DEFCON Mafia 5.0: GAME OVER - NEW AMERICA FORMED

[Prism]

VOTE: TOTAL WAR

I trust gorilla with my life

[Prism]

You don't know me.

You don't know how I play

I am a specter.

Yet I am about to become your closest friend and most loyal ally

[Prism]

Wait I can't change that vote LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

[Prism]

Naw Cakez you don't give mulligans like that I need to read the fuckin rules

VOTE: TOTAL WAR

[Prism]

If Equinox thinks hydras are the worst offenders for talking to yourself in the game thread I can't wait for us to both make it to Day 4

[Prism]

Well, I guess by then he can nuke me, unlike these two irl days

[Prism]

This is like when you tell your mom "buy me the toy I'll take good care of it I promise" then break it before you even get to the register

[Prism]

I am taking the all caps as a terrorist claim from Pooky. Launch is imminent.

[Prism]

Okay I really hate that I have to go back on my page 1 and instantly nuke gorilla the second it becomes available but the primate is scum

Communists infiltrating our zoos, brainwashing our animals.

[Prism]

I am dead serious about instanuking gorilla if I wind up picking silo

[Prism]

Prism is already exuding similar energy to my experience with Prism as town. I instantly clicked with Prism's opener as being town and the things Prism are doing just feel town to me in a way that's a bit hard to articulate. Call it gut if you must but I'm just pretty sure that this is Prism as town. Granted, I've not actually seen Prism as scum but this feels like Prism as town.

Makes no sense given WH13, where I was the only one to pick up on a loophole the mod didn't catch in the pregame, and I did not start out shitposting

[Prism]

My posting across games is intentionally very similar. The fact that this start is not remotely similar to the start of WH13 remains, and it is odd that you think starting out shitposting-as opposed to using it to keep myself sane over the course of the game, which is the norm- seems to be a towntell.

But I will move on.

[Prism]

Jesus Christ we might actually need to Standard Mastina Protocol the game

[Prism]

When I was in college I used to get wicked hammered. My nickname was Puke. I would chug a fifth of SoCo, sneak into a frat party, polish off a few people's empties, some brewskies, some Jell-O shots, do some body shots off myself, pass out, wake up the next morning, boot, rally, more SoCo, head to class. Probably would have gotten expelled if I had let it affect my grades, but I aced all my courses. They called me Ace. It was totally awesome.

Got straight B's. They called me Buzz.

[Prism]

I guess Bell is town and we don't get our free Russian

[Prism]

This is already divergent, not just in the fact that he's posting but in the level of read/reaction given on gorilla and the willingness to be offensive towards the slot

[Prism]

Vax, you seem quite different from what I remember in 2181. I remember you being more aggressive in the opener, not really publicly hedging, and the anti-team read felt a bit out of left field as though it felt pressured to do something.

My memory wrong or has there been a shift in your style?

[Prism]

At ths point bell feel like high postcount but lacking in content. The reads almost feel forced.
Prism sticks out to me as very townys for the moment. Like Prism threw shade on Vax but offered a reasonable explanation for what it could be. samantha is strong town for the total war thing.

I should interject and say normally you shouldn't do this imo, you want to see what they say then compare. I specifically wanted to see if Vax would try to cook up a third option, or try really hard to explain the shift. I'm not really sure how to feel about the answer of different every game/not really remembering 2181, but fishing doesn't mean you catch something every time.

[Prism]

imo Air Base needs to go to Bell and anyone else ranking it at all should be a scumclaim

if you don't understand/don't share the read, all you need to know is that he is one of the most divergent players on site. Make him unnightkillable and force scum to nuke him if they want him out

[Prism]

Since this is dependent on speed, if anyone is super lazy/will struggle to put together a list in time for DEFCON 4, here's a sample draft that should work fine for town.

If you want a nuclear weapon go Submarine into Silo.

If you want to prioritize PRs here's my general suggestion or template:

1. Espionage
2. Fighter
3. Battleship
4. Aircraft Carrier
5. Submarine
6. Radar
7. Counterintelligence
8. Strategic Missile Defense
9. Covert Ops
10. Eavesdrop
11. Silo

Mix it up as you want. If you think drawing a scum PR is lame, gimme town PR or nuke, go for it. I did not include Fail Safe, Fallout Shelter, or Air Base in this list as I don't think the first two should generally be picked and I think Air Base should go to Bell/have scum burn a pick to block him getting it.

[Prism]

Submarine isn't single use actually so maybe move it up to 2/3

[Prism]

Yes. A rolecop in this game is very valuable because scum can use the submarine as a daily second kill and it catches the SK outright, among other uses.

The value of Bell specifically being the person w/ Air Base outweighs the benefit of a single stopped kill.

[Prism]

(And scum claiming submarine defeats the utility in their picking it to begin with)

[Prism]

I suppose it is worth clarifying with Cakez/looking at previous games to see exactly what Fighter returns, "Troop" or "Silo" would not be particularly useful while a specific troop or which silo mode would be.

[Prism]

why don't you just help him here gorilla

[Prism]

I'm calling you one scummy monkey, I feel it in the depths of the soul

[Prism]

Resorting to utilizing government apparatus as a crushing hammer over settling this with our 2nd amendment enshrined freedom next to the tumbleweeds out back. Doesn't sound American to me.

[Prism]

Cakez really picked the most favorable time for the Russians

[Prism]

Looking at my watch

Ready to nuke a monkey and have half the table call me a fuckin moron

[Prism]

I'm finding it really hard to stay interested in mafia at the moment but I don't see why people have gorilla or myself as town. This is very par for the course, mastina's read makes no sense even if I feel she's town anyway, and gorilla really hasn't done anything special either except for 664, which is a good post.

[Prism]

Merlot has an icon that is the manifestation of what I have been actively searching for since I first made this account and I am upset

I'm assuming this slot is town for the amount/depth of content at my own peril

[Prism]

The fact that Et Al has Church of Skitter as scummy puts them immediately on my shit list. I didn't share the same concerns as everyone on S_S but I think the Church slot's reads are very natural and the questioning organic

[Prism]

It is bad because it is specifically Mena/Skitter whose dynamic I saw in 2181

Ya I'm honestly not sure if there is anything else that's even worth having my vote on tbh.
Cephir is probably fine
Bell is probably fine but I need to keep an open mind
Prism is probably fine but I should probably be keeping an open mind
Pooky is showing us that he is proud to be an American
gorilla seems probably fine
Equi + Reck seems fine so far but I need to keep an open mind
Sam is probably fine

These are all natural even if underexplained. I disagree with gorilla town but understand why people townread him, for example. Equi+Reck was another one that stuck out to me the same way, as is Sam. IIRC Mena had a weird theory about reading me from 2181 but that is the only moderately red flag to me here.

[Prism]

I don't specifically know that that post was Mena, which gives ambiguity for the Skitter scumread, but I feel good about the slot regardless of who posted that

P-Edit: Yeah, I 100% am going to tunnel your slot permanently, this isn't an early game dart throw to be marginally improved upon at all.

[Prism]

FWIW with Skitter she appears to get the same treatment I give Nacho of actively hating her reads & process every game, which is not to say that her reads or process are actually wrong but that I tend to find her scummy every single game.

P-Edit: It's a player in the Et Al hydra and a separate hydra, Church of Skitter, run by two simps

[Prism]

LLD is going to have an aneurysm if all of EM winds up townblocking

Meanwhile I forget that the year is no longer 2016/2017 where I ran the table and all these EM Zoomers who never heard of me have replaced me. It's like I've replaced the old 2011/2013 elitists, I'm the boomer now

[Prism]

My saving grace is that petapan is fortunately not here to tank the game with tales of the greatest mafia game ever played way back in 1842

[Prism]

IDK because I'm talking specifically about EM, which was the primary site I played on up until 2018, but if you played there frequently pull up the rocking chair too

[Prism]

Merlot has an icon that is the manifestation of what I have been actively searching for since I first made this account and I am upset

I'm assuming this slot is town for the amount/depth of content at my own peril

okay so i don’t think that we’ve played together that much but when i saw this icon and picked it i actually did think it had your sort of vibe LMAO

My pride and desire to find it myself means I will not ask to trade but know that I am both envious and upset

[Prism]

I knew I should have learned Evelynn instead of spamming 500 Zac games for freelo

[Prism]

??? Titus LMAO

It means Preview Edit, as in an edit/additional note in light of seeing another post when you hit preview

[Prism]

You think 2011-2013 EMer makes you old, try being a 2008-2010 EMer. I was on EpicMafia prominently before I was on mafiascum prominently and actually honed my skills there pretty well, and often in weeks had like top-20 placements on the weekly leaderboard without ever going too high (which I was fine with as being the highest gave burden of proficiency and got you policy-nk'd).

I chose those years because 2011/2014 were the two "golden years" people always pointed to being like "Games were so much better then, kids nowadays" shaking their canes. I am 2010, but fundamentally I just wanted to make funny commentary on the passing of the torch/baton, and feeling like King Bob from Recess in that episode where he builds mud pyramids, rather than make substantive commentary on what a joindate means.

[Prism]

ALSO PRISM IS A RUSKIE SCUM

NOT REAL AMERICAN

no u

[Prism]

No

The search continues, however I thank u all

[Prism]

Pooky — Saturday at 5:15 PM
SORRY FOR LATE REPLY
SNORTED TEN LINES OF LEGION PULSE PREWORKOUT
GOT A TATTOO OF LLD
IF I FLEX MY BICEP REALLY FAST
SHE DANCES
SHIT DEEP CITY LIGHTS FLAKED
IM THE LAST LINE OF DEFENSE FOR THE MOTHERLAND

[Prism]

As much as I dislike hyperposting meta (Ironic for people who know me) if your response to someone having fun is to tell them to shut the fuck up and launch into this condescending tirade about how much worse everything is for it, perhaps you are the one with the unhealthy mindset towards the game. There is not liking a style and finding it detrimental to your experience and there is being a gigantic prick about it.

[Prism]

VOTE: Vaxkiller

Never in my life did I see myself chainsawing for mastina, though this vote is less about having a townread on her and more about not liking Vax's opening and explanation of their houghts on Pooky

[Prism]

Is this the part where if she flips town we call people opposed informed scum?

[Prism]

I can't believe the words coming out of my keyboard but this is by far the most tolerable & limited posting mastina has made in awhile and the idea she has to go for gamehealth is nonsense

[Prism]

Can you explain for me why this is the case in this game but not in WH13?

[Prism]

I don't see her as particularly annoying or intolerable this game. If you think she has more scum equity than usual, sure, but the idea we should preemptively policy her for gamehealth in a game where she is doing nothing wrong is disgusting to me.

I don't think it is a puzzle why I looked in previous treatments of the same player as a contrast in behavior. I explicitly found it scummy, and the response suggesting it is at least partially arbitrary, depending on your personal whim to extend mercy game to game, is not reassuring either way. I recognize that you provided a game-related reason for WH13.

[Prism]

It is unreasonable. Mastina is a human being and another player who has every much of a right to be here as either of us, and nothing she has done this game has suggested otherwise.

I don't have to like her or respect her play/philosophy on the game to believe this.

If you think I'm shitting the discussion from her being scum, then okay, but I absolutely take issue with this. Standing up for players right to be here and play the game should not be a point of debate and is not AI. This is disgusting to me on a moral level.

[Prism]

I'm done with my moral grandstanding but I vehemently oppose that aspect of voting mastina.

[Prism]

I am saying Mastina is scum... And also her playstyle needs a yeet out of this game to learn a lesson.

Infact this is a lesson that Prism taught me in an argument we were having so I don't know why Prism is so upset.

I don't know what you're referring to here specifically. My guess is that it is my discussion of how the site meta has not adapted to figure out how to punish hyperposters, which was not encouraging policying them but for the site to strategically come up with ways to counteract or circumvent its effectiveness.

For any other reason, I am not above using threat of a policy as an incentive to change behavior midgame, and I have my own problems with not treating players with an adequate level of respect that to be frank is happening with a disturbingly increased frequency. While circumstantially different, those were still wrong and I would have appreciated intervention.

That said, regardless of source, if the lesson you learned from me is to policy players whose playstyle you dislike, even before they become a problem, I sincerely wish that you unlearn it as quickly as possible.

I want to make that clear but really don't want to continue this further as the conversation has shifted to be more about the substantive issues with the slot. Feel free to take the last word but unless you explicitly require a response from me I will leave it there.

[Prism]

It's okay Reckoner will forget about her since it's not like she's a real person who was excited to play anyway

[Prism]

I don't have any comments about the mechanics or quality of the game.

I was extremely disappointed in the moderation this game. Time and time again Cakez failed to intervene to protect his players, substituting it for warnings that were blatantly ignored as it was clear they had no teeth behind them. There were too many moments to list, but suffice to say that the moderation team felt 2 bans were warranted as a result of this game while Cakez did not feel they were even worth a forcereplacement. I will openly comment on Reck's since I was one of the reporting parties and gave Cakez a lot of feedback privately, which I felt went nowhere.

I do not feel comfortable signing up for a game moderated by Cakez ever again. He let down and failed to protect multiple players this game, both before and after replaceout, and failed to intervene in even the most egregious scenarios that took place after my replaceout.

Even in a world in which Reck didn't deserve to be forcereplaced for flaming Merlot, the fact that he celebrated and was gleeful and unrepentant publicly in thread about causing 1/2 replaceouts - who could no longer post or respond to his victory lap- was revolting and absolutely deserved a forcereplacement/ban.

[Prism]

(And somehow, without delving too much into the others, Reck was the lightest offender of the bunch)

[Prism]

I understand your perspective for why you chose not to forcereplace them and appreciated the response; at some point we simply disagree which is why I did not continue it via PM. The purpose of my post is that I wanted to make it clear that failing to protect your players has consequences that do not disappear when the game is over: that people will both replace out, and consecutively not sign up for, your games in the future.

This does not extend to you as a player or person, and is only speaking for myself (and no one else) on you as a moderator.

[Prism]

Skimming the dead PT, I also want to take a moment to quote this.

I am saying Mastina is scum... And also her playstyle needs a yeet out of this game to learn a lesson.

Infact this is a lesson that Prism taught me in an argument we were having so I don't know why Prism is so upset.

I don't know what you're referring to here specifically. My guess is that it is my discussion of how the site meta has not adapted to figure out how to punish hyperposters,

which was not encouraging policying them but for the site to strategically come up with ways to counteract or circumvent its effectiveness.

For any other reason, I am not above using threat of a policy as an incentive to change behavior midgame, and I have my own problems with not treating players with an adequate level of respect that to be frank is happening with a disturbingly increased frequency. While circumstantially different, those were still wrong and I would have appreciated intervention.

That said, regardless of source, if the lesson you learned from me is to policy players whose playstyle you dislike, even before they become a problem, I sincerely wish that you unlearn it as quickly as possible.

I want to make that clear but really don't want to continue this further as the conversation has shifted to be more about the substantive issues with the slot. Feel free to take the last word but unless you explicitly require a response from me I will leave it there.

My perspective is unchanged. If that was your takeaway from our conversation it is unfortunate.

[Prism]

I have said what I wanted to and have no further comment for either of your questions.

[Prism]

It is not surprising that the players who chose to continue to play do not put those moments as memorable. I am saying that not to critique those who stuck it out, but to point out that if only the rest were so lucky.

[Prism]

Scum PT wild

[Prism]

Kodak? That's where Pitbull played in Alaska, right?

On another note taking nail color suggestions thanks