Mini Theme 2244: 3d20 uRoll – Somewhere In New Jersey [End]

[Bingle]

Ah, fuck. I thought I was a Jake alt.

Nope. You’re clearly one of Cyrus’ two heads in that headcount. Interesting that no one else even has a head though.

[Bingle]

well if they no kill we can repeat role copping. And if they do kill, then you, me, and the two people loftwing block will be conftown

Kinda nitpicky, but it is an important distinction: those people will be confirmed to not be the scum who killed. They could still feasibly be scum with someone else.

Dwlee and Cyrus jk each other. Std tracks loftwing. Loftwing blocks me and std. Ru investigates Cyrus, I think.

I’ll act so that if loft doesn’t block one of me/std they get caught by the action happening. That prevents loftwing/Cyrus or loftwing/dwlee shenanigans.

Any objections?

Putting this on the new page.

[Bingle]

And before you say that's why you lock him up. How if I'm already in a cell?

There are 0 worlds in which you are not jailkept. If you're town, you will jailkeep Dwlee.

Via RAR wiki page:

"Player B (a Mafia Roleblocker) shoots and roleblocks player A. Player A (a Jailkeeper) jails player B.
Does player A die?
Player B shoots player A
Player A blocks player B's shot
Player B blocks player A's block
Player A blocks player B's block
Again, the blocks of the blocks cancel out. Just as before, this means that the non-block actions are blocked, and fail, so in this case player A survives (the shot was blocked)."

This scenario directly applies here, and this is the most common way to resolve blocker loops.

[Bingle]

VOTE: No elimination

[Bingle]

What's up?

You're gonna investigate someone, preferably cyrus, so we can finally end this game.

[Bingle]

unless bingel is bullet proof yes

Literally cannot be.

[Bingle]

Okay so who hasn't been checked

Are we SURE there needs to be a doctor

Loftwing, Ru and STD.

I did not get confirmation that STD is a doctor, so I was in fact blocked.

The only thing that explains N1 from your POV and doesn't require a doctor or babysitter is me lying about having investigated enchant and I know that isn't the case. If there is not a protective role, there is a mod error to the best of my ability to parse the setup.

[Bingle]

1 - Vanilla (town)/Goon (groupscum)/Bulletproof (3p) - It could explain things if I were BP, but also I was Rolecopped as a JOAT, so...
2 - Alignment Cop (moderator, roll another d20 to determine which alignment it finds, turning it essentially into a Bloodhound, Cop, Seer, Conspiracy Theorist, Private Investigator, or FBI Agent, depending on what rolls) - Doesn't stop deaths.
3 - JOAT (With a 1-shot of Alignment Cop, Doctor, Roleblocker, and one role on this list (roll d20) each.) - I did not Doc on N1.
4 - Mason-type (Roll d20, rerolling same-faction results, to determine if they are added to the Hypogeans, Masons, Monks, Truthers, Atheists, or Neighborhood Watch, based on what evil alignment rolls) - Doesn't stop deaths
5 - Neighborizer/Cult Leader - Doesn't stop deaths
6 - Fruit Vendor - Doesn't stop deaths
7 - Paranoid Gun Owner - Kills anyone who targets them
8 - Parity Cop - Doesn't stop deaths
9 - Role Cop - Doesn't stop deaths
10 - Tracker - Doesn't stop deaths
11 - Asceticizer - Doesn't stop deaths
12 - Motion Detector - Doesn't stop deaths
13 - Finder (moderator, roll another d20 and consult this list for the result) - Doesn't stop deaths
14 - Voyeur - Doesn't stop deaths
15 - Doctor - Hey! This is what we're looking for!
16 - Babysitter - Or this!
17 - Bus Driver - Explains why I didn't die, sure, but why didn't Owl die for targeting Enchant?
18 - Jailkeeper - Explains why I didn't die, but I wouldn't have gotten a result.
19 - Roleblocker - You can't roleblock a PGO.
20 - Vigilante/Serial Killer - Doesn't stop kills.


That is every possible role in the setup. The only way that both Owl and I should have lived after I submitted a cop on Enchant is if Doctor, Babysitter, or JoaT targeted me. If you want to eliminate me to confirm this information that makes me not have to care about the game anymore and I'm all for that.

[Bingle]

So long as their visit wasn’t a killing role, which would kill them because killing roles aren’t stopped by ascetics. But enchant wasn’t ascetic, because I got a cop result. I would have gotten a no result on an ascetic.

@mod can you confirm that there were no mod errors in the resolution of night 1?

[Bingle]

Not that I’ve seen, but it doesn’t hurt to ask even if she already has. Honestly I should’ve asked like 3 weeks ago.

[Bingle]

Yeah, I was just kind of assuming she’d have announced it by now, but you know what they say about assuming. It’s a required step in performing mathematical proofs.

[Bingle]

It’s accurate ish. We don’t know owls secondary drive and how that plays in and that doesn’t account for loft blocking you, but we know that std tracked me to enchant and thus that loft and I were driven.

It’s the biggest why for me thinking STD actually is a tracker.

[Bingle]

Actually, STD saying he tracked someone to enchant is proof I’m not making this up at my end, so there’s that. If either of std or I is town someone visited enchant N1, and no one could have survived doing so without a doc or babysitter existing.

[Bingle]

But didn't STD claim to have tracked you before we knew all this wonky stuff?

Std claimed to have tracked loft to enchant, but yeah.

[Bingle]

Actually, STD saying he tracked someone to enchant is proof I’m not making this up at my end, so there’s that. If either of std or I is town someone visited enchant N1, and no one could have survived doing so without a doc or babysitter existing.

Also fuck my life but this means I’m not a valuable elimination anymore

[Bingle]

Wait, STD could fake that tracker result if he is mafia, right?

If he did he did a damn good job of it. He claimed it as a guilty against Ru when it looked like a guilty on Ru but actually wasn't. Like, faking that level of confusion about a result that doesn't exist would be impressive as hell.

Technically, we could wait another night and have a mech 1v1 between Ru and STD and be slightly safer, but honestly I'm fine with just Slaying the Dargons here.

[Bingle]

I'm starting to wonder if scum doctor even exists

Oooh! I found a way to make myself the most valuable elimination again!

If STD was driven to Kyouko who culted Enchant, then I could theoretically be lying about having targeted Enchant.

Me being town means that either Owl or I targeted Enchant and didn't die necessitating a scum doc/babysitter though.

[Bingle]

DID YOU READ MY POST. I ASKD THE MOD WHAT HAPPENS IF TWO JKS TARGET EACH OTHER NEITHER GETS BLOCKED NEITHER GETS PROTECTED BOTH CANCEL OUT.

When was this and what post?

[Bingle]

Forgive me for not trusting your ability to understand the mechanics, but I’m getting corroboration that cook would indeed resolve mutual jk-ing that way.

In either case, scum dwlee being able to kill last night doesn’t imply dwlee is scum. Scum is obviously no killing because if they kill they clear too many townies to be able to win in the process.

[Bingle]

Well now I feel dumb. Should’ve asked all those questions like three day phases ago.

[Bingle]

So….

There’s probably no doc. I have forgotten any real sense of non mechanical reads at this point, although I think I remain pretty obv town. Anyone have a scumcase for me to sheep?

[Bingle]

ssbm_Kyouko- Flipped Cult leader.
Dunnstral- Flipped Town.
RegRider- Flipped Mafia.

Bingle - Bloodhound with Glowing Eyes


Dragon of the West - Subjectively my strongest townread. We’ve been occupying similar headspaces
Mama Ru - Roleblocked targeting Dwlee, the way she went about claiming was frustrating but showed absolutely no desire to hide from multiball cross kills. I’d probably doc here tonight if I wasn’t the obvious NK.
Save The Dragons - Stale read, but I know the inactivity is NAI because he was inactive modding at roughly the same time.
Loftwing - has seemed townier EOD yesterday and today (hence my deciding to throw in on reg over Loft). Also, CW to reg means probably not specifically mafia.
StrangeMatter - true null, should probably look into this.
Dwlee99 - circumstantial evidence of scum shenanigans. Will be weaker evidence if evidence of a roleblocker comes to light. Have thought they were townish by play, but this was on the short list to investigate.
Quiet Owl - Not paired with Enchant, but the “There could be a bus driver” feels like scum TMI to me.
cyrus62 - Survivalist as shit, may have TMI’d cult existence D1, softing an even only PR incredibly hard and trying to convince protectives to sit on him when there are clearly better targets. This could be Cyrus being Cyrus, but it seems over the top, even for him.
Enchant - Claimed SK, wants a leash. Confirmed scum by Bingle.

Looking at this my reason to read dw is outdated, but the rest is still pretty relevant.

[Bingle]

Jfc

Okay I think it is STD on play

I think my order of trust is you>loft>mama>std>Cyrus. Incidentally, leaving you and loft till last lets us basically guarantee we make it to final three. Lim cyrus, rb all of std mama and me tonight?

[Bingle]

A combination of hubris and Cyrus actively working against a solve for so long. Also, Cyrus being so sure about the existence of cult D1 sounded informed to me.

[Bingle]

Are you suggesting that Cyrus is Serial Killer specifically?

Yups. I don't think association hunting is going to be a good idea because of the whole 3 different flipped scumteams and we don't know what flavor of scum is left, but I do (and have) had a feeling cyrus was an SK for basically the whole game.

[Bingle]

Why would he be informed of anything?

If cyrus rolled cult and then pulled SK he'd know there was a cult. He also spent like all of day 1 talking about a cult. And then a cult leader flipped.

[Bingle]

You are also dead weight, Cyrus. Unable to starve off a 1v1 against any scum player, you would die on an odd night.

I mean... this is kind of irrelevant. Town JK and Scum RB is still a scumwin because scum win on parity.

[Bingle]

Mama ru and bingle both have ways of claiming that don't feel like they come from scum

I know I'm town

I get cyrus is just posting words but I get a feeling he's town here

Loftwing could be mafia but big meh

So who does that leave

STD

Theoretically STD has more mechanical value, but I'm honestly fine with limming there first if you really feel strongly about it. I just think that cyrus' whole "I'm going to throw shit at every wall until something sticks" method has a really high scum equity, particularly when he's been leaning more aggressively into it every time the topic of his elimination comes up.

[Bingle]

bingel is dead wight at this point how do we know he isnt alien . how do we know we can trust him. i pointed out dotw . i also pointed out strange. sure bingel got three right with enchant, owl and regrider but thats it.

FTFY

[Bingle]

Have you played with Cyrus before

Yes. I think he was cult in a game I hydra'd in. Also I've modded him and interacted with him quite heavily in reviewing a large bastard theme game he wants to run someday.

Not making logical sense with his arguments =/= having a clear scum agenda, and I think this game is a case of the latter. Again, though, I'm not super invested and will 100% lim STD here if you feel strongly.

[Bingle]

I have never been cult. And shhhh on my game bingel I don't recall showing you it so is this a alt of some kind?

Did I not make an I am jingle post this game? This is my play account and jingle is my modding account. Publicly linked, not at all a secret.

And I’ve said all I’ll say about your game unless you specifically ask me to say more. If it was a secret that you wanted to mod a game in the first place I apologize, but the point is that we have spent a considerable amount of time talking and I do know how you post.

[Bingle]

Loft should block Ru, she’s not a cop anymore with the mod error in play.

VOTE: std

[Bingle]

That’s E1 I think

[Bingle]

Loft should block Ru, she’s not a cop anymore with the mod error in play.

VOTE: std

Loft should block Ru too.

[Bingle]

There was an error in the resolution of night one.

This means we don't know there's a protective role, which further implies that all of the players trueclaimed role. (We have solid evidence that everyone is actually the role they claim to be and the most likely mod error is me/Owl surviving when we shouldn't have.)

Ru is still a rolecop, but without the mechanical confirmation that scum is lying about their role, she can't actually confirmed generate a guilty. If Loftwing isn't a double RB (tbc, loft and STD are the only people who haven't been rolecopped) then presumably one of me and STD would have been able to act last night and I'm guessing by the lack of STD claiming a guilty on loft that that's not the case, so the only case in which loft is not a double roleblocker is if loft is a scum double-multitasking roleblocker, which is far less likely than Ru being scum rolecop. In light of this, we play around the second option, not the first option. So Loft blocks Ru and I and Dwlee blocks cyrus.

If we have a kill, there's confirmed scum in Loft/Dwlee. If Ru gets a result, there's confirmed scum in Loft/Ru.

[Bingle]

If Ru gets a result, that could either mean I attacked, or Dweelee blocked me.

Fair point.

If we eliminate cyrus and let STD live to track Dwlee that fixes that, but honestly I don't think either of you is scum here so I'm not really worried.

[Bingle]

Are you still paranoid I could be scum?

No, but noting that it'd be 1 scum in three is relevant.

It's also worth noting that if either of you is scum with a living partner you just win with this plan, but I kinda don't want to entertain that as a possibility.

[Bingle]

am i dead yet

Yeah. Or you will be when Cook is around.

[Bingle]

God, I hope that just ends the game because

it'd make you hammering with "He's town" so much funnier

then the game is over

FTFY

[Bingle]

bingel or loft or we have a jester.

Jester would be endgamed here as last scum. I think it's fairly self evident I thought there was a scum doc, which in turn makes it fairly self evident that I had a genuine result on Enchant N1. I was the deciding momentum that shifted the wagon D1 from Loftwing to Reg and I spent D1 tunneled on QOwl with him OMGUS-ing me, so I don't particularly make sense as Mafia and I claimed a high priority NK role unprompted on D2 so I don't really make sense as solo scum or scum without a partner who can protect me at night.

I'm pretty much the most obvtown player in the list at this point.

[Bingle]

Im gonna name my TM team for next year Butler Conspiracy
okay maybe not but it has a similar ring to it as Busboy Revolution

what is the busboy revolution a reference to

Subject: Fiction Rumble II - Week 26 (Current Champion: Zaphkael)

This is where my current nickname comes from, something i rattled off when I was bored and high one night here. This is the story of the

Busboy Revolution

:

Spoiler:

Well sit down and let me tell you about the time all the busboys across the country sat down and refused to scrape another plate until they got the same respect as chimney sweeps.

For too long people had held chimney sweepers in such high regard that the term "hung like a chimney sweeper" was born out of the amount of regard given to them. Busboys had felt the growing divide since the early 1810s when people started to have more and more chimneys installed in their houses. Before then the most any house would have was one, and that was if the family was well of. Most of the houses at this time still were warmed by wood stoves and therefor the life of a chimney sweep was a sparse one.

After the boom in chimneys on each house it wasnt uncommon for some of the more affluent to have fireplaces installed in each room. This caused the number of chimneys to rise over 250% over the last decade. This rose the rates and amount of business that each chimney sweep was doing.

Small operations started to grow until the few that were around in the beginning created almost a cabal that had 95% control of all the chimneys in the limits of the cities. The country was split into just 5 areas and each was ran by one company. They all colluded with each other to stay out of the others areas and they all joined together to squash any upstart companies who think they have the clout to make a dent in the areas held.

This all lasted for over 20 years, with the last 10 years being in control by the cabal, and took their leadership into the 1830's. You may be wondering what busboys have to do with chimney sweeps and why they were the ones to eventually dismantle the power structure carefully built by the cabal. The correlation comes here. When the number of chimneys increased the amount of work for chimney sweeps increased and allowed the lower and middle class people in those jobs before the boom to go to the next level of class in our society. Prior chimney sweeps and busboys were known as comrades in arms. With the boom the chimney sweeps felt like they had to leave their old lives behind and to adopt into the ways of the elites.

Where once friendships were the norm and members of both careers mingled with each other now only resentment sat. Busboys now not only dealt with the elites from normal means, now they were dealing with a new group of chimney millionaires. If you take into account for inflation the amount a entry level chimney sweep was making equals over 1.2 million dollars in todays economy. That was what the veterans were making late into their teens.

Busboys had finally had enough with the insults and the injuries given to them by those who once sat with them in the gruel lines. Singing for their suppers outside the bathhouses, sometimes never being seen again after going home with one of the more prominent members of the local governments with direct ties to cabal money.

It was in June of 1833, one of the hottest days on record. The chimney sweeps were indoors at noon on the 15th of that month because it was the hottest day of that month and the tar on roofs were melting so badly the sweepers shoes were being pulled right off their feet. In every restaurant across the country chimney sweepers were sat at tables, drinking glasses of cold water. The action that broke the camels back was when after hours of sitting there waiting for the heat to break the sweepers drank glass, after glass, after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass,after glass of water and refused each and every servers attempt to just fill glasses they already had from a pitcher.

Each sweeper demanded a new glass every time their glass was emptied.

Busboys sprang into action and started to rotate dirty glasses into the sink, washed them, ran them out to the servers, cleared empty glasses off tables to start the process all over again. They did their jobs stoically, not saying a disparaging word to a single one of their new masters.

It wasn't until the rains came, and the heat broke that the sweepers stood up, and made their way outside to get back to work now that the tar would have hardened again. Since all they had ordered were glasses of water none of them had a bill. The servers had been taking care of them for over 3 hours waiting on the weather to change. The busboys made their money from the benevolence of the servers, which was something the sweepers in power had done on purpose to try and subjugate their former equals to even more harsh degrees.

When the servers saw that not one sweeper had left even pocket change on their tables as they left, they apologized to the busboys and said that all the work that they had done over the last 3 hours constantly moving and washing glasses was just to make nothing from people who are so obviously able to improve the lives of others but made a choice not only to not help, but to make exponentially more difficult.

The busboys had finally had enough. They put down their towels, and took off their aprons and took to the streets. Ladders were confiscated from sides of any building they weren't attached to. Sweepers were stranded on roofs with no safe way to get down, many gave their lives that day.

Once the sweepers became away of the danger they were in they armed themselves with brooms and a chipper attitude. They were no match for the busboys though. The sweepers couldn't run due to their black lung and most were quickly overtaken by the busboys who actually had been keeping in decent shape with all the constant bending and lifting of weights possibly in excess of 25lbs as a repetitive motion. Chimneys were toppled, sweepers strung up and hung en masse in local makeshift gallows, the cabal had been toppled. After years of tyrannical rule the former foes were equals again.

Busboys made their way back to their aprons and picked up their towels and started to wipe tables down like nothing had been out of the ordinary that day. Chimney sweeping as a viable career was left to stories like Mary Poppins.

It became known as the "shittiest revolution" because one of the lesser known responsibilities of busboys is to unclog toilets and everyone knows that as cheap as chimney sweepers are they eat a lot of fast food and destroy bathrooms.

[Bingle]

You thought I was scum even to the point . You said you would just keep jking me

JK-ing you was never about whether you were actually scum. It was about the possibility of you being scum and thus optimal use of night actions. Additionally, you being town was never a sure thing because literally every move you made for the second half of the game reeked of scum motivation.

I have absolutely no qualms with not trusting you here.

[Bingle]

Skulls for the skull throne, after all.

[Bingle]

Was there a dead thread?

[Bingle]

Much grass, ty

[Bingle]

Cyrus not making a lot of sense is a cyrus thing.

I thought he was scum for the rolefishing, the surety of there being cult in the early game, and the confidence that everyone should be townreading him when his play wasn't particularly 'beacon of towniness' and this is a multiball setup.

In hindsight, the last is probably a towntell from cyrus.