Open 857 | Frienemies | Postgame

[Andante]

FIRST!!

[Andante]

VOTE: fireisred
That is a lie. you can't be 3rd so far. only maf lie. easy got one.

[Andante]

will def be around but don't expect too much

excpet super tryhard mode? got it!

[Andante]

No fun zone.

Who wants to talk about this setup a bit?

I think there's 7 VTs, 3 masons and 3 mafia... idk, but just a guess

[Andante]

That there at 7 VTs, 3 masons and 3 mafia...maybe.

sheeping andante first on her vote and then on this post? pocket attempt spotted

also entered with a cute penguin gif... "agreeing" with me by saying what I say? sounds like lock town to me!!!

[Andante]

VOTE: Vulture the game just started, we're not outing the masons right now

[Andante]

That there at 7 VTs, 3 masons and 3 mafia...maybe.

sheeping andante first on her vote and then on this post? pocket attempt spotted

also entered with a cute penguin gif... "agreeing" with me by saying what I say? sounds like lock town to me!!!

See...it's already working.

oh no... that was the plan all along? Penguin lock scum!!! there we go!! I'll just tunnel you, see what you flip, then if you flip town, I'll trust you in the land of the dead. easy! flawless plan

[Andante]

andante town
penguin town
fire town
i am very good at this game

hmmm I too can call everyone town... but someone must be mafia

[Andante]

vulture kinda locktown for being willing to take the hurt that will come from proposing that tbh

hard disagree with that statement

[Andante]

andante town
penguin town
fire town
i am very good at this game

hmmm I too can call everyone town... but someone must be mafia

i believe that i have called three (3) people town

which, if you check the number of players, is not everyone :>

ahhh so scum are just gonna be the last 3 to post?

[Andante]

vulture kinda locktown for being willing to take the hurt that will come from proposing that tbh

hard disagree with that statement

exactly my point

I mean, I'm not saying it automatically makes them scum, but like, I'm not TRing someone going "A MASON SHOULD OUT" like, just wait..play the game like normal, and yeah, cause if we SR a maf, lim the maf, then there's no need to out a mason here, that's just a free kill for maf, make maf actually have to work a bit...

[Andante]

why are there two pages

*three

[Andante]

A MAFIA SHOULD OUT

I second this!!!

[Andante]

I dislike Andante's vote.

would you like my vote instead?
VOTE: implosion

all you had to do was ask for it!!

[Andante]

It's very reactionary.

what's wrong with that?

[Andante]

fire reading my mind....

[Andante]

Andante, vote datisi

it's not really a case you're actually selling.. plus implosion wanted my vote, so like you'll have to talk to him on if he'll let me give it away

[Andante]

It's very reactionary.

do you think that makes her more likely to be scum?

Very nominally so. I have like half a game of experience with Andante scum and no experience with Andante town so I'm going to be calibrating based on that half a game and it kind of jives with that i think.

wait, what half scum game was that? lol

[Andante]

My vote is serious now. Datisi straight avoiding me

VOTE: implosion

if datisi is mafia I guess this is a chainsaw

how does this vote make ANY sense?

[Andante]

It's very reactionary.

do you think that makes her more likely to be scum?

Very nominally so. I have like half a game of experience with Andante scum and no experience with Andante town so I'm going to be calibrating based on that half a game and it kind of jives with that i think.

wait, what half scum game was that? lol

It was the newbie game you repped in to with me and catboi in it

ah yeah.. repping into scum... I think I recal that, I like repped in and got voted out? yeah uhh I wouldn't say that's exactly my scum game lol but uhh hahaha I'm sure you'll tr me soon enough here if that's what you're going off of

[Andante]

what if the 3 green names are the 3 red mafia...

[Andante]

UNVOTE:
also, implosion is picking up votes too quickly, I'm scared of like limming whoever so fast

- yeah fire seems maffy

[Andante]

Real talk, of all the people to talk so far, I think Ari is the one I SR the most...

[Andante]

Real talk, of all the people to talk so far, I think Ari is the one I SR the most...

nvm it's just fire I SR the most.. there's like a 0% chance fire is town here, I'll let others show up and talk, but yeah

[Andante]

I'm scared of a quickhammer...

[Andante]

like, I don't want to yeet someone instantly lol

[Andante]

VOTE: fire

I'll take the risk then... if this goes south... I'll be sad

[Andante]

so yeah I think fire maf, but a part of me also thinks implo maf, cause tbh implo is like "that newbie game you repped into and were scum is the game I'm judging you on..." like, what?? I had a whole 30 posts there... that's not even close to me as scum, so I think that's a very odd thing to make an assumption off of, like could just say "I've never really played a game with andante" why specifically cite that game?? The game was October 2021 too...

[Andante]

it takes 7 votes to elim

you're the 3rd vote

why are you scared of someone quickhammering at this point? you did the same with implosion on 3 votes

3 votes is a scary thing!!! that's a lot!!!

[Andante]

especially when I'm not actually trying to lim anyone this very second
UNVOTE:

[Andante]

it takes 7 votes to elim

you're the 3rd vote

why are you scared of someone quickhammering at this point? you did the same with implosion on 3 votes

3 votes is a scary thing!!! that's a lot!!!

do you think im 0% chance town or not?

I'm scared. I need more info.

[Andante]

I'm not voting him, so thus the question doesn't apply to me, I'll pass the question to VP!

[Andante]

im not used to town you being scared of there being 3 votes on someone else. feels weird

hello, nice to meet you! I'm andante!

[Andante]

can you explain why fire is scum to you? i've noticed you throw out these "x is 100% y" reads around a lot, and you explain them approximately never, and that makes it impossible for me to read you >_>

mostly it's just his lines read awkward to me, and this really isn't the fire I recall, like fire almost always has giant paragraphs that I'll look at and go "uhhh wow" and move on like, when I think of fire, that's what I think. not stuff like:
> VOTE: GeorgeBailey
> hey i know this guy, he's the legendary supervillain from the Datisi Mafia Game Cinematic Universe lore


and
> vulture kinda locktown for being willing to take the hurt that will come from proposing that tbh
like, it's exactly what penguin said, Vulture's idea was definitely something they had when they saw the setup, it's not a thought had after the rand. NAI at best.. like, def not locktown worthy


so like yeah I want more of the game to happen before I actually commit to something here readwise, yeah the 100% is like, "gut says they're maf, I'm pretty sure it's them"
and mehh normally no one even wants my explanations or when I do give them I get to hear how bad they are, but here it's also like, not a huge point, like I need more time and I should have a solid fire read... maybe... this is still very much RVS so there's not a whole lot to explain. the implosion thing was a legit read, I gave my explanation, and everyone ignored, thus I usually just do my own thing... idk, I can try and explain more, but I'd rather not explain and be ignored than explain and be ignored, cause like, just feels like im wasting time

[Andante]

why the heck did I just gain 2 votes?

[Andante]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: andante

Probably should go here first though. Give the scum a fighting chance by limming their weakest player.

I'm the weakest player?

[Andante]

hhahahaha ahhhh implosion is making me not sr him anymore... but like, ok implosion. my new friend. why was like the first thing you said about me referring to "half" a scumgame I repped into like a year ago... like, why would that even be relevant here?

[Andante]

idk if andante is town or scum but i'm enjoying her play. it's so in-the-moment. i strive to live every day like that

this makes me so happy!!!!

[Andante]

it was half actual observation and half intended as tongue-in-cheek comment about forming an entire read off of a fraction of a game of meta.

I have no idea what that means lol, but we're gonna go with "I no longer am CERTAIN this is andante's scum game"
and to that,
wooooooo!!! we did it!!!!


pshhh you're not a coward!! I'm not even voting either of the 2 voting me right now, even though I think those are some bad votes... not voting != coward... and that's a fact!!

[Andante]

andante feels distinctly like andante, but also i'm thinking town!andante. i'll ne honest i kinda was not expecting an Actual Explanation of her fire read when i asked, and 147 is okay. like it's nothing mindblowing, it's page 6 or whatever after all, but seeing parts of the actual thought process behind the read make me think tbis is more likely to be town!andante. also i'm not sure why scum!andante would be giving attention towards the fact that there may be an early hammer so like can be town for now (also like, i note the irony of me not responding to this post immediately and you saying in it how you're often ignored; sorry it's late i need more time for reading mroe than 2 sentences!!)

ANDANTE ALIGNED WITH ANDANTE!!! LET'S GOOOOOOO

lol yeah... I gave an "explanation" shocking I know... you got lucky I was bored, and was like "sure why not" and I was more referring to how everyone ignored me going "I seriously think implosion is maf" and like, no comment on how implosion was referencing half of a day in a game, back in October 2021... like, I remember nothing about that game, and he's like "yeah!! scum there!!" uhh my slot was basically doomed when I repped in, like how is that close to relevant here?

I mean, you're saying implo feels different. I have 0 knowledge of implosion in a game. and so I'm just saying it as it seems like.. like, implosion is my best bet for a sr at this moment, now that the game has gotten kinda serious, he got super quiet, like, yeah.. probably just points to maf?
~~
datisi is feeling really towny. and I almost wonder if he's being too towny right now, like ok, I'm being like andante, and I like never reply to anyone.. but you have no comments on my actual explanation? so like, why did you want that explanation in the first place? hmmmm #AndanteIsOnToSomething

[Andante]

it was half actual observation and half intended as tongue-in-cheek comment about forming an entire read off of a fraction of a game of meta.

I have no idea what that means lol, but we're gonna go with "I no longer am CERTAIN this is andante's scum game"
and to that,
wooooooo!!! we did it!!!!


pshhh you're not a coward!! I'm not even voting either of the 2 voting me right now, even though I think those are some bad votes... not voting != coward... and that's a fact!!

This is fake andante. She would have shit all over implosion trying to suck up to her.

I'm glad you know andante better than me! I have never seen andante do that before lol

[Andante]

then i wanted to see how annoyed is he gonna get if i keep ignoring him.

Don't believe this in the slightest.

Also don't buy datisi handing out shit townreads for weak reasons in RVS.

Andante-Datisi-?????

the funny part of this is I think you might genuinely be right on datisi here

[Andante]

UNVOTE:

hmm ok now andante feels more normal

what is "normal" for andante? I would LOVE to hear this one lol like, cause I was just having fun in RVS (the phase I HATE) that made me maf? "how dare there be no reads thus far!!!"

[Andante]

"how dare there be no reads thus far!!!"

who said this?

I mean, that's why I'm assuming you and fire voted me. must be scum if my focus is fun

[Andante]

I'm not voting him, so thus the question doesn't apply to me, I'll pass the question to VP!

I laughed a lot

Ayyyy that was the goal!!!

[Andante]

idk if andante is town or scum but i'm enjoying her play. it's so in-the-moment. i strive to live every day like that

this makes me so happy!!!!

Andante you are a treasure

AWWW THIS GAME!!! YALLL!!! <3

[Andante]

idk if andante is town or scum but i'm enjoying her play. it's so in-the-moment. i strive to live every day like that

maybe implo is mafia

what's your reason for thinking implosion maf?

[Andante]

Spoiler: Irrelevant

I want to post but the vibe isn't giving the energy that I'd need to reply consistently. >_>

Just post!! What energy would you like? Angry? GRRRR VP IS MAF!!! AHHHH GET HIM!!!

[Andante]

If I need to shut up I can? See yall on page 10!!! Game should be easier for yall to talk without me!

[Andante]

ok I lied, I can't shut up till page 10, so uhh I've gotten used to everyone trying to pocket me or whatever, like, you can't pocket me I'm unpocketable, but what I'm finding so freaking odd right now, why does everyone suddenly SR implosion? like no one was talking about him till I was like "yeah people ignored me thinking he was maf, I still think he's maf" now all yall are like "yeah implosion scummy!!" like what? this is weird...

[Andante]

I think my entrance being a little different is a function of a few things, mostly the player list being one i'm relatively familiar with and tbh me having played more games lately. I think I'm usually a bit more stiff, maybe.

what? why are you saying this like your entrance was terrible or whatever? "different cause I'm familiar" well your first like handful of posts were about me, and we're not that familiar? especially if you're bringing up me replacing into scum for half a day... 9 months ago.. like, so I'm just confused here, cause first off I personally didn't think your entrance was all terrible as you seem to think it was, so not sure why you think it's so bad/different than usual? and it's different cause we're familiar? umm
you saying
> I dislike Andante's vote.
> It's very reactionary.

really makes me think you're not familiar at all with me, so idk my friend.. something isn't adding up here, and then like everyone SRing you? what is happening? these your maf partners bussing or something??

[Andante]

people who try to make andante happy are usually mafia

Andante specifically, or just people in general?

I think she's particularly susceptible to it.

Does it work on you too?

LOL yes yes!! works very well for SS!!! he's easy to pocket!!!

[Andante]

what? why are you saying this like your entrance was terrible or whatever?

it's in response to Datisi's comment that my play felt different

ok well the rest of that statement like still applies though, your play is different cause the player list is familiar.. but your entrance was basically talking to/about me... nonfamiliar person...

[Andante]

And Andante, I think like the fact that we've been in the same game in the past like year puts you in the more-familiar-than-average territory for me, I haven't played very much over the past few years

ahhhh ok, then actually ignore me, cause I can understand that... now I feel bad. ahhhhhhh sorry implosion!!!

[Andante]

LOL yes yes!! works very well for SS!!! he's easy to pocket!!!

Is he?

I've never actually seen him have thoughts or wield thread influence so it's hard for me to think anyone would bother to pocket him

I mean, if you ask him actual questions, he'll like always answer, so you don't see enough thoughts from him? just ask him something. real easy solution tbh

[Andante]

And Andante i'll continue that line of questioning if you want

no no!! it's fine, like, literally looking at your recent games, that game was a lot more "recent" for you than me, and like, I completely understand now ._.

[Andante]

this is p weak, thats an easy thing for ari to pick on as maf

I don't think Ari would necessarily say it in thread if scum. Ari could swoon Andante easily. No real reason to call attention to it, and she certainly isn't going to do it to get town points from me.

Question. How does one get "town points" from VP Baltar? I think I might need some of those

[Andante]

this is p weak, thats an easy thing for ari to pick on as maf

I don't think Ari would necessarily say it in thread if scum. Ari could swoon Andante easily. No real reason to call attention to it, and she certainly isn't going to do it to get town points from me.

Question. How does one get "town points" from VP Baltar? I think I might need some of those

Getting a green PM.

Saying town things.

I'm easy to please.

Hmmmm can I check my balance of VP Baltar town points please?

[Andante]

I don't think you've said

much

towny stuff unfortunately. You are being kind of awkward this game.

THAT MEANS THERE'S SOME TOWNY STUFF!!! LEGGGOOOO

[Andante]

lol this is a weird argument/conversation, like, what's the end goal here? we sort my alignment? I could've just told you, I'm town. ok easy. moving on!!!
Lets find some mafia!

[Andante]

I have exactly 0 idea where mafia is. I had a lead, but that was a bad lead, soooo back to square 1

[Andante]

lol this is a weird argument/conversation, like, what's the end goal here? we sort my alignment? I could've just told you, I'm town. ok easy. moving on!!!
Lets find some mafia!

It's to sort implosion. I feel like that was fairly clear?

oh lol what? this is to sort implosion? hahaha uhh ok, yeah he's just null for me now, not a sr, and I don't think he's aware I'm super easy to pocket(**supposedly super easy to pocket) he's not one of the 6-7 that I know are aware

[Andante]

Is this SS maf? like, I'm really confused by what he was trying to do here, like, was he trying to have Ari hand him all the reasons implosion is maf? idk, I'm more confused by that whole ordeal than anything else

[Andante]

penguin wants a wagon?
VOTE: Penguin

[Andante]

I don't wanna wagon implo. You suss there?

I will always wagon implo

In that case I shall defend implo!!

Uhh friends, can I have some more votes on penguin please?

[Andante]

fine fine...
VOTE: SS

[Andante]

actually, just ignore me UNVOTE:
AVS AINT OUT YET!!!! I'm uhh gonna be back later. Very important times right now

[Andante]

keep us posted on the Stanley Cup Andante!

We're all counting on you!

and..... we're going to find out what happens in game 6 ._.

[Andante]

Gamma can I help you?

[Andante]

Also, andante seems like towm rn

hmmm. interesting idea.

[Andante]

I TR you Vulture!!

[Andante]

she locktown'd you for your fearless setup spec

no. I did not. that is a no. that was not great. it was something else! I'm gonna hold of on explaining it though

[Andante]

VOTE: hutmeil
they seem a little off, like their “focus” upon entering doesn’t seem to be to actually sort anyone, and just asked a few questions where like you could give any answer and they probably wouldn’t even follow up? idk, they just don’t feel like town to me, and they’re probably my strong “lead” for where to go to find maf, could just be I SR their stuff cause there’s not a lot, but I genuinely don’t like what we have so far from hut

[Andante]

if I said anything you did was town leaning, everyone would ignore it

I WOULDN'T IGNORE IT!!!!

Because if I said anything you did was scum leaning, that could draw attention onto you

Why is that a bad thing?

[Andante]

mmm nah I don't think so, at least not for now

[Andante]

I mean, do you have any specific questions for me? I'm thinking hut isn't town, and that's basically my strongest read right now

[Andante]

Why is that a bad thing?

Well, negative attention, specifically.

so like, we'd just ignore something you TR, and you think we'd start tunneling datisi if you point out something scummy? but then you could see who's pushing datisi for no reason? just like how I was like "implo maf" and a bunch of people were like "yeah implo maf!!!" and now all those voices are gone?? idk where they went

[Andante]

not really, i was just wondering if you had any thoughts on my response to the thing you thought made me scum.

i agree hut is being explicitly not townie right now, but voting that slot before they return is boring, especially compared to the alternative.

mm right that sr.. it's kinda still around, but hut and gamma have stolen my focus for the mean time so yeah

[Andante]

Like Gamma went "I have to catch up" quoted a handful of things, and that was it. no "concluding thoughts" or whatever

[Andante]

what I like to call "busy work"

and hut did that but worse? hut's stuff was like strictly not really game related lol, like why do you care if I TR or SR Vulture? they don't have lots of posts, so obviously my read there isn't mega strong, like, you want clarification on my VULTURE read? yet I can tr and sr datisi in the same paragraph... and no questions?

[Andante]

what I like to call "busy work"

and hut did that but worse? hut's stuff was like strictly not really game related lol, like why do you care if I TR or SR Vulture? they don't have lots of posts, so obviously my read there isn't mega strong, like, you want clarification on my VULTURE read? yet I can tr and sr datisi in the same paragraph... and no questions?

Assuming this is the bulk of your reasons. Have you played with hut before? Is their play here outside town range?

I have no idea who hut even is. why is this "assuming this is the bulk of your reasons" like, hut only has like 2 posts... do you want this like 15 page paper on exactly why hut MUST be maf? and even if I knew who hut was, how would that result in me being CONFIDENT they're maf after 2 posts?

VOTE: VP

[Andante]

i agree hut is being explicitly not townie right now,

Is there some hut meta I should know here? What's not town there other than just general not playing the game yet.

Same Q to andante.

have you looked at what hut actually did? do I have to spell it out? the "content" given is not something that helps with reads, it's like "I'm here... look at me!!! I'm doing stuff!!" but like, I didn't like the posts.. I'll say it again. Why does whether I TR or SR Vulture matter to hut? hut only commented on like 3 things. Datisi and Ari knowing each other, my read on vulture, and something else I don't remember. TOWN... reading the game would have actual stuff to comment on

[Andante]

Like Gamma went "I have to catch up" quoted a handful of things, and that was it. no "concluding thoughts" or whatever

I mean, do you have any thoughts or anything after your catch up?

[Andante]

once i saw you saying how i'm ignoring you, i decided to *keep* ignoring you to see what happens.

lol it's a good strat!!! cause if they're town they'll just keep yelling that you're ignoring, if scum, they just drop it and move on... at least, that's what I've learned from my experience

[Andante]

I shared what thoughts I had already
I said earlier that the game so far felt rather bland and I meant it

yikes.. how to make it not bland then? is it me? might be me.. SORRY IM A BLAND PERSON YALL!!! byeeeee

[Andante]

Datisi is lock town

[Andante]

you’re actually probably one of the better parts of the game

heck yeah pocket accepted!!! hahahahaha


I want more voices tbh, we're looking at SS town, and Datisi town, VP is suspicious, and like there's not really anything of value from anyone else..

[Andante]

i agree hut is being explicitly not townie right now,

Is there some hut meta I should know here? What's not town there other than just general not playing the game yet.

Same Q to andante.

have you looked at what hut actually did? do I have to spell it out? the "content" given is not something that helps with reads, it's like "I'm here... look at me!!! I'm doing stuff!!" but like, I didn't like the posts.. I'll say it again. Why does whether I TR or SR Vulture matter to hut? hut only commented on like 3 things. Datisi and Ari knowing each other, my read on vulture, and something else I don't remember. TOWN... reading the game would have actual stuff to comment on

Generally, I agree with you. However, some people just take time to get into a game, which is why I asked about meta. It's kind of a stupid point if this is how hut just plays as town. It's clear you didn't check, so I will just do it myself later I guess

why does meta matter right now?? just wait for hut to post more...

[Andante]

Real talk, of all the people to talk so far, I think Ari is the one I SR the most...

I think this still stands, maybe not sr the most, but SR a lot, like, Ari has a LOT of posts, but nothing in that is really advancing the game, she's just there

[Andante]

i mean, in comparison to everyone here, he’s definitely one of the better ones, I could be wrong, but he just seems like town to me

[Andante]

why does meta matter right now?? just wait for hut to post more...

This is more about understanding you than understanding hut

oh wait what? you wanna meta me? I thought you were gonna meta hut... hahaha why do you need meta on me?

[Andante]

NOO I WAS DOING SOMETHING AND MISSED PEOPLE I WANTED TO TALK TO!!!

Bad at scum I think? Maybe I'm substituting in "easy to read" for that incorrectly.

Also, I wanna clear up I do NOT think

SS's (hmmm too many S's...)

Something_Smart's scum game is bad, he may have fooled me once, and seemed towny /very tryhard when I was his partner, but I think I have him figured out this game.... if he's town lol, if he's maf I literally give up trying, but I believe he should be town!!! I mean, 10/13 odds he's town!!!

why is andante scum and why am i wrong to townread her?

She's had some misreads of the game state and conversations I find concerning. You had the whole backing off Fire out of concern it was getting too serious too fast. You have her launching into pre-emptive defense mode when I asked if she had hut meta. It's obviously hard to separate signal from the noise with her, but I usually find her instincts good even if I disagree with how she approaches the game. Here, I'm not finding a lot of instinctual stuff from her I'm liking.

I think people are tone reading her as town, but from games I've played with people who say they have good meta from her, IDK if you can necessarily use tone to tell alignment.

Why are you like overly cautious of me? when you have almost no one else doing much? so shouldn't you just go "ok gonna assume andante town, see where this goes, and evaluate later if needbe" ?? like, if someone is doing a lot, I'll just assume they're town and work with them for finding scum.. instead you're all "CAN'T TRUST ANDANTE. SHE MAF!" like what? you, yourself aren't doing too much, instead just tunneling in on the people who talk a lot, have you ever considered trying to engage with anyone other than me or datisi this game?
I guess you kinda are with Ari now.. but like, ehhh

[Andante]

Town!Baltar doesn't really care and is just having lots of fun doing whatever he wants.

that has never been my experience. Town him is usually yelling... a lot, scum him is just "hey look I'm nice!!" which was why like KTANE, day 1 there was a point like "hold up, he's too nice here" but yeah, your desciption of town/scum VP do NOT line up with the VP I'm aware of lol. now... are you his scumpartner... or is it just you maf trying to pocket him? either way I don't by any of this, plus I was SRing you earlier, and I'm gonna take a wild guess you saw and this is the "effort" in your posts.... describing meta to us... instead of actually reading VP this game

VOTE: Aristeia

[Andante]

forget what I said earlier, fire is town

[Andante]

Tbh I'm like, a little bit surprised that VP hasn't attacked me back yet, as town or as scum. I think it surprises me a little more if he's town; I kind of expected to be lumped in as the third in his Andante/Datisi/??? solve with how I've acted toward those slots. The way he's been acting toward my slot feels maybe scum-indicative; he's engaging with me some but also kind of ignoring substantive engagement with me. I don't think it's super indicative of anything up to this point but I'm interested to see how it plays out. I'm by no means like sold on VP scum or anything.

Why would I just attack you back?

While I do see you lining up with Datisi, I don't see you lining up with andante necessarily (despite that weird sort of exchange you two had), and she is my lead pick for scum here so far. What substantive things would you like to engage on? I didn't get a lot from your posts toward me.


pedit - @ari, I don't think you actually have a terrible record of reading me at this point? Didn't you correctly townread me our last few games?

LOL "I don't

think

implosion is scum with Andante"
Right.. so... we haven't ruled out implosion completely as my scum partner? cause scum partners start the game like we did? I'm honored you think my scum game is this amazing thing, but it's really not lol

[Andante]

forget what I said earlier, fire is town

is it bc i posted a big paragraph that you looked at and went "uhhh wow" and moved on

hahaha trying to call me out... umm... that's not 100% of it, actually Iw as like, "if he just drops this and waits 24 hours to come back, then he's probably scum" but here you are again, so yeah. good look!!

[Andante]

I think people are tone reading her as town, but from games I've played with people who say they have good meta from her, IDK if you can necessarily use tone to tell alignment.

@VP

the "cautious" thing
(that you actually said, but quotes be wild, and idk how to make it like the cool people do, and I don't wanna click back to OG post... tangent aside, you said it, not me)

[Andante]

which is also why I voted vulture, because it feels like she's doing what I would be doing as scum here

I mean, vulture has definitely dropped off, so like... yeah, "I'm just gonna observe this game" ok.. sure whatever, but we need some thoughts plz...

[Andante]

Tbh I'm like, a little bit surprised that VP hasn't attacked me back yet, as town or as scum. I think it surprises me a little more if he's town; I kind of expected to be lumped in as the third in his Andante/Datisi/??? solve with how I've acted toward those slots. The way he's been acting toward my slot feels maybe scum-indicative; he's engaging with me some but also kind of ignoring substantive engagement with me. I don't think it's super indicative of anything up to this point but I'm interested to see how it plays out. I'm by no means like sold on VP scum or anything.

Why would I just attack you back?

While I do see you lining up with Datisi, I don't see you lining up with andante necessarily (despite that weird sort of exchange you two had), and she is my lead pick for scum here so far. What substantive things would you like to engage on? I didn't get a lot from your posts toward me.


pedit - @ari, I don't think you actually have a terrible record of reading me at this point? Didn't you correctly townread me our last few games?

LOL "I don't

think

implosion is scum with Andante"
Right.. so... we haven't ruled out implosion completely as my scum partner? cause scum partners start the game like we did? I'm honored you think my scum game is this amazing thing, but it's really not lol

that's your emphasis not mine.

As far as quality of your scum game, wasn't it just in KTaNE that a bunch of people were going on about how your tone is similar between town and scum and that's not alignment indicative for you. I think it might have been Bell who said the best way to read you is to look at who you are pushing and why.

ok whatever, so if we're going with this, THE GAME IS STILL VERY MUCH IN RVS RIGHT NOW!!! we don't have actual content right now, my "amazing scum game" the EM people know about and refer to is literally from 2017-2018,

like, this is probably *mostly* representative of my scum game on MS:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=88375

and this is what I would say my *best* scum game on MS is
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=88224

So like, can you stop referring to "meta" that someone else once said once upon a time? Use your game with me, and reach your own conclusions. if you want to keep pushing meta reasons that aren't even your meta, I'll just vote you out here no brakes and call it a day. It's just freaking annoying hearing all this "WELL... META!!" like, yes... I was conf maf, and town genuinely believed I was town and the invest was lying... but that was like 5 years ago... so yeah, Fish in the sea is the closest you're getting for my "awesome maf skills"

[Andante]

i don't agree w baltar's read of andante and also i am not reading her by tone at all

what do you think of baltar reading me by "meta" which isn't even his meta? He's never even seen my scum game.. yet seems to be relying on my scum meta?

[Andante]

As far as quality of your scum game, wasn't it just in KTaNE that a bunch of people were going on about how your tone is similar between town and scum and that's not alignment indicative for you. I think it might have been Bell who said the best way to read you is to look at who you are pushing and why.

@Datisi he just said he's going off something "someone said" about my scum game... like, it wasn't even Bell, so he's like reaching for a reason to SR me? idk what he's doing, but like, it doesn't feel like town!VP is trying to read my slot at all... I am his STRONGEST SR so far. he's said that a bunch, and it's off "meta" that "bell said" I'm pretty sure it would've been catboi in ktane who said what he's referring to, but still like, using someone else's meta? when all VP's knowledge of me/meta should be saying I'm town... idk it's dumb, but I'm his number one SR for dumb reasons

[Andante]

@Datisi he just said he's going off something "someone said" about my scum game...

literally all he said here is that people shouldn't be townreading you off tone... did you even read that post?

nevermind, just ignore me then, clearly I'm misinterpretting something

[Andante]

I'm having a hard time getting into this game (they said, as if they ever really got into them these days) because there's a knot of meta/familiarity that's like wriggling around in the center of it. I think it's unfair to say there's scum in there somewhere (Ari/VP/Datisi) but it's difficult for me to see past it right now. One of those "Feels Like It" things.

Does anyone have any questions for me/want my takes on something.. I'm in a post-y mood.

do you have a read on implosion?

[Andante]

I have done some reading, I thought about it, BAM!!! I ORGANIZED MY THOUGHTS IN PICTURE FORM. You are very welcome!!

Spoiler: Hmmmmmm

(The tiers aren't ordered... or are they??? Do the tiers even mean anything? All good questions I don't have the answer to.... for now)

[Andante]

yeah vp having that response to that tier list is honestly among the most wild things i've seen in mafia games.

Glad to be No.1!

I find the tiers list to be tryharding LAMIST more than actual scumhunting or providing insight into her thought process.

I mean, anytime I say anything about my reads I’m yelled at for “misrepping people” so I figured when not sit down, figure out what my reads even are, and then since everyone hates what I say, bam! picture form!!! yes a few things in the tierlist are different from what i’ve said in thread, but like 90% i literally explained already… Datisi is the only one who I was debating between 2 tiers, everyone else is super solid


@datisi I was trying to make all avatars perfect squares/the exact same size… got to SS’s avatar… and just gave up on that plan

@implosion lol yeah that reaction… I was like “ok guess I’m just watching this play out lol cause… wow.. is VP’s tier like 3/3 maf or something… cause like.. wow”

@ari no the list isn’t rng, it’s reads related, the people in the tiers are the same level, but the levels are not ordered

majority of the reason for me even posting that was how the game felt “dead” and guess what? it created like 10 instant posts, got people talking!! mission accomplished!! I love how no one is talking about that, it’s just “andante changed votes 8 times!!” ok? I either move it a lot or like never.. but since hut’s paying specific attention, it might be town indicative tbh, and yeah @hut, I’m a she, it’s not a huge deal, cause I’m used to it, but uhh yeah


yikes long post… I need to go back to chilling… can’t wait to get yelled at for this post… IM JUST TRYING TO HAVE A GOOD TIME AND MAKE YALL HAVE A GOOD TIME!!! as well as find maf, I don’t get all the “ANDANTE SCUMMY!!!” stuff… i know I’m like never towny by play… but literally leave me alone and I’ll find a 3/3… ahhhhh

[Andante]

Dats I miss you <3

Can we please just stop with this? It's actually getting annoying, I signed up to play mafia, not for this... who do you think the mafia are/why?

[Andante]

The tier list isn't a freaking act. it was my genuine reads mixed with some stuff to hopefully make people laugh, I was trying to see some reactions, the tiers from top to bottom: People I'm concerned about, People I think are scummy, Null, and People I TR

And literally your reaction to it had me going "ok so I'm right on something?"

I don't understand why you are so tunneled on me, you hate me saying every little thing on my mind, then you hate SS saying nothing, like, you hate me saying everything on my mind, so I've just been following along, now like, a few people have definitely shifted tiers on that list since I've posted it, but that's where I was at. I have no idea what you're talking about in KTANE, after N1 I was so over that game (sorry dats... loved it though!!!)

[Andante]

The tier list isn't a freaking act. it was my genuine reads mixed with some stuff to hopefully make people laugh, I was trying to see some reactions, the tiers from top to bottom: People I'm concerned about, People I think are scummy, Null, and People I TR

how did i go from maybe scummy, to being one of the two people you named as town (along with s_s), to then again you being concerned about me?

cause you're either definitely town or definitely maf, like, you're the only one I have like that. Like you're very towny yes. but it almost seems too towny to me. thus. you're in the concerned group for now - that probably made no sense, but basically I'm not gonna write you off as town and call it a day, I just don't think I'm fully sold on you being town yet.

Then again there's like 5 people I would LOVE more/some content from, not like these reads are set in stone yet. it's early d1

[Andante]

Implo, what are your thoughts on Penguin so far?

I'm curious why you pick this specific question to ask me.

I don't think he's done much alignment-indicative yet, but I expect to be able to get a read on him over not too much time.

Feel like you have played with him more than me, which was why I asked. After a short appearance this game, which didn't help me read him much, he has just disappeared.

how do you expect implosion to have a penguin read off nothing though? like even if implosion was a penguin expert... there's just nothing to read there?

[Andante]

this is a case of bad faith arguing a defense that wasn't at all what was being said in the thread.

you sure it's not a case of misunderstanding?

[Andante]

Like you're very towny yes. but it almost seems too towny to me.

???

i am tempted to townread you + fire for this, because the take of "datisi is so townie, it's actually scummy" is so fucking bonkers, i feel like scum doesn't dare say it.

granted, this is more +town for fire, because he said it first, and his justification made slightly more sense, but. bruh.

I mean, unless I'm supposed to believe you do nothing as scum, like the one game I think I'm remembering, yeah.. but it's not like I wanna lim you here, just I'm taking time to call you town, not sure what part of my thought process doesn't make sense?? but hey, apparantly nothing I say makes any sense to like half yall, but then it's crystal clear to the other half? idk

[Andante]

i mean, if you said "you didn't do anything ai yet" or "i need more time to read you", that's fine and valid, whatever

but saying "yes, you're very townie, but *radio static* that makes you scummy!" is ?????????

how does that fit in with the comment of "unless I'm supposed to believe you do nothing as scum", because that implies i'm accusing you of townreading me for simply showing up in the thread; i'm asking about why you're calling me "very townie", your words

@andante

ok, I'm partly confused by the question, but I think I got it

I think you're very towny due to your constant thread presence and like you're always trying to engage people/advance the game.
I mean, you see what we're working with here.. like 6-7/13 doing NOTHING, Ari posting a lot, but nothing that's actually beneficial for the game, VP tunneling me...
My part I'm having doubts on is if you're being too much of a leader cause you're mafia, or if you're just town, but this "tell me why you read my like X" is giving me flashbacks to that town game you wouldn't leave my read on you alone.

I'm gonna guess none of that made any sense... it's why I'm just gonna keep stuff to myself

[Andante]

I mean, unless I'm supposed to believe you do nothing as scum

, like the one game I think I'm remembering, yeah.. but it's not like I wanna lim you here, just I'm taking time to call you town, not sure what part of my thought process doesn't make sense??

like the bolded implies i said you're supposed to be townreading me for Just Posting (which would be a horrible metric for reading me) when that is very much not what i was doing and i don't get where that is coming from?

no I don't tr you for just posting, you're like interrogating me on a read where I said you're either for sure, lock town, or you're just definitely scum, like, yeah... ahhhhhh this is gonna get us no where.. I don't even want to lim you d1

[Andante]

I don't think "reasoning" with andante is a good way to sort her because she doesn't make much sense as town most of the time.

I mean, if people make it clear what exactly doesn't make sense, and let me know, I can usually provide some alternative explanation?

[Andante]

I mean in HDP and PYP she was p different no?

HDP was over the holidays and I was just super busy IRL, which didn't help with the million posts per day there...

[Andante]

There is a certain refuge in audacity baked into Andante's play.

what does this even mean?? lol is it good?

[Andante]

@Ari if you want my present scum game, the normal fish in the sea game... I was very present there

[Andante]

There is a certain refuge in audacity baked into Andante's play.

what does this even mean?? lol is it good?

it means he thinks you're mafia trying to throw outlandish ideas into the thread in order to be townread.

ahhhh that's definitely something I'd do lol, but like, these are my genuine thoughts here? like, what have I even said that's wild so far?? we haven't even gotten to me making a team read yet...

Maybe I need to take notes from Penguin on how to play maf... post a penguin gif and call it a game...

[Andante]

I mean in HDP and PYP she was p different no?

HDP was over the holidays and I was just super busy IRL, which didn't help with the million posts per day there...

even when you had time to be online you couldn't wait to log off during the game which has nothing to do with the holidays.

Do you think Andante could have just not liked that game for reasons aside from being scum? I only spectated it and rather loosely but I know it was controversial

WOAH THERE. We are not making that assumption. I don't care what yall think of my play, but we are not assuming that, nor are we discussing it here.
I was literally home with family. Like, sorry not sorry, my family is my priority. Especially since I only see them once a year... not sure why this is even a thing to talk about. ok whatever my town/scum games are polarized. ok. move on.

[Andante]

@Ari if you want my present scum game, the normal fish in the sea game... I was very present there

also I think her trying to refuse the tr by claiming her scum game is good and citing some game from whenever is mildly +town too

I just think it's annoying the assumption is "scum game sucks, and town is like this"

[Andante]

how do you expect implosion to have a penguin read off nothing though? like even if implosion was a penguin expert... there's just nothing to read there?

This is sort of a weird criticism because I thought that was a somewhat +town thing for VP to ask (his explanation doesn't really affect it). I feel like bringing up a random slot that hasn't talked in a while, especially to me given that VP has implied some degree of townread on me (i think) and so it can also be viewed as reaching a bridge to me, is a somewhat town move. And I don't think Penguin's done nothing, I think it's entirely possible to have a read or even a strong read on him based on his ISO so far, I just don't happen to.

ehhh probably +town if he picked anyone who was actually talking I'd say, but penguin... I don't expect anyone to have an accurate read there yet. but hut with less posts? like, I TR hut. for sure! There's decent content there, like sure everyone thinks differently. I just don't get why you're specifically saying it was weird I didn't like how VP asked you about penguin?
24 posts from penguin. only 2 in reference to you. 1 was saying something to you and the other was jokingly calling you maf. SURE if you and penguin had interactions like you and I did at the start, I could understand VP asking you, but VP asked you about someone you basically had no interactions with in thread, and who hasn't done anything seriously in thread this game.

So yeah, calling it a weird criticism? That just seems off to me... Like, you see nothing wrong with "what are your thoughts on a slot with nothing?" yet, on that same like, VP was like "I don't want to have to hold SS's hand and ask him questions for his reads" yet, he chose to ask you. your expert advice. On a slot you can not possibly share much more than "ehh not bad, but nothing there is really AI"

[Andante]

Penguin you're the best!!!!
VOTE: Vulture

I'll help make an actual wagon

[Andante]

cause Vulture kinda started sliding after doing NOTHING since I've called them town

[Andante]

Penguin!!! Your plan worked!! we got Vulture here!!! best wagon choice!! Genius!!! Best Penguin!!! Woooo

[Andante]

Decided to reread Andante's iso

I really don't think that's the best use of your time... ummm the only reason someone WOULD read my ISO would be if you're trying to case/tunnel me. I hate to be the "bearer of bad news" but uhhh I'm town fam...

[Andante]

I think your main issue with me, is that you're assuming every single line I say is 100% serious.. like the "bad faith" in 34.. that was me joking... post number 34... am I not allowed to joke? like, am I supposed to respond to this "case" cause... it really seems boring to me... if you're taking every little thing I say, as something that's dead serious...

[Andante]

hmm

hmmmmmmm

[Andante]

Ari, and SS, what are yall's thoughts on VP's case on me?

[Andante]

Me, pointing out that is not the point I'm making.

I don't think this is 100% because it's very hard to read what is real aloofness from andante, and what's bad faith. I wouldn't even be on this so much if it didn't seem to keep happening throughout the game.

well just ask for clarification on bad faith stuff? cause I guarantee you, nothing I've said this game has been "bad faith"

[Andante]

There is a difference between not making sense, and making bad faith arguments/being overly defensive.

maybe I just don't make sense? and actually, where have I been overly defensive?

[Andante]

do the things you're saying not make sense to you?

uh everything I say makes perfect sense to me? it's always does, but I understand why/where people get confused. like whatever I said to implosion, I distinctly remember taking the time to make it as clear as possible, then he just blew it off basically, soooo yeah. that's that... like, if we just wanna discuss Andante.. we're going to get no where. I am town. I'm interested in finding mafia. Would love to join you on the hunt

[Andante]

I feel like I have a decent sense, as scum, of what things I shouldn't do because they'll attract primarily negative attention. And that sense is absent as town-- it almost never enters the equation. Probably because I have some amount of faith in the scumhunting skill of the people I'm playing with, that I assume that if I keep saying genuine things as town people will more often than not eventually read me town for it.

YOOO I'm like that!! As scum, literally everything I say I go "will this help me get TRed/ is this at all scummy.." then town... I'm just free, genuinely don't care how people read it... cause I know the town here will recognize me (and if I interpreted that wrong... my be.. not bad faith @VP!!!)

Know who got awfully silent??
Datisi...

[Andante]

DATISI IS BACK!!!

[Andante]

it seems like everyone (other than baltar) has ignored my vote on hutmeil, and everyone period has ignored their return to the game? anyone else find this really odd?

I saw it, I think hut's kinda towny, so I didn't jump to that wagon

[Andante]

I TR you Vulture!!

Also, was this genuine when you said it? If so, what changed for you?

@andante^

uhh I had no read at the time, and vulture was talking about always being SRed at the time, so I said that. like, if you wanna take what I say out of the context it's said in.. obv you're gonna think they're shit posts

[Andante]

Know who got awfully silent??

it's almost like
i said i was gonna be v/la
studied until 2am, slept 3 hours last night, took a test, got a motherfucking A on it, passed out, went to work, and came back home

gee i can't believe i was so awfully silent

WOOOOO CONGRATS ON THE A!!!!

[Andante]

Datisi, what are your thoughts on VP's scumcase on me?

[Andante]

did you need me for anything when you mentioned me?

nah, I was just like "oh wait, where's datisi?" you're not one of the 8 with like no posts though so overall you're fine

[Andante]

like, I'd LOVE more to read from people other than Ari vs SS and VP vs Me, like, everyone else... plz jump in or something

[Andante]

@datisi, this post seemed good. I mean, they're not lock town for obvious reason, I just definitely SR others more, and he said he was gonna ISO fire for something, so like, I look forward to that takeaway

Also what's with the Aris-Datisi "flirting", any history there?

yes

you could say we do that a lot :>

Lol ok!

VOTE: hutmeil
they seem a little off, like their “focus” upon entering doesn’t seem to be to actually sort anyone, and just asked a few questions where like you could give any answer and they probably wouldn’t even follow up? idk, they just don’t feel like town to me, and they’re probably my strong “lead” for where to go to find maf, could just be I SR their stuff cause there’s not a lot, but I genuinely don’t like what we have so far from hut

what I like to call "busy work"

and hut did that but worse? hut's stuff was like strictly not really game related lol, like why do you care if I TR or SR Vulture? they don't have lots of posts, so obviously my read there isn't mega strong, like, you want clarification on my VULTURE read? yet I can tr and sr datisi in the same paragraph... and no questions?

Well, my first few posts were because I got mod prodded lol. Didn't realize game has started. Weekend is family time so ....

Anyway, my questions though quite short are genuine clarifications to what the other slots said. Vulture already responded (thanks!). You didn't directly respond to me, but your recent reads posts indirectly answered my question. And that Datisi-Aris thing hmmm ok

i agree hut is being explicitly not townie right now,

Is there some hut meta I should know here? What's not town there other than just general not playing the game yet.

Same Q to andante.

^ This. So I'm not town because I don't post that much? I understand though, I don't like lurkers too! Speaking of, Malakittens hasn't posted yet has she?

So (speaking anecdotally because I can’t reference back to it anymore) on Epicmafia this setup was played with few numbers, basically. I wanna say it was like 2/3/2. Masons sometimes outed themselves day one. This lessened the pool that people needed to hunt within, and kind of... guided the kills in a way, in that uh... you’re not analyzing the kills for “was this mason hunting or not” so much as like...

Kills were then made and analyzed as “the clear died expected” or, rarely, “why didn’t the clear die here?” Almost always the masons died but sometimes they didn’t and it was a ? moment.

I immediately thought of it when I saw this game and wanted to throw it out there as a way of tackling the game, or alternatively having only one mason out themselves and be the go-between for themselves and the others, etc.

What happened then? Did Town/Mason win when they outed early?

Town won more often than not. The caveat is that the pool is smaller than it would be here, but having town focus in on people who it could reasonably be instead of tunneling masons for a bit was beneficial.

I see. That's an interesting strategy. But if Masons claim early, they'd surely be NKd multiple nights in a row? Isn't that bad for Town?

====================

After going through 21 pages, I see that most of you know each other from previous games. And so far most of the discussions are meta this and meta that. Unfortunately, I don't have that same advantage since it's just my 2nd game on this site.

I find Andante scummy just for the fact that he keeps changing his votes. If I counted correctly, you've already voted 8 times! But then again he seems playful so cannot really read into anything there.

As for Vulture, suggesting to out PR roles this early seems scummy too. But it's a strategy nonetheless. Not sure if that benefits Town/Scum more.

The others I don't really have much read yet.

[Andante]

correct about what? that they're new? that doesn't make them town

Didn't say it makes then town, but it means the push you and andante were on was kind snoozefest, yes?

i don't recall you being cagey about pressuring people.

wait till you see VP's case on me... he has literally never tunneled me like this before. ever. I'm pretty sure I'm playing like I always do...
VOTE: VP

he mafia

[Andante]

correct about what? that they're new? that doesn't make them town

Didn't say it makes then town, but it means the push you and andante were on was kind snoozefest, yes?

i don't recall you being cagey about pressuring people.

Doubling down when you're wrong is usually a bad approach.

I accept apologies in beer and votes on andante.

aren't you just doubling down on me?

[Andante]

okay, i read the case

i want to say "A for effort" because i don't think scum!baltar posts a case like that there, unless he's scum with very specific few people AND he's trying to galaxy brain guess the gamestate that's going to be happening in the rest of d1 (which i don't *think* scum!him does usually?)

the content of that case is not really convincing tho, sorry ): i can go in further if anyone thinks that's necessary or something, but like, i don't feel like doing it if i don't have to lol

*however*, andante's read on hut is. uh. i am extremely skeptical, to say the least, that she went from thinking they're one of her top suspects, to townreading them based on... them counting the amount of times she has voted this game. like, read her original thoughts on them in 310, then read their 508. like.

still, i don't wanna vote andante at least before doing my due diligence on what ari has told me, because i know she is actually decent at reading andante, but to say it's not tempting would be a lie

you wanna vote me cause of my hut read? I mean, I'm giving this the best effort I can here, I'm literally being tunneled by VP, and no one else is doing too much to actually read.. so, yeah.. I don't expect any accuracy from me

[Andante]

aren't you just doubling down on me?

How am I doubling down on you? Where have I been proven incorrect?

You saying "I'm town", isn't really a counterpoint.

ok I think we have different definitions of doubling down.

know what?
I'm maf VP, you caught me! congrats! Good work

[Andante]

VOTE: implosion

this is very likely red

[Andante]

making me wanna yeet you into the stratosphere

Nice!!!
@VP you found yourself a partner in crime!!!

[Andante]

Weird that you didn't think it was productive to respond to me when I was clearly trying to engage you but you thought 398, 399, and 401 were productive.

Yeah this is town.

I think SS is town, for different reasons though, but sure

[Andante]

@fire what are your thoughts on VP's scum case on me?

[Andante]

VOTE: gamma

gottem

[Andante]

did you need me for anything when you mentioned me?

nah, I was just like "oh wait, where's datisi?" you're not one of the 8 with like no posts though so overall you're fine

8???

ocho

[Andante]

Andante I feel like is scum because her saying EIGHT

LMAOOOOOOO

[Andante]

you heard it here first folks... ocho = mafia

[Andante]

VOTE: Andante
Kill this.

that's sad

[Andante]

Andante I feel like is scum because her saying EIGHT

LMAOOOOOOO

you heard it here first folks... ocho = mafia

This is a town response 0% of the time.

hello, nice to meet you. I'm andante

[Andante]

VOTE: implosion

I'll just go here I guess

[Andante]

VOTE: implosion

I'll just go here I guess

do you think that was towny from gamma?

no not at all

[Andante]

Andante I feel like is scum because her saying EIGHT

LMAOOOOOOO

you heard it here first folks... ocho = mafia

This is a town response 0% of the time.

hello, nice to meet you. I'm andante

I don’t care WHO you are! You blatantly misrepresent my arguments on you, you die!

how is quoting words you say a misrep?


like, when I'm scum people were yelling misrep left and right... I'm not even scum here, so I'm actually confused

[Andante]

what made you decide to move vote then?

figured I'd move it to someone I SR before I dissapear for 48 hours

[Andante]

You are acting like I’m scum read you saying A WORD. That’s not the fucking case at all. I’m scumreading you for downplaying the contributions of several slots in this game. You trying to confuse the argument just makes me want your head in a basket more!

If you wanna tell me more than 6 names that are actually doing anything, be my guest. but 8 are either not posting or not contributing anything of value

[Andante]

also like VP hasn't even said I'm mafia

which is weird because he said I'm good at reading him supposedly

so if I'm pushing him and I'm good at reading him and he's town, why would he not think I'm scum and trying to push a misyeet?

Oh I've thought it, but let's see if I'm right about andante first. If so, better kill me tonight homie.

what happens when you're wrong about me?

[Andante]

Hot take: Implosion is mafia

[Andante]

I think VP's andante case actually has a good amount of merit.

I don't, I feel like it was "I MUST prove andante maf!!"

I'm surprised how many people said it's bad or meh.

It's bad. I'm town. VP is tunneling me to tunnel me. Not cause he genuinely thinks I'm maf

Particularly (though this could simply be meta-wrong) it seems out of character for her to have been afraid of the wagon on me

I mean I didn't want us to speed yeet anyone, and it felt like that was the way we were going... I've been limmed 24 hours into day 1 before...

she's been a bit touchy in some weird ways that I think are sensible to interpret as scum caring about how they're perceived.

Why can't I be town that knows I'm town? And thus, I want to be perceived as town. Like ignore the recent bs/shenanigans, if someone is seriously pushing that I'm maf, of course I'm going to do everything in my power - to a point - to ensure they read me correctly.

I have very mixed feelings about her alignment, though. While parts of per play do feel that way, other parts of her play feel very unplanned, or sort of not-premeditated. It feels like there isn't really anywhere she's planning to go. I have a hard time deciphering how her play indicates her alignment without more meta depth.

Fair, I mean, usually I'm described as unreadable. I had a game where the entire dead chat was convinced I was maf... plot twist, I was town. Nice to meet you, I'm andante! I try my best to explain my thoughts, and yes I'll share almost every little thought I have.

I'm thinking more that VP is town. I feel like he's methodically interested in figuring out who scum are.

All I've seen him do is yell that I have "bad faith" arguments... it doesn't really feel methodical

[Andante]

I guess now that I write all that up I do see what Andante was saying about a lot of people not really having given much to this game. I do feel like there's been a lot of useful content but I guess when I sort through it it doesn't really amount to all that much in a lot of ways.

yeah... literally ALL the useful stuff is related to me, and like, I literally need it to be about ANYONE ELSE to actually be able to read... and like, a very good amount of this PL isn't actually doing too much

[Andante]

I guess now that I write all that up I do see what Andante was saying about a lot of people not really having given much to this game. I do feel like there's been a lot of useful content but I guess when I sort through it it doesn't really amount to all that much in a lot of ways.

yeah... literally ALL the useful stuff is related to me, and like, I literally need it to be about ANYONE ELSE to actually be able to read... and like, a very good amount of this PL isn't actually doing too much

*8 people to be exact as of this morning

[Andante]

GeorgeBailey, Gamma Emerald, Malakittens, hutmeil, Something_Smart, implosion. PenguinPower, Vulture
Are all the people I want more actual content from, like, I don't see yall taking stances, doing too much in the reads department, like sure recently a few got better.. but when 8/13 people aren't doing much of anything to even LOOK towny? like, what do the rest of us do?

[Andante]

It's sort of an impression that you're the kind of player that wouldn't care about a speedlim (on someone else) all that much as town. That impression certainly could be wrong.

that is definitely very wrong...

[Andante]

You could be. No scumtell is absolute, but I think the appearance of caring about how one is perceived is typically scum-indicative, because while town does often care about how they're perceived, sort of like how S_S was saying, they're not as strongly aware of it the whole time. Scum has to be constantly thinking about what they post and whether it fits in with notions of what'd be considered townish, whereas town is able to just post without thinking too hard about it because they know if the town is competent enough then hopefully they'll be read correctly.

I certainly think it's not scummy to defend against someone directly attacking you, it's more about preemptiveness.

As scum I tend to just do exactly what VP is doing. you find 1 person, and you tunnel. never rethink. just tunnel. thoughts outside? who cares. must. tunnel.

And like, I know how to read the situation, I know my level of TR with people is slipping, but hey, not like I can do a whole lot when I've been trying my best since this started... and we have 8 just kinda there.. maybe like 6 of them now, just there.. "who cares" like.. just gets frustrating after a point tbh

[Andante]

Penguin, instead of reads from you, what about a gif describing your reads on people? like, can we get 3-4 "reads" please?

[Andante]

OMG I LOVE THIS!!! PENGUIN YOU'RE LEGIT MY FAVORITE PERSON HERE

[Andante]

MY FAVORITE PERSON HERE

Ouch.

do you wanna make a gif list too?

[Andante]

Spoiler: Gif List

VP Baltar

Datisi

Aristeia

GeorgeBailey

Gamma Emerald

Malakittens

hutmeil

fireisredsir

Something_Smart

implosion

PenguinPower

Vulture

Andante

THAT GIF LIST IS PRETTY GREAT TOO!!!
hahahaha I LOVE how this became a thing!!

[Andante]

I think I understand the implosion scumreads.

could you elaborate more on this, and do you agree with them? Or like, where's your stance?

[Andante]

Was hoping for a reaction or two to my gif list

didn't understand mine

[Andante]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: malakittens

AYYYY THIS MEANS IM TOWN RIGHT?

[Andante]

and on vulture, I can't tell if they're town just trying to be careful on reads, or maf like "idk yall... can't trust andante.." like, Vulture, I've been interacting with you... whatever you need from me to help you sort me, just ask? cause this recent like "idk there..." when I have people just tunneling me, it's like, I can't tell what your intentions are there...

[Andante]

I don’t think that I’ve ever been in a place with you where I’m... able to pick out things

but... you're a vulture!! that should be easy!!

[Andante]

oh I think I know who you are then.. and uhh this is nothing like the town game I recall lmaooo

[Andante]

This is a semi-outed alt if not entirely.

Can you just entirely out it and spare us the homework, then?

well as soon as they said tunneled me in pyp.. literally only 1 person did that... but also them going "I'm this person" would basically be a scumclaim here, cause I have never seen town!them play like this, EVER..

[Andante]

Mafiascum is the only place where we’ll articulated sentences still get misinterpreted.

You can say “I scumread Pancake” and somebody will say “so you townread Waffle?”

No bitch, that’s a whole new sentence. WTF is you talking about?

you townread waffle? that's sus
VOTE: Gamma

[Andante]

This is a semi-outed alt if not entirely.

Can you just entirely out it and spare us the homework, then?

It’s Ydra. Every alt is Ydra you know this.

@Andante If you want a reference of how I play on this account I have several completed games on it.

LMAOOO I give up, ok, if it's Ydra, just ignore me, I was thinking Koba, and was like, there's absolutely 0 way koba plays like this. my b!!!

[Andante]

Can't believe people are fighting me on this scummy mess

you called me town!!!

[Andante]

Can't believe people are fighting me on this scummy mess

what

how is that scummy

anything I say is "scummy"

[Andante]

the only person I even remember tunneling me in pyp was koba, so that's where I was like, if vulture is koba... they literally can't be town here hahhaa I'm just gonna shut up

[Andante]

Can't believe people are fighting me on this scummy mess

you called me town!!!

how the fuck do you ever read this as genuine fire

how the heck do you ever read me as fake here gamma

[Andante]

maybe the fact you are claiming people are saying things they aren't?

If you're trying to be funny, you're just being an asshole atp.

maybe im genuinely annoyed that you and VP are tunneling me off something so bad, I'm literally not intentionally saying people are saying things they aren't

sorry I'm the one being an asshole here...

[Andante]

i don't really mind pressure on andante, btw, i think it's useful.

I mind the pressure. I think it's the opposite of useful. I don't do pressure.

[Andante]

Hm.

Has anyone in this game thus far actually hard TR Andante? IMO people haven’t really broadcasted that.

there shouldn't be a reason to hard TR me thus far I don't think

[Andante]

implosion is still mafia though

VOTE: implosion

[Andante]

tldr on this?

I mean, do you think he's town? he's just there. like, not actively doing anything, literally just existing. and like I've been calling him maf all game, and he just shrugs it off. implosion is where my strongest SR is right now

[Andante]

how is this different from a bunch of other slots

like who?

mala? there's 0 content or will to play the game there. like, I'm not opposed to limming her, but like, no point in tunneling someone doing nothing

implosion has put in enough "effort" and I don't think he's town. simple as that

[Andante]

ngl i'm on beginning of page 15 and i feel like gamma is lacking the passion and soul in their posts that they usually have as town. I'm kinda scum reading that slot, but it might be early

keep reading

LOL that was my exact reaction to reading that... "oh just keep reading... just you wait..."

[Andante]

I find Andante scummy just for the fact that he keeps changing his votes. If I counted correctly, you've already voted 8 times! But then again he seems playful so cannot really read into anything there.

That doesn't make her scum. I remember in one of the games (I think Control??) I remember doing a VCA PxP and she kept changing her vote and I wantedto kill her lmaffo

VOTE: gamma

you did VCA on my voting? lol that's funny

[Andante]

i don't really mind pressure on andante, btw, i think it's useful.

I mind the pressure. I think it's the opposite of useful. I don't do pressure.

u don't do pressure as scum
you legit curl and die when you are pressured as scum
town not as much

me no gusta la post

I said I hated the pressure? "I mind" = "I care.."
like, I don't understand your post? I hate pressure as town and scum

[Andante]

As for Andante I was leaning more for town!andnate, but then 870 is giving me pause because I know Scum!Andante hates pressure. I dont think I ever heard town!andante make such a comment.

I'm scum for 1 comment? and instead of asking me for clarification...
From what I'm aware of, scum me loses my mind with pressure, and town me either loses it or starts "openwolfing" cause I think it's so dumb. Why do I lose it as scum? cause the pressure of letting teammates down. so yeah, carry on about how that 1 post makes me maf... not anything else I said

[Andante]

Yooooo, mala delivers.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: andante

WOAH THERE. I THOUGHT WE AGREED I WAS TOWN

[Andante]

an like, in all seriousness, mala did not "deliver" like what even. instead of going "there's no actual solving in Andante's ISO" it's "this post makes her maf because I misunderstood what she meant!"

[Andante]

Mala, 956 or 959. your choice. I want some conversation here.

[Andante]

really? just want to ignore me mala?
VOTE: Malakittens

[Andante]

VP. ar you just skipping over the fact mala just 100% took something I said, out of context, and is basing her entire SR on me on that... I'm trying to engage, and she is ignoring...

[Andante]

Ok, here's what my current reads are looking like,

VP Baltar - Probbly Town

. Just tunneled on me. If he's scum, he knows I'll push him if he's not "fighting anyone" but that's the extent of my read. Almost no confidence in it, but probably just tunneled town? idk, I'm not 1v1ing VP right now

Datisi - Town

. He's doing the exact same thing he did in the other game where he starts getting fixed on how people read him. The other town game I'm remembering, he wouldn't leave my read on him alone, and that seems to be what he's doing here. So yeah I'd call Datisi town.

Aristeia - Ehhh Scum lean

. So I just can't recall anything from Ari, I pulled up the ISO, and like, lots of talk about me, and lots of not game related datisi stuff, the occasional "X is maf" zero explanation why. and like your gif list thing just felt like how when maf sees a reads list they tend to go "oh I should do that!!" and then they post this list... like your gif list was a buch of "idk..." like, there's no point in either including/doing a list with over half as "???"

GeorgeBailey

- Any intentions on playing the game you signed up for?

Gamma Emerald

- in 278, gamma decides to call me town, tbh I don't even remember this. Gamma joined VP's tunnel on me. Gamma and VP aren't gonna be scum together, like if anything. 406 Gamma goes "How is VP sensible?!?!" lol that's kinda funny though... made the switch to team!VP... after early comments like this... but as for my read here? idk, I don't really care to go at it with people tunneling me, and when that's 90% of your "content" like, I'm not gonna piece together the few non tunneling me things for a read I'm semi confident in. If Gamma wants to start doing stuff like finding maf, I'll reevaluate, but for now? same boat as VP in terms of how I'm reading them, unless they want to... not tunnel me? What an idea.

Malakittens - Scummy

. All yall are like "MALA POSTED!!! SHE'S TOWN!! but like.. she HAD to post to avoid immediate elimination. And then like, she just goes "yeah andante maf. this line sucks" like... 1 post of mine... and like, I definitely didn't mean it how she was saying it, I just don't think she's town. Feels like she's trying to find some "valid reason" to TR me

hutmeil - Scum lean

. feels scared to make actual reads, and I'm not sure what exactly it is, but they feel very cautious about what they say, and are all like "I must ISO X" then they'll say something, that's basically already been repeated in thread by someone. So I do have concern here. Either town just unable to get into the game? Or probably scum, and I'm leaning scum.

fireisredsir - Null

. I thought 491 was pretty good "the general lack of wagons and voting in this game is kinda weird actually" like yeah... we haven't has an actual wagon that wasn't me or mala, and mala's was just "you didn't post, you're maf" like, no wagons are taking off... weird vibe for sure, I'm not too sure what my read is here, I don't see all the scumminess "everyone" seems to see though, like, this ISO doesn't seem that bad? fire is just chilling at null for me for now, some of these recent posts, I'm just like "I don't see that scumminess you do I guess?"

Something_Smart - Town lean

. 486 doesn't really feel like something scum would say, AYYY 541 and 552 are "defending" me I want to say the "Ari conflict" thing around 630 is town indicative, like, calling out Ari saying something was productive.. I want to say SS is the only person I've seen just go "Ari isn't doing anything" like, I even just looked up her ISO, she's really not. Now yes, I haven't done a whole lot either, but no one has actually called me on that yet, but.. my posts have all been relevent to the game itself, like, SS going "not productive" is definitely a good look. and that post about Mala's worrying readslist... yeah but then those reads flip and I become a SR for 1 post.. but uhh yeah in terms of my SS read, I think he's on track for being town here, I'm not super confident in that, but based on what I'm working with here, calling him a town lean feels fine.

implosion - Town Lean

. This one might seem shocking, but I liked 973, like, that voiced exactly my thoughts here. Like, we NEED the meaningful conflicts... and they've just all been pointed at me!! like, are people not realizing that? Like, I don't think scum just flat out says "there have been very few meaningful conflicts in which people have become embroiled. At least very few not involving Andante I guess" Like, I think scum would just want the pressure to just stay on me. I'm not 100% sold on implosion town for the moment, but that line, I read it and went like "might be town"

PenguinPower - Scum lean

. I liked the gif list, and I could definitely see what your reads were, and like, it showed you've been following along, like, I mostly agreed witht hem at the time. lol idk how you got so many gifs so fast. but good job!! Overall I just want to say town though, like, nothing seems that bad. but like, the 1 penguin "game" I read, you were town and did a lot more voting.. and the fact implosion called that out too has me thinking possibly not town. It's another low confidence read, but like, if I'm looking at a game, where town you was just voting a LOT, and this game, where you're not really voting.. this is probably that thing where scum are conscious of like every action they make, and like in the town game you had lines where like you were giving good thoughts, and actively questioning people's reads. That game... was Open 836, sure it was only part of a game, but like, you're significantly townier there than here.

Vulture - Town Lean

. I don't think Vulture has been that bad, I like 868 like "who ACTUALLY TRs Andante" like, sure I'm well aware I haven't been acting super towny this game, that's what happens when I'm being tunneled, but like, I like actually question it, like "why again are we TRing andante? she's not giving reads, and that's usually how she is as scum" OH 901 I AGREE WITH SO MUCH yes!!! hut isn't engaging with the game, and like, instead of sending pressure in hut's direction, people were just like "MALA MAF FOR NOT TALKING!!!" this is definitely my least confident town lean here. I mean, starting this I was like, you slipped down to null, but I think your recent posts have been pretty dang good.


I would probably be down to yeet, hut, GB-if he just wants to keep doing nothing, and Mala-as long as she refuses to answer me.

That's about where I'm at right now.