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Post Post #24 (isolation #0) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:17 am

Post by Raya36 »

VOTE: bear hugs
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Post Post #27 (isolation #1) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:55 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 25, T3 wrote:VOTE: romance
It can only end in divorce or death.
Well that got dark quick
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Post Post #39 (isolation #2) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 10:23 am

Post by Raya36 »

Welcome Enchant
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Post Post #50 (isolation #3) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:04 pm

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Hi Titus. I feel you're town
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Post Post #51 (isolation #4) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:04 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Can rvs be over now?
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Post Post #55 (isolation #5) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:07 pm

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Would naming someone random really hurt scum!Unwnd in the long run?
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Post Post #59 (isolation #6) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:24 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 56, samantha97 wrote:no but we're in a theme large

never know if they're about to dayvig lol
Hm very true, although usually you have to explicitly say Dayvig:
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Post Post #81 (isolation #7) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:43 pm

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Why are you voting for no elim VFP?
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Post Post #83 (isolation #8) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:45 pm

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Wouldn't it be more fun to vote someone?
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Post Post #85 (isolation #9) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:47 pm

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Hm well I'm voting bear hugs but they aren't even around to make that fun
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Post Post #86 (isolation #10) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:48 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Let's vote sam. Sam is around and I'm not so sure their take on enchant is genuine

VOTE: sam
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Post Post #89 (isolation #11) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:50 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Because town should generally be genuine. It's scum who want to fake a scumread
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Post Post #91 (isolation #12) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:54 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Do you agree willow?
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Post Post #99 (isolation #13) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:03 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 96, Bear HUGS wrote:cool. anyways {raya, Samantha} has one scum, one town. 75% certain.
And one of us has a case against the other sooooo
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Post Post #103 (isolation #14) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:07 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 102, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 99, Raya36 wrote:
In post 96, Bear HUGS wrote:cool. anyways {raya, Samantha} has one scum, one town. 75% certain.
And one of us has a case against the other sooooo
eh I don't care plus I happen to think ur the scum in the set, not sam, anyways.
Oh, well that's sad
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Post Post #104 (isolation #15) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:07 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Who of the hydra are you btw?
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Post Post #108 (isolation #16) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:17 pm

Post by Raya36 »

hm believable
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Post Post #111 (isolation #17) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:21 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Funny thing is this could fully be Pooky
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Post Post #113 (isolation #18) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:22 pm

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So "Pooky", why do you think I'm the scum between Sam and me?
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Post Post #117 (isolation #19) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:26 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 114, Romance wrote:
In post 36, willow1 wrote:wait they have a post

i'm leaving it anyway idgaf
+Town.

Attitude in general is town already, but I like how they pointed out their own fault and went with it regardless. Feel like they'd be more self-conscious about this sort of thing were they scum.
I like this take, let's keep romance
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Post Post #128 (isolation #20) » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:42 pm

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In post 127, Romance wrote:You haven't done anything yet that drives me to post about you.
She called me fake :cry:
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Post Post #331 (isolation #21) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:00 am

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In post 157, Bear HUGS wrote:Both strike me as extremely fake in games even when town. Im not sure why to be honest. But something about their tone just gives me alarm bells all over the place. So I'm really not sure if my problem with their interactions is just the vibes they naturally give off or if it is AI in this situation.
Wow, so not only was I fake, but now I'm just naturally fake. Kinda hurt
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Post Post #332 (isolation #22) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:01 am

Post by Raya36 »

The turnaround on me and sam including scum to both town was towny of bear hugs
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Post Post #333 (isolation #23) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:06 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 206, samantha97 wrote: I don't agree with raya that you have to be genuine with who you think is mafia though, since it's productive to not be a lot of times
I only said town are generally genuine. Town lie for good reason sometimes. But usually they should be honest and truthful
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Post Post #334 (isolation #24) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:09 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 221, VFP wrote:
In post 145, Romance wrote:It's generally bad manners to out someone's alt, so.
This entire back and fourth about an alt is just weird.
Doesn't look good for the bears imo who seem to be alt fishing.
Is alt fishing scummy or just bad?
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Post Post #335 (isolation #25) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:11 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 229, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 24, Raya36 wrote:VOTE: bear hugs
Do you usually make naked votes?
idk probably 50/50 for rvs votes
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Post Post #336 (isolation #26) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:14 am

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In post 240, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 89, Raya36 wrote:Because town should generally be genuine. It's scum who want to fake a scumread
Is that a scumtell for her? If she makes scummy posts like in Nancy v. Titus, I’ll catcher right away, probably.
Not sure without looking through scum games for meta but regardless I don't think their push was genuine
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Post Post #337 (isolation #27) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:15 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 244, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 113, Raya36 wrote:So "Pooky", why do you think I'm the scum between Sam and me?
That was Noraa obviously. :lol:
Well when "Pooky" gets back you should remind them to tell me why they were thinking this :)
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Post Post #338 (isolation #28) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:17 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 248, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 155, Bamboozle wrote:
In post 94, samantha97 wrote:
In post 89, Raya36 wrote:Because town should generally be genuine. It's scum who want to fake a scumread
this is a good take
Are you saying
Raya's
towny for this?

-Bam
Yeah agree, that post from Raya is kind’ve pointless.
Hold up, before you call my post pointless, sam asked me a question and that was my response. I didn't just decide to state random mafia theory
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Post Post #339 (isolation #29) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:18 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 263, VFP wrote:
In post 258, Bear HUGS wrote:Don’t look good in what way exactly? I don’t agree with alt fishing but you shading us for that is kind’ve gross dude.
Originally I thought it was just alt fishing to look busy while doing noting of worth.
Or maybe worse, a kind of intimidation tactic but the explanation summed it up for me and I changed my mind.
I'm not sure this would fall under 'gross dude', but go for it.
No, I agree with bear here. It's bad practice for sure, but scummy..?
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Post Post #340 (isolation #30) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:33 am

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In post 292, Bamboozle wrote:
In post 1, MariaR wrote:This game also has a post cap of 200 posts per player per phase (lifted final day) posting over the cap will result in punishment
Guys keep this in mind when you post.
Oops. Well prepare for wall posts from now on and not my usual series of mini posts.
In post 308, Enchant wrote:You just destroyed me with facts and logic. I submit to you, anime.

VOTE: dunnstral
Fell into that trap too easy. Of course Dunn could be scum but if you don't actually think he is why let sam make you vote?
In post 314, Flea The Magician wrote:
In post 84, VFP wrote:
In post 83, Raya36 wrote:Wouldn't it be more fun to vote someone?
Probably. Who do you suggest?
Never sheep a wolf. You just feed them :P
Shhhh you're spilling my secrets
In post 314, Flea The Magician wrote:Raya's Radar Angle Fell
:neutral:

Flea feels kinda town to me but for dumb reasons + gut
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Post Post #345 (isolation #31) » Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:13 pm

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What do you mean by sam is mafia looking for you?
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Post Post #356 (isolation #32) » Mon Apr 19, 2021 1:09 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 349, Enchant wrote:
In post 345, Raya36 wrote:What do you mean by sam is mafia looking for you?
I explained already and can't explain further without breaking rules. Asking obvious question (fine "WONDERING") from townie perspective i see odd.
You think sam is looking for mafia you mean?
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Post Post #456 (isolation #33) » Mon Apr 19, 2021 3:40 pm

Post by Raya36 »

I'm agreeing with Titus. I skimmed the 1v1 and I'm leaning towards TvT
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Post Post #616 (isolation #34) » Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:35 am

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In post 508, jjh927 wrote:Raya's approach to sam just looked really strange, and I feel conflicted on Retti because I've liked the posts but they don't quite radiate town
Did I personally look strange or do you not agree with what I was pushing?
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Post Post #628 (isolation #35) » Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:47 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 535, WhemeStar wrote:Jesus bamboozle is such obv scum why haven’t we voted here earlier

VOTE: bamboozle

Looks like scum trying to act townie to me
I'm not seeing this

Well that bell wagon grew fast. Not really sure what to make of that. I'm not super familiar with bell's meta but their latest post doesn't appear scummy, and besides not doing much they seem fine.
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Post Post #658 (isolation #36) » Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:58 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 653, Retti wrote:Also, that last post by Bell was a straight up scumclaim, yeah? Would people be okay with just voting him out here and now?
Not a fan of this. Replacements are nai, they gave reads, the logical thing to do is wait for the replacement who we can read
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Post Post #660 (isolation #37) » Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:04 pm

Post by Raya36 »

I don't even see what was so bad with bell's stuff anyway. They just seemed inactive is all
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Post Post #662 (isolation #38) » Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:08 pm

Post by Raya36 »

usually are*
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Post Post #685 (isolation #39) » Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:01 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 665, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 660, Raya36 wrote:I don't even see what was so bad with bell's stuff anyway. They just seemed inactive is all

did you take a look at the bell games I linked?

there is a clear difference between Bell!Town and Bell!Scum.

Bell!Town has no trouble getting into the flow of the game and putting out content/pushing the action.

Bell!Scum has great difficulty getting into the game, he struggles playing the red!alignment.

Regardless of RL - the fact that he couldn't get into his town!persona at all heavily hints that his alignment this game is scum.

His replace-out post is practically a scum claim, just randomly tossing out townreads/random thoughts at people.


I don't doubt that he had RL problems that caused him to hit the replace-out button - but think about
why
he finds it difficult to get into the game/putting down meaningful reads.

Town!Bell participates very easily - the game just flows. Scum!Bell absolutely struggles to replicate that Town!Bell mentality - he finds the game much harder and that is why he's struggling to get into the game.
I'll take a look tonight. I forgot you posted those
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Post Post #754 (isolation #40) » Wed Apr 21, 2021 12:24 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 703, Bamboozle wrote: I don't like Raya dismissing the Bell case like that at all. Raya more likely scum regardless of Bell's alignment imo, but it's probably worse for her if he flips town. We should absolutely be flipping Bell today btw.
Didn't mean to be dismissive, I just didn't understand. I'll take a look at the meta soon but the wagon and scumreads on bell don't really sit right with me
In post 731, samantha97 wrote:
In post 729, WhemeStar wrote:I was supposed to get townreads from this but the opposite happened bam lied which makes bam scum because only scum lie
Spoiler:
Image

I put off reading raya's other games but in general I'm suspicious when people get lazy and park their vote on me. I'm like a mafia honeypot
I do genuinely think you're scum. I really don't see why Unwnd's choice would be AI. A lot you did around the start was fluff in disguise. I mean bringing up the flavorclaim rule when we obviously can't advance that discussion much farther, asking me about basically just mafia theory and then saying it was a good take, questioning the lack of a bold line in a quote. Telling people to vote dunnstral was the most you did. You said you understand why the recent argument was TvT yet you're suspicious of everyone who said it was, which is shade.

Also something I just noticed. You have enchant in your townblock despite saying you genuinely think they're scum for unwnd's choice. What is the progression on this?

Wow, it's been a while since I've been wagoned D1. I'll take a look at VFP's cases in a sec. Also for everyone saying I've been parking my vote, it's because I do think sam flips scum and I'm lacking in other scum reads at the moment. Nothing sam has done has changed my mind, and has actually supported my read, so I'm happy with my vote there.
In post 747, Bear HUGS wrote: If Raya gets yeeted and flips town, I will be pissed.
Well, I can appreciate this at least
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Post Post #756 (isolation #41) » Wed Apr 21, 2021 12:33 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Was there anything in particular that made enchant stand out as townblock-able?

I think what must have happened is when you said you scumread the slot Enchant had just replaced in and I was still thinking unwnd, so I didn't make the connection when I read it the first time.
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Post Post #758 (isolation #42) » Wed Apr 21, 2021 12:36 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Care to show me?

Is there a reason you're being purposefully evasive?
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Post Post #762 (isolation #43) » Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:55 pm

Post by Raya36 »

This is the choice
In post 5, Dunnstral wrote:Name a name unwnd
In post 6, unwnd wrote:I name myself

What do I win
In post 52, samantha97 wrote: I think enchant is genuinely likely to be mafia because of unwnd's choice

I didn't even consider them picking their own name, I was thinking if I was mafia I would say dunnstral as my answer to avoid it
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Post Post #765 (isolation #44) » Wed Apr 21, 2021 3:35 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Can you link/quote where T3?
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Post Post #776 (isolation #45) » Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:08 am

Post by Raya36 »

I'm back to do the things I promised I'd do.

Bell meta:
Looking at town bell, post count is massive and they start off strong as a heavy poster. Scum bell the posting is generally a bit lower and they still post decently heavy at the beginning but it seems to be less full of content.

This bell:
Very low post count and hasn't really done much content wise. The reason I'm still hesitant to say this is scum bell is because in their scum meta they still post a lot as scum early, it's just lacking content. I want to say bell was just honestly too busy and that's what prevented them from being able to post much. It is possible though that they were struggling to get into the game though as their scum meta shows, especially since I'm even struggling a lot to get into this game and that's not usual for me.
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Post Post #784 (isolation #46) » Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:41 am

Post by Raya36 »

VFP's Cases:
In post 738, VFP wrote:I'm going to take tonight off from MS too but I'm off work for 2 weeks after tomorrow so
@Maria
V/LA until tomorrow evening / night

I want to post about suspicious or scum reads tonight then I'll continue other reads when I'm back.

Town: Retti / Flea
Town lean: Bamboozle / Titus / Wheme

Spoiler: Samantha: Scum
is where Samantha votes for Dunn. Before this Samantha hasn't done anything but post filler. It just reads as haveing to do something in the game and Dunn looked like an easier target. No reason or backing but stays vocal on voting Dunn with / . Still no reason or backing. The first attempt at showing reason is where they respond to me asking for a case. The case is because Dunn has only responded to a vote them them which happens after all previous posts requesting a Dunn vote. This shows that Samantha was voting where easy and used a reason that occured later to justify the vote. If the vote is due to inactivity, then why is this not being push, or targeted to others? / are just echoing noise to sound like they are doing something.
Samantha is reacting to being called out for pushing based on activity, where they are backing off and showing doubt. It's odd to have doubt here from the person you are pushing for votes on to only question your reason.
is Samantha basically joining what looks like a safe wagon. Calls me scum earlier but doesn't act on it. Unless Dunn added so much doubt with to Samantha's 'confident' read, this is just playing to aim for easy lims.
is just staying on the fence while the debate is getting split on TvT and SvT. Considering I'm supposed to be scum for Samantha and they are voting me here, this doesn't seem like a geniune scum read with a comment like this.
Another safe vote, this time on Bell. Responds to Esooa and basically drops a naked vote just after / / to go un noticed again.
The opinions on Bell replacing are split, Samantha looks to be doing another safe vote. PP has 7 posts at this point and if it was an issue with activity / lurking or anything of this agenda then there are other players as well which Samantha is just ignoring. Also, what use is there to just place a naked vote down on someone that you are trying to be active or gain something from? It's just looking busy.
was just wierd. I don't know what to make of this but it doesn't make sense that the "name a player" had anything to do with thir, or any affect.


Spoiler: Esooa suspicious / Scum lean
So Essoa coming in and posting comes accross as town. However, is really strange considering I have 1 game with Esooa. If you didn't read the game, I was town and Esooa was scum. There's a bit of knowledge I want to add concering this game though from a live mindset.
I was the easy mis lim bait by later game, and in the game it felt early on that I wasn't overly being pushed as scum until the game went on and scum were being pushed. I ended up town reading Esooa due to a particular flip of scum which Esooa obviously didn't object to. I didn't want to go into a meta read from a previous game because I feel this game in particular has no backing, but since Esooa is using this to want to shield me makes me think they are just trying to use me as a later mis lim if a scum buddy is in trouble. The reason I think this and show doubt is because the game was odd with having 6 or 7 players not post day 1. I could understand if Esooa said that I'm probably town (as I did have a back and fourth with 2 players in that game) but there's no grounds to say that I do this as only town and that my scum game is differnet. But Esooa is wanting to protect me as town? There is no chance of being
THAT
sure that someone is town because 1 game they were argueing or being snarky. It suggests as I said, wanting to try and have me as a lim later or knowing that I'm town and trying to gain town cred for doing so. The back and fourth from Esooa and Retti where Esooa is trying to dodge the question, to just link the 1 game and say it's meta just looked like Esooa trying to avoid giving the reason, otherwise why wasn't this done before but instead implied it to look at games ehre rather than MU (Because why would anyone here randomly look at my games on MU?)
is more or less letting just assume the games on MS and hope for Retti to back down there.
Also, in that 1 game me and Esooa did, they tried to write someone off as town due to meta early that looked to be an easy mis lim late game (This is who I focused on the last day).
The rest of Esooa I town read, but the above is just enough for me to favour scum over town (considering I ended up town reading Esooa last game too anyway).


Spoiler: jjh susupicious
shows no concern of the game, which could be because there's no pressure on them. / / / / are posts just saying what people want to hear.
is jjh's first solid take for me, and is in favour of a town to scum post here. I like the Raya / Smantha scum leans as I don't favour either of these, the Retti being added just gives opportnity for a back lash.
The rest of the ISO seems like filler. I'm not so much as scum on this slot, but I don't favour them as scum over town if I had to pick.


Spoiler: Raya suspicious / Scum lean
This is the first post from Raya that strikes as odd and is response to . Raya posts about Samantha being geniuene and then proceeds to play off a scum read in Samantha. This was a vote on the spot in response to my which I didn't originally take seriously. Raya doesn't give anything off to suggest that this is a legit scum read, and even shows that the reason for the vote is also something that town can do makes it seem less believable. So to question why they are the scum from the 2 in is odd and seems to have other motive / worry around it.
follow up concerning the above just suggests that these can be scum together or that Raya is actually scum with Samantha town. It just seems to be a high point for Raya to focus on here.
Raya is just playing by the 1 post of Samantha to slide on by, not pushing this or trying to push anything else Samantha has done. Plausible SvS but I'd favour TvS here with Samantha being the scum.


I want to go over Willow again once back. Part of me just thinks it's egos clashing after a re read although I don't think I represented my concern well which without filling the game with more back and fourth like that I just want to explain my mindset with it and where I'm at with Willow.

We are definitely in agreement with sam. I actually didn't catch that the dunn reasoning came after the vote so that's another point to add to my case too. Absolutely agree with the TvT comment not sounding genuine. It just sounds like shade to me. And as you pointed out they're supposed to be scumreading you so why can they see it as TvT? Interesting how me and VFP scumread the same player but both finding a lot of different points for the case. I really think we found scum.

That's an interesting theory on esooa. Not enough for a scumread from me but I also don't know that game and their meta like vfp does.

I'm kind of null on jj. I feel like we're a bit in the same boat. I'm only really starting to get more into the game thanks to the pressure forcing me to.


Case against me:
This might be a typo but in 86 I said sam was disingenuous, not genuine. Your 84 may not have been serious but it did get me thinking about who I'd want to vote at that point of the game. So my answer was serious. I did explain why I was voting there so I thought that showed my scumread was legit. I guess I could've been more clear on that though.

The point about 333 is fair but when looking to see if the motivation is town or scum you need to see what was done with it. Sam now townreads enchant but hasn't given any reasoning for it and won't answer me, so it's hard to use that to look for the motivation. If there was a town motivation to be disingenuous there would most likely be some sort of follow up to it and some sort of read-related gain. Looking at the rest of their iso though, they're still quite scummy in other ways which is why I stand by them being disingenuous in that post.

I questioned bear hugs in 113 for a few reasons. To see if I'm wrong about sam (I still don't think I am), to get a better read on bear hugs from seeing their explanation, to not eventually get sucked into bear hugs scumreads me and townreads my scumread so they must be scum and acting in bad faith.

I can see how 332 could look bad for me and there isn't much I can say on it except that it's an honest read on bear hugs play.

I explained the rest of my read on sam a couple posts of mine ago, although that would be after you posted this so you wouldn't have seen it yet
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Post Post #797 (isolation #47) » Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:17 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 792, Bear HUGS wrote:Town!Bell doesn’t have a problem posting actual content and he gets extremely annoyed when wrongly sr. Here he’s wooden and makes meaningless useless posts. Remember Creature used to have “transparent” as a title because his alignment was the easiest to determine out of probably anyone on MS? That’s obviously no longer true since he now has an impressive scum!meta. Well Bell is the new Creature. His alignment is transparent.
I'd be willing to move to bell and trust your case. I can see where you're coming from although their play this game doesn't really match either their town or scum meta. I obviously prefer sam but if it comes down to it I'll switch
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Post Post #799 (isolation #48) » Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:20 am

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In post 795, Bear HUGS wrote:I could do a metadive on her to test this but I’m not picking that up here. @Raya, I find it curious that you express doubt on us based on my Sam read. Why don’t you then test that theory by voting out flaming obvscum!Bell?
The doubt I mentioned is my bad habit of tunneling people who are wrong on me and townread my scumread. As I just said in my last post, if it comes to it, I'll switch over
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Post Post #801 (isolation #49) » Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:24 am

Post by Raya36 »

Ok whatever, I'll do it. But back to sam D2 if we go with bell today. At least with this flip I can decide if I should be trusting the bears or not

VOTE: bell
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Post Post #826 (isolation #50) » Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:53 am

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In post 822, Titus wrote:Anyone not seeing that this is staged Bell then Noraa flips is out of their minds imo.
Wait what do you mean by this?
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Post Post #829 (isolation #51) » Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:21 am

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In post 827, Titus wrote:
In post 826, Raya36 wrote:
In post 822, Titus wrote:Anyone not seeing that this is staged Bell then Noraa flips is out of their minds imo.
Wait what do you mean by this?
Flip Bell.
Bell flips town.
Flip Noraa.
Noraa flips wrong town.
Ok I see. You're probably right too. Bears is way too confident for pushing a miselim
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Post Post #915 (isolation #52) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:25 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 838, willow1 wrote:
In post 836, Retti wrote:
In post 828, willow1 wrote:i would dayvig titus if i could, not even remotely trying to use the wagons or vote patterns a divining tool other than this awkward defense of bell (bell should be null at best, but pooky/retti are right on meta. i thought he siteflaked but he's still in for defcon)

ik people had questions for me, will circle back in a sec
Really? I wouldn't expect her to go against the grain this much as scum, regardless of Bell's alignment, really
why would you expect this lol, whiteknighting hoping they get flipped anyway is scum 101 and titus has watched day 1 scumflips sink scumteams completely

i'm not saying there isn't town incentive to defend slots, to be clear, but confused as to why you expect the opposite. titus going with the flow in absence of a strong read or lack of appetite for her read is common. she has given some explanation on the bell read/pointing to lack of anchor that i don't really buy
This is sometimes something I do as scum for town-cred too. Going against the grain is not town indicative
In post 846, Bamboozle wrote:
In post 776, Raya36 wrote:I'm back to do the things I promised I'd do.

Bell meta:
Looking at town bell, post count is massive and they start off strong as a heavy poster. Scum bell the posting is generally a bit lower and they still post decently heavy at the beginning but it seems to be less full of content.

This bell:
Very low post count and hasn't really done much content wise. The reason I'm still hesitant to say this is scum bell is because in their scum meta they still post a lot as scum early, it's just lacking content. I want to say bell was just honestly too busy and that's what prevented them from being able to post much. It is possible though that they were struggling to get into the game though as their scum meta shows, especially since I'm even struggling a lot to get into this game and that's not usual for me.
While he was actually posting, he fit that scum mould of posting but no content though. I think he's probably busy irl either way and not lying about that, but I think as town he'd be much more likely to power through it because he a genuine interest for the game.

-Bam
Yeah, you might be right. I've pretty much decided that those who feel strongly about scum!Bell are more familiar with Bell and his meta so I'm willing to trust that now. Especially since there's a decent amount of people agreeing.
In post 858, willow1 wrote:let me be clear for bamboozle

i strongly doubt raya scum, or anyone, thinks she can get bear voted tomorrow lmao
Also to be clear on my part, I have no desire to eliminate bear as of now

Welcome Robert
In post 887, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 878, Robert M Hunter wrote:I'm town 2-shot seer.
Fake claim from another site.

This mod would not use the term "seer" to refer to a cop
I believe seer is used here as a cop that checks only wolves but I could be wrong
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Post Post #917 (isolation #53) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:38 am

Post by Raya36 »

Oh oops. I missed that request. Sorry Bam
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Post Post #927 (isolation #54) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 4:51 am

Post by Raya36 »

I'm interested to see what happens here. I don't think Robert has done anything scummy yet but everyone is still reading the bell part of the slot as scum
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Post Post #931 (isolation #55) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 4:56 am

Post by Raya36 »

Hm good point. I just took it as a joke since gladiator sounds like a joke without context, but it's entirely possible he checked the context to make his "joke".

Either way this is almost always the elim today or whatever based on the duel
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Post Post #935 (isolation #56) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:10 am

Post by Raya36 »

I think you might be on to something with that. And if it turns out you're right that suggests I'm wrong on sam so I'm particularly interested.
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Post Post #938 (isolation #57) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:15 am

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I've learned to read fast. T3, wagon hopping and following the majority, no reasoning behind votes, no conviction to scumreads, finding weak spots, colour code, read a second time, many warnings to give T3 a chance
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Post Post #939 (isolation #58) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:16 am

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In post 937, Bear HUGS wrote:I don't necessarily think that everyone that T3 starts SRing when they go under pressure is town. The thing is that there are too many of these people which makes me think T3 is scum because he doesn't seem to have any reads of his own which I would expect a townie to have reads of their own.
Yep, I agree. And they were doing a good job at staying under the radar while doing it because I don't think many of us noticed
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Post Post #959 (isolation #59) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:35 am

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In post 942, Bear HUGS wrote:From what I understood it was Wheme who wanted to push us for that reason, Raya wanted to push us for Sam. Either way, it’s beyond dumb but after Animals uPick, I am extremely surprised that Raya would even assume any of our reads have been in bad faith. Why would she auto jump to the conclusion that if we were wrong on Sam, it auto translates to a bad faith read on the slot as opposed to us just being wrong? So, it’s a worrisome conclusion on her part, no matter how you look at it.
Yeah, it was a bad take on my part that I didn't really think about
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Post Post #962 (isolation #60) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:38 am

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Hey Robert, wanna explain that claim of yours a bit?
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Post Post #981 (isolation #61) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:51 pm

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In post 980, Bear HUGS wrote:@Raya, I just did a metadive on you and don’t know what to make of your posts in this game. You are not flaming obvtown like you were in both Pokemon Battles and Animals uPick but I’ve played in a game with you where your towngame was very similar to your scumgames. What made you bleeding obvtown in both Battles and uPick, was your fire - Obvtown!you is full of fire. Where is it in this game? I want to have you correctly sorted, so if you’re town here, I will see it if I see that fire. So tell me, why should I tr you?
I'll do my best to pick it up a notch. My honest answer for where the fire is as you call it is that I'm so incredibly tired and I'm having a hard time getting into this game. If you look at my D1 meta I'm sure you'll find I sometimes do have a hard time D1s as town, and I'm sure you can find me saying that I know my D1 reads tend to suck. I like having flips with good interactions to work off of. Give me some time to get some reads that keep me interested and I'm sure I'll show my more usual towniness.
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Post Post #1005 (isolation #62) » Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:10 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Welcome Andante!

VOTE: RMH
In post 994, samantha97 wrote:thoughts on requiring andante to claim?
No?
In post 1001, Esooa wrote:why are there so many fuckin subs on this site
For what it's worth there seems to be more subs than usual lately so hopefully they will die down a bit soon :neutral:
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Post Post #1044 (isolation #63) » Sat Apr 24, 2021 1:29 am

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Self-hammers typically come from scum? Maybe we actually got one
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Post Post #1093 (isolation #64) » Sat Apr 24, 2021 1:11 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1062, Retti wrote:
In post 628, Raya36 wrote:
In post 535, WhemeStar wrote:Jesus bamboozle is such obv scum why haven’t we voted here earlier

VOTE: bamboozle

Looks like scum trying to act townie to me
I'm not seeing this

Well that bell wagon grew fast. Not really sure what to make of that. I'm not super familiar with bell's meta but their latest post doesn't appear scummy, and besides not doing much they seem fine.
In post 658, Raya36 wrote:
In post 653, Retti wrote:Also, that last post by Bell was a straight up scumclaim, yeah? Would people be okay with just voting him out here and now?
Not a fan of this. Replacements are nai, they gave reads, the logical thing to do is wait for the replacement who we can read
In post 660, Raya36 wrote:I don't even see what was so bad with bell's stuff anyway. They just seemed inactive is all
In post 797, Raya36 wrote:
In post 792, Bear HUGS wrote:Town!Bell doesn’t have a problem posting actual content and he gets extremely annoyed when wrongly sr. Here he’s wooden and makes meaningless useless posts. Remember Creature used to have “transparent” as a title because his alignment was the easiest to determine out of probably anyone on MS? That’s obviously no longer true since he now has an impressive scum!meta. Well Bell is the new Creature. His alignment is transparent.
I'd be willing to move to bell and trust your case. I can see where you're coming from although their play this game doesn't really match either their town or scum meta. I obviously prefer sam but if it comes down to it I'll switch
In post 801, Raya36 wrote:Ok whatever, I'll do it. But back to sam D2 if we go with bell today. At least with this flip I can decide if I should be trusting the bears or not

VOTE: bell
These posts in particular are the ones I'm referring to. Raya only caved to Bell after she became the counterwagon, and did so in a manner that looks extremely forced. I think reading her as town off of this is fallacious.
This is understandable. I still think it's unfair at the very least to judge someone as scum because of replacing out. But my progression was actually looking into the meta and Pooky's case
In post 1088, Titus wrote:
In post 842, Bamboozle wrote:
In post 803, Retti wrote:Hold up, no one hammer yet. I had hinted at this earlier but now is a good time to out this:

I am a gladiator and there is a benefit to me using my ability.


There are two caveats to this: I have to use it twice, and it has to be before 7 days have passed in each day phase that I use it. If I meet those conditions, something good happens but I am going to be as vague as possible otherwise to avoid giving away too much information. I very nearly rage-dueled Esooa in the midst of our argument but I'm glad I calmed down and decided against it. This is why I asked if people were okay with voting out Bell, because if so I can just safely piledrive him with no worries. This wouldn't change anything about the day but I really want to use my ability here.
Just use it on
Bell


-Bam
Why is Bam, who is voting Raya, encouraging a gladiate on Bell?
This should at least hint to you by your case, bam is the scum between us two
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Post Post #1140 (isolation #65) » Tue Apr 27, 2021 3:03 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1121, samantha97 wrote:by confident I mean like 99% instead of 95% for bear, for example
Why are you only 95 on bears?
In post 1131, Titus wrote:I'm cooling off on Raya because Romance was killed. If Romance was killed by scum, it would set me up to tunnel Raya. If a town source claims to kill Raya later, I'd go back. (Note: No one should claim if they did.)
You think I'd have killed Romance as scum?

I'll read through some isos later today and give some reads
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Post Post #1197 (isolation #66) » Tue Apr 27, 2021 12:54 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1144, samantha97 wrote:
Spoiler:
In post 617, Bell wrote:Hi, I thought I could do this, but I simply can’t.
I barely have any free time right now and it simply wouldn’t be fair for those more involved in the game.

I think willow seems the townier of the two on tvp but don’t hold me to that.

When romance said I’ll reveal I’m town at some point I stopped scum reading them but that’s a vibe read.

Booze I don’t have a read on.

The bears are being a lot as usual.

Also, too many alts. Cowards.
Dunn is not playing differently from every other game I’ve played with him and I’ve never Ed played with scum him.
But this means little, he’s kind of unreadable.

I don’t feel much from jjh.

Opinion of Sam’s the same. They’re playing slightly differently but I don’t feel that they’re being posturey
Retti looked super authoritarian on first look so I started scum reading him, but chilled out on second read of their opening.

If I haven’t mentioned you, you didn’t make an impression or I didn’t read your posts.

Anyway, good luck all. Sorry for replacing out.

@mod replace me. Apologies.

possible that everyone in this list is town except maybe an argument for vfp based on how he worded it, I noticed bell tended to view his teammates as mafia and town as town, plus we have bamboozle null to compare with jjh/dunnstral

not that I think we should base anything solely or primarily off what bell said
You mean it's in bell's scum meta that they townread those they tmi as town and scumread their partners?
In post 1153, T3 wrote:Robert and Titus felt VERY buddyish.
Can you show where?
In post 1189, Titus wrote: Given Retti and Bamboozle are town, scum were not trying to save Raya but merely gave up here. They went from not caring who was eliminated to resignation.

This points to PP scum as I TR everyone else on the Bell wagon.

PP Dunn T3 is my new answer.
In post 1192, samantha97 wrote:immediately before the bell votes vfp was at 6
So by the logic of these 2 posts would it be reasonable to say that the team could be VFP/PP/Bell? PP was never voting VFP and instead enchant. When VFP wagon dismantled PP went to Bell who had too much traction to bother trying to save.
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Post Post #1200 (isolation #67) » Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:08 pm

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No, I know, I was just combining both of your thoughts while reading through. And good point on the scum size, but do you think those 2 could reasonably be with bell for the reason I said?
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Post Post #1202 (isolation #68) » Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:59 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Yes, VFP and PP
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Post Post #1214 (isolation #69) » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:09 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1206, VFP wrote:
In post 1197, Raya36 wrote:So by the logic of these 2 posts would it be reasonable to say that the team could be VFP/PP/Bell? PP was never voting VFP and instead enchant. When VFP wagon dismantled PP went to Bell who had too much traction to bother trying to save.
Wouldn't this suggest PP tried to save my wagon?
Of course it's plausible but it's a bit tin foil to say that me and PP are scum together because PP didn't vote me.
The more scummy part of your argument is when I vote for Bell I'd say.
Yeah maybe you're right. I need to look more into interactions and stuff but it was an initial theory just based on the vote count.
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Post Post #1259 (isolation #70) » Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:49 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Time to start actually getting into this game. Took some time to read through and sort everyone.

Town

Bear HUGS
- hard town for being the one who got bell eliminated
Retti
- hard town for the gladiate against bell
Esooa
- hard town for case on bell. Didn't sound like a distancing type of case.
willow1
- hard town for the push on bell. Didn't feel like distancing.

Townlean

Andante (Enchant, Unwnd)
- Enchant gave in to sam and voted Dunnstral too easily which shows an extent of not caring where their vote is. They said it was to see what happened which I don't fully buy or understand. Probably town though for saying we should elim bell no matter how towny the replacement seems. Andante seems towny in general too.
VFP
- I read them as towny early on for things like the willingness to change their mind about the alt-fishing push in a way that didn't look like scum getting caught in a bad push, they sounded quite natural when they were under pressure although that could just be personality, I thought the cases in were good and made sense
Flea The Magician
- I find the catch up posts harder to read but that's not AI for Flea, they felt fine in general though. They were for elimming bell from the start too

Null

Titus
- Very light town points for breaking rvs. I don't think the disagreement with bell's case comes from scum for the same reason I disagreed. It felt NAI to me and like lhf and I think Titus felt the same. My read on Titus is mostly just gut in thinking their solving is genuine town solving. I am a little confused about something in that's making me hesitate a bit on fully townreading Titus. For a good amount of day 1 Titus was scumreading me, yet she says in this post that part of the reason for creating a counterwagon to bell was because she believed I was right about bell. But that doesn't make sense if she reads me as scum. This is the reason I'm putting Titus in null. I keep swinging to finding small things that I could see from scum.
PenguinPower
- Null, not much to read there

Scumlean

WhemeStar
- His votes haven't really made much sense (voted Enchant because Dunn is a bad vote but Enchant's vote itself wasn't scummy, voted bam for being scum trying to look like town), wary of since retti is now basically locktown and we know bam is town but this of course could just be wrong town, was on my wagon instead of bell but this could just be me being biased. They haven't posted that much for content.
Dunnstral
- His mentions of Bell could easily be bussing, his D2 entrance was a bit odd (saying all good town roles are dead, discussing multiball (maybe afraid of too much partner analysis))
jjh927
- I'm always wary of people who say scumreading me is valid (), townread a post of bell's but also said it wasn't representative of the rest of the iso yet still has bell as a townread a few posts later. is wanting to go for me (a counterwagon to bell before the duel). Not sure what to think of him taking technical credit for that though.

Scum

T3
- Not that much to analyze but I do agree with the case bears gave. I hope to see more here
samantha97
- Very light town points for being the only player bell gave a townread on before the replace out list but I'm not sure if that's something Bell would do to a buddy. Still scumread for play for the reasons I gave in and . The stance on Robert(bell) when he replaced in. First all Sam said was "neat" until someone brought up the seer claim not making sense, then defended the possibility of a seer on the site, then shaded him for posting elsewhere without explaining the claim. I could see this as scum giving their new replacement partner a chance then once people start going against it, joining the wagon and full bussing.

VOTE: T3
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Post Post #1261 (isolation #71) » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:21 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Thank you, I put some effort into that :)

Titus is only null because I kept swinging both ways when reading her iso. In reality I could probably sort her into one or the other but I can't decide on one. I'm probably leaning more town to answer your question though but I don't feel confident enough to actually do that.

In response to the post form Titus you quoted, I understand that Titus was wrong, but I don't think her reasons are wrong if that makes sense. If she truly finished two games with an active scum bell then why is she wrong for saying scum!bell is inactive is incorrect meta. I don't townread her for this but I also don't think her going against bell's wagon is necessarily worthy of a scumread either
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Post Post #1263 (isolation #72) » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:25 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Yeah, I was thinking about that when reading through. I'm sure scum felt forced to bus to an extent. Just not sure if they would have made light attempts or just full bus
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Post Post #1268 (isolation #73) » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:47 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Plus I think that slot was so scumread at that point there was no safe way to save it no matter the power it had. You're probably right bussing was planned much before the duel. I mean, bell was the only one with votes
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Post Post #1270 (isolation #74) » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:59 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Maye but not necessarily. I would say earlier on when my wagon picked up all of a sudden there would be at least 1 scum jumping there in hopes to get me instead. But probably after when bell picked up traction again scum we're bussing.
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Post Post #1281 (isolation #75) » Thu Apr 29, 2021 2:24 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1273, Esooa wrote:I think Sam is spewed by Bell
Spewed town? Why?
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Post Post #1284 (isolation #76) » Thu Apr 29, 2021 2:50 am

Post by Raya36 »

Sam is who bell talked about being town the most. Is that something bell would avoid doing to a partner?
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Post Post #1331 (isolation #77) » Thu Apr 29, 2021 6:33 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1285, Retti wrote:Probably not, most scum avoid going out of their way to talk about their partners excessively and the general tenor of the way he's addressing he feels like scum talking to a townie. Aside from that I don't really suspect her on play though.
Usually that's true but idk bell's specific meta which so far has been a little off usual.

Willow vs Andante sounds very TvT. Both sound genuinely frustrated and I do still have a decently confident TR on both of them
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Post Post #1338 (isolation #78) » Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:48 am

Post by Raya36 »

What about the readslist looks like it's not made to appease?
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Post Post #1343 (isolation #79) » Thu Apr 29, 2021 12:30 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1339, jjh927 wrote:That most of it is null or leans even on slots where there's a consensus
Couldn't this also be scum keeping their options open?
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Post Post #1347 (isolation #80) » Thu Apr 29, 2021 1:44 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Why do I look scummy by play?

If I look like scum to you what makes you think both the wagons on me and bell weren't scum wagons?
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Post Post #1364 (isolation #81) » Fri Apr 30, 2021 11:41 am

Post by Raya36 »

This is fine VOTE: Dunn
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Post Post #1378 (isolation #82) » Sat May 01, 2021 2:15 am

Post by Raya36 »

Dunn, go back to my readslist and find yourself there. That's why I'm voting
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Post Post #1384 (isolation #83) » Sat May 01, 2021 4:55 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1380, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1259, Raya36 wrote:Dunnstral - His mentions of Bell could easily be bussing, his D2 entrance was a bit odd (saying all good town roles are dead, discussing multiball (maybe afraid of too much partner analysis))
Not seeing a real reason to vote for me here

You don't have any better leads?
I do have better leads but a lead is a lead. Why did you say all good town roles are dead? You can't honestly think that's all town has.
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Post Post #1388 (isolation #84) » Sat May 01, 2021 8:28 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1386, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 1385, T3 wrote:
In post 1384, Raya36 wrote:
In post 1380, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1259, Raya36 wrote:Dunnstral - His mentions of Bell could easily be bussing, his D2 entrance was a bit odd (saying all good town roles are dead, discussing multiball (maybe afraid of too much partner analysis))
Not seeing a real reason to vote for me here

You don't have any better leads?
I do have better leads but a lead is a lead. Why did you say all good town roles are dead? You can't honestly think that's all town has.
That felt more ike a pr soft.
Which alignment though?

I’m still on the fence about Dunn. Noraa is convinced he’s obvtown but Pooky thinks it’s possible he’s scum and I really have no clue rn.
Why does Noraa think he's obvtown again?
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Post Post #1399 (isolation #85) » Sat May 01, 2021 4:39 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1394, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1384, Raya36 wrote:Why did you say all good town roles are dead? You can't honestly think that's all town has.
Cop died and is a powerful role, even with the list restriction. Town Joat also died. That's a lot of town power. Trying to read into it as if I said something scummy is wild.
Maybe I am just overthinking it but it felt like an odd thing to say and maybe and light attempt at PR fishing
In post 1398, Bear HUGS wrote:Gutread I guess, she correctly sr him in me v Titus.
Well so far the bear gut reads have proven successful
In post 1398, Bear HUGS wrote:If scum, Titus is never scum with either Raya or Dunn. Raya is never scum with Dunn. Dunn is never scum with Titus, Raya, Andante or jjh.
Hmm that's a lot of can't be scum with's... UNVOTE:
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Post Post #1411 (isolation #86) » Sun May 02, 2021 3:42 am

Post by Raya36 »

I'd be happy going back to sam. I'm not fully convinced jj is scum and I'm definitely not interested in Andante.

VOTE: sam
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Post Post #1414 (isolation #87) » Sun May 02, 2021 4:33 am

Post by Raya36 »

Why do you townread sam?
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Post Post #1417 (isolation #88) » Sun May 02, 2021 4:40 am

Post by Raya36 »

Are we positive bell doesn't do that to a partner though? I looked into that earlier but I keep going back and forth on sam is scum by play or sam is town because of bell posts
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Post Post #1423 (isolation #89) » Sun May 02, 2021 5:00 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1418, Esooa wrote:
In post 1417, Raya36 wrote:Are we positive bell doesn't do that to a partner though? I looked into that earlier but I keep going back and forth on sam is scum by play or sam is town because of bell posts
positive enough I don't want to vote Sam today, at the very least
Yeah I guess you're probably right with this much at least
UNVOTE:
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Post Post #1424 (isolation #90) » Sun May 02, 2021 5:02 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 933, Bear HUGS wrote:
This is
Noraa
talking and the first post that I've signed so listen up because this post is important. This may be a long post but I recommend everyone to, at the very least, skim it.
T3, if you do not read this post in full and have a good long wall post in reply, you are scum claiming.
Keep that in mind and don't throw the game
if you are town
because I am giving you a chance to change my mind. If you don't take it, it is solely on you if you are mislaunched.


Moving on,
lets start the analysing
Spoiler:
We're gonna ignore the rvs posts. Let's start here.
In post 54, T3 wrote:
Darn not rvs anymore.

Initial tr on samantha.
The word 'initial' just sounds suuuuper bad here because it kinda says they're not dedicated to the read. In which case, why even say it? It also just rubs me the wrong way because T3 starts calling sam scum when sam goes under pressure which is just kinda like ... coincidence? I think not..
In post 58, T3 wrote:
Fair point
, but time zones and weekend.
Defends my hydra against willow's shitty arguments about me being scum before I even posted. Im confbiasing a bit here so ignore this part if you want. But it does feel like self conscious scum towards their buddy.
In post 266, T3 wrote:. I don't like the random assumptions at this point made by bugs. Enchant is
starting off
as town for me. Comes into the game, starts reading, answering questions. VFP is hard town for reasons I don't want to share right now. Wheme doesn't appear to be making an effort but that fits with his meta from town or scum so not sure. I
initially
tred samantha for coming into the game and doing stuff but I'm not so sure. Romance's tone almost feels faked, in a sense. Titus is town. Mostly a gut toneread on this one and would be open to bugs attempting to convonce us. Raya is town for a similar reason to Titus. willow is twn for the idgaf post Bamboozle is guttowny for basically just riding with it at the start.

I think
I'm leavin my RVS vote as is.
Ok so he says here. Bear hydra scum. Enchant town. VFP hard town! Wheme null.
Backtrack on sam TR as sam picks up traction
. Romance scum. Titus town. Raya town. Willow town. Bam town.
Let's also note this is probably the one post with the most content from this slot and there is like zero reasoning for anything.
In post 272, T3 wrote:WhemeStar
actually might be
a good vote.
Oop null read gone as wheme wagon picks up traction.

In post 312, T3 wrote:VOTE: samantha
meh
oh no no.
Sam is picking up traction again. Lets move back!!

In post 344, T3 wrote:can't tell if enchant is drunk or it's still rvs
Enchant TR down the drain as Enchant wagon gains traction.

In post 358, T3 wrote:
The Dunn votes are terrible
I'm not going to read too much into pit.
Shades all of Dunn's wagon because most people are TRing Dunn.
In post 410, T3 wrote:I don't know about VFP here. I
could see
Enchant as scum, same with samantha but not them both together. I would want to go for samantha.
VFP null.
Enchant scum(TR totally washed away for ... no reason?)
. Sam scum.
In post 515, T3 wrote:Esooa
seems right
about. The bugs hydra still pings me as scum.
Esooa, a widely TRed player ofc is a TR. oop we need to bring back the bear SR.
In post 540, T3 wrote:
In post 535, WhemeStar wrote:Jesus bamboozle is such obv scum why haven’t we voted here earlier

VOTE: bamboozle

Looks like scum trying to act townie to me
VOTE: WhemeStar
Thank you fo pointing out the obvious and trying to get toenpoints.
Oop now we're voting wheme because its an easy wagon choo choo.
In post 670, T3 wrote:Something about samantha Enchant interactions
just seem off, in a sense.
Let's wait for the Bell replacement before voting.
Dunn is pinging me as scum
with post 668.
We back to this. Tbh it feels like he's like copying my read on sam and raya at this point.
We shouldn't be voting bell because ..... ??????????????
Dunn is scum now woo so the TR just disappeared down the drain somehow.
(Earlier he shaded all of Dunn's wagon)
In post 678, T3 wrote:VOTE: dunn
No objections to this as of now
.
Ooouuu what happened here?
TR gone as Dunn gains traction.

In post 682, T3 wrote:Alrigt
I would not be surprised
ifcWheme/dunn are s//s
Wheme is always an option ya know, heh.
In post 788, T3 wrote:VOTE: samantha
:/
oh nvm, sam is good too.
In post 871, T3 wrote:I would rather wait for te bell replacement.
ofc you would lol.
In post 872, T3 wrote:VOTE: titus
The whole towncase thing and voting patterns make me feel like this is scum.
ooo
Titus(previous TR) is an option now
too?


Conclusion:
Spoiler:
This is such a bullshit ISO. I can't even. Nearly every vote is sheeped. Zero explanations. Solely trying to float under the radar and follow along with majority votes. He's poking and prodding everywhere looking for a weak spot to push in town and his votes all come with zero explanation. I've bolded some key words in his ISO that will make it easier to read.


Read this spoiler last.
Spoiler:
The
bolded words
are showing uncertainty, shifts in reads, and most importantly, A LOT of replying to/agreeing with other people. Backtracking on TRs due to their wagon gaining traction is shown in
purple
. Notice how T3 switches wagons super often. But
his switches never show individual thought process
. They only show a "aha I found a wagon that I can push" scum mentality. Townies are individual beings who think on their own because they don't have an answer sheet to rely on. Scum however, come into the game with half an answer sheet. Why read this last? Because now that you've read this, I need you to go through and read it again keeping these colors in mind and try to see if you can see what I am seeing. It will go faster because this is your second time reading.


I am not trying to distract from the bell wagon but I need to bring to people's attention how scummy T3 is being. This is also a warning to T3 saying in
big bold red font
, if you are town, you better start acting like it because currently you have done nothing for this game and deserve to get yeeted off the face of the earth.

Pooky is confident in bell scum so I prefer Bell, naturally. However, if Bell wagon starts deteriorating, T3 will town up or get tunneled.

I want everyone that is town to read this post and give me opinions on T3. Do not start a wagon on T3 because a reply from him is very important. If he is under pressure, it is likely that the reply will naturally look more scummy. I don't wish to tunnel town and I wish to give him a chance. Normally, at a time like this, I go full on tunnel mode but after lots of trial and error, I believe this method is better in more ways than one. We still have time and the bell slot just got replaced. Don't start a wagon on T3 and lets work this out together and win this game together. (directed at town ofc)
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Post Post #1462 (isolation #91) » Sun May 02, 2021 1:31 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1429, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 1095, MariaR wrote:
VC 1.finalRobert M Hunter (10): willow1, T3, Bear HUGS, Raya36, Bamboozle, Andante, samantha97, Retti, VFP, Robert M Hunter
Retti(0):

Not Voting (the rest):

With 18 players alive, it takes 10 to fade away
In post 837, MariaR wrote:
VC 1.5Bell (5): Esooa, Enchant, PenguinPower, Bear HUGS, Raya36
Raya36 (4): jjh927, Titus, Retti, Bamboozle
samantha97 (3): VFP, Romance, willow1
Romance (2): Bell, WhemeStar
Retti (1): Flea The Magician,
Titus (1): T3
Enchant (1): Dunnstral

Not Voting (1): samantha97

Deadline is in (expired on 2021-04-27 00:50:57)

With 18 players alive, it takes 10 to fade away
I’m thinking that Raya was probably the counterwagon to scum. Interesting if the same people are voting Dunn. Obviously not including Rhetti.
That's a good catch! Now I'm kind of thinking dunn is town just for that because there were definitely some scum on my wagon. Leaning JJ between JJ and Titus though.
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Post Post #1498 (isolation #92) » Mon May 03, 2021 3:44 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1474, Dunnstral wrote:My thoughts:

PenguinPower is clearly missing internet here. I think he's probably town for the following reason:
He claimed to have not noticed getting the day start pm in posts and . This is believable; as a list mod, he deals with other pms besides game pms. If he were scum, he'd have very likely made an ego post in his scum pt, and would have been more likely to notice that the game had started if his teammates had talked at all. I think it is unlikely that he pretended to have not known the game started.

Titus, WhemeStar, jjh927 are all super low activity here around the point where Retti is deciding on who to gladiate. (And that's suspicious, among other reasons to suspect them.)

[Andante, Titus, Whemestar, jjh927]

My solve is 2-3 mafia in the above pool, and 1-2 townies. I recommend killing everybody in that pool.
That's decent reasoning on Penguin. I don't see him faking that either. I want to wait until he gets back or there's a replacement anyway.

jj felt town since his return.

I want to go back here VOTE: T3
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Post Post #1582 (isolation #93) » Tue May 04, 2021 11:55 am

Post by Raya36 »

If not voting is an option than that's what I'll do. I'm still thinking Titus is town and Retti is almost for sure town
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Post Post #1619 (isolation #94) » Wed May 05, 2021 12:09 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1587, T3 wrote:
In post 1586, Titus wrote:I'd like to say this surprised me but it doesn't. Two scum suspects naked vote me and don't engage with the recent content.

This tells me they feel they can get the votes or they feel no risk from obvscuming.
You claim to be VT without a mask and we have to lim someone.
We don't have to eliminate anyone actually. Titus is probably town here.
In post 1594, Titus wrote:
In post 1592, samantha97 wrote:it'd be cool if any other maskless vanilla would raise their hair
Why are you asking this? Even if there was another maskless vanilla, then it's either scum or just narrows down the places for scum to shoot?
I agree. This makes no sense and is very anti-town
In post 1599, willow1 wrote:titus could literally be the only maskless vt in the game and it wouldn't make a difference i don't understand what the obsession is with people and publicly outing they have a mask
Because that outs the PRs to scum
In post 1612, WhemeStar wrote:What if penguin used mask and now he can’t type
If he wasnt also on vla that's what my guess would be
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Post Post #1636 (isolation #95) » Wed May 05, 2021 11:44 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1620, Flea The Magician wrote: VOTE: Dunn
Only place my vote is going, Dunn is lockscum to me.
Why is Dunn lockscum to you?
In post 1623, Dunnstral wrote:T3, Raya, and Flea. Who is scum?
T3 I think. I'm still going back and forth on Sam because of bell's townspew but also my read. You were a scumlean but I no longer have reason to scumlean you. I'm still considering JJ.
In post 1630, Bear HUGS wrote: Like why is voting Titus scummy? Right now there is a gladiate on Titus and rhetti. We can ONLY vote those two. Why is it scummy?
It is kinda scummy when a lot of us have agreed the duel is probably TvT and we have the option to not vote at all. People still voting anyway could include scum hoping it'll get enough traction to go through anyway if the wagon gets close
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Post Post #1642 (isolation #96) » Wed May 05, 2021 12:12 pm

Post by Raya36 »

If scum was intending to try to push your elim through what was the benefit to call you towny?
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Post Post #1645 (isolation #97) » Wed May 05, 2021 12:35 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Oh ok, Willow said that before the duel. Got it
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Post Post #1649 (isolation #98) » Wed May 05, 2021 1:08 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Did you ever say Titus' reaction was towny?
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Post Post #1651 (isolation #99) » Wed May 05, 2021 1:33 pm

Post by Raya36 »

I see. I need to not try to read when I'm exhausted :lol:

I can honestly see both sides to this. I understand why Titus is suspicious even though it's true that nothing about your stance truly changed
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Post Post #1673 (isolation #100) » Thu May 06, 2021 12:00 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1652, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 1636, Raya36 wrote:It is kinda scummy when a lot of us have agreed the duel is probably TvT and we have the option to not vote at all. People still voting anyway could include scum hoping it'll get enough traction to go through anyway if the wagon gets close
at the same time no elim is very anti town because it gives scum a "free kill"
No elim is better than a town elim though
In post 1664, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1660, willow1 wrote:dunn I do not know why you act like letting deadline pass w/o majority is not an option

there are a few different ways it can resolve but intentional tie/no majority are both plausible no elim scenarios
I don't think we should assume things without asking. Right now I think it's unclear enough that it's possible it's not allowed.
If not asking I'd its allowed is your obstacle then why didnt you ask? Or do you want the miselim to go through?
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Post Post #1717 (isolation #101) » Thu May 06, 2021 4:11 pm

Post by Raya36 »

VOTE: no fade
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Post Post #1840 (isolation #102) » Wed May 12, 2021 1:32 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1748, Dunnstral wrote:VOTE: Andante
Why are you voting Andante?
In post 1750, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 1737, MariaR wrote:
And we're back! Let's see who what I missed.

Esooa has died! Let's see what they were


Spoiler: Welcome Esooa you are
White Feather

Image
Image
Powers
You are a Vanilla Townie

X: You have your vote and voice use them wisely
[/area]
Really thought it would be us or Retti.
I'm also surprised, both you are hardtown reads
In post 1756, Retti wrote:No, it didn't count as using it since no one was eliminated. I'm not really keen to hijack the day again since I think that led to a lot of apathy so I'd rather play things out as normal and only gladiate if there's something approaching a consensus pick. Being withdrawn from discussion was clearly the wrong approach so I'd like to take a more active role today. Things need to get rolling again as I'm feeling a general air of apathy (that is admittedly partly my fault) and I don't wish for the momentum we had going off day 1 to be lost.
I agree with this. I think it would be ideal to wait until we've decided who we want to hammer, then you start the duel and we all just revote. That way you get the reward or whatever and it doesn't really affect the rest of the play at all.
In post 1770, samantha97 wrote:I want to policy inactives so we can get a groove going even if it puts us in lylo from being wrong

like flea has less posts than romance and enchant who have been gone for 20 days
ummmm
In post 1773, T3 wrote:VOTE: Andante
Everyone seemed to reasonably tr this slot so I wasn't sure how to push without revealing myself. My n1 result was also that Flea is town.
Well this is very good to know. I'll vote Andante at the end of my catchup so I can see VC
In post 1777, Andante wrote:like, not even joking, I hardclaim doctor, and I've been saving the bears cause they're towny af
The problem with this is unless T3 got a false result I'm pretty sure the claim is sound. I mean why claim that and automatically put yourself in a 1v1 if scum. And also why claim someone as town when you could instead claim even night whatever or 1 shot whatever.
In post 1778, Flea The Magician wrote:
In post 1770, samantha97 wrote:I want to policy inactives so we can get a groove going even if it puts us in lylo from being wrong

like flea has less posts than romance and enchant who have been gone for 20 days
Flea is currently failing their own vibe check, I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Technically I'm not inactive, I'm keeping with the game and I'm responding and poking things.

Low post count is what you're after here, just call it what it is ;) VOTE: Samantha nowt like going for what looks like lhf.
I'm starting to lean towards scum!sam would never say that because it's just very obviously going to be taken as scummy.
In post 1784, Retti wrote:I don't see why T3 fakes a guilty here
Exactly. I'm thinking we elim Andante then if that's wrong obviously T3 next.
In post 1786, Retti wrote:assuming Andante mafia the POE is probably just professor/wheme/jjh/willow, right
Willow is outside my poe
In post 1799, Andante wrote:again. WHY WOULD TOWN WAIT TO OUT A GUILTY
Didn't they get the guilty last night?
In post 1811, Titus wrote:
In post 1799, Andante wrote:again. WHY WOULD TOWN WAIT TO OUT A GUILTY
If I had one, I'd still be sitting on it. Looking to see reactions.
I honestly sometimes hold back guilties to see if I can case them enough to get them elimed without outing. And while I'm at it I can read their reads from a perspective of knowing they're scum.

Ignore me about voting Andante. Pretend my vote is there. I want Retti to duel andante.
In post 1836, samantha97 wrote:raya is still alive right
Yep! I'm here! Just busier than usual lately
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Post Post #1845 (isolation #103) » Wed May 12, 2021 1:44 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1841, Andante wrote:
In post 1840, Raya36 wrote:Why are you voting Andante?
Cause I'm doc, but T3 is a pr that has me guilty, yet can't claim anything else... so I'm automatically scum
That was before any claims, I'm curious why before knowing any of this
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Post Post #1848 (isolation #104) » Wed May 12, 2021 1:47 pm

Post by Raya36 »

That's a good point. Retti is as close to conftown as we have. Bears is close but still just a read.
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Post Post #1875 (isolation #105) » Wed May 12, 2021 4:08 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1857, ProfessorDrapion wrote:Hello all.
I’ve defeated Empoleon and received a spot in this game taken their place as a result.

I looked into the dead mafia and here are players I don’t think are likely to be partners with them:
Raya36
Flea

As for Bell I don’t see any interactions that can clear anything.
You don't think bears and retti are unlikely to be partners with bell?
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Post Post #1906 (isolation #106) » Thu May 13, 2021 4:43 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1879, ProfessorDrapion wrote:Let’s see.
Insane/Paranoid Cop, etc.
Framer
Redirector
Bus Driver

Probably some others stuff as well.
I mean we can vote the red checked Doctor claim, just don’t let Retti live to MYLO/LYLO that’s all I’m saying.
I don't see why not. Even if it's wrong, it's better than being wrong on some form of investigative
In post 1880, ProfessorDrapion wrote:
In post 1875, Raya36 wrote:
In post 1857, ProfessorDrapion wrote:Hello all.
I’ve defeated Empoleon and received a spot in this game taken their place as a result.

I looked into the dead mafia and here are players I don’t think are likely to be partners with them:
Raya36
Flea

As for Bell I don’t see any interactions that can clear anything.
You don't think bears and retti are unlikely to be partners with bell?
Nope.
Only really your interaction with them can’t be a Buss.
As well as their mention regarding that Magical dude
Both of them were major reasons why bell ever got eliminated
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Post Post #1911 (isolation #107) » Thu May 13, 2021 9:53 am

Post by Raya36 »

Agreed which is more reason why T3 should be trusted above Andante in this situation
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Post Post #1919 (isolation #108) » Thu May 13, 2021 2:11 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1917, ProfessorDrapion wrote:
In post 1906, Raya36 wrote:
In post 1879, ProfessorDrapion wrote:Let’s see.
Insane/Paranoid Cop, etc.
Framer
Redirector
Bus Driver

Probably some others stuff as well.
I mean we can vote the red checked Doctor claim, just don’t let Retti live to MYLO/LYLO that’s all I’m saying.
I don't see why not. Even if it's wrong, it's better than being wrong on some form of investigative
In post 1880, ProfessorDrapion wrote:
In post 1875, Raya36 wrote:
In post 1857, ProfessorDrapion wrote:Hello all.
I’ve defeated Empoleon and received a spot in this game taken their place as a result.

I looked into the dead mafia and here are players I don’t think are likely to be partners with them:
Raya36
Flea

As for Bell I don’t see any interactions that can clear anything.
You don't think bears and retti are unlikely to be partners with bell?
Nope.
Only really your interaction with them can’t be a Buss.
As well as their mention regarding that Magical dude
Both of them were major reasons why bell ever got eliminated
Not from the dead mafia’s ISO.
Retti dueled bell which meant we had to vote bell or retti. Retti basically guaranteed bell would be the elimination.
Bears pushed bell really hard and was the first to even mention that bell was prob scum. Iso bears and ctrl+f bell
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Post Post #1940 (isolation #109) » Fri May 14, 2021 12:06 am

Post by Raya36 »

VOTE: Andante
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Post Post #2005 (isolation #110) » Mon May 17, 2021 12:13 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 1972, ProfessorDrapion wrote:It’s the equivalent of saying: we should vote Drapion today yeah?
This is a really strange angle to go after VFP for
In post 1982, samantha97 wrote:VOTE: samantha97
lynch me today, the price of my mask is pretty steep (in the end I was right lol)

I killed romance and whemestar

I'm a vigilante + POE cop -
there's at least 1 mafia in Titus/jjh927


sad part about romance is I submitted andante first but overthought it and deleted it later

Spoiler:
In post 1068, samantha97 wrote:
In post 1067, T3 wrote:Meta works more often than not IMO.
that's why alts are antitown

and why I'll always support getting rid of them in a tossup
In post 994, samantha97 wrote:thoughts on requiring andante to claim?

oh and the reason why I killed wheme was because I had to pick between titus/jjh/wheme as one of the costs of using my mask and was like nope not going to wrack my brain about those 3 after romance and just rng'd it lol

probably don't want to rush the day but no matter what lynch me today/kill me at night if there's some kind of day-ending mafia power/equivalent

middle of the night for me so goodnight lol
Wait why elim you instead of one of Titus/jj?

I'm gonna think on Titus/jj tonight. But I definitely want to elim between them
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Post Post #2056 (isolation #111) » Mon May 17, 2021 4:44 am

Post by Raya36 »

No mask

I guess in this case we basically have no choice but to elim Sam and then pick between JJ and Titus the next day
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Post Post #2081 (isolation #112) » Mon May 17, 2021 10:02 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2064, willow1 wrote:VOTE: jjh

neat now i can admit to being wrong on titus and sail forth in peace

worth voting this over sam imo even though losing a town sux
It's not a guarantee that both JJ and Titus aren't scum. I think Sam said at least 1 is scum.

I should specify I'm VT with no mask
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Post Post #2153 (isolation #113) » Mon May 17, 2021 12:43 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2084, Titus wrote:Jjh just wants the extra kill.
I agree. He knows he's caught so he wants to be the first elim so sam can cause an extra town kill to happen. I say we just go for Sam today then get JJ tomorrow
In post 2095, Retti wrote:The info I got was that there are 6 masks currently remaining in the game. I have one of them, sam/dunn/flea/t3 are the others, someone is scum who didn't want to claim their mask
Good to know. So the pool is: (willow, professor, jj, bear, me, titus, vfp).
Maybe it's just jj?
In post 2103, willow1 wrote:looking at the list I think that's everyone?

i am a mask checker who has all of vfp/titus/raya as possessing no masks, checked in that order. i softed this a few different times, might collect the posts at some point.
Also very good to know. So pool becomes: (willow, professor, jj, bear)
So prob jj. It's not willow or bear

I think I like eliming jj first the most and sam after. I agree we have enough clears and hardtown reads for this.
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Post Post #2155 (isolation #114) » Mon May 17, 2021 1:06 pm

Post by Raya36 »

scum!jj wants Sam's extra kill. jj's claim is fake to get it so we elim jj tonight and sam lives to kill an extra townie.
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Post Post #2190 (isolation #115) » Mon May 17, 2021 3:01 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2157, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 2155, Raya36 wrote:scum!jj wants Sam's extra kill. jj's claim is fake to get it so we elim jj tonight and sam lives to kill an extra townie.
jjh didn't hear out sam's full claim before their own claim

Their claim was wifom to try to survive by looking town based on claim

Also, it doesn't matter even if he does want that
Oh, I take back that part of my argument then
In post 2158, Bear HUGS wrote:
In post 2155, Raya36 wrote:scum!jj wants Sam's extra kill. jj's claim is fake to get it so we elim jj tonight and sam lives to kill an extra townie.
So you’re saying it’s better to elim Sam? What makes you think jjh isn’t just trying to trick us with this? Because Sam elim does give scum a free kill regardless.
Yes but if we leave Sam then we have to elim them the next day. So it's an extra free kill to force us to let Sam live. That said dunn just pointed out this point doesn't stand.
In post 2159, willow1 wrote:
In post 2155, Raya36 wrote:scum!jj wants Sam's extra kill. jj's claim is fake to get it so we elim jj tonight and sam lives to kill an extra townie.
great, now can u evaluate the optimal play directly without relying on what scum may or may not want as the crux of the argument
Yeah that's a good idea. We should just elim the guilty. If jj is telling the truth then we'd have to wait 2 more days to elim there again.

I see JJ was hammered. Sam tomorrow for sure because of the neg-utility
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Post Post #2239 (isolation #116) » Fri May 21, 2021 12:20 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2217, VFP wrote:So confirmed then

Samantha (at least not Mafia)
Retti
Dunn

Flea was here due to T3 but I think not confirmed now? Unless I'm wrong.

Town
Willow
Bear, I guess?
Still Flea from play alone I think

So a mis lim today makes it 6 players and 1 scum..
Another mis lim makes it 3 players and 1 scum.
(At worst)

Even if you lim Samantha, we only have 2 mis lims now so that works out to not need to.
If there's a deep wolf in the town list I just think it's Bears

Other than that I favour Drapion as scum and if wrong just hope the second kill is in me, Raya, or Bears.

@Samantha

Can your ability thing hit you or is it only other town?
I townread every single person in this game except professor. Which is probably also a sign I need to reevaluate a bit. If I'm wrong I would probably go VFP or unclear bears and go there because that first elim could have been a bus

I think we do need to elim sam first though. We could just hope the day ends on professor but I'd rather go the safer route just in case.
VOTE: sam
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Post Post #2277 (isolation #117) » Fri May 21, 2021 4:47 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2241, willow1 wrote:raya it's counterintuitive but i just worked through it and i'm pretty sure Dunn is right and leaving sam alive is mechanically equal or better no matter who she targets or who scum targets, feel free to work through it b/c chance of me committing 4am error was high
Alright. I'll trust on that for now and come back to it later.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: professor (E-2 I think)
In post 2244, Dunnstral wrote:even if say, sam shoots me and mafia shoot sam, we still end up with at least one of retti/flea in the 4p limlo, so it seems we at least go even
Mafia won't shoot Sam but if we end up breaking even at worst then we might as well take the risk of going for professor and leaving sam alive
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Post Post #2293 (isolation #118) » Fri May 21, 2021 1:33 pm

Post by Raya36 »

I still think it's probably over
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Post Post #2324 (isolation #119) » Tue May 25, 2021 12:10 am

Post by Raya36 »

I'm actually very surprised that bears was nightkilled since some people were considering them to be a deepwolf. I wonder if they were on the right track with something?

VFP is acting very towny above, and I know I'm not scum, so I'm pretty sure we're missing something here.
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Post Post #2352 (isolation #120) » Tue May 25, 2021 4:44 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2325, Retti wrote:
In post 2324, Raya36 wrote:I'm actually very surprised that bears was nightkilled since some people were considering them to be a deepwolf. I wonder if they were on the right track with something?

VFP is acting very towny above, and I know I'm not scum, so I'm pretty sure we're missing something here.
Dunn was obviously the mafia kill, are you trying to act like you didn't realize that after all the discussion yesterday? Also, Bears was "on the right track" for what? Their last posts are right on this page and they didn't say anything besides suspecting VFP and defending you. What are you even trying to say here?
No you're right that dunn was obviously the mafia kill. Bears was Sam. I completely forgot about Sam killing a townie until I saw the post I quoted below.
In post 2326, samantha97 wrote:I believe mafia have a mask because I was poisoned and will die tonight, and no one else claimed poisoned

so tonight I'll kill town + be killed if I'm left alive
So should we just leave Sam then since she is killed tomorrow night anyway. Sucks we'll lose another townie but hopefully we can figure this out and end the game today so that doesn't have to happen
In post 2344, samantha97 wrote:vfp/raya/retti and I claim an inability to target you

willow claims to have targeted retti

so you should just fullclaim
This is correct for me

VFP feels town for making the elim pool for today between me and them. They could have easily added more people to the list. This isn't self-preserving at all and reads as town.

Willow has felt very town to me but I might need to reevaluate him.

Retti I'm unsure of because their use of gladiate was very pro-town but Bell could have been a bus, especially considering game state. That has been my main reason for townreading them so I am very willing to consider them.
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Post Post #2355 (isolation #121) » Tue May 25, 2021 4:49 am

Post by Raya36 »

I'll take a look at those interactions with Retti after work.

(Also maybe this is very surface level but I don't think scum!willow calls retti for sure town right after I make a post essentially saying I'm looking between willow and retti. That said I'm also not in a position where I have much influence)
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Post Post #2357 (isolation #122) » Tue May 25, 2021 4:51 am

Post by Raya36 »

I just realized I townread everyone. This is a problem
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Post Post #2359 (isolation #123) » Tue May 25, 2021 4:53 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2356, willow1 wrote:here are the posts I'm essentially clearing retti off of
In post 1050, Andante wrote:if robert town, we cry, cause I'm trusting gladiator lol
In post 1058, Andante wrote:If Retti was voting Raya, why did Retti duel Bell/Robert? This game, people aren't making sense ahhhh (I promise I'll be fully caught up before D2)
In post 1060, Andante wrote:
In post 1059, Retti wrote:
In post 1058, Andante wrote:If Retti was voting Raya, why did Retti duel Bell/Robert?
Bell had effectively scumclaimed with his replace out (which he did in another game as scum), I had only moved my vote to raya because the slot was empty at the time and people wanted to wait for a replacement before voting.


For the record, with Bell/Robert confscum, I think Raya's behavior around the wagon is terrible.

I see, that'd make sense!! I feel like a lot of this game is going to make more sense when I'm caught up, cause looking at your vote on raya, then duelling bell... but if bell scum claimed, why waste a duel on it? I'm assuming you have a limited number of duels, and it's not infinite?
Is it possible this confusion could have been faked? It does look genuine and unaligned though.
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Post Post #2360 (isolation #124) » Tue May 25, 2021 4:54 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2358, Retti wrote:I also was on Andante day 3 before the guilty was even outed, I missed enchant early but I'm giving myself credit for that pelt
Hm ok, I think you're probably just town.

What do you think of my maybe surface-level point on Willow?
And what do you think of VFP making the elim pool only me and themselves?
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Post Post #2363 (isolation #125) » Tue May 25, 2021 4:58 am

Post by Raya36 »

Scumleaned 3 people still alive and then townread VFP who is still alive as well. No comment on willow.

You're saying this points to VFP?
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Post Post #2364 (isolation #126) » Tue May 25, 2021 5:00 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2362, willow1 wrote:andante literally had a mental breakdown in thread at me putting her as my third scumread so i don't think she is experienced enough to fake that high quality of distance, esp when one of the posts is blatantly curious mechfishing and another testing the waters on if retti could get voted out instead

also unclear what that process is about me not clearing retti as scum. i see very obvious incentives to do so even without the knowledge he is essentially my twitch tier 2 sub whiteknighting simp this game
I think I agree on Retti. I'll but them as town now.

If you're referring to the section I put in brackets I mean I don't think scum!you would lower my pool to just you by convincing me that the only other person in my pool besides you is town
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Post Post #2389 (isolation #127) » Tue May 25, 2021 11:10 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2366, willow1 wrote:scum me can safely put the eggs in getting you voted out w/ vfp as a backup, there's no point in me damaging credibility going on a tinfoil adventure against retti except for bizarre towncred

you are 100% the targeted miselim no matter who scum is in me, retti, vfp and not a crucial swingvoter lol
Yeah that's true. It was mostly the timing of it being right after my post.
In post 2367, Retti wrote:
In post 2360, Raya36 wrote:
In post 2358, Retti wrote:I also was on Andante day 3 before the guilty was even outed, I missed enchant early but I'm giving myself credit for that pelt
Hm ok, I think you're probably just town.

What do you think of my maybe surface-level point on Willow?
And what do you think of VFP making the elim pool only me and themselves?
With regard to willow I've been town reading him because I wouldn't expect him to play this way and try to exert basically 0 influence over the game at all as scum. I don't think clearing me here is a guaranteed towntell though because he'd probably realize I'm not a realistic target for suspicion. I'm gonna revisit him to check because I don't give anyone a free pass at endgame.
Thanks, I'm at the point where I have you sorted as town and Willow leaning town, so this was helpful. I still need to reevaluate the others
In post 2371, Retti wrote:I'll be honest here: the only thing keeping me from just saying fuck it and voting VFP is the blase roleclaim and NKA (does he kill dunn when dunn was the one person calling him town?). But beyond that:

- Andante barely acknowledges his existence
- jjh calls him town earlier and buddies Esooa for "challenging the VFP wagon", otherwise calls him town with nothing attached, mentions him as a scumlean late with no reasons attached to it
- Enchant votes him but Enchant's an idiot who gets bus-happy day 1
- vfp doesn't mention enchant
- wants Titus over andante () but otherwise barely acknowledges her existence ( also looks weird on a revisit)
- has jjh as a scum lean but doesn't really pressure there at all until he's guiltied

Like...this looks more or less slam dunk, to me. Are there reasons to townread him beyond the VT claim?
Dunn was modconfirmed town though and I think that's more important to get rid of than it is to keep the person townreading you
Wouldn't Andante barely acknowledge him point towards them being scum together? Same for VFP not mentioning enchant?
In post 2384, samantha97 wrote:I'm actually a serial killer who got stopped by wheme night 2 and am not really poisoned; jjh/titus was just obvious
How did I not connect "a random townie will die every night as long as I'm alive" to serial killer even if this is a joke
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Post Post #2408 (isolation #128) » Wed May 26, 2021 12:13 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2390, Retti wrote:
In post 2389, Raya36 wrote:Dunn was modconfirmed town though and I think that's more important to get rid of than it is to keep the person townreading you
Wouldn't Andante barely acknowledge him point towards them being scum together? Same for VFP not mentioning enchant?
That's a fair point although it's not like killing me would've raised any eyebrows. My point with regard to the VFP stuff
was
that all of it makes him look more like scum, and the reasons for townreading him are, IDK, vibes?
Ok, I see. I misunderstood. In that case I do agree with you
In post 2407, Flea The Magician wrote:Also looking for arbitary patterns like that is flawed, at least from my own dealings I deliberately avoid arbitrary patterns like that.
I know you can't really listen to me much here but don't think too much into that list, from my perspective it clearly is flawed.
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Post Post #2429 (isolation #129) » Wed May 26, 2021 4:21 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2409, Flea The Magician wrote:You sound weirdly defensive over that Raya, like I'm dismissing it and you're telling me to dismiss it after the fact...
That was a thought on the whole topic in general, not to you directly. I just quoted yours for context
In post 2410, samantha97 wrote:anyway since flea claimed macho you should probably lynch me, since we may autolose even if there's only 1 mafia left
So if we elim you then we will also lose a town to the night kill but we won't lose a town to you. So it'll be 3 townies and 1 mafia if I'm not mistaken? Or 2 townies lost overnight and then 1 mafia and 2 townies for mylo
In post 2414, samantha97 wrote:the only downside to lynching me is the potential for 2 mafia or 1 mafia+traitor to exist, so if everyone is confident it's just 1 person left then we should/we shouldn't if we're not confident
I think I'm town reading enough people that I feel good about this

I'd be ok with Sam or no-elim I think
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Post Post #2439 (isolation #130) » Wed May 26, 2021 9:41 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2434, willow1 wrote:tl;dr of all my conclusions

-raya softdefending scum like it's her fulltime job
-jjh scared of esooa nailing vfp town and defusing that 1v1
-jjh raya progression some ass
-vfp had a pretty town d2 with resisting all the large townwagons+i liked their reaction to andante d3 even if arguably null

i wanna no elim into vote raya
If majority wants that then just elim me now instead so we have another chance next day.
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Post Post #2441 (isolation #131) » Wed May 26, 2021 10:10 am

Post by Raya36 »

If we no fade, then it'll likely be mylo right?
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Post Post #2447 (isolation #132) » Wed May 26, 2021 2:26 pm

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2442, samantha97 wrote:
In post 2441, Raya36 wrote:If we no fade, then it'll likely be mylo right?
6 today

if nolynch there's 3 tomorrow (my poison death + my vig + mafia nk), unless my vig and nightkill overlap

we're already there, the point of doing it would just be to hit you if you're town basically

the downside is we auto lose if 2 mafia

but uh I think we lost already if you're town anyway
Right, so it would be a gamble, hoping the vig hits me.

And if we elim me instead of no elim then 4 town would die total and scum win.

I think no elim is the safest. I don't think I can convince everyone to vote elsewhere and I wouldn't even trust myself enough to pick the right person.

I do just think it's VFP. Everyone else has been very obvtown or basically clear. But I don't trust that enough to elim instead of no elim.
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Post Post #2449 (isolation #133) » Wed May 26, 2021 4:09 pm

Post by Raya36 »

VOTE: no fade
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Post Post #2458 (isolation #134) » Thu May 27, 2021 10:03 am

Post by Raya36 »

In post 2454, VFP wrote:I have nothing to add other than what I said.

If 1 of me or Raya is alive lim there.
Both then whatever
If neither are alive in some strange world, its Retti and they want to lose...

I'm hoping RNG just kills me.
This is pretty much where I'm at
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Post Post #2685 (isolation #135) » Sun Jun 06, 2021 11:12 pm

Post by Raya36 »

Gg everyone
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