Pokemon TCG

[Ythan]

My friends have a seven year old who just started collecting Pokemon cards without actually knowing what they're for so I've finally gotten into the game I avoided all my life in favor of Magic to try to teach him. I've been looking through the cards and it looks like there are plenty of dumb jank decks to be made just like I enjoy doing in Magic, which is perfect since I'm playing a child and don't want to try too too hard to win. So I'm gonna talk about fun cards I find here, maybe you play too and can join me.

[Ythan]

FO Moltres seems fun for a mill deck. Weird to see mill in fire as a Magic player but burning decks sounds fun. Just gotta play around charging it up, probably stall as long as possible and try to win in one shot.

[Ythan]

I'm scanning chronologically and not familiar with any meta ever or any obvious counters to any of the cards or strategies I will be discussing btw.

[Ythan]

RO Dark Machamp seems fun for winning by clearing your opponent's bench. Fling until only one is left and then use something like JU Pidgeot's Hurricane to bounce it to hand for the win.

[Ythan]

i haven't played in a long time but i ordered a pair of duel decks to play with my roommates tomorrow.

That's what I did! I got Rayquaza V vs Noivern V, he picked Rayquaza.

[Ythan]

"Donk"

Thanks I love it

[Ythan]

"Donk" (no bench or active pokemon victory) strategies are not very prevalent in standard because they release lots of basic pokemon that give you a benefit when you bench them, so if you try a donk strategy you generally only succeed in investing lots of resources into generating an awkward moment when the pokemon that is meant for utility is forced into play and that player has to spend 1 energy to retreat it, when you spent like, 3 energy and an evolution card and a bunch of deck design decisions. If the cards you're playing with are strictly limited to old stuff that was out when I was 8 like those pictures though, I remember donk being super strong when I was 8, and there weren't that many utility pokemon when i was 8, so like, I don't see why it's a strategy that would get countered by accident.

This sounds like more of an issue with those moves that lure a specific Pokemon out from the bench?

[Ythan]

G1 Erika's Dragonair's Take Away seems like a poor alternative to Fling.

[Ythan]

Particularly considering the things I would be pairing the Machamp or Dragonair with ie some form of Pidgeot probably is already colorless so I could afford the colored Machamp. I think.

[Ythan]

As does G1 Sabrina's Gengar's Call of the Night. Pain Amplifier looks fun though.

[Ythan]

Lt. Surge's Treaty seems like it might find a place in a deck aiming to collect prize cards directly which sounds fun but obviously it's not going to get you there by itself. Also maybe a good filler card overall as a non supporter that replaces itself.

[Ythan]

Minion of Team Rocket seems like a poor alternative to Pidgeot when like you need

creatures

Pokemon anyway.

I feel like clarifying (again?) that all of these judgements are specifically in the context of my jank.

[Ythan]

What on Earth is the deal with G2 Blaine's Charizard?

[Ythan]

I guess G2 Giovanni's Meowth's False Charity would be appropriate for a mill deck? I hate putting cards into my opponent's hand but filtering out trainers has got to help.

[Ythan]

Can't wait to hear how that goes/went!

[Ythan]

It's dumb to consider using Imposter Professor Oak when your opponent is under seven cards to shrink their deck right? After typing it out I'm more certain the answer is yes.

[Ythan]

I mean maybe they're holding onto something and you can get rid of that.

I have a problem.

[Ythan]

Obviously this would be part of a larger mill deck supporting more dedicated cards.

[Ythan]

Challenge! technically also pulls cards out of your opponent's deck but like five at most.

[Ythan]

Imposter Oak's Revenge actually a poor alternative to the original in my corrupt imaginings.

[Ythan]

Erika is a straightforward example of what I'm looking for here. Drawing cards is good for everyone but you get to draw as many as they do and you're playing mill while they probably aren't and that tips the utility into your favor.

[Ythan]

Blaine's Quiz #1 as well as #2 and #3 likewise have an approximately equal expected value of draw for each player but playing mill tilts the utility in your favor. Quiz cards probably strong against children also now that I imagine it playing out.

[Ythan]

Minion of Team Rocket seems like a poor alternative to Pidgeot when like you need

creatures

Pokemon anyway.

I feel like clarifying (again?) that all of these judgements are specifically in the context of my jank.

On second thought since this is a trainer card it potentially allows bouncing multiple Pokemon in a turn which is something to consider. Not reliable alone though.

[Ythan]

Lol even set AND name are not enough to uniquely identify cards in this game there's at least the two Erika's Glooms and two Erika's Weepinbells in G1 alone.

[Ythan]

Misty's Duel shares relevance with Blaine's Quizzes and Imposter Oak.

[Ythan]

This Feraligator (there's two in the set BOTH with Ken Sugimori art wtf) smells faintly of mill but it's not much or reliable and on its own is just as likely to mill you.

[Ythan]

Real talk my opponent has yet to correctly time a rock paper scissors throw, our duel decks each feature a card that requires it.

[Ythan]

i haven't played in a long time but i ordered a pair of duel decks to play with my roommates tomorrow.

That's what I did! I got Rayquaza V vs Noivern V, he picked Rayquaza.

i think thats what i have sitting on the kitchen table rn

this was wrong i have gardevoir v victini

it was fun. we each played each deck once and the gardevoir deck won both times. I kind of gamethrew by milling myself out

I accidentally drew my whole deck in the one game I've completed and had to recover with a Copycat and scramble to win in the meager time it bought me.

[Ythan]

I think a lot of people flip coins for the rock paper scissors cards simply because there are some officiation issues with the game of rock paper scissors and no such issues with coins.

it's on the cards because kids like to play rock paper scissors

We also need to work on the coin flipping all the way over when we flip it lol.

[Ythan]

I've definitely noticed a ton of fire attacks that require discarding energy so that seems useful for the type.

[Ythan]

Saw this Typhlosion and thought of your basin.

[Ythan]

Pokemon March technically pulls one card from your opponent's deck while being otherwise useful but that's a small pull for a dedicated mill deck.

[Ythan]

I guess even an effect that thins just a few cards out is worth considering if it also has general utility you want anyway, like using Erika instead of Hop.

[Ythan]

Unown E has sort of an (Imposter) Oak ('s Revenge) thing going on.

[Ythan]

I'm expecting to find more such Pokemon eventually but so far just that one Moltres. It was ages before Magic got serious if you can call it that about mill too I guess.

[Ythan]

That makes sense. Ironically I'm looking at it as a friendly alternative to knocking out his Pokemon.

[Ythan]

Shining Magikarp with that one energy two card draw and you even get to share.

[Ythan]

Okay finally Dark Tyranitar looks great it mills about half a card per energy per turn with no discard, which should quickly put it ahead of Moltres. And it does damage blah blah.

[Ythan]

Seems like it might be intentional with stuff like Light Togetic's Sweet Kiss.

[Ythan]

I stopped on Dark Quilava because of the tiny mill but noticed it says "all players" that's weird. I had to double check to be sure 3+ wasn't supported.

[Ythan]

Light Golduck sends some fraction of three cards per turn to the hand for each player.

[Ythan]

Light Wigglytuff's got a handy ability that can pull one a turn too, and in colorless.

[Ythan]

Lucky Stadium, I don't think I've said one of those yet.

[Ythan]

Pokemon Personality Test could have some relevance if some of these dark and light Pokemon found their way into a deck together but then again what's the point if you're trying to win the minigame.

[Ythan]

Team Rocket's Evil Deeds is one for one with a couple added perks.

[Ythan]

Wow another mill Tyranitar in the same set, and a shiny one at that. I think the expected mill only approaches one per turn but theoretically could win at any time.

I gotta stop noting effects that cause or let the opponent draw or search out cards they are far more numerous than anything else I'm tracking and I'm finally starting to see actual mill.

[Ythan]

I did have a thought as to whether one could effectively just plug every potential route to losing and wait for your opponent to mill out naturally. Loads of effects for healing and whatnot, saw at least one Pokemon that doesn't give up a prize card when ko'd anyway, and I think I noticed a move that let me shuffle trainers from discard and there's probably other ways to stave off mill indefinitely.

[Ythan]

Didn't quite see it at first but 4 dolls seems like probably 4 free turns and if I'm recycling cards from discard they could really get out of hand, could it really be that simple?

[Ythan]

Tyranitar seems to be a go to miller.

[Ythan]

A Larvitar that mills and while healing itself rather than dealing damage that's fantastic.

[Ythan]

Magcargo mills, might be handy in a Moltres deck for pulling your own energy out (assuming some form of recovery) while decreasing the amount required to win.

[Ythan]

Oh no I just noticed that's quite a bit lemme see

[Ythan]

The non-foil isn't too bad.

[Ythan]

Groudon ex and it only mills one a turn? Mill so pricey and draw so cheap this is kind of a friendly (the game to the player) game.

[Ythan]

Hi Dwlee!

What would you consider a good ratio?

[Ythan]

Fascinating thank you.

[Ythan]

Groudon ex and it only mills one a turn? Mill so pricey and draw so cheap this is kind of a friendly (the game to the player) game.

My bad HALF a card per turn sigh

[Ythan]

I had not, and I bet you're talking about this one which jumped out at me. I've definitely scanned past loads of trainer cards I could use to recur that every turn too.

[Ythan]

Well maybe not both "loads" and "every turn" but definitely either one.

[Ythan]

The thought of attacking the deck and getting walled by non-items I can't discard gives me Netrunner flashbacks.

[Ythan]

I think some other form of generalized mill would clear the accumulated gunk and maybe help with the diminishing returns if that makes sense.

[Ythan]

muk shuffles the unmilled cards in rather than leaving them on top

I missed that!

[Ythan]

You might be interested in Durant.

I am, and it's flavorful too!

[Ythan]

More efficient than Moltres for sure.

[Ythan]

I like the bugs eating your deck flavor.

[Ythan]

He made his own deck and didn't draw a single energy card just filled his bench with Pokemon for me to knock out all at once with Noivern V. I got to draw four prize cards at once! And hopefully afterward was able to convey the importance of energy or at least a way to tutor energy.

[Ythan]

It can depend how strong or serious you want your deck to be there was a time when I just wanted to kill people with Raticate because he required no energy and is hilarious

The Alolan one? Pretty strong attack, potentially, for no energy, that's fun.

[Ythan]

Less is more. Not to say that more can't also be more.

[Ythan]

Oh nice!

What do you mean about eight double colorless? Are there like two similar versions? Colorless energy with bonuses look fun, I have considered a colorless deck featuring a variety of them instead of basics.

[Ythan]

That seems fun!

[Ythan]

My third win! I actually lost a Pokemon this time which was nice because I had filled my bench up for no reason and then drew my Noivern.

[Ythan]

I may turn my deckbuilding efforts toward speedy wins, as I often have a limited time to play and kids dawdle.

[Ythan]

That's awfully nice thank you!

[Ythan]

I haven't gotten to play any lately, been rolling katamaris instead.

[Ythan]

I've never been to a Pokemon event I should do that, Magic is always so fun that way. Good luck if you do.

[Ythan]

Spoiler:

[Ythan]

Incidentally that's the face of a wizard who just milled out but I'm not sure how the flavor translates to Pokemon.

[Ythan]

I always correct my kid friend when he says kill or die in the context of Pokemon.

[Ythan]

As always I'm generally too fixated on my own favorite bells and whistles to provide real constructive feedback but I can always ooh and ah and learn stuff.

[Ythan]

60 I can answer that one!