HMS Mutiny [Game Over]

[Gimli]

I'm strong townreading eiralox, for some reason, since he asked HPE 'if I trust you, would that be a mistake?' it felt super good to read that

[Gimli]

I'll be using that line as a wolf

[Gimli]

gimli is probably scum

Why?

Hey! If I start trusting you, will that be a mistake?

here

[Bellaphant]

@joker, I'm slightly more aggressive as scum: see the lack of confidence.
@flea, I said 'i scum read X and y for tone but for very different eeasons' and then like three posts later passenger almost literally uses the same language. It's weird, right?

[Gimli]

Save The Dragons (6): Killing Joke, Wayward Son, ActionDan, HighPrincessErinys, Eiralox, Gimli.
HighPrincessErinys (4): Passenger, Save The Dragons, Enchant, Titus.

look at this ugly counterwagon

[Gimli]

the POE voting HPE lmao

[Bellaphant]

VOTE: passenger

^ man's got a point

[Bellaphant]

Tbf two of my Poe are voting Std.

No one's vote on hpe seems well explained tbf.

[Radical Rat]

I can't be sure how much--if any--resolution there is to this in 657. Please elaborate on the above at your earliest opportunity.

'Twas about ye earlier insistence on callin' me loyal. I 'adn't yet been able to decide if it were genuine or an attempt to trip me up. Lettin' ye know that's what I was thinkin' could o' let a nefarious version o' ye lean into that. Though it be in part me own fault on account o' me absence, I didn't get to see much more o' that 'fore tippin' me hand, but figured transparency be more valuable at this point.

[Radical Rat]

Spoiler: Receipts for a smaller squabble

Normally I'm happy to read a hydra based on one head - in this case that would be you, as someone I know, respect and honestly fear at times - but I'm struggling to read you.

SCUM AGENDA DETECTED

On sites like mafia.gg this was definitely a thing that I’ve frequently seen. Scum would often ask lurkers why they should be townread at which point the lurker would be forced to answer and then scum would use that as an excuse to pile on. Not the best tell, but it’s a start.

Fair enough, I've only played a couple games on that website. IIRC I asked that question without much forethought because I wanted to see how Wayword Son reacted to my FoS and to start engaging with them right away. I probably would have doubled down on them if they had been really defensive or overly agreeable. I'm null-Town on Wayword Son now and probably won't push them unless they do something really scummy.

I do need to read you, the problem is at the moment either through the Harley shenangians or otherwise I can't get a grip on you yet and Joker is obfuscating that.

Normally I'm happy to read a hydra based on one head - in this case that would be you, as someone I know, respect and honestly fear at times - but I'm struggling to read you. I can't follow your logic here and they harley mask is stopping me getting the emotive read on you accurately.

i don't know that you're scum i'm just voting you right now because i think it's the most likely option but if you want to prove me wrong you can try

Hot take: I think Flea could be town here. I was initially worried far might possibly have been pocketing me earlier but faer’s recent posts look likr fae’s genuinely sorting. Unlike the above post from STD which I fail to see any townie thought process whatsoever. lol

Also liking Flea’s 191. Flea’s sounds like a real read compared the very obvious fake one from STD.

If posting Harley gifs is really keeping you from reading me than I can stop but after I saw Joker doing it, I thought it looked kinda fun. \_0_/

I don’t believe either 194 or that post about Elements being somehow enraptured ever come from town. In Schadd’s game STD actually had albeit wrong but actually non-bs reasons to push me. None of his posts sound sincere to me.

[Flea The Magician]

Your Eria comments amuse me, you say when is an opening post scummy but I offer when is an opening post worthy of a conftown read as a rebuttal. You can absolutely have alignment indicative openers and several people have been caught on them before. The no-elim is post 27ish, page two and still in RVS so if you're reading something into that other than RVS I'd love to know what you're seeing there.

What amuses me is that Elements locktowned me on my second post and here fae are talking to Erynis, who did no such thing.
I asked Elements why later, no response.

Genuinely I think people have forgotten how to read or at least see context.
That or the whole dang crew is mutinous.

This one already put Mala into conftown for the time being for the Miller claim, but it also doesn't super like their ISO or votes starting with 361.
[snip]
Eira seems fine and this one disagrees with StD's earlier assessment that his opening post is scummy (when IS an opening post actually scummy?), think maybe they could be posting more content? No-elim vote feels kinda NAI also based on the RP.
[snip]

I don't understand your response here, who its aimed at or what you're aiming for here.

[snip]
Erynis is noting something very simple here, and my first post was so basic that Erynis is right. It's interesting, what faer saying here and that fae feels the need to respond to so minor a point at all.

Erynis: How can you form an early scumread like that?

Flea: Uh early tells totally exist(Ignoring nature of my statement and utter brute simplicity of three words), and why is Eira's No Elim indicative of something? (Erynis said it's NAI! Why are fae twisting what Erynis said? NAI means 'not reading into it', yes?)

Yeah my bad on that one, I misread that bit and NAI means read into it but found it Non-Alignment Indicative. Honestly doesn't change my position as it stands on HPE.

I've felt Titus, Flea, Toffee, and Gimli and KJ to an extent, try to save Fenrir. Not saying those folk are scum but saying at this point I don't think I can change my vote anymore. If I'm wrong and misread you Fenrir, so be it.

But there's way too many indications that we struck gold.

Struck gold in that StD is mutinous?
Intriguing. This would infer a potential solve from you of being within Titus, Toffee, Gimli, KJ and myself.
Given interactions between KJ and StD, are you actually sure on that?

Personally at the moment I'm tempted to look at the people who are misinterpreting StD wilfully as I think our odds are better there.

[Gimli]

Flea, you are simultaneously suspecting people who are 'wilfully misinterpreting fenrir' and pushing HPE with your misinterpretation of HPE's post.

[Gimli]

I'll never think you're not probably a wolf now

[Radical Rat]

I think the reason you gave about Gimli wanting to rush the day sounds like scum reasoning: I don't see why Gimli's impatience is AI for scum as opposed to AI for...Town being impatient.

It be the way he speaks of it as a foregone conclusion. There be many loose threads left to pull at, an' he tries to paint the deal as sealed to secure 'is last few votes.

Ye can be impatient 'n' still be loyal, but the message here wasn' that he'd rather things be faster... It's that fate's already been writ, with the goal of dissuadin' lookin' elsewhere

[Gimli]

I don't wanna defend myself too much cause I think this wagon can be important later but

what's more important, RR, that I called for votes on STD to flip him and end the gameday, or that I actively helped changing the tide of the gamethread to one where we're flipping elsewhere? there's no point to your scumread, IDK why you're thinking that.

[ActionDan]

Flea, you are simultaneously suspecting people who are 'wilfully misinterpreting fenrir' and pushing HPE with your misinterpretation of HPE's post.

I did see that but in what I've read since page 20 or abouts I have been liking fleas responses to both me and you.

And @flea, I think from now on I'll judge you by interactions with all other non KJ players.

I still think StD is scum and I'm not sure why people are jumping ship to passenger or worse.... Gimli

[Flea The Magician]

flea's #641 is another post I don't like, but I think it's possible I don't comprehend how faer weighs in the game and whatnot. there's a lot of simply not understanding HPE in my opinion, like here

Your Eria comments amuse me, you say when is an opening post scummy but I offer when is an opening post worthy of a conftown read as a rebuttal. You can absolutely have alignment indicative openers and several people have been caught on them before. The no-elim is post 27ish, page two and still in RVS so if you're reading something into that other than RVS I'd love to know what you're seeing there.

HPE isn't the one reading 'into RVS', HPE is suspecting STD's rationale behind scumreading eiralox early. HPE is not saying eiralox is towny for the 'no-elim' post.

Yeah that's my bad, thats what I get for trying to be copus mentus at 1am after a night out at a pub playing games.

Looking forward to your results on the Gimli wagon.

what do you think of my wagon now?

you still don't feel like you're scumhunting at all. btw I saw you had a question to STD I didn't quite understand either, so if you elaborate on that and if he answered that'd be good.

I generally don't do wagon analysis until we have data for VCA. Did seem organic enough, nothing really to stand out about it. Mala's someone I don't know how to read - seems convinced, StD was YOLO'ing from what I can see and Titus is inactive which means she's currently unreadable.

There was a thing, and apparently I forgot about it. Going to see if I can read back and remember.

[ActionDan]

Titus' votes and iso leave much to be desired

[Radical Rat]

In addition to the above, I have three additional minor reasons to be growing suspicious of you. There is talk in the Clown Cabin that your morale is decreasing over time because your team is losing...while at first you were a high energy slot, now you're rarely present. I think Harley could be right at least that you're more wary of certain things as scum: in Elected Decisions you wrote very good scum posts but you fell into the cautious vs reckless motif in your opening post and that caused me to call you out page 1 (IIRC), though over time your very good emulation of townie writing won me over. I can see how your cognizance of that game can lead you to make a minor adjustment to your scum play where you are looking to engage in a 1v1 early because you've become aware that being reckless is the right way to be cautious as scum.

I won't be engagin' in any tales o' voyages past. Meta be a scourge upon the sea, an' while I know it be unavoidable at times, I think I'm done contributin' to it, for this an' all future crews.

'Avin' said that, I will still discuss general traits an'... If this be genuine, ye've got me pegged on the wrong leg. Me morale's not been waverin', an even if I were on a losin' team that'd be likely to get me MORE fired up rather'n less.

[Flea The Magician]

Flea, you are simultaneously suspecting people who are 'wilfully misinterpreting fenrir' and pushing HPE with your misinterpretation of HPE's post.

There's a difference between pushing, squeezing and sorting.
I have not pushed HPE at all, but have been trying to sort it.
There's also a difference between misinterpretation/misreading and wilful misinterpretation and again between malicious misinterpretation.

Spoiler: Wilful misconstruction refers to this series

i don't think i said he wasn't confident as scum?

Can you expand on those?

Save The Dragons (6):

Killing Joke

,

Wayward Son

,

ActionDan

,

HighPrincessErinys

,

Eiralox

,

Gimli

.

Green is town

Gimli

i'm still trying to figure out how to read gimli, but considering we just played dance game where i wasn't scum, and we just played doctor game where i wasn't scum,

why doesn't he have pause when thinking i'm scum or not in this game? he feels like he did in temple game, where he was scum.

Seems like it to me.

those are two separate thoughts, it's not saying he paused in the temple game

It seems we are at an impasse because to this one that seems blatantly like what you're saying there.

we are at an impasse because you are actively choosing to read it wrong. that is not what i am saying

we are at an impasse because you are actively choosing to read it wrong. that is not what i am saying

Then perhaps you ought to have worded it better because "actively choosing" is incorrect, it is on the contrary genuinely very hard to read it any other way to this one.

and watching someone isn't necessarily SR or even SL them.

why do so many people deal in absolutes? Watching someone is just "huh I should pay attention to you"...

of course then I say nothing and its "YOU'RE ON THE HEDGE!" like my peeps calm your lil marshmellow butts. I have opinions just people want me to put them within one of two boxes. Hopefully some of you will get the irony as why I just cannot.

[ActionDan]

Tbf two of my Poe are voting Std.

No one's vote on hpe seems well explained tbf.

I assume you at this point have some sort of town pool and a PoE pool.

Does that mean you do not have a scumread proper? No one below the PoE category?

[Elements]

I remember why I don't often play large games, there's too many people to keep track of early game. I'm gonna look through the wagons and join one.
I'm not going to look at StD because anything I say KJ will jump on and say "oo look this is two scum"
Don't really get the HPE votes. It's giving points, explaining it's thoughts and asking questions.
I can see the Gimli scum reads. A lot of his points are parroting others.
Passenger is a null slot for me.
Re-reading KJ still just makes me exasperated.

VOTE: Killing Joker

[Elements]

I quite like Action Dan

[Elements]

Bella is still null-ish for me

[Elements]

I like flea