DHSDSM beta: Game Over.

[Ojando]

"Another one Bites the dust"... I think it is safe to now assume A & B lied about killing FrogDodge and submitted a Sex wi5th Ed kill... Thanks.. Two down, two to go.... Hmmm.......

Umm, no.
I find it utterly strange that you are or pretend to be so clueless about the game mechanic when this has been spelled out to you already, IIRC after the lynch of A&B. SWSWC was killed ridiculously much later than 30 hours after A&B's last breath, so it can't have been A&B.
Either Frog dodging had protection or then A&B lied to piss them of or something. And we must still have someone alive outside of the mafia that can kill.

I am not going to change my opinion of how off it feels for Yos to defend Nuwen, however I will give you this point they WERE scum in Alpha and I absolutely do not feel they are scum here anymore. Dude she kicked our asses in Heavens Gates, so for him to say she is inexperienced is off in my humble opinion. Regarding your further comments again me and Nuwen simulposted... My response was NOT to her aim logs...

Yosarian said that their case on you guys was originally Nuwen's read. That's the only thing I can understand you were referring to, this whole inexperienced thing comes from alpha and imo never surfaced in beta. Even though you changed your mind, unless you convincingly explain your thought process about where exactly you thought Yos was defending Nuwen ITT (with quotes) I'm gonna perceive that accusation as twisted enough to be quite scummy.

So basically my choices for scum are unlikely to be lynched, so I should mindlessly follow everyone else? Riiiiight.

The problem is you're not putting any arguments forward or making any case. You've just been putting forward a lone vote based on impression, or voicing your suspicions based on something you haven't even bothered to look up again ("Gut. And I think he made a vote I didn't like the timing of" about why our predecessor was scummy to you). This method marginalizes your contributions very much.

It depends on which half. The half that likes to lurk to victory is also the one that tunnels like mad when town. So seesawing and lurking would lean scum - heavily.

In our opinion Zaphod's strongly meta-based attack displayed for example in above quote is a strange viewpoint. They're trying to meta a hydra based on their experience with the 2 heads and assuming that they'll act like zaphod expects. That seesawing part in above quote for example was clearly two people going in different directions and zaphod saying this is scummy because one of the heads tunnels as town is just a dodgy argument.
In post 201 Zaphod also agreed with selected points from shafteds list of people including in the quotes was RW seeming townish. Yet in same breath she contradicted herself as being ready to lynch RW.
Just last page Zaphod said:

@ Yosariwen
I don't understand why you're voting RW when Poke is another main suspect of yours, has a far larger wagon, and you think Poke may be RW's buddy. To wit: "*10. PoketheAlpaca (PokerFace+populartajo) : Along with the other things that have been pointed out, possible link to Raging Wishbone, in this post where he defends Raging wishbone. "

In 201 Zaphod herself switched their vote to Trotsky, although their hydra was a strong suspector of PTA's. I think SWSWC's flip as scum makes PtA less likely to be mafia, but Zaphod's switch happened before SWSWC got killed.

I need to talk to my better half, at the moment Zaphod, Zmd and RW are the most scummy to me.

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

For once in my life - I'd swear that adding a megapost to this game would make me sick. That, among other things, is making it fairly hard for me to really get into this game. I'll try to put in more effort and do my best here. Right now, my best will hopefully be fairly concise. PREVIW EDIT: Sorry, nevermind; that didn't really happen.

Sex Club. Before I forget, noting that I have seen Elvis-GF bus a buddy not under too much overt suspicion. Gut, though, agrees with J-Scope: PtA isn't a likely buddy of Sex Club.

Hm. Not sure how much that means in either direction, but I found it skimming around. Putting it up on the corkboard for now.

Whether or not scum will post fluff is a WIFOM storm. If it's excessive, why, we've already discussed at length why that's very anti-town. Otherwise there are two balancing WIFOM elements - scum may jump on fluffy stuff which isn't excessive, or scum may attempt to post semi-fluff. I'll deal with it on a case-by-case basis, but theory arguments like this, especially in a game weighed down by megaposts, are derailing.

Yosariwen, I need you to detail what about Sex Club's posting during the A&B lynch looked so notably pro-town, please. Also - you thought the wagon was either scum-supported or not opposed by the scum. Can you pinpoint what gave you this feeling?

I'm still trying to decide what exactly I'm feeling off that post of Yosariwen's. However, the recent development of the Sex Club flip has definitely led me to question the PtA wagon - which I was on, basically.

I think Yoswen is scum with PTA and is trying both to derail his wagon and tie RW to him if he gets lynched regardless and flips scum.

Post. Rubs me the wrong way.

By the way, PtA, my post under the Plum account was a bit mixed up - I think it seemed that I was making a response to you, which you commented on, which was actually directed at RW. I was being called off the computer and didn't have time to preview my post and realize that my copy/pasting had often been in wrong sections of that post.

I still believe that the general attack on me for my analysis of A&B &c. is weak and the fact tells more about my general playstyle than my alignment.

Ah, I see what I was feeling about Yosariwen's post: Probably town player working hard to put together an analysis of a game they're not quite feeling, being a bit frustrated. Unless he's lying about spending two hours on Post 179 . . . I'm getting the vibe of a true attempt at scumhunting from someone frustrated with the game.

RW, I don't always expect great things of you, but your case on Yosariwen frankly sucks. I do not see a compelling enough meta argument to begin to justfy your vote there. Wait. Wait wait wait. I noticed that Sex Club was early on the A&B wagon. Where was RW? His random vote went there. Then Sex Club came along, then Pesco Light (now Nybs) then Trotsky (PtA, let this be a mini-analysis of that wagon looking for possible scum opportunism &c., as you asked; it was a reasonable request). This is all on page 1-2. Sex Club also attacked PtA early.

Why has apples and bananas wagon died? Because they decided to try to look like they're playing the game? All they did was agree with Yosariwen's point and hide behind them. Agreeing is fine. Wagoning is fine. No original thinking = scum.

This was when the first PtA wagon seemed to be overtaking the A&B one. Curious, curious - also screwing with my read on what Sex Club may be up to.

@Kmd

, I think I've learned how to read you; come back moar plz so I can do that kthx.

Gah, RW wasn't voting much as the A&B and PtA wagons were competeing early on. However:

People seem fixtated on the idea that we should only lynch once per action block. This is how things work in regular games, but I don't see why this should be how things will work here. The more and the earlier we lynch, the less kills scum have, the better. I therefore suggest we try writing fewer posts, with more content. I'm not saying people should be terrified of posting, but saying more in fewer posts gains us valuable space. I think people should try treating this game as a form of Verbose Mafia, and only post when they either have a substantial point (which doesn't require the post to be long) to make or several small ones. For example, despite being an entirely valid point, this:

Gut read isn't as conclusive as a post of making a scummy excuse.

could've waited until he had more to say. And of course, "I'll reread later" posts and the such are entirely redundant. This approach may slow down the game a bit, but I think the gain is worth it and anyways our energy is more needed elsewhere.

That, and I think we should be much more lenient towards lynching than we usually are. Again, lynching doesn't cost us scumkills here. Wasting too many posts on not lynching does. So go violence!

DGB feels highly unnatural here, on top of being sorta useless thus far.

Vote Zaphod Beeblebrox

. The Apples and Bananas wagon is good too.

Um, wait. Here you advocate not wasting posts on not lynching, and seem to like the A&B wagon, but don't elaborate on either

and

vote for the one of us less likely to be lynched quickly? Tis odd, and by odd I mean shadyish, suspect.

alpaca's contentless posts do not sit well with me, and neither do A&B's.

vote: applesandbanana

A&B's overdefensiveness combined with the hypocritical attempt to shift the wagon onto alpaca make them seem more likely scum to me, but based on the interactions, I am reasonably sure that exactly one of them is scum.

Hold on a sec. Pity you replaced out; otherwise

WHAT THE HECK

THIS

HERE IS REAL SETTING-UP LYNCHES

. Ojando, if you happen to have any insights as to the thought process here, feel free to share them. If anyone can tell whether Death mean scum as in Mafia (as opposed to scum as in any anti-town-aligned player), I'd be much obliged; that's be useful.

Back to RW. After maybe trying not to lynch A&B so darn quickly, or something, whatever it was, he votes them to L-1 (they'd been there on and off for about that whole page) for 'being scum'. That's about the most explicit he got there.

"Feh, ZMD's most recent post is sparse and almost purely responsive. Everything about his post is watered down and galvanized only by questions. Even his case and vote are forced in order to refute ShaftedSex."

Har. Noting this observation for posterity.

Also RW, why did you unvote Yosariwen when they were still your top suspect??? Whence comes this new read on them?

Wait, shaft.ed attacks Yosariwen's case on RW? My scumdar, vacillate no more (please; it's very late at night). Also see his claim of a townish read on RW in the same post. Excellent stuff, the element of surprise, I must say.

On Zaphod Beeblebrox, I see the case being pushed against them as wobbly. I could see town do the 'gloating' at the sk lynch too.

For the record, there was one line in there which may have read as personal gloating which wasn't meant to be. It may have been read as 'Good, I caught the SK'; I mean 'Good, the SK has been caught'. If this makes any difference to anyone. In other news, I approve of Nybs' idea, I guess; I don't approve of her support for a Yosariwen lynch.

Recent events make me feel less confident that PtA is likely scum, more convinced that RW is likely scum.

[quote="Zaphod Beeblebrox"I agree with the above extracts from your post. I could definitely give a Trotsky or RW lynch a shot. As in, a shot in the head.

I am so glad you agreee with the above, but no where in SexEd's post did she indicate she wanted me lynched... Spin conversations much?[/quote]

'Oh noes, shaft.ed's subtle defenses of me aren't taking root in the minds of the town!'? Fair possibility. Hmph.

Not hating this plan, BUT I dont want to quick lynch people I think are town... I also would like to here what my partner says when he gets back, but, at this point this is the best scum read I have....

FOS: Trotsky
FOS: ZMD

No! Remember, even you noted that we're sorta on a post budget here! Always having your vote somewhere is especially necessary. FOSes with out votes are suspicious.

i haven't completely gone through all of the monster posts that have been made recently, but i will be getting together with my other head and doing that soon. a cursory glance up the page after this shaft.elvis death gives me a warm fuzzy about zaphod's chances of being a scumpartner.

Specifically, why are you getting this warm fuzzy feeling???

PtA, I see you don't feel that shaft.ed's post saying he had a town vibe on RW points to RW being his scumbuddy, but I can't exactly tell why not. Elaborate, please.

Unvote; Vote: Raging Wishbone

Possibly a better lynch than Trotsky (I need some converse with DGB on the matter), probably more likely to happen in a more agreeable timeframe. Maybe - here's Nybs' list with my edits:

Whom I'm willing to lynch now (update it as you post):
1. Zaphod Beeblebrox (0)
3. Zmd (0)
4. Trotsky(3): nyballosulgniirkps, ZMD, Zaphod Beeblebrox
5. Ojando (1): ZMD
7. Yosariwen (1): nybaloosulgniirkps
8. Ortohoops (1): ZMD

9. sex w/ shafteds wife club(0):

10. PoketheAlpaca (0):
11. nyballosulgniirkps (0):
12. Raging Wishbone (1): Zaphod Beeblebrox
13. J-Scope (0):
14. Frog Dodging (0):

[Saunt Adelaus]

Looking through my messages, I see that I've sent out some mixed signals.

"Possible Roles
All roles that appear in the game are from this list. Not every role in this list is used in the game. This setup will include 1 Mafia Group of 3 players, AND at least 1 Compulsive Vig OR 1 Sk."

the "OR" is exclusive. There can't be a vig left in the game since there was a SK, but there might be 1 or more additional SKs left in the game.

[Raging Wishbone]

Thank you Santa Claus...

*pinches*

"Another one Bites the dust"... I think it is safe to now assume A & B lied about killing FrogDodge and submitted a Sex wi5th Ed kill... Thanks.. Two down, two to go.... Hmmm.......

Umm, no.
I find it utterly strange that you are or pretend to be so clueless about the game mechanic when this has been spelled out to you already, IIRC after the lynch of A&B. SWSWC was killed ridiculously much later than 30 hours after A&B's last breath, so it can't have been A&B.
Either Frog dodging had protection or then A&B lied to piss them of or something. And we must still have someone alive outside of the mafia that can kill.

NO, NO, noooooo, lol OJ, this was not clear, there were some minor semantic wonderings and all. Nice try, but the Question has NOW been answered here....

Looking through my messages, I see that I've sent out some mixed signals.

"Possible Roles
All roles that appear in the game are from this list. Not every role in this list is used in the game. This setup will include 1 Mafia Group of 3 players, AND at least 1 Compulsive Vig OR 1 Sk."

the "OR" is exclusive. There can't be a vig left in the game since there was a SK, but there might be 1 or more additional SKs left in the game.

It seems to me, YOU are the one who was confussed and has been passing out bad information! I do think it is utterly strange the way you are or pretend to be so clueless as to the mechanic of this game... There are other scenarios including a Doctor, BUT have you not ever heard of Occam's Razor? Anyways, thanks but the rules are pretty clear now, no matter how badly you tried to confuse the subject.

Now I repeat my question that I have asked three times in this thread already, why is FrogDodge still alive? From the rules....

Serial Killer

You are an evil and calculating Serial Killer. Because you are so crafty, you are immune to kills other than your own.

[/color]

A&B lied or he did not! There was either a RB, Doc protect OR A&B told the truth and tried to kill FrogDodge but could not cause he is a SK. I'll get back to this...

I am not going to change my opinion of how off it feels for Yos to defend Nuwen, however I will give you this point they WERE scum in Alpha and I absolutely do not feel they are scum here anymore. Dude she kicked our asses in Heavens Gates, so for him to say she is inexperienced is off in my humble opinion. Regarding your further comments again me and Nuwen simulposted... My response was NOT to her aim logs...

Yosarian said that their case on you guys was originally Nuwen's read. That's the only thing I can understand you were referring to, this whole inexperienced thing comes from alpha and imo never surfaced in beta. Even though you changed your mind, unless you convincingly explain your thought process about where exactly you thought Yos was defending Nuwen ITT (with quotes) I'm gonna perceive that accusation as twisted enough to be quite scummy.

My post was a simulpost with yos/nuw... I dont need to "convincingly explain anything to anyone", we "Cross-posted".. Read much? I am not going to explain again how OFF it is for him to call her inexperienced after Heavens Gate! Regardless, I think they are the closest thing to town we have, why do I need to explain more? Wanna another wall O'Text, no prob (j/k, lol)...

Seriousley, you do need to confer with your BETTER half! Cause you aint gettin it done.

RW, I don't always expect great things of you, but your case on Yosariwen frankly sucks. I do not see a compelling enough meta argument to begin to justfy your vote there. Wait. Wait wait wait. I noticed that Sex Club was early on the A&B wagon. Where was RW? His random vote went there. Then Sex Club came along, then Pesco Light (now Nybs) then Trotsky (PtA, let this be a mini-analysis of that wagon looking for possible scum opportunism &c., as you asked; it was a reasonable request). This is all on page 1-2. Sex Club also attacked PtA early.

lol, meh I don't blame ya.... What part of UNVOTE do you not understand? It was a good, safe vote at the time, same as you...see I learned from "one of the best" DGB...she likes to just push buttons and form wagons to see who will follow...

Back to RW. After maybe trying not to lynch A&B so darn quickly, or something, whatever it was, he votes them to L-1 (they'd been there on and off for about that whole page) for 'being scum'. That's about the most explicit he got there.

What part of lynching an sk do you not like? Please enlighten me with your wisdom as I would really ike to know why it was not good we lynched A&B!

I agree with the above extracts from your post. I could definitely give a Trotsky or RW lynch a shot. As in, a shot in the head.

I am so glad you agreee with the above, but no where in SexEd's post did she indicate she wanted me lynched... Spin conversations much?

'Oh noes, shaft.ed's subtle defenses of me aren't taking root in the minds of the town!'? Fair possibility. Hmph.

Yeah, and the fact that she practically declared J-scope Town in that post did not enter your cute lil mind Plum? I bet it entered a few other Townies minds.

Not hating this plan, BUT I dont want to quick lynch people I think are town... I also would like to here what my partner says when he gets back, but, at this point this is the best scum read I have....

FOS: Trotsky
FOS: ZMD

No! Remember, even you noted that we're sorta on a post budget here! Always having your vote somewhere is especially necessary. FOSes with out votes are suspicious.

GAH, lol... No that was a manipulative load of crap wasn't it Plum? That post of mine covered, the previous thirty or so "long posts" and took a lot of fucking time! So please don''t try to imply because I decided to FOS instead of Voting for someone that it is scummy, lol... meh fine you want a vote!

VOTE: FrogDodge

Unless we can figure out if A&B was lying... I see no other reason he is not dead. I kinda would like to stick with Occams Razor.

@FrogDodge - Seriousley Dude, why were you so confident A&B lied or you had protection... you wrote in response (paraphrased) to his claim, "Dont count us out until we are dead". You seemed positive you would not be SK'd!

@Ortohoops and JScope still waiting for your screencaps so we can compare them to the Alpha game.

@OJ - Where did you get 30 hours from anyway?

[J-Scope]

@RW: What are you looking for in this QT?

If anyone hasn't read the end of alpha yet, I faked a few QuickTopic entries to make me look town. Here is the altered QT:



And below is the original QuickTopic with all the pieces I used in photoshop:



You can see that Post 5 was used to remake Post 1; Post 7 was used to remake Post 3; Post 8 was used to remake Post 4.

Post 6 was a messup because I needed the darker background color for Post 3.

The black censors don't matchup because I wasn't trying to hide beta talk; I was trying to get the right post lengths and also because I had earlier used the excuse on RW and Ortohoops that I didn't want to post QT's because there was interchangeable beta talk. That was a lie, but what do you expect from scum?

Anyway, now that the magic has been revealed I don't think we can rely on screencaps because they can be faked.

------------------

I don't think FrogDodge is an SK. It seems probable that he was protected or the scummy A&B was roleblocked. A&B didn't have a reason to lie but I don't think occam's razor points to FrogDodge as scum.

I think RW is the best lynch right now. I gave my reasons in Post 210.

Vote: Raging Wishbone

[Raging Wishbone]

@J-scope - I dont get it? You had an entire conversation by yourself or you just posted an entire fake daytalk to ruin any chance we had of catching anyone else? Dude my scum hunting techniques may not be the best, but at least I am trying... you seem to just want to lynch townies.

UNVOTE

VOTE - JSCOPE

[Frog Dodging]

I mean to try and pack as much information in as few words as possible. This post may be quite dense.

ZMD: No wall of text battles. Do not cut up my arguments. Treat it as a whole. In general, you failed to refute any of our points: you haven't given any real excuse for why you are posting opinions on some things but not others. You have given us almost no insight into your thought process. You strawman us a couple of times, particularly when you respond to us saying you should talk about other things than just the one person you are suspicious of and you take this to mean you should blindly follow. Why are you suspicious of x and y? Do you care if people respond to your questions? You are skirting by the waysides.

KMD is doing all the posting. It is not unusual for zazier to lurk. We expect a burst of activity from zazier at some point.

J-scope is giving me bad vibes. Not certain why he is focusing so much on his quicktopic thing - no one has argued with him, yet he keeps pushing it.

RW's accusation is nonsense. If you read the posts, you can see we did believe we were going to die.

SWSWC started the A&B wagon. After that, listed trotsky as a secondary suspect after PTA - this is noted (suspicious). Not feeling the PTA wagon as much any more. ZMD needs lynching. Don't think they expected to die - posts may reveal more, as they had not yet begun preparing to die.

I need to speak to my other half about yosiwen.

[Ojando]

@OJ - Where did you get 30 hours from anyway?

6. A lynch will occur when more than 50% of the players have their votes placed upon the same player, or have their votes placed upon Nolynch. After the 50%+1 threshold is reached, the lynch will occur regardless of any subsequent posting.

Kills will be posted in thread between 6 and 30 hours after I receive them by PM.

I will attempt to randomize the delay as much as possible to prevent date/time type confirmation of kill source.

This seems fairly self explanatory.

and frog dodging is not going to die. it has been 3 days since a+b claimed to have submitted the kill, and the limit is 30 hours. so ragingwishbone, you can stop pretending to care now.

This was pointed out to you already in post 140, why were you still confused about it?
The clarification from the mod was not relevant in whether A&B could have killed sex w/ shafteds wife club.

My post was a simulpost with yos/nuw... I dont need to "convincingly explain anything to anyone", we "Cross-posted".. Read much? I am not going to explain again how OFF it is for him to call her inexperienced after Heavens Gate! Regardless, I think they are the closest thing to town we have, why do I need to explain more? Wanna another wall O'Text, no prob (j/k, lol)...

Way to dodge.
Where did Yosarian imply that Nuwen is inexperienced IN THIS GAME? The simulpost has absolutely nothing to do with this, you talked about this in post 186, that was before the whole simulposting thing. A severely twisted accusation needs explaining even though you changed your mind.

Something a bit older:

d) "Once again; just to reiterate, the above post and the willingness and need for self-adulation of Yoso on behalf of his partner reek of scum trying to find a way to jusitfy their "existence in the world"" - I beg your pardon? This is probably the worst of the lot - it just doesn't make sense. That's not the way scum mentalities work. Scum do not need adulation. They are not looking to justify their existence in the world. I don't even know how you came to that conclusion

I completely disagree with this, except on semantics. Sure, scum might not want ‘adulation’, but they certainly want some credit for apparently townie actions that they do, otherwise they’ve wasted their time. Self-congratulations seems to basically be a scum saying ‘look at how townie I am’. Scum do have to justify their existence, they need to justify themselves as town, if they don’t do anything townie, or appear not to, they will get lynched, I don’t really understand how you could think otherwise.

For the record, there was one line in there which may have read as personal gloating which wasn't meant to be. It may have been read as 'Good, I caught the SK'; I mean 'Good, the SK has been caught'. If this makes any difference to anyone. In other news, I approve of Nybs' idea, I guess; I don't approve of her support for a Yosariwen lynch.

There’s a distinct difference between gloating and what I interpreted it as, which was drawing attention to an apparent town-move. Gloating is something anyone would do, trying to ensure that everyone knows that you’re awesome at scum(sk)hunting is something that scum would do or a townie under pressure, which you weren’t, as far as I recall.

No! Remember, even you noted that we're sorta on a post budget here! Always having your vote somewhere is especially necessary. FOSes with out votes are suspicious.

This seems like a stretch, he was clearly going to post again before we got close to another lynch. If it was going to continue and he basically ould have refused to vote, ok, but this was hardly a telling point against RW.

Oh noes, shaft.ed's subtle defenses of me aren't taking root in the minds of the town!'? Fair possibility. Hmph.

What? RW was questioning why you ‘agreed’ with shaft.ed about RW being scum, when shaft.ed said the opposite.

I need to talk to my better half, at the moment Zaphod, Zmd and RW are the most scummy to me.

I agree with the suspects my other half has listed here. Therefor the updated list looks like this I believe:

Whom I'm willing to lynch now (update it as you post):
1. Zaphod Beeblebrox (1) Ojando
3. Zmd (1) Ojando
4. Trotsky(3): nyballosulgniirkps, ZMD, Zaphod Beeblebrox
5. Ojando (1): ZMD
7. Yosariwen (1): nybaloosulgniirkps
8. Ortohoops (1): ZMD
10. PoketheAlpaca (0):
11. nyballosulgniirkps (0):
12. Raging Wishbone (2): Zaphod Beeblebrox, Ojando
13. J-Scope (0):
14. Frog Dodging (0):

PtA looks unlikely to be mafia after sex club flipping scum.
My first choice for lynch is Zaphod for reasons voiced by us in 225 and here.

unvote; vote: Zaphod Beetlebrox

[J-Scope]

@J-scope - I dont get it? You had an entire conversation by yourself or you just posted an entire fake daytalk to ruin any chance we had of catching anyone else?

What do you mean conversation by yourself? Everything after post 4 was made to help me win alpha. Posts 1-3 of the original QT were honestly trying to play with K-Scope. There never was beta talk with content and it wasn't supposed to line up to anything.

How did I ruin any chance we had of catching anyone else? What would we have caught them doing?

my scum hunting techniques may not be the best, but at least I am trying... you seem to just want to lynch townies.

I am not voting for you strictly you have the opinion that Yosariwen is scum. I am voting for you because you misrepresented why Yosariwen voted for you, and because you have brought emotion into your case from alpha which does not look like a scum hunting technique.

Are you saying that I want to lynch townies because I am voting for you? How do I know you are town again?

J-scope is giving me bad vibes. Not certain why he is focusing so much on his quicktopic thing - no one has argued with him, yet he keeps pushing it.

RW prodded me to reveal the QT in 3 separate posts. Do you think I am focusing more than was needed to by RW's requests? I did not intend to push anything; I think the discussion RW has carried over from alpha about QT's is unimportant.

Here is where he told me to post the QT:

Gee, J-scope, now that Alpha is over you can add in the details to your fake daytalk from that game, please do so....

Very cool Bro, please post a screencap, so we can match it to Alpha screencap?

@Ortohoops and JScope still waiting for your screencaps so we can compare them to the Alpha game.

----------
If RW isn't a viable lynch for today I would consider going back to PtA although they'd have to be an SK and I don't know how likely a second SK is anymore.

I don't really know how Zazier plays but I can see that she is very active in other games. I think more explanation is necessary on their activity level in this game.

I'd still like to see if Trotsky comes around and posts more. I feel it would be more of a lurker lynch on them right now.

[Yosariwen]

Awesome. Ok, on the one hand, me and Nuwen's gut feeling that the Poptajo wagon was scum supported is apparently correct, now that we now shafted is scum. I'm glad I refused to give into pressure and join that wagon. I really can't see any reason his scum buddies would want to bus him day 1, either, so while it's possible, I'm pretty sure Tajo is not mafia at the moment. Also, this is a bit WIFOM, but Shaft.ed's final post where he attacked me for attacking RW, and then defended RW in very vauge terms, make me happier about my RW vote.

The bad news is, between the sudden death of a mafia member and the clarification from the Mod that there are no vigs in this game, we've apparently got a second SK in this game.

Now, to respond to some stuff that's happened since our last post:

On Yosariwen: I hate it. Justification in less than 100 words for last page please. What was the point you were trying to make. Why so many words?

FOS

up to lynch it at any moment.

Excuse me?

I really don't think my posts have been wordier then normal; I've condensed what would normally be multiple posts into one post sometimes, but I haven't been wordier then normal.

And, in any case, this game IS going to have long posts. It's basically written right into the rules. If you can't deal with that, then I'm sorry, but you probably joined the wrong game.

I am curious about the other arguments you were trying to use in 154, because the REST of the arguments you were using to attack him seemed pretty illogical to me, and I would like you to explain them. Especally wher you attack him because he attacked Zaphod for not voting; "not voting" is generally a decent scumtell, and especally in a game like this where you should really be using your vote at all times.

Where did I attack her for not voting?

I have no idea, PTA; you should ask Ortohoops that, not me.

As I mentioned in that part you quoted, I was trying to get Ortohoops to explain their post 154, where they said, amoung other things, this:

Your case on Zaphod, quite frankly, sucks. It seems to be based on the idea that not voting scum = scum.

I was trying to get them to explain what they meant there, because I don't really get it. Looking at their post again, I may have misunderstood what they were trying to say, but I'd still rather they explain it themselves.

Also, since you're still asking about the random vote thing; I still really don't think I have the meta you're descibing, but if it helps, the first post of the game was actualy made by Nuwen, not by me (Yosarian). By the time I made my first post of the game, post 42 on page 2, I had a non-random reason to vote; if I hadn't, I probably would have random voted, just to get my vote on someone, which I think is important in this game setup.

I am not going to change my opinion of how off it feels for Yos to defend Nuwen, however I will give you this point they WERE scum in Alpha and I absolutely do not feel they are scum here anymore. Dude she kicked our asses in Heavens Gates, so for him to say she is inexperienced is off in my humble opinion.

I still don't think I've done this at all IN THIS GAME. If you're still talking about the Alpha game, I'm not sure how that's relevent here.

Yos, what makes me look cautious?

It seems like you were unwilling to scumhunt agressivly, until you were attacked for not scumhunting agressivly, and then you started; it looks like you mostly scumhunted in order to avoid being attacked, instead of because you wanted to find scum.

Being much more concerned with how you look and with not making waves then with what's good for the town can be a scumtell, and I kind of get that vibe from your posts.

Yosariwen, I need you to detail what about Sex Club's posting during the A&B lynch looked so notably pro-town, please. Also - you thought the wagon was either scum-supported or not opposed by the scum. Can you pinpoint what gave you this feeling?

I was wrong about Shaft.ed, obviously.

But, they had a whole series of posts where they was agresssivly attacking A&B for not participating, ect, that really looked like scumhunting to me, and gave me a good vibe; I usually consider agressive scumhunting to be a town tell. Of course it's not a flawless one.

As for the wagon; there was sort of a sense to it that it was...too easy. I've seen a lot of mafia games; usually, when town lynches a scum day 1, it's usually either a huge struggle, or else a scum makes a catastrophically huge mistake and his buddies bus him for it. Neither of those were the case here; the wagon felt like one of those easy, smooth, day 1 mislynches that I see all the time (and sadly often end up on). No one expressed any doubt about it at all, there was really no one that acted in a way that made me thing "hmm...there's a possible tajo scumbuddy".

I couldn't tell WHO on the wagon was scum, exactally, but wagons that are scum supported tend to feel different, tend to play out different, then wagons that are scum opposed.

If RW isn't a viable lynch for today I would consider going back to PtA although they'd have to be an SK and I don't know how likely a second SK is anymore.

At this point, I'm pretty sure PTA is not mafia, and while SK is possible, lynching someone who's probably not mafia just because they might be a SK seems like a bad gamble.

By the way, I'm confused by the second half of your sentance. We know a mafia person got daykilled, we know that it couldn't have been the SK who got lynched (because too much time went past), and we know that if there's a SK there can't be a vig, so there has to be another SK in the game, right?

[Raging Wishbone]

My post was a simulpost with yos/nuw... I dont need to "convincingly explain anything to anyone", we "Cross-posted".. Read much? I am not going to explain again how OFF it is for him to call her inexperienced after Heavens Gate! Regardless, I think they are the closest thing to town we have, why do I need to explain more? Wanna another wall O'Text, no prob (j/k, lol)...

Way to dodge.
Where did Yosarian imply that Nuwen is inexperienced IN THIS GAME? The simulpost has absolutely nothing to do with this, you talked about this in post 186, that was before the whole simulposting thing. A severely twisted accusation needs explaining even though you changed your mind.

I still don't think I've done this at all IN THIS GAME. If you're still talking about the Alpha game, I'm not sure how that's relevent here.

No worries, not dodging; here is the quote where it is implied that there is something unusual about their post...

Really don't like the misdirection in deferring the read to "mostly being Nuwen's" here.

Ok, your first sentance is complete garbage. Me and Nuwen were talking as I was writing that post, she made the observations, and I agreed with them. Why should it matter to you if the thought origionally came from me or from Nuwen? Why are you making such a big deal out of irrelevent side issues here?

So perhaps it is a semantics error and I was combining Alpha and Beta a bit, but the fact is this comment insinuates misdirection, manipulation or some sort of implication of Yos trying to put something on Nuwen. Right or wrong; I perceived this as defensive and as Yos implying she was inexperienced (in otherwords why did yos say oh that was Nuwen, if he did not mean to once again imply she only wrote it because she was inexperienced?).. It was an off comment on his part and reminded me of Alpha! I was not the only one who noticed something wrong with the comment... At the time, I thought it was a valid point, but not anymore. I think their im chats were pretty convincing in such a short period of time and they are townish.

@J-scope... at first I was rather concerned with your post for the following reason; whether you intended to derail my request for daytalk (considering it cleared yos/nuw as scum in my mind) gambit or not you should have allowed Ortohoops a chance to post before making your reply to attempt to ruin all credability in this as a device to hunt scum. You should have allowed others to post...

J-Scope

Thanks for sharing the tidbit about falsifying logs. This is townie points for J-Scope. Although if scum, he might just not feel like being bothered to create fake logs However, what do you like about Trotsky's Zaphod case? There's nothing there.

You and SexEd can say what you want about the importance of pm's, im's, qt's ect.... However me and RR are on page 61 of our qt's in addition to our pms on ms and msn conversations. Yos and Nuw have posted extensive pm logs for Beta...

I mean J-Scope did you post that quick topic to make fun of us all? You have 8 posts, you YOURSELF claim that is was original from Alpha, anyone reading the content can tell you faked it! I mean you "faked it so bad" it is hard to believe scum would make such a huge mistake twice?

At first glance I would assume that you meant to imply that there never was any daytalk, but then you clearly write in the "original" conversation with you and K-Scope it was different and explain EXACTLY where you change you and K-Scopes conversation to fit the Alpha game, hence there was an original conversation between you and K-Scope which lasted 8 posts... but what follows has been contrived! Anybody looking at it can tell it is fake. You follow up with a second post NOW and only now claiming it was never real... It is a complete contradiction.

You SHOULD have realized something important; although daytalk can be faked it is NOT nearly important as it is in the continuing conversation and in this my friend you FAILED, in my humble opinion!

Mod: Can we please get a prod on NYBalls, Trotsky, ZMD, Pokealpca, and Orthohoops

This game is extremely hard to read, however I feel comfortable with my vote. I could be wrong and look forward to more comments. RR should be back soonish from vla and I really look forward to hearing his thoughts. I could go for a Zaphod lynch, however I still kinda feel for DGB writing she was gonna quit mafia scum for being called scum when she is town... I still would like to hear everyones thoughts on the mechanics of this game in specific response to A & B claiming they tried to kill FrogDodge? Does that NOT peak anyone's interest? We only have 1 - SK to lynch and 2 more mafia, if we are al clear on the set-up now.

[Ortohoops]

It's very rare that I make a post containing a huge amount of detailed, carefully thought out, and extensivly explained analysis, to the extent that I just did, and someone's first reactions is "Woah, that post makes Yosarian look scummy!" So, yeah, I find your reaction there quite strange and unexpected. That's not "wifom", nor does it really have anything to do with my alignment.

This is still wifom for exactly the same reasons as previously stated- I do not know your alignment- it is your subjective assertion that your analysis was "carefully thought out and extensively explained".

It's odd, though, that you don't understand what I mean when I say that the wagon feels too easy when you yourself said almost the exact same thing earlier in the game.

A

different

person to me (ortolan) said that, I've already explained this.

Yos: my point against PTA in 154 was just that their Zaphod case as expressed there, was weak.

We think Zaphod is scum. They have agreedwith others/wagon jumped at times convienant to when others have been pressuring them.

Totally non-specific. The other point was that the fact they didn't vote an SK isn't inherently scummy for the same reasons PTA seemed to be suggesting, because they cannot be scum with the SK.

Frog: who posted 198 and 207 respectively (I'm guessing J-Dodge is the latter), because they demonstrate conflicting opinions of Yos. Are you going to stay that way? I know you tried to reconcile your opinion with your partner, but as a hydra where do you stand on Yos? You seem to be the only half a hydra who agrees with me about Yosariwen (except RW, whose attack on Yoswen was kind of internally contradictory).

What do you think of it in comparison to your will to go after post wasters. Do you believe that alone was a valid reason to go after A&B compared to the other reasons out there?

I have no idea what her opinion was there and can't ask her currently. What's the relevance anyway, we can't be scumbuddies busing the SK. And the little non-aggressive question in 211 to Yoswen by PTA is like pretending to still be a bit critical of your scumbuddy, exactly the same way J-Dodge played in Alpha.

I mean the only thing that scares me a bit is that you brought up that you had these intense aim chat logs, so you could have had half that post ready to go...but the rest was so perfect... I really think you are town.

Have you not yet been scarred enough by trying to clear people based on chat logs?

Trotsky is probably scum.

@Hoops, please post us your daytalks without the white blobs Sir, lol. now that Alpha is over you can discuss both games at the same time....

And you want potential role information about us why exactly? And you still think, despite what I pointed out in Alpha, and what J-Scope has acknowledged, that we can't just fake the logs if we want to anyway by editing our posts and wiping out the edit stamp??? This insistence on the chat logs is not only relatively unsportsmanlike, it has already actively hurt the town in one game.

I think Yoswen is scum with PTA and is trying both to derail his wagon and tie RW to him if he gets lynched regardless and flips scum.

Post. Rubs me the wrong way.

Brilliant commentary.

I beat the prod, please be wary with using them in future considering the nature of this game.

[Yosariwen]

Ortohoops; I have a couple of questions for you. If you've already answered these, please forgive me and just point me to where you did; I haven't been able to find answers to these in any of your posts.

1. What information do you glean from finding out Sex with Shaft.ed's alignment?

2. Specifically, does it change your opinion on the PTA wagon at all? Why or why not?

3. As far as I can tell, you still haven't explained much of your attack on PTA in post 154, even though I've asked you multiple times about it. Could you please explain again exactally what points you were trying to make in that post?

4. To the best of my undestanding, the reason you suspect me because you think I'm scum with PTA who was trying to protect him. Is that still correct? Is your reason for suspecting me completly dependent on PTA's alignment?

At this point, I'm getting a bad feeling about Ortohops. A scum, the mafia godfather, died, and yet it feels like that didn't at all change his thoughts on the game, even though it changed the opinion of most other people pushing for the PTA lynch. That seems odd to me, makes me wonder if Shaft.ed coming up scum wasn't as much of a surprise to him as it was to most of the rest of us. It also kind of feels like Ortohoops and Shaft.ed have been "working together" for most of the game; they've been pushing in the same directions, making the same cases; they both attacked A&B at about the same time, then they both attacked PTA, and they both attacked me for going after RW instead of PTA. They didn't directly interact with each other much, but it kind of feels like the two of them were working in tandom to pull the town in certain directions. It's also worth noting that there's also a possible link between Ortohoops and my other main suspect, since Ortohoops attacked me for attacking RW.

My main suspects at the moment are:
RW
Ortohoops
ZMD

(Yes; PTA is no longer on the list, and Ortohoops now is on the list.)

Oh, and to answer the one point he made:

This is still wifom for exactly the same reasons as previously stated- I do not know your alignment- it is your subjective assertion that your analysis was "carefully thought out and extensively explained".

Well, sure it's subjective. When I said that your reaction to my post felt strange to me, it should have been clear that that was entierly a subjective observation made from my point of view. Still, there's nothing wrong with that.

[Saunt Adelaus]

prodded: nyballosulgniirkps, Trotsky, and Orthohoops

PoketheAlpaca informed me V/LA, and ZMD PMp'd me before I could send them a prod.

current prod count:

1

:Frog Dodging, PoketheAlpaca, Yosariwen, Zmd, nyballosulgniirkps

2

: Trotsky, Ortohoops

3rd prod = instant replacement.

If lurking continues, I may consider revising the rules so that 4th prod ='s modkill instead of 3rd prod = replacement. You will have plenty of advance warning, but the prod count will not be reset.
While I recognize that the action phase mechanic is a structural disincentive to post, I will not allow this game to die.
[/mod slap on the wrist]

[Saunt Adelaus]

Votecount as of post 238:

Raging Wishbone:

3

:Yosariwen, nyballosulgniirkps, Zaphod Beeblebrox,
Zaphod Beeblebrox:

2

:Trotsky, Ojando
PoketheAlpaca:

1

:Ortohoops,
Frog Dodging

1

:J-Scope,
Trotsky:

1

:Zmd,
Ortohoops:

1

:PoketheAlpaca
zmd:

1

:Frog Dodging,
J-Scope:

1

:Raging Wishbone

not voting:

0

:

while 11 players are alive, 6 votes will lynch

[J-Scope]

@Mod: I should be voting for Raging Wishbone, not Frog Dodging

By the way, I'm confused by the second half of your sentance. We know a mafia person got daykilled, we know that it couldn't have been the SK who got lynched (because too much time went past), and we know that if there's a SK there can't be a vig, so there has to be another SK in the game, right?

You are right, shaft.ed’s killer would have to be a second SK and not a Vig. I can get on board with prioritizing the search for shaft.ed’s scumbuddies.

How much of SWSWC was Shaft.ed and how much was elvis_knits? I couldn't tell if e_k was contributing but I also don't know how either play. Does anyone know e_k enough to know if she would bus early on or maybe try to ignore scumbuddies?

I mean J-Scope did you post that quick topic to make fun of us all? You have 8 posts, you YOURSELF claim that is was original from Alpha, anyone reading the content can tell you faked it! I mean you "faked it so bad" it is hard to believe scum would make such a huge mistake twice?

No, I posted the QT’s because you asked me to and for no other reason. I was perfectly content with warning the group about how I won as scum in alpha so as to prevent scum from winning that way.

The QT posts 5-8 was not for K-Scope to read. They never existed until I made them to trick you. And I showed you the real posts 1-4 which I am saying are the real deal.

I did not screencap my original QuickTopic to prove my innocence to anyone. I realize that what I am now calling real could very well be another fake. You have to judge for yourself based on my complete game here.

At first glance I would assume that you meant to imply that there never was any daytalk, but then you clearly write in the "original" conversation with you and K-Scope it was different and explain EXACTLY where you change you and K-Scopes conversation to fit the Alpha game, hence there was an original conversation between you and K-Scope which lasted 8 posts... but what follows has been contrived! Anybody looking at it can tell it is fake. You follow up with a second post NOW and only now claiming it was never real... It is a complete contradiction.

I did not have a conversation with K-Scope that lasted 8 posts. Look at the timestamps and see where they correlate to the Alpha game. I’ll do it here:

Post 1 and 2 were made on April 28. Post 3 was made on April 29; Post 4 was made on April 30. So posts 1-4 correspond to action phase 1 and 2.

Posts 5 through 8 took place on May 12 which corresponds to our 3 person LyLo. It was during that action phase that I wrote those four posts and used photoshop to composite the content of Posts 5-8 onto the time stamps of Posts 1-4.

I feel like you are making this out to be a scumtell in our Beta game, when it clearly is only a tell for the Alpha game.

I still would like to hear everyone’s thoughts on the mechanics of this game in specific response to A & B claiming they tried to kill FrogDodge?

Maybe Frog Dodge is the SK, but right now that’s only one explanation compared to the possibly more explanations that deal with a potential RB/Doc power. I don’t think FrogDodge is scum but it’s something to keep in mind if we’re still looking for an SK and the possibility of a RB/Doc explanation isn’t there.

[Zmd]

So basically my choices for scum are unlikely to be lynched, so I should mindlessly follow everyone else? Riiiiight.

The problem is you're not putting any arguments forward or making any case. You've just been putting forward a lone vote based on impression, or voicing your suspicions based on something you haven't even bothered to look up again ("Gut. And I think he made a vote I didn't like the timing of" about why our predecessor was scummy to you). This method marginalizes your contributions very much.

Hogfather was my 3rd suspect. I didn't have much on them. That's why I went after Trotsky and Ortohoops instead. And if you'll read my post, it was the timing of the vote on A&B that caught my atention. I said this in that same post. So saying that I "haven't bothered to look it up" is a blatant misrep. I looked it up the second I was asked why Hogfather was scummy.

@Kmd

, I think I've learned how to read you; come back moar plz so I can do that kthx.

I haven't gone anywhere. I'm just not wasting posts. I'm waiting until I have a decent amount of posts to answer to before I say anything.

And you've learned how to read me? Assuming this is Plum that said this (I'm pretty sure it is), I think the only game you played with me as town was Zelda where I could not keep up at all, so I don't think you even have enough town meta to read me. If it's DGB, I believe you. Pretty sure that was Plum though.

@FrogDodge - Seriousley Dude, why were you so confident A&B lied or you had protection... you wrote in response (paraphrased) to his claim, "Dont count us out until we are dead". You seemed positive you would not be SK'd!

This is a good point. The only way to be THAT confident in not dying is if they are NK-Immune. And, as you pointed out, SKs ARE, in fact, NK-Immune.

ZMD: No wall of text battles. Do not cut up my arguments. Treat it as a whole. In general, you failed to refute any of our points: you haven't given any real excuse for why you are posting opinions on some things but not others. You have given us almost no insight into your thought process. You strawman us a couple of times, particularly when you respond to us saying you should talk about other things than just the one person you are suspicious of and you take this to mean you should blindly follow. Why are you suspicious of x and y? Do you care if people respond to your questions? You are skirting by the waysides.

I'm posting opinions on everything that catches my attention. I have a hard time reading these long posts, but when I see something, I comment on it.

I'm suspicious of Trotsky for the way he posted fluff early, but isn't posting much at all now. Go ahead and call that hypocritical, but I really read Trotsky as scum right now.

KMD is doing all the posting. It is not unusual for zazier to lurk. We expect a burst of activity from zazier at some point.

She has other places that she needs to catch up first. I'd love to see her come back to this game, but I can understand why she hasn't.

ZMD needs lynching. Don't think they expected to die - posts may reveal more, as they had not yet begun preparing to die.

There was an SK which means no vig. The only way I am dying is if scum kills me or an SK who has no vig fakeclaim kills me. I don't see why I'd be a threat to scum unless I am dead-on on the scum team. Even then, I'm probably not their best target. So no, I'm not "prepared" to die.

I don't really know how Zazier plays but I can see that she is very active in other games. I think more explanation is necessary on their activity level in this game.

She tends to fall behind and then if she catches up, she explodes activity-wise. This hasn't happened yet here as she's given other games higher priority right now.

Yos, what makes me look cautious?

It seems like you were unwilling to scumhunt agressivly, until you were attacked for not scumhunting agressivly, and then you started; it looks like you mostly scumhunted in order to avoid being attacked, instead of because you wanted to find scum.

Being much more concerned with how you look and with not making waves then with what's good for the town can be a scumtell, and I kind of get that vibe from your posts.

Actually, the lack of aggression comes from the style of the game. My violent-rage-style attacks usually come in the form of back-and-forth short posts and insults. It's hard to do that here.

And actually, I don't give a shit how I look. If I look like lurker-scum not wanting to do anything, fine. But that's not what I'm doing. I do believe Trotsky and Ortohoops to be scum. More Trotsky obviously. And I strongly believe FD to be SK because of his confidence in surviving A&B's kill. Surviving the kill itself is a long shot. How many times do you see a claimed vig's kill stopped by a doc or RB? And if the action was sent before A&B claimed their target, why would FD be protected? It's still plausible that A&B was RB'd, but that's about it. I think either they were RB'd or FD is SK.

Also, based on the "who I'd lynch" thing (which more people should add themselves to btw), Trotsky seems like a fairly agreed upon lynch.

Mod: Can we please get a prod on NYBalls, Trotsky, ZMD, Pokealpca, and Orthohoops

For future reference, prodding me is pointless. The only time I log into this account is to post here. So I'd see the prod just before I'm about to post anyway. And I'm online every day and highly aware of this game. No need to prod at any time.

So, my top choices for a lynch right now are Trotsky and FD. FD is probably SK though, not mafia.

My guess for mafia right now is still: Trotsky, Ortohoops, Ojando.

If it takes me a few days to respond to something, it's because I'm waiting for more to respond to at the same time, NOT because I've forgotten or am avoiding anything. I'll get to it when I feel it's best.

[nyballosulgniirkps]

Again, I am keeping this short and sweet. If that's a problem, bite me.

PokeTheAlpaca - Well, wasn't really fond of the wagon by the last time I posted, and I think Shaft.ed's death, overall, doesn't say a lot. While it lowers the probability he was scum with them, it doesn't really speak much in terms of whether or not he's the 2nd serial killer.

@J-scope - I dont get it? You had an entire conversation by yourself or you just posted an entire fake daytalk to ruin any chance we had of catching anyone else? Dude my scum hunting techniques may not be the best, but at least I am trying... you seem to just want to lynch townies.

UNVOTE

VOTE - JSCOPE

He raised a very valid point in that inter-hydra communication can be faked. He pulled it off successfully in the Alpha game. Why

wouldn't

he show that it can be done? His posting of the quicktopic also does not invalidate the potential use of the posting of conversations. If scum are going to fake their communications, that is where they will slip up, as we have already seen with Yosariwen in the Alpha game.

@FrogDodge - Seriousley Dude, why were you so confident A&B lied or you had protection... you wrote in response (paraphrased) to his claim, "Dont count us out until we are dead". You seemed positive you would not be SK'd!

That doesn't sound like confidence at all. If you read the entirety of their post, you can see they spat out what they were thinking because,

as they said

, their mortality was on the line.

And I strongly believe FD to be SK because of his confidence in surviving A&B's kill. Surviving the kill itself is a long shot. How many times do you see a claimed vig's kill stopped by a doc or RB? And if the action was sent before A&B claimed their target, why would FD be protected? It's still plausible that A&B was RB'd, but that's about it. I think either they were RB'd or FD is SK.

Again, see above. While the argument for Frog Dodging being possible Serial Killer

because

they survived the kill attempt is legit, I would not jump to that conclusion with the information that is currently available. With two Serial Killers in the game, it's not at all beyond the realm of possibility to assume that town has some fairly hefty power in this game.

VOTE: FrogDodge

Unless we can figure out if A&B was lying... I see no other reason he is not dead. I kinda would like to stick with Occams Razor.

Are you kidding me? You're just going to jump to the conclusion that your suspected 'explanation' for Frog Dodge's survival is the correct one, simply because no role has yet to come forward and claim responsibility?

Die, scum.

[Adel]

fixed, sorry for the mistake.

Votecount as of post 238:

Raging Wishbone:

4

:Yosariwen, nyballosulgniirkps, Zaphod Beeblebrox, J-Scope
Zaphod Beeblebrox:

2

:Trotsky, Ojando
PoketheAlpaca:

1

:Ortohoops,
Frog Dodging

1

:

J-Scope,

Trotsky:

1

:Zmd,
Ortohoops:

1

:PoketheAlpaca
zmd:

1

:Frog Dodging,
J-Scope:

1

:Raging Wishbone

not voting:

0

:

while 11 players are alive, 6 votes will lynch

For future reference, prodding me is pointless.

For future reference, all players are expected to post every 72 hours. Due to my negligence, the current prod mechanism is proving insufficient to maintain that standard of activity. Continued abuse of the prod mechanism to avoid posting only encourages me to revise the activity/prod rules to something more draconian. Y'all are a bunch of active players, grouped into hydra. Post more, please. I am asking nicely, with a thinly veiled threat.

[Frog Dodging]

And I strongly believe FD to be SK because of his confidence in surviving A&B's kill. Surviving the kill itself is a long shot. How many times do you see a claimed vig's kill stopped by a doc or RB? And if the action was sent before A&B claimed their target, why would FD be protected? It's still plausible that A&B was RB'd, but that's about it. I think either they were RB'd or FD is SK.

Because no doc would ever protect the hydra composed of two of the four most experienced (at that point in time) players in the game, who between them have 8 and a half thousand in game posts, have been nominated for four scummies and who are generally well respected and established members of this site. That would just be

silly

.

Can we please stop speculating about this anyway? The only thing we're going to succeed in doing is outing a doc/rber. If at some point we massclaim (and we should) if we were protected/a&b were roleblocked it will be announced then. And if there's no announcement, y'all can draw your own conclusions. But right now we don't need to out power roles.

We don't like the RW wagon. We haven't done the meta yet, but we suspect it is based on RW's stupidity rather than his scumminess. We worry he will end up being lynched by default, as we 'have' to get another lynch before page 12.

Not liking zmd's attack on us at all. Also, their defense of themselves amounts to "Well, why shouldn't we play like this?" which isn't really a defense of anything, it's just rhetorical bluster.

There was an SK which means no vig. The only way I am dying is if scum kills me or an SK who has no vig fakeclaim kills me. I don't see why I'd be a threat to scum unless I am dead-on on the scum team. Even then, I'm probably not their best target. So no, I'm not "prepared" to die.

This was referring to swsewc. I apologies for the lack of clarity.

My other head still needs to put in an appearance.

[Trotsky]

zaphod did you consider that it is the game mechanic making us lurk and not some vague meta argument that you a) apparently based on only one of our heads and b) couldn't be arsed to prove anyway?

zmdposting is bad. the whole of his post 224 is defensive all the way through and without even trying to refute the points against him.

ragingwishbone is a good candidate for scum. selective scumhunting against frogdodging is a pretty reliable scumtell.

besides, frog dodge's response to what appeared to be immenent death make him look more like town than anything else

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

zaphod did you consider that it is the game mechanic making us lurk and not some vague meta argument that you a) apparently based on only one of our heads and b) couldn't be arsed to prove anyway?

No excuses, I have never, ever seen you lurk. Furthermore, as of late, I also have never, ever seen you fail to stubbornly tunnel on me. I must therefore conclude that you are scum.

[Trotsky]

zaphod did you consider that it is the game mechanic making us lurk and not some vague meta argument that you a) apparently based on only one of our heads and b) couldn't be arsed to prove anyway?

No excuses, I have never, ever seen you lurk. Furthermore, as of late, I also have never, ever seen you fail to stubbornly tunnel on me. I must therefore conclude that you are scum.

given that every time you've seen me stubbornly tunnel on you i've been town your point seems to fail on a most basic level.

while you're here, why oh why won't you answer that simple question i asked you ages and ages ago? its been quoted at least three times already to remind you to answer it.

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

given that every time you've seen me stubbornly tunnel on you i've been town your point seems to fail on a most basic level.

That's exactly what I said. Your FAILURE to stubbornly tunnel on me means that you're scum.

while you're here, why oh why won't you answer that simple question i asked you ages and ages ago? its been quoted at least three times already to remind you to answer it.

I don't remember it, and everything you do is to irritate me anyway, so buzz off, scum. I don't care to answer your questions or interact with you but for the fact that you're a scumbag in this game and you should be dead already.

DIE

[Trotsky]

i misread your most recent statement since up to this point your position has been one of supposed exasperation because i'm voting for you in yet another game. when did you suddenly decide i'm not stubbornly tunneling you this game? because this post:

hey zaphod why are you ignoring post 41 even after a second request for you to acknowledge it?

i say we pick someone for a+b to kill and then lynch him. my choice for that kill is zaphod.

Aw, there we go again, I'm scum in every game. You're half the reason why I'm not going to play anymore after I finish my current commitments.

A&B said he already submitted his kill.

I'm happy to be lynched in any game I have the misfortune of having signed up for with you in it.

Don't forget to post under your hydra name next time.

really gives the opposite impression. i guess you can't make up your mind on which position is more likely to help you get us lynched?

and wow, i didn't know things had suddenly become so personal between us. that really doesn't seem like you at all.