Mini 808 - Rabbit Doubt Mafia: Over!

[mykonian]

jeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

/confirm

[mykonian]

btw, Hello KMD, Tenchi, Phily, nice to see you again!

and of course Looker. I hope will have fun this game (I promise I won't try too hard to get you lynched this time)

[mykonian]

Yo, we've gotta get Xofelf into one of these games some time.

your girlfriend?

[mykonian]

ok. I just thought it a weird comment to make.

[mykonian]

you know more then I do...

[mykonian]

FoS Zazie

because I know how this story ends, and I am principially against voting the mod.

[mykonian]

Mykonian opens door 13

To safety!

lol

[mykonian]

sorry people, having some computer problems. Now I'm going home again, things will get better for the weekend, but next week expect low activity. After that, things probably get better.

[mykonian]

I do not have a key.

Hey, I read the manga, and the only person that didn't have a key was the main character. How this will affect the game though, I don't know. Anyway, I guess I should do something useful now.

Wolf opens door number 3

.

battousai probably read it too.

- Somebody should probably lock the room with all the weapons as soon as possible. It seems like a place for the mafia to pick up abilities.

- Heck, we should lock all the rooms. So now, if somebody want's in on somewhere, they have to ask permission first. It prevents people from doing what Battousai has just done, and it leads to much more discussion, and with discussion: there might be some information.

- Did the mod just give us a hint that Myconian has turned into some sort of monster? I think so.

- There are locked doors behind locked doors! Let's slow down with the opening, since we probably don't have enough to open everything.


I will comment on Battousai later, maybe. If I'm not feeling lazy.

this person is directing way too much. I doubt all his motives are town.

vote Penguin

@Kreriov
Wait so, you'd have voted for whoever got the storage room? How does that make me scum? Sorry but if this was an actually issue someone would've brought it up ages ago.

I picked number 7 because its lucky. Quit reaching. +scum points

QFT

[quote="Tenchi]So what is your real reason for going to that door?

Following KMD's lead?
Because it is lucky?
Or because you are one lying lying sneaky weaponless scum looking for weapons?[/quote]'

please check what you are assuming with these questions.

a. the mod gave scum what is in which room.
b. phily is stupid because he doesn't directly go for his room, but talks first.

I think this solely makes your case unbelievable.

[mykonian]

I'll read in a second, but the game is up and I have a non-random vote to make. That's right. No RVS for me.

btw, Hello KMD, Tenchi, Phily, nice to see you again!

and of course Looker. I hope will have fun this game (I promise I won't try too hard to get you lynched this time)

Vote Mykonian

. The only way you could make that promise is if you know Looker's alignment. The only way you know Looker's alignment is if you are scum. Myko is scum.

you actually meant this? No, it is because I have in short time aggressively pursued the lynch of Looker twice, while she was town. Last time she threatened she would talk to me , and we don't want that, do we?

and Tenchi does this more often, I think battousai, while having good reasons, shouldn't go for that. Tenchi seems his town self.

[mykonian]

move to the storage room, close the exit room

[mykonian]

myko, could you elaborate about your vote on Penguin?

mykonian will, after reading the thread, something that he will do, and finish tomorrow. Probably.

[mykonian]

on page 4, tenchi comes with a crap case on battousai, and it is a subjective attack, mostly. It is about battousai not having a key.

a series of quotes, from one post.

It would be awesome if you are a vig, but I doubt that.

LOL. How would we know? Or are you duping a bucket of WIFOM on my lap?

How would I know? Or do you and your buddies don't know each other? Scumslip?

Maybe. Shudda Wouldda Couldda...

I am not buying it.

WIFOM madness.

these are all his reactions on battousai's defence. He actually makes no points, he only subjectively makes battousai scummy.

unvote vote Tenchi

after that, wolf enters, and KMD and Phily react on tenchi.

but paperpenguin doesn't even mention it...

FoS Paperpenguin

then Kreviov comes with a logical, but insane vote on PhilyEc: for agreeing with KMD, but picking another room:

FoS Kreviov

Two different motivations. I've explained why I picked 7, its a lucky number. Battousai's explaination is that he wanted to skip rope...

WHO R U KIDDING? LOL!

VOTE: PhilyEc

(Both are crappy reasons and both are just mere EXCUSES just so you can stuff your noses in that room.)

jumps on the Phily wagon... yeah, i know he later unvoted. and went back to battousai...

tenchi found a new hammer to hit battousai... this guy tunnels way too much.

I have on page 7 the feeling that paperpenguin active lurks.

page 8, battousai attacks tenchi, tenchi won't defend against the "rhetorical question" business

And my point is made. You asked me a question, I responded, you voted me. When asked what kind of answer would have led you to not vote me, you reply that your question was rhetorical (and it clearly wasn't). Therefore, you tried to get me to say something, something that may lead you to believe I might be a powerrole or scum, and since you are denying it, it is more likely they former.

mostly this point.

And why are Myko and Tenchi both still alive?

myko has only pregame posted a joke towards looker about previous games. You come with your perfectly logical argument that I must have made a slip. Didn't think so:

FoS KMD

I read now I thought Tenchi town last time poor tenchi

end page 12 kmd is way too concerned he is logical in his vote on me.

HoS KMD

Quick question, why are we grouping together in the first place?

I think it was based on speculation from Ztife that we might receive notices that a roommate left the room during the night.

I dont think the game is that easily breakable

myko, could you elaborate about your vote on Penguin?

no, it would be a lurker vote by now.

Btw since im in the crime scene room, am I allowed to strip the corpse Super Hot Chick, Codename: ZazieR, to look for a barcode?

As already stated, Super Hot Chick, codename ZazieR, is not a usable object!

ok, ztife is our best clown

unvote vote KMD

mostly gut, but this play just points at him being scum. It is not a big difference, but as town he would never semi lurk this way, tunneling till over page 10 on a pregame post.

[mykonian]

And why are Myko and Tenchi both still alive?

myko has only pregame posted a joke towards looker about previous games. You come with your perfectly logical argument that I must have made a slip. Didn't think so:

FoS KMD

Am I still voting you? Didn't think so.

great argument.

end page 12 kmd is way too concerned he is logical in his vote on me.

HoS KMD

Well if you were more active, I'd have been able to get a reaction from you. So far, you've FoS'd and HoS'd me strictly for voting you, correct?

for doing nothing but that until page 12.

unvote vote KMD

mostly gut, but this play just points at him being scum. It is not a big difference, but as town he would never semi lurk this way, tunneling till over page 10 on a pregame post.

Why is this argument always used against me in games where I am town? See Zelda. See Double Head Alpha. See Disney. See LK's open game. Always.

you lurk. and you tunnel. If you are town, or mafia, you would try to look town. Here, most what you do, is accusing a lurker, not reacting on play:

and stay unnoticed

[mykonian]

I hate people who go off of gut reads

and that is why I explained where it came from, so you can check it. But you seem to have missed that.

[mykonian]

Myko, first, look at my posts and tell me I did nothing else. Second, look at everyone else's post and tell me I'm "unnoticed" (which I'd hate to be as scum anyway as I like to have control. See Spy's recent game.)

that is one reason I think you are a survivor with a nightkill and yes, you are trying to. You are not that much in control as I have seen you before.

[mykonian]

unvote vote KMD mostly gut, but this play just points at him being scum. It is not a big difference, but as town he would never semi lurk this way, tunneling till over page 10 on a pregame post.

^OMGUS

You had far more stuff to vote for Tenchi then went to voting for KMD mainly on gut feeling. I'd say its more likely its because he suspected you so early on.

Fos

you are actually right. I say KMD's vote sucks, and that he is scum for it. but I think I explained, reasoned why it sucked, and that a tell like OMGUS (an unreasoned countervote) should not be used here. It is not applied correctly.

[mykonian]

Myko, first, look at my posts and tell me I did nothing else. Second, look at everyone else's post and tell me I'm "unnoticed" (which I'd hate to be as scum anyway as I like to have control. See Spy's recent game.)

that is one reason I think you are a survivor with a nightkill and yes, you are trying to. You are not that much in control as I have seen you before.

That's called SK. And why the need to differentiate between SK and mafia on Day 1?

because I can. Not that it matters, you are certainly not town, but that is all I think about you. But scum you are, and scum I want to lynch.

I say KMD's vote sucks, and that he is scum for it.

To clarify, you're saying that his vote on you sucked (i.e. not his current vote on Tenchi)?

He doesn't like that even after Page 12, my vote was still on him.

and that his post was: why are 1 and 2 still alive? If he was here, he would have known. But he lurked, and brought nothing new.

[mykonian]

also mykonian, you missed a question I asked you. Why did you try to close the exit room?

I thought you could close them only from outside, and phily had his room closed then (hey, I could have known...), so I wondered what would happen if I joined him and then closed the door so we would be together.

well, nothing.

plus, this being mafia, I don't think there is an exit that can save us. But that had nothing to do with my choice.

[mykonian]

sorry, yes, I guess I missed it.

probably in the catagory of people I didnt really notice. Would you mind if I reread tomorrow to answer that question?

[mykonian]

Tenchi is a player that tends to play with fire, like he does here. His things he said were scummy, but he took risks, something I consider town.

KMD does exactly the opposite. Tries not to stand out, but still be here. Brings little new, doesnt lead the game, like he likes to. Scummy behaviour for certain.

Phily: you are looking too much at prove, not at motivations. A player that takes risks, and stands out, is per definition more town. Check the meta on this site.

[mykonian]

The only risky behaviour I've seen has been scummy. You can say Tenchi is town for putting his neck out on the line after attacking both me and Batt but in truth his approach was scummy. Scum do attack people, scum also bus. From what I've seen you condone Tenchi's actions but go on to say its too risky to be scummy using the same line to defend yourself. You condone Tenchi's actions enough to VOTE him but then move onto KMD therefore meaning that your gut feeling is stronger than the reasons you had for earlier voting Tenchi. It looks like scum bus no matter what light you shed on it.

Scum attack in plenty of games Myk, they take on the risks that are involved when guiding town into mislynches. Your defense is that you and Tenchi are both soooo risk taking that you can't be scum, that isn't something I agree with one bit.

WHAT ARE YOU DOING HERE?

I don't think I said anything about myself, and all you wanted to know is why KMD was my vote, and not Tenchi, someone who I thought also scummy. Here it was, and now you: a. linked us, b. say I think him town c. say I defend myself, or try to look towny.

further I see the word: "bus" in there somewhere, and I have no idea why you would need to use that.


Phily, you attack me because I am a nice target, because there is a "contradiction", not because I'm scummy. otherwise you would never come up with such a post that is only usefull to make me look scummy. Because you are not looking for scum with that post, you are trying to make someone else look scum.

[mykonian]

The way I saw your double vote post Myk. You displayed suspicion on two players then went with one for far less reason than the other. You voted Tenchi then in the same post unvoted and voted KMD. It looks like you're preparing a defense when a Tenchi lynch comes up. I suspect you of pre-busing a partner in order to distance because of your voting pattern. Your replies chain you two together, not my post. My post highlights how you're saying both you and him are town for taking on so many risks.

Do you or do you not suspect him?

is that the problem... explain that then.

The reason I voted two persons in one post, is that I reacted directly on what I read. You can read it chronological. What KMD did on page 12 is so un-KMD, and while it is only one post, it is rather clear. Further, contrary to other games with him, I have trouble to remember what he said. He doesn't stand out. This is an added thing, that doesn't fit in his normal play.

Phily, why do I hear so little about KMD from you, and so much Tenchi-bashing? I do suspect him, tenchi has been second scummiest for a whole time, but you are doing a lot to make you look like KMD's buddy, defending him by attacking Tenchi. Please review what you are saying, as I'm certain that is not what you try to do.

[mykonian]

Myko- please answer my request:


Tell me what Tenchi has done that is so risky, that scum would not do it.

Tenchi was IIRC the first to come with hard accusations, that were likely wrong. That is a town tell.

but like Iece said: a towntell doesn't make him definate town. Just more likely then he would be without it.

I'm getting a bit more uncertain about my KMD vote, although his recent theories dont help, but Phily's buddying gets so obvious...

unvote vote Phily

I think you should not tunnel on tenchi, and not use tenchi as leverage to defend KMD.

[mykonian]

no, bat, I said it before about Phily. I think it is fishy he actually doesn't say a thing about KMD, while he is accusing me for voting KMD.

and scum and town would go into the storage room, so I don't think that a good scumtell, while Tenchi did try to get the game really started that way.

and I did vote Phily, and I "coached" him. That is a way of expressing my theories about what he is doing here. I can't see how it is sneaky in some way.

o and phily, you again got the term OMGUS wrong. It is a reasonless countervote, something I again didn't do.

[mykonian]

but yes, you are right, I should give a bit more attention to this game, because I've already found 4 scum, and 1 town, and those theories dont really fit. I'll try to get a clearer post tomorrow.

[mykonian]

no, Iece, I don't think there are 4 scum, and that is why I should try to get some order in this mess. I have the feeling I'm led too much by emotion. Esspecially when people form a case on me based on OMGUS alone...

Plus: Phily could be scum, but knowing Phily, that would mean: KMD is not his buddy, as he defends himself quite obviously.

KMD & Tenchi could fit together, KMD is not scared to attack his buddy, even sideways ("why are my buddy and that towny still alive?") but Phily and Tenchi are certainly not a team.

and I agree with what you said about Mafiaman, but he really doesnt fit in all this.


so there is much of my problem. I have problems with Phily defending KMD, but I don't think he would defend his buddy.

[mykonian]

Myko, what is your read on me alone? What is your read on Phily alone? If Phily flips town at some point, what is your read on me? If Phily flips scum at some point, what is your read on me? If I flip town at some point, what is your read on Phily? For sake of completeness, if I were to flip scum, what would your read on Phily be? How does Tenchi fit in with all of those scenarios? Do you have other suspects?

mafiaman, and I have a bunch of people where I have little read on.

If you turn up town, Phily is a bit more likely scum (buddying)
If you are scum, phily is most likely town.

if phily is scum, you are likely town
if phily is town, that doesn't say a thing about you.

Tenchi fits not with Phily scum, as phily defends you partially by making me vote for Tenchi. Tenchi scum would make phily town. But your attacks on tenchi could easily be early bussing, the way you posted them. So it doesn't say a thing about you.


@phily: it could be, I'm still trying to make sense out of your aggressive defense of yourself, and your defense for KMD with making me vote Tenchi.

[mykonian]

Me, Attacking Myk for double votes, Myk, using this as excuse to accuse me of buddying to save his own hide.
Got it now?

Can't a man have two suspects, and like one better.

what I hate, is that you disagree with my choice and then actively try to change that, to move my vote from KMD to Tenchi. I've been very clear why I believed KMD more scum then Tenchi, and why tenchi was second choice because of that.

you haven't been so clear why your defense of KMD is justified, and your attacks on Tenchi have been "he acted scummy and posting a lot shouldn't help him, and so shouldn't towntells be".

and this disagreement results in two votes on eachother, and you've been quite eager to make an OMGUS case on me. Not that protown, my dear.

[mykonian]

What I hate is the fact that you never once addressed my arguement correctly so save your own hide.

just in case we are two townies bashing heads, could you provide the arguement in a way that I cant miss it, so I can try to react appropriately.

because even as scum I don't go around arguments, so it is always a mistake.

[mykonian]

btw, something I will then try to look at with a clear mind, so you have the time, I will react tomorrow.

[mykonian]

@ Post 448
Why do you think phily and KMD are not scum buddies? Im not too clear on this point.

I don't see Phily (before I say this) defending his buddy this clearly. He was actively attacking my choice to vote KMD. It actually wouldn't help scum, because it would have gotten them into the spotlight

BTW:

unvote Phily

sorry phily, I shouldn't have gotten you mad. And there is just too much chance that I'm attacking an annoyed towny (would surprise me if you played being annoyed).

And no, this is not to make you unvote, I expect you to think this is again a scum-action, but I don't care. All that can make you unvote is a glass of water

[mykonian]

Me, Attacking Myk for double votes, Myk, using this as excuse to accuse me of buddying to save his own hide.
Got it now?

sorry, but like other people said, this case is not that great you think it is. It was a catchup post, and I was perfectly doing nothing wrong to vote twice in that.

but this is not the whole point, you disagree that I choose for KMD. That is the point you attack me for. Not that I distance from Tenchi, no you say I shouldn't have voted KMD. Later KMD comes with the distance stuff (as I read it)

Sorry I see my name being mentioned alot but I dont have the time to look for when it was first mentioned can someone please help me.

the other names should be more interesting then your own. Remember, you are supposed to look for scum

I think myko's scummiest moment that is difficult to attribute to poor play has been his attack on Tenchi that in my view unfairly characterized his attacks on Batt.

and on his attacks on phily, twice. Sorry for that.

Now I agree that your doublevote was obviously a way to track your thinking as you reread, but the outcome is what I find suspicious as well. If you would have voted Tenchi, and then revoted KMD for a good reason, then it would have been much different.

the choice between voting on the big bandwagon with not a great case. (because tenchi isn't close to confirmed scum, there were towntells) or voting for what my feelings (slightly aided by evidence) on a person that hadn't been voted outside the RVS is not that hard. I believe in it, so doesn't that mean it is a good vote?

How could I be any clearer as to why hes been acting scummy at this point? Why dont you post your opinion rather than piggybacking? It seems like you're fishing for a good point to use.

a. get a glass of water and calm down
b. you are suprisingly aggressive against people that question you. There was nothing wrong with Kreviovs questions. Kreviov actually somewhat defends me, by saying your case is not that great. So do what he asks from you, step back, and stop tunneling.

[mykonian]

I am playing the game. I'm trying to lynch scum.

players who say they are town, mostly aren't. Why did you do this?

In response to Phily:

Lets keep him on the reserve list for suspects then? Play the game for now? With a setup like this scum slips are bound to occur.

I saw Myko's post as scummy, so I voted him. Phily then told me to play the game for now. I said that by voting scum, I'm playing the game.

No

that

is defending against the accusation [/sarcasm]

And KMD what's your read on phily?

I'd probably be suspicious of him if I didn't think the scumteam was Tenchi/Myko/Kreriov.[/qoute]and what do you think of the persons that are not seen as scummy by a lot of people?

BTW:

unvote Phily

sorry phily, I shouldn't have gotten you mad. And there is just too much chance that I'm attacking an annoyed towny (would surprise me if you played being annoyed).

And no, this is not to make you unvote, I expect you to think this is again a scum-action, but I don't care. All that can make you unvote is a glass of water

You think only townies get annoyed?

no, but it makes this reaction more likely to come from town too. If I was already annoyed, and people seemed to misinterpret my arguments, I would tunnel on them until I got a glass of water. Not that it is great play, but if you are in that state of mind things happen.

something I'm sure you knew. Much happier with my unvote after this post.

[mykonian]

no, but it makes this reaction more likely to come from town too. If I was already annoyed, and people seemed to misinterpret my arguments, I would tunnel on them until I got a glass of water. Not that it is great play, but if you are in that state of mind things happen.

something I'm sure you knew. Much happier with my unvote after this post.

I just don't see why it's a townie reaction. I've reacted that way as both alignments before.

the other way around please. We have a reaction from phily, and we are supposed to find out if it comes from town or from scum. The "real" emotion makes the reaction also likely to come from town.

[mykonian]

All that can make you unvote is a glass of water

You like to say this phrase a lot... I don't see how drinking a glass of water would make someone calm down.

the point is that he should calm down. If he does that by running a marathon I dont mind. Just to keep saying he should calm down is acting like his mother, and saying that he should run a marathon is rather weird.

[mykonian]

Perhaps I'm being paranoid but I truely think you've made one terrible slip in that double vote post.

the terrible is a bit weird. I have given the exact reasons, open and clear, what my reasons were for my both votes. Not so scummy.

I think you have seen me as scum. Assume I wanted to distance from Tenchi, but not vote him (already a weird plan), would I have posted clear points against him, that would warrant a vote? [/wifom]

So, the fact that I explain to you why I could vote Tenchi, but why I prefer KMD, doesn't that make that I'm not that likely scum?

[mykonian]

Myko:
-His "promise" to Looker.

explained. Every game till now I have aggressively attacked Looker, when she was towny. It is not more then normal that I change the way I play then. She has been a bit lurky in this game now, something that is a shame, because her posts were not antitown.

-Basically lurked through the beginning of the game.

v/la for the most part.

-Took 12+ pages to respond to my serious vote on him.

strawman. The above explanation was given short after it (a defence). When I reread and you are still hammering that on page 12, I attack you for it.

-OMGUS's me by letting the case develop as I respond to him.

don't get this point. I hate the word omgus, I gave my reasoning

-Votes me over Tenchi, who he actually, you know, HAS a case against.

that is much too easily followed by the wrong people, and there are things that point at Tenchi not being scum. Enough for me not to follow the case

[mykonian]

I see I'm voting someone now, so

unvote

Myk and KMD, your cases against eachother look fake. at this moment, it wouldn't surprise me if you were distancing.

gut=fake? and the fact that he voted for pregame talk, for 12 pages? fake?

Proposition

we are not getting a lot further. Maybe it would make sense to get more talk about a lynch?

[mykonian]

gut=fake?

never said that. Don't lay words in my mouth.

and the fact that he voted for pregame talk, for 12 pages? fake?

yeah, the reasons you had to vote eachother, was so weak you allmost couldn't take it serious.

You said the reasons looked fake. Now you say they were too weak. Now I want to hear from you why you think that. Quote my reasons and show why it is fake.

Proposition

we are not getting a lot further. Maybe it would make sense to get more talk about a lynch?

yeah, ok. first you're accusing people, and when they fight back, you're only protecting your own butt. What do you want? Stay alive or scumlynch? [/quote]?

I think 20 pages is about long enough. And I have the feeling esspecially around Kreviov discussion is not that constructional anymore. It simply doesn't help.

I don't get what you are accusing me of. Most people would have an opinion of me, I think except you and mafiaman, people would have an opinion on anybody.

So exactly you would be save from a lynch, not me. Because people are attacking me, and I want the day to be ended soon. So sorry, but I think you didn't have a clue what I was saying.

[mykonian]

-what are the points in favor of Tenchi being town? Why are they stronger than your case on Tenchi or anyone else's?

I think that I explained before that Tenchi took risks. That is towny the way I see the game. But his "aggressive" starting, weak cases, wrong points, etc, also looks scummy: but could one do better? It did start the game, and he had little to work with. It seems like scum had an easy target with the first person that acted. It makes that I have little confidence in that wagon.

and sorry for the format. Just that I don't know how to clearly answer multiple questions.

[mykonian]

So far the only risk you have stated is that he attacked me with bad reasoning. Also, Tenchi wagon is the second wagon as I was technically the first person to act and he tried to form a wagon on me.

but I hope you get the point where I think I get that feeling from. Tenchis mistakes were the reason he was attacked, but mistakes are going to be made if you try to create something out of nothing, something Tenchi tried.

[mykonian]

Myk's Post 497 - Lurky? Really? My apologies.

after last game, I expect more from you

[mykonian]

Ok, Kreviov went up my list very, very fast. He picks the three suspects as top three that are not really scummy, but are targets (still sorry phily, I shouldn't have done it).

Like the point about Phily: being too defensive about mistakes... Nobody likes to make them, and it makes clear that Phily is attacked for mistakes: not for scumslips (mistakes made by scum). Any town should see the difference.

[mykonian]

@Mykonian - Ok.

My suspects are a as follows with a brief reason why.

Tenchi - Jumping wagons for little or no reason.
PhilyEc - Being way to defensive about mistakes
Mykonian - This whole weird KMD back and forth thing
Kmd - Pushing a bad case
Ztife - Lurking

So you suspect one less than half the game. Awesome. And two of those (obviously not yourself) match mine. And yet I'm suspicious for pushing a bad case?

@Myko - Yup, why do you think I removed my vote? Anyway, you asked. None of those scum suspicions are very strong. One reason I am not voting for anyone Will be interesting to see what others have to say.

^Spaghetti tactic.

agreed. Though it was a weak case that you continued too long.

[mykonian]

Myk's Post 519 - Sorry, but trying to handle RL matters simultaneously. Either way, I would appreciate it if you, Gregory, & Ztife could come up with some suspicions or something to get the game moving. Aren't we still under deadline? Are we intentionally heading for a no-lynch?

eh, why am I put in a list with ztife and Gregory. And why should I seek scum for you? and why do you threaten us? what makes you think a no-lynch is even possible?

[mykonian]

ztife would be the "save" lynch for me (in case everything fails), where I expect this to be Tenchi from the rest. I am against a tenchi lynch.

I rather have KMD, or Kreviov at the moment. I think. Need a reread (and sleep), but that should be the general way I'm thinking. I don't want phily anymore.

[mykonian]

thank you for telling. I guess the lurking helps on me

at least, tomorrow I should have for the first time this weak had enough sleep. A reread and a final decision should be done by me. Because I would rather like this day to end.

[mykonian]

Because it took that long to get a reaction.

uhm, no I defended quite early. I later attacked you on it.

And why should I seek scum for you?

Um, isn't that the main goal for a townie?

So I seek them for myself. But looker shouldn't ask me who is scum when she doesn't say a thing herself.

I want to lynch Tenchi or Myko. I'd be more than happy to lynch Kreriov. I'd be willing to lynch you. I wouldn't be upset lynching Bitchi, Zt, or Gregory. Anyone else, not my top choice, but I'd take over a no lynch.

4 top picks. not upset by 3. uhm...

ztife would be the "save" lynch for me (in case everything fails), where I expect this to be Tenchi from the rest. I am against a tenchi lynch.

I rather have KMD, or Kreviov at the moment. I think. Need a reread (and sleep), but that should be the general way I'm thinking. I don't want phily anymore.

Funny, I thought you suspected Tenchi. And note the distancing from Kreriov here.

expect me to change it. Though after the discussion with Phily I got more convinced of Tenchi town, mostly by myself. And I am worried by Kreviovs picks.

the problem is, I see scum anywhere, but I don't want to pick 7, like KMD does. So sorry for that post that was too early, maybe I should have stayed calmer. KMD still is top pick for early game, that remains.

[mykonian]

First it started as only scum would go into rooms to unlock their NK abilities. Then the newest theory is that players get powers by going into a room.

mind if I will be a testcase what happens if you don't? because I really doubt it is that easy. I expect at least some negative traits, or only first persons in a room to make it. For example, the library doesn't need to give sane cop abilities, and the hospital could give quacks in stead of docs. Because otherwise this game would surely be too easy.

[mykonian]

Am I the only one who thought testcase was testicle? I need to go to bed... haven't gone to bed yet.

I interpret the last post as: put doubt in anyone who gets a powerrole's mind as to if their role is a negative one and to discourage others into going into rooms.

Unvote
Vote: mykonian

This puts you past Tenchi on my list, but only marginally due to his lurking.

eh: I said it after you did it, while I obviously already thought this a long time, seen my little movement. And if all those players get more then one powerrole, because of all the rooms they have seen, yes, then you should think about how powerful you really can be.

remember, the mod doesnt want this game to be easy.

conclusion: no, I don't want to discourage movement, yes I want you to doubt the strength of the pr's you could get.

[mykonian]

could you explain that, perhaps with an example?

[mykonian]

myko has only pregame posted a joke towards looker about previous games. You come with your perfectly logical argument that I must have made a slip. Didn't think so:

FoS KMD

I agree, KMD's case against you was weak, but he thinks he saw a slip, so why should you Fos him for his opinion? OK, he's probably wrong, but does that make him scum?

unvote vote KMD

mostly gut, but this play just points at him being scum. It is not a big difference, but as town he would never semi lurk this way, tunneling till over page 10 on a pregame post.

gut and other games. Can be usefull, but it is also an easy reason for scum to vote someone.

the main problem I have with that weak case, is that he obviously hasn't seen that it was weak in 12 pages. That makes me think he is scum that thinks he has found a towny mistake and continues to push that. I have no idea why he would bring it up again in a post that tells close to nothing.

[mykonian]

I hate how people go around discarding cases and calling other people's cases weak. Its lame.

true, but I'm not saying it to offend myko, I'm saying it because I think they are distancing with this. Making such cases against eachother, that are too weak to lynch someone, but make clear they want eachother dead. At least, that is what I think.

one problem I have with this whole theory is that he agrees that KMD's case is weak, and kept too long, but he disagrees with voting for that. It is kind of the main piece of my case against KMD.

but I have to agree with KMD, greg hasn't yet got all my alarms going. could be because way too many people are way too careful. I see only action from Phily and Batt, and further people are too much playing along. Iece does something, and then a lot of people that are not trying hard enough.

(and no, I don't talk about myself)

[mykonian]

to reinforce the statement that too many arent doing a thing: half of the players have probably not even given a serious vote. And the distancing between KMD and me is more likely: since we don't vote for each other.

KMD has had a history of two votes (seen the counts) that stayed long. Both were on lurkers "that he didn't want to let go" and on not that great cases (seen the protown things that did come from Tenchi).

it is not a lot, but I would expect more active hunting from KMD. His voting suggest more waiting scum.

And no, this is not a great case, but one I would like to go for.

vote KMD

[mykonian]

Myko, have I ever been one to vote hop?

I dont know, actually. It is a tell that was learned to me in one of my newbies and since I remember it, I see that it works great on myself. I think I can compare myself to you, except you are better. So I think this would work, yes.

[mykonian]

or you can skim and only read the posts that are not setup-related: you should have a fast reread then.

and I am not pleased that KMD actually did want to lynch me for that pregame post, as he knew well that wasn't a scumslip.

[mykonian]

Heh heh. Took me a while to figure out that Wolf is who I am replacing. Had to scan the mod's posts in iso to find it. <_<

---
...And that's got to be the quickest read ever. >_>

The last two pages make me dislike Myk and Kreriov, and I see a possible buddy connection already. Will have to look into it with more detail.

uhm, I dislike Kreviovs recent play, certainly who he thinks most likely scum.

[mykonian]

uhm, I dislike Kreviovs recent play, certainly who he thinks most likely scum.

Thing is, aren't you both voting KMD?

If you dislike who he thinks is most likely scum, why do you two share the same vote?

because it was his forth or fifth pick in his last list.

KMD has been first choice for me after his lazy voting, and playing. I have no idea why Kreviov suddenly thinks he should jump at KMD too. You should ask him.

[mykonian]

Yea...seeing stronger Myk-Krev connections from that post alone.

but at least make it distancing in stead of buddying, and please point out then why this points at us being scum.

[mykonian]

Yea...seeing stronger Myk-Krev connections from that post alone.

and you havent checked, you only say this because I say no.

[mykonian]

@Mykonian - Um, gee, could it be that Kmd popped to the top of my list when he started lying and misrepresenting posts? He even ADMITS he is to lazy to get the facts straight and just cares about the prejudicial surface value of the attacks he is using. He has been constantly using a strawman attack as well. I think my vote is pretty solid and reasonable.

point is that I haven't taken time yet to really see what you are both saying.

[mykonian]

I hate how people go around discarding cases and calling other people's cases weak. Its lame.

true, but I'm not saying it to offend myko, I'm saying it because I think they are distancing with this. Making such cases against eachother, that are too weak to lynch someone, but make clear they want eachother dead. At least, that is what I think.

one problem I have with this whole theory is that he agrees that KMD's case is weak, and kept too long, but he disagrees with voting for that. It is kind of the main piece of my case against KMD.

Wait, are you saying I should vote for KMD because he had a weak case? I made it clear he had a weak vote, both of you did for eachother. Him for voting for you for apparent buddying at the beginning and you for voting for him for basically voting for you. The main piece of you case against KMD is that hes got a poor case on you?? Srsly??? Thats like...a weak case of its own, lol.

yes, keeping a weak case too long is scummy. He didn't advance a bit in that first 12 pages. That it was on me, is added, but he has just done very little there.

"he didnt scumhunt", "he (active) lurked"

and personally, I have seen little strong cases (no, not Tenchi, that one has serious problems. We are finding mistakes there, not scum) , and I have a good feeling about this one.

[mykonian]

it is not a lot, but I would expect more active hunting from KMD. His voting suggest more waiting scum.

And no, this is not a great case, but one I would like to go for.

vote KMD

Hmm you do this right after Krev votes for KMD. From what I'm seeing of you Myk, you're using gut feeling to get away from the fact that most of your accusations towards KMD are unfounded. I don't see any effort from you to weedle out answers from him and basically scumhunt, rather you're just waiting for a good opportunity, which strangely enough is what you accuse KMD of. Could you explain why you want to see KMD lynched so badly? I'd like a bunch of reasons that arent too abstract.

if KMD is scum, you won't find mistakes. So yes, if lurking, and not actively scumhunting,(supported by votes, and for example that post on page 12) are too abstract for you, I dont think I can get more.

[mykonian]

With deadline coming, I would expect that you should have done that by now...

5 days a week I'm doing with too little sleep for me. Which means that I cant really be constructive. But I will read them, don't worry.

[mykonian]

It's only a lie if Kmd is scum. Otherwise, it's just a bad guess.

and who do you want to lynch.

same for phily: please be constructive. You said yourself you hated people that went around calling other peoples cases bad. Please pick out the best one, so we don't have to go to fast for a lynch.

[mykonian]

mykonian- You think 4 days before deadline is too fast for a lynch?

i have been clear in my choice, seen over all play. I have given plenty of opinions.

what I was asking was for others to be constructive too, and work towards a lynch, so we don't have to pick the one with the most votes one hour before deadline.

Yea...seeing stronger Myk-Krev connections from that post alone.

but at least make it distancing in stead of buddying, and please point out then why this points at us being scum.

Um. Weirdest post of the game. Did you just admit to distancing when accused of buddying and ask why it's a scumtell?

the problem with what mastin says is that it is quite baseless, and seen what I said about Kreviov doesn't even make sense. Which reinforces me into thinking he didn't read the thread well, and just wanted to bring pressure on Kreviov and me, after having seen the last votecount.


Iece: what did you want from me?

Phily: could you stop defending KMD? You continue to do it. And could you stop tunneling? Less bullshit please, more finding scum. Because your only case is that my case on KMD sucks, something you called bad yourself.

Mafiaman doesn't understand the game, as battousai was completely reasonable in his last posts.

[mykonian]

Kreviov... interesting...

now please, a bit more constructive.

There are at least 4 that want to lynch me. The three who vote me, and KMD. Are there more?
There are now 2 on KMD, are there more that would like that lynch?
Tenchi is an old favorite, and Iecerint is still in favor. I do agree that lurking is not the best thing he could do, and I'm probably a classic example for a person that is affected by it, but anyway: are there 7 who would like this lynch?
Mafiamann is clearly not helping, and looks obviousscum. Recent posts make me agree with a wagon on him.

did I miss someone, or are this the persons we should look at seriously for this lynch? In that case, please post with what lynches you would agree. My vote could be on mafiaman or KMD, I think.

This is no longer making cases, this is placing the vote for the person you want to lynch. We should have some information, and there are some wagons that could be succesful, now we only need to see what wagons would be on scum.

[mykonian]

the problem with what mastin says is that it is quite baseless, and seen what I said about Kreviov doesn't even make sense. Which reinforces me into thinking he didn't read the thread well, and just wanted to bring pressure on Kreviov and me, after having seen the last votecount.

And if he'd read more closely, he'd have seen the two of you distancing?

the fact that I attacked Kreviov for his scumlist makes this a bit weird, yes. So if I and Kreviov have anything to do with eachother, it would never by buddying, it would be distancing. Mastin obviously hasn't read, and wanted pressure on both me and Kreviov.

@Kreviov: some posts are just not worth making. We know where you stand.

[mykonian]

I'm sorry. I knew, I think.

but not a lot of sleep makes me think slow, I guess. I did notice your post though...

[mykonian]

replacing in. i have to pee.

[dj enters room 1]

Last time I enjoyed our agreement

don't lurk, or I'll vote you

and hello!

[mykonian]

Enter: Room 3,
Lock: Room 3

.

We need to lynch Myk today, not KMD.

great case.

not that I'm going to save myself. The "he has the most votes anyway"-reason is working again.

I won't selfvote, but town: WAKE UP. too many people are making it scum too easy. It would be nice to see more scumhunting, and less: "I don't care, we need a lynch."

btw, since I'm probably dead in a few hours, there is nothing wrong with a little directing.

have you ever seen Mastin playing this way? He doesn't bring a thing

a vig would be awesome, I can live with a lynch day two.

[mykonian]

I'm sorry for being unactive. Why are people allways busy in vacation?

At this moment, It wouldn't care to me if we'd lynch KMD or Myko,
but I think there is a more probable myko will be lynched, so

vote: Mykonian

uhm my friend: shouldn't you care who scum is? And it is pretty clear KMD and I arent scum together, seen all the attacks, so you should care.

[mykonian]

I obviously think you're scum and I think you're the one talking bullshit, I've made this clear.

and since all I say is bullshit anyway, you don't have to listen to me. great tunneling, and you got your mislynch. Phily, hunt more scum, and tunnel less. Maybe you listen to me after you have seen my allignment. Or you are just scum.

[mykonian]

myko, you were in the WoT mini, right? Could you remind me of what your role was in that?

uhm... I was town, but I went in and out. Tried to replace, but couldn't make it. Not proud of it, and it won't give you anything, I'm afraid.

[mykonian]

Fair 'nuff. I prefer Myk, though; I see connections to Myk and others, making buddies possible.

KMD has nobody I can see linked to him. And that's a problem; if nobody's linked to him, then it's less likely he's scum.

isn't the point of being scum mostly to get as less interactions as possible? (people getting mad at you, and voting you, or people that see that you interact unnatural with one)

Mastin, a lot of connections is certainly not a scumtell.

[mykonian]

unvote vote Mykonian

via logic of prior post

that was that I had the most votes?

[mykonian]

have you ever seen Mastin playing this way? He doesn't bring a thing

Yea, well, new replacement strategy. I think I'm going to develop a new tactic:

Stop /inning for any game, 'cept for games I'm extremely interested in.
Work solely as a replacement.

And that's because, as a replacement, my posts are FAR easier to ingest. This game's a good example.
Quick skim, iso-read predecessor, first+last pages, iso-read suspects if needed.
Seems to have worked well.

no, it doesn't. You are working on incomplete information, and tunnel afterwards.

[mykonian]

As I understand it, one scum (same role as the Mod in this game) fakes her death and then hypnotizes another female player to commit the murders. The game probably won't be as breakable as that, though.

It's also possible that scum can prevent PRs by denying access to certain rooms at night (e.g. what Mastin is doing at the Library). He's claimed that he wants all of us to lock ourselves in our own rooms, presumably under the assumption that this will make us safe. I suspect his plan, especially if its only actual effect is to lock the library, is anti-town.

as the library should give some cop powers.

and phily, if someone has actually problems to be insulting, it is me. Because I was really annoyed with the word bullshit, used by you, I replyed with it, once. and wringling like a worm, or town that doesn't want to be lynched? You tunnel anyway, so it doesn't make a difference to you anymore.

[mykonian]

you've just been wriggling like a worm, not the most helpful reaction towards clearing your name but then again shows where your motivations are coming from.

you are a worm yourself...

and since you are wrong, please tell me what happens after that. Tomorrow, what will happen after you see that I'm town?

[mykonian]

isn't the point of being scum mostly to get as less interactions as possible? (people getting mad at you, and voting you, or people that see that you interact unnatural with one)

Mastin, a lot of connections is certainly not a scumtell.

Depends how you play it. I once intentionally connected myself to Yosarian2 before I died and got the vidge to shoot him.

mhmm. Buddying is a tactic.

but not to multiple persons, as then you have the problem of your mafia buddy. How to react to him? and how to make sure that is natural? And how smart is it to attack multiple people? not very much, OMGUS feelings tend to make them vote you, at least get you under attack. One reasoning why tunneling is absolutely antitown.

and you know the last thing very well, as you have done that for a large portion of the game. Not making enemies, and on a certain moment choose your target.

[mykonian]

Guy who can't use names, please answer my last post.

if he is smart, he lets Don catch up anyway, so you've got time enough to get that answer.

[mykonian]

Don, you can't say that someone who can't be linked to anyone, is town.

some of you have read the story. what is the big advantage for scum?
according to what some guys said, town should be able to get a doc, cop and vig. Wouldn't that be to overpowered compared to scum?

see previous post about that. Seeing that you are a bit of a newby, you might look at weakened roles.

also seen the story, the jailkeeper is also likely to come from the hospital.