open 841: concgratulations to the winners and losers

[catboi]

Come at me

You're not happening today, and as my read line shows I am very not sure. I did not like your extremely rapid convalescence over something more incremental, nor the way you've interacted with Cakez specifically. I also absolutely think you do the brief cursory review voteswap if you think it will be free and unlikely to be punished.

I would be happy to revisit this Day 2.

I can't control how my emotions function in relation to the game and don't care about the rest

love you bb~ ( *¯ ³¯*)♡

[catboi]

You also have not directly confirmed 2734. You are the only player here who knows how I think as scum, and I strongly believe the truth value is obvious.

I would just outsource the read on me to catboi.

Calling out Pooky to go to bat against me was a hard townclaim. Not even remotely worth the risk as scum.

I had admitted it a little earlier but yes you're clearly town this game

It's not just your emotions; it's how sure you are in pushing something and taking point. I support getting back in the saddle immediately, eager to try again even if you know you will fall flat.

But this isn't about what I want of you, this is about what I think you'd actually do, and I think you'd take it slower.

Again, this is not a hard read, more vague misgivings, but you asked me to speak more and I am willing to.

I feel like I'm taking it pretty slow. I am unabashedly riding your coattails here because I feelyou're more reliable than I am.

[catboi]

Flow and Sleepless feel like the functionally same elim so I prefer Sleepless who has said stuff recently that can be read posthumously and be somewhat meaningfully.

Also I don’t actually think this has a great chance of flipping scum and would still prefer Cakez but c’est la vie.

What does the stuff he's said actually matter if you think his chances of flipping scum aren't great?

[catboi]

I WAS FINE WITH ALL OF THAT

I WAS FINE WITH IT, SAID OKAY AND READY TO MOVE ON AND THEN

because I feelyou're more reliable than I am.

LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

IN WHAT WORLD DO YOU EVER TYPE THIS AS TOWN EXCEPT TO HARD TROLL

I dunno multiple flashbacks to you going after scum where I defended or avoided them

[catboi]

if you want to turn this into a self flagellation contest though I can go all day

[catboi]

Even were I scum, that's a true belief and I'd say it but I just stick to my own guns and act independent minded reads then, so

[catboi]

i wouldn't mind join an impromptu flashwagon on catboi but i doubt that's happening

Because...?

[catboi]

I give Datisi a pass for being involved with that game but if he's faded from the forefront and still alive on day 3+ he's scum

[catboi]

vibes?

i don't think u and midway are scum together

i don't really care for the sleepless wagon for some reason

im skimming ur iso rn and struggling to find anything i can grab at as towny content

I respect the willingness to take a hero shot but I am not the scum you're looking for, if you make your issues tangible I'll address them. Doesn't have to be now, can be day 2

[catboi]

only a true weirdo fakeposts about mafia game dreams as scum

[catboi]

only a true weirdo fakeposts about mafia game dreams as scum

Lying about dreams is easy towncred tbh. Advanced strategy.

I don't see the contradiction

[catboi]

catboi have you done anything out of your scumrange yet?

Probaly not but this isn't how I approach games as scum

[catboi]

ok cat how do you approach games as scum/why is this diff

why do i feel like youv'e been spending a lot of this game in the scum PT

Generally try to be more at the forefront trying to push something, hanging back passively is a great way to lose games, I don't go for the "meh I'll follow others" routine


I was hard ignoring the game through the new year's holiday and you probably felt my absence during hat time even if it didn't register consciously. Somewhat surprised Faker was the only one who called me on it.

Normally can't stand to not be camping the game as scum because I want thread control but as town I'll blow a game off if I find it uninteresting or the discussion is tedious. If anything I'm always the one begging my teammates to post

[catboi]

only a true weirdo fakeposts about mafia game dreams as scum

RC once actually had some kind of insane experience as town where he remembered events from a game that hadn't actually happened which then mirrored exactly what happened in the game he was in.

later

, he then faked having a similar experience in a game where he was scum for towncred.

it's not super beyond the realm of possibility.

again my point continues to be proven correct

[catboi]

The wagon makeups say vote Sleepless but also I have seen scum bus in the absolute dumbest scenarios and

his recent content is better

Heavily considering voting flow trap

?????

[catboi]

i mean surely you get uninterested as scum too and it was during holiday season anyway so good excuse to step away and come back i don't see how that's unbelievable

you've been a little follow-y at times yea? but also for example if town is on the wrong track i could see you taking this approach d1

but yeah idk ill keep this in mind for tomorrow or something and maybe we can cross check ur meta a little (assuming im alive lol)

My general belief is that passivity loses gamse as scum and I actively try to work against that The bottom line is simply that if I were scum I'd be actively playing toward a loss, as it is I just don't care lol

Pretty sure the only vote I've actively sheeped is the sleepless one (although, again, my tendency is to

not

do this, so)

[catboi]

The wagon makeups say vote Sleepless but also I have seen scum bus in the absolute dumbest scenarios and

his recent content is better

Heavily considering voting flow trap

?????

Actually worked through me/you and went a bit further.

2822 doesn't do much for me, the conclusion "one is pocketing the other" felt arbitrary and I didn't like the conditional add-on at the end of 2835 at all - feels like it's making a show of re-evaluating on a scumread that wasn't going anywhere

[catboi]

there is too much resistance to a sleepless vote here for sleepless to be town

Meh. Resistance arguments mean absolutely nothing to me and are rarely actually meaningful. On the other hand I'm not terribly swayed by the arguments in 2911

On the other other hand midway's recent posts do not endear him to me

[catboi]

@catboi you're up, track through the flow trap progression+NSG interactions in Sleepless ISO and collate it into a single post. Keep on mind Sleepless thought NSG knew main.

Thanks, not paying you for it.

bueeeeeeehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh okay

[catboi]

I am writing things on sleepless if that's not clear, on reflection still prefer voting him to midwaybear

[catboi]

was halfway to writing a post on sleepless but opened flow trap's iso to check when their last post was relative to the rest of the game, and kind of hate that flow dipped right after promising to catch up :/. Know that the inactivity isn't an alignment tell but the fact that it came after that specific post makes me feel like it's more than likely they had trouble coming up with things to say as part of a catchup and dipped

[catboi]

Anyway Faker I'm not seeing whatever you're seeing in regard to the northside interactions from sleepless sorry to disappoint yet again

[catboi]

Anyway Faker I'm not seeing whatever you're seeing in regard to the northside interactions from sleepless sorry to disappoint yet again

tl;dr: IMO noticeably more worried about northsidegal reading him correctly than utilizing her reads, has mostly thrown in towel on swaying her and iirc had virtually given up on that front. Doesn't leverage her read on flow trap at all and completely ignores it. Pair w/ Sleepless thinking she had knowledge of main at start, likely targeted interactions+selective ignorance.

Very rushed outline, no longer have time to read and will not before deadline. Absolute comedy of errors atm requiring borrowing items from 5 different people/entities, community effort interview, still have to do a bunch of research/prep and it is shortly after deadline.

Right probably was a mistake on my part to only look at it from one side

[catboi]

the tldr of what I was writing last night was that sleepless's suspicion of flow trap never really moved beyond a couple basic reasons and he avoided really responding to the counterargumentss from faker and northside that the behavior he was scumreading from flow is not necessarily alignment indicative by meta

then I looked back at flow and started to second-guess myself and didn't post it

[catboi]

I think atp I'd rather just wait on a probable flow replacement

[catboi]

If Sleepless flips mafia, northsidegal is obviously scum imo

what

[catboi]

Fortunately that's only 10% and 20% respectively of the reason to remember the name

vigging you for this

[catboi]

I wish I had strong feelings about the wagons but I do not

[catboi]

VOTE: catboi
This guy is scum and I bet that's why Faker was killed

Ah, there it is

[catboi]

VOTE: something_smart

I let up on him too quickly

[catboi]

VOTE: Andante

?

[catboi]

That was kind of my assumption unless it was the world's worst hero vig

[catboi]

VOTE: catboi
This guy is scum and I bet that's why Faker was killed

Ah, there it is

Why no comment on my vote?

Don't have any

[catboi]

separately think Sleepless has been flagrantly self-preservative first and foremost throughout this.

Can you give me some examples of this?

VOTE: sleepless

reread the iso and almost all of the last 40-ish posts are white noise

this progression looks super scum-motivated now that we know Sleepless was town

was halfway to writing a post on sleepless but opened flow trap's iso to check when their last post was relative to the rest of the game, and kind of hate that flow dipped right after promising to catch up :/. Know that the inactivity isn't an alignment tell but the fact that it came after that specific post makes me feel like it's more than likely they had trouble coming up with things to say as part of a catchup and dipped

like for example look at this
he was leaving himself open to vote both wagons regardless of where the tides went

Andante: town
skitter30: null
midwaybear: probably town
Mare: lean town
innocentvillager: town
SirCakez: lean scum
Faker: sheepishly admitting he's town
catboi - nya
Menalque: scumlean from pooky, willing to give him time to get into the game
Datisi: lean town
northsidegal: probably town, under the impression she's fairly polarized and think posting is all right so far
Sleepless Assassin: null
flow trap: scum
Something_Smart: null

In draft order because that's more fun

I guess if the wagons are unsatisfying I'd entertain a vote on something_smart, or if I were feeling particularly spicy, skitter

and look at this readslist he has Flow as scum but never once really went after flow at EoD he just sat on Sleepless

you just quoted a readslist out of context to incriminate me for not wanting to vote flow later in the day

[catboi]

Like it should be blatantly obvious how my progression went there and that I convinced myself sleepless was the better vote but waffled there

Also why do I need to keep myself open to both votes if it's T/T like you're hypothesizing??

[catboi]

VOTE: catboi
This guy is scum and I bet that's why Faker was killed

Ah, there it is

fuck off I can push you without it being some grudge-related thing you always try to make it out to be

Also: calm the fuck down

[catboi]

I am not particularly in the mood for this right now


What I was thinking was that I'd rather shift my attention toward someone who was low impact day 1 but didn't get a lot of attention, felt something_smart fit that bill, so skimmed his day 1 ISO, didn't like it, put a vote there. I get the explanation for Holiday dance party but not sure it changes anything in my mind (I knew he was scum that game and mostly stopped paying attention). I guess the vote on andante is

some

form of action here but I don't really like it


I still need to to properly read back. I also don't feel like doing that right now.

[catboi]

i lowkey think midway and ss are town too, don't particularly want to push either rn
i think we need to push nsg more tho

Why do you think midway is town

[catboi]

Ye, I townread Andante and sort of townread skitter. Based off of Sleepless (rip) claim, we know that there is either doctor or roleblocker in this game. I'm pretty sure skitter and Andante were also pretty townread yesterday, so it would make sense for scum to try to kill them. But, if my reads on them are right (hopefully), scum didn't kill them because they fear that doc might be on them. This explains why skitter and Andante are alive I think and I will probably townread whoever claims doctor (maybe not locktown but pretty sure there is doc).
Note: This sort of hinges on everything above being true which idk how likely that is. But I want to take that risk.

Also, I do think scum would aim higher, so there's at least one scum in Datisi/Mena imo (probably just one; but double is tinfoil).

Okay but then why vote Datisi over Menalque

[catboi]

Unless I missed something, there were only really weak or just compromise reasons to vote my slot

Andante seemed not very interested to engage with me about her thoughts
Cakez pretty much dismissed my vote and immediately moved on

Other than you, pretty much everyone else has been treating the slot like I'm not here and slotting me into scumteams because... reasons, I guess

Idk the whole thing makes me feel like it's not natural

I'm just leaving you alone and seeing what you come up with on your own

[catboi]

Okay but then why vote Datisi over Menalque

idk

really dude

[catboi]

Yeah, logically there is not much reason to be voting Datisi over Mena. Maybe because I have experience playing with Datisi. But I really don't have a good answer. What's your take on Datisi/Mena?

The impression I had was that pooky was not very town and menalque did essentially ~nothing at EOD which struck me as odd that you'd be more critical of Datisi there

[catboi]

you just quoted a readslist out of context to incriminate me for not wanting to vote flow later in the day

Ok yes my bad I put the posts out of order but my point standa

No

, because taking the posts out of order is ignoring how my thoughts actually progressed

[catboi]

VOTE: skitter

[catboi]

Your vote on me sucks and you're trying to rally votes on me without so much as a case, you're shutting down my scumreads with no reasoning

[catboi]

And you gave the pretense of "wanting to get me sorted" but are not trying to do that whatsoever

[catboi]

i mean i voted you to try to get some sort of reaction out of you that i could read, you ignored my vote, didn't have a comment when i asked you about it, so yes i'm escalating it a bit. i need you to interact with me back ...

no, i don't have a case, but i'm not calling you scum, i said as much above that i'm voting you to try to sort you. if you're scum i want to figure that out today, if you're town i also want to figure that out today, and i don't know a better way to make that happen; if you have one i'm all ears

what scumread do you think i'm shutting down

Why would you ever think I'm going to have a reaction to a vote like that, as either alignment? If you want me to interact, I recommend

using your words

. I do not understand what telling Alyssa to vote me does for the purpose of sorting me. I put my initial vote down on S_S, you call him town, I talk with midway about his read on datisi/menalque and you think the menaslot is town, it certainly

looks

like you're undercutting what I'm saying

[catboi]

@skitter why do you townread SS?

- i liked his refusal to vote sleepless yesterday / his townread of sleepless
- i liked his read on mare
- i liked his reaction to my pushing him

Why is any of this a towntell for him?

[catboi]

Why would you ever think I'm going to have a reaction to a vote like that, as either alignment? If you want me to interact, I recommend using your words. I do not understand what telling Alyssa to vote me does for the purpose of sorting me. I put my initial vote down on S_S, you call him town, I talk with midway about his read on datisi/menalque and you think the menaslot is town, it certainly looks like you're undercutting what I'm saying

I was even looking for something like 'why are you voting me', that's kinda the level of reaction i was looking for ... some sort of something that i can use to have a convo back

I'm also not sure i told alyssa to vote you, but ok

I also wouldnt say i'm undercutting your reads either, so much as sharing my opinion on them (also with the hopes that you'd comment back, but you're right, i should have been more direct)

Okay well I have no idea where I can go with this that is actually productive

[catboi]

i don't even think andante is scum atm i am just heavily annoyed at everything she's been posting today lol

ok valid shit i prob need to relook at cakez again at some point

What changed your mind on her just now?


I have no idea what to mak of her posts this day but still think day 1 was probably out of her range as scum with acknowledgement I am mostly terrible at reading her

[catboi]

kinda wanna talk to cakez and catboi when they're around

About what

[catboi]

oh hey catboi can you tell me why I'm scum while I'm gone, I have class in a literal minute

Pooky was not very towny and you've done nothing to change my mind and in fact are kind of reminding me of panic room

[catboi]

oh hey catboi can you tell me why I'm scum while I'm gone, I have class in a literal minute

Pooky was not very towny and you've done nothing to change my mind and in fact are kind of reminding me of panic room

That's a half assed read though, I still need to actually read the game back

[catboi]

Also I thought cakez was scummy yesterday but I kind of felt lioke he doesn't get so tilted at me today as scum. (Mostly it just made me feel sad). Having us both at the bottom of a reads list is ????

[catboi]

Okay well I have no idea where I can go with this that is actually productive

Ok, what do u think abt the stuff i posted abt ss

Meh. First two points don't land for me because scum townread townies being run up all the time. I might check holiday dance party to see how he responded to pressure there.

[catboi]

I think midwaybear's posting right now is fine. Him going "idk" to my question about why he was voting Datisi raised some alarm but right now he doesn't seem uncomfortable responding to things where generally he struggles to interact in realtime as scum

[catboi]

went and looked at datisi's iso because I wasn't sure about him and came away thinking he's probably town

good night

[catboi]

VOTE: Mare

[catboi]

ok

[catboi]

I don't think she's lying about being neighborizer I just no longer actually believe it's good reason to think she's town

[catboi]

I think midwaybear's posting right now is fine. Him going "idk" to my question about why he was voting Datisi raised some alarm but right now he doesn't seem uncomfortable responding to things where generally he struggles to interact in realtime as scum

went and looked at datisi's iso because I wasn't sure about him and came away thinking he's probably town

can you give me a tl;dr of your thought processes behind these two posts? for midway specifically, what about his realtime interactions here struck you as difficult to fake?

I think midwaybear's posts are difficult to fake

for him

in that he has trouble doing that stuff

at all

as scum and having a thought, being able to pull up something to justify it, and re-evaluating and not locking up like a deer in headlights. It all felt natural enough.

The super boring answer is I went over your ISO and was looking through and remembered solvy analysis posts that I had forgotten about, and it all felt real enough that I'm not going to start tinfoiling you on day 2

[catboi]

VOTE: catboi

[catboi]

I know

[catboi]

That's basically exactly how i feel abt catboi rn, yeah

~
Catboi why *did* you switch to mare just before this?

I woke up and decided it felt like the right vote to make

[catboi]

why

[catboi]

why

it seems like a defensive play to try to get pressure off of you which I don't think you'd care about if you were town

You think I don't care about being pushed as town? (Yes I know she's claiming she's not pushing me or whatever the fuck it doesn't matter)

[catboi]

why

it seems like a defensive play to try to get pressure off of you which I don't think you'd care about if you were town

You think I don't care about being pushed as town? (Yes I know she's claiming she's not pushing me or whatever the fuck it doesn't matter)

well
ahem
at least not when it's me

LOL

I generally get annoyed when I feel I'm being voted for bad reasons as town

[catboi]

why

it seems like a defensive play to try to get pressure off of you which I don't think you'd care about if you were town

You think I don't care about being pushed as town? (Yes I know she's claiming she's not pushing me or whatever the fuck it doesn't matter)

well
ahem
at least not when it's me

LOL

I generally get annoyed when I feel I'm being voted for bad reasons as town

ok so does skitter have bad reasons or scum motivation?

Don't know

at the time it felt explicitly scummy but her explanation was not what I thought it was

I still don't townread her

[catboi]

at the time it felt explicitly scummy but her explanation was not what I thought it was

Hmmm?

I thought you were just pushing me for no reason and then you said you're not calling me scum

[catboi]

I've been looking at possible roles left... is there any world in which claiming is a good idea? I'm considering claiming cause it might genuinely beneficial, but I'm not saying others should, if vig is town and shot, you better be claiming though


night 3 vigilante or vengeful
1-shot vigilante or 2-shot PGO (active) - either vig was used or PGO was active
ascetic cop or bulletproof
1-shot watcher - dead
lime doctor or roleblocker
universal backup-dead
neighborizer-mare
jailkeeper or tracker

I don't see what the benefit of you outing now is

[catboi]

I think the tracker claim is probably town unless iv was vigged by a town vig

Yes she could be making up the target but I think she's far more likely to just trueclaim on impulse

[catboi]

I think the tracker claim is probably town unless iv was vigged by a town vig

how does this follow from that?

b/c I feel like she jusyt blurts out whatever her real target is and trueclaims and faking a report on the dead out of nowhere is less likely for her (this comes across condescending but w/e)

[catboi]

Eh. I don't know actually

[catboi]

I have basically no thoughts on anything alyssa has posted so far

I will say that the inactivity from nsg is starting to become concerning, although that applies significantly more to menalque

[catboi]

I finally actually took a dive into something_smart's holiday dance party ISO and I have to admit the confidence with which he's pushing his Andante read in the face of consensus here isn't really like his scumgame at all. I felt he was mostly treading water and advancing soft paranoia cases on people, having a few correct townreads, not really pushing aggressively at all. I saw some of that in his day 1 here but what he's doing now is very different to that. He spends time doing fake analysis stuff going over pairing the basically fill space and look like he's solving (good trick, btw). Here he has...actual scumreads. I guess part of that was why I took issue with skitter's read on him because I don't think him townreading sleepless is at all unlike something he'd do as scum and that's a weird basis for a read in general but looking at the rest of his play I'm actually coming around to him being town, god help me.

[catboi]

Oh, right, had wanted to add but forgot: him being suspicious of his teammates in that dance game is classic recency bias which comes more often from town

[catboi]

Weren't you scumreading him earlier?

[catboi]

uhhh probably? but I know he definitely wasn't a top sr

I'm pretty sure you literally had him in a solve

[catboi]

I didn't feel like cakez would get as mad at me as he did as scum

[catboi]

VOTE: nsg

shrug

[catboi]

ftr my vote is literally just a "do things" vote

[catboi]

cat wagon could get real spicy

guess cat wagon is too spicy. VOTE: northsidegal

I was a wagon for half the day, I'm not sure what you're expecting to happen

[catboi]

I was hoping the vote would get a response of some sort from nsg. She's not inactive which means he's either avoiding the game or not paying attention to it, neither of which makes a lot of sense to be doing as town

[catboi]

NSG Mena catboi?

lol okay cakez

please try to explain how that makes sense

[catboi]

Also did anything actually important happen in the last 20 or so pages or can i just assume it was bickering about stagnation and ignore it?

how much of this game have you actually read

[catboi]

Game is going to be functionally unplayable if half the people in it aren't around to post at all

[catboi]

VOTE: alyssa

[catboi]

Game is going to be functionally unplayable if half the people in it aren't around to post at all

Also functionally i'm not sure how this is any different than the game until now

@schadd can u prod nsg now plz

It has been that way but the multiple v/la declarations made it more pronounced

VOTE: alyssa

Why?

Read her ISO and did not find it town at all, struck me as someone who is content with the gamestate in terms of what she's doing and I think that's a spot scum are likely to be occupying here

[catboi]

And as I stated before, finding a confident gamestate read is hard without a midway read

This post in particular just struck me as something that sounds fancy but doesn't actually make a whole lot of sense - midwaybear has been a fairly low impact player to the point where I have no idea what his relevance to the gamestate is

[catboi]

if midwaybear is scum, then it means the slots pushing for them are more likely town while the slots that aggressively pushed away from it are more likely scum
if midwaybear is town, then it's a lot messier, but scum are far more likely to be among the slots that were just kind of floating around than anything else

it's kinda interesting that the part of my ISO that stood out the most was that part but sure

I don't really believe in wagonomics but who do you see fitting into those categories?

I could point at other stuff but that was one of the posts that felt the most tangibly off to me

[catboi]

nsg is probably getting replaced at this rate

[catboi]

UNVOTE: NSG

I want a mena wagon over nsg, I don't think I like this wagon right now, especially with Mare, a SR of mine casually putting NSG at e-1 and not saying that was e-1

For the record it was not E-1 since I moved my vote. Agree that it was not a particularly thrilling vote.

VOTE: Alyssa The Lamb

Lowkey thinking this is just the best option for forwarding the game

I'll explain later if I have to

Uh...why?

[catboi]

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Menalque

[catboi]

nsg is prob getting replaced + her day 1 was better than pooky's even if she was wrong on sleepless

[catboi]

Have you caught up with the game yet or did you just show up when your name was mentioned?

[catboi]

That’d be the people I named in my last couple of posts chief

Okay but have you caught up with everything since then, do you have thoughts on the game at all, what are you even doing?

[catboi]

I don't like Pooky's entrance so dumping my vote on his slot until further notice VOTE: Menalque

What about it didn't you like

[catboi]

Was very likely a scum vig yes

[catboi]

half the game is inactive right now and a good chunk of the day was spent waiting on nsg to eventually get replaced

[catboi]

welp just figured out who you are

[catboi]

I would've been fine shrugyeeting pooky rather than waiting for a replacement but nah not following cakez on a vote

Unfortunately the more I think about it the more I am convinced it is a townclaim replacement.

You are missing this context

(I don't actually care about reading into the replace out and never have but arguing that the slot had motive to kill Faker because of his reads is incorrect)

[catboi]

Why are you townreading flow trap's slot and cakez

[catboi]

I am not discrediting your reads, I am asking you about your reasoning. Don't see why you're getting defensive over that.

Who's the scum driving flow trap's wagon? How do you have the context to know this if you've been skimming? A good deal of the votes on them were either flipped town or people you're townreading.

[catboi]

my conclusion on flow trap was that they were essentially =rand at the time and I preferred waiting for a replacement

[catboi]

Okay but if it's just "a bad wagon" what gives you the confidence off the gamestate it was TVT, what's pointing you toward this conclusion

[catboi]

atm I don't trust you so I don't feel comfortable answering questions when I'm not as informed - sorry.

It feels like you're digging to find stuff to use against me rather than solve anything.

I'm trying to figure out whether or not you're bullshitting

[catboi]

We have 2 days left, can we make something happen please?

Extra dose of side-eye to the people currently not voting anyone (;¬_¬)

[catboi]

I'm not sure I could name any significant points off the top of my head. I guess the day 1 deadline but even them I'm not sure how important it is

[catboi]

I mean I'm trying to make something happen

[catboi]

I had also nearly forgotten Datisi was in this game

[catboi]

Day1 deadline scramble
Andante claim
Mare claim day1 / claiming her action day2

~
I'm not particularly convinced mena's slot is scum - the rep-out i thought was p town, and i think mena is busy irl

How's mena being busy different from cakez being v/la for several days? IDGI

[catboi]

are you going to vote anyone

[catboi]

i'm gonna mald

[catboi]

congrats on your free win if you're scum this game skitter

[catboi]

VOTE: midwaybear

whatever

[catboi]

Zzz.

VOTE: Mare

Back to bed.

VOTE A WAGON

[catboi]

oh yeah i remember andante said she claimed because she wanted doc to protect her? not sure how she knew that
VOTE: andante

Sleepless outed his pick on day 1

[catboi]

I knew this was what was going to happen and we're going to go "eh give it a day" anyway but I'm too annoyed to care anymore

UNVOTE:

VOTE: menalque

[catboi]

Sleepless outed his pick on day 1

if andante is town, shouldnt there be possibility of scum roleblocker
unless ur trying to say that since she did not get roleblocked she assumed there is doc

I guess? But it could just as easily be an assumption from naive town rather than a scum thing

[catboi]

why unvote on a doc claim when roleblocker is in the same pair?

did the dayplay improve for yall or?

I was never that confident on him as scum I was mainly just tilted at him showing up and not making a vote when we're this close to deadline

[catboi]

That does not sound like something that scum-catboi would have much trouble doing.

SS

, what is youe take on

Cat

? lol

I... am not going to pretend that I can read him at this stage. His scumgame is pretty smooth.

I think it's probably not a great idea for us to be paired given he has kind of a similar paranoia of me.

:thinkng:

[catboi]

how relevant is it that he was scum that game

I mean it's how I actually feel about him so not at all.

Do you have any read on me at all this game?

[catboi]

And for that matter are you going to vote anyone at all?

[catboi]

also I hate relying on PRs to win a game

all that does is allow towns to win games where they just play bad and don't deserve it

I'm glad you're blessed with far-above-average town play but it's a bit rude to call anyone not playing at that level bad and undeserving of a win

I think there's a misunderstanding on what bad town play is to me

the spectrum of town play to me is how well the scumteam have to play in order to beat them; individual player strength has little to nothing to do with it

that is a good definition and im glad to have u locktowned until further notice

I'm not sure why a technical definition is worthy of locktowning? Unless the two are just unrelated

[catboi]

This is probably kaiji's towngame

[catboi]

fwiw i have had andante have a scum vig on their team and that team made the extra kills in a way that made me strongly believe andante was a town vig. she was scum that game and snowed me up until i got mislimmed(partially by catboi no less smh my head)

Don't be modest, it was mostly my fault


This probably isn't scum-pony though

[catboi]

I did not take vig, although I wish I had. I'll claim if people think it's a good idea.

[catboi]

scum!catboi has the most incentive to shoot Faker, imo. Beyond just the townreads on the slot.

I wouldn't have N1'd Faker this game

I know that's gross to say but w/e

[catboi]

what’s wrong with mena vote?

I don't know but it doesn't look like it's happening

[catboi]

midwaybear (4): Datisi, Mare, Alyssa The Lamb, kaiji
SirCakez (2): Menalque, skitter30
Menalque (2): Andante, catboi
Something_Smart (1): midwaybear

not voting (2): Something_Smart, SirCakez

that's my unofficial vc

also midway claimed doctor

[catboi]

I don't know what I want to do

[catboi]

I'll be around all day tomorrow so I'll move my vote then if it's needed

[catboi]

midwaybear (3): Datisi, Mare, kaiji
Menalque (3): Andante, catboi, Alyssa The Lamb
SirCakez (2): Menalque, skitter30
Something_Smart (1): midwaybear

not voting (2): Something_Smart, SirCakez

[catboi]

I'd vote cakez over midway right now

[catboi]

If cakez doesn't show up in a few hours I'm just going to hammer

[catboi]

I hate this game

[catboi]

I'm VT and went for neighborizer and feel stupid for having done so

[catboi]

I'm VT and went for neighborizer and feel stupid for having done so

Okay so now that I can talk about it, and you don't have to go into detail here.

Are you being so harsh on your play/yourself for OOG reasons?

Because uh.

Yeah. That other game that just finished.

I felt like I gave you a peptalk seeing you all down and then you flipped mafia on me. ):

Uh no, not for that game obviously, I was scum in that one so it wouldn't matter for this one obviously (and I got mech guiltied, shit happens)

Just in general haven't been feeling into it as town and have been having bad results

[catboi]

I probably wouldn't have tracked midway either

[catboi]

Too tired for this game right now maybe later

[catboi]

Hey, catching up now

[catboi]

I see no point in voting andante today and it shouldn't even be discussed

[catboi]

Actually

please be careful with your votes

if scum have the N3 vig today is functional MELO

[catboi]

I am insanely scared now that menalque is just the designated mislim that scum have been sparing for days to kill later and that was what drove the vote onto cakez yesterday but absolutely cannot justify him being anywhere near ELO the way things are going

[catboi]

I also don't think there's a world where skitter's town here

[catboi]

For what it's worth I think neighborizer is a straight up worthless role as scum and would sooner chew on glass than voluntarily subject myself to playing it again

That goes double for when it's not an anonymous game and I'm going to get reflexively fear-read

If you want to argue I'm lying about my role go nuts but as scum I'd just wait patiently and claim a PR here

[catboi]

I figured the better roles would likely get taken so I picked something assuming I'd actually have a chance to get it (I did not read the last iteration where a bunch of people tried to take it apparently)

[catboi]

That was also the entire reason I believed Mare's claim because I knew there had to be a neighborizer above me

[catboi]

also would u like to bounce ideas off sometime this weekend, I am simply descending more into being lost here.

I can try but for what it's my reads have been bad lately and I'm extremely burnt

catboi I remembered I had good reasoning to keep him as town - if im wrong then f u gira im never trusting that kinda tell again and BoPing you forever

Uh...okay then? Why were you scumreading me in the first place?

[catboi]

hello i woke up i bet all of you are happy about that

I also don't think there's a world where skitter's town here

i think i need to see more about your thought process here

Okay so in particular I think that there's one scum tops in you/mena, and I can make that 3 with Andante because I do not think she is hardbussing menalque here, and I assume you are not bussing her. There also can only be at most 1 in S_S/alyssa. And so there has to be at least 1 in Mare/skitter/kaiji from my POV. And while I have enormous reservations about how Mare has been playing, her taking neighborizer doesn't really make sense here as scum. I believe Kaiji is town, or maybe I

want

to believe Kaiji is town (and my last time reading them was a big whiff), but at some point after their entry I just got the ~feeling~ it wasn't their scum game and I'd probably have to look back to find the exact posts but my feeling was as scum they're almost more single minded trying to drive through a misyeet. And then theer's skitter. And I don't really have any good reason to townread skitter. And I haven't all game, really.

But further than that, the midwaybear kill is a chaos kill, and generally that type of kill indicates someone on scum is feeling pretty safe in their position

It's also notable I think because from a mechanical perspective, I think the kill points to scum being afraid that midway would be mechanically cleared today and no longer a viable mis-elim. WWhich I think is a pretty good indicator that Andante is town.

But it's also notable in that it shows that scum are absolutely not concerned whatsoever with the possibility of the ascetic cop getting a guilty. And that's a pretty significant thing - my last 3 losses as scum have all been because of me getting mechanically guiltied or POE'd. A cop outing with a guilty or multiple innocents at this stage of the game is potentially game-breaking. But scum very obviously

weren't

cop hunting with that kill, which means the ascetic cop draft slot is most likely in the hands of scum. And there's really only one person who realistically can have that role. And it's skitter.

[catboi]

As an aside Catboi every time i think abt my meta here i feel like i need to rib u a bit because you're managing to be so off despite your thesis on me. This is very much not my scumgame, this is very different than the game i played in slaughterhouse, and very different than most of the conclusions *you* came to in slaughterhouse. I'm not really sure i expect you to do better but like at minimum i do think its interesting that you dont seem to be taking that into acct and are coming to the conclusion that i can be scum here)

Okay, I am sick of the digs here so let me try to clear this up:

The reason I went on that dive was for the purpose of trying to convince people that my scumread they were ignoring was correct. I was trying to make a point because I kept getting shut down when I actually tried making any arguments, and instead Taly whined and bitched until I second guessed and went down a rabbit hole of stupid, when rightfully I should have just told him to fuck off and be done with it. But the point being is, I fucking failed. I did not succeed, I drew the wrong conclusions and mishammered like I usually do. All the effort was unhelpful and in fact counterproductive in what it achieved. It was a huge fucking waste of time.

But, further, the entire point of that dive was for me to try to justify my association hunting. Your slot was already flipped in that game. I did not catch you based off anything in that. The only reason I even did catch you was because you claimed scum to my face by trying to get me eliminated when you couldn't justify it, and even then I nearly secondf-guessed on it, because the only justification I had was OMGUS. It was hardly a read where I had actual meaningful insight


But your implication here is that if I am town (from your POV), I should be townreading you here and the difference should be clear to me, and I absolutely do not believe that you believe that. It erads more as an attempt to belittle me and try to make me second-guess my view of you and I am absolutely not going to let that happen.

[catboi]

catboi what exactly are your reads looking like atm

I hate making lists

but

Andante

Kaiji, Datisi
mare, alyssa, something_smart
menalque, skitter

I don't know there's a lot of uncertainty in the bottom part. I was thinking something_smart was town but the way he popped in to chip at kaiji calling me town on day 2 bothered me

even if skitter is scum, I don't think it's actually correct to flip her unless we have very good reason to believe she's the vig

if she's town, I think the game moves to being unwinnable more often than not

I'm not advocating for flipping her today because vig hunting is the right play and if menalque is town that dramatically alters my worldview

[catboi]

random-ass thought but is NSG likely to pick vig as town? Never played with her before (was looking forward to it, too...), would be helpful if someone who knows her could weigh in

[catboi]

Knew the first part but wasn't sure what type of player she was, thanks for that

[catboi]

Does anybody have a good reason to tr catboi?

Uh yeah I do

[catboi]

I was thinking something_smart was town but the way he popped in to chip at kaiji calling me town on day 2 bothered me

This is level 0 logic. Why do you think I wouldn't do this as town?

It's specifically the timing of it where all you were doing is shooting down someone's read rather than providing anything more substantive

[catboi]

I would agree that actually claiming BP is a scumclaim though

[catboi]

But further than that, the midwaybear kill is a chaos kill, and generally that type of kill indicates someone on scum is feeling pretty safe in their position

It's also notable I think because from a mechanical perspective, I think the kill points to scum being afraid that midway would be mechanically cleared today and no longer a viable mis-elim. WWhich I think is a pretty good indicator that Andante is town.

But it's also notable in that it shows that scum are absolutely not concerned whatsoever with the possibility of the ascetic cop getting a guilty. And that's a pretty significant thing - my last 3 losses as scum have all been because of me getting mechanically guiltied or POE'd. A cop outing with a guilty or multiple innocents at this stage of the game is potentially game-breaking. But scum very obviously weren't cop hunting with that kill, which means the ascetic cop draft slot is most likely in the hands of scum. And there's really only one person who realistically can have that role. And it's skitter.

i just need to point out how *silly* it would be of me as scum to give a plan that would conftown midway and then kill him because i was scared of conftowning him when i could just, like, not do that and/or flip him ... ?

i think that ascetic cop is either not in the game or scum have it, same with the n3 vig. i think we're basically out of pr's and not gonna be getting much help from them

fwiw if ascetic cop in the game it's probably in the very bottom slots

shrug okay you could easily have thought the blowback from flipping the doctor wouldn't be worth it, I don't know

[catboi]

second paragraph: i think that there are some p clear differences between this and my scumgame, namely:
- i would have ran out of energy nineteen billion years ago as scum: this game is so long, and so ~dragging~ ... even if i were in a winning position i would have a hard time to keep trying to move things along
- similarly/related, scum-me literally doesn't try to make the game moving. scum-me doesn't try to prod people into activity. scum-me isnt' annoyed that nobody is posting for two whole dayphases. scum-me is very much fine that the game is slow. scum-me is very, very, very happy i don't have to continue posting and that the game is going fantastic from scum's pov without me even doing this much. i don't post nearly this much as scum, especially not in a game where scum is winning and scum doesn't *need* me to post as much
- scum-me doesn't care abt prodding people in an eod deadline scramble 2x
- i am flabbergasted why scum-me would propose a plan to conf midway and then just kill him
- scum me actaully probably has some idea as to who to she wants to flip today instead of just going around in circles becuase the game is confusing
- scum-me doesn't start off a hunt for a scum-vig well before anybody else does (and certainly doesn't if it's me ...?)

there's probably more to this that i'll think of as i think about this game
but the first two points are basically how to read me ... the fact that i still have energy and still *care* about trying to win this is not indicative of scum-me at all

You have to be absolutely kidding me with this. The self-meta here is so riduculous, it verges on being parody. Let's break this down.

You claim that, as scum, you would have lost interest in a game that scum are handily winning. Anyone who actually believes this is true ought to retire on the spot. (pooky nearly caught me on this in GB's mini, because I was too motivated and not tilted enough). I don't buy whatsoever that you stop tryign altogether and make it obvious, you can't let it

show

that you're okay with nothing happening, you have to put on an

act

, but for all you're playing up

trying

to get the game moving, you have accomplished exactly

nothing

with it, which is exactly the place where scum wants to be - looking like they're trying without actually accomplishing anything. (This was apparently how I won a game back in the day, because even though I had a somewhat suspect claim, I had been apparently trying to get people to post as part of trying to look town). Again, I don't believe at all that you lay back and do nothing at deadline as scum. That immediate reaction stuff is utterly trivial to fake and completely meaningless in terms of alignment - if we're flipping town both days it's nt like that urgency was at all meaningful.Going around in circles just means people just keep spinning their tires and the town ends up directionless, and you can try to feel out where people are actually willing to vote. At some point it's going to become evident that there's a scum vig and I see absolutely no reason why scum wouldn't want to get ahead of the curve on that front because it's going to be narrowed down eventually. There are obvious benefits to doing it because people aren't going to look at the one who's starting the hunt, or maybe you know the scum vig gets caught eventually and you want to clam credit for "starting" it

Like it's an entire list of "why do I do these things as scum that have very little risk to me and make me look town"??? There's almost nothing that is actually meaningful for finding scum

[catboi]

also dats, ty for 4644 ... it was very helpful and i do think you're being kinda townie in that sense tbh

~
i think i'm looking at like ... catboi, mena, alyssa, maybe ss ?
i don't think andante, kaiji, or dats are scum

i think if andante is scum it opens up more worlds for possible scumteams but im also having a hard time wrapping my head around andante-scum

Lol okay

I spent most of day 2 wanting to vote mena only to get pushback from the rest of the thread on it, if I have a partner who's getting cleared by people in the thread I don't fuck it up by bussing for noreason and ou should

absolutely

know that

[catboi]

i'm interesting in finding the scum vig today now.

its a much tighter pool


and honestly i think her claim is complete bullshit


who the fuck chooses tracker for first pick


if they did choose that slot, its to deny the person below from getting it.


i dont see any town reason to do so

pony's game has been extremely weaksauce


and on a scum flip we can confidently clear the people she's been pushing(me, in particular kek) because she is extremely anti bus

I am very confused right now

[catboi]

no you're fine skitter, you're good. you're the 1 ray of happiness I'm getting right now

gritting my teeth rn

[catboi]

also andante just to be clear, catboi = gira if that helps you understand that slot better

YOOOO THAT'S WHO THAT IS??? lol no it doesn't help at all, but that's too funny

pony i LITERALLY TOLD YOU THIS IN THAT NEWBIE GAME

and then in the holiday dance party mafia chat you were like "yeah idk who that is I don't remember him at all"

[catboi]

I don't think it's outright impossible that Mare would simply forget to submit an action as mafia

But I also don't think she's scum with skitter

[catboi]

okay

what scumteam would she be with that would allow her to forget about having a night action

forget

to submit

an action, not forget

about having

a night action - having teammates doesn't matter if you have trouble figuring out a target and never submit one in time

I guess it sounds outlandish but given circumstances I don't think it' that far fetched, a lot of people put off decisions until the last minute and it wouldn't be out of line with, uh, how she's been this game. I just don't feel good clearing someone off of a night action thing like that

[catboi]

@catboi, as i feel like i need to respond to what was said above

- although she's gotten good at, scum is still not skitter's preferred alignment. she prefers to keep her team with her rather than solo carry as she tends to lose energy in late game. "demotivated/not high energy is historically a scumtell for me" (i was aware of this)

Sorry, i said i would drop it but i dont get now you go from the quote to what u wrote above

You know that i flag and lose energy as scum .... whether or not i'm winning, there's only so long i can maintain 'good posting' as scum before i start spinning around in circles and hating literally every single time i need to post

It happened in slaughterhouse, where i was losing. It happened in deja vu, where i *winning* (most of my ranting that game happened, tbf, i believe in the hydra pt and not somewhere you were able to see, but iirc it was like 10 pages long and the latter half was just me like dying inside thinking abt needing to post and maintain that mess.)

I simply start to flag, and it takes more and more energy from me to continue posting. The fact that i'm winning is immaterial. This game is ridiculous, its dragging, and i would have lost the motivation to keep pretending to *care* as much as i do a very long time ago, that's just not really something i can fake. I would very, very, very badly want it to be over by now as scum, despite being apparently in a winning position

And i believe you *know* this ...

If i'm scum here i stop *trying* so hard (and quite simply, the game wouldnt need me too, so i wouldnt feel like i had to) ... but i'm town here and still think we're probably going to lose but i care more (or differently, at least), and still want to try to solve this utter mess in a way that i absolutely wouldnt be able to pretend to still as scum. Yes it would be great as scum if i can go around in circles and feel people out and so on but honestly it wouldnt be needed and its unlikely i keep dredging up the energy for that day after day after day after day

~
Unless you want to argue i'm scum with exactly andante, i'm baffled why i would nk midway instead of andante when i could have just flipped him and used the nk for like literally anybody else

This doesnt prove i'm town or anything but just like its a silly thing to do as scum when i could just, like, not

Its a silly way to expand the nk when i could get the exact same slot out via a flip ... there's no point nk'ing someone when they're flippable. I had at least two chances ro flip him, both day1 and day2 ...

See,again, the key difference here: yo perceived things in slaughter hour were going bad (and also nancy drew replaced in and you didn't want to play with her,

which you told me

), so it was actually for entirely different reasons than what I wrongly assumed

And in deja vu you kept trying in spite of the fact that no one else on that team was doing

anything

I don't give a damn about how you felt

internally

, it very clearly did not come through in the game thread, and that game looked like a near certain loss on day 1. I absolutely could not have done that shit. In the late game you were the

only

thing keeping it going and it was only through

your

effort that scum won after tweet very nearly flipped that game around

So no I don't buy for a goddamn second the idea that you wouldn't be trying hard as scum

Your argument here boils down to "I would throw a game I was winning as scum" which is complete nonsense. No one should believe that. It is frankly insulting that you are even trying to argue this

[catboi]

fucking hell, whatever coherent worldview i come up with, either it's two people that picked the same number or it's my tinfoil about [thing] being wrong

maybe it really is catboi/skitter/??? because nothing in this game is making sense rn

have those two even voted each other??? like at any point??? started building wagons on one another??? in contrast to how much shit they're spewing at each other???

and then one of s_s/alyssa, probably? s_s

I was avoiding it because I felt like menalque was the better vote and more important to my view of the game

[catboi]

I spent most of day 2 wanting to vote mena only to get pushback from the rest of the thread on it, if I have a partner who's getting cleared by people in the thread I don't fuck it up by bussing for noreason and ou should absolutely know that

Uh ... where? You voted him twice but basically made no effort to flip or push him or to get other people to wagon him

This is a really really weak reason for me to think you're unaligned, there's like no oomph to ur mena push at all

this made me go back and reread myself and I really didn't argue hard enough for it, I guess because I didn't have the confidence, but still

[catboi]

I'm probably just being dumb on mare but in these situations I can't help but run through nightmare scenarios in my brain

[catboi]

whatever fuck it resolve this today while we have a ML

VOTE: skitter

flip me or flip skitter here because at this point she has all but scumclaimed to me. either kill me and see that I'm town then get her after or get her today

[catboi]

Sorry I haven’t been around but uh, yeah, this may be useful info: i have a hard guilty on catboi

bullshit

[catboi]

that is absolutely a desperation claim to get an elimination off and there is absolutely no way anyone should believe it coming now

[catboi]

or it's a really fucking dumb reaction test but either way it's fake shit

[catboi]

went to check and there's nothing that really gives any indication at all that skitter was an innocent for him

[catboi]

Further: there is absolutely no fucking way if I am scum I do not try to take cop in the draft, because even if I don't get it I at least KNOW where to hunt for the cop. There is literally 0 chance I would let it potentially fall to town who is directly below me in the draft, it would be a complete gamethrow. My last THREE losses as scum have all been because I got mechanically guiltied. The cop is by far the most dangerous thing in this setup to me and my immediate goal as scum would be trying to either block cop or kill it as quickly as possible. If there was literally any chance whatsoever of there being a cop in the game I don't kill fucking midwaybear

[catboi]

I gotta grab breakfast but don't do anything stupid

[catboi]

Okay I'm back

if mena doesn't retract the guilty in his next post I'm voting him

[catboi]

The draft cop is flipped and dead

[catboi]

But do we flip cat over mena to see? cause cat is vt, and mena is potentially real. mena checking dats would most likely result in dats maf, and thus I think maf kills mena tonight knowing mena would be checking dats, so then I'm here tracking people.. probably getting useless info. mehhh not sure our numbers allow a mislim

This is exactly the logic he's banking on people using (assuming it's a scum guilty and not some stupid reaction test) because it's the "safe choice but still burns an elimination to put scum into 5P ELO

[catboi]

actually


there's a nonzero chance pooky took vengeful because he wanted to troll as scum, and the play here is to get me killed so he gets voted tomorrow and wins with the venge

[catboi]

Like, my only hesitation with killing mena here, is I'd 100% die and all that's left is a neighborizor. doesn't give reports, just makes hoods. Yall may not like me, but I give reports. at least leaving mena today makes maf kill either me (the useless tracker) or the universal SR Mena.

I don't think I'd no lim here... cause if no vig, it just loses our mislim right? So I might be down to just yeet catboi and see what happens. Worst case, VT goes, best case Mena is right and we know skitter town

that is EXACTLY WHAT THEY ARE COUNTING ON

MAKING THE "SAFE" VOTE RATHER THAN LOOKING AT WHO IS ACTUALLY SCUMMY

BUT IT DOESN'T MATTER BECAUSE IT'S NOT A REAL GUILTY HE JUST WANTS TO WASTE THE ML

YOU'RE NOT GETTING A TRACKER REPORT EITHER WAY

PEOPLE ARE JUST STUPID AFRAID OF KILLING A PR CLAIM NO MATTER HOW TERRIBLE IT IS BECAUSE THEY'RE GREEDY

BUT IT'S SHIT PLAY AND ALWAYS WILL BE

[catboi]

@catboi from my pov if mena is venegeful that makes you or dats the vig

And from your pov that makes dats the vig (or me i suppose)

i guess i'm just running through possibilities and not really thinking it through

i still don't think scum would double up probably

[catboi]

i was going to say i'd rather be yeeted today than be the potential game losing miselim tomorrow but potential n3 vig

[catboi]

right the whole timing of it makes it beyond obvious that it's not real

[catboi]

i was going to say i'd rather be yeeted today than be the potential game losing miselim tomorrow but potential n3 vig

cause if you're town, we flip you, flip mena the vengeful tomorrow and lose

well that or scum have a n3 vig and just win overnight

[catboi]

actually it's possible he was lurking it out this whole time to see whether it was safe to fakeclaim or not

[catboi]

real question Catboi

if you were scum with Menalque, and he was a vengeful, what would you have done in that scenario?

specifically, where menalque is about to come back after almost being replaced

Well in the first place I probably would have pushed for N3 vig over venge in the draft if we were going all in on kill power in the first place. But regardless if pooky didn't want to play ball for whatever reason and we had the venge I'd probably be going all in on trying to get a single mis-elim today (which would not be skitter, because as scum I pick fights I think I can win) and treat that as the win condition, because at that point even if menalque gets voted in F7/F5, we win. I wouldn't even care if I looked blatantly teamed at that point because if I went down first him going after me is still a win

[catboi]

I guess datisi's claim would limit my options for who could be voted anyway if I were scum, not really in that mindset when I was writing that

[catboi]

Datisi can attest I will go for the sneaky quick win when when possible

[catboi]

catboi, are you town here? cause it really doesn't feel like you're trying to consider who is maf here... it's more like "I'm town, trust me! oh and dats can vouch for me!" like, ok, you're town, who does that make maf?

I'm sorry I kind of shift into a different mode when someone is claiming a guilty on me in a situation that could very possibly be MELO

I was very obviously trying to figure out who was mafia for a good part of the day prior to this and I don't know why you'd ignore that because I was not immediately outing a 3/3 in the hours after I had a guilty claimed on me

I can try to look back at pooky/mena stuff from the perspective of knowing they're confirmed scum later, assuming he does not come back and go "haha jk it was actually all a test"

[catboi]

So I'm here like "catboi really isn't solving, just doing what dats kinda was doing earlier" and you're trying to change the topic for why I need to track mena? ok whatever I'll tell you I'll track mena. just like midway. I don't like the change in conversation

god are you serious right now

this is not how I operate and the most important thing for me right now is convincing people menalque is mafia

doing a bunch of performative "solving" shit that sounds nice would be utterly trivial to fake anyway


your top scumread outs a guilty reportt and dips and suddenly you go "hey maybe he has a point" when he has done literally FUCKALL, like what is this sudden double standard where i'm not "solving" when he's literally been MIA all game

[catboi]

catboi, are you town here? cause it really doesn't feel like you're trying to consider who is maf here... it's more like "I'm town, trust me! oh and dats can vouch for me!" like, ok, you're town, who does that make maf?

I'm sorry I kind of shift into a different mode when someone is claiming a guilty on me in a situation that could very possibly be MELO

I was very obviously trying to figure out who was mafia for a good part of the day prior to this and I don't know why you'd ignore that because I was not immediately outing a 3/3 in the hours after I had a guilty claimed on me

I can try to look back at pooky/mena stuff from the perspective of knowing they're confirmed scum later, assuming he does not come back and go "haha jk it was actually all a test"

I'm trying to find the team that makes the most possible sense. Mare is gonna be thrown in by default for doing nothing, and if I had any idea of what you were thinking, like dats at least said it's me and SS (not sure how that makes sense, but it's a read...) but after the guilty, you like took on this stance of "I'm town, people can prove it!" rather than thoughts about where we should vote. Just like dats was obsessed with how people read him the majority of the game. If I SR you, I'm inclined to just vote you out see what happens, that's really where I'm at right now

i'm sorry i can't MAGICALLY DECIDE ON A TEAM IN FOUR HOURS

[catboi]

thoughts might be something of an ask but I can give impressions if that works

I didn't like cakez' very end of day push toward me, but I especially didn't like that his pretty gung-ho "kill mena" seemed to be entirely forgotten today, also that he hasn't actually addressed me or spoken to me since I repped in, and that insofar as his read on me isn't purely based on pooky it seems to be from a v lazy "mena not here therefore mena scum" outdated meta read

other than that I feel pretty floaty?

reads list is something like, uh:

andante, S_S
skitter?
datisi?
mwb
mare?
alyssa
catboi
cakez

kinda wanna talk to cakez and catboi when they're around

oh hey catboi can you tell me why I'm scum while I'm gone, I have class in a literal minute

Ehh i think dissolving nsg wagon is prob a good thing but I’d rather do cakez/catboi

kaiji gdi

will vote midway I guess but in my very limited capacity I feel like the difficulty in getting traction on either of cakez/catboi is probably telling given that sleepless/myself/maybe kaiji!slot have all been p easy to run up at one point or another and given that 2/3 are town with potentials for all 3 I wonder if scum are just propping up any alt wagon that comes along while avoiding each other

I need to read cakez/catboi interactions more closely tho, I'm not sure if they make sense as scum teaming or just that they could each be individually

Alyssa I don't follow you

and hm. okay, I got the impression that it wasn't so much that sleepless/flow trap were hard to get votes on as it was that they were both easy to get votes on and the momentum kept swinging back and forth. catboi it never really felt like a serious wagon? I think it was only 3 quite briefly and that was early in the day

okay maybe I just have no idea wtf scum are trying to do these days

if town continues exactly like this and it's not like, exactly mwb/catboi/cakez or something then yes big trouble

but with the PRs doing something and that being broadly correct then even if today/tomo are mislims there's still time to turn it around

I mean I'm not exactly enthused by PR reliant play but I feel like my chances of sorting non-mechanically are somewhat flawed given rusty-ness and lack of time

I would love to test my theory and we flip one of cakez/catboi and find out but I don't have either the confidence or the presence to try things my way via day play

there's more baitlims in this game than there are available misflips so i'm not super enthused by that strategy
tbh your slot is one of them too ...

yah, I was kind of half figuring that my flip might be one of the ones that would prompt re-eval

re: voting on catboi/cakez. skitt I was barely making it to thread last week, I didn't know the exact wagons. I'm only here now because no students turned up during my last 1.5hrs and so I can be here for a bit while avoiding lesson planning

would you be interested in doing catboi now ?

Sorry I haven’t been around but uh, yeah, this may be useful info: i have a hard guilty on catboi

I went and pulled every post menalque had about me up to the guilty claim

and I know "zomg he has no reasons" is cliche bullcrap but he literally had no justification for scumreading me at all at any point

his entire push n cakez amounted to "he is scum for pushing me"

I'm not convinced he's actually read any of the game at all

[catboi]

the only people pooky voted were IV faker and sleepless

well that's useless

[catboi]

here's where I'm at - still torn on mena, don't believe the claim. but if mena is maf, there is no way on earth dats is partners with mena, so I think this might be a point towards mena being real...

weren't you suggesting the possibility they were doubled up not that long ago?

[catboi]

Who is a mastermind type of scum in this PL other than me?

eh, aheh heh...

[catboi]

here's where I'm at - still torn on mena, don't believe the claim. but if mena is maf, there is no way on earth dats is partners with mena, so I think this might be a point towards mena being real...

weren't you suggesting the possibility they were doubled up not that long ago?

what haven’t I said this game? it’s not about the path I take, it’s about what the final reads are…

That's not really my point? What was it that changed your mind there?

[catboi]

I don't get why we're settling for a no elim if the majority view is that mena is scum

[catboi]

Catboi what are u thinking abt dats here?

Sorry for not getting to this earlier, been busy with other stuff tonight. I was sort of keeping him out of my thoughts because I had been wanting to flip menalque and was only going to paranoia him if menalque flipped town, though obviously that isn't possible now. Because of that I haven't been paying a ton of attention to him this phase. I don't

think

he plays it this way if he's scum with pooky and they doubled up in the draft as a gambit but I'd want to look back at his recent posting. That's a lame non-answer, I guess an actual one is "town, probably?"

[catboi]

tbf datisi did have his partner neighborize him once (I realize these scenarios are vastly different in terms of risk)