Mini 2254 | Subreddit uPick | Fin

[The Bombay]

Something rather unfortunate was found inside our role pm.

We have a posting restriction, and it is mean.

All of our posts must have correct capitalization. Each post must end in appropriate punctuation. We are not allowed to post run on sentences or sentence fragments.

Before I opened my pole pm, I thought that both cabd and ffery thought of me as a friend. Now I see that they both wish me harm.

They have granted us a simple reprieve, and they have allowed for the use of emojis.

I am considering making post using only emojis if I feel the need to comment on something while phone posting However, that is something to consider when that moment comes.

[The Bombay]

Something rather unfortunate was found inside our role pm.

We have a posting restriction, and it is mean.

All of our posts must have correct capitalization. Each post must end in appropriate punctuation. We are not allowed to post run on sentences or sentence fragments.

Before I opened my pole pm, I thought that both cabd and ffery thought of me as a friend. Now I see that they both wish me harm.

They have granted us a simple reprieve, and they have allowed for the use of emojis.

I am considering making post using only emojis if I feel the need to comment on something while phone posting However, that is something to consider when that moment comes.

[The Bombay]

I cannot believe that I still forgot a period after I spent so long working on that post. I saw it the moment I hit send.

This is very mean.

[The Bombay]

I believe that both of their accounts are listed without capitalization. I assume that account names should match the punctuation that the user entered when making the account.

That would mean that "morph the cat" and "skitter30" would not be capitalized, while "Shiro" and "Rogue" would need to be capitalized.

However, that post is already going to count as an infraction because there is no period at the end of one of my sentences.

I am also realizing that they have created a lot of extra work for themselves. Now they have to check all of my posts. Maybe it is as mean to them as it is to us.

[The Bombay]

To be fair fferyllt isn't capitalized, but I believe Cabd is

I stand corrected.

[The Bombay]

Proxy vote to: Lady Lambdadelta

I'll vote whoever LLD does (even if it's me).

Peace offering: I promise never to vote LLD prior to D3-at-earliest (barring guilties on her). I reserve right to state suspicion, but promise not to act on it, and the proxy vote is proof of commitment to this promise.

I do not like this.

If you think that someone is a member of the mafia, voting them out is playing to your win condition if you are a member of the town.

I doubt Lady Lambdadelta would want you to play soft ball with her.

[The Bombay]

Can you not abbreviate names either?

When I followed up with the mods about our restriction, I was explicitly told that I could not use text abbreviations such as "brb".

I did not think to ask about abbreviating account names, so I decided to play it safe in my recent post.

[The Bombay]

Good evening everybody!

it’s going to be hard on marci

This statement made me cry, it's very rude.
I'm kidding, I do see how people will think this is tough for me but I will prove everybody wrong because of my solid game plan.

I will see you all later and post again when I feel like there's something actually interesting to talk about, au revoir!

~Marcistar

[The Bombay]

I'm not awkward but I don't wish to explain why.

[The Bombay]

This is a formal request to the thread.

Please do not highlight any mistakes that you think that we make with our posting restriction. If the mods wish to count an infraction against us, I would rather them have to look for it themselves. Don't make it easy on them.

[The Bombay]

marci seems very subdued. I wonder why.

I could make a response to this that would come across extremely sarcastic, but the energy is hard to replicate while trying to maintain our posting restriction.

It would be about you seeing that Marci has a posting restriction, and you also knowing how Marci normally posts. The implication being that you really should not be surprised that her posting is different than usual, given the circumstances.

The implication of said post would be that you are either not thinking very critically about what you just said here, or that you are just looking to shade her for any reason.

But, like I said, it is hard to capture the energy I want to give off using this restriction. Therefore, I will skip making such a post.

[The Bombay]

Don’t worry, I won’t show them the error you made in this post. Your secrets safe with me.

VOTE: Rogue

[The Bombay]

I don't want that, can we please vote Mastina?

[The Bombay]

I am mad. I clicked the link.

[The Bombay]

I don't want that, can we please vote Mastina?

UNVOTE:

It was only a joke vote. I planned to talk to you in our hydra chat before doing any serious voting.

[The Bombay]

White Move 1

This move does not match T3's first move in post [post]60[/post], or Dwlee99's move in post 61.

But it does match T3's move in post 62.

I don't know if their posts have anything to do with the move made by the mods.

Does anyone know anything about the chess game?

[The Bombay]

Can whoever controls white use the king as an attack piece? That's such a funny way to play, though it's super scary as well.

[The Bombay]

VOTE: jjh927

[The Bombay]

Why's it uncool?

Also rude, I'm trying my best.

[The Bombay]

Explain why it's uncool then.

I hate grammar so much I've always been so bad at it. I used to write and just use semi colons like crazy for no real good reason and now that I don't use them at all I

still

look like a clown.

[The Bombay]

I am happy with my role, even given the posting restriction. However, the posting restriction was not expected. Comparing it to your experience with Isekai would not be accurate.

I am not sure what you mean by "the amount of focus and attention" that we are putting into it.

Do you really think that we would ignore the restriction? I play to win my games regardless of my alignment, and that includes trying my best to adhere to this restriction.

[The Bombay]

I am happy with my role, even given the posting restriction. However, the posting restriction was not expected. Comparing it to your experience with Isekai would not be accurate.

I am not sure what you mean by "the amount of focus and attention" that we are putting into it.

Do you really think that we would ignore the restriction? I play to win my games regardless of my alignment, and that includes trying my best to adhere to this restriction.

Right but you actively complained that the post restriction is difficult on you because and I quote, grammar is not your strong suit.

I literally cannot fathom a world in which.. this doesn't track to me, for you to get this and the chosen subreddit...

It doesn't track, and your interaction with the post restriction is suspect tbh

124 was a post made by me, Luke. The "grammar is not my strong suit" post was a post made by Marci.

Our subreddit choice has nothing to do with grammar, and I did not expect a posting restriction from it. However, I do see the joke that Cabd used to justify the restriction.

I feel like the moment you see our subreddit choice, it would click into place for you. Let me talk to Marci to see if she is okay with us flavor claiming.

[The Bombay]

I don't know the harm in flavor claiming, and Marci has agreed. I don't know that anyone would guess our abilities based on the flavor.

Our subreddit choice was r/CatsInBusinessAttire.

We chose it for obvious reasons.

As business professionals it is important that that level of professionalism shows in our writing.

Cabd made a joke, and we got a restriction.

[The Bombay]

I agree with Lady Lambdadelta that two people jumping to our defense was surprising

jjh927's in particular felt weird to me. He appeared, declared us town, did not flinch when we voted him, and then proceeded to defend us.

[The Bombay]

Skitter's prgression on us felt more natural in comparison.

My gut reaction to the situation was the jjh's was a pocket attempt hiding behind Skitter's initial defense.

Idk if marci goes along with such a fake post restriction tbh

This seems like a fair observation.

I dunno, Bombay is well over my day 1 bar for towniness and I don't think it's a fake PR

This feels like "me too! I am also defending you, and also calling you really townie!"

[The Bombay]

[The Bombay]

I think it was the "well over my day 1 bar for towniness" that rubbed me the wrong way.

pedit: It appears Marci is trying to find loopholes from actually trying to type under the restriction.

[The Bombay]

Do you have any other reads jjh927?

[The Bombay]

What reasons do you have?

[The Bombay]

Why do you think it's weird that I am happy to defend a stated townread from a push with a role related angle? Is it because you are voting me? Should I be more unwilling to TR you because you voted me? Uncool people are frequently town

I find it weird that you see any player as "well over my day 1 bar for towniness" on page 5.

I also find it weird that that was your response to Lady Lambdadelta's post 117.

It did not engage with the actual reasoning that she gave to call it suspicious. It just called us town, and therefore Lady Lambdadelta's point was wrong.

To again compare your response to Skitter's, Skitter's post showed that she was actually thinking about Lady Lambdadelta's point and thinking about whether we would fake it. Would Marci agree to this? Would Luke try to talk her into it anyways?

[The Bombay]

for now I can say that it is far too early to be shaking me down for reads

Why are you so against it?

[The Bombay]

[The Bombay]

So boring but I got what I wanted kind of.

I'm fine with
VOTE: Dwlee99
as well.

Should I sign as well? It's a bit cringey in my opinion.

~Marcistar

[The Bombay]

Let's do it.

I don't think I like it as much as you do unfortunately. You seem like a huge fan, call it intuition.

[The Bombay]

Yeah, Dwlee99s response to Lady Lambdadeltas vote was super weird and kind of an over reaction in my opinion.

I'm not sure about Lady Lambdadelta though.

[The Bombay]

No.

[The Bombay]

Skitter skitter

What do you think

Specifically about a "full tilt defense"

I think you're trying to egg on skitter30 to get her to continue "defending" you.

[The Bombay]

Also, I'm worried about Dwlee being scum at this point since I've seen his scum game play and they are really good at it so...I'm keeping a closer eye on them.

I would say that a good portion of this playerlist has good scum games. Is there something from this game that made you worried about Dwlee in particular, or is this entirely a holdover from a prior game?

[The Bombay]

~Luke

[The Bombay]

Rogue
T3
Lady Lambdadelta
That Idiot Ivan
skitter30
Shiro

I may have solved the game as well

I lean town (to varying degrees of strength) on almost every player on this list.

The sole exception being Shiro, who is squarly in null at this point.

~Luke

[The Bombay]

idk anything about the chess game
we'll probably find out later i think

This looks suspiciously like someone who knows something about the chess game.

~Luke

[The Bombay]

Rogue
T3
Lady Lambdadelta
That Idiot Ivan
skitter30
Shiro

I may have solved the game as well

I lean town (to varying degrees of strength) on almost every player on this list.

The sole exception being Shiro, who is squarly in null at this point.

~Luke

Who off the list are you scumreading?

Off of your list? I am not scum reading any of them currently.

I am scum reading you, Mastina, and jjh. Although Marci's read on jjh spontaneously changed a couple games ago, and she disagrees with me.

Cakez and StrangeMatter are two that I am keeping an eye on, but I would not call either a scum read yet.

I have had zero thoughts about Suripoko.

[The Bombay]

I like T3 less after reading page 11.

[The Bombay]

I think part of the townsense is because I'm lightly townreading The Bombay, and if this was scum-LLD pushing them, I don't think she'd back off and pivot so quickly. Her force of personality here is stronger than theirs

I am leaning town on LLD as well, but feel the need to defend my honor.

LLD has attempted to kill me in every single game that we have played together.

In Bloodstained, she tried to kill me and failed.

In Gensokyo, she tried to kill me and failed.

There were extenuating circumstances for me dying in Isekai. Specifically, there was a mechanic in place where the scum team was able to predict who would be eliminated, and they were rewarded if correct. Therefore, we were scared to kill our top scum read. I was a paranoia elimination, and I even self voted.

I am extremely difficult to miseliminate; that Isekai game is my only miselimination ever (and again, there were other factors that made it happen). I think my force of personality is plenty strong enough to stand up to LLD if needed.

------

All that being said, I am also leaning town on LLD. Given our history, I don't think that she would choose me as her initial push if she were scum, because she would know that I am hard to eliminate. I also don't think that she would have chosen this particular angle to push even if she did decide to see if she could make it happen, because scum LLD would already know that the restriction is true.

Furthermore, having seen LLD and Cabd's discussion about her role in the Isekai game in the post-game, the way she was thinking about my role makes sense to me.

-----

As an aside, I confirmed with the mods that I can abbreviate her name to LLD.

~Luke

[The Bombay]

Also, I'm worried about Dwlee being scum at this point since I've seen his scum game play and they are really good at it so...I'm keeping a closer eye on them.

I would say that a good portion of this playerlist has good scum games. Is there something from this game that made you worried about Dwlee in particular, or is this entirely a holdover from a prior game?

Well, putting it that way I have played games with them and seen their scum gameplay, been fooled by them before, and have seen more of their scum games than games I've played with people I have played with in this game. So it is a holdover from a prior game that makes me put them as potential scum to be worried about.

Ignoring your past game paranoia, what would be your read on Dwlee so far?

Do you have any scum reads yet?

[The Bombay]

Which reads in particular, mastina?

All of them? 44, 83, 107, 162

44 was not a read. It was a response. I don't like the idea of the proxy vote, but I was not saying that you doing the proxy vote was scummy.

83 was not a read. It was a joke vote, because I got rick rolled. That was made explicit in post 85 and again in 87.

I stand by the jjh and dwlee reads still.

----

You taking 83 as a serious read makes me question if you are really looking that critically at our posts before dropping us into your scummiest scum tier.

[The Bombay]

i know something about it, but i am not a player (as of now)
i won't elaborate further, there's no point in doing so.

I was correct.

[The Bombay]

44 was not a read. It was a response. I don't like the idea of the proxy vote, but I was not saying that you doing the proxy vote was scummy.

83 was not a read. It was a joke vote, because I got rick rolled. That was made explicit in post 85 and again in 87.

Perhaps my usage of the term 'reads' was too restrictive.

I didn't strictly mean reads, so much as "content of posts".

Your 44 and 83 might not be reads (and yes I am fully aware they were not reads)--but the content of the posts still fit the same pattern as your stated reads. As a reiterating, I found both 44 and 83? To be: not genuine. Looks faked, surface-level interactions, and forced. More like trying to appear as town(/scumhunting), rather than being genuine. I linked them because they still fit the pattern shown even if they are strictly speaking not reads in of themselves. They still show the lack of genuine depth I'd expect from a town player.

So Rouge made not one, not two, but three rickroll style posts 81, 95, 102, and I responded with joke anger at having been successfully rickrolled. Rogue is your towniest of town reads, but me joking back around with him is part of your evidence that I am the scummiest player in the game?

To be fair, I don't think that my response was a town indicative one. I am pretty sure that I would have responded to Notty posting a rickroll link the exact same way if I were scum. But it does feel strange for you to look at that interaction, declare that my half of the interaction was a surface level, scummy interaction, but that Rogue is obviously town.

~Luke

[The Bombay]

On an unrelated note, jjh, what is your read of Mastina?

[The Bombay]

UNVOTE:

For now, but I still scumread Dwlee99. Talk to you guys later!

[The Bombay]

Yes, jjh927 is a townread.

I'll be honest, I was about to townread Dwlee99, but they just keep getting worse.

[The Bombay]

What's your line here on Bombay then? Guessing it's different to LLD's

Thanks for the response. It is not what I expected, but then I looked back at the post that made me ask, and I think I misread the intent behind it. Ignore me.

[The Bombay]

That is the wrong quote.

On an unrelated note, jjh, what is your read of Mastina?

I have a tendency to just townread Mastina. This is correct most of the time, but my awareness of the tendency still lowers my faith on my early Mastina reads

Currently I am townreading Mastina

[The Bombay]

~Luke

[The Bombay]

That is a surprise

Well, FYI, Mastina frequently memeclaims mason, particularly if she is in a neighbourhood that is not a masonry, although inevitably also in the event that she was an actual mason or similarly functioning role (however the likelihood of this scenario is statistically low)

I was in a "monkery" with Mastina, and she did not claim to be a mason (or a monk for that matter). To be fair, it makes more sense to not claim it when you are actually in one.

This is a pointless observation. If she fake claims it enough for you to say this, it is moot. I just found it interesting in an NAI kind of way.

~Luke

pedit: It seems intersting things are happening while I am trying to catch up

[The Bombay]

I received a PM saying that white won the chess game on time. The players may continue to play the game, but it will not affect the result. The players in the game have been informed of the winner, and then some additional info.

White and Black should claim.

What does it mean that they won on time? As in, they had limited time to make their moves, and black ran out the clock?

I don't know what else it could mean, but that seems like weird game timing since the Day has 8 days left.

[The Bombay]

I received a PM saying that white won the chess game on time. The players may continue to play the game, but it will not affect the result. The players in the game have been informed of the winner, and then some additional info.

White and Black should claim.

What does it mean that they won on time? As in, they had limited time to make their moves, and black ran out the clock?

I don't know what else it could mean, but that seems like weird game timing since the Day has 8 days left.

[The Bombay]

I kind of want to town bin T3 for 483 and 490.

[The Bombay]

T3, there is quite a lot that I am not following.

What made you think that dwlee knew too much? Was it post 465?

Even if it does make him a player, why does that make him scum? Do you have reason to believe that one of the players must be scum?

Do you think that the town or the scum player won?

[The Bombay]

He already claimed to not be in the chess game.

What are you waiting for before you reveal your information?

Should we all claim player / not a player?

[The Bombay]

Posts 522 and 523 are shifting me towards Mastina being wrong town over being scum.

I'm saying that Bombay's justification of it still doesn't make it fit even in context. The vote makes

sense

in context. That doesn't make it

fit

in context. I'm not sure how to word that but I've made it fairly clear. My point isn't that "the vote shouldn't have been made at all"; my point is that "the vote doesn't look like it came from town". It wasn't the presence of the vote (a vote in that way makes sense in the context); it was the

way it was handled

(it didn't fit in the context).

Mastina, I am not sure what makes you think I would not joke around with a player that I am familiar with. Maybe you are missing the context that I am friends with Notty? Like, we have played several games together, we added each other on discord, and we are even in a Dungeons and Dragons group together now.

I might not have joke voted someone that way if I did not know them, but I am more comfortable with Notty then you then your average player.

I was in a "monkery" with Mastina, and she did not claim to be a mason (or a monk for that matter). To be fair, it makes more sense to not claim it when you are actually in one.
This is a pointless observation. If she fake claims it enough for you to say this, it is moot. I just found it interesting in an NAI kind of way.
~Luke

HURT: The Bombay

To be clear, this is a scumclaim in of itself from Luke. Both in portrayal of that game and in content from Luke. I don't believe this is a town-Lukewarm.

Not sure what you mean by this one.

I saw jjh's post that you claim mason frequently, especially if you are actually a mason or in a neighborhood -> remembered that I was in a monkery with you, and don't remember you claiming mason or monk day 1 -> thought it was interesting, but also that in context it made sense that you did not claim in that game -> realized that it meant nothing about your alignment this game -> commented anyways, because I have little self-control on spewing my thoughts to the thread.

---

I get the feeling that me engaging with you is going to locking you into a tunnel on us.

~Luke

[The Bombay]

I've been thinking about whether that reaction from t3 to the chess thing should lock t3 town and have decided no especially while they ignore an elephant in the room on their push

What elephant in the room are you saying is being ignored?

[The Bombay]

Also if anyone got a jailkeeping role, ik it is hard to pick a target so that you don't fuck over town - feel free to target me

Okay y'know what

Anyone who scumreads me

Why do I make this post as scum?

There are plenty of reasons why scum might do this in a uPick.

If anything, my thought when I first saw this post was "why would town make this post." Would it not be better for a jailkeeper to either target the person they think might perform the night kill, or to use their ability as if it were a doctor?

Spoiler: plenty of reasons

-You wanted to be able to point at this post to call yourself town.
-You have a passive ability, not an active one, so being roleblocked is not a big worry.
-You guys already know who will be doing the nightkill (maybe a ninja), so you being jailkept is better than your buddy
-Your buddy has a really good active ability that you wanted to keep from being roleblocked.
-You are ascetic.

[The Bombay]

We were roleblocked last night, and this is pretty uncool of who ever did that.

We also received a box. We have no way to use the box. It may be a fruit vendor type ability, but there was an indication it might be more then that. Interestingly, we got the box at the start of the night. Which means we were targeted either during night 0 or during the day.

Sorry.

[The Bombay]

Wait. Actually, we no longer have the box. We received the box at the start of the night phase, and we lost the box at the end of it. I did not see that pm until just now.

[The Bombay]

I would be very interested in hearing from T3 about he was going on about with the chess game yesterday.

I originally thought he was the source of the chess game. Like it was his ability that create the game, but he was not a player. I thought that was why he knew about it. Now that I have seen Dwlee's flip, I am very confused about what was going on.

[The Bombay]

jjh927 seems like the type to give out boxes like that.

[The Bombay]

Maybe that idiot ivan as well.

[The Bombay]

Do you have any ideas on who would?

If it helps I think it's a mechanical box of some kind, not sure though.

[The Bombay]

What?

Can you explain, I'm dumb.

[The Bombay]

Ivan scum questionmark?

[The Bombay]

Why was it that you asked me and Ivan if we had anything to do with them?

You ghys seem like the type who love mechanical things.

[The Bombay]

Which hydra head are you

I think your idea of the nature of subreddit I have selected may be quite incorrect

Marcistar.

How is it "quite incorrect" when you literally said it's a result of your role? Laughing.

[The Bombay]

Useless argument.

[The Bombay]

Who did you suspect jjh927? Sircakez and who else?

[The Bombay]

Why not?

[The Bombay]

Why would that of all things be scummy?

[The Bombay]

VOTE: StrangeMatter

[The Bombay]

Who do you suspect then?

[The Bombay]

T3, were you the other chess player?

I don't know why I am doing so poorly at this this game.

[The Bombay]

Suripoko, is post 679 trying to push the blame of your hammer onto LLD?

Because you are quoting 585, but her literaly next post was this one:

Like I would like to progress to the part of this game where we put Dwlee at L-1, ask for a claim, hum and haw about whether we think that Cabd gives fake claims in this game, judge Dwlee's claim against the JK statement they made earlier.

It does not look like she was telling you to hammer without a claim to me.

[The Bombay]

An issue I had with StrangeMatter was post 603.

Spoiler:

SirCakez is concerning.

Rogue is better than null on the town side, but given the players I'm not taking that to the bank any time soon.

I'm also ignoring that chess game unless someone says I have to pay attention to it. Chess is really not my thing.

P-edit: okay, fine, I'll keep half an eye on it. Cats are such assholes.

Why was SirCakez concerning? I don't feel like you've ever elaborated on this and it's just not been talked about it.

I spoke to Marci about it over night. I wish I had gotten a chance to talk about it before the hammer.

Basically, I find it very strange that they out of the thread for six pages, and when they returned the only thing they found worthy of comment was something 500 posts back. Especially since the time that they were gone was when T3 made his chess game announcement.

[The Bombay]

It felt to me like she returned to the thread, wanted to post, but did not want to disrupt the dwlee wagon. Also, that she also did not want to join it.

[The Bombay]

i thought dwlee was scum because he claimed to have the anarchychess subreddit but not having received it.

Spoiler: The claim in question

I think this is the case cause anarchychess was my first choice but I didn't get it

What makes this scummy?

All that would have meant was that more than one person requested anarchychess.

[The Bombay]

Bom were you told that you were roleblocked or you assumed? Out of curiosity.

The mods told me that our ability failed. Being roleblocked is the simplest explanation.

[The Bombay]

Also, I use the gender pronouns are They

Apologies.

I am not sure how I managed to do it correctly in one post then, turn around and do it wrong in the next.

I'll try harder.

[The Bombay]

T3, were you the other chess player?

I don't know why I am doing so poorly at this this game.

no.

So you were not a chess player. And you were also not the player who created the game, since it came from Dwlee.

Yet you somehow knew the rules of the chess game, and also were informed when a win condition of the chess game was achieved?

I'm going to need more then that.

[The Bombay]

My first guess from your all bolded post was that your role made the game, but you were not a player. Like you were a referee to the game, but that is not the case.

My second guess once Dwlee flipped was that you were the other player in the game, but you are claiming that is not the case either.

[The Bombay]

I think it would make sense for us to all claim if we were the other chess player or not

We were not a chess player.

[The Bombay]

Maybe the chess claim thing is pointless.

VOTE: t3

I find it hard to picture Dwlee playing against a town player given his reward for winning. I cannot picture the mods punishing a player for trying to win the chess game they were placed into, and "since you won, the town cop does not get to fire" seems pretty bad for town - even if they got something else as a reward. But obviously, this would be a prize for scum.

I feel like T3 is either lying about being a player, or he got his information second hand from a scum buddy who was the other player.

It does not make sense to me that T3 would know the rules to the game, and have the mods inform him that a win condition to the game had been met if one of those two things were not true.

[The Bombay]

I don't think that scum would get a pr if they won. I was saying that their reward was strictly stopping Dwlee.

[The Bombay]

That seems irrelevant to the discussion to be honest with you.

Looking back at Dwlee's ability, this is all it says about the outcome of the game : "If you are the winner, you will be able to use your night ability that night."

There is no indication that the opponent gets anything. There is also nothing about his games stopping if an unspecified player, in other words, his opponent, were to die.

So I don't buy that his opponent had a role that was predicated on Dwlee being alive. Which would be the implication of your worry that the other player would out a powerful ability combined with the fact that the game shave stopped.

Pedit: the irrelevant part referring to the scum team possibly playing as a team.

[The Bombay]

Curious about what Shiro thinks right now.

[The Bombay]

So, I agree that the hammer was bad. But they did announce that they were going to hammer him a good 200 posts before they were put at E-1. So putting him at E-1 after this post was just as bad as hammering in my opinion.

Spoiler:

Dwlee99 (5): Lady Lambdadelta, T3, mastina, SirCakez, Shiro

That being said, T3 had repeatedly dodged the chess issue. I would love to force him to explain himself. E-2 seems like the smart way to do that. Join my wagon, please and thank you.

Jesus Christ.

The actual worst part of this is that this is my only game currently. I don't even have an excuse that I was posting on my main. I am actually just the worst.

[The Bombay]

I think Lady Lambdadelta is scum.

[The Bombay]

I thought I knew something but your statement made my thoughts wrong.

What did you think you knew..?

Mastina and Suripoko are my only real suspects tbh

I don't agree with these to be honest.

Bombay is voting you after you've fingered 2/3 should tell you who the third is.

You're tunneled, you literally cut out my exact reason for voting StrangeMatter and now you're trying to make the vote fit what you want it to.

You have game thread access to post and demonstrate that you'd be a good choice to trust, especially since anything I tell you by necessity is told to the thread at large as well. I'm not giving out info unless I think it's going to be used well by a likely town player(s) such that it's worth the risk of scum having it.

What says scum doesn't already know about it?

I think Lady Lambdadelta is scum.

Which of you is this and why do you think that?

I’m pretty sure she’s actually sick ftr

Marci.
I have reasons but I don't really have the energy to type that up right now, I spent so much energy last night spamming Luke with reads. It isn't because of her activity levels though.
(What does ftr mean?)

[The Bombay]

I think Lady Lambdadelta is scum.

Which of you is this and why do you think that?

I’m pretty sure she’s actually sick ftr

That was Marci. Marci did day one isos for everyone, and and also looked at Skitters reads to see why she was the night kill. This read came from that. LLD being off thread had nothing to do with it.

I see Marci's point, but I am a bit on the fence with Lld myself.

- Luke

[The Bombay]

and also looked at Skitters reads to see why she was the night kill

Basically, we thought that all three of Skitter, Rouge, and us were pretty widely town read, and where we predicted the night kill to land. Then Skitter was killed, and we were roleblocked. So Marci went back and looked at skitters reads compared to ours to see why they might chose to do it that way versus killing us and roleblocking Skitter.

Comparing our reads, these are the the main places that we diverged.

We were leaning town on LLD (well, I was at least), and Skitter was scum reading her, and even ended the day voting her.

We were town reading Mastina, and Skitter was scum reading her.

We were leaning scum on JJH, and Skitter was town reading him.

Marci's conclusion was that one of [LLD / Mastina] is likely to be scum, and that JJH is more likely town.

Then looking at the two of LLD and Mastina, she thinks that Mastina looks like tunneled town.

I agree with her assessment of Mastina. And I see her point about Skitters reads. So my own read of LLD has dropped from lean town to on the fence.

[The Bombay]

I would add the caveat that it was an n1 nk on the least mislimable of the strongest players in the game

Yeah, we took that into consideration.

We considered ourselves, Skitter, and Rouge to all be equally hard to miseliminate and equally town read. That is why we were looking at us as the alternative, and not looking at the people we thought might be miselim targets.

[The Bombay]

Nothing in Dwlee town (Dwlee was null) or skitter town (skitter was town) changes my previous reads; it only strengthens them. Bombay and SirCakez don't become less scum from those; they become more scum.

The thing that should probably make you second guess your reads is probably this:

Respectfully, you also think LLD is scum, and I very much don't, so. You and I seem to be on entirely opposite pages.

When your reads and Skitter were on "entirely opposite pages," I feel like you might want to question your reads when they choose to kill Skitter.

Do you think that Skitters reads were really bad, and that they decided to kill her off over one of the other town read players? Since you think I am scum, why not kill Rogue if Skitter's reads were bad?

That being said, Cakez is in our scum pile too. So maybe don't second guess that one. But you not spending the entire game tunneled on us might be fun.

[The Bombay]

I don't think rogue was particularly high profile, while you were a more controversial slot and still are to some extent

I think that the only person in the game that was scum reading us is Mastina, so I am not sure that I would agree with you. And every time that Mastina called us scum, a number of people came back and told her that her reasons were bad (off the top of my head I remember you, Skitter, and Rogue all doing so).

But regardless, my own play experience tells me that I am a particularly hard person to miseliminate.

[The Bombay]

And we also took into account that they roleblocked us.

In thinking about why that happened, I think it was because I said I was happy with my role despite my posting restriction. Which they might have taken to mean that I had a strong role to counter balance the restriction.

So, I am a hard person to miseliminate, and we were fairly widely town read (with multiple people coming to our defense when suspicion was sent our way), and they clearly believed that we had a power worthy of their roleblock, they still chose to kill Skitter over us.

[The Bombay]

Bombay, what's your read on Shiro?

I don't have one. I don't remember if Marci gave one in our chat either. If she did, it was not one that she talked much about.

I am curious what they meant by saying they had a guess about what happened last night with respect to our ability though.

[The Bombay]

Luke Luke Luke

Are you scum, bud? Was this the plan, to use Skitter's misread of me to weaken confidence in me and claim thread control?

Because this thread is a mess. A complete mess of chaos and scum influence, and I'm honestly kind of curious how you decided that this train of logic was remotely reasonable.

The tone of this feels so wildly different then any other time you have called me scum, and you have called me scum in every single game we have played in together.

That also looks like a dumb plan.

Lld, what are your thoughts regarding the chess game and T3?

[The Bombay]

Bombay, what's your read on Shiro?

I don't have one. I don't remember if Marci gave one in our chat either. If she did, it was not one that she talked much about.

When I gave reads last night I left three of them blank, but you've already figured out one of them based off of my stuff before the list.
Shiro was one of the blanks, I had no read of them, considering how they've played in the recently ended holiday dance game, I think inactive is a large part of their playstyle.

At any rate, I really don't think the accuracy of reads after a 72 hour day would be a major nk consideration. I am pretty sure it was always gonna be skitter

Of course I knew that, but scum don't just kill someone for no reason which is why I wanted to do it anyways and leave it there and talk a bit about it.
I mentioned the possibility that it could've just been scum trying to make Lady Lambdadelta look bad, but I'm not really all too confident with making a conclusion from just that, so I had other reasons I haven't told Luke yet that I built the read on as well.

Luke Luke Luke

Are you scum, bud? Was this the plan, to use Skitter's misread of me to weaken confidence in me and claim thread control?

Because this thread is a mess. A complete mess of chaos and scum influence, and I'm honestly kind of curious how you decided that this train of logic was remotely reasonable.

Why blame Luke for it, when that read was mine? It does read like this is omgus unfortunately.

My role allowed a neighborhood to form with two other players last night that persists into today. By foregoing posting there until night ended, I was able to get a parity cop result on the other two players. LLD and Shiro share an alignment.

They were informed when the neighborhood formed that someone could be reading along.

That someone was me. Based on the interactions and information shared over night phase and so far this day phase, they're very likely both town rather than both scum. I can elaborate later, but I think I'd like to let the thread marinate in this situation first.

I think my one problem with this is... they were informed somebody could be reading along, so if they were scum wouldn't they be on their best behavior?

I might be wrong here, but then that'll completely kill my will to play.

[The Bombay]

Wait..
I think I'm understanding stuff wrong.

But then that makes town super stacked with investigatives I think, is that why scum has a roleblocker?

[The Bombay]

My role allowed a neighborhood to form with two other players last night that persists into today. By foregoing posting there until night ended, I was able to get a parity cop result on the other two players. LLD and Shiro share an alignment.

I was so confused because I read this like he used it like a parity cop but isn't actually it.. but you guys are saying it's not that? I'm so confused.

[The Bombay]

I am so confused now.

[The Bombay]

I liked my townreads I had before though but I don't know where its wrong now. I hate you.

Where do I look now I feel the urge to do my usual thing come over me..

[The Bombay]

[The Bombay]

I've never really cared for putting a huge spotlight on my reads, so I'm fine thanks. I'll let you know what I have when I figure out what I fully think of this.

I wouldn't mind "possibly dying" if needed, though I'm sure Luke would mind a lot more so if you want a reaction do that.

[The Bombay]

I can see him as either alignment. There's alot of posts that I like, but also theres a couple of posts like 374 & 560 that I don't.
Originally my read on him was sort of like "I have bigger fish to fry" sort of thing.

[The Bombay]

I'm struggling to believe in the parity cop.

We are an investigative, which is why we knew we were roleblocked. We didn't get a result.

I do not believe that the mods would have allowed us + Dwlee's cop + a parity cop to all fire night one.

I think I want to kill Ivan, but going to talk to Marci before I move our vote.

I'm pretty sure his claim means he is scum.

If he does flip town, then that would actually confirm Shiro and LLD.

[The Bombay]

My leading theory at this point is that Ivan is a scum neighborizor. His ability makes a good between him + two other players. He is not announced in the ad, but can choose to reveal himself at any time (or remain as a PT spy if he chooses), and the scum team decided to fake the parity cop portion of it.

Reminds me of Something_Smart faking that his neighborizor was loyal in that Yggdrasil game.

[The Bombay]

I'm not worried about being blocked given the way my role works.

It looks like he is saying that he is not even just 1-shot.

So a parity cop that can keep firing, and a un-roleblockable cop that can keep firing, and us.

It don't think it makes any sense balance-wise.

[The Bombay]

I'm not worried about being blocked given the way my role works.

It looks like he is saying that he is not even just 1-shot.

So a parity cop that can keep firing, and a un-roleblockable cop that can keep firing, and us.

It don't think it makes any sense balance-wise.

Vote: Bombay

Also, this reads like a bit of TMI.

I am saying that a multi-shot cop that cannot be roleblocked + a multi-shot parity cop that cannot be roleblocked + my own role is simply too many town investigatives.

That is potentially 4 alignments being revealed night 1. I don't believe it.

A scum PT spy making a play makes way more sense imo.

[The Bombay]

Marci has not responded to my message yet, but VOTE: Ivan.

[The Bombay]

My role allowed a neighborhood to form with two other players last night that persists into today.

By foregoing posting there until night ended, I was able to get a parity cop result on the other two players.

LLD and Shiro share an alignment.

[snip the pic]

VOTE: That Idiot Ivan

This is a good point too. That requirement to unlock the parity cop ability doesn't make any sense either. (I think that that is what Suripoko is saying here).

The pt opened at the start of the night. If he can hold back from posting during the night phase he gets a parity result. Like, what is the gate here?

[The Bombay]

I have a question for both LLD and Shiro. When did Ivan claim in the PT? Was it at the beginning of the day?

[The Bombay]

If you aren't lying then yeah that paranoia was just really bad.

I am pretty sure they are always in a PT together here. The thing in question is if Ivan really has a parity cop, or if he just made the PT.

[The Bombay]

Ivan, can you talk about why you chose Shiro and LLD for your parity cop?

[The Bombay]

because right now it's 3 confirmed townies

And you are not questioning this at all? 3 confirmed townies from one ability, and he has claimed he can fire again. In addition to an alignment cop immune to roleblocks, that could also fire multiple times.

Even without taking my role into consideration, this is already a lot of alignment reveals firing on night 1.

[The Bombay]

if Ivan's scum, what's the motivation in making me confirmed town?

I can think of one.

[The Bombay]

Desperation? Please sit down, that implies I'm actually scared of you, which I'm not.

[The Bombay]

Maybe I am arrogant actually, it's just something that comes out whenever I get super tunneled on I guess.

I had something typed out, but in my opinion it isn't all that helpful to this game, and will probably just egg on a bigger and more toxic fight so I won't post that, I value you more than that.

~Hope you aren't too angry~ But I do genuinely suspect you and That Idiot Ivan to be scum.

[The Bombay]

Desperation? Please sit down, that implies I'm actually scared of you, which I'm not.

I did not know that Marci could be this snarky.

Spoiler:

The urge to end this sentence with "lol" is very strong. It saddens me that I am not supposed to do that because of the posting restriction.

-Luke

[The Bombay]

Marci is super duper, extreme levels of convinced that LLD is scum. Like, I just had 25 messages on discord from her about it.

I am pretty sure that Ivan has to be scum. I want to call LLD scum too, but I have also seen her be this surprisingly confidently wrong before as town. And I have never actually encountered her as scum.

[The Bombay]

No thanks.

Volunteering myself to die so that my reads will be sheeped later has never been my cup of tea. Closest I have come before has been to offer myself up to die if I was wrong.

So instead, let's kill Ivan, and when he flips scum I will be basically confirmed town, and we can go from there.

[The Bombay]

Won't stop me from trying.

I am like 95% sure Ivan just flips scum here, but even in the case that I am wrong, his flip would actually confirm you and Shiro.

Both of those options seem infinitely better then accepting my own miselimination.

[The Bombay]

I am willing to agree to kill Ivan tomorrow if you flip town.

You die today, we kill Ivan tomorrow if you're town.

You should be good with that, given you're making it a 1v1 at this point right?

Actually, thinking about this. This is a wild offer for you to make.

You seem so convinced that him parity copping you proves he is town. What about my town flip is going to 180 your stance on him?

Unless you agree that 3 investigatives firing night one is too much? So seeing my investigative flip will change your mind?

Please tell me why my town flip would change your read on Ivan.

[The Bombay]

VOTE: T3

[The Bombay]

Suripoko is obviously scum here let's get rid of them first step

How are they "obviously scum"?

[The Bombay]

@T3

Please claim how you knew the rule and results of the chess game.

If you were a player, please claim what your reward would have been if you won.

Thanks!

-Luke

[The Bombay]

You seem so convinced that him parity copping you proves he is town. What about my town flip is going to 180 your stance on him?

Unless you agree that 3 investigatives firing night one is too much? So seeing my investigative flip will change your mind?

Please tell me why my town flip would change your read on Ivan.

@LLD

-Luke

[The Bombay]

You seem so convinced that him parity copping you proves he is town. What about my town flip is going to 180 your stance on him?

Unless you agree that 3 investigatives firing night one is too much? So seeing my investigative flip will change your mind?

Please tell me why my town flip would change your read on Ivan.

@LLD

-Luke

Oh I'm not the one who wants Ivan dead, but if you're saying Ivan is this locked in I was assuming you'd be interested in it. But you're not, because you'll flip red and then... oops.

Like 1 for 1 is a trade any town would take right?

No, I don't think volunteering myself to die is the town thing to do. And I cannot imagine you accepting a 1 for 1 trade like this where you died first, so that line feels especially empty.

But I am trying to get a feel for your stance on this game, and it is not lining up. Just a moment ago, you were saying that my claim that a cop + a parity cop + my own role being too much town power was "tmi." Which, feels like you are implying that knowing my role could/should not make me doubt the parity cop claim.

So, to then see your offer to kill Ivan after my town flip, and me being an investigative being confirmed, doesn't sit right. Is it unreasonable for me, as a town investigative, to think that there are now too many investigative claims on the table? Or, would seeing my flip lead you to agree with my take on the balance.

The logic behind acting like my doubt makes no sense and behind killing Ivan after my flip feels inconsistent.

-Luke

[The Bombay]

@T3

Please claim how you knew the rule and results of the chess game.

If you were a player, please claim what your reward would have been if you won.

Thanks!

-Luke

no

This should probably die if Ivan is off the table.

[The Bombay]

I have not committed to you being scum. Marci has.

Frankly, I can see you making similar moves as town just because of the type of player you are.

If you are town, I am pretty sure that if I died, you would not kill Ivan tomorrow. That would be the inconsistency. You were not actually willing to kill someone you are convinced it town, you just wanted to set up a gotcha moment on someone you thought was scum.

[The Bombay]

Like Luke, I scum read your slot, I'm poking you for reactions and to show others your reactions.

I don't need to be consistent. I'm confirmed town.

Hey, that was the exact thought I was just typing out.

[The Bombay]

You're not trying to get a sense of my stance on this game

If you had tried to double down on the idea that you would kill Ivan, I would have scum read you for it. That was how I was poking you for alignment information.

But instead, you ninja'ed me saying the exact way I thought I could see a town LLD making that offer.

[The Bombay]

I have not committed to you being scum. Marci has.

Frankly, I can see you making similar moves as town just because of the type of player you are.

If you are town, I am pretty sure that if I died, you would not kill Ivan tomorrow. That would be the inconsistency. You were not actually willing to kill someone you are convinced it town, you just wanted to set up a gotcha moment on someone you thought was scum.

... yes, correct. I have no intention of killing Ivan tomorrow.

Well... okay so, there are circumstances I might? But I can't see myself getting there in this game, not tomorrow at least.

Oh look, a reason why it never makes sense to agree to a 1 for 1 where you die first. You die, and then the follow through never happens.

That is not the only reason, but you sure did point out a good one.

[The Bombay]

At least from what you have put in the thread, it appear that you are scum reading me because Marci scum read you. Which, I have to say, is a pretty convincing argument.

And it sure does feel like you are not looking at much else. Which is the same feeling I got in Isekai when you decided you wanted me dead.

To be real with you, if I was scum, I would have killed Rogue over Skitter every time. Notty has much more experience with me then Skitter does, including sizable amounts of meta discussions about me with Ffery when they were playing with me as a hydra together. And Skitter was actively defending me every time suspicions went my way. And Rogue apparently was concerned about something with respects to our slot, but never actually followed up on it. So that is a bit of a question mark for me even now, and I would not have wanted to walk into this day phase with that mystery reason hiding in the back ground.

Hell, I probably would have killed you over Skitter as well (but probably Rogue over you). You have actively and loudly pushed me in every single game we have ever played in together. I would rather not have you here to do that again if I really were scum and had a choice in who was here. LLD, who wrestles the thread hard to push through her scum reads, who in prone to scum reading me, and has already voiced suspicions on me, or Skitter, who is repeatedly defending me at every turn.

[The Bombay]

If Ivan is off the table, lets kill T3.

It is like painfully obvious that T3 was the other chess player, and that his push on Dwlee at the end of the day came from being informed that he had lost.

I still think that it makes the most sense for Dwlee's opponent to be scum, but I was willing to consider it was town before he has repeatedly avoided revealing what he knew about the game. But then that is what he did. Like his iso for the day is almost all refusing to talk about the chess game or prodging - likely hoping that we would move past it.

I cannot think of the town motivation to refuse to talk about a game that already ended, after Dwlee has flipped, after the games have ended, and after it is very clear that he did not win the game, so he does not need to hide his reward from the scum team.

[The Bombay]

My top three scum reads right now are Ivan, T3, and SirCakez.

[The Bombay]

ok yes but The Bombay's play is town

i don't have any super strong reads here although I feel decently sure Dwlee is scum
the active players like Skitter, Ivan,

Bombay are feeling tough for me to read here

the bombay's posting today is transparently town

Bombay Rogue up
jjh, T3, Strange Matter down

I don't believe in Cakez's read on us.

This is every time Cakez has given a read on our slot. There is no reason for it at all ever given.

I am bouncing back and forth between thinking that he wants us to look partnered, to kill us if he dies first, or that he is trying to look good if we die.

The random statement saying that we are tough to read feels weird too given the repeated town reads thrown our way. This is what he said when asked about it.

Cakez, why are you having trouble reading Bombay? Where are you on them after catch-up?

The PR is making me want to lean town + I badly misread notsci recently so I feel like I'm inclined to lean town even more

So like I really want to say they are town but there are factors making me biased here

How real is his read on me if he does not even know who is in this slot.

Furthermore, if he does want to claim that he does not feel comfortable town reading Notscience because of their recent games, why is he consistently giving him a town read.

Rogue into townbin
Dwlee into scumbin

both for posts on page 8

Bombay Rogue up
jjh, T3, Strange Matter down

[The Bombay]

I’m going to make the super obvious comment here that one side of the chess match is probably scum.

not necessarily? this is a weird comment

This post also pinged the hell out of me.

The moment the chess game started, my first thought was that it was a town v scum match.

If anything, this felt like Cakez was trying to anti-tmi. "I can't know that one of the scum team is piloting half of the chess match."

[The Bombay]

My concern was marci was fading some. It has since been put to rest.

Don't worry! I'm planning to fade out for realsies for multiple reasons soon!

Help me I don't know where to rethink.

[The Bombay]

jjh927 doesn't read chat, must be scum.

[The Bombay]

T3 gives me a headache.

One of Suripokos posts has me convinced T3 and Sircakez are mafia besties with eachother. Your welcome for the hard carry. ( :

[The Bombay]

Pooky hydra is probably scum for that hammer. I literally just was scum with Pooky where he quickhammered a day one elim like that, and have seen the bear wiggle out of way too many ducking elims lately.

Maybe if you got better reasons instead of just being scared of Pooky I would be more convinced.

[The Bombay]

I think it's kinda interesting that your whole night kill analysis thing relied on you being a widely townread slot rather than the kinda controversial slot I had you down as. To go down that train of thought you need to make the assumption that LLD not voting you any more means LLD doesn't scumread you any more. I don't see scum forgetting that LLD scumreads them.

Please, I don't think too much I just do stuff. How else would I be a dumb queen?

[The Bombay]

Why are they town?

I can’t use my typical tell wrt antitown antics on a player I know who subverts it.

What are you seeing I’m missing?

Remind me in six hours I think I'll be at home then.

[The Bombay]

Essentially, Bombay, I’m at this-

I think LLDs behavior here matches very closely with her behavior in MtDew when she was confirmed town. I’m fine calling her town for now, revisit if it’s MELO and she’s not dead.
I think you guys are town, I think we’re syncing pretty significantly especially lately wrt setup and I think marci would have been much less present as scum? I also don’t think she’d pick a fight with LLD as scum.
I thought shiro seemed town yesterday.
T3 gives me a headache.
I think SM is misguided town, who doesn’t have full context.
Idk if jjh narrates the chess game like that as scum?

Ivan makes sense to me as a PT spy. Especially given my read on you guys and your claim plus info we know, it just doesn’t seem likely that there’s a parity cop, who also creates a neighborhood with multiple other people to become masons?
Cakez NEVER townreads me. He constantly thinks he’s caught me as scum. I’m debating if this is actual self awareness or scum who knows I’m town, because this isn’t my best showing activity wise
Mastina being a nonentity concerns me.
Pooky hydra is probably scum for that hammer. I literally just was scum with Pooky where he quickhammered a day one elim like that, and have seen the bear wiggle out of way too many ducking elims lately.

I feel like a lot of of these match mine.

Main points of difference are T3, who I have gone at length on.

Mastina, who I am leaning pretty strongly on them just being tunneled town. Their reasons for being so sure I am scum feel too bad to be made up scum reasons. Like, I feel that scum Mastina would try to have a some what convincing reason if they were going to approach so certain.

Suri, who I am more null on. I'd say null town. I could see scum Pooky and Ydra posting this way. Hammer was anti-town.

Here are the things that make me consider they could be town. I don't like the hammer, but I also don't fits the bill of calling it a quickhammer. They said they would hammer him if he hit e-1 a good 200 posts before their hammer. Obviously, the hammer was anti-town, but it was not completely out of no where like Pooky's hammer on Titus in Bloodstained. I also liked that they also appear to be questioning Ivan's claim. Particularly 872, because that is a part that I missed. I don't know that scum steps out like that. My reasoning for this thought feels convoluted as I typed it.

Spoiler:

If Ivan is scum, then I think they are making a play to get LLD to town lock Ivan to do their pushing for them. Pointing out a pretty good point about the claim feels counter to that. Drawing LLD's attention to it.

If it does somehow turn out that Ivan is town, sticking their neck out there still feels wrong if they are scum. Ivan has already voiced suspicions of the slot, and that just gives Ivan even more reason to target Suri. Alternatively, if they decided that maybe they could get Ivan killed, where are the rest of the scum team edging the thread that way?

And finally, all of my scum reads are pushing them.

Suripoko (4):

SirCakez, That Idiot Ivan,

Rogue,

T3

Like, there is my scum pile. And if Suri is town, they are an easy and "safe" place to park your vote after that hammer.

[The Bombay]

Those are Luke thoughts. Marci might have more to say later, not sure.

[The Bombay]

Yeah, I also kind of felt like the choice for parity cop targets was off, but not exactly the same reasons you said. I was kind of hoping Ivan would respond to this.

Ivan, can you talk about why you chose Shiro and LLD for your parity cop?

[The Bombay]

My top three scum reads right now are Ivan, T3, and SirCakez.

[The Bombay]

My role allowed a neighborhood to form with two other players last night that persists into today. By foregoing posting there until night ended, I was able to get a parity cop result on the other two players. LLD and Shiro share an alignment.

This seems pretty cut and dry as a neighborizor plus parity cop claim.

The only thing I see that might have been a misunderstanding is if you are saying you did not get to choose your targets, and therefore our questions about why you chose LLD and Shiro are irrelevant.

That does nothing with my bigger concern that my role + Dwlee's role + your role is up to 4 potential alignment reveals all with the ability to fire night 1.

[The Bombay]

I do not want a Suripoko elimination today.

I will move my vote to any of my three scum reads to get those to go through over Suri.

StrangeMatter also voiced reservations about killing Suri.

Suri obviously would not want their own elimination.

That is enough votes to consolidate on a non Suri wagon, and I don't agree with you accessment that they are already the elimination for the day.

[The Bombay]

Like, all three of those people moving to join you and Mastina on Cakez currently kills Cakez over Suri.

[The Bombay]

Wait, Mastina moved off Cakez.

But still, her vote would be a part of the consolidation effort.

[The Bombay]

I am reading the gamestate

Suripoko will be the elim without a significant gamestate shift

Then lets make that happen.

Who would you consider killing today?

Mastina and I look to both be open to Cakez, which already ties (I am assuming Suri's vote to be on what ever counter wagon exists, obviously).

Rogue has voiced concerns about Ivan's claim, and might join that wagon. You, me, Mastina, Rogue, and Suri handedly becomes the top wagon since that pulls a Rogue's vote off of Suri.

For reasons I cannot understand, people seems strangely resistant to the T3 push despite him doing fuck all all day phase. So, that seems off the table. :/

[The Bombay]

As I said, Suripoko is capable of using their words any time they choose to. I have no sympathy for this game of Pictionary.

Bombay, might I suggest you stop trying to sing the song of this game when you've only been given a handful of notes?

This feels suspiciously like you are saying that I should not be trying to solve with the information that I have available, which is like, the entire point of this game.

[The Bombay]

1) I have never called you confirmed town. I am leaning town on you. Marci on the fence.

2) You are currently voting for me, which means you don't seem like a person I can really work with right now.

3) Every person I am trying to work with are people that I think are town (Mastina, jjh, and rogue).

[The Bombay]

Also, this day phase does not need a hammer. Plurality rules are in effect.

[The Bombay]

I mean
Consider that if you are wrong on bombay, then bombay has reason to doubt your reads

Then bombay should be trying to convince me otherwise, not trying to organize 6 voters, at least one of which needs to be scum from my POV, to kill someone.

To be real with you, I figured my best way to do that was to organize a wagon on my scum reads, and kill scum today. I frankly don't know that you would respond to anything else.

[The Bombay]

You recognize that unless scum bus your plan REQUIRES you to find the 6 townies, yes?

I don't know that this is true. I just set out with the idea that we can get one of my scum reads to a higher vote count then [Cakez, T2, and Ivan] all parked on Suri.

That seems perfectly possible even without you agreeing to work with me.

[The Bombay]

Bombay, just for what it's worth since you are probably missing the mechanical subtleties here-

LLD and Shiro are conftown from each others' perspectives as a result of Ivan's role. I believe 'parity cop' is just a way of simplifying how the role actually works in practice, and that they have effectively received the result on each other in some way.

I don't think that this is true. They are only confirmed town to one another if Ivan is town.

@LLD- is the parity cop confirmed in the hood?

No

They are not confirmed town. I think that LLD is likely town, but she is claiming that she is confirmed. That is not true. Unless Ivan dies, and actually flips parity cop.

[The Bombay]

That assumes that all three scum would jump on your Lukewarm wagon. Which seems pretty suicidal for a scum team as a whole. But frankly, I was not thinking about it to the point of there being exactly two wagons. I was at "There are currently 6 wagons, and we can easily consolidate some of that to kill one of my scum reads".

That being said VOTE: SirCakez since that is where jjh said he would go.

[The Bombay]

Bombay, just for what it's worth since you are probably missing the mechanical subtleties here-

LLD and Shiro are conftown from each others' perspectives as a result of Ivan's role. I believe 'parity cop' is just a way of simplifying how the role actually works in practice, and that they have effectively received the result on each other in some way.

I don't think that this is true. They are only confirmed town to one another if Ivan is town.

@LLD- is the parity cop confirmed in the hood?

No

They are not confirmed town. I think that LLD is likely town, but she is claiming that she is confirmed. That is not true. Unless Ivan dies, and actually flips parity cop.

At which point I'm shot and killed and then oh look the scum get to say "Well it was the right play" when it was garbage.

The town owes this claim one kill, one vote to try and prove itself, before it gets mutinous.

And I'm not saying you take it from Ivan himself.

But you need to work with Shiro and I, if you are indeed town.

Which I currently have doubts on.

I think you misunderstood the intent of that post. I have mostly abandoned the idea of killing Ivan today, because you are going to fight it tooth and nail. I moved to T3 a while ago to kill my other strongest scumread. But no one wants to join me there. x.x

So now I am compromising down to SirCakez, third strongest scum read.

The point of this post was to say that I think jjh misunderstood how the alignment reveal occurred. He seems to think it is different then I thought. Can you actually clear that up?

Is Shiro mod confirmed town to you directly (and vice versa), or does that hinge on Ivan telling you the truth?

[The Bombay]

So fuck it, I think we have to masslcaim today. If the ledger of Bombay's argument is on the mechanical improbility of Ivan's role existing, we should massclaim today and settle the mess, yes?

I don't know that a full massclaim is called for.

As an olive branch, I will partially claim. I am happy to work with you if you are willing to work with me. I just really felt like you were not interested in working with me at all, and was trying to do my best with who would work with me. If we are working together, I guess the kill it Cakez since you said that you leaned town on T3.

We have more then one ability, I would rather not reveal each of them. But what we have access to each night phase is affected by our number of infractions with our posting restriction (up to, and including not being able to fire at all).

Last night, we fired as a watcher. We targeted skitter, but like I said, we were role blocked. This is why I was particularly annoyed at having been role blocked, because we spent a good portion of the night trying to guess the night kill, and got it right, and still did not get the guilty that would have given us.

[The Bombay]

That was also the starting point for Marci's night kill analysis. When we were trying to guess the night kill, we boiled it down to us, Skitter, or Rogue.

[The Bombay]

So, we landed what should have been a guilty. Ivan is claiming that he can get 2 innocent results night one (this is probably worse if he did not choose his targets), and his ability cannot be roleblocked. Dwlee would have had a 4th alignment reveal if he was not killed Day 1.

That is 4 alignment reveals on night one. That does not seem balanced.

[The Bombay]

I don't know. Mass claiming always scares me, and I prefer to avoid it in general.

I can't tell everyone else what to do though.

[The Bombay]

JFC, why would you claim that if you're town?!?

Do you not see LLD shouting from the roof tops for me to claim?

This feels like a fake reaction given what is actually happening in the thread.

[The Bombay]

You probably got a space part from me because I'm space based?

I got a pm at the start of the night saying I received a box of mechanical parts. And the start of the day, I got a pm saying that I lost the box of mechanical parts.

I am pretty sure that is what jjh was looking for.

[The Bombay]

JFC, why would you claim that if you're town?!?

Do you not see LLD shouting from the roof tops for me to claim?

This feels like a fake reaction given what is actually happening in the thread.

Speaking of, your turn.

Full claim. At this point just full claim please.

I'll claim right after if you need it I don't care I just need to fucking understand this game and massclaim is the goal.

I fired as a watcher night one, and if we broke our posting restrictions too many more times we would not have had any ability last night. That is the most I am willing to claim this day phase.

I am sorry, but I am not budging on this. I can give you more day 3.

[The Bombay]

I am /r/pikmin, and I am a third party survivor

I can also leave the game early as a winner (the game continues) if I collect all of my ship parts. There are 4 of them. I target 3 people each night, and I got one last night out of (mastina, lld, skitter).

I am not clean what part of this is supposed to clear up the balance questions. Maybe I am just dumb.

[The Bombay]

LLD, given that everything I'm claiming is backed up in the hood, I assume you want my full claim later in the process? If not, happy to get this shit done with pronto, but yeah.

Losing a vote if jjh self-resolves and exits isn't to our advantage if we don't start eliming scum.

And really, Bombay? You do whatever LLD tells you to? And that doesn't explain your start of day behavior claiming anything at all. Do walk me through your thought process there.

Yeah I'm going to have both you and Bombay full claim in thread.

But until Bombay does, you're holding.

and more importantly, Bombay, if you're town I don't care whatever pride or shit you have and you wanna wait for day 3 when you're basing your accusations and logic on role stuff.

I want your claim.

My accusation was based solely on my watcher ability.

[The Bombay]

Fuck it, if this loses I will just blame LLD.

I lied a little about our ability just now.

We are an odd night watcher, and an even night commuter. Breaking the posting restriction too many time does block us though.

We watched Skitter, but did not get a result. We had decided to claim our result at the start of the night, to hopefully draw the night kill into our commute. Similar to how I drew a kill into my commute in Shakespeare. Since we were role blocked, we adjusted course slightly, and claimed the fact that we were role blocked to do the same thing.

[The Bombay]

We were roleblocked last night, and this is pretty uncool of who ever did that.

We also received a box. We have no way to use the box. It may be a fruit vendor type ability, but there was an indication it might be more then that. Interestingly, we got the box at the start of the night. Which means we were targeted either during night 0 or during the day.

Sorry.

This post was actively attempting to draw the night kill. If scum did role block us, then it confirmed us as an investigative to them because I knew the role block happened. I did consider that Mastina might have role blocked us as town, but the effect should have been the same.

[The Bombay]

Because you are not the boss of me. <3

[The Bombay]

Actually. Wait.

[The Bombay]

that doesn't explain your start of day behavior claiming anything at all. Do walk me through your thought process there.

What the fuck are you talking about. You also told me to explain it.

[The Bombay]

I hope Marci is not as mad as Ivan is pretending to be.

She did not respond to my Discord messages before I decided to say fuck it and claim.

[The Bombay]

To be clear, you being more then 1 shot was like way over the top. But my issue was how many could fire night one. And from my role, I knew that cabd and ffery had the very easy balance switch of just moving my watcher to the even night slot.

[The Bombay]

that's really gutsy for bombay or ivan to fakeclaim though.

A knee ways,
I had a feeling That Idiot Ivan

could be

town because :waves hands: roleblocker helps scum combat all the investigatives, but I'm also not surprised that its a one shot.

This T3 posts reads a bit like too much info (in That Idiot Ivan = town world), but also reads like he wants to appear like he's trying to stop the fight, but isn't really (because he isn't directing the conversation elsewhere.)

[The Bombay]

Hey, Marci is here.

[The Bombay]

I promise you, Lukewarm, I'm genuinely mad. You might have to wait for post-game or dead thread to confirm it, but trust me, I'm pissed as hell.

You're always so convinced that your perspective is the only possible one and that your purported logical conclusions and plans are the only way to go. Like, congrats, you're probably town; how much did you burn to the ground to get there?

Just because shit can fire night one doesn't mean it will. Your claimed investigative's existence and Dwlee's weren't guaranteed to be available. And circumstances exist where I wouldn't have used mine immediately.

If you really are town, the I guess I am not sure why this anger is directed at me. I claimed an investigative role strategically trying to draw the night kill on the same night I would be unkillable. That does not burn anything to the ground.

Unless you are mad that I scum read you and didn't believe your claim, which also does not seem like the right way to approach this game.

But literally everything I revealed about my role that you seemed to think was a dumb thing to reveal, was me trying to get killed.

Up until LLD, who from your point of view should be confirmed town, pushed the rest out of me. Why are you not shouting at LLD?

Your anger feels misplaced. I said over and over that I did not want to claim the part of my role that was actually bad for me to claim.

[The Bombay]

I... don't know...

Can we just do T3..

[The Bombay]

And even when I did claim my commute, I was sitting here realizing that I was never going to be might killed now. Not with LLD having such a strong desire to kill me. I was suddenly a very miselimable slot.

I weighed that in my decision to claim my commute. The commute value was greatly demished by LLD's read on me.

[The Bombay]

Unless there's more to it I know Mastina's role and it's pretty low power

???

How the fuck do you know this

I want you to claim it, and then Mastina can clear up.

Mastina claimed that they shared a brief "weaker neighborizor" conversation my interpretation was that they got to send a single message to one another.

Not sure why Mastina decided to full claim to him though.

[The Bombay]

Bombay, might I suggest you stop trying to sing the song of this game when you've only been given a handful of notes?

Hey, this probably applied to you when you got mad at me mentioning the roleblock. You didn't know I was a commuter. Gasp, turns out Luke did think that roleblock comment through, and you just didn't have all of the information.

[The Bombay]

Maybe signing posts is a thing I should actually try, I don't know.

[The Bombay]

I honestly don't know if this is real arrogance or scum bravado but the truth is you were never getting shot night 1 or 2 IMO.

Well, when I originally was trying to set up being killed (when I claimed the roleblock), that was before you announced you wanted me dead. Walking into day 2, I was decently town read, and was "slipping" that I was an investigative. That is generally a good shot at getting killed.

Of course the calculations changed wildly once you decided you wanted me dead.

[The Bombay]

Don't worry Luke night 3 will be our night to die. <3

[The Bombay]

the fact that you thought that ODD NIGHT WATCHER and ONE SHOT PARITY COP with Dwlee's cop thing was so unbalanced I will never fucking understand as a townie logic

I still feel like a potential 4 alignment reveals night 1 seems like too much. I guess less drastically so given the third party.

And again, my own role could easily have flipped to not fire night 1.

But the their party, and your reaction to the claim are giving me second thoughts.

I really want to kill T3.

[The Bombay]

VOTE: t3

I'm out for the night.

[The Bombay]

And this part? It actually gets

stronger

with a lack of ability to select your target.

Mastina, why are you simultaneously calling Ivan scum, but then also taking all parts of his claim at face value?

You did this earlier when you said you believed he really was a parity cop. You are doing this now when you say that you believe he did not get to choose his targets.

This feels counter intuitive, to just believe him while calling him "lockscum."

As someone who was not believing him, my thoughts were that the parity cop just was not real. He was just a PT spy. Why did you jump to that being real?

[The Bombay]

And also, if you believe he could not choose his targets, how does that affect your thoughts on LLD not being killed?

[The Bombay]

Having slept on it, I am still not convinced that Ivan is town. However, I am convinced that it is possible for the claimed roles to coexist, therefore he is no longer lock scum.

For the love of God, I need an explanation from T3 about the chess game. Or else he can just die. Thanks.

[The Bombay]

Having slept on it, I am still not convinced that Ivan is town. However, I am convinced that it is possible for the claimed roles to coexist, therefore he is no longer lock scum.

Looking back at this, I don't know that it conveys my thoughts on it. It looks more like I am pretty sure he is still scum then I intended. I am at "give him some breathing room to reevaluate later."