Team Mafia 2021 Information

[Thestatusquo]

more thoughts: please add more scumsided setups next year. having a whole team of 4 behind you adds another dimension to the game and like makes it inherently more townsided in that regard. people who roll scum shouldn't be effectively boned in that regard. literally every setup here was won by town, and only 1 was like considered closed in that regard and that was the large theme and id say that was largely carried by FL nearly hardcarrying a win.

make town work for it.

and like perhaps a more dynamic points system for each side - so that you get *some* points when you do advance your wincon. Like if you lose as town, you still get *some* points if you manage to lim some town, and for scum you get more points the longer you keep the game going with x amount of scum or something. maybe just thoughts for the future. hope to play next year and not get banned in the middle of the games tho! definitely will have reformed koba playing then

I agree with this generally speaking. I think the two main pain points of team mafia are a) its much harder for scum than a traditional game and b) its very all or nothing where winning is the only thing that matters and players can play great and not get any benefit from it which snowballs for scum with point a.

Not sure exactly how to switch that up but I think its definitely an issue. As a partner I don't agree that FL played well but also I'm definitely not willing to get into that as I'd be very happy to not play with/interact with him ever again.

[Thestatusquo]

Despite having the best team ever, I hated my game due to certain individual(s) - primarily one - making it over the top toxic and unplayable. I never ever want to have to ever go through that again. TM needs to have a much lower threshold of stopping toxicity in games.

Nancy I really wanted to enjoy playing with you but I think you added an amount of toxicity to that game with the way you play where you immediately assume that you're obviously town and then go after anyone who even begins to dare question it. At one point in our game you even demanded an apology from someone for suggesting that you had the slightest possibility of being scum. Thats not playing mafia, and it made the game really fucking unfun to play for me.

Like I said I wanted to enjoy playing with you but I didn't because of that.

I want to say the way pine talked to other players in our game was pretty unacceptable and toxic as well, responding to players who were in good faith arguing against him to "shut the fuck up" repeatedly.

I don't understand when playing mafia became less about actually playing mafia and more about shouting as loud as you can and being as rude as you can to people who don't agree with you/suspect you but there were several players in that game who just made it supremely exhausting to open the thread and I really wish that those players would take a second to think about what the point of mafia is and whether winning the game by making it extremely unfun to play is actually worth it. I get this is team mafia and I get that the stakes are high and I get that everyone is try harding but at the end of the day I found that game extremely miserable despite the fact that I thought it was going well for most of it and by the end of it I was just extremely checked out (and would have replaced out if not for it being team mafia) because it was just downright awful to play.

I'm sad about that because I was really excited to play it and even more excited when I rolled scum but at the end of the day it was one of the worst play experiences I've ever experienced on this site and I hope every player in that game takes a second to evaluate what they possibly did to contribute to that.

[Thestatusquo]

As a brief plug, now that TM is over dogs vs cats is going to go back into signups soon and I've added specific rules against what I would call toxicity that were inspired from this team mafia experience. I would suggest more mods adopt them because ultimately mafia is supposed to be fun and this wasn't for me.

[Thestatusquo]

Congrats to the winners through: Well deserved. Team mafia is fucking hard and coming out on top is awesome.

[Thestatusquo]

Nancy regardless of my specific example I am saying to you, one human being to another that I found your playstyle really unpleasant to be in a game with.

You can ignore that if you prefer, but I'm just trying to express to you that I didn't like playing with you and that I felt like the way you were playing the game made it unfun for me. I'm not really interested in having a huge argument about it and I think you're an enjoyable person outside of the context of mafia games and I'm not trying to attack you, I'm trying to give feedback from how I, personally, felt playing in a mafia game with you. FL was extremely toxic. Pine was extremely toxic. I felt like the way you played also increased the toxicity of the game. You can take that information and do whatever you like with it.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm not making a point, Nancy. I'm expressing how you made me feel.

[Thestatusquo]

Like if you want to talk about it my DMs are open both here and on discord. I want to underscore again that I really hope you don't read this as an attack. its not intended as one.

[Thestatusquo]

I agree that the way that FL and pine played was wrong and made the game awful but I feel that there was a lot independent of that which you did which contributed to the toxicity.

[Thestatusquo]

And norwee made a very similar point in the game thread which you also just brushed away which is why I felt compelled to post this in the first place.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm asking you to try to view it through my POV instead of through yours because I think that might be helpful to you, but I understand if perhaps its too recent and raw for you to do that.

[Thestatusquo]

I dont think I've ever claimed to suffer from CPTSD, but rather from depression and anxiety.

If someone saying to you "the thing you did was harmful" is triggering to you I am sorry for causing harm but at the same time that does not alleviate you from the responsibility of causing harm yourself.

[Thestatusquo]

I've said what I want to say. If you want to ignore it thats on you, but if want at the end of a game 3 of the other players in the game to not express that they found your behavior hurtful you'll maybe listen to me instead of attacking them as trying to bully you.

I will not be responding any further. Take care of yourself.

[Thestatusquo]

Guess i can’t complain about townbias then.

I think you can in the sense that I think the balance in these games just simply doesn't account for the fact that it is much harder to win as scum than it is to win as town in team mafia.

[Thestatusquo]

I mean we don't have a huge amount of data and what we do have is kind of noisy (slightly different rules, etc) but it does suggest that the town win rate in team mafia games is somewhere in the 70s or 80s which is probably not acceptable.

[Thestatusquo]

I think it was pretty troubling that the town was basically able to crack the setup in multiple games this year based on mod meta and past versions of those games. I think that this sort of mod predictability plays a huge role in how those setups play in a game where there are 50 people trying to do setup spec instead of 8.

[Thestatusquo]

I think its not necessarily that hard to make setups that are hard to crack, I think mods don't really bother. I think in general a lot of mods end up conforming to a meta of what players expect and it makes it trivially easy to suss out a setup.

[Thestatusquo]

my game for one had one of the most obvious setups I've ever seen.