TM2021 | Anime Destroys Untrod Tripod | Endgame

[PenguinPower]

Votecount 3.07

Pine(3)

~ NorwegianboyEE(199), thestatusquo(52), Akarin(77)

NorwegianboyEE(2)

~ Flavor Leaf(329), Ramcius(54)

thestatusquo(1)

~ Pine(67)

Ramcius(1)

~ Mistyx(76)


Not Voting (1): Nancy Drew 39(204)


With 8 alive it takes 5 to eliminate.

Day 3 deadline is in (expired on 2021-02-24 12:25:00)

Mod Notes

• Have fun!

[Akarin]

I really have trouble with the idea that scum decide to use their 1-shot strongman on Ico last night, instead of waiting for massclaim.

Molla was dead and flipped already, Ico

wasn't

one of the two likely PR shots they could have made if we pretend everyone is town for a moment (Ram, FL)

It just seems way too weird.

[Pine]

Uh, no.

That would roleblock a Doc shot.

My jail is best used offensively, to roleblock a suspect.

FL is my lead suspect in those worlds (well I guess not scum norwee but the others)

He isn't mine, and you don't get to dictate my role usage.

Further, jailing someone and having a kill still go through provides a mechanical clear on that person.

I will not be jailing FL. I haven't decided who I will be, but he's the only one I'm definitely not going to jail.

Okay

Then establish who you are going to jail before day ends so we get the clear if you die

There's merit to that, but there's also the strong likelihood that scum have a roleblock or similar power. I'll think on it.

[Pine]

im sorry, i just feel a lot of scum energy coming from Norwegian guys, and that also helps my Pine town read.

His Norwegian case, or Dannfloor's really, is far superior to mine, im not the case maker, i go off feeling people's auras and actions

Speaking of, when is he planning to post that?

Paraphrased from Dannflor:

Dear Mini Theme,

I hadn't really been following, but when Pine started floundering I dived in. I now have strong opinions.

First, Nancy and Flavor - you are both Town, and the petulant TvT you're doing is trashing this game. Knock it off.

Nancy is Town. First, this is precisely her Town meta. That whole freaking out over being misread thing is classic her, and my research shows she sucks at faking it as scum. Further, she doesn't even

try

as scum, she's way more forgiving. That's not what's happening here. her scumgame is far more self-aware, and her blatant

lack

of self-awareness here is kind of a dead giveaway. (Editor's note: Creature shed the "Transparent" title, maybe it should go to Nancy for a while.) The only time I've ever misread Nancy was in our first game together, and at this point she's easy. I had some paranoia, but I checked and checked twice. She doesn't pull this a scum. The spats with FL reinforce this.

Flavor Leaf is also Town, incidentally. He mentioned earlier that DEB's buddies weren't likely to TR his absence and stone-throwing. DEB never remains unflipped in this game, and FL knows it. @FL you know who was hard TRing him right from the start? Nancy. As a scumbuddy, Nancy busses DEB here. And yeah, there's a WIFOM argument to be made here, but that's bunk. She can maybe do some WIFOMing stuff, but she's not up to that level yet.

Back to FL. Along with the hard Towntell Pine found earlier for him, his consistent approach to the game has been to solve and sort. Yeah, he's a prick. Yeah, he's a bit of an ass. But that fits with his aggressive means of sifting the game. But he's not quite this

reckless

as scum, and when he is it's far more calculating. Town!FL here has few illusions about survival, he's there to get in, solve, and pass it off to the grownups in the room to prosecute. It's what he does. Scum!FL has no motive to do a lot of the things he's done, provoking the people he has. There's just no

benefit

to it. He's not afraid to do so if there's gain, but there isn't here. He's just being a dick. But he's OUR dick.

Dann had a few minor observations about other players (including calling Shea out as a deepwolf long before I was convinced of it), but his thoughts focused most strongly on the Nancy vs FL issue and Norwegian. To continue.

HOW IS NORWEGIAN STILL ALIVE? He's so fucking scummy I'm starting to think he's intentionally trying to invoke the "too scummy to be scum" trope to avoid suspicion. He's been intentionally manipulating the game from the very start, pushing Town players into fighting with one another, then stepping back to stoke the carnage. Absolutely nothing he's done this game has been geared towards solving, it's all been tearing people down and tilting them at one another. "Frankly, it's gross and manipulative."

(Editor's note: That last sentence in quotes is a direct quote, everything else is heavily reworded to comply with the rules. Mods, if you want to whack me for five words, that's your prerogative.)

It's a long and abusive slog, but reread FL vs Norwegian in paired ISO. Think about what Norwegian's posts are doing. He's

goading

FL. I had Pine quote two posts from him earlier in the game, and they

remain

the scumfuckiest thing in the game. Here they are again:

titus says that Norwee and FL should never be voted unless Akarin flips town

i'm inclined to agree

I don't think this is a super bad take though, even if anyone dislikes VCA by principle.
If Akarin is town then it proves both me and FL are most likely in a SvT, and if Akarin is scum then maybe this just is a TvT and scum are in the inactive fucks or cheering our TvT on.

I’m not changing my vote until either me/FL is flipped or FL admits he is wrong on me.
I’m not going to become the elimination in ElO because of FL’s garbage play.
If FL agrees on voting someone else like Akarin then i’ll consider voting there as well. Otherwise, no.

Sweet jebas these are scummy posts

Credit @Dannflor

Everything about Norwegian's ISO is designed to engineer a scenario which is most beneficial to himself personally, while smearing others, particularly threats, with mud. He's trying to paint himself as the logical and Towny one, where he's anything but. He breathes toxicity and and tars up the game with nonsense, dragging the biggest threats into the quicksand of AtE and strawman attacks. Let's look at 3781 for a sec, where he's setting up this exact scenario, transparently trying to push an agenda rather than a solve. He's not considering other possibilities. He's stoking others' paranoia to keep the Town off balance until it drives home a lazy elimination. That's how we got a Zor elim, it's how we got a TGP elim. And all the while, he sits back and keeps poking. But again in 3781...LOOK AT WHAT HE'S DOING - he's demonstrating uncanny certainty and an impossible degree of confidence for a Town player. No Town player on D3 has the game solved this firmly. He has

presumptions

of Town on all of {misty, ND, shea, Akarin, Ramcius} that are so rock solid he's not trying to question them. He's only framing his arguments to this crowd.

TL;DR - Norwegian's game has been one of manipulation and provocation. He goads people into doing his dirty work for him, steeps the game in toxicity, and has crafted a narrative where he's the Town component of not one but two TvS pairs, in order to discard all outward suspicion of others and buddy up to them.

Whew, that was lengthy.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Dannflors read on me is not real. Tell him i know him better than that.

It is on me but he would also give that read as scum but it does sound incredibly earnest.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Pine and FL have given up on logical arguments and are continuing this disgusting shaming and treating me like i don’t have feelings or am insensitive to their blatant insults and attack on my personality. It’s sad how far people will go in order to win.
Misty/Nancy please just vote.

I want to hear Jingle and Dann’s Ram/Shea thing and I’m not voting anyone until I do.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Letting FL constantly talk about the same things is only going to make the game more demotivated. There's something named morale, and it's important.

Sorry to break it to you but that ship has already long sailed.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Nancy Misty are partly to blame for the toxicity in this game right now because they are enabling FL and Pine’s behaviour by not voting.

Are you fucking kidding me with this?

[Pine]

i'm not (helping to) kill today:

Nancy/TSQ/Norwee

pending stuff that needs adressing, i may or may not wanna kill:

TGP
FL

slots that I would have no problem yeeting today:

Pine/Deb/Akarin/Ramc (these are in order or preference)

Dann's rationale is that we can assume that TGP/FL/Pine/Akarin are all Town, which means the only one on his list who he's threatening is Ramcius, while impeding a Norwegian elim.

This NKA was the core of their reasoning, but all of us agree that it is stale and not as strong as the Towncase on Ramcius in light of recent Towntells from Ram.

[Pine]

Nancy Misty are partly to blame for the toxicity in this game right now because they are enabling FL and Pine’s behaviour by not voting.

Are you fucking kidding me with this?

Yeah, in a scummy game, that's the scummiest by a good margin. It's emotional blackmail.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Nancy Misty are partly to blame for the toxicity in this game right now because they are enabling FL and Pine’s behaviour by not voting.

This is the most toxic post all game.

This is actual emotional blackmail.

It’s definitely the dumbest.

[Pine]

No no no.

No.

You're assuming stupidity when you should be seeing malice.

Norwee is

not

that dumb, and you never see that coming from a Town slot.

[Nancy Drew 39]

ugh

hey akarin/nancy can y'all talk to me when you're online

I’m here now.

[Mistyx]

Norwee I still want your take on Ram

Town until both scum not being in Pine/FL is disproven.

I can't see a team not being Pine/FL at this point.

ok then you are blatantly not attempting to reevaluate and are therefore a liability

[Pine]

Nancy, can you talk to me about your reads? I've been a bit in and out this game, and I'm having trouble tracking where you're at now.

[Mistyx]

I really have trouble with the idea that scum decide to use their 1-shot strongman on Ico last night, instead of waiting for massclaim.

Molla was dead and flipped already, Ico

wasn't

one of the two likely PR shots they could have made if we pretend everyone is town for a moment (Ram, FL)

It just seems way too weird.

i think it's ~reasonable that they could have predicted that DEB was dying today so they had him use it before that

[Mistyx]

hi nancy

i assume you're still catching up so you'll see the thing i asked you in a bit

[Nancy Drew 39]

Spoiler:

Votecount 2.13

Akarin(4)

~ thestatusquo(73), Mistyx(65), Nancy Drew 39(197), Iconeum(186)

NorwegianboyEE(3)

~ Flavor Leaf(325), Ramcius(58), Pine(52)

Flavor Leaf(1)

~ NorwegianboyEE(217)


Not Voting (3): TheGoldenParadox(13), Dr Easy Bake(10), Akarin(12)


Day 2 deadline is in (expired on 2021-02-12 12:40:00)

Mod Notes

• Iconeum on weekend v/la

Votecount 2.14

TheGoldenParadox(3)

~ Nancy Drew 39(257), Akarin(49), Ramcius(63)

Akarin(3)

~ thestatusquo(88), Mistyx(68), Iconeum(186)

NorwegianboyEE(2)

~ Flavor Leaf(407), Pine(52)

Pine(1)

~ NorwegianboyEE(277)


Not Voting (2): TheGoldenParadox(13), Dr Easy Bake(12)


Day 2 deadline is in (expired on 2021-02-12 12:40:00)

Mod Notes

• Iconeum on weekend v/la
  
• Prodding TheGoldenParadox

Votecount 2.17 - Final

TheGoldenParadox(6)

~ Nancy Drew 39(286), Akarin(49), Ramcius(70), Iconeum(223), Mistyx(71), NorwegianboyEE(318)

-- HAMMER

NorwegianboyEE(2)

~ Flavor Leaf(420), Pine(56)

Flavor Leaf(1)

~ TheGoldenParadox(17)

Akarin(1)

~ thestatusquo(90)


Not Voting (1): Dr Easy Bake(12)


Day 2 deadline is in (expired on 2021-02-12 12:40:00)

Mod Notes

• That's it for Day 2!

okay i got some from titus about yesterday's VCA

she thinks DEB not voting is indicative of the wagons being TvT, and thinks scum are probably sheeping there

and thinks that Ram following nancy fills that idea

Math disagrees but yeah I think this is really interesting.

@Pine, please post Jingle/Dann’s Ram/Shea case please.

[NorwegianboyEE]

ok then you are blatantly not attempting to reevaluate and are therefore a liability

Don't give me that nonsense. I've evaluated more than you can believe, and now that i've got the solve in the bag i'm done. If you don't want to finish this game then don't, i was right and was targeted by two strong players since day 1 so it's not easy to convince at least 5 out of 6 town. Although consider that 5 out of 5 because Ramcius is just a lost cause.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I have a question, do strongman go through commute?

Norwee, simple question - why scum have 1-shot strongman, if town has only 1 JOAT with doc and commute?

These were the ones which made Jingle yell at me in all-caps that he was Town.

There's no scum upside to exploring this issue. He's solving the game through the setup. Scum either sticks their fingers in their ears and goes LALALALA KILL THE STRONG PR (like Norwee) or ignores the topic and tries to get the kill without engaging it (like Shea)

Scum does not poke holes in the setup argument against me

So did I misunderstand you then? Jingle now thinks Ram is town? Dann too?

[Nancy Drew 39]

I have a question, do strongman go through commute?

Norwee, simple question - why scum have 1-shot strongman, if town has only 1 JOAT with doc and commute?

These were the ones which made Jingle yell at me in all-caps that he was Town.

There's no scum upside to exploring this issue. He's solving the game through the setup. Scum either sticks their fingers in their ears and goes LALALALA KILL THE STRONG PR (like Norwee) or ignores the topic and tries to get the kill without engaging it (like Shea)

Scum does not poke holes in the setup argument against me

So did I misunderstand you then? Jingle now thinks Ram is town? Dann too?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Uh, no.

That would roleblock a Doc shot.

My jail is best used offensively, to roleblock a suspect.

FL is my lead suspect in those worlds (well I guess not scum norwee but the others)

He isn't mine, and you don't get to dictate my role usage.

Further, jailing someone and having a kill still go through provides a mechanical clear on that person.

I will not be jailing FL. I haven't decided who I will be, but he's the only one I'm definitely not going to jail.

Well that obviously makes sense because FL has promised to doc Akarin.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Nancy Misty are partly to blame for the toxicity in this game right now because they are enabling FL and Pine’s behaviour by not voting.

Are you fucking kidding me with this?

I apologize.
But consider this, FL and Pine is being toxic. And by not voting them out the gamestate is being switched in their favour because they are getting free range to keep being toxic and warp the gamestate in their favour.
You are currently stating that it's hard to keep up because of the constant toxicity, have you ever considered that might be exactly what they want?

[NorwegianboyEE]

That goes for MistyX too.

[Nancy Drew 39]

By the way

If Pine is town, scum are not bussing here

Which I think rules out Norwee/Ram and Norwee/FL

Why not Norwee/Pine?