Open 107: Carbon 14 - Game Over! before 716

[Stef]

Vote orlotan

because his name makes me thing about the word charlatan.

[Stef]

Ehm.. Stef is short for Stefan, a MALE name.

[Stef]

Orlotan is the only one who hasn't posted.

[Stef]

INFIDELS! I'm AHMED the Terrorist. I KILL UU

Unvote
VOTE STEF MUAHHAHAHAHA ( HAHAHA ) haha!!!!11
Unvote

And that is how AHMED the DEAD Terrorist came to life. The end.

[Stef]

unvote

Vote: Stef

Self voted and hasn't got his vote on someone.

Is that serious?

[Stef]

Care to elaborate why having no vote on in this stage is anti-town? Also, is your also not completely random?

[Stef]

So you put me at L-2 in page 1 of the game based on the fact that.. i unvoted? Nobody was debating if we want a lynch D1. What i do find suspicious is the fact that you felt the need to make a deal out of my post and seriously put me at L-2 and then backpedaling and ambiguously saying that it wasn't "completely serious".

FoS: Empking

[Stef]

L-2 is L-2. This isn't about semantics. Arguing about it changes nothing.

EBWOP: Point two should read:

2. Why aren't you voting for Empking, Stef? More importantly, why haven't you unvoted yourself yet?

Omg... are you SURE i didn't unvote? [irony]Try reading the fine

BOLDED

parts. [/irony] I didn't vote for him because i'm not sure it warrants as a vote.

Regarding 3: He stated "I think your lack of vote is anti-town" after stating that his post wasn't completely serious. That means that he didn't suspect the self-vote. As far as your "experience" with these sort of things.

There are too many things wrong about your post:
1. You say that two votes aren't a big deal even if they mean L-2 but you give an example regarding another game where the player who self-voted was hammered page two. That would make L-2 quite a big deal wouldn't it?

2. You feel the need to misrep empking to attack me. You count a self-vote that was unvoted in the same post as a big deal. You also invoke a "game" in which a player who self-voted was scum. That is utter crap and is misleading the town.

3. You further agree with empking in his points against me but you start of on the wrong premise. I didn't vote for him because i didn't have enough reason to. You on the other hand give me enough reason to:

Vote occam

[Stef]

Unvote

Thanks Darox. Didn't realize it was the L-1 vote.

[Stef]

Ehm.. simuposted.

[Stef]

Also, the other players should come out of the RVS as well since their votes are not particularly helpful right now.

Empking why suggest occam claim so early?

[Stef]

You haven't answered my question.

[Stef]

Carbose and Crazy + me doesn't = majority. The two votes on him are from the RVS.

[Stef]

Can i explain what?

[Stef]

L-1 is a big deal on page two though, but you don't seem to think so.

OK, if that warrants L-1, than more power to you.

1. Pay attention to the votecount.

So you're saying that i had the intention of putting you at L-1 but you also tell me to pay attention to the vote count? You can't really have it both ways. It would imply you think it was premeditated as well as a mistake.

what's your point? That's why I brought it up.

It's a null-tell.

P.S. Back off with the personal stuff such as "look up ironic" since me as a real person doesn't really concern you. If you look into other games i played you will find out that i don't react good to such remarks. As aggressive as i might be in the game i make no remarks to you as a real person. Please do the same.

[Stef]

I think she meant "a lynch during the first

irl

* day"

[Stef]

We'll have to wait for her to post now won't we.

[Stef]

I was in that game and no, Korts put himself at L-1 on page 1 and the cop hammered page 2. It's not the same situation; Stef is acting different now than Korts was then.

My point is simply that self-voting in a game with 7 players alive is not a good idea, and the only time I've seen someone do it, they turned out to be scum. Is that definitive? No. But I think it's worth bringing up.

You're incredible! What is your line of thought when you make such a big fuss out of it? Really? How is it ANTI-town or SCUMMY to self-vote? Here's an incentive to answer.

vote Occam

[Stef]

It's all situational. In this case, since you unvoted right away, it's not such a big deal.

Funny. Now you say it's nut such a big deal but yet you have managed to use it as an argument every step of the way when you attacked me. Now that you are at L-1 you start to backpedal? Nice.

Um... I would have answered anyways. And I can't take much of what you've said thus far with merit anymore - you've knowingly put me at L-1, this time, so there's no excuses.

Of course you would have answered anyway but you can expect different answers from a player when he's at L-2 from RVS votes or at L-1. My vote made it's point and revealed more inconsistencies. I've knowingly put you at L-1 since you seemed to think that it was the same the other time so it made no difference anymore. What i've said so far is really accurate from my point of view. I'd beg you to prove otherwise. I don't need an excuse to put you at L-1. From what i remember trying to lynch scum is pro-town.

Stef is taking advantage of the fact that there are two votes which don't need justification sitting on me to make it seem like he's justified in voting for me - and after the stink he made about being put at L-2... this is just ridiculous.

So.. wait a minute. You say that because the two RVS votes you have on you aren't justified means i'm not actually justified to vote for you? And the "stink" i made about being put at L-2 was because he had no real reason to. I have all the reasons i need to push for your lynch. You are just scum crumbling under pressure. The only thing i used was those RVS votes to help me pressure you.

unvote - vote: stef

See? You are crumbling under pressure. A desperate OMGUS vote.. tisk tisk.

I'll unvote for now since my vote fulfilled it's purpose and since i want the others to read this as well and give their opinion.

Unvote

[Stef]

Heh.. and even more to the point (since i didn't notice i was at L-1) you put me at L-1 based on an OMGUS vote. Are you scum much?

[Stef]

Code: Select all

 It's [b]something[/b] for bold

[Stef]

but one of these votes was his own.

People really need to start reading the game.

Occam reads pro-town to me, especially as he stood his ground on claiming despite the crappy pressure posts.

So you think he is pro-town because he stood his ground despite "crappy pressure posts"? wow.. This together with what i've previously quoted will lead to you saying that i asked him to claim.

[Stef]

We're 7 with 2 mafia. If we misslynch today next day there will be 2 mafia and 3 town. That's lylo D2 not 3. Trying to mislead much again?

[Stef]

Nvm.. misread. Anyway.. I don't think no-lynch is a good idea either but then again this is my first 7 player game. What bothers me about it is that it would take more power away from the town.

[Stef]

@Occam:

@Stef - If I'm so scummy, why did you just unvote? I don't get it...

I don't want to cut the day short by leaving you at L-1 before people had the chance to discuss and before i got some feedback. Me putting you at L-1 was a gambit and as far as i'm concerned it pulled through.

Stef (3) - Caboose (not random), Empking(not random), Occam(not random)
Occam (2) - Mada (random), ortolan (random)

Carboose: Not random vote? OMG... yeah.. his reason was very game related and not RVS at all.. His reason is, and i quote,

Vote: Stef
Because you're going to make me mess up my pronouns.

So yeah.. really serious and non-RVS vote. Again you misrep and obv lie to help you make BS points.

Empking: Whoa...

Confirm Vote; Stef

Putting someone at L-2 is scummy but L-1 isn't.

Yeah..you are right. This is a serious vote and a good case against me.

Your vote: Yeah right. We're running in circles about how scummy it is to put some1 at L-1 without enough info when my intention was clearly not to keep you at L-1 but to get reactions. You keep me at L-1 based on a Carboose RVS vote ( which i'm very curious about seeing that he hasn't removed it even considering i'm at L-1 ) and on an Empking vote which has very crappy grounds not to mention you appear to ignore the fact that at least one of the other two voting for me might be scum. Kinda tunnelvisioned don't you think? That's just even more evidence to you being very very scummy.

Ah, sorry. But voting yourself then unvoting in the same post is kind of confusing and pointless...

QFT, if you want to talk about confusing and misleading the town, Mada, why wouldn't you scoop this up?

WoW! A joke in the RVS considered to be confusing and pointless? Apparently it was only confusing to those who didn't bother to read it properly to see that i unvoted in the same damn post. I wonder how it was confusing and misleading the town. How does a joke selfvote unvoted in the same post mislead anyone? Mada didn't scoop this up because it's crap.

OK, I explained why I voted for Stef, as did everyone else who is voting for him.

You did provide an explanation for the vote against me. A BS one but still. Carboose has done no such thing as his vote is from the RVS and Empking's vote hasn't really been backed up with solid arguments. This is just you pushing for my lynch when clearly the case against me is crap.

Overall you continue to misrep and mislead by using logical fallacies and lies to back you up in your case against me and try to reinforce your lies by repeating them.

I think you are scum and if you aren't then you're the worst townie i've ever seen. More than enough to warrant my very confirmed vote on you.

Vote Occam

L-2 vote.

[Stef]

Me putting you at L-1 was a gambit and as far as i'm concerned it pulled through.

How was it a gambit and how did it pull through?

Is that a serious question? What don't you understand? Please check http://www.dictionary.com and http://en.wikipedia.org for the two terms and then put my L-1 vote and the reactions i got from you in the equation and you get a gambit and it's semi-result. I guess the only clear result will be revealed when you either turn up scum or not.

Carboose: Not random vote? OMG... yeah.. his reason was very game related and not RVS at all.. His reason is, and i quote,

My point is that we were well out of the random vote stage, and he had been active (unlike the players voting for me), so his vote, which remained on you, was no longer random.

That doesn't excuse the fact that you put me at L-1 when one of the votes was very weird at the least. Funny how nobody picked that up especially you who claimed you checked every vote. Don't you find it scummy? Cause it seems you are very willing to use anything you can to lynch me including shady votes and knocked up reasons. Keep adding to the pile.

Yeah..you are right. This is a serious vote and a good case against me.

Yes, you're also correct, Empking's reason for voting you was 100% valid.

Really? Then we have a 100% valid reason to put you at L-1 since the same argument can be brought against you.

You keep me at L-1 based on a Carboose RVS vote ( which i'm very curious about seeing that he hasn't removed it even considering i'm at L-1 )

Lol. There's my point - he still hasn't taken it off - does that tell you anything? Thanks for that.

You are starting to sound very arrogant. Not a scum-tell but something good to know. Yes, the fact that he hasn't taken his vote off without giving any reason for that vote tells me something. That he's scummy because he might as well be the one voting me at L-1 without giving any reason. All i wonder is why don't YOU see it as scummy. I guess that's because you are scum.

Mada didn't scoop this up because it's crap.

Yeah, it's crap. Thanks again!

Ehm, are you intentionally trying to play like a VI? You just agreed to my point which was a point made against your own. You're making no sense.

Please, by all means, back this up with some quotes and point out where I lied or used a logical fallacy.

I'm too lazy to quote again but meh:
- Your "slip" when accusing me of self-voting. As far as i'm concerned you might as well be lying to mislead. Your intention when you had that "slip" is not known to the town. Don't take our trust as granted on that incident.

All I said was that everyone voting for Stef had already given their reasons.

You actually said that everyone who had voted for me had given a reason. Carboose had clearly done no such thing. How is this NOT a lie?
The fact that Carboose might have reasons for his vote is a completely other story. I never challenged that. The fact is that you lied to mislead the town yet again and not to mention that Carboose might also have forgotten that his vote was on me or be trying to get away with a townie lynched while he lurks. Only i see these plausible reasons?
- The simplest example of you using a logical fallacy is the one you just wrote in your last post:

Just because someone doesn't make a page long case doesn't mean they don't have a decent reason.[/b]
It also doesn't mean that they have one whatsoever. That's you using a logical fallacy and misleading the town. Right there. If you're gonna argue this you might as well use http://www.dictionary.com to check the word "Fallacy" as well.
And, even if you are right, withholding information, voting without giving a good reason and overall not contributing substantially to the game is deff scummy.

A. I think you're calling me scum because you're mad that I'm pushing a case against you.

Not at all. I'm calling you scum because the chances you are town are too slim. A townie has no reason to lie and mislead the town like you have nor to misrep and use shady votes to lynch some1 who hasn't done anything scummy enough to warrant a lynch. My emotions have nothing to do with it. It's simple logic.

B. I think you KNOW I'm town because you're scum.

Ok.. anything to back that up or are you just using crap-logic and the unfounded presumption that you are townie to built an argument?

C. It's never a good idea to say "OR YOU'RE A TOWNIE, BUT I'M OK WITH LYNCHING YOU ANYWAYS" in a game with only two mislynches.

That's it! Take out of context! At least don't use comas when you don't really quote me. It's less obvious when you are trying to mislead. I said no such thing. I said i think you are scum and if you aren't ( there's always the chance i'm wrong ) then you are the worse townie i've ever seen. how in HELL is that the same thing you "quoted"? I can't possibly point out how blatantly scummy you are and how you blatantly try to mislead by lying, misreping and using logical fallacies.

[Stef]

Carboose:
- Why haven't you unvoted knowing that i'm at L-1 and considering your vote is from the RVS and considering you haven't really mentioned any suspicions of me?

Empking:
- Why are you asking for claims all the time? How would it be helpful for the town?
- Can you please build cases against the people you suspect?
- Your vote against me, considering the circumstances, is only based on me putting Occam at L-1 for a short period of time? Do you think that is enough to warrant my lynch?
- You said that 4 people have me as their main suspect. Who are those 4 people?

Orlotan:
- Why does Occam appear pro-town to you? Please elaborate with explicit points.
- Why is it confusing when i self-vote and unvote in the same post in the RVS as a joke? And it wasn't pointless. It was a joke in the RVS. It was supposed to make people at least smile. Don't you know Ahmed the dead terrorist?
- How is voting Occam ("an attempt to wagon Occam") scummy if i think he's scum and i bring arguments to back that up?
- How is his vote NOT OMGUS when his stated reason is clearly not enough to warrant a confirmed vote at L-1 under the shady circumstances?
- Why would you say you don't like the accusations regarding Occam misleading and misreping? How do they seem to be distractions when i actually back them up with arguments and quotes? If you are going to bash my case and defend Occam at least have the decency to point out the flaws ( if you can find them ) in my case. Unless you do that you are defending Occam with no real reason and misleading as well.

Crazy: Care to write down your thoughts on what has happened lately?

Mada: Waiting for the post you promised.

[Stef]

Bah.. this is getting on my nerves. Even now you use a whole bucket of WIFOM as defense which is a clear scum-tell.

You obviously weren't THAT sure I was scum because you pulled your vote off of me almost immediately thereafter.

It had nothing to do with my suspicions of you. I didn't want to keep you at L-1 with RVS votes and i wanted the discussion to go on. How tunnel-visioned can you be? You don't take reason into consideration. You only see the parts of a whole that fit your story.

I don't consider Caboose's vote random any longer. If he declares it random or removes it, I will consider it so, but thus far he hasn't.

But then again he hasn't really been around now has he? And you are pretty much taking advantage of that to try and get me killed. I had no intention of lynching you at that moment when i put you at L-1. I did it for reactions and unvoted afterward. You clearly have not. What is your reason for being so sure i'm scum again? Really curious. Please just state simple facts and quotes to back them up. I'm very anxious how the "stef is scum" case looks like and how much credit it actually has.

The fact that it put me at L-1 after YOU had made the big stink about L-2 was what made it suspicious.

So you are using both the fact that i put you at L-1 and the fact that I unvoted you afterward as scummy things i did but you fail to connect them and see the possibility it was a gambit proven by the fact that i unvoted. More narrow-tunnel-vision.

2. Actually, I suspect that Caboose is also scum, who is currently distancing you. I also predict that he'll withdraw his vote in the first post he makes after he comes back to the game... or will he, now that I've said something...

So you make D1 P5 scum-team speculation based on Carboose who voted me in the RVS and who has posted 4 times since then two of which have been to complain about a so-called-headache. Whoa... And about you're prediction: that's utterly crap besides being blatantly WIFOM, you also try to make a possibly founded unvote scummy? Geez. You have NO grounds for that statement. That's even more scum misleading + WIFOM attack.

I'm saying that what you said is crap, not that what you said I said was crap. Get it?

Hard to get it when you make no sense. If you understand it don't take the other people's understanding as granted. I think i don't need to prove i know how to read.

Lol, right? Because this is pretty much what your case on me is founded on

I wish i could quote Empking but i'm to lazy. You very well know that's not what my case against you is founded. Don't tell me you actually didn't notice all the points i made against you. Besides THAT IS WIFOM DEFENSE. It's a classical scum-tell and i can only hope people will see this and see through you. So help me god after all this if you aren't scum then I am not playing a game with you ever again.

My bad for assuming that someone who has posted regularly and had the chance to withdraw his vote doesn't have reasons for it.

NOTHING YOU SAID WILL CHANGE THE FACT THAT YOU LIED! You not admitting to a blatant lie is yet another clue to you being scum.

The example quote of mine that you cite in no way demonstrates a logical fallacy. I said: "Just because someone doesn't make a page long case doesn't mean they don't have a decent reason." That is a 100% valid statement and in no way meets this definition:

It's not because by leaving the other part out it has become logically unsound and it is used to mislead and that makes it a logical fallacy.

Assuming that I'd ACTUALLY TRY TO MISLEAD THE TOWN INTO NOT THINKING YOU UNVOTED YOURSELF IN THE SAME POST. Only a COMPLETE BUFFOON would try to argue something that could be disproved with a simple quote. I can tell you (and I hope you'll take my word) that I am NOT a COMPLETE BUFFOON.

Even more WIFOM defense. This is making my brain hurt.

nothing except everything I've said, which is plenty.

Plenty to show that you are scum since you haven't really made a decent case against me. You have been to busy defending yourself and misreping to actually find evidence.

Is this another Lol? You clearly stated: OR YOU ARE THE WORST TOWNIE I HAVE EVER SEEN... meaning YOU ARE EITHER SCUM OR A BAD TOWNIE - EITHER WAY I'M FINE WITH LYNCHING YOU.

How DIDN'T you say that. Cause you did. You did. You said it.

I think you are scum and if you aren't then you're the worst townie i've ever seen.

"OR YOU'RE A TOWNIE, BUT I'M OK WITH LYNCHING YOU ANYWAYS"

That's a blatant misrep. You go against me by saying that i'm fine with lynching a townie when i said i want to lynch you because i think you are scum. The "if you aren't" is just my amazement about your play and it doesn't really mean what you said and you know it. Nobody can be convinced 100% of some1 else being scum D1 with a Day start. I'm leaning 90% for you and that's more than enough to lynch you. Having 10% reserve and admitting to the possibility i'm wrong is only normal since i can't be 100% right of anything atm. How isn't it a blatant misrep when you take me admitting that there's a very small chance i'm wrong and using it as "HE SAYS WANTS TO LYNCH A TOWNIE!"? Are you for real?

Stef... I don't think I'll ever understand you, but I don't have to understand you to know you're scum.

The only way you could know any alignment at this point of the game is if you are scum. Wasn't that already said? Oh well.

This said.. i wish i had more votes to vote you with. However i don't.. so.. people.. start posting and decide if it's me or him who makes more sense. I'm dry out of patience.

[Stef]

Darox, can you please prod crazy? Thanks

[Stef]

Carboose has made no such statement .. ortolan said i'm scummy but hasn't voted for me nor has he said he wants me lynched. That leaves you and Occam and i'm pretty sure he's scum. A claim at this stage would serve no purpose and would be anti-town.

As for that not being the reason you mentioned in your vote post.. lol:

Confirm Vote; Stef

Putting someone at L-2 is scummy but L-1 isn't. [/b]

unvote

Vote: Stef

Self voted and hasn't got his vote on someone.

The reason you voted for me in the first place is what warrants my lynch?
Since the other reason you gave in your "voting" posts was the one i mentioned.

I'll repeat this.. what is your case against me?

[Stef]

Ehm.. this was supposed to be the post:
---------------------------
Carboose has made no such statement .. ortolan said i'm scummy but hasn't voted for me nor has he said he wants me lynched. That leaves you and Occam and i'm pretty sure he's scum. A claim at this stage would serve no purpose and would be anti-town.

As for that not being the reason you mentioned in your vote post.. lol:

Confirm Vote; Stef

Putting someone at L-2 is scummy but L-1 isn't.

unvote

Vote: Stef

Self voted and hasn't got his vote on someone.

The reason you voted for me in the first place is what warrants my lynch?
Since the other reason you gave in your "voting" posts was the one i mentioned.

I'll repeat this.. what is your case against me?

[Stef]

Its L-1 with Cabboose voting you. You must be his top suspect. Your hasn't voted me argument is bad.

Huh? I haven't seen him post much really. I am not denying that i might be his top suspect but his posts so far indicate that it's more likely he didn't realize he has a vote on me since he hasn't posted one single phrase indicating that he has any suspicion on me. I guess only he can say what's behind it.

- You didn't have a vote on someone

Since when is that a tell of anything? Are you for real? If you really think it's a tell please explain how it works and how it benefits mafia

- The l-1, L-2 thing. (What you find most scummy, is what you do as scum)

What i do as scum? lol.. do you even bother to scum-hunt?

- Constantly misinterpreting the attack against her.

Great defense of Occam! How did i misinterpret in my attack? Please provide quotes

- Arguing that because Ortolan sidn't hammer, he must not find him scummy.

Where did i ever say that because he didn't hammer he doesn't find me scummy? Please read what i said again and don't misinterpret again

[Stef]

- Arguing that because Ortolan sidn't hammer, he must not find him scummy.

ortolan said i'm scummy but hasn't voted for me nor has he said he wants me lynched.

How am i arguing that he must not find me scummy when I mentioned he thinks i'm scummy? Jeez..

[Stef]

And i fail to see where you have quoted or pointed out misinterpretations on my account.

[Stef]

He has stated his suspicion of me before i was in this situation and yet he did not vote. That could mean something or it might not. Wasn't really relevant. My whole argument was that you are exaggerating when you say that 4 people have me as their main suspects. The most blatant example is Carboose and Orlotan isn't far behind. Why do you feel the need to speak for then instead of waiting for them to actually say what they think?

I don't see the need for exaggeration in this case for neither you or Occam. The only reason you might have to do this is to make me think this is more than it actually is and claim. Me claiming is anti-town.

FoS: Empking

[Stef]

I'm not saying anything till someone tells Stef he's wrong. It's a waste of time.

Tell me i'm wrong? Lmao.. PROVE IT! That's the lamest thing i've seen so far. Asking for others to tell me i'm wrong when i'm having a quote-war with you? That's just sad. And proof that you've run out of arguments to defend yourself. Scum.

[Stef]

Hi, sorry for disappearing. I'll look into this game and post tomorrow.

Looking forward to it. One way or the other this game needs new blood. Hopefully Carboose and Orlotan will also come to give us their opinions and actually play the game.

[Stef]

I could respond to every one of your posts - but without outside input its going nowhere. And you're wrong, and I think everyone else will realize that when they read you - so I'm going to let someone else do the talking for a bit.

Sure you are. I'm not wrong and any person with a common sense can see that. Anyway.. this is pointless since you stopped talking till some1 else starts giving input. Hopefully some of our less active players like Crazy, Carboose, Mada and Orlotan.

[Stef]

This is getting utterly ridiculous.

Carboose is posting daily but he hasn't posted here in 3 days.
Same for Orlotan.

Darox: Please prod these two or replace them.

[Stef]

Now you have. I agree that empking and carboose are both scummy as well but the problem is we only have two scum.

And regarding my attempt to distance myself from a possible Occam lynch in the opportunity he's town, that's not the case.

Crazy appears to have disappeared again since he still hasn't posted.

Carboose is getting on my nerves. He's completely ignoring what everybody else is saying + his previous actions make him scummy enough. Talk more and contribute more Carboose.

Unvote: Occam Vote: Carboose

[Stef]

4 days since crazy last posted...

Mod: please send some prods to those who haven't posted in the last 3 days, Crazy and Mada.

[Stef]

It looks to me like Caboose is being quiet until Crazy's next post. That's it. If anyone is at fault it's Crazy.

... How many forum Mafia games have you finished so far?

[Stef]

... How many forum Mafia games have you finished so far?

Many many many. But why does that make a difference? You've only been here since September!!!

That isn't the point. IF you think NOT answering so many people for over a week is ok just because he said he doesn't post till crazy posts then you are either noob, scum, idiot or brilliant. You don't seem to be more brilliant than the average guy so that leaves the last 3. Considering you said you've played "many many many" .. well.. before i jump to conclusions please explain how is it ok to do what caboose has done so far? And how is it Crazy's fault that Caboose has been so non-interactive? That's one of the logical fallacies i've been talking about.

[Stef]

I do owe this game a reread.

Hopefully we'll get it ... eventually..

[Stef]

He is being blamed by me and others for being non-responsive and actively lurking. How is that OK for him to do?

[Stef]

Good. Then, why did you hammer? You appear to have had a sudden change of heart since you first stated that you don't see anything wrong with what he did and then you hammered based on the reason you claimed was not suspicious at all. It's simply inconsistent.

[Stef]

Are you mad I killed your scumpartner?

[sarcasm]Yeah.. that must be it! Every time some1 lays an anti-town hammer the person asking him why must be his partner. [/sarcasm]

[Stef]

EBWOP: Bah.. must be the partner of the person lynched*

[Stef]

Because it was sudden, there was time till a deadline for more discussion, there were issues still on the table like Crazy and Caboose and you came out of the blue and hammered. How is that pro-town?

[Stef]

Or better yet.. how is it NOT anti-town?

[Stef]

A. It doesn't matter if he's scum or not. It doesn't change my points explaining why it's anti-town.
B. How do you know you'll be alive tomorrow?

[Stef]

I do want you to answer that question. As i said: if he turns out scum it doesn't change the fact that the hammer was anti-town. Your reasons for cutting the day short are bullshit.

How would it be stupid for scum to kill you? You used a WIFOM defense. Scum wouldn't kill you if you were scum. Otherwise there's no way to know if you will be night-killed or not.

There was NO rush to hammer. There was NO rush whatsoever. In a game with so few players days should be as long as possible to find out as much as possible. Nothing you say will change that. The only way it would have been reasonable is if you would have KNOWN, as town, that he is scum. There is no way of that being the case.

[Stef]

1. Asked me to answer a question, then told me no answer would satisfy it, negating the purpose of asking it.
2. Said something flat out wrong about scum NKs.
3. Pointed out the obvious, which is that town can't KNOW who the scum are.

1. Misrep much? I said that no matter what you say it will still be anti-town. That is not related to me wanting you to further explain your reasons. You're picking unrelated straws and putting them together to make a point. That point is non-existent since you misrepped what i said.
2. What exactly is flat wrong about scum NK's? Please quote the exact phrase. Really curious how you're going to pull this one through.
3. Wrong. Pointed out the obvious that SCUM DO.

[Stef]

I'm the seer. I investigated Occam and he's not a wolf.

[Stef]

how is it clear that he is scum?

[Stef]

Ok.. i guess this is my decision now ... and it will most likely win or loose the game. I'll read and vote soon.

[Stef]

I'm simply not buying crazy's case. I think he is the scum. If i'm wrong we loose.. if i'm right we win. I don't have time right now to explain my decision into detail since its a very busy period.

Vote Crazy

and GO TOWN!

[Stef]

Did we just loose?