November-December Challenge

[Isis]

It's a little late, so let's do another two monther?

Previous Challenge

This month's challenge: Design a setup that indefinitely has kills, then becomes indefinitely nightless, OR a setup that is indefinitely nightless, but then indefinitely has kills. "Indefinitely nightless" means that an uninformed majority elimination is directly followed by another uninformed majority elimination, "indefinitely has kills" means each uninformed majority elimination is followed by one or several scum controlled kills or undemocratic kills. The "indefinitely" emphasizes that discretionary one shot effects don't count, for example, basing a game around the Alien faction doesn't work because it's unclear when the aliens will choose to use their limited nightkill. "Kills" means nightkills by default, but I'll also allow for it to mean dayvigs in an EBONAHAResque setup. There must be at least two phases after the shift. Before the shift, you would need at least 2 phases of eliminations to generate a first part of the game that was nightless, but you only need one day followed by one night if you want to generate a first part of the game that had kills.
If you manage to switch back multiple times, that's allowed, but that's obviously hard.

Setups that would qualify are:

-Fusion Mafia
-One Kill Mountainous, if the kill is forced to be used night one.

as it should be

-FakeGod Dance : although it's not nightkill heavy, you can draw a line after intermission and identify that at least 2 more phases of mafia will be played, but the mafia have no more factional elimination for the rest of the game.
-Fae of Wishes : It's a technicality, yes, but challenge requirements are intended to spark creativity, not forbid many designs for purity so it'd still be allowed (whether it'd be likely as a response to the prompt, eh)
-Safe to Split Push, which is a setup I didn't even use as a final entry to a contest but if you remember it before I feel less lazy and link it tomorrow, you earn so many stickers.

Wouldn't qualify:
-Purgatory: while the game can get into judgment day lock, judgment day is a purely town controlled exercise. If you get in on the EBONAHAR-style exemption, scum need to control about as much dayvigging as town (which is generally scumsided, which is why it matches the spirit of the challenge, a shift in tone on how much each faction can control the game)
-Nightless Vanilla: never has nightkills

[Isis]

Post 4 counts. I'm guess post 6 technically counts but it's just 11:4 double day

Gypyx's setup is mafia, because the Survivors are an informed minority, even though the mafia isn't. It's sufficiently in the spirit of the challenge, to me.

I'm pretty sure Akarin wasn't forum active when those open setups were posted so she is pretty covered in stickers. For the record, Fusion Mafia was actually run once (town won)

[Isis]

I'm gonna reword the OP cause I'm not sure >_<

[Isis]

Ok, I think that's more defined.
I'm still not positive whether Pooky's should count, I encourage him to consider doing a new submission in any event.

[Isis]

I'm bad at math.. it's actually just two eliminations, followed by nightkills and eliminations in alternation, right?

It definitely fits the challenge requirements, actually. I feel confident it's supremely scumsided. At 3:12 it's still scumsided but maybe runnably scumsided. 4:11 is definitely insanity-level scumsided.

[Isis]

it's 4:11 but scum don't get to nightkill until we hit a scum.

I actually played a game run by mith where it was 4:11 but the scum lost their nightkill if we hit a scum and that wasn't so bad :3

For some reason I read "they" as "all players in the game"

I am not sure why

Ok, after thinking about it, the reason why is that "started the night" is a counterintuitive clarification. It might be slightly more readable if you removed it.

[Isis]

It's definitely a scum sided setup but I hate town enough to tolerate it.
Could make it a 4:13. With mountainous adding townies is a somewhat futile effort to balance the game but when the game is at least partly nightless it could be effective.

[Isis]

you should do all of these things

[Isis]

Would you consider retroactively flipping the players during N1, people usually like flipz.

[Isis]

Yeahhhhh I dunno about that.

[Isis]

I would introduce Town Popcorn Machines that get VT PMs, but the scum know that they're Popcorn Machines. The scum would know they're more important to pocket from day 1. That seems like interesting gameplay.

I like the setup.

[Isis]

Another idea:

Situation Room

4 Mafia City Planners

13 Town City Planners

• Begins Nightless.
  
• When a City Planner is eliminated, the entirety of their wagon is added to a new neighborhood. This neighborhood will remain open until the end of the following day.
  
• After 5 eliminations, the game thread is locked.
  
• From there, each neighborhood is opened again and gains a nightkill, decided by majority vote within the neighborhood.
  
• The game continues with nightkills decided within the neighborhoods until one faction has achieved victory.

aka "Panic Room but hopefully not broken".

Definitely open to input on the numbers here, although I really like the concept. Not really sure how to balance starting nightless but then proceeding to the shootout. Maybe I should tend towards scumsiding it because scum don't ever get the ability to remove people they want to remove, it could be wildly townsided as is.

Do the 5 nightkills resolve simultaneously? It seems like it would probably be too easy to orchestrate a scenario where the second wave of nightkills eliminates all but 1 player from the game, allowing the town to win with one correct townread. It probably wouldn't be possible to setup if all four scum is alive by that point due to the likelihood of an all-scum neighborhood, but a mediocre town performance clearing 1-2 scum seems like it could set it up.
It's also a strategy which, even if it doesn't overall give overtuned EV, is grindy to actually execute but feels wasteful not to execute.
Sequential kills from the neighborhoods fixes this and seems better I think although I know it has much less fun game tempo.

[Isis]

Before eLo mafia-controlled neighborhoods can be held accountable for their decisionmaking so even that is not truly and completely a case where the behavior deviates from nightless EV.

Considering the neighborhoods get less neighborhoody the more they get winnowed down, maybe a black flag condition would be the best balance toolkit choice for fixing the nightless townsidedness.