Micro 1034 | Meet me on the Astral Plane | Game Over!

[Wright and Justice]

as for flea - are you really claiming im tunneled on mollie right now? And not looking anywhere else?

You have a specific kind of hyperfocus, you do look around but you'll always take a shot at your current primary target where you can. Which is what you're doing. Difference here to previous to me is that those shots are more frequent than I'm used to seeing.

Dont know if that's just because I'm not the primary for once ^_^;

Was partially due to grudge.

Im hashing it out in the hood since its not really game related ish in the sense of necessary to solve either of us. Should be mostly ok from this point forward especially if i have finally stumbled upon the right solve

Me - wright

[Wright and Justice]

Flea - im curious in particular how you're viewing alice then since you agree with me on Holden being obvtown.

[Wright and Justice]

OK I want to shelve it and not add onto the fire and talk about it postgame mollie.

So if you please - drop it.

If you want to discuss it further we have a private topic.

I'm not going to unpack and explain right now.

We made progress here. Just focus on that please.

[Wright and Justice]

In case people do want to know - i, while drunk, tried to push mollie into going in the direction of solving slots outside of me and not just talking about our slot as it was getting frustrating for me to constantly be unable to get mollie to stop discussing me and actually give thoughts on other people.

I did so in a way that nitpicked their entire play and pointed out things that were objectively scummy to continue to do on top of other things. Which was out of frustration with how mollie was treating the game and me.

I don't want to continue discussing this during the game and have another 3 pages of mollie vs me so this is the last you will hear about it in this thread until the postgame.

[Wright and Justice]

OK I want to shelve it and not add onto the fire and talk about it postgame mollie.

So if you please - drop it.

If you want to discuss it further we have a private topic.

I'm not going to unpack and explain right now.

We made progress here. Just focus on that please.

It is clear that you have made the hood an unsafe place to be in.

I am not going to talk to you there, because I want witnesses.

I am now scumreading your slot because Gamma was once a list mod, and is well aware of the direction of the sitewide goal of inclining towards civility as a whole, because it has been toxic for years. He should be telling you to shut the fuck up right now,

(she did tell me to stop btw)

because you are trying to bully me into submission but it isn't going to work.

What I am trying to parse, is whether or not you came in with a premeditated plan to pick a fight with me or whether you merely anticipated one. Every single bit of that points to Gamma's and your pregame analysis, and it is their alignment I need to determine in order to determine yours.

Gamma knows that site meta historically has been, "pick a fight with Mollie, if you are scum you will get town cleared because she is emotional and she gets toxic when she gets emotional". it is why I took a break, and the world changed and the site sort of got better. At least I thought.

It is Gamma I am trying to read at this point, not you, I just want you to make up your mind about me and leave me the fuck alone.

ok I'm going to put a pin in it for both of you here, if lines have been crossed, report it to the game mod, or use the report button, or talk about it post game and hash it out or just frankly call it done between you both.

we're on 21 pages, and I'm going to reiterate this.

Its like watching 2 kids fighting, coming to tell on the other kid then going back to fighting just far away that you can't hear whats being said. This clearly isn't a good environment for either of you rn and it's already spilled over here.

Stop.

In case people do want to know - i, while drunk, tried to push mollie into going in the direction of solving slots outside of me and not just talking about our slot as it was getting frustrating for me to constantly be unable to get mollie to stop discussing me and actually give thoughts on other people.

I did so in a way that nitpicked their entire play and pointed out things that were objectively scummy to continue to do on top of other things. Which was out of frustration with how mollie was treating the game and me.

I don't want to continue discussing this during the game and have another 3 pages of mollie vs me

so this is the last you will hear about it in this thread until the postgame.

[Wright and Justice]

Anyways.

mollie - do you have a read on Holden yet?

[Wright and Justice]

Stop instigating.

Seriously.
Stop.

You are baiting me at this point.

[Wright and Justice]

thank you mollie for finally engaging people who aren't me

as for flea - are you really claiming im tunneled on mollie right now? And not looking anywhere else?

I ask because some of the statements you are throwing out imply that.

Also there is a pleathora of new info since i last mentioned my read on mollie ->
a) IV is extremely unlikely to be partnered with mollie at this point due to mollies confident claim that they thought IV and andres were in a hood
b) they have finally started to engage people outside of me in a way that looks genuine
c) there are people now actually egging on the TvS stance -> wheras before the majority were mostly reading it as TvT(as in active people). This leads me to my next reshuffling of my PoE:

Alice is approching the game in a 1 dimensional manner that betrays an agenda
I'm not sure what to think of IVs stance on pushing us as town but when people are not pushing their direct counterwagon -> esp someone with a weaker scum meta-> i venture to say that is +town(and objectively regardless of if you think I am town 9r not ) *unless* the 2 are SvS.

That being said -> I'm wanting to pivot away from IV at this point in time because of their string of posts and the fact that my direct solve was disproven.

VOTE: Alice

My IV read is shelved for now contingent on if they continue their energy this dayphase. It's not a high bar either for them- IV knows what is being looked for

I think Wright and Justice can be partnered with HoldenGolden. I think they push the same agenda. I will elaborate on this later.

In particular this read on Holden is complete hogwash and meant to discredit the town fulcrum as well as leader ^

Holden is the towniest player by far this dayphase. I will not be taking criticism. There is overwhelming evidence if one even bothers looking in how Holden approaches the game.

Alice - show us the thought process you used to reach Holden scum. You have been hesitant to play thus far.


Facebones - you were already asked before, but why havent you used your hood to communicate with IV?
@IV - what has been said in there thus far?

Anyways.

mollie - do you have a read on Holden yet?

Now - let's talk about the game we are playing ->

these are the game related posts I want to actually be paid attention to at this point on this page and responded to by relevant parties(other than flea who already has responded)

[Wright and Justice]

stand down gamma, we're moving on and focusing on the game

[Wright and Justice]

thank you mollie for finally engaging people who aren't me

as for flea - are you really claiming im tunneled on mollie right now? And not looking anywhere else?

I ask because some of the statements you are throwing out imply that.

Also there is a pleathora of new info since i last mentioned my read on mollie ->
a) IV is extremely unlikely to be partnered with mollie at this point due to mollies confident claim that they thought IV and andres were in a hood
b) they have finally started to engage people outside of me in a way that looks genuine
c) there are people now actually egging on the TvS stance -> wheras before the majority were mostly reading it as TvT(as in active people). This leads me to my next reshuffling of my PoE:

Alice is approching the game in a 1 dimensional manner that betrays an agenda
I'm not sure what to think of IVs stance on pushing us as town but when people are not pushing their direct counterwagon -> esp someone with a weaker scum meta-> i venture to say that is +town(and objectively regardless of if you think I am town 9r not ) *unless* the 2 are SvS.

That being said -> I'm wanting to pivot away from IV at this point in time because of their string of posts and the fact that my direct solve was disproven.

VOTE: Alice

My IV read is shelved for now contingent on if they continue their energy this dayphase. It's not a high bar either for them- IV knows what is being looked for

I think Wright and Justice can be partnered with HoldenGolden. I think they push the same agenda. I will elaborate on this later.

In particular this read on Holden is complete hogwash and meant to discredit the town fulcrum as well as leader ^

Holden is the towniest player by far this dayphase. I will not be taking criticism. There is overwhelming evidence if one even bothers looking in how Holden approaches the game.

Alice - show us the thought process you used to reach Holden scum. You have been hesitant to play thus far.


Facebones - you were already asked before, but why havent you used your hood to communicate with IV?
@IV - what has been said in there thus far?

Anyways.

mollie - do you have a read on Holden yet?

Now - let's talk about the game we are playing ->

these are the game related posts I want to actually be paid attention to at this point on this page and responded to by relevant parties(other than flea who already has responded)

so back to this^


Also does *anyone* think Alice has been towny?

Because I think they have not and I want them wagoned here.

[Wright and Justice]

stand down gamma, we're moving on and focusing on the game

I have almost 60+ hydras and I can promise you that this is not an okay way to talk to a hydra partner.

"Stand down"? WTF even is that shit, Gamma is your equal, not your subordinate.

You should treat them with respect.

What YOU need to do is stop posting. You are bringing the game to a toxic level and you have been warned.

Sit on your hands if you have to. I used to tell Titus this very same thing when we hydra-ed. In text. On phone calls.

How can I possibly look outside of your hydra if you won't shut up for 2 freaking seconds?

Ok.

Anyways - What's your read on Holden?

[Wright and Justice]

i actually don't love that koba backed off me so quickly it's weird and almost pockety that they were lockscum on me and suddenly are voting someone else.

I already had Alice in my PoE and I am giving you a chance here because you showed depth of thought.

What do you want to know about my thought process surrounding the move?

[Wright and Justice]

thank you mollie for finally engaging people who aren't me

as for flea - are you really claiming im tunneled on mollie right now? And not looking anywhere else?

I ask because some of the statements you are throwing out imply that.

Also there is a pleathora of new info since i last mentioned my read on mollie ->
a) IV is extremely unlikely to be partnered with mollie at this point due to mollies confident claim that they thought IV and andres were in a hood
b) they have finally started to engage people outside of me in a way that looks genuine
c) there are people now actually egging on the TvS stance -> wheras before the majority were mostly reading it as TvT(as in active people). This leads me to my next reshuffling of my PoE:

Alice is approching the game in a 1 dimensional manner that betrays an agenda
I'm not sure what to think of IVs stance on pushing us as town but when people are not pushing their direct counterwagon -> esp someone with a weaker scum meta-> i venture to say that is +town(and objectively regardless of if you think I am town 9r not ) *unless* the 2 are SvS.

That being said -> I'm wanting to pivot away from IV at this point in time because of their string of posts and the fact that my direct solve was disproven.

VOTE: Alice

My IV read is shelved for now contingent on if they continue their energy this dayphase. It's not a high bar either for them- IV knows what is being looked for

[Wright and Justice]

For me PoE looks something like
[IV - Mollie ] for people acitvirely scummy to me and [t3 - alice - flea] for the rest who are poe by not having towntold yet

Anyways ->

ATP I want hard pressure on Alice because based on POE from people who have spoken having towntold to some capacity, Alice is caught floundering in PoE and also avoiding playing in this game.


If IV is scum they will help spew their team atp and i'm willing to let them live as they have lots of trouble with endurance - but their more recent postings have shown a higher thought process than I remember reading from their scumgames and thus I doubt that will be necessary.

[Wright and Justice]

lmao me going in circles with IV and backing off for the same reason again LMFAO

[Wright and Justice]

I also mention Alice as part of my PoE twice in my hood on page 3 and 4, which mollie if they want to be helpful can corroborate.

I will quote this into the PT and provide the posts for mollie to look at.

We can consider no reply as a confirmation I'm telling the truth - so mollie doesnt need to interact with me.

[Wright and Justice]

I hope that's enough proof for you IV that I didn't just suddenly change directions(in the sense of a jarring progression) and I naturally arrived where I am now due to new evidence in thread.

[Wright and Justice]

Inaccurate:

When solving a game, one needs to factor in who the FN is.

It helps to find viable solves this way, if I have a read on someone being an FN, then I can eliminate that person from my POE, even if I think their play feels scummy.


I come from a background of Chat Mafia play where we played a lot of open setups that involved town PRs that needed to hide. The better players learned to PR hunt as town - and would even pull of roleswaps based on their PR reads as town(myself included).

I would love to give an example of a game but unfortunately the website, Epicmafia, went down. T3 however played on that site with me and can corroborate what I am saying is true.


To solve in this setup, having an idea of who can be viably partner with who is important. This is part of why one wants to keep the hoods hidden at first - that way, if someone is pushing a solve that involves 2 hoodmates together, that is useful info for that hood as they know that the person that is pushing that is pushing a confirmed townie.


I solve on a holistic level - meaning I look at all options and in the process I end up solving PR puzzles too.

My level of play is at a fairly high level in this sense that I am looking at everything as a whole and making sure it fits.

My weakest part of my play - which is on display here - is being convincing to players, especially people who have little experience with me.

This would be scummy - I give you that mollie - if it came from a noob player who was not good enough as town to do what I detailed above.

However at worst your case is NAI on me.

I fully admit I am looking for FN on the side - but if you think that I have been actively hunting for it, that is something you need to prove rather than point out a conclusion i shared with you. (FN this is a signal to you that you shouldn't use your ability on me, other than the obvious reason that our hood is claimed.)


This is a game philosophy that I maintain throughout games. I don't play many open setups anymore at all - and the ones I do are vanilla role ones - so I cannot prove anything recent but I think T3 should be able to advocate that what I say is true about the mindset of players from Epicmafia regarding treating PRs when town.

[Wright and Justice]

Right now I look at solves in my head that look like:

WNJ - mollie[/green]

IV

-

Facebones

Alice

-

REDACTED

REDACTED - REDACTED

REDACTED

this is how I view my solves in a setup like this.

I would have shared this solve with mollie if I could trust them not to just share it with everyone and point scum straight to the FN.

Sorry mollie , but your tenacity to constantly share things that are not pro-town to the main thread does not make me want to work with you in terms of solving the game - not that you are willing to right now with anyone. (please prove me wrong by doing so)

[Wright and Justice]

Right now I look at solves in my head that look like:

WNJ - mollie

IV

-

Facebones

Alice

-

REDACTED

REDACTED - REDACTED

REDACTED

this is how I view my solves in a setup like this.

I would have shared this solve with mollie if I could trust them not to just share it with everyone and point scum straight to the FN.

Sorry mollie , but your tenacity to constantly share things that are not pro-town to the main thread does not make me want to work with you in terms of solving the game - not that you are willing to right now with anyone. (please prove me wrong by doing so)

fixed oops

[Wright and Justice]

I was hesitant to push on IV earlier because I thought they were FN for a while - mollie knows this. If I was scum who had an agenda of just outting the FN I just skip that step and push them or just let the townies push them when theyre already getting pushed.


Or I just get my partner to vote them because eyes are still on me.


Unless you wish to say andres is my partner.

Which I suppose is a valid response to that - and a step in the direction of getting you to actually look at the game beyond just me.

I have been concerned about andres' lack of engagement but its sitewide so I've shelved it as NAI as this is very typical for andres on d1.

[Wright and Justice]

I can't get past it. At all.

Doesn’t seem like you’re really trying, is the thing. Though is really referring to just your general approach to us, not your view on the mech stuff, though I’m sure Koba knows what they’re doing. And I am also trying to help Koba be more chill but it’s in 1 on 1 talks.

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

Mollie - yes or no - when I told you IV was possible FN, did I, or did I not say that if they were not the FN they were likely scum?

Answer honestly. No semantics.

Actually i was wrong the answer is no but I did actaully later on out this read in the hood on IV.
I at the time of the FN thing did tonally scumread IV - and i did push them at the start as you see - and i only shelved it *because* of said possibility of FN.

My bad.

However after seeing holden and gamma both express concern on IV while having my own concerns - i too agreed with this once looking over holden case.

[Wright and Justice]

so timeline:
I start game pushing on IV -> alice attacks me for ???(seriously still dont understand the initial reasoning) -> andres denies hood+refuses to ellaborate-> i back off thinking IV potentially did an FN gambit -> i still think IV is scummy if not FN -> holden starts pushing IV -> i actually remember saying in thread we should leave IV alone for the time being -> i am drunk-> i see holdens case -> i am like ye that snot bad -> gamma also thinks iv is bad and says so to me -> i share this into the hood so i have proof of progression -> i decide to sheep later on because i feel the scuminess outweighed the possibility of FN

It's really simple when you create a timeline of events.

[Wright and Justice]

what mollie assumes is that i have a strong read on IV being FN when i never actually expressed that and even my initial post stated i thought itd be between andres/IV.

[Wright and Justice]

In case you have forgotten: Justice = Gamma.

-Wright

[Wright and Justice]

Now mollie are you ever going to answer what your read is on Holden?

[Wright and Justice]

i literally beg anyone to force mollie to provide content on slots other than me i am willing to do anything at this point.


they have now implied i am lying that my first langauge is polish in our hood and i have reached my breaking point after the previous accsuatiion that i faked a post for gamma


please i fucking beg people to step up and force mollie to get into line and stop their bullshit towards me

[Wright and Justice]

@holden @T3 @flea @andres @IV

i really dont care what your read is on me i just want to stop suffering in this game from someone who is making it unbearable for me with how they interact with me.

[Wright and Justice]

i literally beg anyone to force mollie to provide content on slots other than me i am willing to do anything at this point.


they have now implied i am lying that my first langauge is polish in our hood and i have reached my breaking point after the previous accsuatiion that i faked a post for gamma


please i fucking beg people to step up and force mollie to get into line and stop their bullshit towards me

oh to follow up on this after i broke down to them begging them to stop accusing me of lying about everything they continue their damned questioning and ask me if im really from poland or not - to which i will refuse to answer because im done with this bad faith shit.

im thoroughly disgusted with you mollie and you should be ashamed of how you treat people.

PEOPLE
I am a PERSON mollie

THANK YOU.

[Wright and Justice]

i literally beg anyone to force mollie to provide content on slots other than me i am willing to do anything at this point.


they have now implied i am lying that my first langauge is polish in our hood and i have reached my breaking point after the previous accsuatiion that i faked a post for gamma


please i fucking beg people to step up and force mollie to get into line and stop their bullshit towards me

I asked you what part of Poland you were from, and you didn't answer that question.

And when I asked you to check the box as to whether Polish was your first language, you said no.

YOU ARE BEING PEDANTIC AS FUCK

[Wright and Justice]

what

RELEVANCE

is this to the game??

do you enjoy this? is this a sick perverse pleasure you get from making me upset mollie? because i keep telling you the way you approach me is upsetting me and you seem to intentionally do the thing i tell you not to.


its like you are trying to cause issues.

i dont know what your problem is with me but its just gross that you treat someone this way.

[Wright and Justice]

you are so scared to answer about a read on another player but you are perfectly fine intentionally upsetting a person by doing exactly what they told you is triggering to them.


why are you so afraid to say how you read Holden, Mollie?

[Wright and Justice]

seriously if you are town this game : it is YOUR responsibility to tell mollie to take it down a few notches at this point because i have now enough proof that mollie is just literally seeing red in *everything* I do to the point of being extremely pedantic.

[Wright and Justice]

like mollie has us to such a high standard that I have to dance for them and even if i do dance for them i still end up losing its a losing battle like i wish i literlaly randed any other person as hood or preferably the FN


please i deadass need people to actually put mollie down a few notches so they stop because i really really want to play.

[Wright and Justice]

yall sick of the mollie/I 1v1 can direct yalls concerns to mollie because if you cant see I have literally begged mollie multiple times to look outside of my slot and interact elsewhere - but hey we got 1 more person saying "stop focusing on eachother"

i'm prob not going to post much anyways for the next 24 hours anyways.

[Wright and Justice]

Spoiler: just the sampling of the number of times I've tried to push mollie into talkinga bout anyone but us

For the record mollie has refused to ellaborate kn reads on slots other than myself after being prompted several times.

The IV read feels like bullshit - also objectively it is an exact reaction that has happened from him within a scumgame on d1.

This game isnt the mollie show - so stop acting like it. You're ruining the gamestate and as is im fine policying you on the basis you keeo pushing lies despite having them proven wrong directly and quickly goalpost adjusting in response to some etc.

You're constantly putting my slot on the defensive and try to avoid talking about anyone else but me except to defend IV from us. Why did IV get special treatment? Oh wait you also shaded T3 townreading us.

This is not the play of a townie solving - this is the play of a townie tunneling, or a scum trying to powerwolf against a strong player.

I came into the hood strong and swinging and you interpreted that somehow as scum because either a)youre a townie whos playstyle clashes with how i play or b) you are scum who panicked seeing me in your hood being very proactive.


Give reads on others - in rhe same depth you’re putting forth on me - or die.

I wont budge my vote on you until you sort in more depth outside of me.

Mollie i have to conclude you are scum afraid to tread on toes and spew other people if you refuse to make reads elsewhere btw.
Im trying to push content out of you and you refuse to talk about more than just me and talk in circles about it.

Flea entrance had poor logic basis but it's town thought process for flea - > flea if you're reading this, don't trap yourself into thinking mollie vs I has to be TvS. That's not how it works. People make shit conclusions often as town. This is likely one of them.

I'm aware, I'm watching for a reason. If I get caught in this, then I get caught in my usual pit of treating a biased read as gospel.

I know you're firey, and it's that I'm watching at the moment. I haven't played with you as scum to memory so at this point it's down to hopeful pattern recognition.

My recent scumgames have been super passive and trying to be under the radar for the most part.

Honestly I keep going back and forth on mollie in my head like thinking are they town hardtunneled on me with shit logic or just scum hardfocusing me so they can get me mislimmed while avoiding spewing anyone else. (because I have tried to get them to talk about literally any other slot and its been with limited success) but its more of an 80%-20% town-scum in my head atm.

I think scum are mostly hiding in inactives is my vibe atm and I'm just waiting till it gets obvious those people are just dodging game by wearing them out via endurance for the most part as its hard to case POE rather than case who has talked xD

mollie you keep trying to circle back to talking about our slot - why wont you talk about anyone else?

Koba let me level with ya cause four shots of whiskey makes me want to KASLAM everyone.

I admire your bash stance but it's hard to follow and take you seriously when you constantly rattling off about how someone is discrediting you and ahit. It bloats your posts and adds more fuel to the flame for any would be scum read if your town. I ~think~ me and you even had something similar to you and mollie in brass harald but I can't fucking remember.
I just remember us fighting for a good while Over the tonal beats and stuff though my weak ass bitch ass is a sucker for good town atmosphere and I think I gave up.

Humble up my friend. You don't need harshness to be the leader.

At least can we both agree and actually stick with the no shit talking in the thread cause? If one of ya makes a bad red on another, let someone KASLAMM them and get us more info.

Anyways town atmosphere. We need that fucking shit. We can keep entertaining the shitshw, but we are sorely lacking in content outside of it. It's why for example Wright is prodding in the afks.

Anyfuckingways: I'm wifoming between the two being TvT or TvS due to how the thread was lax during that time. If it's TvS, the partner should of been pushing pressing off but no one did? So either it's TvS with second partner afk or it's TvT since scum is fine with the shit show.

Idk. I want to smoke

(This isn't meant to be mean or condensansing. I'm just noticing I feel irrated already and that's a bad sign)

bless you holden i love you

im also like 4 shots in but im not a lightweight hahaha

alright deal I will stop interacting with mollie - I'm already only responding to mollie within my PT for the most part.

Let's get mollie to actually talk about other slots eh?

You wont engage with us becsuse im smart enough as a player to dissect bad arguments and that kills your push against me if you acknowledge my points

Your summary of the hood is dishonestly framed - as you *yourself* avoided answering the question and never evem asked us back and just assumee we were scummy for not sharing back. This is deranged as hell for a towny. You dont interact with people like that. If you're town here - then fuckint stop ruining the game thread with this projection because its jot helpful
Yes i think theres a chance youre a townie just tossing the game over your own ego. Just own up to it if you are because its not fucking healthy for a solvestate.

If im scum here - how are you gonna find my partner? Js. You haven't even looked to solve outside of me

This game isnt the mollie show - so stop acting like it. You're ruining the gamestate and as is im fine policying you on the basis you keeo pushing lies despite having them proven wrong directly and quickly goalpost adjusting in response to some etc.

You're constantly putting my slot on the defensive and try to avoid talking about anyone else but me except to defend IV from us. Why did IV get special treatment? Oh wait you also shaded T3 townreading us.

This is not the play of a townie solving - this is the play of a townie tunneling, or a scum trying to powerwolf against a strong player.

I came into the hood strong and swinging and you interpreted that somehow as scum because either a)youre a townie whos playstyle clashes with how i play or b) you are scum who panicked seeing me in your hood being very proactive.


Give reads on others - in rhe same depth you’re putting forth on me - or die.

I wont budge my vote on you until you sort in more depth outside of me.

Oh am I that player? No. I'm not. Trying to impose another player's meta on someone is a scum tactic btw

What is your expectation of town me to say? your push is a good show? You're hilarious. Nice try.

What lies? Your premise is entirely on a small interaction in the hood and my views on mech - you misread a post i made towards you then said accused me of not sharing my side (which i think you dont really care about). Your paranoia is overblown to me.

Also youve yet to make any solid reads outside my slot- why do you keep avoiding doing so?

Also thank you for giving thoughts on others but its still a lack of depth that is a stark contrast to how you treat our slot+ no scumreads outside us.
What would a ranked list of reads look like for you?
Also regarding alice - they made a joke about my mixup with the page count and you are interpreting that as a scumread - nice agenda pushing much huh?
Stop putting words into people's mouth

mollie why are you so allergic to posts asking you to look at people outside of us?

You have ignored the prompt *several* times.

just ctrl-f'd "outside" to see how many times we have mentioned mollie to get them to talk about slots that aren't ours - its building up!
and if you go to these posts, mollie has not responded a single time


We also have asked mollie at least twice in hood to sort outside of us.

so what gives mollie why are you dodging trying to make any solid reads?

You outted your mid reads list - I now remember that - but you had not even another scumread there and it was super weak reasoning compared to what you were pushing at us. Quite a disproportionate difference - are you not reading the game or ?

Oh no this is all 1 person for the most part.

all posts from gamma are signed "Justice"

I am very capable of solo posting this much.

And I was done after my last post.

I do notice you still refuse to talk about IV and dance around making reads or interacting with content that implies sorting other slots - which is incredibly scummy.

If you wish to just keep making the case for us by proving our point about that continuously - go right ahead. I have no qualms about an easy town win.

At the moment I'm 100% sure the solve is within IV/Mollie/Alice and leaning hard on IV/Mollie purely with everyone else town.
-Wright

hey mollie in case you havent noticed, everyone else wants you to shut the fuck up about our slot and talk about other people.

just like a hint - as I've said several times recently in our PT.

Have fun tho I don't mind you digging your hole deeper, I gave you a ladder but you swiped it away.

In case people do want to know - i, while drunk, tried to push mollie into going in the direction of solving slots outside of me and not just talking about our slot as it was getting frustrating for me to constantly be unable to get mollie to stop discussing me and actually give thoughts on other people.

I did so in a way that nitpicked their entire play and pointed out things that were objectively scummy to continue to do on top of other things. Which was out of frustration with how mollie was treating the game and me.

I don't want to continue discussing this during the game and have another 3 pages of mollie vs me so this is the last you will hear about it in this thread until the postgame.

at least im pushing to actually correct this issue and have tried to reach out

@Flea what do you think of the vibes of the few posts Alice has made?
Perhaps outline how you feel if I were confirmed town vs confirmed scum in the scenario, in terms of how Alice has primarily sniped at my slot.


Their ISO is short, only 5 posts, so shouldn't be too difficult.

[Wright and Justice]

sorry

[Wright and Justice]

give a read on holden and i will stop posting for 24 hours 100% - that is my deal.

[Wright and Justice]

I wasn’t kidding when I said I’d not be able to be rlly active until at least Wednesday
Also: I would not have approved of Koba using my tag to veil their thoughts, primary reason being that I feel a kinship with actual character of Apollo Justice, and given that I prefer that we stick to the tags we opted for initially. I can be snide when I want to, I just try not to go overboard with it.

Also: I kinda forgot what mollie was trying to ask me because I saw her mention something regarding me not answering it and I am drawing a blank about it

Also also: to the point about Koba focusing on making mollie read Holden, pretty sure that’s just meant as a first step.

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

I find it hard to believe that Dkoba is coaching you. It's what they are insinuating. It wasn't snide, the comment sounded almost worshipful. Of Dkoba,

Anyways, my question to you is what your pregame notes were to Dkoba, because they made TvT early on and then picked a fight with me. I want to know what you told them. Their rage seems manufactured in the same way that your scum partner MT's did in our recent game. I have said this in the gamethread and in our hood.

lol, if it sounds worshipful of Koba it might just be, they have been a pretty great person in my experience. As heated as things can get in games, outside of them Koba is a genuinely nice person.
And my pregame notes were basically non-existent but I did say at gamestart I figured you’d be paranoid of me and I didn’t rlly know how to read you, and tbh the fact you didn’t seem to exhibit that paranoia in a way I expected is kinda what makes me distrust you (aside from the meta lies, those are bad)

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

If you knew that I would be paranoid of you then why did you act all surprised and indignant when I joked and said that I was gonna vote you outta spite with a cute emoji?

Because as I said, that wasn’t a win, though if the amount to lim was kept straight it might have been, but we were basically at the knife’s edge if we didn’t get the miselim in 10p

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

You have a lot of interest in me currently mollie, whats

your

read on me currently? You've asked a few people and nothing comes to mind when I think of you mentioning a read on me recently.

Well, I came into the game with the expectation that we would get along and that if we both town, we would have a bonding experience. It is clear you have no interest in that.

I only have one game with you, and you were reads were the worst in the game. I think you lack discernment.

So I am going to try to sort you through POE. I am just going to leave you alone and work on figuring out other people.

Ok well if you're going to talk to me like that then frankly this game just got a lot less enjoable.

I asked a simple question, got a character attack and talked down too followed by a screw you. Lovely.
Never got the answer to the question either.

tell me about it lmao


also come vote alice with us.
-wright

[Wright and Justice]

Hey Mollie?

I mean this nicely, but you need to read the thread closer.

For example:

No.

I don't even know what you are talking about here.

I asked if you had read them in isolation.

It is a simple yes or no question

.

Have you iso-ed W&J?

I am not engaging in meta, I am asking if you have looked at them in isolation.

I was going through it and there is a lot there that doesn't add up and it seems like town!you would pick up on that.

You brought up meta to this discussion at that time. I had just done a catch up and I wasn't sure what you were exactly referring to by it. Thus I ask what meta are you talking about. It's not as complicated as you make it out to be.

The post that 608 responds to also includes my stance on Dkobba which conflicts with the underline. I did answer it -- regardless if you liked it. This ties back in with the TvT stuff. Even other people in the thread like IV were saying that it was TvS when you made those posts. Yet, you kept saying it was TvT. Stuff like that

Never once have I ever said it was TvT.

Dkoba said it was before we even interacted. It came across as trying to force a perception.

In the bookmark you went from a SvS, to TvS, to possible TvT.

It really fells you are more invested in trying to prove people are scum rather then scum hunting. I mean, you jumped on T3 here for a post that says it is unrelated to game which implies you didn't also read my catch up post.

Could you please point to that post that you are talking about here? I really don't remember jumping on T3 for anything, I just wondered at one point if they were playing the "too scummy to be scum" card. I am intrigued that they were endgamed 5 times as scum.

*Holden thinks they are being slick with the tags

I think that is why George Bailey highlighted your name in unbolded red, I think. The bbc code messes up if I requote your [/m e t a ] post intacted.

Did you know that would happen?

You forgot a quote start bracket hence why it broke and when you quote the original one, it fixes the post. Try it. Press quote on 608.

1) Nope, it is also against the rules I believe
2) The meta tag you are referring to was added in on your reply. My post's code doesn't actually contained it.
3) [meta][/meta] aren't actual bbcode handlers and such wouldn't impact anything.

I thought all I did was remove the meta tag but maybe I inadvertently changed the quote tag in the process.. I thought it was funny and I thought the mod thought it was funny too, hence why they referred to it. I didn't know it was against the rules. You know I think you are funny, right? I think you bring a much levity to the game and I kinda love it

This accusation is actually pretty serious for what is outlined in 1). I would normally forgive it, but

you seem to have added the meta tag which you are claiming breaks the bbcode.

Regardless of your actual role: if you are scum, that's really fucking low and toxic. If you are town, you really need to be more careful and track . You aren't coming off as 'direct' but rather unwilling to parse things.
-------------
I spent all the free time I had before class writing this on mobile. When I'm done, I'll engage with the rest of your post. 612 just really got to me and I want to set it straight first.

Huh? The only tags I added were tags. And I apologize, I certainly meant no offense, like I said I thought it was funny, I certainly wasn't trying to get you in trouble. I think I misunderstood the tags rule, I always thought it was mod related. Like you couldn't use mod tags or something. I never really understood the rule, to be perfectly honest. I thought it was an IT thing.

I just thought you were being slick! Like a funny pun.

But I am sorry that you took it that what, it isn't what I meant.

to the highlighted: this is a lie/misrepresentation(mollie will claim otherwise because their misinterpretation is what they take as absolute fact) and just an assumption mollie made based on how i entered with the air of cooperation - the only thing i can think of where mollie thinks for whatever reason we thought this was that I offered to let eachother's RVS vote be determined by the other - which was a probe into who mollie might choose as a deeper way to read them. but apparantly mollie wanted to play the assumption game and be all like "lol that means u townread me".

these kinds of deranged conclusions dont come from a scum so really just like bin mollie as town and just ignore them from now. they got 24 hours and only just barely decided to read outside of my slot and still keep trying to make reads based on how people read my slot.

its been well over 24 hours so im coming back swinging now.


Andres - I understand being sparse in content is NAI for you ,particularly now. However - we have little time left now. Please at least force out a perspective by now. I think you should try to read in the slots that aren't Me(because you have uh yeah been inaccurate with me)/Holden/Mollie, and I wanna know how you feel about players like Flea/T3/Alice/Facebones

[Wright and Justice]

Mollie
Wj
Holden
Facebones
Flea
IV/Andres
Alice

honestly - I have no concrete scumread between Facebones-IV-Andres, IV being the weakest of them at this point - but what I am sure of is that Alice has been swept away by the pace of the game and has only popped in to egg on what I view as a TvT fight atp - in which case makes Alice scum independently. Plus IV/Facebones cannot be teammed together.

[Wright and Justice]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=87956&user_select[]=36003
btw I just finally had this scumgame finish, If you want to see how I've been generally playing as scum recently -> you can take a look here.

Alice is also in this game and had a much more solvy vibe there.

[Wright and Justice]

I think Flea is town, faer thought process so far seems rather genuine
me and koba have been pretty synced in our reads I would say, which is nice because it's sometimes a struggle to do that for me

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

My case on WJ and HGwas around T3. T3 was strongly townreading WJ and I noticed that without any reason HG put him as a townread. I had a closer look at both of the isos when HG started questioning my read on WJ indicating that it is very weak and nai arguments were used.

I just checked HG iso and their posts make sense provided that WJ is their partner. Didn't look at WJ, beside first 5 pages. Maybe something has changed.

Can you give some examples of the posts you are saying "make sense" as partnered?

Also now that a game has finished that had both of us in it, (I was Jolyne), does knowing I was Jolyne in that game change your view on me here?
-Wright

[Wright and Justice]

I was hesitant to push on IV earlier because I thought they were FN for a while - mollie knows this. If I was scum who had an agenda of just outting the FN I just skip that step and push them or just let the townies push them when theyre already getting pushed.

Like this makes no sense. You thought they were FN, so you held on pushing them, but then why didn’t you question Holden’s case more aggressively? It came quite early, so you should have pushed back on it somewhat if your belief that IV was FN was genuine. But… you didn’t. You quoted it multiple times as legitimate in fact.

I believed their ploy to claim a hood with someone who wasn't their hoodmate was a possible FN thing so i decided to avoid pushing on it but when dayplay reasons catch up with someone, the mech reason isn't going to stand in my way.

it wasn't a particularly strong FN read regardless.


I get your point about my tone/play being able to come from scum!me - but if you and I are agreeing on reads for similar reasoning and such, that should be a good sign for you. you aren't explicitly townreading me here which is usually where we "agree" on reads if I'm scum against you so take that as you will. I *did* have you in some possible teams early on if I'm being honest - around the time I was pushing IV I thought there was a chance.

Right now I'm at the point where I think its Alice-> One of Facebones/IV and if game were to not end after that i'd be thinking hard about who last scum might be.

[Wright and Justice]

im a bit "high" off the covid booster shot right now so sorry if anything in the previous didnt make sense

[Wright and Justice]

Also, perhaps I need to detail why I’m being so skeptical of W&J. Because as much as I hate to say it, they will do anything and everything to win within the bounds of the game. I have seen them get into heated fights with their Partners, absolutely railroad players that weren’t sufficiently loud but had a good grasp for what was happening, engage in blatant manipulation, claim a nonsensical PR (and get away with it!), and even outright spam the thread as Scum. Everything that’s been said about their Town game is accurate btw - it’s based a lot on gut and emotion, but it tends to be mighty accurate. They can also switch on a dime. Which is why it’s so hard to pin them down early, and why I would caution anyone about forming a hard read of the slot unless they’re leading consecutive Scum executions and truly don’t make sense as Scum (though by then, they’re usually just NK’ed).

You can stop right fucking there. Koba is not the only one steering this slot, and yet your words here illustrate that they’re the only one you’re really perceiving. That is extremely reductive and I want you to stop.

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

Also I think what AliceK is seeing regarding T3 TRing is should imo make her question T3. T3 has a way of forcing out reads as scum, which I applaud him for as my own scum strategy tends to involve putting out strong reads, but there’s a way in which he does it as scum that I think can be recognized. Do I think he’s guilty of it here, not yet. But it’s something I think one should be wary of. So it’s concerning Alice immediately jumps to accusing us and Holden vs. scrutinizing T3’s immediate TR on us for Koba’s mech talk. Koba’s theory is Alice is trying to discredit town leader slots and I’m inclined to agree via the targeting of Holden in particular.

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

You can start complaining if I personally attack you or pretend like you don’t exist. That’s not what I’m doing. What I am doing is cautioning players from settling on the collective read they have of your slot because I know a member of the hydra is willing to go to great lengths as Scum to win a game. Not sure what’s so controversial about that.

Do you think I’d sit idly by and let Koba do things I disapprove of? I’m pretty sure I’ve already had to bring them in a little. It just seems like you’re completely ignoring my influence, and that offends me. Being marginalized is one of my pet peeves.
This also feels like you’re throwing paranoia our way for very little reason. Do you ACTUALLY think we’re scum rn? If not, why the shade?

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

You haven't looked at me at all from a town perspective stop lying LMFAO

[Wright and Justice]

I'd like to point back to the game I linked where people asserted that me looking for 3P meant I was 100% scum and then got to be clowned for the take.



you aren't the first nor the last to try to tie an action that *already explained why I do from a town perspective* and twist it as only being from scum.


I 100% expect an apology from you post game after the way you have treated me even if you flip scum.


You are so caught up in this tunnel still you forgot that Facebones wagon is a thing and that Alice/Facebones can be teamed together.


Point me to a single thing Alice said that was towny - and no, sowing doubt on obvious town like Holden isn't towny.

[Wright and Justice]

stop pretending like you're a fucking saint lmfao

you have been consistently bad faith, inconsiderate, and straight up awful towards me this game and you refuse to admit it because your ego is too large.

[Wright and Justice]

its been a sludge because the 2 main pushes have been mostly quiet and not active and hey - that kinda makes it *hard* to get movement.


notice how nobody is sheeping you on my slot now?

Are you a scumhunting genius now? That you can see through me so well when others have seen the same evidence and said basically "nah thats fucking NAI garbage"

humble thyself.

[Wright and Justice]

just because townies are finding eachother without you doesn't mean townies aren't finding eachother btw mollie - it just means you're getting in the way.

[Wright and Justice]

and as for Gamma being a "good egg" and you making all those assumptions about what she would do - in all seriousness? you dont fucking know gamma well like that. you dont get to make assertions like that about people you barely know. so frankly, show some respect to gamma and dont assume things. Gamma is someone who isn't going to make me do anything.

[Wright and Justice]

like what gives YOU the right to come in and continuously assert that someone would do something in a certain way - when you know jack shit about that person other than playing a couple games with them.

you don't get to extrapolate data like that. it's upsetting gamma atp and while I'll tolerate for the most part shit you say about me I will absolutely put my foot down when you start your incessant gaslighty behavior towards gamma.

[Wright and Justice]

Votecount 1.8

AliceK(3)

~ Wright and Justice(248), T3(42), Flea The Magician(50)

Facebones(2)

~ innocentvillager(104), HoldenGolden(69)

Wright and Justice(1)

~ piratemollie(129)


Not Voting (3): Facebones(14), AliceK(7), Andresvmb(12)

With 9 alive it takes 5 to eliminate.

Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2021-12-05 18:49:25)

FLAVOR

"All of you start running back to school."

"Things get worse."

btw if anyone wants a smart read on why wagons are not moving - 2 people off wagon are people who are getting wagoned which can strongly suggest that those people are both scum together!!

And the alternative theory? - IV is scum with Alice.

So in both worlds.

Alice scum.

I don't think there's any other worlds really past Alice + one of IV/Facebone atp.

[Wright and Justice]

How I reached this solve you may ask?

Let's start by removing the people I am sure are not scum: Holden + Flea + Piratemollie +Andres

Now we have left: T3, IV, Alice, Facebones

T3 unpaired with IV and Alice
IV unpaired with Facebones(mech) and T3
Alice unpaired with T3
Facebones unpaired with IV(mech)

From that we have:
T3/Facebones (I have a light townread on T3 but I just never fully trust T3 atp because I've been snowed so many times but also am hesitant to send a scumread there because i've also mislimmed them a few times recently)
Alice/IV
Alice/Facebones

And thus - this is why I have my vote currently on Alice and have no issue with the FB wagon.
IV has towntold to a degree recently but I still see concerns regarding what FB claims they said in the hood - which I'd like to see IV explain why they said such things.


But this is where my thought process is at.

[Wright and Justice]

eta: lol. I guess Gamma went AWOL. That isn't Gamma., lmao

You clearly don’t know anything about me based on this. I’m dead serious that being marginalized is something I dislike in all corners of life. I have to struggle to get a word in edgewise with my family because they cannot shut up for long enough to actually allow a natural break to occur for me to chime in when I’d like to. It’s straight-up problematic that your reaction to me expressing a real problem I have IRL is to discard my feelings. Might I bring up I can’t recall a single significant interaction between us outside of playing mafia? There have been people who have chosen to get to know me outside of just playing mafia. You haven’t, and yet here you are claiming to be an authority on how I feel. That doesn’t feel okay, and while it’s a struggle to write this out, I think letting this go unspoken is way worse for me. I appreciate Koba also sticking up for me, but I need to put this out there myself as well.

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

good to know that 3 of my town-ish reads are possible FN atp so roleswap is possible.

FN should holster their ability atp btw if you havent used it by this point and save it for if you are run up and people are deadset on limming you (unlikely with the pool of people who are FN)

the coincidences andres sets out are way too much especially since IV tried to claim a hood with andres.


it is possible IV went into scumchat -> saw andres was a hoodmate -> and then slipped in main thread.

@Facebones did you say anything in hood chat before IV claimed a hood with andres?

[Wright and Justice]

let me look at the previous run of this setup and see how the scum pt was setup since it was run by GB too

[Wright and Justice]

nvm - last time GB didn't list who the hoodmates were so such a mixup is weird to have

viewtopic.php?f=90&t=84054

Subject: Micro 965 | Meet me in the Backrooms | The Tunnels Scum PT

"Convenient tunnels that lead to everyone's room."

Spoiler:

---

Welcome

NorwegianboyEE

Marquis Loki Dokie

, Ş̸̤̼̹̼̂̄̃̑̓̋͒̔̈́͆̃̈́͜͠ö̸̙̟̦͇̎̕m̵͙̻͇̙̤̘͍̣̒̏͂͆̒̎̅͑̄́̋̈́̉͘͝è̶͙̯t̷̤̗͔̝̬͙̳̭́̅́̌̔̏̏̓̃͐́̅̄̿ḧ̸̢͖͕̗͓̫̪́̀̿͂̍̊̈̊̑̆͝ͅį̷̲̤̞̜͓͜͝ͅn̴̨̨̗̩̦̯͔͈̺̣̘̎̈͒̑̅͌̈́͂̐̒̕͝ǵ̷̨̺̤̰͙̥̜͙͍͈̺̲̰͊̓͛͐͜ͅ

,

tn5421, Ş̸̤̼̹̼̂̄̃̑̓̋͒̔̈́͆̃̈́͜͠ö̸̙̟̦͇̎̕m̵͙̻͇̙̤̘͍̣̒̏͂͆̒̎̅͑̄́̋̈́̉͘͝è̶͙̯t̷̤̗͔̝̬͙̳̭́̅́̌̔̏̏̓̃͐́̅̄̿ḧ̸̢͖͕̗͓̫̪́̀̿͂̍̊̈̊̑̆͝ͅį̷̲̤̞̜͓͜͝ͅn̴̨̨̗̩̦̯͔͈̺̣̘̎̈͒̑̅͌̈́͂̐̒̕͝ǵ̷̨̺̤̰͙̥̜͙͍͈̺̲̰͊̓͛͐͜ͅ

• Daytalk
  : Day/Night talk my dude
  
• Quoting
  : You can directly quote anything
  from
  the public thread
  into
  this PT. You
  may not
  directly quote
  from
  this PT
  into
  anywhere (except for posts written by you and clearly drafted with the intent to be later posted in the main thread by you).
  
• Privacy
  : If you want this PT kept private after the game, please tell me sometime between now and 24 hours after the game ends.
  
• Have fun!

People with access to this topic: GeorgeBailey, Datisi, Micc

[Wright and Justice]

i think the remaining 3 people are all town, i think my hood is TvT, so Alice is 100% the best lim IMO.

[Wright and Justice]

It's possible that a scum facebones tells scum alice about what IV did in their hood


honestly we just need a timeline for when things happened here, lets use in game pages as a time marker so we dont go into the realm of quoting private topics ->

basically outline actions in hood in relation to posts in thread/page in thread.

I just want a general idea of what theories are viable right now.

[Wright and Justice]

holden come hammer

[Wright and Justice]

Goodbye andres o7

[Wright and Justice]

i mean they were both wagons at the same time that refused to vote for each other so lol

[Wright and Justice]

nor did they even remotely look at eachother in any sort of critical light

[Wright and Justice]

FB IV Mollie PoE

No deviation

[Wright and Justice]

Mollie refused to solve during night and instead made excuses for 1 aspect they pushed us on and gave 0 reads or reaction to the flip so im cool policying the slot

[Wright and Justice]

Also nice to town with you and not scumread eachother finally Andres o7

[Wright and Justice]

Like the summary of the night chat is: mollie accusing gamma of stuff that they "let me" do things that made them fos us (???)
While not stating an updated read or anything and when prompted several times by me to state reads based on flip - i was straight up ignored.
One thing going for them is that we weren't nightkilled as i threatened to hard push their slot next dayphase if they refused to answer anything game related.

Also i brought up how mollie made a pillow statement against alice d1 as well as alice treating my slot differently than mollie - labeling mollie as town.

So this isnt just being upset at being ignored - this has other substance to it that goes beyond.

I'd like FB and IV to make a case for who they thin remaining scum is.

I dont mind if you accuse someone in holden/flea/t3 trio and i wont attack you for that basis so long as you bring a thought process. It's fine to brainstorm and tinfoil here as we want to not leave possibilities unchecked - and being in PoE is a powerful position for reading.

[Wright and Justice]

i mean like if they seemed unaligned with alice even remotely id be like "yep ok lost as fuck townie" but alice v mollie interactions are gross as hell

[Wright and Justice]

VOTE: facebones
It’s between this and mollie for me rn
But I’m basically done in the hood atp

-Justice, who always is, always will be, and

always has been

Gamma

[Wright and Justice]

Like the summary of the night chat is: mollie accusing gamma of stuff that they "let me" do things that made them fos us (???)

I am going to cut you off here, because this isn't how the timeline flows and you know it. You are lying about how things transpired. LYING.

And marginalizing Gamma, who is the only person I talked to in the hood, and we had several back and forths that you are intentionally leaving out. The only time I addressed you was when I accidentally misgendered you while trying to phone post while talking about you to Gamma. I hate quoting while phone posting. So I switched to a computer and did not double check, I just copy-pasta it to my computer.

I am in the middle of something right now, but when I get back I am going to break down everything that Gamma and I discussed.

cos it's delicious.

ok.

the point was u gave 0 reads and didnt comment at all on alice's scum flip lol

[Wright and Justice]

like deadass i asked mollie who they think is scum after the alice scumflip and they couldnt even answer a simple question


also im overriding the FB vote, mollie x alice interactions are way too gross to ignore especially if mollie is suddenly not wanting to talk about the current gamestate after the flip has happened VOTE: Mollie

[Wright and Justice]

that's E-2.

[Wright and Justice]

And btw most of what mollie said to me was basically trying to turn me against Koba, telling me that they were the one who should be apologizing for the situation of mollie calling certain posts of mine not mine, which I do not approve of, because out of the the posts she did that with, 2 of the 3 were ones that were me spilling my guts on some personal struggles of mine. So it wasn’t cool that mollie basically tried to dodge responsibility for in essence saying “I don’t believe you when you say you have these struggles”.

-Justice

[Wright and Justice]

mollie state a single read challenge (impossible)

-wright

[Wright and Justice]

you lack reading comprehension - because look at the last sentence. Andres clearly stated that the previous in that paragraph should be discarded if im just leading town elims.


What did Alice flip?

Who was the primary pusher of Alice?

Who was Alice trying to discredit within nearly all their posts?

[Wright and Justice]

Call us scum here.

I dare you.

[Wright and Justice]

Hello everyone. Wow already 5 pages. But most of it comes from Wright and Justice.

Oh nevermind its only 2 pages but its felt like 4
I think my brain messed up thread pages with hood

Maybe you misunderstood with a scum thread (;

Didn't find enough time to catch up, but from few first pages I think Wright and Justice is scum.
1) discussing mechanics and providing optimal strategy is a cheap way to get towncred, you don't need to do reads and probably people wouldn't reveal their hoods anyway. T3 got baited for that.
2) self-meta thing is something scummy as wellg
, I definitely can see Kobba trying to replicate the same style as scum.
If it worked as town why wouldn't it work as scum.

Also Mollie revealing their hood is quite controversial which usually comes from town as you can never know how town will react to that.

Mollie, T3 - town
Wright and Justice - scum

Will read the rest of the thread tomorrow. Probably I'm quite behind.

Didn't find enough time to catch up, but from few first pages I think Wright and Justice is scum.
1) discussing mechanics and providing optimal strategy is a cheap way to get towncred, you don't need to do reads and probably people wouldn't reveal their hoods anyway. T3 got baited for that.
2) self-meta thing is something scummy as wellg
, I definitely can see Kobba trying to replicate the same style as scum.
If it worked as town why wouldn't it work as scum.

Also Mollie revealing their hood is quite controversial which usually comes from town as you can never know how town will react to that.

Mollie, T3 - town
Wright and Justice - scum

Will read the rest of the thread tomorrow. Probably I'm quite behind.

1) "could be scum" is a shit reason. You are accusing me that I would never do that as town(which is impossible as a) I did it in a previous iteration of this setup, b) I am town this game) so nice try alice
2) I self meta on the regular as town. Wanna get dunked on? I refuse to talk about self meta as *scum* because it makes it harder for me actually. A conclusion with no basis in fact.

Take a shot and reread it.

Alice: why is 1) scum lean and not NAI? That logic only makes sense if you come from it with the notion that they are scum only. Show me why it's AI.

Yes it is not scum only thing of course, but I can see a plan to attack anyone who doesn't abide by proposed startegy to be attacked (Mollie). That's scummy. Other than that which is not talking place here, when you do mech talk without doing reads.

I think Wright and Justice can be partnered with HoldenGolden. I think they push the same agenda. I will elaborate on this later.

My case on WJ and HGwas around T3. T3 was strongly townreading WJ and I noticed that without any reason HG put him as a townread. I had a closer look at both of the isos when HG started questioning my read on WJ indicating that it is very weak and nai arguments were used.

I just checked HG iso and their posts make sense provided that WJ is their partner. Didn't look at WJ, beside first 5 pages. Maybe something has changed.

My case on WJ and HGwas around T3. T3 was strongly townreading WJ and I noticed that without any reason HG put him as a townread. I had a closer look at both of the isos when HG started questioning my read on WJ indicating that it is very weak and nai arguments were used.

I just checked HG iso and their posts make sense provided that WJ is their partner. Didn't look at WJ, beside first 5 pages. Maybe something has changed.

Can you give some examples of the posts you are saying "make sense" as partnered?

Also now that a game has finished that had both of us in it, (I was Jolyne), does knowing I was Jolyne in that game change your view on me here?
-Wright

They mentioned T3!Town only once, then it dropped to null. It is basically the timing of their read. What happened?
1. You start talking about mech.
2. Because of that (or maybe something else) you pocketed T3.
3. HG starts to tr'ing T3.

7/8 posts mention my slot in a negative light.

Please tell us more about how we are partnered with this.

I really need a good laugh.

I consider this game solved.
Donezo.

It's heavily likely either you or Facebonez.

And tbh i really wanna get rid of you first.

What I think is you are frozen scum who was desperate as fuck to get us mislimmed and failed miserably and are now grasping at anything to advance the gamestate.


and no, I will not be sorry if you flip town because I think everyone playing here will agree that with a scum lim secured you're a perfectly safe person to elim.

[Wright and Justice]

I’m not sure here

maybe I will relook mollie

also no longer convinced WJ is town either for some reason

part of me is considering the Alice got bussed hard equity

oh fuck off

[Wright and Justice]

"bussed hard"

yes i randomly fucking bussed alice when the lim was between you and facebonez IV, very fucking smart lmfao

[Wright and Justice]

so i planned to bus alice from *checks notes* before post 113?

[Wright and Justice]

no im not going through this fucking wifom bus bullshit again

[Wright and Justice]

i just finished a game last week where i buried a scum gamma and the next dayphase had people like you IV being all paranoid that i bussed gamma when gamma was shading my slot subtly *IN A SIMILAR WAY ALICE WAS HERE*


fun fact: its a consistent scumtell when someone is egging on shade on a town slot, i.e. me.


also, fun factoid: a scumgame with alice in it just finished recently, let's link it and look at how alice was in that game, shall we?
i admit i was spectating that other game and part of my read was based from that game to be more confident in it.


IV, you either case mollie or FB.

the time for tinfoil garbage is not today unless you actually find evidence

i dont want to see dumb vague accusations against T3/Me/Holden/Flea.

if you think one of us is scum, you need to come in swinging with a case not a bunch of "could be's"

[Wright and Justice]

it's also possible im just town who buried a person who was shading me all game


so frankly your point is like pretty garbage and not conclusive

[Wright and Justice]

Hello everyone. Wow already 5 pages. But most of it comes from Wright and Justice.

this is post 113

alice immediately opens with shade towards my slot.

while im being attacked by mollie.

[Wright and Justice]

have people forgotten what occam's razor is?

yall can fucking reeval me on d3 or d4.

today is not the day

today is where you follow the people who actually gave results that are proven


because i got my hands dirty and i got something out of it.


im not in the mood to fight off this bullshit.

[Wright and Justice]

it's also possible im just town who buried a person who was shading me all game


so frankly your point is like pretty garbage and not conclusive

Of course it is and I never made any such claim it’s conclusive what

I feel like to you everything is so black and white

well its frankly a noobtown thing that people try to use as evidence and why im fucking sick of this game because people keep using it against me when i roll town.



see: mollie

see: quick/darby/STD in a recent normal that finished



literally stop trying to tinfoil this way and you will immensely improve your accuracy i promise you

i used to do this and i had shit reads this way and i stopped and now scum fear me being at the table as town

[Wright and Justice]

IV, you either case mollie or FB.

the time for tinfoil garbage is not today unless you actually find evidence

i dont want to see dumb vague accusations against T3/Me/Holden/Flea.

if you think one of us is scum, you need to come in swinging with a case not a bunch of "could be's"

lol you don’t get to tell me what to do sorry

oh yeah?
you literally did the same shit claim scum gambit as alice in your hood and also andres said they wanted your head, so frankly i would not talk back like this in your position.

I think coincidences can be real and you have a town meta of doing this so i see viability that town you could have done the former and the latter is bunk because andres was declared clear off of the alice flip.


now see ^ this is how a good player thinks about things they might think are scumtells -> but really aren't.

[Wright and Justice]

well consider someone who was tinfoiled in a recent game in a similar way and mislimmed off of it when they were pushing last scum start of that day.



i dont need that shit in my last game before i take a break.

[Wright and Justice]

viewtopic.php?p=13132580#p13132580
look at this triple tinfoil from loltownies who can't handle that someone was able to decisively catch scum so quickly on d2.

[Wright and Justice]

this is how i feel coming into this day and getting 0 credit for the push i hard shoved over facebonez - who cannot be my partner here if im scum.

so if im scum, i saved a town facebonez who was mostly doomed for my scumbud alice who wasn't even on anyone's radar except mine.

[Wright and Justice]

831 was a p rude post and I’m not a fan of the way you’re talking to me

im giving you a free lesson in discarding NAI points that has helped me improve

it will 100% improve your accuracy in being able to find bad pushes.

the technique of looking for reasons why a certain string of events/action being called scum could come from a town perspective (within reason) is a successful way of saving LHF slots from being mislimmed.

[Wright and Justice]

Spoiler: mollie posts about alice

How are you reading holden here, mollie?

I think they're solidly town based on how their thought process presents itself looking at other people, despite being a bit odd. And with this i think they are actually trying to solve the game, notably with how they were interacting with my slot, about myself and people like t3.

Mollie i have to conclude you are scum afraid to tread on toes and spew other people if you refuse to make reads elsewhere btw.
Im trying to push content out of you and you refuse to talk about more than just me and talk in circles about it.

There is only like 5 minutes trying you "trying to push content" out of me and your first non-belligerent post.

I went to the bathroom and did my nightly skincare routine. I mean I can do that, yeah?

I am keeping my cards close to my chest because I am waiting to hear more content from other players. This is just my playstyle, especially in neighborhood game, when I suspect my neighbor is scum.

I already said, I think IV is town because I think they intuitively picked up on the over-explaining of the post that they reacted to, that I liked. I think that they picked up on that it seemed scum motivated. It is a weak read.

I have a weak scumread on T3, but I can't decide if I think this is a playstyle thing.

I need more content from Holden.

I am not sure why you expect me to be able to read the players that have barely posted.

Do you have reads on them? I see you are voting Alice but she also FOSed you so :/

I outted an FN read and they interpreted me as only fishing for FN(in the same post I outted a couple reads on Alice + Flea)

It's a misrepresentation and I won't elaborate one it because its blatantly antitown to share my PR reads when they are actually good.

So....

this is the second time that Dkoba is answering a question aimed at me with the intent of discrediting me, before I had a chance to respond.

This is what I mean by trying to control the narrative in lieu of scumhunting.

I mean, is Koba's description wrong? Koba outed who they thought might be FN, and didn't push the discussion past that point. And from personal experience, koba is notable as being able to pick up on certain PR tells

-Justice

Yes. He left out the part about IV being easy to crack. He went after IV then backed off and he is in the hood saying that he thinks the FN is between is between IV/Andres. His only scumread is Alice, who has only posted twice, once to FOS you guys. :/

His priorities are clear; he is power role hunter over scumhunting. I mean in his head, his townreads should be IV/Andres/Flea/Me but that is the POV he is navigating from. He is just trying to cross off FN candidates.

Yes. He left out the part about IV being easy to crack. He went after IV then backed off and he is in the hood saying that he thinks the FN is between is between IV/Andres. His only scumread is Alice, who has only posted twice, once to FOS you guys. :/

His priorities are clear; he is power role hunter over scumhunting. I mean in his head, his townreads should be IV/Andres/Flea/Me but that is the POV he is navigating from. He is just trying to cross off FN candidates.

Oh, I agree with those townreads but that isn't what you are saying.

You keep asking me who is your partner, but you haven't said who you thought Alice's partner was. So I will ask because if I don't you will discredit me because I assumed that you would be more forthcoming.

Who is Alice's partner?

Oh would be protown play to stop posting for an hour and allow other interaction to occur.

I am one person trying to post, and I can't keep up with both of you spamming the thread.

Didn't find enough time to catch up, but from few first pages I think Wright and Justice is scum.
1) discussing mechanics and providing optimal strategy is a cheap way to get towncred, you don't need to do reads and probably people wouldn't reveal their hoods anyway. T3 got baited for that.
2) self-meta thing is something scummy as wellg
, I definitely can see Kobba trying to replicate the same style as scum.
If it worked as town why wouldn't it work as scum.

Also Mollie revealing their hood is quite controversial which usually comes from town as you can never know how town will react to that.

Mollie, T3 - town
Wright and Justice - scum

Will read the rest of the thread tomorrow. Probably I'm quite behind.

You are like a breath of fresh air.

mollie has played a game that is predicated on avoiding engaging with anyone.
-
in our hood I tried to engage mollie on reads on other slots before the hood was outted but mollie refused to - a pattern that can even be seen in this thread.

You tried to engage me on a scum!IV read, right after they voted you.

The next person you go after is Alice, who FOSED you.

Then you say that you think the friendly neighbor is in IV/Andres.

Now IV/Me are a scumteam.

I have asked you several times to point to the posts where I lied and you disproved them. Because I don't remember that happening.

I asked you something else and you never answered.

If you are town then the protown thing would be to go back and answer the questions in order to avoid hypocrisy (accusation aimed at me) because otherwise YOU are the one who is projecting your shit on

me.

You have given zero reads with depth. "Oh Holden's town entrance looks good!", was your read on another player while demanding more depth from my reads in which I have repeatedly said, were weak due to not being enough content at the time. Oh! You said Flea's entrance looked good too.

Flea entrance had poor logic basis but it's town thought process for flea - > flea if you're reading this, don't trap yourself into thinking mollie vs I has to be TvS. That's not how it works. People make shit conclusions often as town. This is likely one of them.

Holden is town for similar reasoning in terms of a deeper thought process being shown + actual solviness.

Facebones is above the line in terms of towniness for me, the entrance reminds me of when we played together and they were town.

mollie is just loltown who thinks they are good at mafia and are trying to push a read on a player who is being a leader. fun fact: this doesnt help ever and you are just going to be cited as a major reason town lost if we do lose.

Andres/IV I will revisit later

Gamma says they think T3 is towny, I dont think i can read T3 so I will just let them have that here. they still are near the bottom for me, above facebones though.

that leaves Alice as the odd one out here -> I think from all angles they are scum here. Well. Not all angles. But from the theories I have currently about the game this is how I feel.


Also if you think mollie has good points against me, think about your read accuracy in games yourself especially towards me in the past and then slowly deposit your agreement into the trash.

Who is Alice's partner again?

Or are you still adhering to IV/me scum?

I mean, I can't tell. There is a distinct lack of progression in these reads, and scream cog-dis, because you cannot get wild about the idea that IV/me are a scumteam, and vote/push Alice simultaneously.

Votecount 1.4

innocentvillager(2)

~ HoldenGolden(54), T3(33)

Wright and Justice(1)

~ piratemollie(84)

Facebones(1)

~ innocentvillager(87)

AliceK(1)

~ Wright and Justice(208)


Not Voting (4): Facebones(8), AliceK(5), Flea The Magician(24), Andresvmb(7)

With 9 alive it takes 5 to eliminate.

Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2021-12-05 18:49:25)

FLAVOR

I thought AliceK was voting W&J?

Difference is they reacted calmly and didn't come to us hackles raised.

They did this the second I raised suspicion about them and didn't go along with their plan. I have been trying to talk to Gamma all game, cause I can get a better read on them. What I have been trying to determine is if this aggressive overreaction is coming from a resentment they had pregame (which would make it genuine) or if Gamma told Dkoba that if they got into it with me, and soak up my time, they were guaranteed to get townread (scum motivated).

Morning Tweet did this by overblowing fake outrage at my misreading of one her posts, and she was Gamma's scum partner. She soaked up half a page with her bluster.

Gamma still hasn't answered that question to them. And I stopped replying to Dkoba ever since I asked for help, except for one post where I reached out because of a Polish commonality and they got weirdly defensive about it. Gamma, who are the only ones I am responding to, posted and I explained how it came across as an ethnic slur/dog whistle and I am not okay with that. Apparently I misinterpreted their over-defensiveness of it.

Mine and Gamma's exchanges have been fine. With Dkoba, I feel like I am interacting with FOX news. "Stand down Gamma" wtf is that shit? lmao

I do not believe that Gamma made that one post signed by Justice.

I honestly think they are scum. I still think Gamma is a good egg, but still scum, and I think they are hiding behind Dkoba's playstyle a bit. Dkoba is a bad egg and seems like obvious scum to me.

I had a good case but it has been buried. Not a sinlge person has refuted it, not one, including W&J.

I think I might have gained 24 hours of peace, and I need to make good on my end of the bargain,
so:

@Holden

- let's tango

@AliceK

- could you plz unpack your W&J/Holden for me? I feel I see where I might getting that, because Dkoba referred to mine's and our hood as TvT before we had even interacted. I felt like Dkoba was trying to force me into perception that they were town, and that they knew that I was. Holden immediately jumped to TvT, it was the post that I reposted and bookmarked. I want to engage with Holden in order to get a feel so I can get a better read.

My read on Holden is the only read that Dkoba is weirdly obsessed with, and they are townreading them. Wouldn't my opinions on Alice and Facebones be more important, since they are scumreading them? But w/e I am giving it a rest. Y'all either see it or you don't.

I did find Holden's comment about Facebones abbreviating to be funny though. My absolute favorite post in the entire thread so far <3. It would make my heart sing if I could get a townread on them.

Sorry for being inactive for so long. I think should be prodded... Can anyone give me a short catchup?

W&J is pushing for your lim and you have an outstanding question to you, about what you meant when you said that Holden and W&J seem to have the same agenda.

Could you plz answer that one?

Mollie
Wj
Holden
Facebones
Flea
IV/Andres
Alice

I disagree with this list, but I have noticed that you have navigating the entire game from this perspective and that there is internal consistency with your external output (posts). So are going into the town pile for now.

I think Flea is town, faer thought process so far seems rather genuine
me and koba have been pretty synced in our reads I would say, which is nice because it's sometimes a struggle to do that for me

-Justice

It is a struggle with me too. Mine and majiffy's Beauty and the Beast hydra was so bad I am shocked we never got banned from games, lol. We used to fight over the vote in the game thread.

I am not really loving Alice's asking for a catch up and then dips.

So I had a thought. I've been reading these odd and morbid manuscripts of unspeakable evil and have ponder its applications. In a fit of transcendent brilliance, I realize that one could infuse the negative social energies of a cud de sac into a being. Thus my work begun beating an AI with a digitally crafted stick. The pain mirroring that of which we all have felt, one time or another. In the end, the sickening sacrifice was finished and now it paints its pixelated surfaces with its dread. Like all artist, it's depressed and inflicted with deep rooted daddy issues. Like Picasso or myself. However Like all good entertainers, repression hides the all consuming void of illness to fulfill commissions.

Signor Wombo.ai bespeaks that you gaze upon its newest psychedelic piece dubbed 'Happy Mafia'.

Spoiler: Happy Mafia

Let's us all admire and treasure this new addition to the game while willfully ignoring that the donkey has been busy with LDOC and finals starting Friday.

(Catching up now)

You could be a copped confirmed scumlordz and I wouldn't ever vote this game because of the levity you bring to it.

No fair!

Fortunately I think you might be town this game. Where are you at with your reads?

I am very much liking IV for town. I kinda get a decent vibe from T3 but they are one to watch due to their apparent longevity in games as scum.

Andres has yet to play. I personally kind of like yours and FB's exchanges. Alice isn't following up on any of her posts.

And that's where I am at.

Also, perhaps I need to detail why I’m being so skeptical of W&J. Because as much as I hate to say it, they will do anything and everything to win within the bounds of the game. I have seen them get into heated fights with their Partners, absolutely railroad players that weren’t sufficiently loud but had a good grasp for what was happening, engage in blatant manipulation, claim a nonsensical PR (and get away with it!), and even outright spam the thread as Scum. Everything that’s been said about their Town game is accurate btw - it’s based a lot on gut and emotion, but it tends to be mighty accurate. They can also switch on a dime. Which is why it’s so hard to pin them down early, and why I would caution anyone about forming a hard read of the slot unless they’re leading consecutive Scum executions and truly don’t make sense as Scum (though by then, they’re usually just NK’ed).

I have found that the only way to read players like this is to read them through town perspective and then a scum perspective. The combined spam posting + pr hunting points to a non-town alignment.

I didn't find Holden's case towny since it is predicated on IV's readslist being scummy for being nuanced. I

do

wonder how much of this is impacted by my hard tr on IV.

I also find it interesting that Holden is saying that when a game is this sludgey, it usually indicates that scum are okay with the gamestate - which seems to be slowly moving to an AliceK lim - and then says that they will lim Alicek.

Let's be honest, at that point in the game, town was too dysfunctional for AliceK to be a scum!lim.

My biggest thing on Holden is that he is trying to force a narrative (scummy motivated) rather than to probe deeper into why there is a lack of a town cohesive one (town motivated).

And there is Gamma, and Gamma is pretty scummy here.

eta: lol. I guess Gamma went AWOL. That isn't Gamma., lmao

look at the progression mollie has against alice - and when alice starts becoming inevitable i think they slip ->

look at that they say "well alice hasn't been answering stuff thats kinda scummy idk " and then suddenly they switch gears and its a jarring difference "no alice can't flip scum because town isnt working together".

[Wright and Justice]

oh nice there was a [/spoiler] tag hanging out somewhere in those quotes so it broke the 2nd to last post lol

but it does nicely highlight the last 2 posts mollie had about alice which is what i want to highlight the most anyways

[Wright and Justice]

a town mollie - i feel at least - would have actually had a little consideration for the fact that alice flipped scum. scum mollie here thinks they are stuck and dont know what to do now that the gamestate is impossible to push on us.

[Wright and Justice]

and in case you think that i was accusing you of bad tinfoiling out of just bad faith of putting you down IV, I used to have the same problem and I have just the game where I tinfoil someone who flipped 2 scum till the end from last year, it was really atrocious: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... -Tactics-1

[Wright and Justice]

hey peeps, currently in a pain flare.

AliceK lurkscum meta established.

People really are iking their wine today too from what I've seen.


also not touching Mollie/Koba discussion with a barge pole I am avoiding all of that *big sweepy hand gestures*

Can you tackle the mollie/alice associatives - i dont care abour their interactions towards me.

[Wright and Justice]

Can we not fn speculate

I'm manipulating mafia, hoped you would pick up on it.
I do know who FN is so its not speculation.

[Wright and Justice]

UNVOTE:

[Wright and Justice]

VOTE: facebones

[Wright and Justice]

facebones mafia everyone else town

[Wright and Justice]

ez prodge

also sorry was really demotivated from the you know what that happened

[Wright and Justice]

never seen anyone ever tank the towniness of a slot upon replace in but now ive seen it
VOTE: pooky

[Wright and Justice]

have been boopethed.

Will be catching up later to see whats what.

ur replaced lol

[Wright and Justice]

i want pooky to read the game and actually try solving

their MT vote on replace int was not good considering MT"s content in the game thus far, suggesting he hadn't even bothered reading.

and i'm not allowing pooky to coast by at all.

[Wright and Justice]

viewtopic.php?f=84&t=83068
@IV here's a baseline of how Holden's towngame operates if you want to see an example and see if there's anyway you can see that it's viable from your POV for them here.

[Wright and Justice]

who out of gamma/koba do you think never signs posts

[Wright and Justice]

viewtopic.php?f=84&t=83068
@IV here's a baseline of how Holden's towngame operates if you want to see an example and see if there's anyway you can see that it's viable from your POV for them here.

I do think it a bit suspicious how Mx. Slick hasn't even looked at any other slot post flip
He was convinced the scum team pre-flip was Alice and myself (towards the end of the day, after he figured out IV wasn't going to be as easily incriminated as he would've hoped and was finished with his WJ/Molly TvS bullshit)

I was saved by the skin of my teeth thanks to Koba (first round on me next time we're at the pub)

Then D2 started, and I was about to give up until IV convinced me to try and get my thoughts out in the game thread instead of admitting defeat and giving up, which I like to believe I did. I tried my best to explain myself so people can see where I'm coming from, and Mx. Slick was not willing to view anything I said from a towny perspective, instead trying to cast shade upon me and and share some rather ridiculous, skewed notions about some sort of plan I've concocted to win as mafia on the second game day?

It's inciting paranoia around my slot, and I don't think it's being done in good faith.

can you look at the town game i linked for holden and tell me how you feel?

[Wright and Justice]

pooky cant push me here bc i buried a scum lololol

[Wright and Justice]

if Facebones flips scum I demand you townread me for lyfe

Alice flipped scum and its a 2 scum game

Dumbtell denied

[Wright and Justice]

Stop pretending you didnt see the scum flip because we discussed it in thread when you were around

[Wright and Justice]

unless pooky is fn theres no way he was ignorant bc of hoods existing

[Wright and Justice]

to be fair i read almost nothing from my own slot and wright's and it turned out okay enough

You posted analysis tho

[Wright and Justice]

Tweetie

is there anyone more easy to pockit

Than DKKoba?

Be honest

So pocketed i got scum d1 and refused to listen to anyone else.

Whos pocketing me?

[Wright and Justice]

Why does no one ever think I'm towny?
This is a bunch of bullshit, yo

you're very pleasnt!! But when you're giving reads (Like when you were giving your insight into Wright v. PB, or your read on T3, or your opinion on mollie tunneling Wright), it just feels like you're very safe and noncommital

holden was a lot more bold and a lot more genuineness shone through -- with you it felt more like the baseline of what one might imagine a townie would say rather than genuine ideas coming into your head

if i may ask what do you think you've done that you wouldnt/couldnt/whatver do as scum. What makes you feel towny. So basically ditto on what IV said

Didnt need to look far to see MT posted depth that would have drowned you based on how much you've shown pooky

Flea wasnt exactly the strongest townread i was just ok with fae bc fae was also the target of mollie being an absolute jerk and i sympathized and didnt want them to turn on me too to pressure mollie to stop

[Wright and Justice]

Tweetie

is there anyone more easy to pockit

Than DKKoba?

Be honest

So pocketed i got scum d1 and refused to listen to anyone else.

Whos pocketing me?

me

Im very difficult to pocket lol

[Wright and Justice]

The only way to pocket me is if you actually help flip scum - MT slot doesnt fit that criteria