TM2021 | Anime Destroys Untrod Tripod | Endgame

[NorwegianboyEE]

I don’t know what’s up with FL here but I definitely think Ram is town and Pine’s plan is protown. I’m not sure if I should vote for Norwee or Shea yet but I have some paranoia that Norwee might actually know his alignment, since he seems to be beyond convinced that She’s flipping town.

FL suddenly wavering on his hard town Pine read, why?

I’m really paranoid that it might actually be FL/Norwee and prior to that I was going to post that it was likely a Norwee/Shea team but now I’m wondering if Math was actually right?

Do you think both scum are in the vanilla claims, or if it's 1 in vanilla and 1 in PR, or if it's both in PR claims?

[NorwegianboyEE]

I don't see what the scum case on TSQ is beyond PoE either.
Like it's so obvious to me that the only reason he's being pushed is because scum fake claimed and is now trying to control the gamestate by claiming they are uneliminable because of their claim and now we apparently have to eliminate town because he's so obvscum, of course Ramcius is still very possible scum. But Pine completely ignores that slot and claims we're not eliminating there for some unfathomable reason.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Pine has 0 plan for someone flipping town today. It is identical to flipping 2 people.
That is not a mechanical plan and it's wrong to phrase it as one.
We will support any plan that allows for a town victory in the case of a Pine/Ram scumteam. Does the plan account for that?

[Nancy Drew 39]

I don’t know what’s up with FL here but I definitely think Ram is town and Pine’s plan is protown. I’m not sure if I should vote for Norwee or Shea yet but I have some paranoia that Norwee might actually know his alignment, since he seems to be beyond convinced that She’s flipping town.

FL suddenly wavering on his hard town Pine read, why?

I’m really paranoid that it might actually be FL/Norwee and prior to that I was going to post that it was likely a Norwee/Shea team but now I’m wondering if Math was actually right?

Do you think both scum are in the vanilla claims, or if it's 1 in vanilla and 1 in PR, or if it's both in PR claims?

I think that DEB strongman doesn’t make sense with just molla’s role, so at least on in vts and I really don’t understand the Ram sr. I think he’s really obvious town. I mean it’s possible that this setup doesn’t make a whole lot of sense mech wise but I don’t think Penguin creates just a ridiculous setup.

See Pine jking either you or Shea would clear whomever but I don’t believe scum!Ram says green flip on you/Shea clears the other. Scum doesn’t want clears. That’s a transparently townie thought.

[NorwegianboyEE]

See Pine jking either you or Shea would clear whomever but I don’t believe scum!Ram says green flip on you/Shea clears the other. Scum doesn’t want clears. That’s a transparently townie thought.

Pine JKing only clears in the event of a scumflip today, which won't happen if we follow scum!Pine off a cliff.

[Thestatusquo]

I dont think its fair to say pine completely ignored ramcius. I just find his reason for finding him town really uncompelling and hand wavey.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Do you think this 7 town PRs vs 3 scum, 1 of whom is a 1-shot strongman?
The previous game was 6 town PRs vs 3 scum PRs.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Pine has 0 plan for someone flipping town today. It is identical to flipping 2 people.
That is not a mechanical plan and it's wrong to phrase it as one.
We will support any plan that allows for a town victory in the case of a Pine/Ram scumteam. Does the plan account for that?

If Pine claims to jk you/Shea and a kill happens, then he has no choice but to clear whichever one of you he claims to jk because if a kill still happens during the jk, then he’s a liar basically. And if no kill happens then all 3 confitown slots survive the NK, so how isn’t that protown?

[Thestatusquo]

I don’t know what’s up with FL here but I definitely think Ram is town and Pine’s plan is protown. I’m not sure if I should vote for Norwee or Shea yet but I have some paranoia that Norwee might actually know his alignment, since he seems to be beyond convinced that She’s flipping town.

FL suddenly wavering on his hard town Pine read, why?

I’m really paranoid that it might actually be FL/Norwee and prior to that I was going to post that it was likely a Norwee/Shea team but now I’m wondering if Math was actually right?

Do you think both scum are in the vanilla claims, or if it's 1 in vanilla and 1 in PR, or if it's both in PR claims?

I think that DEB strongman doesn’t make sense with just molla’s role, so at least on in vts and I really don’t understand the Ram sr. I think he’s really obvious town. I mean it’s possible that this setup doesn’t make a whole lot of sense mech wise but I don’t think Penguin creates just a ridiculous setup.

See Pine jking either you or Shea would clear whomever but I don’t believe scum!Ram says green flip on you/Shea clears the other. Scum doesn’t want clears. That’s a transparently townie thought.

Ok but I made a very similar post day 2 that you said was town so if you think its either me or ram that point is a wash.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I dont think its fair to say pine completely ignored ramcius. I just find his reason for finding him town really uncompelling and hand wavey.

Yeah that's what i meant. But if you want to be theatrical you might as well just say he has ignored the slot. Or at the very least, appeared very unconcerned with it.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Pine has 0 plan for someone flipping town today. It is identical to flipping 2 people.
That is not a mechanical plan and it's wrong to phrase it as one.
We will support any plan that allows for a town victory in the case of a Pine/Ram scumteam. Does the plan account for that?

If Pine claims to jk you/Shea and a kill happens, then he has no choice but to clear whichever one of you he claims to jk because if a kill still happens during the jk, then he’s a liar basically. And if no kill happens then all 3 confitown slots survive the NK, so how isn’t that protown?

If a townflip happens today then he won't need or even theoretically be able to clear anyone that night, and scum!Pine would know this and can thus make all the promises he wants as long as it secures the miselimination on TSQ which he would be gunning for in this scum!Pine world.

[Thestatusquo]

If there's a town flip a JK isn't even a clear even if we believe pine.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Do you think this 7 town PRs vs 3 scum, 1 of whom is a 1-shot strongman?
The previous game was 6 town PRs vs 3 scum PRs.

There are 6 - in both flips/claims: Zor/molla/Akarin/Misty/Pine/FL vs 1 scum PR/DEB that we know of.

[NorwegianboyEE]

You're still pretty much assuming the plan will go in this order.

TSQ flips scum ->
Pine JK's a slot and catches final scum or clears them as town.

But what i am saying is that the entire premise is flawed from the get go, because if TSQ flips town then he can't clear anyone. So unless you are absolutely sure TSQ flips scum this plan is completely folly and it also makes complete sense for scum!Pine to argue for this plan sunce he would know TSQ is flipping town.

[NorwegianboyEE]

If all the PR claims are true and town-aligned, then town has:
A tracker/watcher/voyeur joat
2 Doctor/Follower/Commuter joats
A 1 shot neighbouriser
A 1 shot novice vig
A venge
A full, ungated jailkeeper
It's likely that one of the claims is false.
And that's independent of the ungated jailkeeper being something that doesn't mesh with the setup.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Do you think this 7 town PRs vs 3 scum, 1 of whom is a 1-shot strongman?
The previous game was 6 town PRs vs 3 scum PRs.

There are 6 - in both flips/claims: Zor/molla/Akarin/Misty/Pine/FL vs 1 scum PR/DEB that we know of.

You forgot TGP 1-shot neighborizer. There are 7.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I don’t know what’s up with FL here but I definitely think Ram is town and Pine’s plan is protown. I’m not sure if I should vote for Norwee or Shea yet but I have some paranoia that Norwee might actually know his alignment, since he seems to be beyond convinced that She’s flipping town.

FL suddenly wavering on his hard town Pine read, why?

I’m really paranoid that it might actually be FL/Norwee and prior to that I was going to post that it was likely a Norwee/Shea team but now I’m wondering if Math was actually right?

Do you think both scum are in the vanilla claims, or if it's 1 in vanilla and 1 in PR, or if it's both in PR claims?

I think that DEB strongman doesn’t make sense with just molla’s role, so at least on in vts and I really don’t understand the Ram sr. I think he’s really obvious town. I mean it’s possible that this setup doesn’t make a whole lot of sense mech wise but I don’t think Penguin creates just a ridiculous setup.

See Pine jking either you or Shea would clear whomever but I don’t believe scum!Ram says green flip on you/Shea clears the other. Scum doesn’t want clears. That’s a transparently townie thought.

Ok but I made a very similar post day 2 that you said was town so if you think its either me or ram that point is a wash.

You need to link or quote that post because I can’t remember.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Do you think this 7 town PRs vs 3 scum, 1 of whom is a 1-shot strongman?
The previous game was 6 town PRs vs 3 scum PRs.

There are 6 - in both flips/claims: Zor/molla/Akarin/Misty/Pine/FL vs 1 scum PR/DEB that we know of.

You forgot TGP 1-shot neighborizer. There are 7.

Oh right, well it might mean then that one of FL/Pine could be lying.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Do you think this 7 town PRs vs 3 scum, 1 of whom is a 1-shot strongman?
The previous game was 6 town PRs vs 3 scum PRs.

There are 6 - in both flips/claims: Zor/molla/Akarin/Misty/Pine/FL vs 1 scum PR/DEB that we know of.

You forgot TGP 1-shot neighborizer. There are 7.

Oh right, well it might mean then that one of FL/Pine could be lying.

Yeah that's what we've been saying, and we believe it is likely Pine's claim that is the fake one.

[Nancy Drew 39]

If all the PR claims are true and town-aligned, then town has:
A tracker/watcher/voyeur joat
2 Doctor/Follower/Commuter joats
A 1 shot neighbouriser
A 1 shot novice vig
A venge
A full, ungated jailkeeper
It's likely that one of the claims is false.
And that's independent of the ungated jailkeeper being something that doesn't mesh with the setup.

Based on this, Pine’s claim is more believable than FL’s being identical to molla’s.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Do you think this 7 town PRs vs 3 scum, 1 of whom is a 1-shot strongman?
The previous game was 6 town PRs vs 3 scum PRs.

There are 6 - in both flips/claims: Zor/molla/Akarin/Misty/Pine/FL vs 1 scum PR/DEB that we know of.

You forgot TGP 1-shot neighborizer. There are 7.

Oh right, well it might mean then that one of FL/Pine could be lying.

Yeah that's what we've been saying, and we believe it is likely Pine's claim that is the fake one.

The obvious wrinkle is that the venge is neutral/negative so maybe that balances it out?

[NorwegianboyEE]

If all the PR claims are true and town-aligned, then town has:
A tracker/watcher/voyeur joat
2 Doctor/Follower/Commuter joats
A 1 shot neighbouriser
A 1 shot novice vig
A venge
A full, ungated jailkeeper
It's likely that one of the claims is false.
And that's independent of the ungated jailkeeper being something that doesn't mesh with the setup.

Based on this, Pine’s claim is more believable than FL’s being identical to molla’s.

JJ wants me to tell you that 2 identical roles is well within the expected mod wifom from this game. And they've concluded FL is more likely the town claim than Pine.

[Nancy Drew 39]

You're still pretty much assuming the plan will go in this order.

TSQ flips scum ->
Pine JK's a slot and catches final scum or clears them as town.

But what i am saying is that the entire premise is flawed from the get go, because if TSQ flips town then he can't clear anyone. So unless you are absolutely sure TSQ flips scum this plan is completely folly and it also makes complete sense for scum!Pine to argue for this plan sunce he would know TSQ is flipping town.

But Ram is saying that either of you flipping town clears the other one right? So why does scum!Ram say this?

[NorwegianboyEE]

He expects that PenguinPower would design the setup with something that would punish us for assuming the setup was the exact same as last time. However, it would not be so far away from the previous setup as to include an entirely ungated role.

[Nancy Drew 39]

If all the PR claims are true and town-aligned, then town has:
A tracker/watcher/voyeur joat
2 Doctor/Follower/Commuter joats
A 1 shot neighbouriser
A 1 shot novice vig
A venge
A full, ungated jailkeeper
It's likely that one of the claims is false.
And that's independent of the ungated jailkeeper being something that doesn't mesh with the setup.

Based on this, Pine’s claim is more believable than FL’s being identical to molla’s.

JJ wants me to tell you that 2 identical roles is well within the expected mod wifom from this game. And they've concluded FL is more likely the town claim than Pine.

Can he elaborate on why that is?