Spicy take. Not_Mafia and Elbirn are scum together and they formulated that plan to get mad at them to distance.
Also A50 is v big wrinkler brain for putting them at L-1 while at the same time inviting N_M to hammer.
- JV

[MiniVirgo]

as for johnnyfarrar they are a player in this game that much I can say for certain. do you have a more direct question perhaps? prod me into a good direction

yeah. ok challenge 1 sort these names from town -> scum

Professor Mafia
A50
MiniVirgo
MWNN
JohnnyFarrar

JohnnyFarrar
MWNN
A50
Professor Mafia

Just from right off my head

[MiniVirgo]

as for johnnyfarrar they are a player in this game that much I can say for certain. do you have a more direct question perhaps? prod me into a good direction

yeah. ok challenge 1 sort these names from town -> scum

Professor Mafia
A50
MiniVirgo
MWNN
JohnnyFarrar

JohnnyFarrar
MWNN
A50
Professor Mafia

- JV
Just from right off my head

[MiniVirgo]

Bus Drive: Nandor the Relentless -> Myself
Cop: Shellyc

[MiniVirgo]

Is this a hypoclaim what is happening

They're hypoclaims

[MiniVirgo]

So you'll forgive me I'm new to this, are we claiming what we did/ would have done as driver/cop last night or what we will be doing tonight

We would be posting our "actions" that were performed last night not our plan for the next night, that way we get the results of any randomly dying PRs without the need for them claiming.

If you're a Cop with a red-check, I think you should just out the information. And never ever hypo-claim a red-check, most likely you're just wrong and then yeeted out of the Cop poe so hard lol.

[MiniVirgo]

So you'll forgive me I'm new to this, are we claiming what we did/ would have done as driver/cop last night or what we will be doing tonight

We would be posting our "actions" that were performed last night not our plan for the next night, that way we get the results of any randomly dying PRs without the need for them claiming.

If you're a Cop with a red-check, I think you should just out the information. And never ever hypo-claim a red-check, most likely you're just wrong and then yeeted out of the Cop poe so hard lol.

From JV

[MiniVirgo]

VOTE: Not_Mafia

ezpz

[MiniVirgo]

was that from mini or JV

N_M not claiming is tstbs imo

The one and only JV

[MiniVirgo]

tstbs

Too scummy to be scum?

Indeederino

Another version is TWTBW which is too wolfy to be a wolf. Same concept different kind of theme, I sometimes say wolf terminology over mafia one just out of habit but they're usually interchangable unless you're in a multiball setup or something

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

I'm gonna do a little secret things to try and gauge reads but I won't be outting my results or swaying my public reads off it for a while. I've found something great

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Also I think it's just them, my vote on them is out of policy because we cannot allow anti-town behaviour and I've generally come to realise that anti-town behavior, even if town, has to go bye bye.

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Shelly, Faraar can you please give me a read on the other? In detail please if that's alright

[MiniVirgo]

Shelly is confscum here, they're still alive after d1!

- Mini

[MiniVirgo]

Also I think it's just them, my vote on them is out of policy because we cannot allow anti-town behaviour and I've generally come to realise that anti-town behavior, even if town, has to go bye bye.

do you townread N_M

Nope, I am SRing them but I think I am because they're being anti-town and I don't remember playing a game with them in a while but I know they're like this so it's policy at the same time.

If that makes any spec of sense

[MiniVirgo]

Shelly, Faraar can you please give me a read on the other? In detail please if that's alright

johnny is like. my second strongest SR after profmafia. i didn't really like the vote

[1]

as it was pretty lamisty + they themselves didn't really have a solid take on profmafia in 789 albeit voting profmafia

I explained how they were trying to make something out of nothing with their MWNN thing, and their iso isn't really spicy at all and lacks firm takes

[2]

[1] Are you referring to their ProfMafia vote today?

[2] Lack of spicy and firm takes is generally nai and sometimes can be even town!ai as no town should really be confident in their reads unless it's close to rock-solid if you know what I mean?

[MiniVirgo]

Also I think it's just them, my vote on them is out of policy because we cannot allow anti-town behaviour and I've generally come to realise that anti-town behavior, even if town, has to go bye bye.

do you townread N_M

Nope, I am SRing them but I think I am because they're being anti-town and I don't remember playing a game with them in a while but I know they're like this so it's policy at the same time.

If that makes any spec of sense

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Shelly, Faraar can you please give me a read on the other? In detail please if that's alright

johnny is like. my second strongest SR after profmafia. i didn't really like the vote

[1]

as it was pretty lamisty + they themselves didn't really have a solid take on profmafia in 789 albeit voting profmafia

I explained how they were trying to make something out of nothing with their MWNN thing, and their iso isn't really spicy at all and lacks firm takes

[2]

[1] Are you referring to their ProfMafia vote today?

[2] Lack of spicy and firm takes is generally nai and sometimes can be even town!ai as no town should really be confident in their reads unless it's close to rock-solid if you know what I mean?

From JV as well

[MiniVirgo]

[1] Are you referring to their ProfMafia vote today?

[2] Lack of spicy and firm takes is generally nai and sometimes can be even town!ai as no town should really be confident in their reads unless it's close to rock-solid if you know what I mean?

[1] yes
[2] One thing that absolutely glows town to me is a read that is confident but isn't TMId if you know what I mean
do you think lack of content (I consider takes to be content) is townie then?
content is town!AI and there's almost none from that slot

I'll have to read their ISO to gather things because I think you see things vastly different than how most see things, definitely not a bad thing of course!

- JV

[MiniVirgo]

Fwiw I believe I called out what I didn't like about their vote

[MiniVirgo]

Spoiler:

Mod confirmed scum for not being bolded correctly

Why provide reasoning in a second post? Town aren't afraid to RVS
VOTE: mwnn

"*Casts vote*

Oops that might get pushback

*here's a dumb reason*"

Thought process of a page 1 scum

Instantly jumping into the thread yeeting on MWNN and derp. I remember also calling out derps switch though iirc.

I think mech talk is a bad way to TR people fwiw

and this is true, mech talk is the easiest thing in the world to do as scum

I mean, it's not the talk itelf that gives JV and yessiree townpoints, it's the proactivity, it's how they suggest solutions to solve this game and furthering the game out of RVS, and how they engage each other in a very genuine tone

I agree with this

Big Elephant is sounding increasingly scummy, I think the TR on MiniVirgo is a deep pocket, and they're just generally agreeing with stuff and throwing out forced reads instead of solving.

I think mech talk is a bad way to TR people fwiw

VOTE: Big Elephant

I shittily try to end RVS but THIS gets no vote? /salty

VOTE: ProfMaf

Agreeing but not adding content and then trying to get cred for them ending RVS when they didn't.

She draws some undeserved scumreads. I recently replaced into a game that lost it's whole first day to Shelly vs. The world shenanigans and then she flipped town

This is one post I don't see scum!john and town!shelly as I would imagine scum!johnny just trying to yeet shelly.

Read up.
Pretty sure this is town Shelly posting.
Would be willing to vote Elberin.
Yess seems really cautious to me?

Those are the prevailing thoughts upon a reread. Is this a micro? I feel like there are only like 6 players

Barely any content up to their 19th post and then landed a vote on me.

The double derp is reasonably compelling, assuming that was the two different heads. Perspective slip, maybe? But by the end of your post we get into Shelly bein' Shelly.

Still better than voting someone who isn't here

VOTE: shelly/elephant/whatever

Keeping an eye on that prof maf slot tho

Sheeping again, even when they were voting me right before. They completely 180'd on shelly for little reasoning.

@mod is there daytalk in this game

Not sure there's anything to respond to here. Lemme know if you have any direct questions homies.

Asked what I already confirmed, possibly faking content.