TM 2021: A normal roguelike

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Post Post #2200 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 11:39 am

Post by Adorable »

In post 2197, xRECKONERx wrote:
In post 2167, Adorable wrote:
In post 2166, xRECKONERx wrote:
In post 2165, Adorable wrote:Creature had some weird interactions around beeboy. I also had a feeling scum said in the thread they town read petapan on day 1 and Creature was one of the players who town read petapan on day 1.

VOTE: Creature
Why do you think scum said peta was town
petapan is a really good scum player and he is the kind of player town needs to be cautious on. I was wary of petapan on day 1 worried he would be a deepwolf in the end since I did not have him on my town read and since petapan got killed on day 1 then this made me think he got town read by a scum player.
I'm not sure this answers it for me, why specifically do you think scum called peta town at the start
petapan made so many posts and petapan looks like the type of player scum will throw out a town read on.
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Post Post #2201 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:01 pm

Post by DeasVail »

In post 2199, Augustus Caesar wrote:(I know Deas had already claimed previously)
Oh?

(Not that I think the chaos was necessarily a bad thing either though. I don’t feel the need to be overly precious about claims etc)
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Post Post #2202 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 1:26 pm

Post by Isis »

Votecount 3.1
  • Augustus
    Caesar (He/Him)
    (0)
  • Aristophanes (He/Him)
    (2) xRECKONERx, Creature
  • Ydrasse
    (She/Her)
    (0)
  • Creature (He/Him)
    (2) Augustus Caesar, Adorable,
  • xofelf (They/Them)
    (0)
  • DeasVail (He/Him)
    (0)
  • The
    Bulge (Any/Any)
    (0)
  • Adorable (She/Her)
    (0)
  • xRECKONERx (He/Him)
    (0)
Not Voting (5): Aristophanes, Ydrasse, xofelf, DeasVail, The Bulge,
With nine alive, it takes five votes to make a decision.
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Post Post #2203 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 1:36 pm

Post by The Bulge »

who all is in favour of having me leashed? I'll share my thoughts after I get some responses.
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Post Post #2204 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 1:49 pm

Post by Aristophanes »

I think that limits your ability and I don't think it is proper in this case.

Leashing a vig is reasonable. Leashing a doc? No.
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Post Post #2205 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 2:08 pm

Post by DeasVail »

I disagree with leashing as a concept in most cases, so yeah no
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Post Post #2206 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 2:30 pm

Post by xRECKONERx »

In post 2203, The Bulge wrote:who all is in favour of having me leashed? I'll share my thoughts after I get some responses.
Leashing a doc seems like a very smol pp strategy
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Post Post #2207 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 3:14 pm

Post by Ydrasse »

i actually don't think that the chaos at eod yesterday was like... intentional.

it felt like it was happening because we were all going back and forth on who was scummy and who was a good idea and like... actually trying to consider and just being awfully indecisive which sucked

as siad before though, it's useful at least to see where people were bouncing from/away. but i still don't think that it was manufactured

that being said i feel like shit right now and will be here more tomorrow. also doc-leashing is dumb
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Post Post #2208 (ISO) » Tue Feb 16, 2021 3:16 pm

Post by xofelf »

Doc leashing is bad and dumb, please do not.
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Post Post #2209 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 12:18 pm

Post by The Bulge »

thanks yall. Adorable? Creature? Hectic?
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Post Post #2210 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 12:46 pm

Post by Augustus Caesar »

Nah, no value. Especially when there's no good reason right with no outed power roles to protect.
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Post Post #2211 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:22 pm

Post by Creature »

In post 2209, The Bulge wrote:thanks yall. Adorable? Creature? Hectic?
Meh, just masonhunt.

I feel like scum can easily find the other mason so you should prob do the same.
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Post Post #2212 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:22 pm

Post by Creature »

Ah I'm tired
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Post Post #2213 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:22 pm

Post by Creature »

So what should we do?
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Post Post #2214 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:23 pm

Post by Creature »

Can someone tell me if Adorable's reaction to their nearlynch comes from town?
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Post Post #2215 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:24 pm

Post by Creature »

Man did I find a game more stressing than mafia
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Post Post #2216 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:26 pm

Post by Creature »

I'll assume Ydrasse can only be scum with Hectic.
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Post Post #2217 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:27 pm

Post by Creature »

Feeling so unhappy about all this

VOTE: xofelf
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Post Post #2218 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:58 pm

Post by Adorable »

In post 2203, The Bulge wrote:who all is in favour of having me leashed? I'll share my thoughts after I get some responses.
I'm not in favor of having you leashed.
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Post Post #2219 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:01 pm

Post by Aristophanes »

Wow did we actually just agree on something unanimously?
That's impressive!
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Post Post #2220 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:14 pm

Post by The Bulge »

what a day eh
In post 2177, Augustus Caesar wrote:Also, my floating theory for why Datisi is dead and The Bulge isn't, is because scum rolecopped Datisi night 1, and so killed him night 2 over the doc claim. The fact everyone believed The Bulge's claim lends to this, since normally it'd be far more optimal to just kill the claimed doc everyone trusts rather try and snipe for another PR. I think it's far more likely they knew was a mason from a night 1 check.
I feel like design-wise, the informed goon and a rolecop accomplish the same thing. sure they work in tandem but I feel like they are both a solution to the same problem just at different power levels. it's like training wheels on a tricycle. would they both be shoehorned into the same 3-person team? I doubt it, but if anyone knows of site meta precedence or anything feel free to prove me wrong.

I have a couple theories. my first is a little egocentric, but basically in 2170 as town loyal jailkeeper I overthought things, was way too paranoid in my play (I fervently pushed for the elim of a claimed d4 ic on d3 who turned out not to be bullshitting and then still didn't protect him n4, among other things) and my night action choices, and ended up with 1) a false inno on a traitor and 2) a false guilty on town-Shea due to wagonomics not taking the possibility of a traitor into account. yea that game was a mess. anyway I wonder if scum did their research and actually thinks I'm more of a liability than an asset to town at this point lmao.

my psych is useless now, but obviously having a doc alive is not ideal for scum...unless they have a strongman or roleblocker. roleblocker honestly feels a little heavy if it hits me on one of the first nights when my psych has a chance at working, and with masons and idk something else probably? idk, I feel better about there being a strongman. if that's the case, I wonder if they have the strongman performing all kills now that my psych is burnt out (keep in mind too they know if there is another tracking-type role they need to worry about or not) and are going to keep me alive for another night for the double-whammy "why is bulge still alive?" + "why did you let X die?" push. leashing my protection would obviously be playing right into this frame, which is why besides all the other reasons you all know it's terrible, I especially hate Creature's earlier suggestion of directing my action.
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Post Post #2221 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 6:01 pm

Post by The Bulge »

we're solving this game today people, we're in a fantastic position for it. keep an eye out for thread momentum crashers. I need to read read read this weekend but I'm gonna try to be here as often as I can promoting workflow but at this pace apathy will be our undoing almost certainly
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Post Post #2222 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 7:48 pm

Post by Augustus Caesar »

In post 2220, The Bulge wrote:for the double-whammy "why is bulge still alive?" + "why did you let X die?" push. leashing my protection would obviously be playing right into this frame, which is why besides all the other reasons you all know it's terrible, I especially hate Creature's earlier suggestion of directing my action.
What do you mean by this? If we leashed you onto a target, why would you be "letting" someone die? Oh wait, you mean if you were roleblocked and the person you were supposed to protect dies anyway. Right. I don't know if Creature would be so obvious about it and be the first to propose it if that was the plan though.

Good point about it being a little unlikely there's an Informed Mafia that knows the setup + a rolecop - seems a little too overlappy.
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Post Post #2223 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 8:11 pm

Post by Augustus Caesar »

Deas, how do you read Ydrasse now?
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Post Post #2224 (ISO) » Wed Feb 17, 2021 8:14 pm

Post by Augustus Caesar »

Spoiler: WIP ordered reads
Ydrasse -


POSTIVES:

I'm extremely confident Ydrasse is town for tone and emotion.
Firstly, for her end of day 1 reaction to being counterwagoned to scum.
Secondly, for her emotional reaction to Datisi pushing her. More in .


Puff -


POSITIVES:

Initially, I thought her town since her entrance was very LHFey, and I'd expect some level of coaching from teammates.
This was a towny post in perspective that I see unlikely as coming from scum!Puff.
Overall, her play is antagonistic and draws a lot of attention, I think it unlikely she's the type of player who comes out swinging like this for Team Mafia.
Akarin and Puff had talked about the game in a previous day, and Puff had not presented these reads to us previously. She only felt the need to share them when she thought she was going to be mislaunched, and didn't want Akarin's thoughts to go to waste. I find it unlikely Akarin prepared notes for Puff to share to look towny at a later date, and I think the recounting of the discord conversation felt real.

The Bulge -


POSITIVES:

The crumbs for his claim, and his suspicion on peta for the psyched post.
The Bulge's play since then has just looked a lot more towny, the arguments make sense.
His annoyance at me for outing him in posts like this, and others.
His highly emotional entrance start of today.

NEGATIVES:

I have one major hangup with The Bulge, and it's him expressing fear of being nightkilled. I think it's more likely he makes that post as scum, since it has the benefits of making him look like a PR and he doesn't have the concern of not being nightkilled. Being a PR however, it's somewhat careless and I'd expect more caution.


Xofelf -


POSITIVES:

Initially thought their posting felt organic and natural, I think they believe what they're digging at.
I think it's very unlikely xofelf interacts with RCE in the way a scum partner would, and similarly the way RCE interacted with xofelf.
I like the way they scumread Ydrasse based on what she knows from playing LSGs. They're taking their skillset from playing social games like survivor, and trying to apply that to Ydrasse to solve her. I like it.

NEGATIVES:

I don't like the way they responded to me about my towncase on Ydrasse here, and here. It felt stubborn yet sympathetic and the contrast felt off. As if they wanted to disagree with me since Ydrasse is a possible mislaunch, but didn't want to step on my toes too much.


DeasVail -


POSITIVES:

Deas said he thought I was even more town after I pushed him, but never expanded on why. He only brought up why today, and the reasoning is solid and looks towny. The reason why I think this is so town-indicative, is that Deas had a good reason to think I was town but didn't feel the need to explain it to make himself look towny yesterday while he was nearly murdered several times, he only brought it up when someone suggested I might be a deepwolf the next day. Shows there's an underlying thought process there and one he didn't care to use to "look" town earlier.
If scum!Deas thinks Datisi is a mason or some other PR that he plans to kill in the night, I don't think he pushes him to the extent he does yesterday.
and bleed town to me. His concerns feel really real and I love the paranoia about him thinking he might be wrong about Ari, but still not wanting to counterwagon him.

NEGATIVES:

This feels oddly blunt for Deas, and I wonder if the difference is due to talking to a scum buddy and wanting to appear strong/unaligned.
My initial case on him. Didn't like how he didn't argue more for keeping RCE around for a night.
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