Micro 1038: Brass and Shrapnel - Game Over

[UNOwen]

Hello everyone.

VOTE: Little Green Wheels

[UNOwen]

So I guess we just play mafia.

Good idea.

UNVOTE: Little Green Wheels
VOTE: Eden'sFlame

[UNOwen]

Oh another kiwi. I'll sheep.
VOTE: LGW

Do you think the point is good?

[UNOwen]

zefiend is zetown.

We should just play the game out.

Still a good idea. What do you think about the votes against you?

[UNOwen]

Explain why to me, would you?

I don't think scum puts in the effort when the game is starting this slow. More likely to be earnest town.

[UNOwen]

VOTE: unowen

What's the thinking here?

[UNOwen]

Hope all had a merry Christmas or otherwise good day yesterday.

UNVOTE: Eden
VOTE: Little Green Wheels

E-1.

[UNOwen]

1. You weren't asking about a vote on you.
2. Phrasing. "Explain why to me" rings like someone wanting to understand the reasoning behind the vote. "What's the thinking here" feels a little more like what someone says when they know there are valid reasons to consider them scum and are wondering if the player is voting them for a good reason or is right for the wrong reasons.

I think there was a good or at least reasonable reason for LGW to vote me there.

[UNOwen]

The slip was in #38 (first quote above, stating without qualification that there's a mafia doc) not #57 (LGW's attempt to excuse the slip).

Is your read on LGW entirely based on believing that post 38 was a slip?

[UNOwen]

If LGW ever feels like explaining their vote against me then an explanation for the unvote would be good too.

[UNOwen]

You first.

If I gave a possible reason for your vote before you give the actual reason then that would defeat the point of asking.

So no, you first.

[UNOwen]

Votes against Eden are agreeable.

[UNOwen]

Why?

I think complaining that they're having difficulty getting involved but not posting in a way that's likely to change that is suspicious.

Btw:

The slip was in #38 (first quote above, stating without qualification that there's a mafia doc) not #57 (LGW's attempt to excuse the slip).

Is your read on LGW entirely based on believing that post 38 was a slip?

[UNOwen]

As for what's stopping me is I usually need a good amount of content to analyze to form any real conclusions to be proactive. Just isn't my strong suit. I prefer a reactive day 1 and then go from there.

How much experience with mafia do you have?

[UNOwen]

I'm going to be contrarian and say you don't have 1 scum in here.

Why is Eden town?

[UNOwen]

It's more that in skimming their iso I don't think they're scum.

Fair enough.

Can you elaborate on this please:

I then called him town and unvoted to observe and they did the weird mafia doc tmimaybeslip thing and their posting isn't very convincing as town. From the "slip" I believe imaginality/LGW are tvs.

Are you saying that you think imaginality/LGW are opposite alignments? If so why?

[UNOwen]

LGW your question dodging continues to disappoint me.

[UNOwen]

I think there's one scum in these two players so that rules out TvT fmpov.

Right but why do you think this? I get thinking LGW could be scum independently but I'm not understanding what about their interaction means one is likely to be scum.

[UNOwen]

I see, you're asking what my thinking was when I voted you. Someone covered that. It was a weird thing to ask. If you would've asked why did I vote you, that would've been one thing, but what was my thinking when I voted you is an approach I can't grok. I think I may have been thinking of butterflies or cornbread at the time.

Ok, then I'm asking why did you vote for me? The offer of chocolate milk is appreciated but if I could get an answer to this that would be much preferred.

[UNOwen]

The problem with the slip is that as far as I can tell it can't possibly be an actual slip. The setup isn't that mafia get either a factional roleblock OR doc, it's that they get a factional roleblock AND doc but can only choose to use one each night. So LGW knowing mafia have a doc ability suggests nothing, because mafia will always have that ability anyway.

I believe that imaginality is sincere in his push on the slip and is town, what I'm not sure of is whether this:

And yes, it says there could be a maf rolecop too, but I don't know the utility of one so why worry about it?

means that LGW also thinks it's an doc/rb exclusive situation. If so and assuming I'm right about the setup then that would actually be a town slip. I was hoping to prompt LGW to talk more about it to be sure but I lean towards thinking that LGW didn't challenge imaginality's interpretation of the setup because they too are town so also uninformed.

[UNOwen]

I was hoping for more interaction on my strategy post. Not gonna lie, I was kinda excited for people to say "go for it." But I guess that shows I'm a bad player since it was universally agreed to be bad.

I didn't think it was bad, I'm just not interested in attempting to game mechanics.

[UNOwen]

Oh another kiwi. I'll sheep.
VOTE: LGW

Do you think the point is good?

No I just think my townread could be bad.

It has nothing to do with them interacting and everything to do with the "slip" either LGW did slip or imaginality is pushing it as a slip because they know that role does exist as they are scum. It's moonlogic but that's how I roll ^.^

I think this is a sketchy progression. Why did you change your mind on the slip?

[UNOwen]

@SirCakez

- is this correct:

The setup isn't that mafia get either a factional roleblock OR doc, it's that they get a factional roleblock AND doc but can only choose to use one each night.

?

[UNOwen]

I thought it was coming from scum trying not to look like they're OMGUSing.

You're telling me you voted for me because of the way I reacted after you voted for me.

I suggest buying a lottery ticket.

[UNOwen]

Calling a misunderstanding a "slip" could be a mistake, though. Mafia can misread the setup too.

That's true, but this would be known from their role PMs so they should've been aware that they had both abilities. And even if they weren't at first, I think if scum LGW would probably have checked at some point whether the slip imaginality was accusing them of was actually a slip?

[UNOwen]

I didn't.

I don't buy that this is a consistent position. Post 53 you dismissed the slip but now it's meaningful enough that you think one of them is scum?

UNVOTE: Little Green Wheels
VOTE: CheekyTeeky

[UNOwen]

Also, your argument that I'm scum because I'm inconsistent is incredibly weak because it assumes that town are more consistent than scum when I've experienced the inverse to be true. Also also, there is no inconsistency because I didn't dismiss anything. I want to say you're town for trying to place me but I feel like an innocent witness being lead by the defense into falsely incriminating myself, I'm not sure of your motive.

I'm not sure how your original reply to me could be intended to mean anything other than "No I don't think imaginality has a good point and that's not why I'm voting LGW".

Town can appear inconsistent because they're not bothered by how coherent they look but there will still be a reason for changing their mind. The reason I'm suspicious of you is that you changed your mind to push LGW v imaginality as being TvS, even though the logic for why you thought that doesn't really make sense.

What is your read on zefiend? You voted him because you wanted to poke around but haven't mentioned him since.

[UNOwen]

VOTE: Eden'sFlame

Ok vote.

VOTE: Imaginality

Bad vote.

VOTE: CheekyTeeky

Best vote.

[UNOwen]

Does announcing targets really help scum? I figured it the way Teeky said it -- scum's most likely play is to doc whichever of them takes the NK on the chance they hit a bomb.

Scum probably docs whoever takes the NK, but they have to choose which of them does that. If we all announced vig targets then we'd help them make that decision.

[UNOwen]

Eden, LGW, The Onion need to weigh in FAST and say who is scummier, Imaginality or Cheeky so we can get the show on the road.

I do agree with you on the others though. Eden and onion have both been prodging and not playing for several days, which may or may not be scummy but it's certainly not helping.

+1

[UNOwen]

imaginality is getting hammered in ~3 hours.

Ideally he will hammer himself beforehand but I'll be back if not.

[UNOwen]

Not hammering yourself then.

VOTE: imaginality

[UNOwen]

I would've if it was between me and no-lim. As it was,with zefiend also de facto E-1, it was reasonable for me to hope Pav or someone would vote zefiend and let me hammer him instead.

Pav preferred your execution over zefiend, so that wasn't likely to happen. RIP me I guess.

Still think CheekyTeeky was the best vote.