TM 2023 | Super Mario Bros Mafia | Game Over!

[Adorable]

yeah so that's a scumclaim

fwiw jingle should never be allowed to endgame because his play this phase has been downright horrific. i pulled the detente with him partly because i thought he might actually be a mason with hpe but his posts after proved to not be the case. i think the weird round of questioning might be pocketing, not sure. regardless if he's not cleared by an investigation don't let him off the hook.

everyone else off wagon i think is town tbqh. generally when scum plays like porkens their partner is going to recognize and cut bait sooner rather than later

So… just to unpack here: I’m confscum. And also Porkens is confscum. And also I’m literally the only person in the thread who would see porkens scum buddy flailing and dying and goes “you know how I should react to that? By drawing literally all of the attention to me.”

for the record that was a reaction to what i mistakenly presumed was an accidental selfhammer, which is not the case. this is also before you came into the thread and had a crying screaming flailing meltdown at me calling you out

but again i've laid out alternative scenarios. i think it's possible porkens's partner cut bait on him and is voting him. i'm not gonna fully discuss that right now. i just want you to be the elimination 100% of the time following a porkens red flip, absent anything mechanical clearing you. because your play makes far more sense as being proscum and you shouldn't be given a pass for it.

What did you think about my read on Jingle on 322

You said Jingle's play makes far more sense as proscum and what would be the scum motivation for him to be against people getting the double vote to then changing his mind and wanting me to have the double vote and speculates about me having the double vote?

[Jingle]

Spoiler:

VOTE: porkens

VOTE: unvote jkjk

VOTE: Adorable

WELL?

If I was Cakes I would DEFINITELY punish town by making scum op if they got the power up

AMONG THEIR LSCK OF REAL PRECENSE IN A GAME WHERE TOWN ARE BICKERING AMONGST THEMSELVES

PUT

YOUR

VOTE

WHERE

YOUR

MOUTH IS

VOTE: adorable finally

yeah so that's a scumclaim

fwiw jingle should never be allowed to endgame because his play this phase has been downright horrific. i pulled the detente with him partly because i thought he might actually be a mason with hpe but his posts after proved to not be the case. i think the weird round of questioning might be pocketing, not sure. regardless if he's not cleared by an investigation don't let him off the hook.

everyone else off wagon i think is town tbqh. generally when scum plays like porkens their partner is going to recognize and cut bait sooner rather than later

oh i kept thinking it was a 9er and that was actually a selfhammer i'm silly

i'm still fine with giving wgeurts time to catch up

The whole sequence, and why I don't think the explanation of "I only posted that because selfhammer." holds a lot of weight.

Particularly, Porkens selfvoted and unvoted less than a minute later. People continued playing the game. Peta then decided it must have been a selfhammer 5 minutes later. Also, the votecount on the previous page and the declaration of E-2 as the previous pagetop didn't prevent the idea of selfhammer, but.

All of which does nothing to address the bigger issue, like the burden of proficiency at mech that apparently an unspecified JOAT claim of unknown power level from an unknown alignment slot should make me not attempt to read Fate based on a softclaim of "I'll be a BIG help later" from Porkens. The meat of this interaction isn't whether I should be considered scummy in light of a theoretical scum Porkens flip, it's that peta has been blatantly lying about things happening in the thread to make me look bad regardless of Porkens' flip. And that I believe he's doing so because I'm the one scumreading him.

[petapan]

What did you think about my read on Jingle on 322

You said Jingle's play makes far more sense as proscum and what would be the scum motivation for him to be against people getting the double vote to then changing his mind and wanting me to have the double vote and speculates about me having the double vote?

i don't think it's impossible to fake that, however, i changed my mind on him being scum again and think he's town but misguided

[Jingle]

As an oog aside, peta, regardless of your alignment I think it's worth saying that if you do find me annoying I'm willing to avoid you in future games, but having this back and forth with you has been a ton of fun for me and I'd much rather play with you again in the future. I AM here because it's a game and I'm having fun more than anything else. If I were to get genuinely upset I'd like to hope I'd replace out and retire again rather than let it fester like I used to. I've been spending far more time than I should playing mafia because I genuinely enjoy this and I hope that you at least somewhat are enjoying yourself.

[petapan]

Particularly, Porkens selfvoted and unvoted less than a minute later. People continued playing the game. Peta then decided it must have been a selfhammer 5 minutes later. Also, the votecount on the previous page and the declaration of E-2 as the previous pagetop didn't prevent the idea of selfhammer, but.

i entered the thread having seen 4 votes on the previous page. cakez doesn't put E-X indicators in his VCs. I mentally forget we're at 10 players, I assume the E- is wrong. I come in, think it was a selfhammer and brief twilight trolling. i think, oh shit, i just buried who outed himself, i better leave a quick legacy post in case i get shot over this. that might seem egotistical but it happens to me a fair amount of the time. i leave an advisory to vote you out because fmpov at that moment in time you have clearly hard scumsided all game and i was worried people would let you get away with it

all that was written under the assumption porkens had outed himself as scum.

again why do you think i would lie about any of this??

[Adorable]

What did you think about my read on Jingle on 322

You said Jingle's play makes far more sense as proscum and what would be the scum motivation for him to be against people getting the double vote to then changing his mind and wanting me to have the double vote and speculates about me having the double vote?

i don't think it's impossible to fake that, however, i changed my mind on him being scum again and think he's town but misguided

To me that play looked inconsistent to be scum and have been struggling on figuring out why the change of mind if Jingle is scum.

What made you come around to a town Jingle?

[petapan]

As an oog aside, peta, regardless of your alignment I think it's worth saying that if you do find me annoying I'm willing to avoid you in future games, but having this back and forth with you has been a ton of fun for me and I'd much rather play with you again in the future. I AM here because it's a game and I'm having fun more than anything else. If I were to get genuinely upset I'd like to hope I'd replace out and retire again rather than let it fester like I used to. I've been spending far more time than I should playing mafia because I genuinely enjoy this and I hope that you at least somewhat are enjoying yourself.

lmao nah it's all good i treat the fight as, like, part of the game

[petapan]

What did you think about my read on Jingle on 322

You said Jingle's play makes far more sense as proscum and what would be the scum motivation for him to be against people getting the double vote to then changing his mind and wanting me to have the double vote and speculates about me having the double vote?

i don't think it's impossible to fake that, however, i changed my mind on him being scum again and think he's town but misguided

To me that play looked inconsistent to be scum and have been struggling on figuring out why the change of mind if Jingle is scum.

What made you come around to a town Jingle?

because in arguing with him i've come to realize he has a perspective that is very self-centered around him being town and i believe it to be real. he seemed legit worried that i was trying to paint him as a scapegoat.

[petapan]

As an oog aside, peta, regardless of your alignment I think it's worth saying that if you do find me annoying I'm willing to avoid you in future games, but having this back and forth with you has been a ton of fun for me and I'd much rather play with you again in the future. I AM here because it's a game and I'm having fun more than anything else. If I were to get genuinely upset I'd like to hope I'd replace out and retire again rather than let it fester like I used to. I've been spending far more time than I should playing mafia because I genuinely enjoy this and I hope that you at least somewhat are enjoying yourself.

lmao nah it's all good i treat the fight as, like, part of the game

i do think you might be one of those people where we have a philosophically opposed view of the game that means we're never going to be able to work together well as town but we'll see how this game shakes out

[Jingle]

because in arguing with him i've come to realize he has a perspective that is very self-centered around him being town and i believe it to be real. he seemed legit worried that i was trying to paint him as a scapegoat.

FWIW the former half of this is true but the latter half isn't. I do tend to base a lot of my reads on how people treat and/or read me, mostly because I know that I'm town. I'm not particularly worried about you 'painting me as a scapegoat' and am fully aware of how likely I am to eat a lim if Porkens does flip red. Most of this arguing is being done for the countercase, which I happen to believe is both more likely and more relevant, that Porkens flips green. Honestly, if Porkens flips red I don't really feel I have much to worry about because there are enough people who were viable counteroptions which never panned out that narrowing down who actually made the Porkens flip happen over say, the HPE or Adorable flip should provide a pretty clear roadmap for a town win. I wouldn't go so far as to say Porkens-red mech clears you, but I definitely wouldn't be interested in a peta elim tomorrow.

My scumread, at the very heart of things, is that you seem to be approaching me in a way where you're not even attempting to read into my intentions and blatantly disregarding what has actually happened to achieve that purpose. You also make a lot of sense as a partner for all of the people I think are most likely to be scum.

The reason I focused on the specific interaction of the 'hammer' reaction was that it seemed like a cut and dry case of you going out of your way to discredit specifically my slot. It wasn't "Fate's defense of Porkens is town." it was "Everyone who isn't voting Porkens bar Jingle is town." That list, of course, is Fate, Porkens, and the three people I think are most likely to actually be scum. 2 of whom were literally absent for the whole of the Porkens wagon.

I will concede however that in hindsight lying about whether you thought it was a self hammer is silly, with the caveat of you continuing to call porkens selfvoting a scumclaim definitely cut the impact of the oh, not a hammer post.

[Jingle]

i do think you might be one of those people where we have a philosophically opposed view of the game that means we're never going to be able to work together well as town but we'll see how this game shakes out

Eh, me and rc have basically opposite views of the game and I've still managed to play well with him on occasion, so I doubt it's something that couldn't be overcome. Also, I vastly prefer scumgames anyway.

[petapan]

lld wants to kill you still but i'm not into it and if porkens flips town i'm fine with letting someone else take the reins

with the caveat of you continuing to call porkens selfvoting a scumclaim definitely cut the impact of the oh, not a hammer post.

cuz ultimately he made 3 nonsense posts and peaced out which is generally not what i expect from town that seesthey're a wagon

[Adorable]

What is everyone's stance here?

What would be your order of elimination?

[Porkens]

id fight it but i cant

[Porkens]

please let me kstay in the game. just look elsewhere. im just town.

[HighPrincessErinys]

please let me kstay in the game. just look elsewhere. im just town.

You haven't really given us a convincing reason to do so, is the thing.

[Adorable]

please let me kstay in the game. just look elsewhere. im just town.

Claim now.

[Adorable]

I don't like it when there is stalling and most of the time it is scum who stalls.

[Porkens]

toad, vanilla town,

SWING YOUR ARMS
FROM SIDE TO SIDE

[Fate]

What is everyone's stance here?

What would be your order of elimination?

Thinking about Nk choices already

Bold

[Fate]

Porkens you were truly a player of all time

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Lim Porkens

[Radical Rat]

toad, vanilla town,

SWING YOUR ARMS
FROM SIDE TO SIDE

Sample VT PM was a Goomba. While it isn't entirely inconceivable there could be two different VT flavors, this very well may be a scumslip

[Fate]

There's obviously.... The fuck would you say that

[Cat Scratch Fever]

What rat said