Not Quite Normal Multiball II (Game Over)

[Flavor Leaf]

It’s not a fallacy mafia is a game of probability.

you're using gambler's fallacy, though

[Flavor Leaf]

Youre acting like I just happened to claim my role, but there's like absolutely no way I do that as scum here, but you're too hard up on the gunsmith result to see the proof in the pudding in front of you that I'm more likely town.

[Flavor Leaf]

But you push like the %'s make it so statistically id somehow be more likely scum, which is just not true here.

[Flavor Leaf]

it's possible monkey's a wolf who was sitting on catboi not expecting it to ever go through, but i just think theyre dense town here.

[Flavor Leaf]

It’s much more possible you’re a wolf.

I can't be a wolf.

And no, it is not, if you mean scum.

How is it more possible? I claimed before you did, so taking out the guilty.

How is it more possible?

[Flavor Leaf]

viewtopic.php?p=10854444#p10854444 - This is the game that I pulled the gambit as town saying I was a Day 3 IC. Nobody believed me there. I was a 1-shot Vig, held my Night 1, and I shot scum Night 2, then I got pushed as scum killing my own partner.

viewtopic.php?p=11204754#p11204754 - Here is Detective Penguin, another game I claimed Day 3 IC as a Vigilante.

viewtopic.php?p=13354434#p13354434 - Here's where I say this game that "I'm gonna pull from the Old FL handbook....I'm a Day 3 IC."




viewtopic.php?p=12257454#p12257454 - A vig game of mine where I replace in Night 1, and hit scum Night 1 also, this one I didn't get a chance to say I was a Day 3 IC because I came in during the night and used the shot.

this is undeniable proof that I softed Day 1 as well on top of claiming it legitimately in my monkery immediately going into Night 1.

You're saying it's convenient and more likely that comes from scum when it's literally basically impossible for this to have happened.

[Flavor Leaf]

On top of that, claiming I'm a scum vig is just plan stupid, because I would never in my life claim my real role there. I just don't.


I am both scum team's number 1 threat right now.

[Flavor Leaf]

And here's the thing, as scum, I NEVER live through this game because if I were scum, the other scum team would kill me eventually anyways because they have to.

The fact I'm town means both scum would have to risk getting shot by me night after night, so even if you believe I am scum here, it doesn't hurt at all to just move past what's right in front of your face based on my slot becoming a slot needed to be killed as town, and even if i were scum.

So on top of you having surface level logic, there is always scum on my wagon. 3, maybe more scum, are 100% on my wagon right now.

[Flavor Leaf]

I also thought about Monkey being scum that's willing to sacrifice himself to get a vig and I think it could make sense in a setup with limited kills. This scenario also means that he has a scum buddy that told him that FL claimed vig.

In the traditional sense, multiball refers to mirrored scum teams.

I also think that 2 1 shot gunsmiths could certainly co-exist as town so MM/tic tac are prob both the same alignment. I'm not so gung ho on MM/Tic Tac being scum but it could make sense?

so maybe something like


scp
monkey
yd
butter


catboi
tic tac
meg
klick/cass


mastina



or with a t/t gunsmith its like a


scp
malcolm
yd
butter


catboi
meg
klick
cass


mastina

I never claim Vig as a scumVig here.

[Flavor Leaf]

So i agree with you that Monkey could be scum indicative, Nero.

But I dont see it as both of my wolf mates, and probably not SCP, tbh unless they white knighting me here

[Flavor Leaf]

STD has also been putting themselves out to defend me, so if one are scum, theyre white knighting and defending me when they would make the difference in fading me I feel

[Flavor Leaf]

I agree Flavor is likely mafia on balance of things

this really irks me. Like what do you know about the games balance?

there's a flipped town voyer

a flipped wolf bookie

2 claimed 1x gs

a vt claim

a parity cop claim

a monkery and a masonary.

I might be forgetting some claims but I don't see how a town you, with the same info as me, can determine whether or not a vig exists based on balance.

You forgot the Beloved Princess claim by your top scum read.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Cass - I believe there’s scum, Mafia specifically, in the straggler votes on Catboi.

Mega, Toogeloo, TicTac, and CSF are those 4. Toogs flipped town, and TicTac/Mega are Masons. Meaning I think it’s highly likely that CSF is Mafia here.

[Flavor Leaf]

I do know that scum can only kill 2/3 nights and there might be protectives, but I just think it's unlikely

I actually think it makes some sense for both teams to not shoot n1 and save their shots instead of rando kill n1. This also means that no one worried them b/c scum is in control of this gamestate.

This is what MonkeyMan was saying too

[Flavor Leaf]

@Cass -

I believe there’s scum, Mafia specifically, in the straggler votes on Catboi.

Mega, Toogeloo, TicTac, and CSF are those 4. Toogs flipped town, and TicTac/Mega are Masons. Meaning I think it’s highly likely that CSF is Mafia here.

citation needed

I don't understand why you think mafia would jump on catboi over the Town!Toog wagon

I still don't think it makes sense for FL's kill condition to be tied to keeping possible scum alive.

I still think it's more possible for him to be scum who decided to fake claim vig than actual vig.

I still think we don't want FL to be around in the late portions of the game.

I still think FL being eliminated is better than any potential vig beneifit.

I could shoot them, but i lose the Vig. It stops me from shooting both of them, not one of them.

[Flavor Leaf]

Didn’t mean to quote the first one.

There’s also a Beloved Princess claim

[Flavor Leaf]

Pressure on me here implies i have strong reads this game, which is proven with my Toogs/Catboi correct reads. I believe I am also correct on CSF.

With me being as correct as I am, i don’t make it to end game, but scum are trying to get rid of me asap.

[Flavor Leaf]

I thought Dunn was super scummy this day phase, thought townier last phase

[Flavor Leaf]

do you think fl is scum

Yeah his push on me is pretty bad I think?

And with no other kills last night, I don't really buy that it's a vig over scum a kill. like yes, I do know that scum can only kill 2/3 nights and there might be protectives, but I just think it's unlikely

what do you think of the wagon on you

I think Nashville and Ydrasse are scum if that helps

I might slightly agree with you that they aren't great but I'm not sure if it's a scum slot.

I mean I agree that FL's push on CSF isn't great. I think he's scum reading her b/c he thinks there was mafia on the catboi wagon and just ??? like I don't understand this thought process

don't really agree with her it makes no sense for there to be no scum nk if FL is vig. Still think it makes sense for scum to not shoot n1 but that's just me I guess.

I think when being asked about the wagon on her you could be nitpicky and say that she didn't include FL and could maybe invoke the "push town/bus buddy" mantra (I'm just tunneled on YD) and you could maybe get a yd/csf are mafia.

Her vote on FL is OMGUS which is null b/c both alignments do it.

I could be wrong and have been wrong on CSF before but I just don't feel gung ho about this being scum and I low key think its going to be a misflip just b/c its the same group of ppl that flipped Toog.

I wish we could just all come together and vote obvious scum Dunn.

or Butterchurn

or you know someone from the Toog wagon.

@Nero - Doubt my VCA solves, do you?

People doubted the Catboi VCA too.

[Flavor Leaf]

In addition, I believe it’s possible for CSF to be wolf based on the way they tried to move me off of Catboi at one point onto Mega.

[Flavor Leaf]

So if I’m wrong they’re mafia, their next likelihood is probably wolf.

[Flavor Leaf]

If CSF doesn’t happen, I’m not against voting Dunn.

I’d probably also hop on Ydrasse, Malcolm, maybe Menalque, maybe Monkey, Mega/Klick probably has 1 wolf 1 town

[Flavor Leaf]

I need to make a list of people calling CSF reasoning for scum weak.

[Flavor Leaf]

I asked you to explain what your VCA and you didn't do that.

I’m barely keeping up atm, and if you walling, I’m missing.

Feel like I have explained it, though.

Based on the VCA of Catboi, it implies wolves weren’t bussing, and if they were, then it’s like 1. Of the straggler votes, likely has Mafia somewhere in them. Multiple Maf could be on that wagon if ND or Nero ended up being Mafia, I’m town reading the both, however for reasons I explained multiple times Day 1.

Leaves TicTac, Mega, and Cat Scratch. TicTac and Mega claimed masons.

There’s also the possibility of Cat Scratch Wolf based on the way that they tried to get me to move off of Catboi onto Mega.

It’s pretty solid VCA.

I’ll vote Dunnstral if I need to.

[Flavor Leaf]

Monkey being Mafia throws it all out of wack, but I’m thinking they’re a wolf if they’re scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Cass - I believe there’s scum, Mafia specifically, in the straggler votes on Catboi.

Mega, Toogeloo, TicTac, and CSF are those 4. Toogs flipped town, and TicTac/Mega are Masons. Meaning I think it’s highly likely that CSF is Mafia here.

I’ve said this pretty recently, i believe, and this wasn’t the first time.

[Flavor Leaf]

you have and I remember it, I just thought there was going to be more to it. I'm just not a huge fan of that reasoning though. I mean, maybe I'm being a useful idiot and derailing a scum wagon but my heart just isn't in it and it was the same group that mislimmed Toog d1 which made me not really want to vote her. Of course, now that group is slowly coming over here so...idk

Do you scum read Dunn?

Dunn could be scum, but i feel like there's a chance im biased since they were poorly pushing me. Not as confident, but like I said, i'd vote there.

[Flavor Leaf]

y'all gonna call me scum even if I get the kill on mastina.

[Flavor Leaf]

My theory with Ydra is they claimed to target Catboi so they wouldnt get seen as a Catboi partner.

[Flavor Leaf]

My theory with Ydra is they claimed to target Catboi so they wouldnt get seen as a Catboi partner.

do you think ydra is mafia or wolf?

probs wolf.

[Flavor Leaf]

If my choice is between CSF and Dunn today I'm definitely voting CSF

but I'm frustrated that FL lost steam

You're choosing the wagon I'm pushing because the wagon on me lost steam?

[Flavor Leaf]

2. I really wanted FL out of the game as a stronger scumread and as someone who was making it impossible to play for several players,

this is so yesterday's news. ive been mostly inactive this day phase.

[Flavor Leaf]

Personally I would have checked for two town players on day 1 if I had that role but that's just me.

She's a wolf, though, you're town. Havent you heard the howling.

Can keep her around, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

If my choice is between CSF and Dunn today I'm definitely voting CSF

but I'm frustrated that FL lost steam

You're choosing the wagon I'm pushing because the wagon on me lost steam?

This is multiball.

So? My push on CSF was specifically Mafia with smaller chance of Wolf.

[Flavor Leaf]

Menalque seems like town who realizes they were defending scum all game, and gave up instead of putting in work to reset reads because it's more effort, but yeah, there's some scum equity in that if they using that as a ploy.

Would rather CSF/Dunnstral today.

Dont know how I feel about the 2 wagons I wanted are the 2 that are countering right now.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Butter - they sheeped me onto Catboi, Catboi then called them out slightly, then after the Bnuuy wagon, they never went back and sat on ND the rest of the game.

[Flavor Leaf]

My theory is Norwegian was sheeping me trying to pocket me earlier which coincides well with me pushing Catboi. Positioning around me. Ydrasse coming into the game with a town read on Catboi was a flip of the positioning along with the parity cop checking on catboi as a theory.

Klick/Mega would be a good parity cop.

[Flavor Leaf]

Eh, i just spent way too much time playing Day 1, said I would cool it, naturally wanted to take a break, need to finish writing my book, setting up to move in 2 weeks, letting others play today, and frankly, I tasted sweet vindication.

[Flavor Leaf]

I licked it twice with Toogs town and Catboi scum.

And me being less active got the 2 people I wanted faded as the main wagons, so

[Flavor Leaf]

don't really remember you scum reading Dunn/Well Done but then again its not like I've been reading that closely

I wasnt at the end of Day 1, but the initial Well Done vs FL is the 1v1 that caused Catboi to turn their town read on me to a scum read, which is the moment my scum lean on Catboi turned into a scum catch.

And then Dunnstral's play this day phase has been poor, and is exactly how scum interact towards me after I shoot scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

Lukewarm felt really townie, but my initial push on Well Done slot was because of me feeling Dunnstral's read on me specifically was fake, exactly like this day phase.

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor/Nero, Do you find it odd that the three people I called out the most yesterday all decided to vote me?

I spent so long defending your slot day 1, I've kind of been subconsciously tuning out anyone still trying to push you at this point. I doubt they're all scum, but there is probably one scum at least trying to get your wagon going again, likely to save either CSF/Dunnstral, whichever of them is a partner.

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor/Nero, Do you find it odd that the three people I called out the most yesterday all decided to vote me?

If you're talking about me, this is once again extremely twisting the narrative of things. You townread me early on, in fact, and I voted you first. You've been my strongest scumread for most of the game. Implying that I decided to vote you due to you calling me out is ludicrous. It was the other way around.

I dont think this is as strong as a defense as you think it is; i think you're town and this post pinged me.

[Flavor Leaf]

Has no merit. I'm obv town, people just dont want me to be town.

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor/Nero, Do you find it odd that the three people I called out the most yesterday all decided to vote me?

If you're talking about me, this is once again extremely twisting the narrative of things. You townread me early on, in fact, and I voted you first. You've been my strongest scumread for most of the game. Implying that I decided to vote you due to you calling me out is ludicrous. It was the other way around.

I dont think this is as strong as a defense as you think it is; i think you're town and this post pinged me.

Well, you also think Nashville is town, so I can see why you wouldn't notice her twisting things. How is it not twisting for her to imply that the three people voting her are doing so because she called them out when 2/3 of them scumread her strongly before she "called them out"?

eh, maybe. i just dont think it's intentional by them.

[Flavor Leaf]

I really really want you to be town. You're just not, FL.

I know that I am, though Absolutely no way I could claim Vig so happenstancely if I was scum here. You only think this because you saw I had a gun without knowing I was a Vigilante.

Your 'likelihood' theory is just plain wrong because I claimed before you did. Had I claimed after, then sure, that would be a fine theory, but I literally claimed and softed before any gunsmiths came my way.

[Flavor Leaf]

Has no merit. I'm obv town, people just dont want me to be town.

I just feel this has to be scum not wanting us to unite on CSF/Dunn.

I think scum thought I'd be an easy wagon based on yesterday + gunsmith, so I could see it. I'm sure some got scared off after the vig claim happened prior to the day phase.

Idk if people are actively pushing me as much anymore, though. Dunnstral/Klick, but like, that's where I think scum has high potential of being as well.

[Flavor Leaf]

do you think you might be scumreading meg and/or klick because they are masons? you've had them as SRs for a while (since the beginning of D2 at least), but I don't think you've thought about that. Obviously, they can be wolf but I want to pick your brain here

no

I think both are scummy for their end of d1 actions. I even speculated @ one point that only one of them were scum b/c they were masons. I just think a do nothing Meg is/would be a decent d2 elimination.

got it
I feel like a do-nothing meg would be more likely town by some degree, tho idk if that's the vibe I get

End of Day 1 Meg was super scummy as a possible Catboi partner. I just think Klick is also a possible catboi partner, and I dont know how I feel about the both of them being scum. If so, poor Tictac.

[Flavor Leaf]

If you were intending to kill Catboi why didn't you say so D1 FL?

I was intending to kill Mastina.

[Flavor Leaf]

Thanks for the clear Ydrasse. You can endgame.

[Flavor Leaf]

CSF probs Mafia. Dunn probs wolf.

[Flavor Leaf]

Thanks for the clear Ydrasse. You can endgame.

Drassic park can get to Day 6 now instead of endgame.

[Flavor Leaf]

all four alignments have different wincons is the impression i have

hmm, then what's the point of specifying 'identical wincon' over just 'same alignment'? don't those mean the same thing?

Drasstic times call for Drasstic measures for a wolfy.

[Flavor Leaf]

Miller would be town to parity cops because they are town.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t believe the claim, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

CSF wagon looks like all town.

[Flavor Leaf]

Miller would be town to parity cops because they are town.

Like anything other than this is just incorrect.

[Flavor Leaf]

YD's claim or Dunns? or both?

sure, take your pick.

Since scum had a miller before in the first one, I could see Dunn true claiming their real role as scum, so that role might be believable.

Ydrasse had zero reason to out herself today if she was a Town Parity Cop. The result and claim was performative.

Anyone thinking she could be Malefactor, I just really really don’t believe she ever makes that one post she made saying “if you trust me on anything, trust I’m not a Malefactor.” That’s just super super dirty, and i believed her when she said that.

She’s a Wolf, and her claim on FL-Catboi was a hard distancing from Catboi because it puts it in the mind that she “wondered” about Catboi alignment, and I’m a believable target.

I wouldn’t push Ydrasse fully today, though, not more than the shade I’ve been throwing at the least.

[Flavor Leaf]

Don’t go out on a limb on the cat wagon fl.

I don’t think I’m ‘out on a limb’.

If Nashville and Nero are town, which I believe they are, then CSF is scum. Like there just isn’t any room around it besides that.

I’m fine fading Dunn if that’s what we gotta do, but yeah.

I know most people don’t see the case on CSF, but like, :shrug:

I just don’t think I have a need to start doubting my process/reads yet.

I’m not gonna hard tunnel or anything, I’m still talking about other scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

CSF wagon looks like all town.

Yea but this is MB so the other faction would still be voting other scum so we can't really judge wagon comp like a single.

It being multiball doesn’t cancel out me having town reads on the two slots specifically.

Menalque I’ve been back and forth with, but even from the get go I called out as Menalque being town with an incorrect read on Catboi.

Catboi tried to use meta for Menalque catching them as scum, even though Menalque town read them until later in the game same way as now. I don’t see that meta reasoning coming from a scum partner Menalque, and frankly i don’t see why Menalque does what he did day 1 as scum. It did nothing for them to defend Catboi. I could be wrong there, sure.

I talked about me thinking TicTac was town and defended them yesterday enough.

[Flavor Leaf]

VCA is just so good in multiball.

[Flavor Leaf]

UGHHHH

sod. sit with me my child. listen to my words:

i have a hard time taking this game seriously and derive a lot of joy from being goofy even to my own detriment readwise

and that means i will lean more and more into fakeclaiming scum if it makes me smile

but you have my word i am not a malefactor. i make no promises otherwise

This doesn’t come from wooferMalefactor.

[Flavor Leaf]

What’s a hirsute?

It’s not just yellow miller?

[Flavor Leaf]

Hirsute seems just like Yellow Miller, Seer is just Yellow Cop.

It acts like town to a parity cop, full stop.

[Flavor Leaf]

Werewolf is just Yellow Mafia grand scheme of things, Vanilla Cop doesn’t go for alignments. Yes, in theory there could be alignment specific, but Vanilla Cop targeting a Vanilla Werewolf should still get Vanilla.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Dunnstral

CSF wagon dying :/

[Flavor Leaf]

Klick/Dunn/ydrasse is the wolf team.

CSF/Mastina/Malcolm + one other is the mafia team.

Malefactor is somewhere in between

Day 2 prediction

[Flavor Leaf]

Switching Mastina with Dunnstral is possible.

[Flavor Leaf]

that's the impression i got anyways

we could ask him point blank

DUNN DO YOU WANT THE PARITY COP TO CHECK YOU?

The parity cop is scum, and anyone about to go down is always gonna say yes to this, so idk the purpose of this comment

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah so is Gunsmith but multiple players have claimed it doesn't work against werewolves. What makes vanilla cop different?

in flavor, SKs use knives thus they get negative from a GS. Perhaps the mod has wolf flavored as using their

CLAWS

and they are basically a faction of SKs?

Not for vanilla cops.

Vanilla just determines PR or not. Faction be damned. Period.

~Titus

This

[Flavor Leaf]

Hmm.

Don’t like the Malcolm wagon.

[Flavor Leaf]

Mainly because of 9 votes that fast when everything else stalled.

Feels like what happened to Tictac when Catboi wagon was getting more momentum.

[Flavor Leaf]

If Dunn isn’t happening, I’m going back to CSF

[Flavor Leaf]

If someone Parity Cop is town here, i think they should be on Nashville and someone they think is town.

[Flavor Leaf]

Somehow*

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t see any reason for butter to be so stuck on ND a scum here

[Flavor Leaf]

Do you think Dunn is more likely to be scum than CSF?

No, but more likely than Malcolm.

Ydrasse moreso than Dunn for me, so I do like their last post.

[Flavor Leaf]

The parity cop is scum

Yeah Ydrasse is probably scum.

This is strictly their scum meta. They open up strong and interact with people to leave a good impression, but as the game goes on they taper off and have difficulty contributing to actual content, or doing anything beyond looking good on tone early on.

Why are they voting for malcolm right now? Why did they vote for me? Why are we letting them get away with that?

I get we're not going to elim them based on their claim today but it should be kept in mind for sure

I would bet specifically they are a wolf even. Their interactions with Catboi just aren’t natural, I think Catboi tried to fabricate the tone manipulation they did with others, but then Ydrasse came out today with the Catboi-FL “check”

And it pointlessly outed themselves as a Parity Cop. It’s completely a scum cover move, that naturally makes people think she had to “check Catboi” so it naturally distances.

She never voted Catboi either, but kept it open.

I probably would have accepted the possibility of her being Malefactor had she not made that one post promising, i think it was Keeper, that she can’t promise anything else but is not Malefactor.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like there was no reason we had to know Ydrasse was a Parity Cop this day phase.

It gave zero information that we didn’t have. It was performative.

[Flavor Leaf]

Parity Cop targeting Hirsute and a Wolf would still have not same alignment, because they aren’t.

Hirsute and town would get same.

Miller and Mafia would get different alignment.

Miller and town would get same.

[Flavor Leaf]

Parity Cop unless something specifically is done weird would not act like a Cop/Seer for other investigation, just like a Vanilla Cop would still get Vanilla on a Wolf Goon.

Those roles aren’t the same as Cop/Seer, and Parity Cop is not the same either.

[Flavor Leaf]

Parity Cop essentially is checking for the Color of the role itself. Say Werewolf is Yellow, Maf Red, Town Green, Malefactor Purple.

If you check 2 of the same colors, they’re the same, if different. They’re different. Full stop.

Millers and miller like roles do not change Parity Cop results.

[Flavor Leaf]

And it pointlessly outed themselves as a Parity Cop. It’s completely a scum cover move, that naturally makes people think she had to “check Catboi” so it naturally distances.

I mean, I agree but I've seen town do the same thing and unnecessarily out their role. Could she just be scum that's mimicking bad town play? Sure

As I said before, I could see it as a mafia action that was trying to see if you were bussing catboi. Dunno why she said that she thinks she has a guilty at day start.

It’s a combination. Yes, I’ve seen town for something like that before, but with the other 3+ reasons, it no longer comes from most likely town to me.

I look for the chain of actions, and sometimes a chain can be filled with tons of green links, one red link, can rust the others into turning orange and red.

[Flavor Leaf]

I also specifically don’t believe she did it as scum trying to make a bad town play.

It was not a bad scum play.

Her targeting Catboi automatically subconsciously puts it into the natural gamestate that Ydrasse investigated Catboi which is another layer of distancing.

[Flavor Leaf]

And with the claim + distancing from wolf, it lets her naked vote constantly without repercussion because of the exact reasoning of “just town disinterested” which ties everything together.


This goes back to Norwegian as well, because I was beginning to read the slot prior to Ydrasse’s replace in.


CSF-Ydrasse are my stronger scum reads right now. I think CSF is Mafia and Ydrasse wolf.

[Flavor Leaf]

Mm, wow. I am wrong, and absolutely do not agree with that as the base.

Should be changed, because it’s just limiting variations.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’ve gone pages and pages back and forth since like 2015 talking about how I don’t think Vanilla Cop is a Cop just because it has Cop in its name.

Name could have literally been anything, it’s about function.

[Flavor Leaf]

Mm, wow. I am wrong, and absolutely do not agree with that as the base.

Should be changed, because it’s just limiting variations.

To be fair, I can’t imagine there’s been loads and loads of play with Parity Cop to the point it needed it, and would still be possible to change and variate but will confuse people.

It’s like how you can make Neighborhood a function rather than role title as a variant change, but it’s gonna confuse people based on black and white ness of the wiki, but just time and time playing naturally fixes it.

[Flavor Leaf]

tbh, the vanilla cop page hasn't been updated since 2019 so there's a chance that its not accurate. Also agree with Gamma's take that it might have singleball in mind.

I had felt like you were trying to just bullshit us here but there's a chance that you are just sitting there and going by what the wiki says and acting like it's a bible. Wich one could argue is scummy in and of itself.

Wolves always showing as a pr if checked by a vanilla cop just doesn't seem right and needs to be fixed after the game.

Yeah, agree with this.

That was one of my scummier things Dunn was doing, but it’s less so now, even if he is doing it as scum. I did also like his post on Ydrasse.

[Flavor Leaf]

yeah, Malcolm probs town.

[Flavor Leaf]

I was wrong on Ydrasse

Oh well. Im burnt out and getting ready to move at the end of the month.

I’m out of shots.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't remember you saying you were X-Shot?

I only did in the monastery.

[Flavor Leaf]

I can’t be a wolf. I’m just Flavor.

[Flavor Leaf]

and the monks can't be wolves?

Nope.

I also shot Catboi.

[Flavor Leaf]

Meg/Klick/Dunn/Cass

Has a wolf. Maybe Monkey.

[Flavor Leaf]

Could have multiple wolves, not just one

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor Leaf (8) | Klick, tictac, Dunnstral, cassowary,

mastina

,

MalcolmTucker

, Menalque, MonkeyMan576

mastina being the lone scum on this? yea right

all the wolf potential, maybe even another Mafia.

Eh, actually, with 4 mafia all alive during that, there's probably 2 of each scum on this wagon.

For what it's worth, I think Mastina probably thought I was fake claiming my role, even though she knew I was town. Or she got doubled up on, I guess by wolves and I.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't remember you saying you were X-Shot?

I only did in the monastery.

was there a point in claiming a different restrict before?

both restrictions are there.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Menalque

[Flavor Leaf]

Super serious about power fading through my wagon from Day 2.

[Flavor Leaf]

so i think FL is prob town -- we can confirm that he's at least not a WW

from Yaddrase^

I dont think FL would vig mastina for scum credit

What is the significance of Ydrasse making it so I’m not a wolf?

[Flavor Leaf]

so i think FL is prob town -- we can confirm that he's at least not a WW

from Yaddrase^

I dont think FL would vig mastina for scum credit

What is the significance of Ydrasse making it so I’m not a wolf?

Parity cop check

oh right, forgot bout that

[Flavor Leaf]

I'm not opposed to wagoning off of FL's wagon but why Mena instead of like Klick or Dunn?

i was just going with the wagon. I think Klick/Dunn i'd like more, but no harm in the mena wagon right now.

[Flavor Leaf]

i totally missed the fact Butter flipped Malefactor.

[Flavor Leaf]

let's move to the next day, this day's inactive, which is fine.

If a Doc could just sit on me, and we powerfade my wagon, we probably eventually just win

[Flavor Leaf]

let's just kill Menalque, Dunn or Klick and go to the next day

[Flavor Leaf]

actually, i dont even really scum read dunn or klick too much anymore.

Dont even really scum read Menalque, but think it's a solid fade with a chance of scum.

I'm at a reset now, kinda fell off, will start from scratch, but i dont think Klick is scum.

We're at a level right now where we have a lot of circular arguments regarding a lot of players of if they or arent they, and new night can help.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Unvote

312 pages anyone wanna tldr?

Flavor Leaf wanna give me your latest targets? I wanna see where your reads are scoped first while I catch up.
Klick I don’t know much about you. I feel like there’s a void in my knowledge.

I’m Conf town, i don’t have any more targets

Docs on me tonight.

[Flavor Leaf]

I hard pushed Catboi and Mastina Day 1.

Then I killed them.

[Flavor Leaf]

I am now out of shots, and moving this weekend, and will be floating around the bay for a couple of weeks before my new place, so the next 3 weeks of my game time will be light posting.

My contributions to this game were early game heavy.

[Flavor Leaf]

Your slot claimed a Gun guilty on me after Day 2.

I claimed Vig in monkery Night 1.

This has been a big topic, others can point you in the direction.

[Flavor Leaf]

Didn’t see your post

[Flavor Leaf]

The others can. I have 1300 posts. Don’t plan to hit 1500 this game.


You might be missing the scum only can kill 2 nights every 3.

IMO, there’s like 50 more reasons why I’m town, but I’m done convincing of my slot this game.

I’ll put my anecdotes out to other slots when i have em

[Flavor Leaf]

Nero shooting Butter makes it so he has to do work outside, and butter wasn’t really too big of a threat and was a possible misfade.

I think butter was probably killed to frame Nashville.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Klick - did you have any other actions?

[Flavor Leaf]

Ah, i think Monkey could have been a wolf sitting on Catboi then.

It makes sense why they backed off when we said to let Flavor shoot Mastina.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, i could kill Klick.

WallFlower theory will always be good in my heart of Catboi/Klick.

Catboi called it a dumb theory.

VOTE: Klick

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, i could kill Klick.

WallFlower theory will always be good in my heart of Catboi/Klick.

Catboi called it a dumb theory.

VOTE: Klick

These are the kind of things that ping me. Like you’re very logically inconsistent here.

You’re arguing that I (because I am monkey slot) am not scum with mastina namely a wolf.
However, you’re arguing my scumread of Klick is correct.

Like what? FL my head hurts.

Where is the masons claim btw? Were there crumbs?

thats because you have little to no context for the game and my position right now.

My thoughts on every single slot in this game are out there, just zero energy for this game right now, and in kind of a reset mode.

I dont even know what you're saying in this post.

Yes, there's a masonry and a monkery.

[Flavor Leaf]

If I'm scum, I would have to be Mafia.

And I said all day yesterday I'd be killing Mastina, and people were even holding me to it.

Wolves don't kill Mastina.

You're angle shooting because you try to push me as scum every single game at some point, and you dont like that im conf town here.

And we've just talked and talked so much about all the other stuff you've brought up, that i just dont have the energy to be the one to catch you up.

[Flavor Leaf]

If Klick is not a mason then Tic Tac and Meg are confirmed to all be lying about masonry yeah?

need to stop this.

zero chance it's a lie, even if somehow they were all scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

Masons are conf not Mafia.

This is multiball.

SPC, STD, and I are Monks, and confirmed not Wolves.

[Flavor Leaf]

So I'm going for Klick/MonkeyMan slot as the fade today. Don't like the 1-shot Gunsmith yesterday then now there's more. It's off in one of the places.

[Flavor Leaf]

math regardless of what night flips have happened just acknowledge that flavor leaf is not a prophet and cannot predict that wolves are going to shoot mastina for him on a night where he is supposed to do just that to prove himself.

No it would just have to be the mafia night kill done on a mafia, which would be pro win con.

I did something similar shooting Karnos in Shadowrun.

I want to figure out which alignment did which kill.

Math, just dont focus on me this game. focus on other slots over me here.

Enchant had just died the day before.

For what it's worth, everytime someone has pushed me as scum killing a partner, they have flipped scum.

I quoted this earlier.


Also, I have had near perfect reads this entire game, had Vig threat, and conf not wolf by way of Monkery.

It's stupid to get rid of Mastina, who isnt really easy to fade especially considering she had that Beloved Princess claim, and waste teammates like that.

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, I have had near perfect reads this entire game, had Vig threat, and conf not wolf by way of Monkery.

this makes me high night kill possibility, so it just doesnt have merit.

and like i said, ive gotten pushed this exact way multiple times, and it comes from scum generally.

[Flavor Leaf]

People act like killing a partner as scum is something that I would ever do or come up with.

You can't just force kill a scum partner.

[Flavor Leaf]

is flavor was town he would have taken me up on the idea to shoot outside to dodge a possible mafia doc rather than blast his own partner with the nightkill.

is it possible he did blast mastina? sure.

is is stupid to do so and make yourself a target to wolves? very much so.

so the chances FL is scum who has laid out a shitty plan to win is very low, near 0.

He just doesn’t feel right

I see the other posts to focus elsewhere but he feels wrong.

Like I can’t explain it.

I am going back to figuring out the kills.

And sure FL you quoted that. Here I am town saying you feel weird.

I had 1.2k posts Day 1.

[Flavor Leaf]

mastina has been killed. She was a...

Spoiler:
Mafia Loathed 2-shot Activated Wolfsbane 1-shot Roleblocker

Loathed: If this player is eliminated or killed by Town during the Day, the first elimination of the Day will not end the Day, and will be followed by an additional elimination.

Activated Wolfsbane: Chooses nights to become immune to wolf kills

.

This could have happened Night 1.

There's also possibly unclaimed protectives out there that we dont need claiming yet.

[Flavor Leaf]

Part of me thinks Mathblade/Monkey could be a wolf here who got roleblocked by Mastina, and it stopped a kill.

The angleshooting/scum kill scum I generally see coming from scum.

Monkey sitting on Catboi, but really was just being a cheerleader could be a bus vote they didnt expect to go through. But then Catboi flipped Wolf, and they turned, and happened to claim a role that was already out there.

But now they have more?

[Flavor Leaf]

Malefactor doesn't have a gun.

How do you know that?

Also, lol

[Flavor Leaf]

It’s also a literal fact scum killed scum unless you believe that a vig killed butter

eh, it's separate scum, and self aligned. for all they knew, butter was town, and that's what i think scum shooting butter was assuming.

Scum want Nashville slot dead, that's been apparent since early game.

[Flavor Leaf]

The butter shot IMO is from a scum faction who thought that butter was part of the opposite scum faction and nothing more.

eh, this is possible too.

[Flavor Leaf]

Im gonna check your alignment tonight

run away

So Ydrasse was going to check Enchants alignment

Ydrasse died because they were attached to malcolm's role, and Enchant died because they hammered Malcolm.

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor Leaf (8) | Klick, tictac, Dunnstral, cassowary,

mastina

,

MalcolmTucker

, Menalque, MonkeyMan576

power through this entire wagon, tbh.

guarantee you there are 2+ scum on it other than Mastina.

[Flavor Leaf]

Mafia Loathed 2-shot Activated Wolfsbane 1-shot Roleblocker

Loathed: If this player is eliminated or killed by Town during the Day, the first elimination of the Day will not end the Day, and will be followed by an additional elimination.

Activated Wolfsbane: Chooses nights to become immune to wolf kills.

oh, wait.

it specifically only is immune to wolf kills. I felt like there were people earlier trying to wonder why Mastina didnt protect themselves, gonna have to go back and check out who was saying that.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think that’s the first protown thing he’s said

wtf, I've called out two scum, then shot them both, correctly called out 2 town, defended Toogeloo to life and death.

First pro town thing I've said? I've had near perfect reads this game, and went into depth with my reads on essentially every slot.

VOTE: Mathblade


What non pro town thing have I said this game?

This is pure discrediting attempts to avoid me getting conf town.

[Flavor Leaf]

enchant not taking out FL to save Mastina means they feared that check more

Enchant died to a Supersaint variation because they hammered, and Enchant was here to hammer, and only laid hammer votes.

[Flavor Leaf]

Enchant/Ydrasse died because Malcolm was faded. They weren't taken out.

[Flavor Leaf]

neither of them knew Malcolm was that role.

[Flavor Leaf]

oh, Enchant chose Ydrasse.

I thought Ydrasse died because of being connected to Malcolm.

Hmm.

Eh, she claimed Parity Cop. Ydrasse didn't say anything about who they were checking, as far as I recall.

I was pushing her as a Catboi buddy.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think that’s the first protown thing he’s said

wtf, I've called out two scum, then shot them both, correctly called out 2 town, defended Toogeloo to life and death.

First pro town thing I've said? I've had near perfect reads this game, and went into depth with my reads on essentially every slot.

VOTE: Mathblade


What non pro town thing have I said this game?

This is pure discrediting attempts to avoid me getting conf town.

First protown thing you’ve said since my replace in.

If you’re not conf town you’re not shot at?

There is zero harm in me sorting your right now

This feels like an overreaction here

yeah cuz of your lack of context, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

You doing this doesnt just make me magically not conf town.

Scum are gonna see me as conf town no matter what, even if there are a few doubts elsewhere.

[Flavor Leaf]

oh, Enchant chose Ydrasse.

I thought Ydrasse died because of being connected to Malcolm.

Hmm.

Eh, she claimed Parity Cop. Ydrasse didn't say anything about who they were checking, as far as I recall.

I was pushing her as a Catboi buddy.

Ydrasse’s last words were they were checking Enchant

So mainly I am trying to get inside mafia’s head here

Again ASUMMING YOU ARE TOWN why does mafia pick Ydrasse to die over you?

You push this like you're assuming Enchant made any type of decision with a team rather than just say a name.

I do see what you're saying, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think Enchant just picked. Only 40 minutes in between. I highly doubt they were reading the game.

I thought Ydrasse was high wolf possibility, so they could have just been taking a wolf.

Also, I feel like Mastina could have thought she wasn't going to die, tbh.

But yeah, you're putting a lot of stock into assuming Enchant had a reason besides just saying a name of one that claimed Parity Cop.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think Enchant just picked. Only 40 minutes in between. I highly doubt they were reading the game.

I thought Ydrasse was high wolf possibility, so they could have just been taking a wolf.

Also, I feel like Mastina could have thought she wasn't going to die, tbh.

But yeah, you're putting a lot of stock into assuming Enchant had a reason besides just saying a name of one that claimed Parity Cop.

Why would Mastina think she wouldn’t die?

Iirc she could only block herself from wolf kills, you said you’re outed not wolf by then yeah?

Mastina doesn't believe anything I ever claim. But yeah, idk. All I know is, I planned on sitting pretty, taking a backseat until my inevitable night kill.

gonna try to get back to that. Moving out this week, moving into a new place a couple after that.

[Flavor Leaf]

Mastina mightve known she would have died, I guess.

Doesn't mean Enchant knew what was going on, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

The way Malcolm happened over Dunnstral is scummy.

[Flavor Leaf]

i don't think it's likely that scum mastina claims beloved princess if she actually is a beloved princess

i also don't take any weight in true-claiming mastina because what if one day she decides to fuck with that maybe today is the day maybe there never will be a day but maybe it's today

i don't think mastina's scum i'm just grumpy this morning and trying to make a point

Most likely scenario is that beloved princess is mastina's actual role this game

Pushing mastina on day 1 is pretty anti-town. It's a 23 person game, we can't do anything better than risk hitting a claimed BP on day 1? Maybe somebody here is a vig and blasts them night 1 because they don't trust them.

is this scum/scum with mastina? i say likely no

I say yes.

Scum Well Done would know Mastina has partial BP

And odds of an N1 vig on Mastina are limited

If scum slow down cross kills they can ursurp control

So I would argue given Mastina’s role likely

Disagree. My plan was to Vig Mastina Night 1. fade Catboi Day 1.

She claimed Beloved Princess

[Flavor Leaf]

Then let’s focus on making it fun again.

Barren hoods typically (not always) mean a scum is in that hood.

Who do you think could be/is scum in there?

this game was confirmed to have a random element, and could have had all 3 be scum in there.

[Flavor Leaf]

Alignment assignment and role design had a random element; as a result, the setup may break certain common assumptions, such as the idea that a neighborhood cannot be composed entirely of members of the same scumteam. The first game featured a Mafia Miller.

[Flavor Leaf]

dunn should have been faded yesterday, and those are all players on the wagon I'm hunting down so, fine with it.

[Flavor Leaf]

Occam’s Razor:

Maf also shot Catboi.
Mathblade kill got blocked.

[Flavor Leaf]

Watch there be zero kills tomorrow

[Flavor Leaf]

I mean tbf Mastina was destined to die via FL anyways. Ydrasse at least claimed a pr

Maybe I just view everything differently

FL said he was already leashed to Mastina at that point.

i leashed myself. people were trying to leash me, but since it was the target I wanted.

I have an insanely good record at shooting scum as vigilantes.

[Flavor Leaf]

Occam’s Razor:

Maf also shot Catboi.
Mathblade kill got blocked.

there's also the chance Mastina used Roleblock Night 1, then used her defense Night 2, and the other team blocked Monkey fearing a possible reverse Gunsmith ability to catch wolves.

Or Klick is ascetic.

the fact these are missing from Math's possibilities makes me feel off, and think option 1 occam's is more likely.

Also, way too much assuming Enchant knew what was going on in the thread.

Everytime I shoot scum as vigilante basically, someone tries to push I'm scum who shot my own partner, and it comes from scum, not town.

[Flavor Leaf]

Because I don't believe FL is going to actually shoot me, that simple.

He's Flavor Leaf.

Anything he says he will do, he won't.

also, this could have been Mastina's legitimate thoughts.

I was scum once, and fake claiming, and they actively were calling me town fake claiming.

[Flavor Leaf]

2 hirsute’s is more believable than 2 town gunsmiths.

[Flavor Leaf]

Rip the monkery.

Looks like a Nero frame kill. Scum killed SPC to get Nero pushed.


CSF is not a wolf, but Menalque already said that yesterday.

@MOD - VLA until June 5th.

I am moving my stuff out of my current place today, going to Vegas for a few days, then starting a new job right after, then moving my stuff to my new place after that. I’ll still be playing, and probably won’t ever be prodded, but wanted to get this out here.

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, I don’t need a babysitter—but protections on me make sense.

[Flavor Leaf]

Dunnstral

(8) |

MathBlade

, Save The Dragons,

Menalque

, MegAzumarill, Nero Cain, bnuuy, Nashville Dreams,

cassowary

Flavor Leaf (8) | Klick, tictac,

Dunnstral

,

cassowary

,

mastina

,

MalcolmTucker

,

Menalque

,

MonkeyMan576

Scum is in purple.


SPC was also likely never gonna get faded, and they were one of my biggest defenders, and I imagine both teams wanted to keep the opportunity to fade me alive.

I was defending TicTac earlier, but I’ve started town reading Mega and Klick, and mixed in with how I knew I’d get off vibes from TicTac if they were scum, I started talking about how they could be scum with Monkey in my Monkery last night.

I don’t necessarily think Math is scum right now, it’s possible, but I’ve flipped, and it makes zero sense for scum to say they think i was shot at here.

Could still be scum, but not my priority right now.

[Flavor Leaf]

So TicTac, Cassowary, and Menalque is probably my pool.

I do have a gut town read on Menalque, though, and I’ve had it since Day 1, but they’re in my purple.

Idk.

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like I’m conf town, tbh. But I somewhat understand the BOP.

TicTac going me with reasons of ‘im the Limpool’ is pretty obv scum, though.

You can ask STD to confirm that I had called TicTac scum overnight

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Tictac

Also, Bnuuy, don’t bring attention to stuff like that.

[Flavor Leaf]

pretty sure im conf town. fade in the people who were trying to twist it like im not at this point.

[Flavor Leaf]

like, 100% of the time I get called scum shooting partner scum, it's been from scum.

For that to have happened, you'd have to believe that 1) scum would have chosen to do this immediately after Enchant died. 2) Mastina and rest of scum team would have to be okay with it. 3) You'd have to believe that happened with the added likelihood of getting killed by other scum.

that doesn't happen.

Scum pushes scum killed partner scum in this scenario. Full stop.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think it’s 100, but people want to keep the “they shot scum partner as scum” line open.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, still voting Cassowary.

We're a vanilla cop.
Confirmed SoD N1. They're vanilla.
Checked mastina n2 based on how mastina fake claimed.
Checked Cassowary n3. Not vanilla.

Also cassoway claim is bullshit btw. It's designed to be a claim to give nothing but a vague promise to be useful in the future. They've done less than SoD as well. Plus, Cassowary's claim is proven to be an utterfiction if Math's claim is I think.

I expect most of the remaining town slots to be vt based on power. SoD hardclaiming vanilla early doesn't seem to help scum though. If you still want SoD Nero, we'll talk about it. My stuff doesn't clear him but that's my stance.

I think it's FL Math or FL Cassoway for Mafia
One mason, Math/Cassowary, Plus one remainder as wolves

~Titus

You checked Mastina when you were town reading me, and I was vigging there?

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m super anti bus, and go out on limbs to defend buddies, but people think I would kill my own scum partner

You also have to believe that Mastina specifically would be okay with me killing them if you think I’m scum

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m super anti bus, and go out on limbs to defend buddies, but people think I would kill my own scum partner

You also have to believe that Mastina specifically would be okay with me killing them if you think I’m scum

mastina would do that.

Allow me specifically?

[Flavor Leaf]

Let’s kill TicTac

[Flavor Leaf]

Idk, Cass gave me townie vibes with their last few posts

[Flavor Leaf]

Just kill who you think is scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like that’s just an actual dumb reason, and you playing a mechanical game rather than a social game

[Flavor Leaf]

Like, i die, what info do you even get?

You learn that I killed Catboi and Mastina.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like if I was anyone else, I’m Conf town here.

I’m super anti bus, and that’s been on record for years, and defend my partners generally, but this nonsense push of me killing my own scum partner happens essentially every single time I am vigilante.

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, I’m kinda tired of getting BOP’d by Mathblade every single game.

Like play outside of me.

Like the last 3-4 games you’ve played with me, are relating back to me.

Just move past me.

[Flavor Leaf]

Just kill who you think is scum.

I think your elim is best for town

If you are town then that breaks open the night kills.

If you are scum then that breaks open the night kills (and in this world wolves always shoot mastina here and mafia shoots butters)

The elim of the person who has caught the most scum, and will likely to continue catching more is “best for town”?

Yeah, get out of here.

This is on a mech level, which is just inferior.

So you’re wrong

Social deduction > Mech.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like you’re only deducing this game with mech, and frankly, it’s boring and your conclusion is anti-town.

[Flavor Leaf]

I was also off of Toogeloo, Malcolm, and Dunnstral.

Dunnstral I was okay with until the end.

We should be fading on my wagon from Day 2.

Literally, my flip does nothing. It’s effectively a policy/info flip, which is just not relevant here.

I have 3 full days of actual play you can look into, get out of here with the mech

[Flavor Leaf]

Just kill who you think is scum.

I think your elim is best for town

If you are town then that breaks open the night kills.

If you are scum then that breaks open the night kills (and in this world wolves always shoot mastina here and mafia shoots butters)

The elim of the person who has caught the most scum, and will likely to continue catching more is “best for town”?

Yeah, get out of here.

This is on a mech level, which is just inferior.

So you’re wrong

Social deduction > Mech.

Mech = always true
Social deduction can be flawed

Disagree

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, I’m kinda tired of getting BOP’d by Mathblade every single game.

Like play outside of me.

Like the last 3-4 games you’ve played with me, are relating back to me.

Just move past me.

I am not BoPing you though.

I am saying we need to sort the kills.

If we know if you’re a vig or not that solves things definitively.

The only thing it shows is that I’m a vig.

It does nothing but solves my slot which should already be solved, tbh.

[Flavor Leaf]

If you truly think that’s the best way, you need to open up the way you think about the game.

Because you’re locked onto mech.

Stop playing around me.

There’s 5 scum. Play the game.

My flip does nothing but confirm something that will likely get confirmed later in the game. Use foresight

[Flavor Leaf]

Mech is supplemental.

[Flavor Leaf]

FL shouldnt be limmed
Period. end of

Why not?

I think he’s a vig but I think what we gain
Locking imho scum!Titus into a world where she can’t spew bullshit anymore is ideal.
If I am wrong she’s right and then probably town and I was right yesterday and got caught up in fancy play.

FL has no more shots left if town so it’s certainly no risk.

My TicTac/MonkeyMan theory is back.

I talked about it over night.


@Mega/Klick - when did Klick claim their gunsmith on me? Was it before Monkey claimed Gunsmith? My theory was that TicTac told Monkey, about it, and decided to claim it on me.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, no, Mathblade is actively trying to twist this and came into this game trying to make sure I don’t become Conf town because it forces scum to have to kill me.

The fact they did this switch after I brought up pushing TicTac again is scummy timing

[Flavor Leaf]

they claimed GS either day or night one, i forget
They claimed targetting you begore MM claimed their result

Yep. I think MonkeyMan/TicTac took that information to try to push a guilty on me.

It also makes sense how the gamestate was going “there can easily be two gunsmiths!”

But when we talked about there being 2 Hirsutes gamestate didn’t think it was likely.

That means scum wants that to be the general mindset.

TicTac/Monkey are wolfs.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, no, Mathblade is actively trying to twist this and came into this game trying to make sure I don’t become Conf town because it forces scum to have to kill me.

The fact they did this switch after I brought up pushing TicTac again is scummy timing

That makes zero sense.

I was arguing TicTac scum and you conf town earlier.

However through discussions I realized one world where that wasn’t possible.

I analyzed the situation and realized that if I am wrong a very narrow situation has to be true.

You’re welcome to elim me if you want but I still think you’re the best elim.

If you think I’m the best elim, you need to level up your non mech related mafia skills.

Because the only way you think my elim is best is so you can get mech confirmations on things you don’t even need to catch scum here.

Especially considering I’ve already caught out 2 scum, and correctly town read 2 of the flipped townies prior to them flipping in Toogeloo and Malcolm.

So you saying that is the best elim is just flat out twisted and wrong

[Flavor Leaf]

Klick is the gs not tictac

Yes, but TicTac saw the info, and passed it along is what I’m saying.

It also makes sense why TicTac pushed the way they did, and how they’ve been hopping onto my wagon.

It’s like they were being coached on what to do rather than think it themselves.

[Flavor Leaf]

they claimed GS either day or night one, i forget
They claimed targetting you begore MM claimed their result

Yep. I think MonkeyMan/TicTac took that information to try to push a guilty on me.

It also makes sense how the gamestate was going “there can easily be two gunsmiths!”

But when we talked about there being 2 Hirsutes gamestate didn’t think it was likely.

That means scum wants that to be the general mindset.

TicTac/Monkey are wolfs.

I don’t think there can be two gunsmiths and you’ll see why with my flip

Scum always shoot me here but I think the info gained here if I die is of no loss.

It will confirm Cass town and Klick scum so I won’t defend myself

I think FL is the better elim as it says which group did which kill.

Look at the way this is posted.

They say they don’t think there can be two gunsmiths, but they want to fade me to confirm the kills which would just end up back to the gunsmith.

They are actively adding a middle man here to try and get me out of this game because I am essentially mech town cleared, and they’re trying as hard as they can to use Mech specifically to wiggle me out from being Conf town.

If they’re trying to prove their Can’t be two gunsmiths, then going Klick is the best way to prove it.

This also coincides with my theory of TicTac/Monkey taking Klicks claim.

In addition, Monkey flat out claimed 1-shot Gunsmith, and Math came in here trying to add more to wiggle this situation out.

Their entire game has been predicated on trying to get me to not be Conf town.

Now they’re trying to find a way to wiggle how I’m somehow the best elim despite being essentially Conf town.


I am the biggest threat from being mod confirmed not wolf, and having killed Catboi and Mastina.

Mathblade has ignored other possibilities that could have happened during the nights to specifically create a situation where they can push me.

They setup this situation so they can push me while calling me town for mech reasons, when that’s just weak play if they were town.

[Flavor Leaf]

You’re not mech towncleared though

That’s my point

I thought you were but you aren’t.

No, i am 100%.

The only possible way I am not is if I killed my own scum partner, which I barely even want to dignify that as a response.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like if I thought you were conf town I wouldn’t be arguing this at all

But the best case for you being cleared is scum have to kill you which is true of anyone we don’t elim by definition

Yeah, this is scum.

STD can confirm I was pushing a Monkey/TicTac team overnight.

[Flavor Leaf]

You’re not mech towncleared though

That’s my point

I thought you were but you aren’t.

No, i am 100%.

The only possible way I am not is if I killed my own scum partner, which I barely even want to dignify that as a response.

Incorrect

Mafia shoot butters
Wolves shot mastina

Yep, this is wrong. Wolves would never shoot Mastina during the night.



Thanks for slipping up on your mech reasonings.

[Flavor Leaf]

Mathblade just outed themselves as intentionally trying to setup the mech pathway with that one.

Wolves would not know my alignment, and had no reason to doubt me being a vig. They knew I was since I shot Catboi.

I had been hard claiming I’d shoot Mastina.

Wolves don’t shoot there.

Hook line and sinkered.

[Flavor Leaf]

You put too much stock into votes.

I’m voting TicTac, someone who i have clearly pushed as your partner.

I don’t move votes that much, and you using that as a defense just helps out you even more because it implies you think that I wouldn’t vote you here, which is clearly not the case.

I don’t threaten people with votes, my words say what I need to do.


Go ahead, keep trying to twist things around.

I don’t need a gothcha moment, so don’t minimize this like it’s an instance of a single gotcha moment. This is a layered case that predicates back to even your predecessor.

[Flavor Leaf]

I mean what’s the alternative: let me live and I get another check or heal off? Scum don’t want that.

Yeah, scum don’t want me to catch more scum either.

I’m on fire this game, tbh

[Flavor Leaf]

This is the most pointless t/t ive ever seen.
VOTE: Cassowary

Math isn’t town.

[Flavor Leaf]

They also were pushing me as town wanting to flip me to confirm the kills where if they already thought I was town, they wouldn’t need to.

They’re twisting the mech talk to go specifically in their favor to try and give the best push they can to make it seem like my wagon is the best mech reason, when in actuality, I’m one of the worst mech fades since I’ve essentially confirmed my roles.

Catboi and Mastina were my 2 strongest scum reads I was pushing, and they both flipped separate scum.

Ydrasse parity copped Catboi and I showing that people naturally want to think I’m bussing for some reason trying to pull the wool over one’s eyes, but that’s not the way I do that.

I defended Toogeloo. I defended Malcolm.

I have been essentially correct on slots where the majority wasn’t, and now scum need to get rid of me.

[Flavor Leaf]

Role assignment is random and it makes sense for either scum alignment

Yes I agree

Cass is still town move on

I agree with Cass is town, but yeah, Cephir flat out stated that if you think a role can’t be scum, you’re probably wrong.

So seriously enough with the mech. It’s so boring

[Flavor Leaf]

So yes FL/Titus/Klick/TicTac whoever is scum in that group can succeed in miselimming me sure

But then they lose the war on my flip.

So no I won’t out my gate I won’t do as you ask

Cass is conf town based on claim. Y’all can pick elsewhere

If you say scum lose the war on your flip, makes me want to fade you more.

We’ll catch scum with your flip, right?

Then that makes YOU the best mech fade.

[Flavor Leaf]

This is the most pointless t/t ive ever seen.
VOTE: Cassowary

Math isn’t town.

Then look at how hard he's defending an obviously bad claim.

~Titus

It’s not a bad claim, and he needs allies. Cass is a possible fade, and is in need of allies as well if they are town. Math defending Cass the way they are feels like them trying to get Cass to side with them since they aren’t on sides.

I think Cass is town for how they’re posting today, and absolutely not by mech.

[Flavor Leaf]

I have zero desire to fight with you or defend myself.

I am playing strategically if you succeed in elimming me then I flip town, Klick becomes conf scum and Cass conf town. Where you could be scum and the kills laid out how I said becomes clear. FL dies and we learn exactly how top three kills played out.

So if you want to win the battle go right ahead.

But then scum lose the war.

I have work to do.

So i win the battle and scum would lose the war?

That sounds like the best course of action tbh