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[Mewtaph]

Hey everyone.

VOTE: Salsabil Faria

Applying additional pressure here. Results of said pressure to be determined.

[Mewtaph]

VOTE: T3

One of these days I'll be right. Going by the math

Sounds like you two have history. Anything we should know about T3's town game? I trust that you'll be able to read them particularly well.. unless..

[Mewtaph]

I have to admit, I saw that one coming. Naked votes don't give me much to personally work off of, though.

[Mewtaph]

@ChaosOmega: I don't know about likely to get votes, but talking about pressure in the way that I did in my first post does create a potential scenario for votes to come in my direction. Said scenario happened, now the way that it happened being AI or not is up for debate (I'll hold off on commenting on that for now).

10 is a bit directed and selfish for my own read purposes, I'm not going to overjustify it this early on. It is a vote and it is perhaps an easy justification for a vote. When it comes to pretty much every game, I want the game to move away from RVS which is why I made that vote the way that I did.

@Datisi: 12 may seem forced. However, more posts as far as I'm concerned brings the game in a direction further away from RVS which is the spirit of what I created 12 in. I do anticipate how it can come off as forced solvy but prior to that point the thread was still in RVS. 12 wasn't on my mind when I made 10. Looking for spaces to squeeze potential areas to move away from RVS, however, it seeme a reasonable place to start ias any n addition to my first vote to try and get the game state moving.

[Mewtaph]

Me being aware that my posts can draw votes I don't think is necessarily AI.

Just me knowing how other players generally respond to my play.

I don't think that I do particularly well under pressure as either alignment, to be honest. At least, it's harder to be analytical-solvy when you're the biggest wagon in the game.

[Mewtaph]

Lol, page 1 just unloading the cannon.

I actually didn't like 10 more, I was voting for that before I was sniped. It reads like cautious scum, they want to make a vote to build a wagon and force pressure to look town but don't want to step on any toes, so they pull all the teeth from the vote saying it's for pressure and they're not sure what for.

I'm continuing to be selfish here in not explaining my full thought process behind the vote but I don't think stating that you're applying additional pressure necessarily removes the teeth away from the vote. Nor do I have the intention of building a wagon, either. If that was my intention then I wouldn't have made the vote in the way that I did.

[Mewtaph]

Also, you're getting the

pressure

you think I should get which is ironically funny atm

It's not really funny because you're taking it "poorly", as in adding unnecessary comments/gestures such as yawning at my vote post. Nothing to yawn about a vote, and I haven't yawned at anyone voting me. Evidently I think you're more likely to be town than not because I don't think mafia!you steps on my toes as boldly as you have but I've been wrong before. Don't think I'm wrong here though. Of all reactions I could have gotten yours is at least AI.

[Mewtaph]

@Salsabil Faria: Sure. I know that voting somebody with a reason of "applying pressure" is redundant. I got what I wanted out of the vote, which was a reaction out of you. I feel confident enough in my town lean on you to move my vote.

VOTE: Roden
I didn't know the game was bastard...

This vote is essentially null. I'd like to see you move your vote sometime soon (even if that person happens to be me). This vote could just as easily gone to T3 in my eyes.

VOTE: Dwlee99

[Mewtaph]

Evidently I think you're more likely to be town than not because I don't think mafia!you steps on my toes as boldly as you have but I've been wrong before.

in what way does salsa's posts towards you make you think it's unlikely to be scum stepping on toes, that doesn't make you feel so from me/omega?

also, can was there a reason you picked her - taking a cursory glance at your topics, i don't see you've played together before?

It felt unnecessarily stand-offish. Scum can accomplish the same outcome (ie. reaching the conclusion of voting me) without navigating it the way that they did.

I chose her because of all places I could place my vote at the time, 1) this applied genuine pressure at the time, 2 votes being the largest wagon possible. This limited my options to a few people already. From there, I guess you could say it's a guessing game. I could be wrong about my read, as I have gotten similar reactions from both town and mafia. It depends on how things develop from here.

[Mewtaph]

VOTE: innocentvillager

[Mewtaph]

Margot/Mewtaph/Kyouko? is where I think scum is

Vote me then.

[Mewtaph]

[Mewtaph]

Evidently I think you're more likely to be town than not because I don't think mafia!you steps on my toes as boldly as you have but I've been wrong before.

in what way does salsa's posts towards you make you think it's unlikely to be scum stepping on toes, that doesn't make you feel so from me/omega?

also, can was there a reason you picked her - taking a cursory glance at your topics, i don't see you've played together before?

It felt unnecessarily stand-offish. Scum can accomplish the same outcome (ie. reaching the conclusion of voting me) without navigating it the way that they did.

I chose her because of all places I could place my vote at the time, 1) this applied genuine pressure at the time, 2 votes being the largest wagon possible. This limited my options to a few people already. From there, I guess you could say it's a guessing game. I could be wrong about my read, as I have gotten similar reactions from both town and mafia. It depends on how things develop from here.

Placing a 2nd vote on someone on page 1 with the reason "Applying additional pressure here. Results of said pressure to be determined" does not apply "genuine pressure". Your last game I see, you were town and entered the game with a naked vote on a building wagon. That can actually build pressure. What you've done this game looks fake.

On an unrelated note Mewtaph, what do you think of Margot?

----

ssbm, what is your read on Mewtaph, and what are your thoughts on the iv wagon forming?

I don't want to get stuck on something that happened on page 2-3. All I'll say is this: I think we're referring to different types of pressure here. I got what I wanted out of my vote, arguably more than I bargained for since we seemed to have moved out of RVS almost immediately after that post. If this causes others to scumread me then fine.

I like Margot's intention to do a dive and post a reads list. Do I actually like Margot as town is a different situation entirely and something I'm still going to have to decide on in the posts to come.

[Mewtaph]

I like SF's post on datsi being town. I have similar experiences with datsi/Gamma, though I don't think I've ever been exposed to their scum game, so while this is probably within their scum radius I'm inclined to read them as town for now. Could change.

[Mewtaph]

Oh, so it's a serious vote then. Alright.

There are a few players being cautious around locking in as town too early, T3 and Datisi. I think both are townier than not right now but that also just gives me pause.

I don't like ssbm_Kyouko's reasoning for their vote in their last post because trying to meta someone you haven't really played with doesn't really work. Or at least the meta read is going to be shallow as I know that it is wrong here. I know that you replaced into my scum slot but you haven't really engaged with me as players with me being scum and you being town so for you to call me on a scumtell is a little bit unsettling.

I don't understand Margot's scumread on me either. I wasn't exactly trying to do a galaxy brain play, just trying to move the game out of RVS. I'm not exactly sure what's to dislike about my posts directed to Salsabil Faria specifically. Is it because they come off as forced or something else entirely? I have no clue, just that they don't like my posts and that they don't like the AtE coming from my slot (which I don't really spot, but okay).

Of all the votes on me, ChaosOmega's vote makes the most sense to me and he has explained why he thinks my opening comes off poorly and I can see why. Overall though there's just not enough content in his ISO for me to feel comfortable giving him a solidified read. Similarly, Aristeia is in the same boat. Just not enough posts for me to feel comfortable giving a settled read on. Hopefully that changes by the end of the day.

[Mewtaph]

VOTE: ssbm_Kyouko

[Mewtaph]

There are a few players being cautious around locking in as town too early, T3 and Datisi. I think both are townier than not right now but that also just gives me pause.

does this mean that you read us as town, but you're cautious about committing to the read? if so, what about us is giving you pause (and what do you find townie about t3?)? if that's not what you meant, can you rephrase?

First question - yes. What's giving me pause is scumranges. As much as I'd like to lock my townreads in confidently and move on I think I'll find it hard to do so this game specifically with your two slots. The reason I'm townreading T3 - a level of engagement or disengagement with the game that I think comes off as townie and is hard, but not impossible to replicate as scum. Datisi, your play similarly is also most likely within your scum range but I think it's hard to keep your level of gamesolving up as scum without pushing yourself into a corner eventually. I haven't played with T3 before but it seems that other players that have played with him before (Margot) are giving him credit for his scumgame so I'm doing the same.

[Mewtaph]

1 like = 1 thank

My instinct upon seeing this is noting how there's no sense of urgency here to address my post. Seems like something town!Kyouko would be interested in addressing, while scum!Kyouko is more comfortable with leaving it in the air so their vote remains occupied on me (and not elsewhere in the gamestate).

[Mewtaph]

i find it a bit odd that you're thinking in terms of scumranges when you've never seen scum!me (or town!me for that matter) before? unless you've done your research on me, i'd assume you don't know what my scumgame is like, so why the thought around it?

The thought around it is because I've played heavy on day 1 solving as scum before to the point where I entangle myself to the point where I can't "gamesolve" in a genuine sense anymore (pushing wagons on innocents to forward win con). I don't know what your scumgame is like, but I am approaching with caution. Not to the point where I'm going to try and find every way your posts can be interpreted from a mafia perspective, but to the point where I'm not operating around you being locked in as rown (which I think is more likely than not) in the off chance that you aren't.

[Mewtaph]

Not following Kyouko. Quick check on a few of my scumgames (including the one where you replaced in) and I don't see the same tell that you're seeing. Nor was I interested in being centre stage for leaving RVS but we'll play into that for now. If you're town genuinely believing to have found a scumtell I don't expect to to change your mind at this point, but I don't exactly feel that town!you would insist on this scumtelll this hard considering it isn't an actual scumtell (I'm town this game and this tell seems more like a take on what happened this game except my intention wasn't even to make a big deal about leaving RVS). It would make more sense if you didn't try to add the meta part to it honestly.

[Mewtaph]

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=69588
This is the newbie where ssbm_Kyouko replaced in my slot for reference.

[Mewtaph]

Please clarify what pressure you applied with your posting, and how this is different than pressure that I am referring to.

There's wagon pressure and there's vote pressure. My vote wasn't threatening a wagon, it was invoking a reaction. I got said reaction. That's all.

- Why wouldn't you address Margot's read on you in her read list when I asked you about her in 271?

Didn't think of much of it at the time or at least I have doubts that discussion between me and Margot would be productive seeing as she has me as her biggest scumread for "galaxy brain takes" but has Datisi as a strong town read under the same term. Just means that how I continue to post will continue to ping her as scummy.

If I didn't think that discussion would likely be productive towards me and another player, withholding that information and just observing so I can try to get a better read on Margot seems like a better line of play imo, but also slightly pointless now because they were busy and didn't post much so I ended up posting it anyway, mostly because I was pushed for reads by IC. If I had it my way I wouldn't even post reads at that particular point truthfully.

- How can you say here "I'm not exactly sure what's to dislike about my posts directed to Salsabil Faria specifically" when you said in 15/19 that you saw the possibility to receive votes for your post directed to Salsabil Faria?

What I'm referring to here are the posts that Margot refers to during her read on me in 199: where Margot refers to 39 and 48 for her read. What I said in 15 still stands and I'm not trying to deny it here.

- You criticize ssbm for using meta against you, but I also used meta against you in 271. Why push her and not me for it?

Yours made sense to me: you referring to building pressure and how I did that in a town game and how I'm not doing it here. ssbm's doesn't sit well with me for reasons I explained. That being said they explained it enough at this point where I have to accept that they're probably going to be stuck on me for the forseeable future.

[Mewtaph]

There are a few players being cautious around locking in as town too early, T3 and Datisi. I think both are townier than not right now but that also just gives me pause.

does this mean that you read us as town, but you're cautious about committing to the read? if so, what about us is giving you pause (and what do you find townie about t3?)? if that's not what you meant, can you rephrase?

First question - yes. What's giving me pause is scumranges. As much as I'd like to lock my townreads in confidently and move on I think I'll find it hard to do so this game specifically with your two slots. The reason I'm townreading T3 - a level of engagement or disengagement with the game that I think comes off as townie and is hard, but not impossible to replicate as scum. Datisi, your play similarly is also most likely within your scum range but I think it's hard to keep your level of gamesolving up as scum without pushing yourself into a corner eventually. I haven't played with T3 before but it seems that other players that have played with him before (Margot) are giving him credit for his scumgame so I'm doing the same.

Disengagement on day 1 is actually pretty strongly indicative for me because meta

Figured.

[Mewtaph]

So I explained why I voted Kyouko when I did but I'm not really feeling that scum!Kyouko pushes forth post 420. I don't think that wagon is going anywhere either, however I also don't particularly think that IV's entrance is scum indicative. Keeping my vote off the table for now.

UNVOTE:

[Mewtaph]

Please don't make me explain that. I feel like I'll have to at some point due to how many people are scumreading me so I'll explain both right now. It seems unlikely for scum!Kyouko to push a scum-tell on me knowing that I'm town. I hate explaining this because it's only really applicable from my perspective but I'm probably going to have to explain it at some point anyway. I don't think a weak entrance from IV is necessarily scum indicative either; if anything I'm slightly townleaning them for it.

There, I paid my dues.

[Mewtaph]

There are a few players being cautious around locking in as town too early, T3 and Datisi. I think both are townier than not right now but that also just gives me pause.

does this mean that you read us as town, but you're cautious about committing to the read? if so, what about us is giving you pause (and what do you find townie about t3?)? if that's not what you meant, can you rephrase?

First question - yes. What's giving me pause is scumranges. As much as I'd like to lock my townreads in confidently and move on I think I'll find it hard to do so this game specifically with your two slots. The reason I'm townreading T3 - a level of engagement or disengagement with the game that I think comes off as townie and is hard, but not impossible to replicate as scum. Datisi, your play similarly is also most likely within your scum range but I think it's hard to keep your level of gamesolving up as scum without pushing yourself into a corner eventually. I haven't played with T3 before but it seems that other players that have played with him before (Margot) are giving him credit for his scumgame so I'm doing the same.

So you trust

MR

's read/observation on

T3

? If so, can you tell me why? It’s confusing because I don’t think you have

MR

as a townread yet?

I reached T3 being townie on my own terms. I am not townreading MR right now, no.

[Mewtaph]

1 like = 1 thank

My instinct upon seeing this is noting how there's no sense of urgency here to address my post. Seems like something town!Kyouko would be interested in addressing, while scum!Kyouko is more comfortable with leaving it in the air so their vote remains occupied on me (and not elsewhere in the gamestate).

Don't get it either

I'm speaking to urgency to address my post (332 at the time). Votes on me bad from my perspective as either alignment, but I'd rather avoid people tunneling me... also as both alignments. Under Kyouko's read on me having scumtold this game as correct, if my intention was to build town-cred through 10 and 12, I certainly did a pretty poor job at it.

[Mewtaph]

Uhh.. yeah I just realised that one of the games that ssbm_Kyouko is referring to, the Birds of Paradise game, within the first page I was instantly reminded of a major contributing factor as to why I siteflaked. The meta is interesting but wrong unfortunately. Like Kyouko is trying to piece together how I feel about the RVS stage based on what I've said in a single game where I wasn't even invested in the game at all. The whole scumtell of trying to get towncred I can buy into, but I don't really feel like that's specific to me, and if I did attempt to get towncred in this game I definitely failed to considering how many people voted me and how many people continue to vote me.

[Mewtaph]

The amount of tiles I have been tunneled based on how I play or type is kind of ridiculous. But the way mykonian handled that game was easily among the worst.

[Mewtaph]

times*

[Mewtaph]

Hmm... I want to see what Mew's response for this. Their play style is confusing to me. But I agree, I also felt that they wanted the towncred for moving the game forward from the RVS but at the same time, it attracts attention
where I can't wrapping my head around it. If they're gamble type scum players, then it makes sense ig.

I feel like I've responded to the parts I can really respond to as best as I can, but if there's anything in particular that you want me to address, feel free to point me in that direction.

Speaking of Mewtaph, specifically what I found in his meta is that as scum he has made a big deal of getting the game out of RVS.

Like, this is as far as I can really respond up to. This honestly reads more like just what I did this game except I don't really care about it either (leaving RVS, yes, great, but "claiming" that for towncred or as what good has come out of my posts I don't really give a shit about).

It was a newbie game from a long time ago but he hasn't played many games. I think he's still new to scum and that this is still a viable tell. *puts on a tinfoil hat* Now for the juicy bit. Datisi coming into the game swinging on Mewtaph's opener could be a partner interaction. My theory is that Mewtaph came into the PT and voiced that he is new and/or uncomfortable playing scum. Datisi strikes me as a good scum player (have not metad them yet, but I get the vibe from their posting that they would be good at it), and I think that they could have planned for Datisi to make the push early and veer off in order to discourage wagons later in D1 and build cred for Datisi at the same time.

This is a scenario specific to a scum!me and scum!Datisi scenario, so in other words largely a waste of time unless they're planning on pushing that further on D1.

I feel like when someone was a wagon early and their wagon dissipates that town is often hesitant to revisit the first wagon unless they've exhausted other scumreads and realized "hey, my original read might have been right because all these other players I've tried to pressure today are towntelling."

All that said, Datisi could have just sniped Mewtaph's ass and I'm not convinced Datisi is scum with Mewtaph. Just wanted to share this.

This is more of a general statement and one that even I'd agree with, except I don't think that there's any hesitation when it comes to people voting my slot lol.

I do like 420 though in terms of Kyouko being town but 382 alone doesn't really convince me that they're town. Though in any case I don't think I'm the target audience of these posts anyway.

[Mewtaph]

Hmm... I want to see what Mew's response for this. Their play style is confusing to me. But I agree, I also felt that they wanted the towncred for moving the game forward from the RVS but at the same time, it attracts attention
where I can't wrapping my head around it. If they're gamble type scum players, then it makes sense ig.

I feel like I've responded to the parts I can really respond to as best as I can, but if there's anything in particular that you want me to address, feel free to point me in that direction.

Nah, you don't have to which means I'm more confused lol, not your fault though... I usually face tough time to read certain types of play style, you're one of them atm. Let's see what happens next....

What your stance on other players atm?

Lots of townreads. Not very many scumreads, which is slightly concerning. I do want to give the players that have been voting my slot the space to breathe a little bit so I can get a more settled read on them, but it's moving quite slowly to be honest. Been waiting on ChaosOmega/Margot to give more to work off of for a while now.

[Mewtaph]

I'm curious actually, as to how many people have my in their lunch plans between now and D2. Seems like a lot of people at this point.

[Mewtaph]

Lynch. plans.

[Mewtaph]

L****. plans.

We don't use that word on site anymore

Oh, okay.

[Mewtaph]

Sooo that flashwagon happened and I'm reading IV as pretty hard town after that.

[Mewtaph]

Sooo that flashwagon happened and I'm reading IV as pretty hard town after that.

Yeah same, I think it's TvT between

iv

and

Datisi

.
What do you think about

T3

and

MR

's vote on

iv

? I'm always paranoid about

T3

,

MR

's putting them E-1 not liking it, on the other hand

Aris

also vote

iv

which I don’t know if it’s buss or not.... My brain will explode anytime soon!

MR's vote is a lot worse than T3's.

[Mewtaph]

Not to say that T3's vote is bad. I think his vote is fine actually.

[Mewtaph]

and if I did attempt to get towncred in this game I definitely failed to considering how many people voted me and how many people continue to vote me.

this is a very meh argument

Wasn't an argument but alright.

[Mewtaph]

Mewtaph’s posts seem kind of secretive which is +town

could you describe where you're seeing this

Salsabil Faria asked something similar to me but the real reason why you're scumreading me is...? All I know is that you do. Haven't seen why anywhere yet.

[Mewtaph]

I'm going to need an answer to 628. I don't care if you don't townread me. But you've had this scumread on me for a while now so you should be able to explain why.

[Mewtaph]

@datsi: You've had a resistance to voting me in the past which I find really odd because of all your scumreads I'm the one that's most likely to head into the direction of an elimination. And even if that's not the case now, it was in the past (at the time where you resisted voting for me).

[Mewtaph]

You’ve felt very reactive thus far

... Is that all.. or?

[Mewtaph]

Mewtaph’s posts seem kind of secretive which is +town

Not following?

I've found that quietly solving the game and making a point of not telling people what your reads are usually comes form town.

You learn that by seeing yourself play?
Also idk if the description you gave fits what Mew has been doing

How would you describe what I'm doing (take 2 of trying to get you to explain your read on me)?

[Mewtaph]

Mewtaph’s posts seem kind of secretive which is +town

Not following?

I've found that quietly solving the game and making a point of not telling people what your reads are usually comes form town.

You learn that by seeing yourself play?
Also idk if the description you gave fits what Mew has been doing

How would you describe what I'm doing (take 2 of trying to get you to explain your read on me)?

I missed 684. Never mind, ignore this.

[Mewtaph]

pedit: Mewtaph I haven't formed a read yet. I think I was scum with him a long time ago either in a newbie or a micro so I'll be looking into that at some point.

I'm inclined to townlean just because of the wagon on him but that's not good enough to take him off the table D1 so I'll still have to read.

@ssbm_Kyouko: Can you explain this townlean after finding out that Roden is IC and Salsabil faria being your strongest town read? If those two are true, on what basis were you inclined to townlean me for the wagon as you describe in 272?

[Mewtaph]

I can't wait for the tell to be something wrong

[Mewtaph]

Mewtaph’s posts seem kind of secretive which is +town

Not following?

I've found that quietly solving the game and making a point of not telling people what your reads are usually comes form town.

You learn that by seeing yourself play?
Also idk if the description you gave fits what Mew has been doing

How would you describe what I'm doing (take 2 of trying to get you to explain your read on me)?

I missed 684. Never mind, ignore this.

I'm sick, will play when feel better.

Alright, get better soon.

[Mewtaph]

Did not mean to quote that. Whoops.

[Mewtaph]

VOTE: Margot
DIE SCUM DIE!

Can you explain your read on Margot at this point in time? Preferably with detail.

[Mewtaph]

Also, how has your read on Margot progressed from that point to now?

[Mewtaph]

@Mew, idk if I got to it but I can’t really put my feelings on you from early on any other way. You feel more proactive now though at least.

I understand. A lot of my content has been reactive until recently. Not necessarily by choice but still.

[Mewtaph]

Datisi, datsi, T3, ssbm_Kyouko, innocentvillager, Salsabil Faria, Dwlee99.
^ my town read list.

[Mewtaph]

Margot is kind of close to a TR but I need more. I don't know how to describe it. I do think she's more likely town than not though.

[Mewtaph]

Margot is kind of close to a TR but I need more. I don't know how to describe it. I do think she's more likely town than not though.

Actually I take that back. I don't know lol.

[Mewtaph]

Datisi, datsi, T3, ssbm_Kyouko, innocentvillager, Salsabil Faria, Dwlee99.
^ my town read list.

the tldr on datsi/iv/salsa/dwlee? sorry if you explained already, just link if you have (or alternatively yell at me to find it myself)

datsi - consistently town-pinging me, similar read to T3 in that I think their level of engagement/disengagement is hard to fake as scum, I also think they've had weird hesitances around my slot which I think is more likely to come from town than scum
IV - weak entrance I feel is a risky move as scum, but they did it anyway. I also feel like the back and forth between you and IV was a risk that IV kind of walked into, whereas I think scum!IV generally tries to maintain focus on their genuine frustration and limiting/avoiding interaction with other players while in that state.
salsa - I thought their posts were more likely to come from town than scum early on, the way that they've handled my slot feels townie. their reads are also quite fluid in a way that comes off as town trying to sort out the game rather than scum trying to appear townier for posting read lists or something (idk, just an example scum motivation)
Dwlee99 - I think that their interaction with you was weird but genuine. They've also showed initiative with pushing their vote onto me early game but their solve doesn't include me as scum. I see myself as a reasonably likely ML so for scum to come up with that list without me in it seems bold but mostly unnecessary. Dwlee99 feels town here most of the time. not all of the time but most of the time

[Mewtaph]

I think that their interaction with you was weird but genuine.

referring to p3

[Mewtaph]

Oh I'm listening.

[Mewtaph]

I was rereading some things in the mean time and I spotted a potential partner interaction. Just going to stay quiet about it for now and see how it plays out from here.

[Mewtaph]

Margot is kind of close to a TR but I need more. I don't know how to describe it. I do think she's more likely town than not though.

Margot is kind of close to a TR but I need more. I don't know how to describe it. I do think she's more likely town than not though.

Actually I take that back. I don't know lol.

what happened between these two posts?

I realised I don't really TR Margot at all.

[Mewtaph]

IV: 277 pretty much sums up my stance. I'm still trying to get a more settled read on Margot but there's also only so much time in the day for me to do that before I have to decide on a read.

[Mewtaph]

VOTE: MargotRosa

Yeah I'm kind of not up for waiting 24-48 hrs just for 786 and 787 again.

[Mewtaph]

okay
i feel like i'm struggling this game because a lot of slots fall into the "you did some not good and not bad and all together it's a mess" category of reads and that's bad

@aristeia, what's your reads looking like right now? thoughts on iv since his recent batch of posts? townreading everyone outside of your solve, or?

I'm not exactly sure where your reads are but I can do more if that'll help your read on me. I think I would approach this game similarly as scum though I don't really give a shit about town accurately solving the game as long as me and preferably my partner's look like they have longevity in the game. It seems my town reads aren't consolidating so okay, here is a longer post.

T3 seems more like a hub for all the scum players to park their vote. Now I don't actually think everyone voting them is scum but I think he's largely a distraction.

On Kyouko, I read what you wrote on them and I largely agree if that makes sense. I don't know if my townreads exactly lines up in the realm of things scum!Kyouko wouldn't do and I want to relook my read there at some point, maybe even D1 if you're specifically looking there for potential scum.

I actually like Aristeia's slot. I don't really want to lynch there today.

datsi's whole comment about 5/7 got me thinking, but not really against T3. I still don't understand why people are scumreading T3. I read all the posts regarding him I think. There's residue reasoning from the start of the game as vibes/gut and it's nearing the point of the day where you actually need to make a decision. Given the reasoning I'm not exactly sure how I'm supposed to ever vote T3 here from my stance on them.

And Roden, you can discredit the people voting Margot but you know that calling that wagon the scum team is incredulous. Or maybe it's not, maybe you really think that all three of us are scum waging Margot but if you think that lol whatever.

[Mewtaph]

Frankly it doesn't particularly seem that anyone has a strong read on Margot (but she got some early votes for her early ISO). If your read isn't that consolidated on Margot, then a wagon being there seems pretty productive imo. At least more productive than me keeping my vote on no-one but it's not exactly like the time we have in the day is infinite so yes I'm going to vote a slot I'm not sure about to hopefully kick them into high gear. Now that doesn't actually seem likely so if that's the case can we talk more at least so we can get a better idea of where our heads are at in terms of day 1 scumreads? If not scumreads, then strong townreads please. Doesn't need to be a comprehensive read list on the game.

[Mewtaph]

IV also just never goes to ELo without a confirmed inno on him, because if he's town then he'll be mis-elim bait for the rest of the game.

Why? So because there are people scumreading IV suddenly his longevity in the game should be relegated to "doesn't reach late game"? That's the kind of policy that N_M should have except not even because IV has done enough readable things to be read. If you don't have a take on IV after what they've done today that seems crazy to me.

[Mewtaph]

I don't have a lot of experience playing with IV so I am kind of relying on your experience here, however I don't think he's posted anything that makes me think he is trying to be active in advancing the game state - it's mostly "how dare you vote me" AtE which is very bleh to me.

Exactly why we need to run him up and get an actual claim out of him. I don't like that Mew and T3 wanted IV out until he was brought into claim range, but then got cold feet and swapped over to Margot therefore making all of their pressure pointless and showy. If they want to keep fake pressuring people we can 100% just vote T3 or Mew instead, as I don't see any reason to vote out Margot before any of the three that are voting her.

Fake pressuring people. Alright, nah. I didn't even want IV out so check your narrative. Except it's not even a narrative because you're IC, you're just wrong. Sigh.

[Mewtaph]

There isn't much of a case, three scum read players are just consolidating their votes on Margot.

This post right here. But in any case what use is a back and forth between me and IC really going to accomplish? Particularly because you've been quite deeply set in scumreading me this game. If you're going to discredit what I do then yes it is a bit of a problem on my end and I'm going to at least comment on the fact that you're actively discrediting my slot (discredited more than just once). Do I actually think this back and forth is very productive? No, not really.

[Mewtaph]

IV also just never goes to ELo without a confirmed inno on him, because if he's town then he'll be mis-elim bait for the rest of the game.

Why? So because there are people scumreading IV suddenly his longevity in the game should be relegated to "doesn't reach late game"? That's the kind of policy that N_M should have except not even because IV has done enough readable things to be read. If you don't have a take on IV after what they've done today that seems crazy to me.

I gave my take on IV. He's done fuck all to scum hunt or solve the game, he's AtE'd us all to hell and back, and he's been wagon'd twice and has had immediate massive resistance to said wagons each time.

Massive resistance is a bit of a retell but I'll just let this sit. I'll restate: I don't think this is very productive. We're just going to have to agree to disagree and depending on how other players respond to this then I may have to revisit what was said here.

[Mewtaph]

I feel like communicating with you further is anti-town. I don't care if you scumread me for it, communicating with you feels shit and I'd rather not do it.

[Mewtaph]

You are part of that reason, by the way. Not the IC part.

[Mewtaph]

And yes I can walk away. Wow. Yes. Now if you're going to continue to dump shit on me I'll respond in the capacity that other people respond to this whole interaction. Am I interested in interacting with you directly? Nope

[Mewtaph]

But yes keep turning on the heat. Keep calling this AtEm I really don't carwm I don't want to communicate with your slot.

[Mewtaph]

And this is exactly why I didn't want to communicate with your slot by the way. But go on.

[Mewtaph]

Mmm, you may have hit a nerve that isn't specific to you. I apologize if it comes off as aggressive, but yes. Can we leave this for now, please? If you push my slot I'm fine with it but I don't really feel like interacting with you is best for my general state right now.

[Mewtaph]

I'm sorry. It's personal. And I don't really want to talk about it either, not in a public space. I'm going to try to get to a point where I can at least respond to what you're saying but it's just hard for me at the moment.

[Mewtaph]

And by personal, I mean personal to me. I don't have issue with you, I have issue with how you handled my slot because of personal reasons. So yeah. My bad I guess guys lol..

[Mewtaph]

I'm going to leave this for now, don't expect any posts from me for a while.

[Mewtaph]

I really hate that this is going to be used for AI purposes but oh well I guess. I'm leaving out of the thread for a while to(kind of lied, committing to it this time) though I'd prefer if people talked around it, it can't really be helped. Probably going to not post for at least 12+ hours. Anyway hope people have fun cleaning up my mess lmao sorry.

[Mewtaph]

Margot, I'm curious. Do you think IV is in the best position to actually tag you for "correct" scumreads, y'know, full mug shot with evidence and proof and everything? And if not, then why exactly is their attempt to try and get a better read on you scummy? Other than the fact that you're previously scumreading them for reasons (I'm assuming there are other reasons besides this that you're scumreading IV for, anyway).

I know I did kind of go back on what I said almost immediately after I said it but you did post like 5 minutes after I did which was kind of miraculous considering I was gone for a good chunk of time so I saw your post.

[Mewtaph]

Odds on a quick response In rating as low but if you come back to me within 12 hours I can't resist a reply.

[Mewtaph]

on*

[Mewtaph]

I don't have a lot of experience playing with IV so I am kind of relying on your experience here, however I don't think he's posted anything that makes me think he is trying to be active in advancing the game state - it's mostly "how dare you vote me" AtE which is very bleh to me.

Exactly why we need to run him up and get an actual claim out of him. I don't like that Mew and T3 wanted IV out until he was brought into claim range, but then got cold feet and swapped over to Margot therefore making all of their pressure pointless and showy. If they want to keep fake pressuring people we can 100% just vote T3 or Mew instead, as I don't see any reason to vote out Margot before any of the three that are voting her.

Fake pressuring people. Alright, nah. I didn't even want IV out so check your narrative. Except it's not even a narrative because you're IC, you're just wrong. Sigh.

This post actually feels really bad
VOTE: Mewtaph

By the way, stuff like this is fine. Please just avoid talking about the personal stuff. It went there, yes, it happened but can we not discuss it and make it this whole big thing please. There are many other posts and points to read my slot from, go there. Thanks. And while obviously from my POV I don't want one of my stronger townreads to be voting me I can't really stop them from doing it unless I discuss what happened because this is essentially leading up to what happened and I don't want to do that. So I'm not going to. Cheers.

[Mewtaph]

Like, if by the time I come back in here, I see people doing meta around this or like really, really get into calling me town or scum over this (basis of your read/vote/case) going to votepark you for the rest of the day phase and try to push my thoughts across anyway even if I don't think you're town. Just like don't do it lmao I feel bad enough for letting this happen already. Let's try to make this as painless to work around as either alignment as possible.

[Mewtaph]

Thank youuu. And if someone does exactly what I said not to do, enjoy my vote boomeranging straight in your direction.

[Mewtaph]

Okay, fair enough.

[Mewtaph]

Yeah, I am speaking from my point of view there. I do think that IV is voting you because they are trying to get a better read on you. That extra information does help though. Thank you.

[Mewtaph]

By the way I think ChaosOmega is town. Just wanted to squeeze that in there. Okay, bye.

[Mewtaph]

By the way I think ChaosOmega is town. Just wanted to squeeze that in there. Okay, bye.

how do you have a read on this slot?

I can't reveal my secrets so soon. I'm waiting on more people to post, some with more attention than others. Your posts are really good imo but I am a bit biased.

[Mewtaph]

I've read through again. Here's my stance.

I stand by my Mewtaph and IV scum reads. I asked for a claim because that is my understanding about what happens at e-1. I didn't specifically angle for IV to be killed n1, but if they were, that would have been fine with me, because I think they are scum, and given the setup is not revealed, the claim would likely not have meant anything anyway.

I still think T3 is likely not scum. I also Town Read the heck out of Datisi. I think the fact that Mewtaph and IV both voted for me is pretty scum indicative in my book, and I'm feeling more and more confident that I've solved two of the scum roles.

This is especially given the fact that all of IV's reasons for voting back at me are bizarre when you actually stop and think about it for five seconds. Like, asking for a claim is scum indicative? Trying to vote out someone you think is scum is scum indicative? What isn't scum indicative in your book IV? Anyone voting for anyone is scum. Is the only Townie in this game N_M?

hi hope you're okay Margot

honestly, kind of annoying that you don't think the claim matters much at all, because that's an easy answer for you to say as scum i guess when you were really just trying to rolefish as scum.

just in the future if you're town, i think you should give people more time to play the game because blah blah ive talked about it enough. if ur scum great job bc you almost rolefished me/got me killed and now have a plausible explanation/apparently no one other than me thinks ur scummy for this so ill probably have to reconsider a little on you ig.

I think she's scummy. Just wanted to make sure she was super invested in her reads.

[Mewtaph]

Ooo exciting content. I like it. Sorry I went back on not posting within 12 hours but I don't think anyone really cares at this point.

[Mewtaph]

For IV: Bottom of 332might help. A reread helped me get a better read on his slot but yes I was exactly where you were for a while.

[Mewtaph]

His posts make a lot of sense. I think his progression on my slot (uptick) is extremely townie and I've basically interacted with him the most. There are other things but that should be more than enough for now.

[Mewtaph]

His posts make a lot of sense. I think his progression on my slot (uptick) is extremely townie and I've basically interacted with him the most. There are other things but that should be more than enough for now.

I am, however, a bit biased here. If you TR me though, you can trust my read on him. I feel quite strongly about him being town.

[Mewtaph]

UNVOTE:

At this point, I don't think the back and forth with Mew is helpful. I disagree with some things from his last response to me, but it's getting semantic and I'm feeling better about his slot.

Posting from my phone, I feel like crap. I need to look back over this game because I'm pretty lost right now in terms of reads, will do that tomorrow.

Is also a very, very good post. Don't really want to explain why but just wait for his reads list if you're unsure. Feeling very much like it will come from a townie perspective.

[Mewtaph]

His posts make a lot of sense. I think his progression on my slot (uptick) is extremely townie and I've basically interacted with him the most. There are other things but that should be more than enough for now.

There are actually a lot of things. Several. One minor thing being that I said reads list but ChaosOmega said reads. Semantics.