TM 2021: A normal roguelike

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Post Post #1625 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:34 pm

Post by Aristophanes »

In post 1621, DeasVail wrote:
In post 1618, Aristophanes wrote:
In post 1617, xofelf wrote:Sure, what's up?

What don't you like?
I've been talking with the team and well, I tihnk we've landed on an Ydrasse townread. Her posts are just too laid back in a lot of ways to be coming from scum, almost as if she's not worried about how she looks.

I get that she's a lot of filler fluff but there's also a lot there to work with and I don't think this is a game where filler fluff is a good idea for scum. I just don't really see it after looking at it with this in mind.
Ari I would argue that a lot of her posts actually seem very focused on how she looks.

Why don’t you think filler fluff is good for scum?
In a very laid back way maybe but no I don't think it's her focus.
And filler fluff in this game with these players and this gamestate is just scum asking to get limmed and I don't think scum come at it with that trajectory.
In post 1622, DeasVail wrote:Like, that’s the whole point of most of her posts. How many of her posts are about finding scum/town and how many are to look a certain way?
I feel like a lot of her posts are neither?
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Post Post #1626 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:40 pm

Post by Aristophanes »

In post 1624, xofelf wrote:Okay, why not? Also, if any of your reasons are meta, that's not going to mean anything to me so, try to keep it this game focused or more mafia theory centered, yeah?
Jingle quoted me the voteon you and honestly, does scum ever go "Vote xof for now but this wagon is shit and I hate it and am gonig to change the vote later but this is a vote for now"?
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Post Post #1627 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:47 pm

Post by xofelf »

For the sake of looking to be doing something, absolutely. I don't find that to be AI, I really don't.
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Post Post #1628 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:48 pm

Post by Isis »

Votecount 2.6
  • Sirius9121 (He/Him)
    (1) - Aristophanes
  • Augustus
    Caesar (He/Him)
    (0)
  • Aristophanes (He/Him)
    (3) xRECKONERx, Datisi, The Bulge
  • Datisi (He/Him)
    (0)
  • Ydrasse
    (She/Her)
    (2) DeasVail, xofelf,
  • Creature (He/Him)
    (2) Ydrasse, Augustus Caesar,
  • xofelf (They/Them)
    (1) Adorable
  • DeasVail (He/Him)
    (1) Creature,
  • The
    Bulge (Any/Any)
    (0)
  • Adorable (She/Her)
    (0)
  • xRECKONERx (He/Him)
    (0)
Not Voting (1): Sirius9121,
Deadline: (expired on 2021-02-14 04:00:00)



"Let us say that you are right and there are two worlds. How much, then, is this 'other world' worth to you? What do you have there that you do not have here? Money? Power? Something worth causing the prince so much pain for?'"
"Well, I..."
"What? Nothing? You would make the prince suffer over... nothing?"
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Post Post #1629 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:48 pm

Post by Aristophanes »

Interesting.

Okay I think that helps me grasp you. Thanks xof <3

Sorry this is, like, the first time we've talked this game :P
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Post Post #1630 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:54 pm

Post by xofelf »

Like, okay, look. I think we go about looking at reasoning fairly differently. Like if you said would Ydrasse do this, I might think about it. But like, there's a lot of stuff that isn't outside of the kind of things scum would do to look town. Like playing in a way to appear like a poor player is entirely within the realm of things people can and do often do. Like I look at Ydrasse's behaviour here, and a lot of her interactions with people specifically look like trying to behave a certain way with certain people to get specific emotional responses. Like, the people she knows, if she says this thing in this way to them, then it'll give them good feelings and vibes so of course she has to be town, right? I'm not saying town doesn't do that either, but there is something about the way she does these interactions that feel like a performance or almost gamebotty to borrow an LSG term, it's like if I put enough of the feelings coins into the interaction slot, town reads will pop out.

Maybe Ceph is wrong, but like, I'm playing with him because I trust his reads much more due to more experience than I have. And something just sticks out in a way that doesn't gel right.

P-edit: Lol okay. Well don't apologize, just fix it >:(
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Post Post #1631 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:59 pm

Post by Aristophanes »

Fixing it <3

I'm intrigued by the LSG approach to this tbh.

That said I'll have to dwell on it for the evening.
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Post Post #1632 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 4:09 pm

Post by DeasVail »

Ari, you mentioned that your team had landed on a Ydrasse townread together, yet most of your posts since then refer to your thoughts specifically. Is there anything additional that your team has said about a Ydrasse townread? I ask because your points seem more reactionary against suspicion on Ydrasse rather than reason why Ydrasse is town.
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Post Post #1633 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 5:33 pm

Post by Aristophanes »

In post 1632, DeasVail wrote:Ari, you mentioned that your team had landed on a Ydrasse townread together, yet most of your posts since then refer to your thoughts specifically. Is there anything additional that your team has said about a Ydrasse townread? I ask because your points seem more reactionary against suspicion on Ydrasse rather than reason why Ydrasse is town.
Oh, well that's mostly because of the way I approach teamreads tbh. I think it's way better to use the team's reads an a thing to lean on and use the provided thoughts to bolster one's own in a conversational style rather than just going "x said this" "y said this". I take my teams reads seriously and thus adopt them and use the point they've presented to in proper conversation and cases.

Jingle has helped me a lot here and has some thought I have yet to present but they are things I am considering and will vocalize when the time is right.

In typing this I can see why it might lead to a scumread on me tbh but I also don't think just spewing what the team thinks is a reasonable way to play and that crafting the right read from team interactions is of a huge importance to this event.
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Post Post #1634 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 6:10 pm

Post by DeasVail »

Thanks for the response Ari. It makes sense to me and I actually agree with your approach. I prefer the idea of integrating the team's reads with one's own and having a united approach rather than "x said this, y said this", as you point out.

I disagree with the Ydrasse townread, both because of how my own read differs and I don't think the reasons presented for her being town are very good ones. But I think you are town.

--

I had been unsure of the Ydrasse scumread but Xof/Cephrir scumreading her also and posting about it has given me new life and I feel positive about this direction once again! I have tried my best to find reason to scumread Ari, and attempted to challenge my own townread, but honestly I am coming up short and I just can't convince myself that Ari is scum.
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Post Post #1635 (ISO) » Wed Feb 10, 2021 6:17 pm

Post by DeasVail »

Datisi!

I need to know what your read of Ydrasse is. You've expressed light suspicion of her throughout but I can't find any solid opinion from a quick look through.

I also am brewing a scumread on you! At this point I see Ydrasse/you as the most likely remaining scum
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Post Post #1636 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 2:12 am

Post by Sirius9121 »

*observes*
余命数か月ばかりの恋に点滴で扶養する患者達
被害者の甘い期待を弔い悔悟の機会を躊躇うドクター
所以など行方知らず未知の病巣に臥す患者達
発熱が死因 然れば早期に躊躇すべきだったと知る放火犯
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Post Post #1637 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:00 am

Post by Datisi »

sirius can you stop being useless and vote???
I will straight up disregard all reason if you have a PR dream again. You can come back and be like, “I dreamt that Locke is a N2 Bulletproof Multitasking Cop and Self-Targeting Doctor,” and I will go, “Okay, Locke kill it is then.”
~M
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Post Post #1638 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:09 am

Post by Datisi »

In post 1635, DeasVail wrote:Datisi!

I need to know what your read of Ydrasse is. You've expressed light suspicion of her throughout but I can't find any solid opinion from a quick look through.

I also am brewing a scumread on you! At this point I see Ydrasse/you as the most likely remaining scum
deasvail!

the only "towny" thing i recall from ydrasse in this entire game is her throwing a fit at eod1. that's it. do i think she's scummy? eh, not quite. but not sure anyone in this game fits "scummy" right now. i don't mind voting her. i do think her townread or whatever on me is like... not good.

VOTE: ydrasse

also lol at me/ydrasse being scum together. i'll have what you're having, please.

@hectic, after scrolling through your iso for 0.7 seconds, i think i saw you not wanting to vote ari? can you refresh / link me as to why?

@ari, should i be townreading you in this game? also shotgun reads pls.
I will straight up disregard all reason if you have a PR dream again. You can come back and be like, “I dreamt that Locke is a N2 Bulletproof Multitasking Cop and Self-Targeting Doctor,” and I will go, “Okay, Locke kill it is then.”
~M
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Post Post #1639 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:37 am

Post by Augustus Caesar »

Alright
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Post Post #1640 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:42 am

Post by Augustus Caesar »

I read back on Deas/RCE interactions and I found this weird:
In post 725, RCEnigma wrote:My slot hasn't posted prior to my rep in so I'm assuming you mean unreadable, but treating as scum.
In post 727, DeasVail wrote:
In post 725, RCEnigma wrote:My slot hasn't posted prior to my rep in so I'm assuming you mean unreadable, but treating as scum.
No I think you’re scum
In post 729, RCEnigma wrote:Oh, well damn I can't beat that logic.
RCE replied too jokingly for my liking, whereas I think he would feel the need to act more annoyed or react harsher if talking to town.

BUT, then i saw this:
In post 718, RCEnigma wrote:I'll gauge the room, I'm 5-ish pages into my catch-up. Do any of you terribly mind catching up by response to significant (imo) posts or just most of my thoughts summarized in a block?
In post 721, RCEnigma wrote:Probably, through 7 pages my shortlist poe is datisi/Deasveil/Reck
In post 722, RCEnigma wrote:Actually looking through the last VC that doesn't hold up. I don't know the game state page 20+ but it's probable there are at most 2 scum on my slots wagon. That's mostly by virtue of not yet being hammered.
In post 723, RCEnigma wrote:Yeah I'll do summary over stream of consciousness, I'll have to give it some thought.
In post 724, DeasVail wrote:[Town]-- Aristophanes - Adorable, xRECKONERx, xofelf -- Datisi, Augustus Caesar -- The Bulge - Summer Nights, petapan - [Sirius9121] --- Creature --- RCEnigma --[Scum]

Reads update.

RCE I'm really sorry but you're looking very scum right now.
Deas states RCE is looking a lot like scum straight after RCE posts for the first time. No one else has reacted to RCE's initial posting and Deas is the first to do so. Scum!him has no way of knowing how people will react to it, unless he didn't have any part in helping RCE in the PT, and just let him post a fairly weak catchup. I think scum!Deas doesn't just put forth this RCE-catchup-bad narrative right from the getgo, but would at least allow others to react to it first. Like, this was RCE's first posts, it's close to a clean slate on a lurker-slot rep-in, Deas doesn't need to do this to his partner as scum.
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Post Post #1641 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:56 am

Post by Augustus Caesar »

Next I'm gonna check my Sirius meta to see if it actually fits what I remember of scum!him in my mind

Woah, so it turns out Sirius mods a lot of games

His first mafia game:
viewtopic.php?t=83818&f=50&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go

he's visibly having less fun and there's some forced-looking scumhunting there

this was a while ago though, so for this to be useful, we should look at a towngame during this same period:
viewtopic.php?t=84069&f=2&st=0&sk=t&sd= ... er_sort=Go

cool, so here, he's more natural and lolposting, he's kinda all over the place and just having fun. there's no forced-looking scum hunting

I think a big difference from these two games is that scum!Sirius feels the need to fake scumhunt, while town!Sirius doesn't care

in comparision, his ISO this game fits the latter mould. he answers questions when asked and has stated we should just do that:
In post 413, Sirius9121 wrote:
In post 378, Aristophanes wrote: Also, Sirius, something AI would be really nice from you.
Thx.
hi I'll post later after 30mins feel free to ask me questions
but isn't putting out fake-looking stuff
In post 1042, Sirius9121 wrote:assuming scum has setup info, scumteam easily find a perfect scumclaim.
we should give rce a kill target and if the target isn't dead kill him anyway on d2

go unvote
fools
lol I just saw this
isn't this really town-indicative? I don't think Sirius is the type of player to make a post like this about a partner
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Post Post #1642 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:08 am

Post by Augustus Caesar »

In post 1620, xofelf wrote:Maybe it's not a good game for it, but at the same time, it's not a good game for town to do filler fluff. Like it's a net-negative no matter which way you slice it. I also talked with Ceph for a while about Ydrasse to try to figure out why he thought she was scum, and a lot of the posts I brought up came from that discussion. In the post of mine you're quoting, I said I was flip-flopping. Cuz there is a lot that has made me think she's not town. And there's some stuff that could be town because it does remind me of myself a little, just the whole of it all just sits bad with me. So much of her content is nothing, and she has a lot of posts. I'd expect more effort to actually do something of some kind from town. Like yeah I know I'm not great, but I'm trying and I give what I feel about what's going on and try to give posts to actually justify this.
This depends on the player and you shouldn't treat this as a blanket scum-indicative trait. Ydrasse has towngames where she does nothing but fluffs for 90% of them. Fluffing/shitposting is not a useful way to read her imo
In post 1622, DeasVail wrote:Like, that’s the whole point of most of her posts. How many of her posts are about finding scum/town and how many are to look a certain way?
Which of her posts give you that impression?
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Post Post #1643 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:09 am

Post by Adorable »

Hectic what do you think of this post

I only gave a list of players I town read on day 1. I asked him what readlists is he talking about and he ignored me.
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Post Post #1644 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:10 am

Post by Augustus Caesar »

In post 1638, Datisi wrote:@hectic, after scrolling through your iso for 0.7 seconds, i think i saw you not wanting to vote ari? can you refresh / link me as to why?


last game I played with Ari he was town and got launched because he kept lurking and feeling demotivated (bonneytunz) - this feels very similar to that. The initial solving he was putting out and his tone also feel out of the scumrange I linked in that post
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Post Post #1645 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:15 am

Post by Augustus Caesar »

In post 1643, Adorable wrote:Hectic what do you think of this post

I only gave a list of players I town read on day 1. I asked him what readlists is he talking about and he ignored me.
Yeah, that doesn't really make sense and I don't know what Sirius is getting at.

@Sirius:
Can you show where you think Puff is talking about players she's planning to push later?
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Post Post #1646 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:23 am

Post by Augustus Caesar »

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
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Post Post #1647 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:30 am

Post by Ydrasse »

can i not be scums eod push again lol
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Post Post #1648 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:31 am

Post by Augustus Caesar »

just townspew lol

I'm just ISOing people... trying to find a semblance of a slot I feel even slightly good about flipping scum

ISOed Reck and not feeling it
ISOed Creature and not feeling
ISOing Bulge right now...
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Post Post #1649 (ISO) » Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:34 am

Post by Ydrasse »

am at work rn VOTE: xofelf

xof teetered on me back and forth for the game, defending sometimes sometimes not, their name got floated around and they came around and had suddenly decided i’m scum and now here we are

idk how they reacted around rce but i can read when i’m home, just like. ya
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