Micro 1047: Vengeball! -- Game Over!

[The Bulge]

VOTE: vander

long day at work, will be back in the AM

[The Bulge]

it's morning somewhere, right?

catching up. who's all here rn?

[The Bulge]

hullo! glad you're town

time for quick thoughts on dwlee?

[The Bulge]

im gonna try and post a solve once im read up

[The Bulge]

damn bbcode

[The Bulge]

hi koba

[The Bulge]

did you still want to pry at anything or what

[The Bulge]

VOTE: bulge
smells like godfather

this is my brand

[The Bulge]

I too am excited to try to sort bulge before inevitably failing for the thousandth time.

lol

also fwiw "that's just my brand" is more aline with what i was tryna say :^]

[The Bulge]

ok here it is, read em and weep.

kcda and vanderscamp are goons. dwlee and doc worm, godfathers. boom

[The Bulge]

i dont see colour

[The Bulge]

if you both just disappeared into a scum pt i'll be upset

[The Bulge]

UNVOTE:

yoink

[The Bulge]

for godfathers i'm looking for meekness and/or forced bravado, in general. dwlee looks hesitant to engage meaningfully with the game, but they know they can't just go ghost and risk drawing gf suspicion for inactivity. their only real game-related comment (aside from the shaky koba read) is a tiny little suggestion of hockeyfan scum, which even on its own i don't like. the worm is a shtick but it still fits the bill for leaning on it to force content.

kcda and vander both voted obvtown hockeyfan and kcda's framing in particular was gross. actually looking it over this is making me think kcda/dr worm is a more likely pair than not. looking over vander's iso there's actually not a lot else here I hate but I still like my solve.

[The Bulge]

kcda easily the scummiest of the bunch, then dwlee>worm>vander. and yea i wouldn't sub in any other player atm so this is my Bible for now

[The Bulge]

kcda easily the scummiest of the bunch, then dwlee>worm>vander. and yea i wouldn't sub in any other player atm so this is my Bible for now

How does enchant not make the cut?

They came in to give no content at all, all they've given is the anti-town-to-suggest and imo inaccurate mechanical opinion that scum should be pushing to kill town.

Enchant would probably be the easiest slot to slot in there, yea. now who are you to question my piety?

[The Bulge]

for godfathers i'm looking for meekness and/or forced bravado, in general. dwlee looks hesitant to engage meaningfully with the game, but they know they can't just go ghost and risk drawing gf suspicion for inactivity. their only real game-related comment (aside from the shaky koba read) is a tiny little suggestion of hockeyfan scum, which even on its own i don't like. the worm is a shtick but it still fits the bill for leaning on it to force content.

kcda and vander both voted obvtown hockeyfan and kcda's framing in particular was gross. actually looking it over this is making me think kcda/dr worm is a more likely pair than not. looking over vander's iso there's actually not a lot else here I hate but I still like my solve.

bruh you could read for a GF yourself by your own damn definition.

this is literally your only post of substance all game.

lmao. show me how my iso is similar to dwlee's or dr worms.

if I was at a hundred before, this post pushed me to a thousand!

VOTE: da worm
chk-chk

[The Bulge]

kcda easily the scummiest of the bunch, then dwlee>worm>vander. and yea i wouldn't sub in any other player atm so this is my Bible for now

How does enchant not make the cut?

They came in to give no content at all, all they've given is the anti-town-to-suggest and imo inaccurate mechanical opinion that scum should be pushing to kill town.

Enchant would probably be the easiest slot to slot in there, yea. now who are you to question my piety?

I'm Vanderscamp!

I'm just confused why you would say that you wouldn't sub anyone else into those four, implying that you read all of those people as significantly scummier than enchant, who I feel has given very poor contributions so far.

Like, was my retaliate RVS vote on someone you feel is obv town really enough to make you that confident with me being scum over Enchant? Because I don't really buy that level of confidence.

I don't find anything Enchant has posted scummy enough to note.

[The Bulge]

but like, the other 3 are pretty solid townreads, so yea

[The Bulge]

also it's not your vote I dislike, it's your stance

[The Bulge]

Yo dwlee's iso is so bad... I think i found a goon in them. I'm mainly looking at the quick turn in posts 64 and 67

cuz of this i think koba is town... I dont think you interact with your GF that much.

I am not voting a goon d1. I want a GF. gimme some time peeps.

You're really giving a read that someone is town because they're not aligned with someone you think is scum?
For serious?

i'd like to see your follow-up to this

[The Bulge]

Vander reading null, and can help me by giving an opinion on Hockeyfan. any metric you like

I dislike hockey saying that dwlee/koba/bell we're all town because from their pov that should be very unlikely, and hockey should have pretty good reasoning to think that's true, which I didn't get from anything hockey or those three said.
I don't hate it but I definitely didn't like it.

its mianly based on tone/gut def not concrete yet. Im starting to not like Kcda anymore tho lol

Wait you thought me/koba/bell were all town AND that kdca was town?

strongly dislike this post as well. what is your point? where are you going with this, and why don't you just say it? also, why haven't you interacted with me or defended yourself?

[The Bulge]

you can call it an rvs vote but you've still pushed against town!hockeyfan all game

[The Bulge]

The bulge seems fine if a little inflexible. But no more than Dwlee has been so far.

no more fine, or no more inflexible?

[The Bulge]

Why is hockey obviously town?

reactions to the thread are natural and clear-cut. no agenda. pure tone. good vibes.

[The Bulge]

It's going to depend very much on people's mindsets and ability to compartmentalize.
I don't have much experience with multiball because I avoid them. So I've been brain storming on how to differentiate. But I've been mostly stumped so far.

only difference is there's more of em. and a lot of classic go-to tells (associatives, fake reads, etc) don't work. up against a singleball team of solid scumplayers it's really no different, but the odds here are even better.

[The Bulge]

read: scummos still gonna scum. shoot to kill.

[The Bulge]

Even if you do disagree with it, btw, do you agree that it's possible that some scum who disagree with you might genuinely be pushing on people they think are mafia?

even still you risk a scumslip when you try so hard to get someone else lynched. It is FUUUUUUUCKING difficult (y'all cool with cussing right sorry didnt ask before) to scumhunt as scum because you are also burdened with being the informed minority.

ESPECIALLY in a setup like this that discourages bussing you have to be careful as fuck with what you say and do. I just don't see that caution from Koba. THATS why they town.

haven't decide if I think this and the previous response are reading backpedally to me

[The Bulge]

I think associatives would work especially well here. But the rest gets muddled yeah. I don’t have much multiball experience tho.

true, guess I meant anti-associatives.

[The Bulge]

the wording of the original statement really looks like it's specifically because koba and dwlee don't seem aligned. if we're supposed to take 225 and 240 at face value, why didn't a hint of any of that reasoning make the cut in the first place?

[The Bulge]

like idk, looks very straightforward to me. and you're right, the two following posts aren't obviously fake but they certainly don't give me any warm feelings. but idk if there's as much room for interpretation of 192 as kc would have us believe

[The Bulge]

They manage to be just stubborn enough that their backpedals don’t come off as obviously fake.

whoa whoa whoa where did I back pedal other than the Worm thing?

205 vanders calls out the logical flaw in your koba read, which you never directly address in your ensuing explanation.

[The Bulge]

nah, bolded in thread is just old-fashioned.

[The Bulge]

They manage to be just stubborn enough that their backpedals don’t come off as obviously fake.

whoa whoa whoa where did I back pedal other than the Worm thing?

205 vanders calls out the logical flaw in your koba read, which you never directly address in your ensuing explanation.

but i did address it in the other posts you linked.

sure, but not directly. you didn't acknowledge the setup error you made, you just added more words to seemingly explain it. not a "ah crap, I forgot this was multiball! my bad", not even a "I see what you think you're seeing here but let me elaborate", it's like you were hoping we'd all assume that's what you were trying to say in the first place, when that is clearly not the case. I don't buy it for one minute.

[The Bulge]

VOTE: dwlee

I can support this

[The Bulge]

oh wait there's more pages

urge to burn the worm, stirring

[The Bulge]

Vander reading null, and can help me by giving an opinion on Hockeyfan. any metric you like

I dislike hockey saying that dwlee/koba/bell we're all town because from their pov that should be very unlikely, and hockey should have pretty good reasoning to think that's true, which I didn't get from anything hockey or those three said.
I don't hate it but I definitely didn't like it.

its mianly based on tone/gut def not concrete yet. Im starting to not like Kcda anymore tho lol

Wait you thought me/koba/bell were all town AND that kdca was town?

strongly dislike this post as well. what is your point? where are you going with this, and why don't you just say it? also, why haven't you interacted with me or defended yourself?

If hockey thinks that then that'd be literally the entire town from hockey's pov which just seems pretty unlikely at this stage. Especially when I don't feel kcda is all that townie

unlikely how? unlikely that a townie would correctly identify the other townies so early? or unlikely that hockeyfan has that many townreads?

[The Bulge]

Vander, no response to me?

Bell, you really sure im the target today?

I'm glad about that vc cuz if i didnt wait i'd be on a wagon with bulge which im uncomfortable with.

why don't you share with the class

[The Bulge]

What is this hunt for godfather for?

There's no big difference in elimming Goon>Godfather, just opposite is faster.


Hunt mafia overall, don't try to hunt for Godfathers exactly, duh.

huuuuuhmhmhrrmrmrmmmmmmmmmmmm. Enchant.

[The Bulge]

...i locked in a solve in my 10th post naming you as my strongest sr. i have not yet deviated from my solve for even a minute. are we reading the same game here?

[The Bulge]

for godfathers i'm looking for meekness and/or forced bravado, in general. dwlee looks hesitant to engage meaningfully with the game, but they know they can't just go ghost and risk drawing gf suspicion for inactivity. their only real game-related comment (aside from the shaky koba read) is a tiny little suggestion of hockeyfan scum, which even on its own i don't like. the worm is a shtick but it still fits the bill for leaning on it to force content.

kcda and vander both voted obvtown hockeyfan and kcda's framing in particular was gross. actually looking it over this is making me think kcda/dr worm is a more likely pair than not. looking over vander's iso there's actually not a lot else here I hate but I still like my solve.

bruh you could read for a GF yourself by your own damn definition.

this is literally your only post of substance all game.

lmao. show me how my iso is similar to dwlee's or dr worms.

still an open q, btw

[The Bulge]

What is this hunt for godfather for?

There's no big difference in elimming Goon>Godfather, just opposite is faster.


Hunt mafia overall, don't try to hunt for Godfathers exactly, duh.

huuuuuhmhmhrrmrmrmmmmmmmmmmmm. Enchant.

Wha

it's this post. it's not good.

[The Bulge]

cuz of this i think koba is town... I dont think you interact with your GF that much.

explain your logic here as completely as you can

[The Bulge]

i feel like Guy Pearce

[The Bulge]

boom

chk-chk

shoot to kill.

i feel like Guy Pearce

ha ha

[The Bulge]

cuz i realized my last post was an unexplained nonsequitir and then i dipped for a day and a half and thought id explain the joke

[The Bulge]

i mean i wasnt crumbing or anything lmao, altho maybe from now on i will always crumb vengeful in vengeful just for the hell of it. i just noticed when i was reading the other day i made two gun noises in the wrong order in my iso lol thats all

[The Bulge]

hey bulge what do u read Enchant as?

i wanna vote there tbh to flip them now.

yea uh im reading up and enchant is disappointing me bigtime lol. i wanted so bad to stick to my 4 as long as i could til we saw some flips, but enchant wants in and he's pushing and shoving his way there.

[The Bulge]

yes, crumbing a role that is essentially vanilla .. very.. necessary

thats what im saying lol, your 434 looked to me like you were trying to do damage control for a slipping PR lmao and i was like tf are they on

pedit: i talked about this before, i didnt think any of enchant's early posts warranted a scumread.

[The Bulge]

gonna finish reading in a lil bit

[The Bulge]

ok so why did the 4 people below that warrent being there, can you explain each one of them?

compared to when i first spoke of them, dr worm has established more of a presence but continues to check all my boxes for a scum gimmick account (namely, avoiding meaningful events in the game thread and leaning on the gimmick to produce borderline game-relevant content nice and far from the action); kcda is still my strongest read, but it's a strong goon read so i dont wanna go there today; dwlee i havent taken a close look at a discussion i remember seeing with idr who, but i wanna pay attention to if they have changed the trajectory of their play at all from early game criticisms, this read's a little stale but was initially a super strong gf ping; vanders hasnt sold me, our interactions havent swayed me one way or another, so still a scumread, but in need of development and/or rechecking. and i mean, finishing reading the thread. pce for now

[The Bulge]

compared to when i first spoke of them,

177

[The Bulge]

hmm

yeah i think im coming around on kdca as town here

this post is right in the middle of the most overtly scummy discussion starter i've seen all game lmao

[The Bulge]

how does going around getting everyone to out their vigshots help anyone but scum??? with a wagon at e-1 no less

[The Bulge]

ok but wheres the counterpush? there is no way in hell we are hitting a godfather here. what's the rush? id like to see some unvotes personally

[The Bulge]

ok sweet, aorn im still liking my picks for the other team, but i was wrong about dwlee's role meaning im due for a careful readthru.

speaking of the other team, any of you wanna give the case on me? lmao. the votes look like they're meant to be self-explanatory but i am definitely not following that logic

[The Bulge]

hey yall sorry for disappearing, i have family visiting. I'll try and set aside some time today to catch up

[The Bulge]

NOTE who RAN AWAY when BUNGIE was at lemon nation minus ONE..

and who would that be? give it to me straight, doc.

actually at this point I'd be happy if you produced even a single contributing point to the game, your call as to what.

[The Bulge]

anyone have meta on dr worm? idc who the main is im talking experience with this particular gimmick

[The Bulge]

wow uh as much experience as I have with it, I do hate to be wrong, but hockeyfan's iso today smells like shit

[The Bulge]

no townie should be vengekilling here anymore anyways because it removes the godfather win con

agreed. also the comments about who we'd shoot if limmed are still weird.

[The Bulge]

back to work, more later

[The Bulge]

hehehehe

[The Bulge]

ngl tho i probably would have hammered that, buddy lost the plot a lil towards the end. but im still pretty fuckin pleased with my reads this game. will not be voting koba or bell today.

[The Bulge]

im off today so ill probably do some rereading in a bit, try and eliminate some possible pairings

[The Bulge]

dr worm's page 1 content is still megascummy lol, can i stop reading here?

[The Bulge]

upon reread i think it's vanderslot/worms. not entirely sure who i prefer for gf. kcda's early content didn't strike me as scummy as it did before on the second time around. there's a few minor kc/worm interactions earlier on that looked kind of contrived to me at first but i don't see any obvious theatre looking back. and then there are some interactions that don't really make sense if coordinated, like my flashwagon and worm's subsequent nonsensical kc shade. any kc posts that were tonepinging me i think could be NAI, same for the stilted early worm interactions.

meanwhile, vanders and dr worm completely avoided each other in-thread. worm stated a townread on vander several times; vander liked koba's list with dr worm at the bottom, and then later agreed with hockeyfan's towncase, that's it. zero explanations, zero interactions. vander did however back up and clarify the good doctor's koba/bell position in 266. can't really blame vander for not knowing how to interact with that partner, I've been in similar situations and chose to just avoid. but i won't say more on that so we dont get into any angle shooting.

individually, there's a tonne about vander's play i have disliked. overall, their play seemed rigid and formulated, something I couldn't put my finger on at first. there is also a habit I'm seeing where he talked a lot of theory about what scum would be doing, enough to push a narrative, say. more specifically, i dislike our interactions more on second read, the way he tried to slide enchant into my scumlist (which probably had vander's whole team on it lol) was slimy where any of vander's own efforts against enchant were hedgey at best. 357 is *chef's kiss* beautiful lmao.

dr worm's hop on enchant was terrible, hop on my wagon was even more egregious, and the way he tried to float the idea that kcda was scummy for abandoning the flashwagon is completely ridiculous. the absolute moon logic aside, the way it was initially presented ("NOTE...") is in line with worm's MO this whole game, playing from the sidelines. 289 is one other good example of worm forcing content with minimal gamestate impact.

[The Bulge]

to be clear i thought hockey was solidly in scum meta bc ppl from his community emphatically stated he was an easy read and clear to read when scum and he was acting this way


Granted one of those people mainly stating it is a caught cheater so hey

So yeah my meta was bad xP

Bulge, why is bell town?

for me hockey's d2 play looked rushed and nervous. i thought i was seeing blue scum trying to avoid a repeat of d1 at all costs.


i can't recall many times i've been wrong tonereading bell. town bell is present and casual where as scum he gets a little cagier and more aloof. and I'm not getting the sense he's 'trying anything' here, jafeel?

Bulge, talk to me why you think you are outside of scumrange

Bell, tell me why you are outside of scumrange.

im not sure my meta is consistent enough to define a scumrange. people tend to have troubles reading me as either alignment.

[The Bulge]

got a couple other things i wanna pursue but im finishing a game of monopoly before my family travels back home tomorrow.

[The Bulge]

upon reread i think it's vanderslot/worms.

I wrote you a POEM for taking SUCH A BOLD STANCE!!

BULGEY is going OUT ON A LIMB !!
and making me SQUIRM
he wants to ELIM
NM ..
or WORM ..

A+ would read more

[The Bulge]

wait i have something for this

edgar annelid poe

[The Bulge]

All this is trying to tell me that it's bulge and worm but i am still too uncertain to move on it.

let's yeet the worm and see what happens?

[The Bulge]

actually I'm torn atm. i think my vander read is a little stronger than my worm read, but gamestate i think makes it slightly more likely we hit scum with dr worm. idk im pretty sure about the pairing anyway but dunno what to think anymore about gf play.

[The Bulge]

anyone have meta on dr worm? idc who the main is im talking experience with this particular gimmick

I have none. First time seeing this gimmick. 0 interest in stopping whoever gets limmed shooting them Or they get limmed them shooting Bulge.

ohoho bell is this you falling off the fence? sorry once again my dude.

[The Bulge]

NOTE who RAN AWAY when BUNGIE was at lemon nation minus ONE..

and who would that be? give it to me straight, doc.

actually at this point I'd be happy if you produced even a single contributing point to the game, your call as to what.

Back on my shit here

VOTE: Bulge

NOPE UNVOTE:

FUCK DAT LOLLIM BULLSHIT

hey doc, can you go into some detail about this? poetry or prose, your call, but i wanna see your reasoning

[The Bulge]

VOTE: dr worm

[The Bulge]

did anybody even read my shit or should i have stuck to 2 or 3 lines per post

[The Bulge]

the last few pages (which are dumb) got me thinking about a bell-scum world. i dont think that's the world we live in, but i think he could only be paired with dr worm. or else why would he be coming for koba rn instead of going with game momentum

[The Bulge]

am i wrong to assume you would hammer your own goon in this setup? hypothetically

[The Bulge]

the last few pages (which are dumb) got me thinking about a bell-scum world. i dont think that's the world we live in, but i think he could only be paired with dr worm. or else why would he be coming for koba rn instead of going with game momentum

this paring seems unlikely with dr worm's "cool guy" read of bell and the surrounding interaction, but idk bell hasnt touched like any of his posts so

[The Bulge]

I would hammer my own godfather

i kinda believe this but also feel like ive seen you bluff something similar and not follow thru but idrk what im thinking about could be nothing

[The Bulge]

who is town

[The Bulge]

actually

VOTE: Dr Worm

this prob flips goon but its the one slot i am like 1000% sure will flip scum


like i feel a tiny percent of doubt on my other scumreads

but this one?

nah

this one flips scum always.

also they scumread me and thats annoying

koba do you still a strong read on dr worm?

[The Bulge]

as if i could ever be dr worm's partner lmfao

[The Bulge]

VOTE: Not_Mafia

[The Bulge]

haha wp

bell i'd like to believe I would have gotten there with more time, but i thought this was your town play for sure.

great game! had a lot of fun playing with everyone. thanks pavowski for hosting!

[The Bulge]

ok here it is, read em and weep.

kcda and vanderscamp are goons. dwlee and doc worm, godfathers. boom

bulge is 2/2 on reading goons as godfathers!

ah shoot, i was holding the darn thing upside down!

[The Bulge]

that was a pretty stellar ending