[OLD] Open Setup Ideas and Discussion

[Xylthixlm]

Re-nominate

Rebels in the Palace

, as its nomination somehow translated into an AitP nomination on the way to the queue.

[Xylthixlm]

Rebels in the Palace

8 Rebels (win if King is lynched)
3 Guards (know who King is but not who the other Guards are, win if King + Guards >= Rebels)
1 King (doesn't know anyone, wins if King + Guards >= Rebels)

Assassins in the Palace

2 Assassins (have vengeful kill when lynched, win if King dies)
9 Guards (know who King is but not who the other Guards are, win if all Assassins are dead)
1 King (doesn't know anyone, wins if all Assassins are dead)

[Xylthixlm]

1) Did the standards change, or am I wrong about something being standard?
2) Both are nightless. Assassins can only talk to each other in twighlight or pregame. Correct?
3) Is Your given Assassin's Setup really in the queue now?

1) That was from memory, so I'm not surprised if it's wrong
2) Don't know
3) I proposed RitP in the last thread, and it got nominated/seconded/etc., but somehow AitP got added to the open queue instead of RitP. I have no idea if that's still in the queue or if it got run.

[Xylthixlm]

Mutually Assured Destruction

4 scum, 8 town.
Day 1, the players to decide who to lynch normally. Then the lynched player gets a kill before they die, then the killed player gets a kill, etc, until the remaining players are all town or all scum. The player can choose not to kill, in which case it goes back to lynching. Players (including the player about to make the next kill) can talk at any time.

[Xylthixlm]

Chain Reaction

The no-time-limit was because, honestly, I don't expect people to ever decide to go back to lynching. But adding a time limit might add some incentive to do so.

[Xylthixlm]

Chain Reaction

I've run a game called that what about:

Everybody's Vengeful

How about

Popcorn

?

Also, rethinking the math I think 9-3 is better than 8-4.

[Xylthixlm]

Needs more anti-meta.

15 town, each selected randomly and independently from this table:
1-2: tracker
3: vig
4: reporter
5: watcher
6: bodyguard
7: jailkeeper
8: super saint
9-30: vanilla townie

I have faith in the binomial distribution.

[Xylthixlm]

If I had time I'd graph the expected number of power roles in my formulation vs yours.

EDIT:

Which one is yours and which one is mine?




















Yours is on the left.

[Xylthixlm]

We should call it "Nothing at all like C9".

[Xylthixlm]

Nominate Vengeful

second

third

[Xylthixlm]

1 PokerFace (must find and lynch Ythill)
3 Angry Townies (must find and lynch PokerFace)
1 Ythill (must survive)

[Xylthixlm]

Gunsmith

2 Mafia

1 SK (Kills with a spoon.)

2 Cops (only see Mafia)
2 Gunsmiths
1 of Cop or Gunsmith who doesn't carry a gun.

The mafia claim cop, and hope they don't get caught by the real cops. Probably devolves to a counterclaim situation.

The SK claims gunsmith and tries to guess who the real gunsmiths are so he doesn't out himself by his role.

Nobody actually scumhunts.

[Xylthixlm]

Well-played mountainous tends towards the same win probabilities as you would get from random lynching.

[Xylthixlm]

Yes you can. And should.

[Xylthixlm]

Meh Dethy

- it's a logic puzzle, not Mafia.

I think we can agree that there should be a rule that says "games that do not start off with more than one scum player are not mafia" -- that is my objection to Dethy anyway. It needs more scumz.

Nominate SS3

[Xylthixlm]

2:10 Bugs Bunny

("What's up, doc?")
2 mafia
1 doctor
9 townies

[Xylthixlm]

Doc with no power roles to protect just keeps mafia from killing all the good scumhunters.

[Xylthixlm]

I think "swingy" means something like "reduces the effect of skill on the outcome".

[Xylthixlm]

Needs more simple, playable setups.

[Xylthixlm]

How about this?
2 Mafia Goons
1 Even Night Cop
1 Odd Night Doctor
5 Vanilla Townies
Day Start

Does it start day 1 - night 2 or day 1 - night 1?

...

You need to ask?

[Xylthixlm]

Nokill 10

6 townies
1 doctor
1 roleblocker
2 mafia

Day start, mafia must kill every night.

[Xylthixlm]

3 mafia role blockers

3 mafia role blockers
5 cops
1 doctor

night start


have fun with hypocop.

Hmm. Night 0: A cop dies, three others are blocked. One gets a result.
Day 1: Cop with result claims. Doc claims, since the mafia know who he is anyways (he wasn't blocked and doesn't have a result). No lynch.
Night 1: A cop dies, the rest are blocked.
Day 2: It's now lylo (3 vs 4) with one doc and one sane cop result. Town is screwed.

[Xylthixlm]

Hypocop just makes

all

the cop results useless.

[Xylthixlm]

assuming that the doctor doesn't block the N0 kill:

• N0:
  • nk:
    
    5/6 chance of cop death
    • RB:
      
      2/5 chance of 3 cops RB'd -- 1 unblocked investigation
      3/5 chance of 2 cops and 1 doc RB'd -- 2 unblocked investigations
    1/6 chance of doc death -- 2 unblocked investigations
    
    
    Result:
    2/3 chance of 2 unblocked cop investigations, 1/3 chance of 1 unblocked investigation

So there are three possible game states for day 1:

a: 1/6 chance of a dead doc, two unblocked cop investigations (each with 1/3 chance of catching scum)
b: 2/6 chance of living doc and 1 unblocked investigation
c: 3/6 chance of living doc and 2 unblocked investigations

Town is screwed.

are you still sure that this is broken for scum Xyl?

A 1 in 3 chance of the game being nearly unwinnable for town before day 1 starts is too high.

[Xylthixlm]

Based on further calculations and observations, I think Rebels in the Palace might be actually good if it had three fewer rebels and one fewer guard...

RitP 8

1 King (wins when King + guards >= rebels)
2 guards (know who King is, win when King + guards >= rebels)
5 rebels (win when King is dead)

This has an EV of 56% for the king+guards and 44% for the rebels.

[Xylthixlm]

A game with a dominant strategy is called a "puzzle". If you know the dominant strategy, it's a solved puzzle.

[Xylthixlm]

From the Open Certification Group thread: Bird C9 may need renaming since it has none of the traits that C9 got its name for.

How about just "Bird"?

[Xylthixlm]

Bird open?

[Xylthixlm]

Macho Bird C9

Fail.

[Xylthixlm]

Mandatory lynches

and

NKs? I take it you're fond of zugzwang.

[Xylthixlm]

Let's make the cop one-shot only on even nights, and the doc one-shot only on odd nights, and make it so the doc can't protect the cop, and give the scum a roleblocker.

[Xylthixlm]

Let's make the cop one-shot only on even nights, and the doc one-shot only on odd nights, and make it so the doc can't protect the cop, and give the scum a roleblocker.

And a one-shot odd night deputy and a one-shot even night nurse. And make the scum werewolves 50% of the time.

The really, really amusing part is that this setup is unbalanced in favor of the town.

[Xylthixlm]

7-player with vig

2 mafia
1 cop
1 vigilante
3 vanilla