Night Watch Open 95 - Game Over before 703

[orangepenguin]

Speaking of my hypoclaim, I will NOT be hiding behind ortolan tonight, and instead will be hiding behind...bionicchop2.

[camn]

... id be willing to be a couple of the scum are the ones that have "disappeared" lately with deadline coming up, so they get no more pressure and don't change the direction of the lynch. everyone knows that with as little info we have on a few of the players, a deadline lynch won't happen on someone not active to defend themselves.

That is SO true.
I hate deadline lynches.

[bionicchop2]

mod

- what is the time of the deadline on the 5th. I want to make sure it doesn't occur during my sleepy time or I may have to change my vote tonight. Otherwise I will be around most of the day tomorrow to adjust my vote as needed.

[orangepenguin]

mod

- what is the time of the deadline on the 5th. I want to make sure it doesn't occur during my sleepy time or I may have to change my vote tonight. Otherwise I will be around most of the day tomorrow to adjust my vote as needed.

I second the TIME. Since it looks my ort case never took off, I might have to change it, because, I don't think camn is scum, and don't think he should be lynched.

[ortolan]

Agreed. But TCS is not helping by refusing to give justification for his continual tunneling on HC/OP.

I am suspicious of camn's sudden change of tune about me. It seems to be based more on the fact afatchic and bionic seem to now think I am town, rather than their arguments.

fyi, the two points afatchic made for me being unlikely to be scum:

Yeah, i doubt that was too much role fishing, since he was more of asking the town how we could use the hider the best way. also, i think it was about his first week on the site when it happened, so you may even pass if of as just newbish. but either way... i don't really think he is the lynch for today.

had in fact already been made by me as far back as posts 92:

First of all; to repeat, when I say I did not suggest that they should claim, I mean I did not suggest this was the only option- I clearly stated that an alternative way of playing would be to go through the game as a vanilla townie. Secondly, as far as I saw it, based on the roles described by the mod, my plan was flawless. I have not played in a game with a hider role previously, and have no knowledge of what might be considered "conventions" for them. Thirdly, as this is an open setup, if it is true that the hider dies if they hide behind someone who is killed, then it seems a reasonable expectation that this fact might be mentioned by the mod in the "hider" description.

and 117:

Please back up the assertion that discussing the setup (especially in an _open_ setup game) is a scum-tell. All that my discussion of the setup has lead to so far is the hypoclaim plan, which everyone agrees will benefit town.

As such it's somewhat ironic you should say:

I tend to agree with you about Ort, afatchic.... but I would have loved to see the defense come from him, rather than anyone else!

Oh well.
UNVOTE. . for clarity.

...and then unvote. I had already made similar arguments in my defence. Your unvote seems more likely to be due to you realising weren't going to get the support of town in lynching me, at least today, and thus backed off, rather than agreeing with the actual argument afatchic presented.

Just did a quick read on TCS, though.. and I don't see him as scum. ...
I, of course, would rather see Xtoxm hang.. but we don't have the time.

I have a bad feeling about this day!

I don't like how you're so sure of TCS' alignment. It could be a scum move to look good when he flips town. He has in fact given good reasons for voting for him- his unexplained tunneling on HC/OP in the absence of a claim seems good enough. But there are other things, like his dodgy attack on bionic (post 412):

Also...

fos: bionic

.

In this hypoclaim strategy, it would ultimately behoove the hider to hide behind scum.

Something just occurred to me, actually, that it would be explained if he was a watcher, watched KMD night one and both OP and HC targetted him. It would surprise me though if TCS had left this until the deadline day with him as the leading lynch to claim this however. (Again, this is not rolefishing- this is the only valid explanation I see for TCS' actions without supporting evidence).

Unvote

pending response from TCS, he needs to explain his position on OP/HC now though.

Finally, I agree about lurkers- both xtoxm and Crazy have lurked too much and posted too little of content.

Seconding bionic's request for knowledge of when the deadline is.

[ortolan]

Oh and my "agreed" in the above post was meant to be in reply to camn's post 426

[afatchic]

Ortolan- sometimes it just takes another persons opinion to change your views. and when you posted that back on 92 and 117, you may have still been acting scummy, but i would be willing to say your play has improved since then.

Also, very good catch on why TCS may be stuck up on them, however i think he probably shouldn't confirm this today. it brings a little wifom into the night stage. and if he dies watcher tomorrow, then we can go from there. OP will full claim and see if any CC arise. then we may even have to have hider fully claim, since mafia will practically be able to narrow it down and find him after the hides tonight.

[camn]

It is true that Ort's play has been better. But honestly.. my vote in post 381 was mostly for pressure, and to see Ort's reactions.
They weren't bad reactions. I would have liked more.. but meh.

Oh, and for forewarnings sake...
I will obviously vote TCS to save myself, given no changes. Even though i

think

he is probably town, I am

sure

about myself! so maybe-mislynch>definte-mislynch, IMO.
Also, I'll throw a vote at Xtoxm on principle.
I am even almost ready to OMGUS vote Crazy... since he is mega-lurking and his "case" against me sucks, but practically has me lynched anyway.

Hmm.

[afatchic]

just out of curiosity, how often are a few day extensions given out when we are in need of prods on quite a few people. either way ill reread in the morning, and see what comes of that.

[Jex]

Vote Count

2 - The Central Scrutinizer (Haschel Cedricson, StrangerCoug)
2 - camn (Crazy, bionicchop2)
1 - Ortolan (orangepenguin)
1 - Haschel Cedricson (The Central Scrutinizer)
1 - bionicchop2 (icemanE)
1 - Crazy (Xtoxm)

Not Voting

afatchic, camn, ortolan

It takes 6 votes to lynch

Deadline is Dec 5th at 10pm PST

[ortolan]

Also, very good catch on why TCS may be stuck up on them, however i think he probably shouldn't confirm this today.

Even if he's going to get lynched otherwise? It seems at this point we're either going for a no lynch or a lynch of TCS (camn has said she would vote him, I only unvoted him due to my interpreted roleclaim)- if we're going to lynch TCS he should claim- if we're happy to no lynch then he shouldn't.

[afatchic]

I didn't about him getting lynched. yeah TCS please claim today when you get on.

[bionicchop2]

I will attempt a full thread read today. I encourage others to be active as much as possible for the next 13 hours until deadline.

[bionicchop2]

Initial reactions to my re-skim:

====
Not as suspicious of icemanE. I may have been too trappy in my gambit. Needs refinement.
====
Very suspicious of Xtoxm due to my experience in playing with him. Something is off about his game in this one. I think he is fitting into his scum meta more than his town meta in a few ways. I will leave it at that for now. My point about OP's power claim and his hypclaim on Xtoxm remains, so I don't think he is a good vote for today. Definite

FoS

though and will look at closer if we find OP to not be hider.
=====
Camn still looking very scummy to me, particularly at the start of the game:

That sucks about KMD... I was looking forward to another game with you!

- discussion about being saddened by the night results which implies she would not kill KMD.

OR, maybe its scum trying to bait us into a WIFOM-driven retaliation nightkill discussion...
Like killing Xtoxm in order to build a case against Crazy. (which is what

I

would have done!)

- along the same lines, "If I were scum" discussion (unprovoked). Town really has no reason to discuss who they would have killed if they were scum.
=====
I also don't feel AS bad about the TCS wagon as I did previously. I still think Camn is a much better lynch today. She has also already claimed and did not claim a power role.

[icemanE]

No lynches on day one are a terrible thing. The last thing I said about TCS was:

TCS is saying that a wagon based on nothing is appropriate... which it's not. Maybe on page 3. Not on page 13. Duh.

I also don't understand TCS's point about OP's win in PD Mafia (which I was in - in fact, I was one of the two scum he killed to win the game). First of all, the game mechanics in PD mafia were insanely different than this game's. Secondly, I was sent to jail because the town thought myself and my scumpartner were town, and OP used his power which killed two people the townies thought were town. Finally, you seem to be arguing that OP is a good player - and what's your point? He says he's bad, you say he's good... where were you trying to go with that?

That active lurking point on OP is also bull.

Gonna look through and see if I want to vote TCS.

...and I do. He's scummy enough for a day one lynch, in my evaluation, and I forsee a no lynch occurring if we don't act quickly, which is detrimental to the rest of the game.

unvote - vote: TCS

[bionicchop2]

Well, we know camn will vote TCS, so we should assume he is at 4 votes (L-2) for all intents.

Since we are on deadline, I would request

TCS to claim in his next post

. My reasoning is that it will give us time to digest. If he claims something right before deadline and we have to change courses too quickly, we could end up with an accidental NL or a hasty lynch of someone else.

[Xtoxm]

TCS>Ort>NL

Unvote Vote TCS

As deadline is today.

[Xtoxm]

Having said that, none of the 3 remaining options look that interesting to me.

[afatchic]

Initial reactions to my re-skim:

====
Not as suspicious of icemanE. I may have been too trappy in my gambit. Needs refinement.
====
Very suspicious of Xtoxm due to my experience in playing with him. Something is off about his game in this one. I think he is fitting into his scum meta more than his town meta in a few ways. I will leave it at that for now. My point about OP's power claim and his hypclaim on Xtoxm remains, so I don't think he is a good vote for today. Definite

FoS

though and will look at closer if we find OP to not be hider.
=====
Camn still looking very scummy to me, particularly at the start of the game:

That sucks about KMD... I was looking forward to another game with you!

- discussion about being saddened by the night results which implies she would not kill KMD.

OR, maybe its scum trying to bait us into a WIFOM-driven retaliation nightkill discussion...
Like killing Xtoxm in order to build a case against Crazy. (which is what

I

would have done!)

- along the same lines, "If I were scum" discussion (unprovoked). Town really has no reason to discuss who they would have killed if they were scum.
=====
I also don't feel AS bad about the TCS wagon as I did previously. I still think Camn is a much better lynch today. She has also already claimed and did not claim a power role.

Well, sadly i do think he may be the hider, which clears xtoxm.

[Jex]

Vote Count

4 - The Central Scrutinizer (Haschel Cedricson, StrangerCoug, icemanE, Xtoxm)
2 - camn (Crazy, bionicchop2)
1 - Ortolan (orangepenguin)
1 - Haschel Cedricson (The Central Scrutinizer)

Not Voting

afatchic, camn, ortolan

It takes 6 votes to lynch

Deadline is Dec 5th at 10pm PST

[camn]

whoa. Game dynamics question:
What happens at deadline?

I was assuming that whoever had the most votes got lynched ( which is why I consider myself practically L-1)
But you all are talking like deadline=no lynch ( which i have seen, too)..
Do we know which it is? I could easily have missed it...

[bionicchop2]

wow, I just realized there are no rules posted...

::runs to quote mod PM::

[afatchic]

I just looked through all the mods posts and couldn't find anything. I'm assuming the vote leader gets lynched.

[bionicchop2]

I'm assuming the vote leader gets lynched.

Dangerous assumption. We should go for 6 votes and play it safe.

[Xtoxm]

I had assumed NL at deadline.

There should be rules posted...