Open 93 - Near Vanilla: Game Over, Mafia Win!

[thegeckoj]

vote: SpamWise

for not confirming yet.

[thegeckoj]

unvote, vote: MafiaSSK

i have meta him and i dont like the looks of his page, admitted lurker playstyle is unhelpful at best, scummy at worst. plus he doesnt even have our game on his list, makes me suspicious of him.

plus his only two posts are one confirming(sorta) and one incourging people to meta him, which seems weird to me.

[thegeckoj]

Doktor Per, how are we to leave the non-game related stuff out? isnt each game we play something to build our skills on. and the player specific wiki pages are there to browse to know something about the players from the get go. MafiaSSK has either a very poor play style, is scum or just likes to make himself sound tough on his wiki page.

frankly i dont see a reason to take my vote away from him.

fos Doktor Per

for trying to only have us focus on whats in front of us. this is an odd tactic as this early in the game as much if not more information can usually be found elsewhere.

[thegeckoj]

if you are agreeing with me that meta is fair game why are you voting for me?

[thegeckoj]

B/c retro's meta implies this is the norm for him.

i still dont understand the vote for me. i voted for MafiaSSK because he was lurking and because i dont like the way he tend to play games. plus he hadnt updated his current games list which lead me to believe he was conflicted about his role and didnt know how to put it down. just because other people had voted him earlier doesnt make me scum just means people are on the same page.

i never voted retro or said anything about his meta, so i dont understand why that makes any difference.

in the few games i have played people who get a band wagon on them early then drop out tend to be scum, if they werent they usually fight a bit harder. i still believe strongly for MafiaSSK to be scum. this is my reason not his namesake. right now i am not entirely sure who is on the 'wagon' for MafiaSSK as we havent had a vote count in awhile.

frankly i find Darox's vote of myself to opportune and see his trying to start a bandwagon on me, his '2nd choice.'
Darox: are you just going for your 2nd choice as opposed to your first because i am seem to be an easier target and you just want a quick lynch to end day one? this is really scummy if you ask me, but i still feel more strongly about MafiaSSK and his abandonment of the game just when the screws were getting turned to him.

[thegeckoj]

i didnt vote SSK's wagon randomly either. i buy into the whol scum gets caugth with his hand in the cookie jar routine.

i do find it odd that Doc pulled his vote when SSK was at L-1, since he doesnt really have much insight as to why he did it or who else he find more suspicious. this very likely makes a Doc/SSK team probable.

[thegeckoj]

actually by my count thats 5 votes and i'm up.

[thegeckoj]

bah never mind, its 7 needed, hold on im readying my defense...

[thegeckoj]

unvote, vote: MafiaSSK

i have meta him and i dont like the looks of his page, admitted lurker playstyle is unhelpful at best, scummy at worst.

plus he doesnt even have our game on his list, makes me suspicious of him

.

plus his only two posts are one confirming(sorta) and one incourging people to meta him, which seems weird to me.

The bolded part gave me the impression that it was a random vote. How does not having a game on his wiki page make him suspicious? I want to know what your exact reason is for voting SSK. I've read somewhere that you voted him, because he was lurking in this game (why him and not someone else?) and based upon his play style. SSK also asked you why it was weird, but you never gave that answer. Can you give it?

originally i voted him purely based on the fact that he was lurking and had a vote on him to put pressure on him hopefully to come out and start some dialog. i found it weird that at the time 1/2 of his posts was urging people to meta him. i find meta play usually helpful to others and less helpful to yourself. MafiaSSK case in particular because he claims a playstyle (lurking) that many players hate and which tend to impede progress of the game. why he would want everyone to know he has a negative playstyle (according to most) is beyond me.

B/c retro's meta implies this is the norm for him.

i still dont understand the vote for me.

i voted for MafiaSSK because he was lurking and because i dont like the way he tend to play games. plus he hadnt updated his current games list which lead me to believe he was conflicted about his role and didnt know how to put it down.

just because other people had voted him earlier doesnt make me scum just means people are on the same page.

i never voted retro or said anything about his meta, so i dont understand why that makes any difference.

in the few games i have played people who get a band wagon on them early then drop out tend to be scum, if they werent they usually fight a bit harder.

i still believe strongly for MafiaSSK to be scum. this is my reason not his namesake. right now i am not entirely sure who is on the 'wagon' for MafiaSSK as we havent had a vote count in awhile.

frankly i find Darox's vote of myself to opportune and see his trying to start a bandwagon on me, his '2nd choice.'
Darox:

are you just going for your 2nd choice as opposed to your first because i am seem to be an easier target and you just want a quick lynch to end day one?

this is really scummy if you ask me, but i still feel more strongly about MafiaSSK and his abandonment of the game just when the screws were getting turned to him.

Here you can see in the bolded part, you're reasons for voting him. These were lurking, his playing style and the fact that he hadn't updated his current games list. Only there have been others lurking as well, the fact that he didn't update his games list is for me not a scum tell and you've never played with him before. All your reasons for voting him are very weak. Tell me why he deserved your vote with reasons that I can see as good reasons. Until you do I'll

Vote: thegeckoj

i have explained why i voted him. of course there were others who were lurking two but sometimes you have to pick someone out of the few that seem scummy. to you my reasons may seem weak but since it is all i have to go on they are important to me.

Next you also say that some others have the same thoughts about SSK as they also voted SSK. Let's ask them all why they voted SSK. Everyone who voted SSK, please state the reasons for doing so.

This is as far as I know your third game in which you play. From two other experiences you state the part in italics. I don't know how this is called in English, but in my country this is known as a bad argument. From one or maybe two games, you're concluding something, while there are more games played besides those two in which you perhaps saw this.

i have only played two games on this site but i have played a few others online and in person as well. in the few games i have played (maybe 8 in total) this was my experience. again this is all i have to go on so it makes sense to me. this was even the case in the 'live' games, scum went quite once they felt defeated and resigned to their fate.

Then we have the underlined part. In it you ask Darox something and then without he has given the answer to your question, you attack him. You believed he voted you as opportunism, but in his answer you could see this wasn't the case. But in the underlined part, you attack him, without waiting for his answer, stating already that he attacked you as he sees you as an 'easy' target according to you. I don't like this part at all.

Then in your last post you do the same. You state something, don't wait for an answer, and start stating something comepletly wrong according to Doctor P.

first i dont know what you are really saying about Darox. i accused him of wanting to start a band wagon on me and stated that it was probably because he just wanted to off a seemingly easier target with a quick lynch. HE confirmed he did want to start a band wagon on me.

in my last post i made a mistake i thought the Doc had pulled his vote, he didnt, i jumped the gun. plus i do agree with him that it is to early to start guessing pairs.
i dont understand what you are saying i state something and dont wait for an answer? i wasnt aware statements needed answers. plus my statement was my sentiment, the fact that i believed MafiaSKK got caught being scummy and dropped out when he felt defeated, the main reason i feel that he is scum and continue to maintain my vote for him.

Short said, wrong reasons for voting and bad attacks. You're doing wrong things.

i think your reasons for voting me are bad and your attacks are fluff and just really drawn out. i appreciate the coaching but i think you are way off base here. i am not sure what you are trying to accomplish by make such a long post. you could have simply said "thegeckoj jumped on a bandwagon and makes attacks and doesnt wait for answers." this would have been much simpler and much easier for me to quote.

i urge you and the others on my bandwagon to reread the game so far and you will see what i mean about the who hand in the cookie jar with Mafia. i agree my play hasnt been ideal but at worst it has suspect definitly not something worth a lynch on. i am pro-town and trying to dig the truth as much as anyone. my playstyle clearly rubs ZazieR the wrong was because i am a bit abbraisive and accusatory but i find 'bad cop' tends to ferret out the scum while a few other pro-town players maintain the 'good cop.'

[thegeckoj]

i don't feel the need to a specific claim. i think that would be a bad idea at this point, just to appease some impatient people. i am pro-town, that is all i am willing to claim, once we start claiming specific roles that gives the scum even more of an upper hand and anyone that suggests it is really suspicious. the scum arent happy enough knowing who is scum and town? they want to know the exact roles as well?

i figure some people voting me right now actually believe me to be scum and i doubt anything i can say at this point will convince them otherwise. one or two are likely scum so there is no convincing them either. the few people that are currently voting 'just because' really need to reread and ask themselves if just lynching someone for the sake of it is worth it, because tomorrow the town will be down 2 people and really how much more information will we have? not much.

i am currently voting MafiaSSK because i feel he is the most suspicious for reasons already stated. do i know he is scum? no, not even close (probably in the 33% range) and that is how i feel everyones voting right now, just on a gut feeling with little to no substantiated evidence.

bascially what i am saying is i have to go back to the drawing board, and do an exhaustive reread to really pick clean what is availlable here and i urge everyone else to do the same, that way we have some realy votes not a bunch of guesses and bandwagons.

[thegeckoj]

i urge you and the others on my bandwagon to reread the game so far and you will see what i mean about the who hand in the cookie jar with Mafia.

That's twice you've talked about the hand in the cookie jar thing. Can you give us some quotes to explain what you mean by this?

[thegeckoj]

i urge you and the others on my bandwagon to reread the game so far and you will see what i mean about the who hand in the cookie jar with Mafia.

That's twice you've talked about the hand in the cookie jar thing. Can you give us some quotes to explain what you mean by this?

when i said hand in the cookie jar i was refering to the generic situation of when someone is caught doing something wrong (i.e. being scummy when you ARE actually scum) and there reaction is to hide. this is the was my original offense against MafiaSSK. people started a bandwagon on him early (possibly for reasons not totally warranted, which is besides the point) he tried a little at a defense but when it seemed it failed he gave up and didnt post for a long time. this is all i meant.

i know some are still pushing the role claim idea but i fail to see why that would be beneficial at this point. if i am scum wouldnt i just claim vanilla townie to be safe, there would be no way to prove or disprove this. so if i am a scum or a vanilla townie claiming would be equally pointless. if i am a power role it is a bad idea to claim since the mafia then know exactly who to target on night one (barring if i do get lynched because someone doesnt believe my power role claim).

the only thing that i am willing to claim is pro-town. this information is just as helpful as anything else i could claim.

i appreciate armlx and afatchic (with a little input from darox) discussion on the pros and cons of claiming at L-2. while i do think that armlx is pushing a bit hard for them claim and afatchic is defending me a bit much they both seem to be discussing for actualy knowledge and not to confuse or mud the waters.

as stated i completely disagree with armlx since i dont see how claim could possibly be beneficial unless i was scum and claimed scum.

i think we have made some small progress on the past few pages but in all honesty i feel as if we are at a stalemate with people not wanting to move from their respective 'bandwagons.' i certainly dont want to move from MafiaSSK yet and with very little participation (myself included, i apologize) from the majority it is hard to get any new info.

[thegeckoj]

geckoj- role claiming is a big help, for both sides. i.e. if you have a power role and are about to be lynched, then its in the towns best interest for you to claim so that we can try to find another candidate to lynch and not shoot ourselves in the foot by lynching a power role D1. and yes there is a chance you may be NK'ed tonight if you claim, unless a doc saves you, if you don't claim then you get lynched in the day, either way you die so its best to claim in the day and help out the town.

with all that said i still don't believe a L-2 claim is at all right. however i strongly urge an L-1 claim. and since i haven't liked any of the defense that you have provided or how you have acted once under pressure, im going to give you the chance to role claim now.
UNVOTE Vote Thegeckoj

Now claim.

fine, i am a vanilla townie. nothing special, definitely not the power to get people to stop voting him.

i dont know what else to say, i am an innocent, just a townie. i may not have the best defense or even the best reasons for MafiaSSK, but it is all i got and for all your sake i hope you believe me.

[thegeckoj]

The issue with that is you keep trying to defend someone you say you think is scummy from being lynched. See the contradiction?

right now he does seem scummiest, but i don't think we are ready for the lynch since half the people aren't playing. if we had full participation and were where we are now i would probably support it, but as it stands i think we need some replacements or something first

this game is lagging so much that i am ready for a lynch and i am begining (scummy though it may sound) to not care if it is completely educated. everybody is probably going to jump on my bandwagon for this and so be it.

vote: afatchic

purely to push him, hoping for a lynch just to get things moving.

i've already claimed vanilla townie and that is the best i am going to do at this point. i play these games for both sport and fun and while the sporting part still remains the fun part is quickly dwindling.

if this causes a backlash and i get lynched, so be it, but it would be the wrong move.

[thegeckoj]

i just realized i voted without unvoting, so...

unvote. vote: afatchic

so now afatchic has 4 votes and i have 5, i think anyway.

at least the game is getting a bit interesting. i am still very suspicious of MafiaSSK as he still isnt adding anything to the game, except for a short post letting everybody know he is keeping his vote on me.

[thegeckoj]

i just realized i voted without unvoting, so...

unvote. vote: afatchic

so now afatchic has 4 votes and i have 5, i think anyway.

at least the game is getting a bit interesting. i am still very suspicious of MafiaSSK as he still isnt adding anything to the game, except for a short post letting everybody know he is keeping his vote on me.

Self- preservation, very nice[/sarcasm]
if you are still suspicious of mafiassk then why are you voting me?
you are def. going back up on my LOS.

i am fairly sure MafiaSSK is scum, you i am not sure at all. i am voting you cause you are closer to a lynch then MafiaSSK and i am deathly bored of this day and want it to end, simple as that.

[thegeckoj]

Unvote: afatchic

FOS: afatchic

Hey Scum, when you get to kill people tonight, please kill MafiaSSK, OK? I think it would be mutually beneficial.

I don't like this - I will explain why tomorrow if needed.

Vote: thegeckoj

no one hammer yet! sineish can you please explain why you quoted Doktor's post then voted gecko. no one hammer until he has a chance to explain as i think it was a mistake

i am town, 100%. i am convinced MafiaSSK is mafia, i dont know why a bunch of small trivial things not the least of which is his metagame. is it great evidence, not by a long shot.

am i gonna change any minds, nope. and i am sick of this game anyway, hammer away and meet your fate.

[thegeckoj]

oh and i am pretty sure it is a MafiaSSK-Zazier scum pair. if i am right i will be back to gloat when the game ends with a scum win.

[thegeckoj]

The Gecko wagon: Started with good scumhunting, and continued to build from there.

I can see him flipping scum if we still want to lynch him today

. With that, I will add my

VOTE:Gecko

i am not scum. i have already said i am town.

[thegeckoj]

this game has seemingly grinded to a halt. what is everybody looking for? i'm pretty sure the scum are just holding out hoping i finally get lynched, saying nothing.

[thegeckoj]

dood. you guys are gonna be sorry. im not scum. MafiaSSK and ZazieR are the scum pair.

[thegeckoj]

silly me, okay its mafia and someone else then.

[thegeckoj]

@ gecko. what's your final case on Mafiassk?

just look over his entire post history this game. he has added absolutely nothing except to vote me because of a feeling. he doesnt even attempt to provide any evidence.

i realize a lot of people are convinced i am scum, there is likely no way for me to avoid my fate today, so be it. however when i turn up town tomorrow i hope all you vote MafiaSSK so at least you can try to even the score.

[thegeckoj]

im in too deep now. not much else to say, ive made too many mistakes and played a little to fast and loose to redeem myself. and i hate it when people point out appeals to emotion, obviously thats what it is.

[thegeckoj]

i know it often appears scummy, but in reality anyone close to 'death' is going to try and appeal to the killers emotion especially when the killers are supposedly innocent townspeople.