Mini Normal 2280 | Music Hits of 2015-2019 | GAME OVER

[NJAC]

VOTE: Kitty

[NJAC]

Oh it's finally up.

I'm a kitty. Meow.

And where is your vote?

[NJAC]

I don’t know if it’s all that great. What if you are town reading scum, don’t you risk spreading that misconception to others? What if scum uses it as a way to plant town seeds on their members?

You are not a newbie, as far as I can tell, why do you keep asking questions about typical mechanics of the game?

[NJAC]

How so?

[NJAC]

LOL, okay, so what's your plan to solve this game?

[NJAC]

I don’t really have one. I’m going to try and not get miseliminated. That’s really my only goal. Although I know that can’t win the game by itself, it’s my goal for the first couple days, at which point I hope to have gotten some idea who is scum er not.

Yeah, if you're town that alone won't help.

Have you tried several strategies to scum hunt before and failed?

[NJAC]

I don’t know if it’s all that great. What if you are town reading scum, don’t you risk spreading that misconception to others? What if scum uses it as a way to plant town seeds on their members?

You are not a newbie, as far as I can tell, why do you keep asking questions about typical mechanics of the game?

You choose to enter the thread saying this?
Have anything else to add?
Rather then trying to pick on Porkens like that and not even in a good way.

I entered the thread before you, in case you didn't notice. I'm already voting, btw.

What's wrong with my approach to Porkens?

[NJAC]

How so?

LOL, okay, so what's your plan to solve this game?

I REALLY don’t like this.

VOTE: NJAC

Care to explain?

[NJAC]

I don’t really have one. I’m going to try and not get miseliminated. That’s really my only goal. Although I know that can’t win the game by itself, it’s my goal for the first couple days, at which point I hope to have gotten some idea who is scum er not.

Yeah, if you're town that alone won't help.

Have you tried several strategies to scum hunt before and failed?

Why does this better?
They can just play and do there best.
You are pushing stuff that isn’t AI your just talking about someone’s capabilities and how they play the game.

I'm trying to understand what kind of player Porkens is and what to expect from them.

[NJAC]

OH
You changed your profile picture.

What are you talking about? I have never changed my profile picture.

[NJAC]

Alright.
My bad, just thought you came into the thread, read over stuff and starting going after someone I’m not a great way.
But it wasn’t your first post so it’s not taken the same way.

Please elaborate. Why exactly wasn't it a great way? What exactly changes now that you notice it's not my first post?

[NJAC]

Why is my vote irrelevant? Just because you said you don't vote early, it doesn't mean other players cannot make something useful with our votes.

[NJAC]

Exactly what I was getting at Cres.
NJAC asks about stuff that is basically NAI rather it be play or some sort of “newbie” or “mechanical” talk.
And that’s what I was trying to say “it doesn’t bring us anywhere” cause it’s NAI the stuff they ask.

Okay. You got my attention. Where were you bringing us before I started asking Porkens?

[NJAC]

Why is my vote irrelevant? Just because you said you don't vote early, it doesn't mean other players cannot make something useful with our votes.

If the vote actually mattered you'd be explaining why it mattered in this post.

It matters. I'm waiting for Kitty to show up.

[NJAC]

It matters. I'm waiting for Kitty to show up.

I'm here.

Yes, I can see that. In the last game we played you said you use to do better when players are active and there's enough content. Do you think this is the case? Is there enough content and people are being active enough in this game for you to try to solve the game?

[NJAC]

VOTE: Kitty

How

is

a vote in 6 a relevant vote? I'll wait for Kitty's response to ask my next question.

I want him to feel some pressure. It's like an implicit message to him that I'm going to watch his play closely.

What's your next question?

[NJAC]

Read-list : 01

Slight Townleans⇨

Wayward

: meta + vibe

NJAC

: meta + I can understand what they're coming from about

Porkens

.

Malcolm

: Get town vibes from 41 & 78.

Slight Scumleans⇨

Porkens

: Reason stated in 140.

Professor

: Their aggressive approach towards

NJAC

for going after

Porkens

doesn’t sit well with me. It almost seems like (to me) they

know

Porkens

is town

somehow. Also they kept trying to dismiss

NJAC

's approach towards

Porkens

by saying it’s completely NAI stuff (which isn’t, stated in 140 & 143) +

buddying attempt

with

Crescent

(142).
While writing this, I find

Professor

is more scummier than

Porkens

.

VOTE: Professor

Shiidaji

: (mostly based on vibe) got ping from 11 & 30 + don't understand their

Crescent

townread (74 ➤ where they mentioned 8 is a town response from

Crescent

but to me it’s a NAI stuff).

Rests are null for now.

I don't necessarily agree with your read on Porkens, but I think I agree with your read on Professor, I felt the same, like he knows Porkens is town and saw an opportunity to make a fake case on me. His posts were not intended to try to determine my alignment but to throw a lot of shade on me and discredit me.

[NJAC]

You realize the dudes discussion is going nowhere right?
There was better things they could have said/asked Porkens.

I think your just jealous I used your color in that one post

What better things could have been said/asked to Porkens at that moment?

[NJAC]

Malcolm could be a wolf I suppose here.

Please explain this in detail, I feel Malcolm could actually be town.

[NJAC]

VOTE: Kitty

How

is

a vote in 6 a relevant vote? I'll wait for Kitty's response to ask my next question.

I want him to feel some pressure. It's like an implicit message to him that I'm going to watch his play closely.

What's your next question?

From their current posts what is your thoughts?

I'm still waiting to see more from him to form a proper read.

[NJAC]

@Wayward: 162 was addressed to you. Please answer it.

[NJAC]

VOTE: Kitty

How

is

a vote in 6 a relevant vote? I'll wait for Kitty's response to ask my next question.

I want him to feel some pressure. It's like an implicit message to him that I'm going to watch his play closely.

What's your next question?

From their current posts what is your thoughts?

I'm still waiting to see more from him to form a proper read.

I feel like Kitty in 2277... At least was a little more proactive than this. There hasn't been a single post worth anything from them all game.

A big block of null that needs to do something.

Agree. My recommendation is not to allow Kitty to sit in the fence. I caught scum!kitty in Newbie 2100 because of his lack of contribution and lack of interest in solving the game. He said he was better when other players are active so I'm waiting to see him in action.

[NJAC]

If Professor is town, he's a really bad townie.

[NJAC]

@Professor: do you plan to answer the questions addressed to you?

121, 256 and 257 were addressed to you.

[NJAC]

Why do I need to respond to 257?
I’ll have to take a look back to give you examples to answer your question in 121 but I’m lazy and will probably do it later zzzz
As for 256 “threadstate” and kinda have a vibe read on them that doesn’t mean much but think it can mean they can be a wolf.

I think you can do better than this.

In 257 you said Malcolm could be scum, but you don't explain why, and that's exactly what I want to know because I'm interested in understanding what in the post you quoted looks scummy in your eyes.

121 is important because you said my questions to Porkens don't bring us anywhere, so I want to know what exactly were you doing before to bring us somewhere. So don't be lazy and answer the question.

With regards to 256 (not sure if you mixed up 256 and 257) I want to know what was a better question to Porkens according to you.

[NJAC]

Yeah, Salsa can go to my town list.

I'm having a hard time getting a proper read on Professor, but I'm not sure if his erratic behavior is coming from scum.

I think Kitty is at least trying, compared to Newbie 2100, so I feel I can unvote him for now.

I need to reread, meanwhile I'm just going to sheep Salsa:

VOTE: Galron

[NJAC]

In case it's not clear I think Salsa is town now

Galron should really be voting Drapion right now

LEt's see where it goes. I get the impression Drapion is a gunslinger so I'll give some room.

What did you mean here with "gunslinger" and why did you say that?

[NJAC]

Yeah, Salsa can go to my town list.

I'm having a hard time getting a proper read on Professor, but I'm not sure if his erratic behavior is coming from scum.

I think Kitty is at least trying, compared to Newbie 2100, so I feel I can unvote him for now.

I need to reread, meanwhile I'm just going to sheep Salsa:

VOTE: Galron

Why?
What makes you change your read on me?

As I said I'm not sure if your erratic behavior is coming from scum. And I can see a scenario in which you are town and scum are joining your wagon for an easy mislim.

So I'm leaning to think you're dumb but probably not scum.

[NJAC]

His play in this game kind of remind me his play in Newbie 2100. But I haven't seen anything particularly alignment indicative besides that. I'd say null for now.

[NJAC]

So I'm leaning to think you're dumb

Do not use this kind of language.

General rules:

9. Please remember, at all times, that this is a game that is supposed provide an enjoyable experience for all. Mafia can get heated. Players will argue. This is all part of the mafia experience. However, you should be considerate of the feelings of others while posting and refrain from any actions that could turn this game into a hostile environment for anyone.

9c. Do not criticize a player’s character or characteristics. Criticize their behavior and, most preferably, in-game behavior instead. Using meta on other players is allowed.

My apologies. I'm still adapting my language to the current meta and new rules of the site.

[NJAC]

@geraintm:
Do you think that what you said in 365 could apply to ProfessorDrapion's claim?

[NJAC]

If anyone has any questions aimed at me, ask them.

What's your opinion on what I said that ProfessorDrapion's erratic behavior might not come from scum?

[NJAC]

His play in this game kind of remind me his play in Newbie 2100. But I haven't seen anything particularly alignment indicative besides that. I'd say null for now.

You don’t think he was “joining my wagon for an easy ml”?

Yeah, maybe, assuming you're town that's plausible.

[NJAC]

@geraintm:
Do you think that what you said in 365 could apply to ProfessorDrapion's claim?

I had to go back and find thr claim, I hadn't noticed it.


Note for self" professor has claimed some odd roll linked to Doc

But yeah....does have the feels of "clever as a bag of hammers scum claim"

So you're saying that you're not focused enough on the game to notice his claim?

What's your current read on Professor?

[NJAC]

@geraintm:
Do you think that what you said in 365 could apply to ProfessorDrapion's claim?

I had to go back and find thr claim, I hadn't noticed it.


Note for self" professor has claimed some odd roll linked to Doc

But yeah....does have the feels of "clever as a bag of hammers scum claim"

So you're saying that you're not focused enough on the game to notice his claim?

What's your current read on Professor?

pretty much. i have a tendency when catching up overnight to skip most of the posts and look for my name. if others had made abigger deal of it at the time i woul dhave been more likely to notice

Okay. Now please answer my second question.

[NJAC]

I'm also interested in who is Crescent going to vote, btw.

[NJAC]

@geraintm I think your case on Malcolm is going nowhere, who else are you considering to vote?

[NJAC]

We're running out of time. Those not voting should vote.

And what's with that nonsense of no elimination on D1? When did the typical consensus of how bad for town is not eliminating on D1 change?

[NJAC]

@Galron: 314 was addressed to you. Please answer.

[NJAC]

I think Galron's wagon is all Town.

Mine, ehh.

Malcolm's vote maybe scum.

Do you think scum are not voting?

[NJAC]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=83299&start=325

As a rep in it doesn't do much for early game analysis but I'm going to archive this for later on. Thanks!

@Galron: what insights did you get from that game about scum!Porkens' play?

[NJAC]

OK, but what in his ISO makes you feel Town him is a possibility? Serious question.

The way he entered the game and the way he's gone about "arguing" you suggests awful town to me more than it suggests scum, but I don't strongly read him in any particular direction (I also think he missed the mark with pointing out what in your ISO looked bad), and I would not seriously oppose voting him as he hasn't actually sold me he's an asset even if he is town.

Like, for example, NM was referenced earlier in this game. I would vote NM in a second if I got stuck in a game with him in a game, because I think he's anti-town no matter what the alignment of his role says.

I gotta get to Synagogue though.

I’m not anti town although I’m aware I’m not being super aggressive like I can be.
I gave my solve though so take it as you will.

You keep seeing things that aren't there. That post of Crescent was clearly not about you. The main problem I have with this is that I'm leaning to think you're town, but your play is lazy, and if you're truly town it would be nice if you double read.

Anyway. I quote this post because you said you can be super aggressive, and I think this game might benefit from that, so I would like to see your aggressive play.

[NJAC]

And for the record it has all the makings of scum getting pressure and then lurking to try to wait it out. Galron has had 3 votes for about 50 hours. In this span, he has just 8 posts. There's been some very light shade at Malcolm, and... Really nothing else. He has made zero attempt to do anything towards the train on him, just some "pst pst hey look at Malcolm" followed by nothing.

i would have expected more of an effort from their partners if they were scum to get another wagon going. i dont think they are going to flip red

Gun to your head who do you think is scum in Galron's wagon?

Also why do you talk in plural, do you think there are more than two scum?

[NJAC]

I think Crescent's case on Gera is solid. Their contradictions here do not make sense as town. Moving my vote before going to sleep.

VOTE: Geraintm

That’s a scummy fucking vote.

Why?

And what's so special about Gera's first post that makes him town?

[NJAC]

VOTE: geraintm

This is worth pursuing.

[NJAC]

That's E-2, BTW

[NJAC]

Btw,

@Malcolm

, will you come back to the thread before the finishing time?

@NJAC

.... are you here?

Frustrating matter is that I can see town!

geraintm

is also doing these things as scum!

geraintm

.... but I don't necessarily agree upon scum-flip of

geraintm

will clear

Professor

&

Porkens

but it will clear

Malcolm

&

Crescent

ig. I don't mind voting them if I have to avoid no-elimination today, but still prefer

Wayward

or

Galron

over them.

And

wayward

's recent posts are like.... I don't know if they're pretending or really are town....

@Shiidaji

,

@NJAC

.... help me out here

I think Wayward's posts at E-1 looked town. Still catching up, lot of activity during the night.

[NJAC]

@NJAC Who's scum?

Still working on it. It would be easier if there weren't so many anti town players.

[NJAC]

Wayward Son (5): Porkens, ProfessorDrapion, Galron, Salsabil Faria, Shiidaji (E-1)
geraintm (3): Wayward Son, Crescent, NJAC
Galron (1): KittyTacky
MalcolmTucker (1): geraintm
Porkens (1): MalcolmTucker

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to eliminate.

Day 1 ends in: 0 days, 10 hours, 8 minutes.

Geraintm needs to ditch the vanity wagon. Kitty too.

Wayward is not scummy to me. Neither is gera. I refuse to vote someone who I don't think is scummy.

What's exactly your case on Galron?

[NJAC]

@Wayward: You should full claim at this point.

[NJAC]

I know there's some meta about geraintm, but he could easily be scum here. I'd prefer limming him over Wayward to be honest.

[NJAC]

I'm in the same position as Malcolm.

If necessary will hammer.

[NJAC]

VOTE: geraintm

I expect to see you stop being anti town from now on, btw.

[NJAC]

VOTE: geraintm

I expect to see you stop being anti town from now on, btw.

i am not sure i follow this post.
you clearly think i am scum
you also think i am going to more pro town from now on?
surely that just means you expect me to fake it better from now on? because as scum i cannot ever actually...be pro town?

I think you are scum. Am I sure you are scum? Nope. So, if you happen to be town, I expect you to be pro town.

Also if you're indeed scum, then yes, fake it if you want.

[NJAC]

@Geraintm: you ignored my 651, please answer.

[NJAC]

Dude TF is NJAC’s post “oh do you think there isn’t 1 wolf in an 11 player game”
Dude if there was 1 wolf in an 11 player game I’d feel bad for the 1 wolf.

VOTE: NJAC

What the eff are you talking about? Nobody is suggesting that there's only 1 scum in this game.

If you're not faking this then, with all due respect, I strongly suggest you to improve your reading comprehension.

[NJAC]

looking at the wagons from day 1, i can only see the 2 main ones on Galron and Wayward Son. There was a minor one later on on me that had 3 people on it - 2 of whom are dead and the other was NJAC

Galron (4): Salsabil Faria, NJAC, Shiidaji, MalcolmTucker
that was Galron's
Wayward Son (5): Porkens, ProfessorDrapion, Galron, Shiidaji, Salsabil Faria, MalcolmTucker (Hammer)
that was the hammer

All 4 on Galron either ended up on Watward Son - Town, or me - Also Town (yes yes, i knwo you lot don't know that but i do).

Those 4 would be where i would suggest there is a much higher chance of there being scum than not.

Why? Do you think Galron is town? If so why?

[NJAC]

My POE is

{

Professor

,

Porkens

,

Shiidaji

,

Galron

,

geraintm

}

(in no particular order) by creating the town-block including

{

NJAC

,

Malcolm

,

Kitty

}

Agree. Not sure about Kitty, though.

Why is Shidaji in your PoE?

[NJAC]

I strongly believe ger is town.

I think Crescent's case on Gera is solid. Their contradictions here do not make sense as town. Moving my vote before going to sleep.

VOTE: Geraintm

That’s a scummy fucking vote.

What do people think of these posts? On the one hand they feel a bit too obvious for Porkens and Gera to be teammates. Scum would typically be more subtle. But from Porkens' game so far I'm not exactly sure subtlety is something they really do. The second post here feels like an overreaction; why does Porkens, as someone who admitted themselves struggled with reads, have such a strong townread and visceral reaction to a vote on a player who is notoriously difficult to read confidently in D1?

Yeah, I think I agree with you here. However I think you should ask this directly to Porkens.

@Porkens please answer this.

[NJAC]

My POE is

{

Professor

,

Porkens

,

Shiidaji

,

Galron

,

geraintm

}

(in no particular order) by creating the town-block including

{

NJAC

,

Malcolm

,

Kitty

}

#
you voted off a towie, you dont get to make town blocs

Your play style sucks!

LOL +1

[NJAC]

Yeah, I know but I'm not confirming anything.... when saw the flip, immediately 3 names came to mind who are in my town block atm, so the rests are in my POE.

Did

Crescent

townread

Shiidaji

?

Crescent didn't seem to have too many thoughts on Shii.

I need to read the ISOs again...
I was hoping to see

Professor

dead as per their claim tbh, but scum didn't kill a supposed PR but non-PR

Crescent

.... usually means they were caught scum or on the right track.

I was initially thinking something in those lines. However I'm now considering that if Professor is indeed town, it's not necessarily scum's biggest threat, considering a backup PR is basically a VT until the original PR dies. So Professor still being alive doesn't necessarily mean he's scum.

[NJAC]

I think whoever steered the wagon away from Galron is scum with Galron.
VOTE: Galron

Can you please summarize your case on Galron?

[NJAC]

I think whoever steered the wagon away from Galron is scum with Galron.
VOTE: Galron

Can you please summarize your case on Galron?

I'm sheeping Malcolm who sheeped Crescent.

The previous post sums up exactly why I'm not against voting Porkens. Barring a full-on town confirmation. players like him almost always get voted off eventually. It's a matter of when, not if.

But here's a fun fact: Galron really has arguably done even

less

than Porkens has, he just hasn't been as obvious about it. He has given exactly one reason to suspect Drapion (#179), said he's voting him or Malcolm is #384, and given exactly one reason to suspect Malcolm (#472). That's... Really it.

Porkers may be doing next to nothing, but his approach to Wayward, as much as I had to pull teeth to get him to actually elaborate on anything, is more than we've gotten out of Galron. Porkens is failing, but Galron feels like he's totally lurking from commitment.

I feel like we have circled around this train while discussing trains to oppose it, while most people seem to agree everyone voting him is town, while the player the train is on hasn't given us any reason to look away him. I have yet to see anything that resembles true, game-solving thought process, and he's the lowest poster in the entire game, who has done effectively nothing since September 13th.

IMO this makes sense, I played with town Galron and he's not this much of a contentless lurker.

I think Professor is town too, Galron just hid in the shadows while two townies were being run up.

BTW

@Mod the thread icon is still a moon and not a sun.

Okay, but that was like 26 pages ago, is there anything new to add to that case, maybe something specific?

I'm also a bit curious about why you say you are sheeping Malcolm, instead of sheeping Crescent directly, given that it was her case after all. Did you trust Malcolm more than Cres?

[NJAC]

I feel like I'm starting to tunnel Prof to the exclusion of everyone else.

Can you please state what was your case against Professor? I don't remember you voting him.

[NJAC]

@Galron: 314 and 535 were addressed to you. Please answer.

[NJAC]

I’m town and I think Galron is town so it’s kinda sad he thinks I’m wolf.

Why is Galron town?

[NJAC]

I strongly believe ger is town.

I think Crescent's case on Gera is solid. Their contradictions here do not make sense as town. Moving my vote before going to sleep.

VOTE: Geraintm

That’s a scummy fucking vote.

What do people think of these posts? On the one hand they feel a bit too obvious for Porkens and Gera to be teammates. Scum would typically be more subtle. But from Porkens' game so far I'm not exactly sure subtlety is something they really do. The second post here feels like an overreaction; why does Porkens, as someone who admitted themselves struggled with reads, have such a strong townread and visceral reaction to a vote on a player who is notoriously difficult to read confidently in D1?

First of all, “what do people think of these votes” is a sus way of bringing something up. But as for why that vote was scummy it was because it was just pure sheeping without admitting it.

But why were you so sure that geraintm is town?

[NJAC]

Okay. Professor, what was your claim yesterday? I can’t find it.

Any thoughts this turn? What do you make of my Ger/Kitty read? How does Wayward turning out to be town affect your read on the game?

I think ger is town based on his soft claim. Kitty I’m unsure on.

What softclaim?

[NJAC]

No order within groups:

Ger
Salsa
Professor

Njak
Malcomb

Gal
Kitty
Birdy

Ish

Who is Birdy and why do you scum read them?

[NJAC]

@Professor: please don't ignore my questions.

1003 was addressed to you.

[NJAC]

Same goes for @Galron l, btw.

[NJAC]

@Salsa, why exactly did you change your read on geraintm from scum to town?

[NJAC]

Okay, now that we are talking about softclaims, I didn't want to bring much attention to this, but I think it's better to clarify this soon: my main reason to unvote Galron on D1 was his softclaim.

@Professor. Was that softclaim your reason to ignore my question twice?

[NJAC]

Busy weekend, will be posting properly in a few hours.

[NJAC]

Meanwhile, for those asking the softclaim I was referring to is 680.

[NJAC]

@Porkens. Now that you know that geraintm didn't softclaim, what's your stance on him and Malcolm currently?

[NJAC]

To varying degrees I'd be happy with any of Ger, Galron or Porkens going today, roughly in that order. If the town consolidates on one of them I will change my vote if others are sticking to vanity wagons. That is not fence-sitting at all.

What happened with your case on Kitty? Did you change your mind on that slot?

Also, what do you think about Galron's softclaim?

[NJAC]

I don't wantnto vote porkens
I think I want to VOTE: malcolm

Can you please summarize your updated case on Malcolm?

[NJAC]

Vote: NJAC

Please state your case on me, as detailed as possible.

[NJAC]

@Galron: when you come back, there are several questions in my ISO addressed to you that you ignored. Please answer them.

Also, do you confirm that you softclaimed?

[NJAC]

We are running out of time again. I feel like voting Porkens or Kitty at this point.

Salsa and Malcolm seem town, leaning null on the rest.

Professor's game keeps being that of a bad townie, BTW.

I'm going to reread before deciding my vote.

[NJAC]

Ok let’s talk NJAC

Sure. I'm here. Do you have any questions for me?

[NJAC]

We are running out of time again. I feel like voting Porkens or Kitty at this point.

Salsa and Malcolm seem town, leaning null on the rest.

Professor's game keeps being that of a bad townie, BTW.

I'm going to reread before deciding my vote.

I'm not voting

Kitty

today but you're also town reading them? What changed?

I'm not town reading Kitty right now. He has been mainly in my null list most of the game, but now I'm suspecting that slot on D2 more than what I was suspecting him on D1.

[NJAC]

@Galron: 314 and 535 were addressed to you. Please answer.

In case it's not clear I think Salsa is town now

Galron should really be voting Drapion right now

LEt's see where it goes. I get the impression Drapion is a gunslinger so I'll give some room.

What did you mean here with "gunslinger" and why did you say that?

I don't know why this is importatn but Prof seems to accuse/vote and then examine it. Like shoot first and ask questions later.

If you found that scummy then why didn't you vote Drapion? Seems to me like you were shading Drapion, a wagon that was gaining momentum at the moment, but without compromising to vote.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=83299&start=325

As a rep in it doesn't do much for early game analysis but I'm going to archive this for later on. Thanks!

@Galron: what insights did you get from that game about scum!Porkens' play?

I didn't get anything because porkens was a rep in and their part was late game.

So, if that game was not useful, what's your current approach to determine Porkens' alignment? What's your current read on Porkens?

[NJAC]

To varying degrees I'd be happy with any of Ger, Galron or Porkens going today, roughly in that order. If the town consolidates on one of them I will change my vote if others are sticking to vanity wagons. That is not fence-sitting at all.

What happened with your case on Kitty? Did you change your mind on that slot?

Also, what do you think about Galron's softclaim?

Forgot about Kitty here but not opposed to an elimination on them. I think it's likely there's one scum in Kitty/Galron for sure. Doesn't seem to be a lot of pressure indicating anyone wants to vote out Kitty right now though.

Can you link me to the softclaim? I constantly miss crumbs when they're thrown.

680

Also, if you think Kitty deserves votes, even if there's not much pressure yet, you should insist. You could start the pressure.

[NJAC]

I feel this is the right decision today:

VOTE: Kitty

[NJAC]

Yeah well, I'm not following your logic.

[NJAC]

Yeah well, I'm not following your logic.

Ok.
Well I have my own ways of figuring stuff out.

You keep repeating that but I fail to see any sensible reasoning to support what you say.

[NJAC]

I'm town.

Okay, I'm intrigued now, you have repeated this many times, why are you town?

[NJAC]

@Salsa: why are you against voting Kitty?

[NJAC]

Okay, so basically gut. I think you should join me on this wagon.

[NJAC]

NJACs ISO is basically 3 things:

1. Do you think XYZ is town? Why?
2. What is your case on XYZ?
3. You didn’t respond to 123, please go back and respond.

This is quintessential scum fluffing. It looks like activity, but it’s not. It looks like it contributes, but it doesn’t. It’s scum playing facilitator.

VOTE: NJAC

This is a huge misrep of my play, and I find it very hypocritical coming from a player whose contribution has been almost null, and their posts are basically: I'm bad at this and that, that's scummy, etc., without providing much reasoning.

[NJAC]

Point to 3 posts that aren’t one of the above.

You should do the job if you're genuinely interested in determining my alignment.

My posts in which I talk about the softclaim, my posts in which I state my reads, even the very first posts in which I first interacted with you, are examples of posts that don't fall in the categories you mentioned. And no, asking questions, advancing the game and forming reads on other players through interactions is not scummy, so stop misrepping me.

[NJAC]

NJACs ISO is basically 3 things:

1. Do you think XYZ is town? Why?
2. What is your case on XYZ?
3. You didn’t respond to 123, please go back and respond.

This is quintessential scum fluffing. It looks like activity, but it’s not. It looks like it contributes, but it doesn’t. It’s scum playing facilitator.

VOTE: NJAC

This is a huge misrep of my play, and I find it very hypocritical coming from a player

whose contribution has been almost null

, and their posts are basically: I'm bad at this and that, that's scummy, etc., without providing much reasoning.

In a very, very mild defence of Porkens, for all their uncertainty and meddling logic I'd argue they've absolutely had reads this turn. The actual logic behind them isn't particularly solid (their read on me has felt fake) but I feel like this post is a bit overly defensive.

Well, I don't have meta to rely on, so my point stands still. And it might sound defensive because we're running out of time and I see a high chance of the wagon on me ending up in another mislim, so I better defend from the case made on me.

[NJAC]

NJACs ISO is basically 3 things:

1. Do you think XYZ is town? Why?
2. What is your case on XYZ?
3. You didn’t respond to 123, please go back and respond.

This is quintessential scum fluffing. It looks like activity, but it’s not. It looks like it contributes, but it doesn’t. It’s scum playing facilitator.

VOTE: NJAC

This is a huge misrep of my play, and I find it very hypocritical coming from a player whose contribution has been almost null, and their posts are basically: I'm bad at this and that, that's scummy, etc., without providing much reasoning.

I agree with Porkens here, in terms of how I read your playstyle. When I play scum and I'm trying to fabricate content I feel compelled to just ask people quick questions in succession, and then keep track of people that don't respond to me to have something to post about later. I know town can do this too, it's a vibe I'm getting from your posting.

Okay. I haven't been scum in a while, but asking questions, interacting with others, seeing the way people answer and react to my posts is how I use to form reads on other players. In this particular game I have had to quote my questions several times because many players have decided to ignore them, that's why you see me insisting on them.

[NJAC]

Where do you think you e advanced the game?

Through my posts: I ask others to explain their cases, to detail their reads, to take stances, etc., so I can try to determine if their intentions are genuine or not, and understand better why they post what they post. It's also useful for others. So that's how I help to advance the game.

[NJAC]

Point to 3 posts that aren’t one of the above.

You should do the job if you're genuinely interested in determining my alignment.

My posts in which I talk about the softclaim, my posts in which I state my reads,

even the very first posts in which I first interacted with you

, are examples of posts that don't fall in the categories you mentioned. And no, asking questions, advancing the game and forming reads on other players through interactions is not scummy, so stop misrepping me.

Your first interactions with Porkens are posts which could absolutely come from scum - they allow to appear helpful and communicative with Porkens without actually having to do anything to advance the game, while also looking as if you are concerned for a townie to make sure they know what they're doing, or to gently probe and hint someone could be scum if their responses don't look particularly great.

Yeah I think it could come from scum, I'm not saying the opposite, I was aswering Porkens' question, so what's your point here?

In fact I think it was you who said that those interactions were useful, and at least for me they were, because I got an idea of what to expect from Porkens and the kind of player I was dealing with.

[NJAC]

No I mean show me where you have advanced the game state; an example.

Well I'm not sure what exactly you expect me to answer, perhaps you can show me an example of game advancing so I can understand you better.

[NJAC]

NJACs ISO is basically 3 things:

1. Do you think XYZ is town? Why?
2. What is your case on XYZ?
3. You didn’t respond to 123, please go back and respond.

This is quintessential scum fluffing. It looks like activity, but it’s not. It looks like it contributes, but it doesn’t. It’s scum playing facilitator.

VOTE: NJAC

This is a huge misrep of my play, and I find it very hypocritical coming from a player

whose contribution has been almost null

, and their posts are basically: I'm bad at this and that, that's scummy, etc., without providing much reasoning.

In a very, very mild defence of Porkens, for all their uncertainty and meddling logic I'd argue they've absolutely had reads this turn. The actual logic behind them isn't particularly solid (their read on me has felt fake) but I feel like this post is a bit overly defensive.

Well, I don't have meta to rely on, so my point stands still. And it might sound defensive because we're running out of time and I see a high chance of the wagon on me ending up in another mislim, so I better defend from the case made on me.

On a very brief skim through your ISO there, Porkens is absolutely correct about point three - there's a lot of cases where you're constantly asking people to go back and address something you've asked them. This could be something you always do meta-wise (if you can help me on this one then great) but the defensiveness seems odd to me when one of the three things they've pointed out is a fair and accurate representation of your play. Constantly asking people to go back and address points/questions is something which could come from scum wanting to look meticulous and townie in their approach to the game. And my issue here is I don't think anything in your response to Porkens necessarily refutes what they are saying, but I'll need to take a slightly closer look.

As I said before if people wouldn't have ignored me so many times, especially Professor and Galron, you wouldn't have seen me doing 3.

[NJAC]

Professor's responses and perhaps some of the recent geraintm's responses to my questions, as examples, were useful to me because I got town vibes from them.

[NJAC]

Same with some of the first responses from Porkens to my questions.

[NJAC]

It's a bit hard to explain, let my order my thoughts:

1) Mainly gut, probably because of the tone of some posts.

2) I feel like he's adapting his game to change it from the last game we played, to avoid being caught as scum again.

3) Sometimes I feel like he's more informed than what I would expect from a townie.

4) As I said before, I suspect that slot more on D2 than what I was suspecting it on D1.

[NJAC]

Town vibes for Porkens, btw.

[NJAC]

978 and 979 are probably examples of (1) and (2), and maybe even (3), like I see him too confident and the use of enumeration looks like he's kind of emulating my posting style in that game.

[NJAC]

As an example of (3) his confidence on Gera's slot seems like he is informed.

[NJAC]

At least one scum supporting the wagon on me or considering switching to it. Gun to my head Shidaji comes to my mind.

[NJAC]

Malcolm too, although his effort seems a bit more genuine.

[NJAC]

Yes, Shidaji could be scum here.

[NJAC]

I agree having Gera at Elo is bad, but how do you know we will be in Elo on D3, @Galron?

[NJAC]

I won't be online during deadline, it's my sleeping time. I'll be around like an hour or so if someone has more questions for me.

Given the circumstances I better switch to ger:

VOTE: geraintm

[NJAC]

E-1

[NJAC]

Yes, Shidaji could be scum here.

Keep this in mind if I die tonight.

Also don't forget my case on Kitty.

[NJAC]

I have an investigative role, used it on Kitty on N1, and didn't get any result.

[NJAC]

Yes, Shidaji could be scum here.

Keep this in mind if I die tonight.

Also don't forget my case on Kitty.

Honestly two laughable concepts here: one is the idea that mafia would shoot NJAC. Why would they do that, exactly?

Two: the word “case” used quite loosely.

I’ll hammer before I go to bed in 3 hours but I STRONGLY SUGGEST anyone who reads this and isn’t doing so already VOTE NJAC.

Don't see what is so laughable.

[NJAC]

Thanks for modding @Greeting. I have no redactions.

I feel this was a bit unbalanced, btw.

[NJAC]

It was unfortunate that the end of D2 was during my sleeping time. I woke up in the middle of the night and saw that I was about to get hammered so claimed, and I had some convincing arguments to explain why I chose Kitty, but I needed to go back to sleep, and I never imagined that town was going to hammer a claimed investigative role. That was decisive for the game, so well done Town, specially Porkens and Salsa.

[NJAC]

Thanks for modding @Greeting. I have no redactions.

I feel this was a bit unbalanced, btw.

Why? It passed review.

I'm not really sure, I think an early Lim on one scum would make things really hard for the remaining scum. I think I have never played 2 vs 9. Considering as an example that newbie games have 2 vs 7 I feel this setup is harder for scum. But I'm not an expert so I don't really know.

[NJAC]

It was unfortunate that the end of D2 was during my sleeping time. I woke up in the middle of the night and saw that I was about to get hammered so claimed, and I had some convincing arguments to explain why I chose Kitty, but I needed to go back to sleep, and I never imagined that town was going to hammer a claimed investigative role. That was decisive for the game, so well done Town, specially Porkens and Salsa.

What were those arguments?

I was ready to explain that during N1 I made several ISOs and found in your ISO that you were trying to gain my confidence and convince me that you're town, and that what called my attention is that you seemed to know that I was town, but you really didn't have any reason to treat me like I was town, unless you were already informed. Or something in those lines.

Not sure if this was convincing enough, but I thought you could also confirm my claim somehow. But as I said I needed to go back to sleep, so couldn't defend and explain, and never imagined that town would hammer like that.

[NJAC]

@Greeting thanks for taking the time to explain your view on the balance of the game. As I said I'm not an expert, so you're probably right about it.