Mini 2167: Illicit Substances Mafia (Game Over!)

[Remilia Scarlet]

do not target me; literally any other target is better. I'm psuedo-confirmable

[Remilia Scarlet]

death, taxes, and i fucking suck at this game

[Remilia Scarlet]

Also, bork, spayhalf is asleep but she told you so.

yeah well we can't all be in the top 90%

sorry i was just really convinced that the no-kill made no sense from a claimed target on you perspective and i couldn't really spin out of that

[Remilia Scarlet]

i have no PM about a neighborhood nor is it listed in my PTs

[Remilia Scarlet]

I also think targeting me, if that's what happened, was a fucking terrible idea

[Remilia Scarlet]

You also believed that 420's role couldn't exist with yours. How does that impact your setup spec?

who the fuck knows; my first inclination is that it's maid but I think as muffin pointed out earlier it's possible that setup creators classified a town suicide bomber as negative utility.

Maid has the opportunity to falsify such a hypothesis so

p-edit: what you said

[Remilia Scarlet]

Is it possible it's a reflexive removalizer?

If maid comes in and says they targeted Remelia N1 and N2 i think we're also a wrap?

I feel like I'd get a PM if i were vanillaized

[Remilia Scarlet]

Actually, if the keep-away-izer is a night roleblock followed by a day-thread-removal then it's possibly just a guilty now?

Hopefully that's the case and they'll waltz in here and game is over because not RBing mariaboy meant that kill happened.

Does not explain maid getting removed from thread and April claiming roleblock on D3

[Remilia Scarlet]

Is there any world where april is scum here

I don't get the claim of a roleblock N2 if maid was the target N2 and scum has a roleblocker-thread-go-awayer

but that doesn't reconcile w/ april being gone now

i think the two mechanics have to be separate

[Remilia Scarlet]

The other issue is we are lightning rod, night 1 we submited but were removed from the game before our action went off. This refunded our shot.

ALL actions N2 redirect to you?

[Remilia Scarlet]

We redirected all actions to ourself.

why didn't you die then?

p-edit beaten

[Remilia Scarlet]

removed us from the game

during the day, not at night

[Remilia Scarlet]

We also redirected a doc to us N2.

You 100% did not lol

[Remilia Scarlet]

VOTE: Maid

[Remilia Scarlet]

UNVOTE:

This doesn't explain the April roleblock hang on

[Remilia Scarlet]

We know there was no protect involved N2, let's throw that out

[Remilia Scarlet]

So they were commuted while April forced to visit them.

what commute?

[Remilia Scarlet]

N2 we were removed from the game so April got 'roleblocked' because the target was redirected to us Along with the missing nk being explained via the doctor and us not being in the game thread.

this part in particular makes no sense; there's no way that protect from N1 hit you

[Remilia Scarlet]

That still leaves the missing NK hitting us n2 because

we weren't a valid target

that's something isn't obvious to me -

why

aren't you a valid night target

but April's lack of a result supports this

[Remilia Scarlet]

the second quote does not imply the first

one is for day things

the other is for night things

[Remilia Scarlet]

are they potentially related? sure

that's what we're trying to fucking sort out

so maybe drop the attitude

[Remilia Scarlet]

like some fucking metal sonic shit here

[Remilia Scarlet]

my cat can sense stress i think because she just swooped in to save the day

[Remilia Scarlet]

Scum is incapable of doing both those things.

*to two different targets, is the point you're really making

i agree

[Remilia Scarlet]

if the yeet is factional then unless maid can self target it they're town

[Remilia Scarlet]

you are taking a remarkably literal interpretation of a high concept that ST is floating

[Remilia Scarlet]

"fairly normalish" does not equivocate to "has to behave like the [antiquated] wiki in every respect"

[Remilia Scarlet]

i guess i want to know what your hypothesis is

[Remilia Scarlet]

Pedit
The only way it makes sense is Bork scum.

Someone has to say it.

only way what makes sense

[Remilia Scarlet]

I truly think a mod error or something weird happened because I still have no answer for why our shot was refunded n1 but that's a rabbit hole I don't wanna go down atm cause that's not my thing.

ehhhhh that should be in your role pm or not

[Remilia Scarlet]

I think clown maid and if maid flips town it has to be Bork.
Pedit
Maid being town

why does it _have_ to be me exactly

[Remilia Scarlet]

N1 you alien the bomb to stop them from booming you
N2 redirect or whatever
N3 stop April from targeting you to make sure she doesn’t die

why is this predicated on it being me

[Remilia Scarlet]

I doubt Rem has this amount of hissy fits as scum otherwise they're kinda being a dick for no reason.

I don't really feel like I crossed a line here?

[Remilia Scarlet]

because mariaboy claimed bomb who was (probably) going to target you (or noddy) if true and noddy's POV being what it is means POE you're the scum in that relationship that was scared of asplosions

bruh

[Remilia Scarlet]

See muffin

but that's a dumb thing to think

[Remilia Scarlet]

i mean, im not saying i agree with that logic, just that's what noddy is saying

i'm aware

[Remilia Scarlet]

What is the remaining mafia's role name? How on earth do you explain everything that's left?

for starters. at this point i think you have to assume that scum are capable of removing someone every day ad infinitum

[Remilia Scarlet]

Maid is the easiest mislim in the world day three... why block them twice in town-maid scenario?

they didn't, they targeted someone else N2

[Remilia Scarlet]

in order to believe Maid you have to allow for that, yeah?

[Remilia Scarlet]

the refunded shot is....interesting but ultimately might be the key to the confirm here

[Remilia Scarlet]

So in a town-maid world, correct me if I'm wrong here:

N1 something caused them to not be able to act, their shot WAS refunded. They WERE the target of the day removal

Day 2 they could not post due to the yeet.

N2 they got their shot off, their shot was used up, they were NOT the original target of the day removal.

Day 3 they could not post due to the yeet.

that's what I'm thinking; there would have to be a deliberate check that says a roleblock on your action refunds it

only thing that strikes me about all of it is that's two HUGE ways to block a kill in a world where we likely know no strongman exists

[Remilia Scarlet]

and then doc can't act again until N3. so I guess I can see it

[Remilia Scarlet]

yeah since both of these actions affect the other, you have to use the NAR tiebreaker stuff

NAR is explained horribly on that page btw

[Remilia Scarlet]

never really heard of a game where a person can take multiple non-factional actives

[Remilia Scarlet]

Copy
Hide <--Generally I apply commuting to be here, but it's up to each mod to decide that.
Bus Drive
Block <--The alien role could be here instead
Redirect <--Lightning Rod would be Here
Protect
Miscellaneous
Kill
Recruit
Inspect

yeah self-actions are explained awfully by this. Does a commute "affect" a roleblock's ability to resolve? what does that even mean?

[Remilia Scarlet]

Never heard of a game of mafia where presumably the mafia can straight up not let the player play the game they signed up for, for weeks on end, but here we fucking are.

yeah mistakes were made

[Remilia Scarlet]

The vortex ability can't be self-target.
That would be extremely silly right?

I don't feel comfortable saying "definitely not"
but probably not

[Remilia Scarlet]

Yeah it's like a Loud Alien basically?

[Remilia Scarlet]

Where on that priority list does the alien role fall?

Block imo

[Remilia Scarlet]

Why does tammycho put that wackass role in an otherwise nice and simple mechanically setup.

ahem

[Remilia Scarlet]

ironically I think that role helps clear Maid here

i'm w/ muffin here in every respect

[Remilia Scarlet]

{Bulge} is unimpeachable
{April} i think is basically clear here.
{Maid} processing but losing interest
{Muffin} I think looks town today by play and everywhere else too

---------

to re-sort: others

[Remilia Scarlet]

With a 1-shot do you get a refund if you're blocked?

varies

[Remilia Scarlet]

Scum decided to block a town bomb from going off on a pool of two townies, when said town bomb explicitly had both mafia so far in their 100% town list.

someone who wanted to get value on a claimed PR imo

[Remilia Scarlet]

i don't think there was any necessary guarantee they were going to flip what they claimed on D1 at that point and leaving it till later in the game could've potentially either clarified that for scum or muddied the waters for town

[Remilia Scarlet]

Why not target april, who explicitly claimed provable PR during day one?

well that i can't answer

[Remilia Scarlet]

I think it's just within tunnel and remillia at this point, no?

thought you didn't believe i'd make such a move?

[Remilia Scarlet]

yeah

[Remilia Scarlet]

since you're suddenly so sure that's what happened

[Remilia Scarlet]

Do you have a better explanation other than it being notsci, in town-mariaboy world?

this is an argument from ignorance. i can't prove a negative

but it's also a really convenient way to just potentially line up me and ST

[Remilia Scarlet]

But your tone here right now suggests I was wrong.

my tone huh

[Remilia Scarlet]

i won't yell at you

but i don't really know what else to say:
this started as "this looks like it could've been you/notsci but that seems pretty surface level / probably irrelevant" and ended up at "do you have any other explanation than the NK for how we ended up here" in the span of minutes from them

[Remilia Scarlet]

Lmao okay quickwagon midwayscum if plus flips green, which I do think happens, midway literally your only hope is he flips red.

-innocentvillager

if anything worries me in ST's iso it's this.

[Remilia Scarlet]

This is kinda different, though. It feels like you have no choice but to discredit me now.

Do I?
I could just engage in a shit fest w/ ST over this "i guess you have a point that it's one of us and it's not me so it's him" thing
I could push muffin who has been on the periphery the whole game.

There are fewer places to look now. I feel like that should be self-evident.

p-edit: I don't care about any of this NKA stuff. it's so easy to say "I'd never do X as scum" and totally have done it

[Remilia Scarlet]

It's been on the JK page forever as a variant

voidedmafia used to run newbies and would mistakingly process JK like Alien, then tried to tell me I was wrong post game when I mentioned it

[Remilia Scarlet]

If ST flips town then what?

Why is the onus on me to know exactly where I'm going to end up in a hypothetical

if me/ST flip town because your assumption was wrong then what?

[Remilia Scarlet]

Like I legit don't get where you're going with this

I look elsewhere

[Remilia Scarlet]

VOTE: remi

Lightning rod pulls the alien to them, I got my question answered

how does this make me scum exactly

[Remilia Scarlet]

sigh. i didn't either and i'm getting really suspicious of anyone who isn't you pushing that

[Remilia Scarlet]

Why is it hell

Because it’s down to me or Bork or someone deathly afraid of town us dying for some reason?

It's hell because we think one of our locktown reads is actually scum that snowed us until night actions. One of those reads was fading on Day 3, but still.

Spayhalf hates life when players she loves to play mafia with draw scum against her.

your attitude on this page is just not commensurate w/ a game that is down to the PoE that you claim it is

[Remilia Scarlet]

Two of rem’s recent posts pinged me.

Due to where my head is at rn, I son’t Think it would even make sense.

His “tone huh” sounded like it had a double meaning of wistfulness.
#6996 is. post I don’t think a town Bork makes due to it deflecting or trying to relax tensions between a player that should be more likely than not scum
From his POV.

I think you're legitimately trying to figure this out but you've come to all the wrong conclusions
I'm not being "huh you caught me if only I'd acted like x instead"; I just am not sure I believe that all the sudden my tone suddenly betrays my now apparent alignment because i happen to be suspicious of them
I also don't subscribe to the theory that Morph is purporting about what the N1 block says about the remaining team so I don't know why you're trying to hold me to it.

[Remilia Scarlet]

I mean it's super easy to say "scum is playing a long game where they could go back and point to said exact shit" to eliminate whomever on D2 or D3. I obviously can't prove that.

Maybe they didn't believe the claim (but knew they weren't scum)

Why not just NK maid if they were such a threat here.

[Remilia Scarlet]

yeah

[Remilia Scarlet]

Damn bork. You have miscalled my attitude over and over again this game.

Your attitude toward me/ST changed so fast between 6836 and 6947 it about gave me whiplash

so help me understand

[Remilia Scarlet]

I feel pretty confident it's not muffin.

I don't have as strong of a feeling about bell

[Remilia Scarlet]

Like every time I've pushed in on you i've gotten some form of "you don't understand me" and I've backed off

I'm done backing off

That was all me (neuterhalf)

Spayhalf didn't drive last night.

I want more clarity on this. I think the block on maid being indicative of ST or me scum is a weak point and every time I say so you seem to want to shift the burden of proof of that on me

[Remilia Scarlet]

Spayhalf however, is well below 50% it being you, and has been for quite some time.

Most notably, she maintains the way you acted around the wake fake guilty comparison shit that went down is something you'd not do as scum.

Yeah well this just seems like deflection where you don't have to answer as to why you're halfheartedly pushing me.

I don't see ffery here yelling at bell/ST about voting me

[Remilia Scarlet]

and then I get "it's all doom and gloom cause bork/ST rolled scum"

come on

[Remilia Scarlet]

Every fucking time

[Remilia Scarlet]

VOTE: ST

final answer.

i don't fucking know

[Remilia Scarlet]

we might need to have a serious talk postgame

[Remilia Scarlet]

Your claim does not at all fit the theme/simplicity of the rest of the flipped roles and claimed roles in the game.

i guarantee you that i did not just make up a dipshit claim just so people like bell would go "huh would bork really do that"

[Remilia Scarlet]

-f

[Remilia Scarlet]

I thought you would have seen we're looking wider than ~it must be bork or st~. And I thought you'd want to look wider, too.

I don't think it's muffin
You don't think it's bell
I'm willing to have a conversation about either one of those

[Remilia Scarlet]

Muffin is primarily tone

Yesterday like, April fucked up big time w/ pulling an audible on the target and Muffin righteously took him to task for it. like if Bulge were to have ended up dead and April hit scum and also died, that would've basically been gg

[Remilia Scarlet]

I was weird on Bell early game
Why _don't_ i need to worry about bell because i don't know that i can find a compelling reason that you do w/o a lot of scouring other than poe

[Remilia Scarlet]

Bulge, Maid, April, and I'm inching muffin into that group as a bank-it read that I don't want to touch
if you somehow faked 7050 well, um, great for you.

[Remilia Scarlet]

and why?

do i really need to explain those first three?

In order to believe

either

of April,Maid you have to assume that this ability is self-targetable

[Remilia Scarlet]

now that 420 flipped can you go in depth like i'm five years old level of not understanding, why you thought your role and 420's couldn't coexist?

No,

that

is a suspicion i can entirely understand

Initially I thought that all the claimed PRs just painted too strong of a picture without one being fake, and it's why I claimed when I did, and I thought it heavily controlled who scum got to eliminate in a way that seemed unlikely to have both of 420 & me being town - because I thought a me alive at ELO could turn a loss into a win with scum none the wiser (i mean fuck depending on the team we could probably get the whole fucking team to claim after they thought they'd won. Is that fair? Probably not but that's not my fucking problem lol). I also thought that it synergized in a way that basically would allow 420 to get me to endgame if he so chose to w/o scum really being super able to stop it from happening

Yesterday I didn't see a world where scum has to deal w/ 420 and April and instead goes for you; but if they only had to deal w/ one of those two because the other was scum then it made considerably more sense.

[Remilia Scarlet]

(I think it’s a fair assumption that scum wouldn’t want to bus there?)

Trust me, I read F/GO

If I thought my Archer buddy was going down you bet your fucking ass I'd have no problem powerbussing that goon flip

(I hate having to make this kind of argument but come on)

[Remilia Scarlet]

relax

there is no relax

[Remilia Scarlet]

Do you think bell is scum?

I really haven't ruled it out to the extent others have

you made a post earlier:

[Remilia Scarlet]

I am pretty nuts Bell, but like the chance that you are scum is like smaller than the chance that I misread our role PM and we’re scum

-innocentvillager

ok IV made it but still

want to know what the rationale is behind that statement

[Remilia Scarlet]

But why does a Bell Bear Joyed team alien maid n1?

because getting ahead early isn't necessarily winning?
because they didn't believe the claim? (i think this makes potential sense in particular)
because prophetically they knew we'd eventually be right here right now having this convo?
because WIFOM

i think the potential value of letting maid do whatever d2 is probably worth it to a scum team even if they did believe there was a shot at getting pressured d2 which is why i'm thinking maybe they thought maid was something other than what they claimed but they didn't know what

[Remilia Scarlet]

because they didn't believe the claim? (i think this makes potential sense in particular)

Unpack this one on me, please?

They knew that maid wasn't on their team
They knew that maid was a PR but didn't take the claim at face value

[Remilia Scarlet]

Where do you think Plusjoyed used the rolecop?

clearly not on maid
other than that i have no idea

[Remilia Scarlet]

I don’t think it’s you guys? I like your interactions with bear as t/s

i want to know the posts you're pointing to here

[Remilia Scarlet]

Okay but why would they disbelieve a claim of town bomb in particular when they have perfect knowledge of their own roles as goon/alienthing/1-shot rolecop?

I don't really understand this question

[Remilia Scarlet]

They’re saying with alien as such an easy counter to bomb why wouldn’t they believe it

Pedit
^

I see.

Doubt I have an answer for this that is going to satisfy.

[Remilia Scarlet]

I'm trying to talk myself out of being paranoid that this is a hangup because you KNOW scum didn't believe the claim, stupid as that sounds.

well now you're being silly;

I don't want to go and post-hoc come up w/ reasons why that might be true. I don't think that's what you want to hear and I think it'd be confbiasy from me.
my resistance to this idea was a reaction to the the manner in which you decided to narrow down the pool to two people one of whom i'm positive is town. I still cannot prove any of what you're saying is true or false and I'm not sure what else to say about it.

[Remilia Scarlet]

Current mental state: Crawl in a small hole and rock myself back to forth.

christ

[Remilia Scarlet]

I'm not sure what to really do here. I can prove my role at ELO if we end up at such a place.

{ST}
{Bell}
{Morph} just mechanically if not one of the top two
super outside shot at {Muffin} but I think it's less likely than the other three

Unless I'm drastically misinterpreting some sort of night interaction in which case {Nacho}

It'd be nice if scum ran out of shots of alien and were forced to kill april at some point because it would probably get a last clear / or a guilty that bulge could verify but you don't see many 3-shot roles.

[Remilia Scarlet]

at one point i started thinking "it could be a role he designed for that game hes running and he's whipping it out here as a fake-claim"

Not really my style, in either respect (whipping out a role i have in a box or making a role like mine where scum just loses if they don't cop it / get it claimed)

[Remilia Scarlet]

p-edit: We had a role like that that explicitly stated the mod would inform you when it went away. In a bork designed game. That's why we're paranoid of it.

that's not a feature of my role

[Remilia Scarlet]

It does not say.

[Remilia Scarlet]

I assume that "miselimination would immediately end the game"

[Remilia Scarlet]

it just says <paraphrasing> "if an elim would end the game in a town loss"

[Remilia Scarlet]

sorry to disappoint but i'm off tomorrow and kicked off early today

[Remilia Scarlet]

I am reading it in that the elim itself would have to end the game (and not go to night to possibly end the game)

i think this is the only reasonable interpretation of this

[Remilia Scarlet]

well, again, do you get told that's the case?

no

and how does that get affected by the removaliser role (e.g. it's 8p now only 7 can vote, so theoretically if it were 4p but only 3 could vote, the game would end after a NK and not on that day?)

I'll ask but i don't think i'm entitled to that information

[Remilia Scarlet]

Don't really get what that objection was. It's not like I couldn't have sorted that out if/when it happened. Didn't really occur to me that that role could change when the game ended, and i don't really believe that it can. a silenced townie is not dead.

[Remilia Scarlet]

it could force an artificial lylo i guess, since even an NL there allows scum to NK to win

I strongly suspect that my role would not end the game in that case and i even more strongly suspect that nacho won't tell me
I have a PM out about it

[Remilia Scarlet]

If you're town bork you can yell at me in the dead thread and postgame and revoke my API key.

dead thread? considering the length of twilights in this game i'm perfectly content to yell at you right here

[Remilia Scarlet]

me first

[Remilia Scarlet]

mm hmmm

[Remilia Scarlet]

ok, the answer was actually a conditional "yes"

<paraphrasing> if such a role exists that brings ELO (or MELO! MALO? he used old mylo/lylo terms) earlier than it seems to be, basically if town

could possibly

lose by the beginning of the next day by eliming incorrectly then it would activate

[Remilia Scarlet]

assuming all that shit is actually possible, yes.

[Remilia Scarlet]

I'm claiming, fuck it.

Brotherhood, Last Resort ("Catch You When You Fall Bro")

If scum were to hammer me, at ELO, game will not end, VC will be reset, and my role PM will be posted in the thread.

Brotherhood is role flavor name, "Last Resort" is like what would be there in place of "Cop"

"Catch You When You Fall Bro" is ability flavor name, and Last Resort is also the thing that would say "Investigate" if I were a cop, etc.

[Remilia Scarlet]

i think this is the most amount of posts i've had in any game

[Remilia Scarlet]

how do we move the game forward at this point

apparently i am dead man walking

bulge, april, maid

who out of {ST, Muffin, Morph, Bell} are you suspecting

[Remilia Scarlet]

i'm about to have my nightly bout of "morph has an entirely too high concentration of doom-and-gloom flavored paranoia alternating with weird targeted mood changes" again and i need someone to talk to about it

despite the time that every time we interact ffery is able to placate me

[Remilia Scarlet]

despite the fact that every time we interact ffery is able to placate me

ebwop

[Remilia Scarlet]

just kinda wish more people would actually play the game here i feel like this is basically a bunch of



with confirmed town sitting on the periphery

and if that was to gather data that's one thing

but i kinda feel like it's apathy that could potentially lead to a loss

[Remilia Scarlet]

and no town has any reason to be apathetic at this point in the game

[Remilia Scarlet]

I have posted as much in the last hour as I have the last week

so whose apathy is confounding you?

you misunderstand

i'm not suspecting you

i'm worried for you

[Remilia Scarlet]

like if morph is scum i don't think you have it in between you and maid to every whirl around on them because they're just so entrenched

and you're here i guess now which is cool but before then you were a non-presence
maid is is prod range

so whatever

[Remilia Scarlet]

I got lazy today and didn't bother writing the case on why I think it's Remilia.

I don't think it actually matters or needs to be created at this point.

god i hate this post

but it's the circle of life

someone fucking do something

[Remilia Scarlet]

lol fuck off
my whole role is to be in cylo

[Remilia Scarlet]

eh, it's a lot of irl stuff

all you had to say. i'm not gonna belabor that

[Remilia Scarlet]

can't wait for all this shit really

[Remilia Scarlet]

your efforts are better spent actually figuring out how to win the game on d5

[Remilia Scarlet]

Look man, if you want it, i'll effort it into existence tomorrow while I pretend to work or something. But it's not like it'll do either of the two of us any good. I'm never gonna convince you that you're scum, and I already am convinced you're scum and don't need a case to make that happen.

i am glad you read your mafia 101 handbook on how to engage w/ your scumreads

[Remilia Scarlet]

sorry i'll try to stop being an asshole

[Remilia Scarlet]

like literally everyone in the game has expressed desire to vote me

like fuck off with that. someone fucking sack up or actually engage me on my viewpoints

[Remilia Scarlet]

i feel like i'm the only one besides morph and st putting in any amount of effort and that's FUCKING WEIRD for this gamestate

[Remilia Scarlet]

Why does morph scum not let Maid sui bomb us n1? Who do you think would be the n2 alien of theirs if they were scum?

My entire ISO today has been about this. I'm not fucking going into it again

[Remilia Scarlet]

Right now gun to head if you green-flipped and I had to hipshoot within 30 seconds? I'd be shooting muffin in the face. I don't know that spayhalf agrees with that.

I don't either but i see why his interactions today make you think that

reminds me a little of yours w/ me in persona 4

[Remilia Scarlet]

Actually my reason is completely different from that.

what is it then

[Remilia Scarlet]

it turns out that Amid the pressure of multiple mechanical clears, a general obvtown gives no help.

p-edit: if that interaction was today it's cause i had the entire fucking game gunning for me on my mind sorry

[Remilia Scarlet]

The only one I get weird about was that convo around the hammer but it felt too openwolfy to be wolf

i should probably go back and look like who were plus/bear interacting w/ like they were defeatedistly feeding information to

[Remilia Scarlet]

5768 honestly looks like the most spur of the moment candid thing in that string

[Remilia Scarlet]

Midway if you come back you should definitely tell us why the heck you shot something smart

Yeah that probably wasn't too smart. Honestly, it didn't even make sense mechanically in hindsight(I think) but it is what it is.

this is pretty compelling tho yeah

[Remilia Scarlet]

not sure midway had the foresight to stage and run that theatre

[Remilia Scarlet]

to be fair that's just applying occam's imo

[Remilia Scarlet]

I can make a case for and against Rem and may or may not become eliminatable/uneliminatable from it. But I don't really feel like it.

please don't i don't really want to fucking deal with it

[Remilia Scarlet]

how is the last sentence relevant

[Remilia Scarlet]

@morph

[Remilia Scarlet]

Yeeting april prevents him from targeting muffin, the mafia yeeter, in this scenario?

you really don't want april getting a result, no matter who it's on, as scum imo

[Remilia Scarlet]

Everything is on the table if there's a tomorrow.

wait why is everything not on the table now

[Remilia Scarlet]

Because it's you.

[Remilia Scarlet]

some wacky claimed XYLIM

so wacky wow crazy

non-normal

just wow weird

[Remilia Scarlet]

Like you supposedly have this wacky weird inflatable tube man role. And yet you never bothered to clarify the mechanics of it at all until pressure to do so by outside forces while at Lim-1?

Yeah, fuck that.

yeah wow it's like i don't constantly play the game like i have to have arbitrary theorycraft from others in triplicate at any point in time
YOU all had clarifications to make
I got them clarified
fuck off

[Remilia Scarlet]

i can just sign off?

like i don't fucking want to do this either but you can't be fucking arsed not to goad me

[Remilia Scarlet]

i'm really not in the mood bell

but thanks

[Remilia Scarlet]

no actually i'm not gonna post anymore tonight because i hate this

[Remilia Scarlet]

i am entirely aware

[Remilia Scarlet]

Tomorrow.

[Remilia Scarlet]

yo

[Remilia Scarlet]

Do you feel like you got anything out of last night?

just aggravated.

going to be even moreso if this day goes to deadline w/ people basically prod dodging and going 'imma case remi'

like at least just have the fucking decency to just say 'poe / i hate your claim' instead of iso diving me and looking for whatever your confibias minds are capable of dredging up

this wasn't really directed at anyone in particular

[Remilia Scarlet]

i really hope it's ST or you're all going to have a very uncomfortable ELO

[Remilia Scarlet]

Just your personal read of things, or?

it's commensurate w/ your current theory about why maid was blocked N1

[Remilia Scarlet]

I'm not sure what to really do here. I can prove my role at ELO if we end up at such a place.

{ST}
{Bell}
{Morph} just mechanically if not one of the top two
super outside shot at {Muffin} but I think it's less likely than the other three

Unless I'm drastically misinterpreting some sort of night interaction in which case {Nacho}

It'd be nice if scum ran out of shots of alien and were forced to kill april at some point because it would probably get a last clear / or a guilty that bulge could verify but you don't see many 3-shot roles.

this hasn't really changed

[Remilia Scarlet]

i'm just townreading muffin a lot harder than bell. i just think his whole body of work is just like, really town and if he's scum i think he's painted himself into an unwinnable corner by contributing the to mechanic solve as much as he has

whereas i feel like bell is just more of a tonal thing for everyone

[Remilia Scarlet]

morph-bell-muffin.

agree that this is a very real scenario assuming no ST.
or something's going on w/ maid or april that i don't understand

[Remilia Scarlet]

And bulge activity makes total sense given claimed IRL things but can you fucking blame me?

luckily there is literally no world where bulge can be scum

[Remilia Scarlet]

April is not a weak neighborizer would be that world.

really don't think this game started 9-4

[Remilia Scarlet]

ohhhhh a town regular neighborizer

[Remilia Scarlet]

yeah that'd be, uh, a thing

[Remilia Scarlet]

meh i'll call this one a W and move on if that's the case lol

[Remilia Scarlet]

i think seriously operating in that sphere is likely to lead to a loss

[Remilia Scarlet]

?

[Remilia Scarlet]

i have no idea what you're even talking about lol

[Remilia Scarlet]

i'll put some more effort on rereading those slots but i can't promise that's the conclusion i'm going to come to on reread

[Remilia Scarlet]

you want us to get killed N1?

[Remilia Scarlet]

I'm looking at the very, very early game and I think some of bell's early D1 interaction and voting patterns are kind of weird wrt to the scumteam:

Like he's hyper overreacting to things that + does (187 he votes plus for townreading him, but ST did the same thing w/ no reasoning on the previous page and he didn't bat an eye)

I remember not liking 492 when it was made and i still kinda don't now that midway flipped scum. I think this is the same kind of thing as the previous thing - something that he's over-anticipating the rest of the game is going to see as weird and is putting conscious effort on distancing early and often.

[Remilia Scarlet]

I’ll put it in spoilers so Town Rem can avoid having a stroke and scum Rem can nod along or throw his computer out the window for how bullshit my reasons are.

nah man i'm not going anywhere

[Remilia Scarlet]

The only reason I haven’t is because i’m feeing down and Rem told me not to.

you don't need to convince the rest of the game to vote me, lol, so if that's your motivation i'd rather you just not bother

this is turning into something different

[Remilia Scarlet]

i have no idea what you're even talking about lol

neuterhalf asked me last night why you were so pissed that he was scumreading you.

My answer: because you're town.

FUCKING
THANK
YOU

(really, thanks)

[Remilia Scarlet]

510

I feel like the point of the line of questioning from April is to understand why 183 led to 187
And it just reads as a huge nonanswer. "I'm trying to read plus but I don't really know how it's going to go because I was wrong last time so I'm being cautious" and then ends w/ a huge hedge on the read instead responding to anything substantive.
Also I don't see how naked vote based on "I'm townreading bell" is at all taking it slow

[Remilia Scarlet]

Where do you want to go today. Your vote is currently on tunnels but is your HEART on tunnels?

The worst thing that ST has done all game is definitely 5716; this post gave me an ulcer
this is the type of post that you use to get pressure off a scumbuddy later due to the prophetic red flip of plus and i need to look closer as to how ST handled midway the next day

[Remilia Scarlet]

VOTE: midwaybear

Wagon hooooo

now this came as a response to 6252

like i'd have to assume that they'd already planned to bus the next day due to how the hammer looked the day prior in order to believe that was a bus

[Remilia Scarlet]

i guess that isn't too much of a stretch but i can't really put good likelihood on it

[Remilia Scarlet]

I think I’m actually down to kill Secret Tunnel. In a townMorph world, which I can see, ST just seems like they kinda have to be scum based on where the game stalls at.

We’re unclownable.

-innocentvillager

kinda wrote this slot off at several points due to stuff like this and thought this was a PR soft

[Remilia Scarlet]

Both?

Neither you nor Bork wants muffin and I am still really flimsy on it. So I’m not shoving him

You guys and Bork I’ve been townreading all game and bulge is town by play and by April who I think is also town now

I felt bell was town earlier and same for the bear

this post seemed kinda town to me when i read it

[Remilia Scarlet]

ST's progression on muffin seems ok to me. I think they're always like on the periphery of elim-pool but not in an opportunistic way

see 7164, 7168, 7170

[Remilia Scarlet]

i may have a limited shelf life tonight but i'll try to collect my thoughts a little bit when I have a larger block of time tomorrow

realistically ST/Bell is where I'm putting most of my effort today; I'll review muffin but like i don't even have a baseline of what's scummy about what other people are seeing in him atm other than he's being
(characteristically) passive in an ivory-tower kind of way (this is mostly aimed at ST, i know morph isn't really looking here either)

thinking more about what to do w/ morph: every time i latch onto something i think is weird here my opinion is just completely changed maximum of three pages later. I think I'm just going to throw morph into the townbin and just hope i don't have to deal w/ that ever again

if i get weird just point me at this post

[Remilia Scarlet]

UNVOTE:

[Remilia Scarlet]

It's going to be absolute hell trying to document a scumcase if we decide we need to because of how comfortably zmuffin's scum game lives inside his town game.

i mean i'll keep that in mind but i feel like there are places in this game all muffin had to do is

nothing

and it would've probably turned out better for scum than the state we're currently in
i'll try to qualify that

[Remilia Scarlet]

progression starting in 6861 culminating in the conclusion in 6919 was the specific thing i was recalling from memory

[Remilia Scarlet]

No see that was the town bork section believe it or not. If I had the energy I would make a scum Bork section after finishing that.

seems really odd to me that you'd put so much effort into a conclusion you're not really trying to advertise

whose benefit was 7437 for?

I think there are silences, weird read progressions, weird role mechanics that make Bork's role untenable.

Like if you really believe that why not just point to why

[Remilia Scarlet]

This thread saddens me.

VOTE: Muffin

uh

[Remilia Scarlet]

We don't think it's muffin either :/

what changed

[Remilia Scarlet]

Unless mechanics/role shenanigans are at some level beyond our comprehensions then last scum is in {morph, Remilia, Secret Tunnel, Bell, Muffin}

i guess i thought you (collectively) bought into what you put in 6947

[Remilia Scarlet]

(because of 6920)

[Remilia Scarlet]

just wanted to know where your head was

can we talk more about bell? his strategy seems to be like "let me stream of consciousness everything that comes to mind right now in the hope that people townread it"

mixed w/ stuff like 7452 which reads to me like just designed to focus you on soothing the potential emotional cost here of misflipping me

[Remilia Scarlet]

So I disagree with his conclusion you're scum, and right now I don't really grasp the points that lead him to that conclusion. AND I can relate to that, too.

I don't really think he's made a lot of effort to advertise those points

[Remilia Scarlet]

your read on muffin is extremely insane for town Bork.

you keep saying this and you refuse to really explain why other than "that's not the read i have" or "it gives remi room to backpedal" (7129)

why does that read in particular give me room to backpedal

[Remilia Scarlet]

No? I mean, maybe on D1?

there's no way muffin has the pissing match w/ April starting in 6020 as scum, he just laughs about it in the scum pt

that was what my 6032 was about at the time and it continues well past that

like i'm sorry but I don't see scum going down this road at all.

It's not a complicated read but it's one I haven't really seen any reason not to be confident in

[Remilia Scarlet]

also if you didn't catch 7221 that was him checking to see if I was really PMing nacho

[Remilia Scarlet]

You can point in contrast to morph’s mistake and correction by muffin on joyed where he proactively stopped a possible mistake.

and that's basically what I referred to last night in 7436 relating to Maid