Open 860 | Elected Decisions | Postgame

[PenguinPower]

[PenguinPower]

Either test me like a human or gtfo

mmmm....this is a bit of an overreaction.

[PenguinPower]

they were very clearly referring to your posts and not you specifically with "this"

[PenguinPower]

honestly not sure what to make of this

[PenguinPower]

We have THREE votes to make here, not just two. Though the rules do seem to indicate we CAN combine the divulge/depart vote as some have been doing, I think that's a bad idea and we should take things separately, otherwise someone is going to accidentally hammer something and we're all confused and also dead

? - what's the third vote....divulge/depart, nominate for PR....and?

[PenguinPower]

We have THREE votes to make here, not just two. Though the rules do seem to indicate we CAN combine the divulge/depart vote as some have been doing, I think that's a bad idea and we should take things separately, otherwise someone is going to accidentally hammer something and we're all confused and also dead

? - what's the third vote....divulge/depart, nominate for PR....and?

1. Divulgence or Departure
2. Who is getting Divulged or Departed
3. Who gets the PR

ah - you're separating the nominee from divulge/depart

[PenguinPower]

fair enough - probably best to break it up though divulge is probably the best way to go today

[PenguinPower]

It's not explicitly stated but I guess that's one way to do it although locking into a divulge course and then someone gets scummy, do we revote?

no - we make them the target of the divulge. either they're cleared or we depart them the next day.

[PenguinPower]

[PenguinPower]

?????

that's my standard page top steal

[PenguinPower]

[PenguinPower]

I will agree Fun Times is town...verdict is out on the other two.

[PenguinPower]

So - dilvulge is at hammer stage. My vote is there in spirit atm.

[PenguinPower]

[PenguinPower]

Enchant

Agree with this.

[PenguinPower]

I can't read Enchant at all (i know i know...look who's talking)...and I don't see how a correcting someone is town indicative.

[PenguinPower]

mmm...ok, i buy it

[PenguinPower]

i mean - yeah i buy that that's your thought process - otherwise i wouldn't have said it.

you can see my iso to see where my reads are at atm

[PenguinPower]

i mean - yeah i buy that that's your thought process - otherwise i wouldn't have said it.

you can see my iso to see where my reads are at atm

I can't read Enchant at all (i know i know...look who's talking)...and I don't see how a correcting someone is town indicative.

I will agree Fun Times is town...verdict is out on the other two.

Ah yes, super helpful!! Thank you Penguin!! I was kinda wanting to see if you had reads on like anyone else, cause you saying Fun Times is town doesn't do anything for me, I know we're town.

-Andante

yw

[PenguinPower]

Yeah what the fuck am I reading here

three people who think fun times is town, two who think galron is town, and one who thinks bella is town.

[PenguinPower]

Yeah what the fuck am I reading here

three people who think fun times is town, two who think galron is town, and one who thinks bella is town.

It looked like parroting to me.

penguins don't parrot - and usually parrots say the same thing, not different things.

[PenguinPower]

So - dilvulge is at hammer stage. My vote is there in spirit atm.

It's at -2

Day 1 Count II

Divulgence

(-3) - Taly, Radical Rat, Galron, Roden

Departure

(-5) - Frogsterking, Greeting

Not Voting

- Bellaphant, Enchant, Fun Times, KittyTacky, PenguinPower, RCEnigma

---

Frogsterking (-6) - Taly
Galron (-6) - Galron
Radical Rat (-6) - Roden
Roden (-6) - Frogsterking

Not Voting

- Bellaphant, Enchant, Fun Times, Greeting, KittyTacky, PenguinPower, RCEnigma, Radical Rat

---

Taly (-5) - Taly, KittyTacky
Enchant (-6) - Frogsterking
Greeting (-6) - Greeting

Not Voting

- Bellaphant, Enchant, Fun Times, Galron, PenguinPower, RCEnigma, Radical Rat, Roden

Notes

• The combined mod ISO is here.
  
• With 12 remaining, it takes 7 to form a majority.

The

Day

concludes in (expired on 2022-07-26 15:56:07).

UNVOTE:

VOTE: divulge

Well, this game finally picked up.

I think I’m going to do this:

VOTE: Divulgance

Haven’t nailed in the heal yet but rn leaning to RR or Enchant - probably RR. Frog is another possibility.

I want to hear more from Taly, so I can get a better read on them. @Roden, there is nothing remotely scummy about anything RR has posted.

@RCE, totally do not get your sr on Penguin.

I have my eye on Kitty since he fooled me in Schadd’s game.

~Nancy

?

[PenguinPower]

oh - you were on it already....

thanks for the confusing action there...

[PenguinPower]

Happy to vote divulge now?

why - you wanna be n_m?

[PenguinPower]

VOTE: kittytacky

HEAL: Fun Times

[PenguinPower]

Can I hammer?

Yeah hammer that.

Seems you have been given permission.

[PenguinPower]

HEAL: kitty
VOTE: Divulge

This is good.

HEAL: kitty
VOTE: Divulge

[PenguinPower]

Any volunteers to have their alignment flipped?

I'd like to see greeting atm.

[PenguinPower]

Why do people still want to vote Divulge? We're on odds.

Counterpoint: Why not?

[PenguinPower]

I'm fine with divulging again but I'm not okay with wasting the pr power on Kitty. I FoS all who are in support of Healing Kitty. This is a very convenient choice for scum as they will be able to both kill our IC and our TPR at the same time.

mmm...you realize that we either gain another IC or out scum though right?

[PenguinPower]

like - that's the safest plan of action vs. potentially giving scum a PR and allowing them to kill our IC.

[PenguinPower]

perhaps we divulge frog then

[PenguinPower]

Worst case scenario is that none of us know how to play mafia and we get down to 3v3 where We have to hope that whoever gets pr that night is both town, rolls bp/rb/jk/vig and successfully hits scum to save the day. Then repeat down till game end or till pr Rands a game ending role.

absent the fact that i don't know how to play mafia - someone is going to need to explain to me why we shouldn't do the rotation of "divulge->town?->yes->heal"/"divulge->town?->no>yeet."

[PenguinPower]

Should we depart once or devulge twice? That's real question.

Sell me on depart.

[PenguinPower]

like - that's the safest plan of action vs. potentially giving scum a PR and allowing them to kill our IC.

perhaps we divulge frog then

VOTE: penguinpower

Wow…basic omgus. Unimpressive.

Perhaps you expound upon your reasoning? Too much to ask?

[PenguinPower]

If you're town, don't heal me. Unvote and heal someone else.

Explain please.

[PenguinPower]

Any volunteers to have their alignment flipped?

I'd like to see greeting atm.

Hi! How can I help you?

Shush. I’ve moved on.

[PenguinPower]

If I get a PR, then scum can kill both effectively an IC and another PR at once. If someone else does, scum has to choose between killing the IC and the PR.

But, we prevent scum from getting the PR and we either gain a new IC or out scum.

[PenguinPower]

If I get a PR, then scum can kill both effectively an IC and another PR at once. If someone else does, scum has to choose between killing the IC and the PR.

But, we prevent scum from getting the PR

Wrong approach.

Only really harmful PRs are Vengeful and Vigilante. Vengeful requires mafia to being elimed to be useful (which still kinda bad). Vigilante can be used for quickmajority, otherwise reguires shoting someone scummy/outing as mafia. They can as well die more early for surviving.

Are not giving PRs to mafia IS YOUR ONLY reasoning? Cuz it suck

No, you suck?

• Option 1: Give confirmed town a PR and either get another confirmed town or confirmed scum. Scum is very likely going to kill confirmed town with PR, and we go into the next day with a confirmed scum or confirmed town.
  • 1(a): Confirmed Town: We have two confirmed town, one with a PR. Scum shoots confirmed town with PR.
    
    1 confirmed Town; No PR
    
    
  • 1(b): Confirmed Scum: We have one confirmed town with a PR. Scum shoots there.
    
    1 confirmed scum
• Option 2: Give town?scum? a PR and either get another confirmed town or confirmed scum.
  • 2(a): Town PR/Confirmed Town: We have two confirmed town and town gets a PR. Scum probably shoots the PR, but who knows? We enter tomorrow with probably two strong town regardless.
    
    2 confirmed town; No PR
    
    
  • 2(b): Town PR/Confirmed Scum: We have one confirmed town and our yeet for tomorrow. Scum probably shoots the PR, but who knows? We enter tomorrow with one confirmed town and our yeet.
    
    1 confirmed Town/1 confirmed Scum
    
    
  • 2(c): Scum PR/Confirmed Town: We have two confirmed town and scum gets a PR. Scum shoots the stronger of the confirmed town. We enter tomorrow with one confimed town and who knows what happens as a result of the PR....
    
    1 confirmed Town/Scum PR
    
    
  • 2(d): Scum PR/Confirmed Scum: We have one confirmed town and our yeet for tomorrow. Scum probably shoots the confirmed town? We enter tomorrow with no confirmed town and our yeet and who knows what happens as a result of the PR...
    
    1 confirmed scum/Scum PR

Option 2 has a 50% chance of ending up where we are at by using Option 1 BUT scum also gets a PR. Sure, there's a 50% chance of a better outcome...

You still suck, but I'm more open to option 2 than I was.

[PenguinPower]

Stlll an unknown vs. a known

[PenguinPower]

Stlll an unknown vs. a known

Yes but if the unknown has a higher probability of being town than scum, it's more than a 50% probability of a better outcome. So give the PR to the second-towniest person. The benefits outweigh the risks.

And honestly I think your constant illogical pushing for this, combined with personal attacks, is scummy.

i literally laid out all of the options and said i was more open to healing someone else than I was before but sure, i'm the illogical one who isn't reading the game

[PenguinPower]

well that escalated quickly

[PenguinPower]

What’s it like living in a world where any of what you said is true?

Are you capable of reading and comprehending?

[PenguinPower]

What’s it like living in a world where any of what you said is true?

It makes me want to play 1v1 games instead of team games.

Perhaps come back to reality and play team games then.

[PenguinPower]

I'm thinking penguin, enchant are both town

Why am I town?

[PenguinPower]

What’s it like living in a world where any of what you said is true?

It makes me want to play 1v1 games instead of team games.

Perhaps come back to reality and play team games then.

I'm drawing a hard line with the TPR vote: Healing Kitty makes Town more likely to lose the game. End of calculation. If you've come to any other conclusion then you made a mistake in your calculation (if you aren't straight up lying about your calculation in the first place.) I'm willing to compromise on divulging, the divulge target and the unconfirmed player we heal, what I'm not willing to go along with are plans that can be demonstrated to be objectively bad for Town.

Demonstrate the objectivity for me then. I haven’t tried to convince anyone it’s a good idea (as you suggested), but I have said I think it is a good idea and asked others to say why not. Outside of Kitty giving a brief reason, I’ve been met with nothing but “it’s obvious” or “it’s demonstrated” when it hasn’t been. I outlined the options fmpov and even said that once I did so not healing kitty became a better option than I originally thought (which you ignored btw).

So instead of throwing insults and inaccuracies, maybe do what no one else seems to be capable of/has the desire to do and explain it.

[PenguinPower]

How was you shading my slit not intentional? You voted me. That seems pretty intentional.

Tbh - you’re still voting me despite what you’ve said so that feels pretty disingenuous.

[PenguinPower]

…slot.

[PenguinPower]

Stlll an unknown vs. a known

Yes but if the unknown has a higher probability of being town than scum, it's more than a 50% probability of a better outcome. So give the PR to the second-towniest person. The benefits outweigh the risks.

And honestly I think your constant illogical pushing for this, combined with personal attacks, is scummy.

Thank you. I wish mafia was a simple probability game but at least you tried the hardest.

[PenguinPower]

Or…actually tried.

[PenguinPower]

Fair enough. Sorry for missing that.

[PenguinPower]

Stlll an unknown vs. a known

Yes but if the unknown has a higher probability of being town than scum, it's more than a 50% probability of a better outcome. So give the PR to the second-towniest person. The benefits outweigh the risks.

And honestly I think your constant illogical pushing for this, combined with personal attacks, is scummy.

Thank you. I wish mafia was a simple probability game but at least you tried the hardest.

In this case this decision is a probability game,

as your own analysis tried to show

.

1. I was laying out all of the options...if I was going off pure porobability I would have fully convinced myself and recanted.
2. If we were playing in a vaccum, then yeah, let's go purely off probability. But, and I cannot be more clear about this...this is a social deduction game where MANIPULATION of others is paramount. So sure, there's a 70% chance to hit town with a PR in a vaccum, but that "second towniest person" may very well be scum because THEY ARE GOOD AT MANIPULATING OTHERS.

Remember how we all thought you were superscummy?

[PenguinPower]

ugh i want to edit vacuum

[PenguinPower]

puppies and unicorns

[PenguinPower]

but I read somewhat of a self-profiling intention.

Huh?

Who?

How?

Why?

wut?

[PenguinPower]

Stlll an unknown vs. a known

Yes but if the unknown has a higher probability of being town than scum, it's more than a 50% probability of a better outcome. So give the PR to the second-towniest person. The benefits outweigh the risks.

And honestly I think your constant illogical pushing for this, combined with personal attacks, is scummy.

Thank you. I wish mafia was a simple probability game but at least you tried the hardest.

In this case this decision is a probability game,

as your own analysis tried to show

.

1. I was laying out all of the options...if I was going off pure porobability I would have fully convinced myself and recanted.
2. If we were playing in a vaccum, then yeah, let's go purely off probability. But, and I cannot be more clear about this...this is a social deduction game where MANIPULATION of others is paramount. So sure, there's a 70% chance to hit town with a PR in a vaccum, but that "second towniest person" may very well be scum because THEY ARE GOOD AT MANIPULATING OTHERS.

Remember how we all thought you were superscummy?

Bruh.

Scum generally isn't that good at manipulating people as to make the risk of someone who seems very townie being scum relevant.

Now you're ignoring probability and instead do this wishy-washy "but what if the second-towniest person is scum" spiel.

Town on PP.

HEAL: Enchant sheeping Frogster.

this....this has been my stance the whole time and why i didn't just go "enchant you're a genius" when i layed out all of my options...

whatever, i'm done discussing this point and don't really give a fuck anymore

HEAL: enchant

[PenguinPower]

VOTE: greeting

@mod: I am weekend v/la...every weekend

[PenguinPower]

VOTE: Depart
VOTE: Greeting[/quote]

[PenguinPower]

Why Enchant? I thought PRs were perpetual.

I want to turn Enchant into a Mafia hunting supersoldier

[PenguinPower]

i don't really feel like dealing with kitty again so i'll withold until they agree

[PenguinPower]

HEAL: kitty

[PenguinPower]

HEAL: no one

[PenguinPower]

I don't understand the super-soldier thing. Do you mean, Rad, that Enchant would get two PRs under your plan or do you want to just possibly change the nature of the PR? I don't think the former is possible. Not sure about the latter.

why wouldn't the former be possible - the rules explicitly say multitasking is enabled by default

[PenguinPower]

I’ve come down with Covid so my weekend vla may extend a bit, but I’ll try to be here tomorrow.

[PenguinPower]

VOTE: divulge

[PenguinPower]

Can we leave nm for a bit? It's one of my very niche skills - I've never scum read him when he's been town.

I'm town

I believe you.

[PenguinPower]

I'm probably only going to consider me or Roden for a pr today. I can't read pp and am only slightly confident on my read of rr.

If Roden is in your 50/50 scum pool why would you consider giving Roden a PR?

[PenguinPower]

I don't really see RCE scum.

So what

do

you want to do?

[PenguinPower]

Not_Mafia is hard to read, I don't think his predecessor was.

[PenguinPower]

Thanks for remembering me.

[PenguinPower]

very helpful

[PenguinPower]

VOTE: Vivax

[PenguinPower]

who we healing, kitty?

[PenguinPower]

Are we following kitty or making super kitty?

I’m waiting for kitty.

[PenguinPower]

Hi.

[PenguinPower]

find it interesting that scum decided to yeet vivax over the new PR or the cleared PR.

[PenguinPower]

find it interesting that scum decided to yeet vivax over the new PR or the cleared PR.

Really? It's pretty much exactly what I expected to happen

why's that?

[PenguinPower]

mmm...makes sense

[PenguinPower]

I do think it's time we start departing instead of divulging, but we shouldn't be rushing into anything.

we're on evens rn, why would we not want to divulge?

[PenguinPower]

Roden isn't clear - but even assuming scum!Roden, the logic checks out on why not Kitty.

Unless you're thinking that's a perspective slip.

[PenguinPower]

sorry - are we dilvulging or departing?

[PenguinPower]

someone want to explain why we're departing instead of divulging...i've asked twice now and keep getting ignored.

[PenguinPower]

we're currently at evens is why i'm asking

[PenguinPower]

i mean - it doesn't make sense to me to stay on evens regardless.

[PenguinPower]

ok then

[PenguinPower]

HEAL: galron

[PenguinPower]

why am i not surprised...

[PenguinPower]

Gg mafia team.

I have some thoughts but I’ll just keep them to myself since they are likely not productive.

[PenguinPower]

Wish you had been in it from the start.