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Post Post #7 (isolation #0) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:51 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Vote: Papa Zito


He knows why.
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Post Post #11 (isolation #1) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:06 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Papa Zito wrote:
Seraphim wrote:
Vote: Papa Zito


He knows why.
Eh? What'd I do now?
I'm not sure though I'm sure I'll remember eventually.
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Post Post #16 (isolation #2) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:24 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Well Mr. Rampage, have we played since War in Heaven 2? It seems hard to believe we haven't played in so long...

Also, Zito has proven himself scum with his last post. A wagon must be formed on him at once.
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Post Post #19 (isolation #3) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:31 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Papa Zito wrote:Seraphim doesn't approve of the farside wagon. Why's that, Seraphim?
It's not that I don't approve of the farside wagon, it's that you are obviously scum. In fact, the fact that you are trying to call me out for not approving the farside wagon, a clear misnomer because I never stated such sentiments, is in fact incredibly suspicious in itself.
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Post Post #27 (isolation #4) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:42 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Farside, I never stated that the reason Papa Zito was obvscum was because he started a BW on you.
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Post Post #29 (isolation #5) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:47 pm

Post by Seraphim »

farside22 wrote:
Seraphim wrote:Farside, I never stated that the reason Papa Zito was obvscum was because he started a BW on you.
So why is Papa zito obvious scum?
Zito stated 'arrite'. Only pirates say 'arr'. Pirates are dirty people and therefore scummy. Therefore, Zito is a pirate is obvscum.
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Post Post #31 (isolation #6) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:52 pm

Post by Seraphim »

well, so is being a pirate. And let me say that pirates are much worse smelling than us normal folk.
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Post Post #35 (isolation #7) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:01 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Albert B. Rampage wrote:RVS is over kid. Time to fess up.
The random stage is over when it's over. And clearly, it ain't over.
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Post Post #48 (isolation #8) » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:54 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Image[/img]
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Post Post #71 (isolation #9) » Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:04 am

Post by Seraphim »

What happened to the anteaters?

Also, it should be fairly obvious that Zito is Pirate Scum, guys.
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Post Post #77 (isolation #10) » Fri Mar 19, 2010 9:45 am

Post by Seraphim »

Unvote
Vote: NickF227


for pretending to be a Final Fantasy fan and then not playing Final Fantasy VII. Fail.
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Post Post #83 (isolation #11) » Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:12 pm

Post by Seraphim »

RichardGHP wrote:
curiouskarmadog wrote:
vote richard


have I done this yet?

is it too early to say I am tunneling?
If this is some kind of attemp at a Policy Lynch, please stop.
What makes you say this might be a policy lynch?
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Post Post #86 (isolation #12) » Fri Mar 19, 2010 1:32 pm

Post by Seraphim »

If he was seriously going for a policy lynch, I think he would be trying to convince us to policy lynch you rather than just voting for you.
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Post Post #106 (isolation #13) » Sat Mar 20, 2010 1:57 am

Post by Seraphim »

If CKD is doing what I think he's doing, then he is not being scummy. By all means, continue to scrutinize him but I am going to follow other leads.

Bv310 - could you please explain how prolonging the random stage would help scum find the "weak town"? I have never heard anything like this before...true, I could have missed it in my absence but otherwise...

Porochaz - thank you for the gold star.
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Post Post #124 (isolation #14) » Sat Mar 20, 2010 11:17 am

Post by Seraphim »

bv310 wrote:Seraphim, I've found that it's always scum who try to draw out the RVS in order to get it a bit closer to deadline before the actual play begins. It's usually not close enough to make a difference, but it gives a bit extra time to look for either breadcrumbs (in a theme game) or slight PR-tells.
I disagree. The benefits to the scum in question is minimal and it puts them in the hotseat. I have never considered prolonging the RVS a scumtell and you have not convinced me otherwise.

Unvote
Vote: RichardGHP


He needs more votes.
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Post Post #126 (isolation #15) » Sat Mar 20, 2010 11:30 am

Post by Seraphim »

RichardGHP wrote:Everybody should vote me now.
Reverse psychology ain't gonna help you here.
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Post Post #129 (isolation #16) » Sat Mar 20, 2010 12:10 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Omigod, Faraday is in this game? Hi Faraday!
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Post Post #132 (isolation #17) » Sat Mar 20, 2010 1:42 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Richard, why do you think we should lynch you?
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Post Post #161 (isolation #18) » Sun Mar 21, 2010 6:19 am

Post by Seraphim »

I don't want Richard lynched but I do want to see more votes on him. I'm not letting him get away with this 'gambit' bullshit unless he pulls out some analysis. I don't care if he's inexperienced or not, wallowing in self-pity does the town no favors. Under pressure, scum will often pull 'gambits' as a way to take pressure off themselves. Nope. Not gonna happen.

As for the lurker hunters...

Mod: please prod both Anon and DocPotter


...is a lot more productive than voting them. If they haven't posted yet, they may not even be watching the game and your pressure and main focus is doing nothing.

ABR, why would you want to wagon CKD?
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Post Post #167 (isolation #19) » Sun Mar 21, 2010 8:10 am

Post by Seraphim »

Jahudo and bv310: what do you think of Richard?
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Post Post #170 (isolation #20) » Sun Mar 21, 2010 10:19 am

Post by Seraphim »

bv310 wrote:I think Richard is town, but very whiny town. And not by a big slot either. He seems to grasp the game quite well, but his little tantrum and subsequent backpedaling to say he was reaction-fishing just seems really forced. He seems to be playing the newbie-scum stereotype quite fully.
So, is he newbie-scum or very whiny town?
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Post Post #175 (isolation #21) » Sun Mar 21, 2010 2:14 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Depending on what Richard does next, bv may be my next suspect. I may have to read up on his meta because his posts are throwing up red flags.
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Post Post #197 (isolation #22) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 10:22 am

Post by Seraphim »

FoS: All 'lurker hunters'


I don't know how many of you are scum or not. All I know is that your crusade is not helping anyone and is getting on my nerves. It's not scum hunting because you have no reason to believe DocPotter is scum. If he doesn't post today, he'll be replaced. Big effing deal. It's the first week of the first Day. By focusing solely on the lurkers, you are acting like them by not participating in the game and giving us little or no read on you. Use your vote to hunt possible suspects and let the mod do his job.

Anon's recap post is terrible. Richard is not an 'easy target', Richard is a player with strange anti-town behavior that needs more consideration and more pressure. He's been backpedalling and doing all sorts of scummy stuff. Not to mention jumping on a wagon based on the RVS based on this craplogic is very bad. Very bad. I wouldn't doubt that if Andrew is scum, Anon is scum with him.

dybeck, why ABR?

If I had another vote, I would be voting bv310. He's straddling the fence like a horny anteater. He's still voting Porochaz for 'extending the RVS'. Bullshit. Not to mention, as stated earlier, his posts just scream scum to me.
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Post Post #199 (isolation #23) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:04 am

Post by Seraphim »

Post 195 in particular is not a good example but a lot of his earlier posts are.
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Post Post #202 (isolation #24) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:59 am

Post by Seraphim »

bv310 wrote:
Seraphim wrote:If I had another vote, I would be voting bv310. He's straddling the fence like a horny anteater. He's still voting Porochaz for 'extending the RVS'. Bullshit. Not to mention, as stated earlier, his posts just scream scum to me.
Parroting PZ too? Nice.
This doesn't discount the point that you haven't taken a serious stand on anything.
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Post Post #204 (isolation #25) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:12 pm

Post by Seraphim »

My Milked Eek wrote:Lurker hunting is easy to use as scum.
says the lurker. Nah, just kidding. I didn't even know you were in the game until this post though. You lost your amazing Pokemon avatar so I didn't recognize you.
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Post Post #209 (isolation #26) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:43 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Please explain, since you are such an expert at reading players, why he backpedaled and then said his 'lynch me now' statement was a gambit.
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Post Post #211 (isolation #27) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:51 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Anon wrote:
Seraphim wrote:Please explain, since you are such an expert at reading players, why he backpedaled and then said his 'lynch me now' statement was a gambit.
did he say his "lynch me now" was not a gambit?
No, he said it was which doesn't really fit into your furious town postulate. Sounds like pissed off scum trying to cover his ass to me.
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Post Post #221 (isolation #28) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 2:39 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I still think it's serious backpedaling. Your other points are valid but could be applied to scum too. It also ignores his later play where he seems, to me, strangely smug. I disagree with Farside's intent to lynch...I haven't decided if he's scum yet, only that he needs more pressure until he coughs up the analysis his "gambit" gave him.
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Post Post #223 (isolation #29) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 2:41 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Lynching lurkers on page 9 who have not posted accomplishes nothing. I think there are scummier things lurking in these waters than...lurkers.
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Post Post #226 (isolation #30) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 2:45 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Espeonage wrote:Papa Zito is vig
*face-palm*
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Post Post #232 (isolation #31) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 2:53 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I don't think anyone is pushing for a lynch immediately at this moment.
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Post Post #237 (isolation #32) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 2:57 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Gaaaaaah...I want to vote bv310 reeeeeally bad right now...but Richard still needs pressure...
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Post Post #239 (isolation #33) » Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:05 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Zito, you're smart, I'll ask you. Do you think I should join you on the bv wagon or keep pressuring Richard?
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Post Post #288 (isolation #34) » Tue Mar 23, 2010 10:57 am

Post by Seraphim »

In terms of meta, I tend not to use it in a lot of my normal play. However, when I'm getting a gut feel on someone rather than anything concrete, I'll read a person's play as town to see if I'm getting the same feeling. It's really just for my own personal benefit.

I'm not voting bv because I want answers from Richard first and unvoting him now will drop the pressure on him. I'm talking about in sort of a glorified FoS manner.

Keeping an eye on lurkers is fine, voting them when there are suspects and discussions on the table? Especially when the lurkers you are hunting haven't even posted yet? That's almost as bad as lurking. It's too early to have players dedicated solely to lurker hunting.

There are other points I want to highlight but not right now.
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Post Post #292 (isolation #35) » Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:59 am

Post by Seraphim »

dybeck wrote:Albert, is it your intention to lurk in plain sight? Or are you just lazy?

You seem to have made a lot of posts for someone who's said precisely nothing.
Hey, pot, have you met kettle?
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Post Post #294 (isolation #36) » Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:18 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I think Richard is town, but very whiny town.
He seems to be playing the newbie-scum stereotype quite fully.
I'm not sure yet. I'm leaning towards newbie-scum, but that's not enough to warrant a real wagon.
he seems slightly scummier after a quick iso-read.
I don't know what to call him now.
That dramatic a turnaround and AtE seems very much like scum trying to cry their way out.
Unvote
Vote: bv310
[/quote]
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Post Post #295 (isolation #37) » Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:20 pm

Post by Seraphim »

and yes, I fail at quote tags and yes, those posts were all made by bv, and yes, those are in order of occurrence.
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Post Post #315 (isolation #38) » Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:39 am

Post by Seraphim »

bv, what do you think of the case I've made on you? Can you explain your waffling?
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Post Post #318 (isolation #39) » Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:47 am

Post by Seraphim »

So, let's get this on the record: you think Richard is scum?
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Post Post #320 (isolation #40) » Wed Mar 24, 2010 12:00 pm

Post by Seraphim »

So, if you thought Richard was scum previous to this, why didn't you vote him?
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Post Post #327 (isolation #41) » Wed Mar 24, 2010 2:29 pm

Post by Seraphim »

He flip-flopped from town to scum to not sure to scum to not sure to scum and then only voted under pressure.
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Post Post #352 (isolation #42) » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:27 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Why does it seem like Pomegranate is just jumping on an easy wagon? Subsequent rereads takes Richard as more of a VI than scum...
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Post Post #355 (isolation #43) » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:45 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I just feel like Richard is exhibiting VI behavior. Also, my feelings towards the wagon are influenced by the fact that my major suspect(bv) in on there along with a few other players I have questionable reads on.

Richard: summarize your play so far in the game in five words or less.

Also, why is Faraday scum?
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Post Post #356 (isolation #44) » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:50 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Pomegranate wrote:
Seraphim wrote:Why does it seem like Pomegranate is just jumping on an easy wagon? Subsequent rereads takes Richard as more of a VI than scum...
I've played with him before, and he didn't act like this at all. Also, I'd say that bv is the most popular wagon right now.
Richard wagon: seven votes.

bv310 wagon: five votes.

I'd support either if deadline hit but that's two weeks away. Also, looking back, I missed him(Richard) using meta to defend himself which is terrible...I still like my vote though.
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Post Post #379 (isolation #45) » Fri Mar 26, 2010 1:26 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Richard's post disturbs me.

You need to stop wallowing in self-pity and start scumhunting. Honestly, the entire "world against me" attitude is getting so old. Whenever I try to get information to get a read on you, you freak out. If you're town, it's distracting and looks terrible. If you're scum, you are going to get lynched.

Do something about it unless your 'lynch me now' post wasn't a gambit but a desperate plea for attention.
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Post Post #397 (isolation #46) » Sat Mar 27, 2010 8:44 am

Post by Seraphim »

bv310 wrote:ABR, in 17 posts you haven't said anything. Now you're just switching to a townie wagon with no reasoning whatsoever?
HoS: ABR
And no, this is not meta. Most of your games you at least contribute on a cursory level
Do you find Richard more or less scummy than ABR? Explain your answer.

@Richard: why do you think bv is scum?

@ABR: why do you think bv is scum? What do you think of him HoSing you? Does it make him more or less likely to be scum in your eyes?

@Ojanen: I may have missed it, but you haven't commented on bv310's play at all. What do you think of it? Do you think the wagon on him is justified?
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Post Post #399 (isolation #47) » Sat Mar 27, 2010 9:56 am

Post by Seraphim »

bv310 wrote:I find them both scummy, but for different reasons. Richard is scummy to me in is reactions to pressure, while ABR is scummy for his lack of contribution and jumping on popular bandwagons. (Although he does seem to play like that in any game I'm in with him)
You didn't answer my question: is Richard more or less scummy than ABR?
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Post Post #406 (isolation #48) » Sun Mar 28, 2010 1:16 am

Post by Seraphim »

and because your ABR case is built on so much more, right?
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Post Post #420 (isolation #49) » Sun Mar 28, 2010 7:35 am

Post by Seraphim »

I think your descriptor of where the scum are fits bv quite well. He hasn't done anything 'controversial'...if you think that is the accusation being leveled at him, then you obviously haven't been reading the game.

I am voting bv310 for being too passive and too agreeable and too willing to take whatever stance is popular. In fact, I'm not sure if he's had one original position all game.
Sando post 96 wrote:Why are people in this game seemingly obsessed with staying in the RVS, every time we start getting vagueling non-random conversation we apparently need more ant-eaters.
bv310 post 97 wrote:I can think of a few reasons. Namely, scum trying to prolong the random stage so that they can get a handle on who the weak link in town is.
Notice he has no problem with this extended RVS until after Sando starts actively attacking it. His next post, 110, is just blustering something I've never heard of about scum using the RVS to find weak breadcrumbs or PR-tells.

After that, he proceeds to waffle on Richard's alignment, which I've already pointed out and do not feel the need to point out again.

He also attacks Esp for "pointing out" that Papa Zito is vig. It's a joke at worst, WIFOM for the scum at best. So why does he attack it so vigorously? Because he thinks he's taking a pro-town position, "blending in".

He also mentions his 'lurker meta' quite a bit which is odd because, to my knowledge, he has not lurked at all. It seems like an excuse to coast through the game.

bv had also been attacking Richard a lot, a large wagon that has achieved a lot of popularity from the beginning of the game. Easy to jump onto. Easy to get off of if the popularity declines. However, he does not jump onto the wagon until I pressure him to. Sounds like coasting to me.

bv as a player has been too passive and too easy to agree with whatever the popular position is at the time. His play, compared with the other players under suspicion, raises the most red flags for me and obviously for others.

---

So, now, dybeck, why is Esp scum? Is it for reasons Ojanen has pointed out or for other reasons? Why do you like an Esp wagon more than an ABR wagon?
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Post Post #476 (isolation #50) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:57 am

Post by Seraphim »

Mod: Can we get a prod on bv310?


I feel like Richard and bv are slipping underneath the radar...neither have provided good explanations for their play.

I am also getting very bad reads from dybeck. His 180 on ABR is very suspect due to his sudden shift in reasoning...erratic =/= pro-town but erratic =/= scum either. One needs to take his play in the context of the game...dybeck might be making an opportunistic leap onto a budding wagon. I don't like Pom's play much either. This I can't articulate.

Still, I feel like bv310 is the place to be. My gut and my head are in agreement.
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Post Post #478 (isolation #51) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:59 am

Post by Seraphim »

dybeck wrote:@dybeck: why are you so intent on defending a player who isn't really under any pressure when you should be scumhunting?
This is a good question you should be asking yourself. Oh, wait...you are. hmm. So, I'll mirror it back. Consider your question asked to yourself.
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Post Post #481 (isolation #52) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:05 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Espeonage. In the last few pages, it has been the most 'popular' wagon, I think.
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Post Post #485 (isolation #53) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:08 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Well, when it has been 48 hours in 4 hours, can you prod him?
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Post Post #486 (isolation #54) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:09 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Ojanen wrote:
Seraphim wrote:Espeonage. In the last few pages, it has been the most 'popular' wagon, I think.
Look at the votes casted, not true.
Still waiting for Esp, btw, the prod resulted to a "was prodded" post.
In terms of votes, no. Hence the quotes. I think a lot of people have agreed with the overall sentiment, though.
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Post Post #490 (isolation #55) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:18 pm

Post by Seraphim »

dybeck wrote:A good solid read of the game would be good from bv310.

Seraphim: what's your general impression of the players ON the bv wagon? Generally town? Or some bussers on there?
First point: yes. But you said you weren't feeling the bv wagon...do you think it warrants your consideration now?

Second point: bv wagon = Papa Zito, Anon, Seraphim, Espeonage, farside22, curiouskarmadog, RichardGHP

hmmm...if we assume I'm town, I feel the town is the majority here. Richard is VI, I think. That doesn't excuse his play but that's what I'm feeling right now. That's likely to change if he doesn't get off his lazy ass and post. Espeonage is most likely to be bussing scum...I don't get that feeling from Richard.
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Post Post #497 (isolation #56) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:40 pm

Post by Seraphim »

So, you think the wagon on bv310 isn't warranted because several suspects of possible scum are on the wagon? Well, I disagree. Good scum play is playing like town. Whether or not you're voting your partner, you should a player who is scummy. bv is scummy. People will be voting him. If he's scum, added bonus.

Though, TBH, I think it's too early to be looking for bussing...once we get some flips, then we can talk about it.

Also, Espeonage, please enlighten us on...something. Seriously.
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Post Post #499 (isolation #57) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:48 pm

Post by Seraphim »

bv, who is scum?
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Post Post #501 (isolation #58) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:50 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Seraphim wrote:bv, who is scum?
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Post Post #504 (isolation #59) » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:54 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Why? And why do you feel like three of your four suspects are scum? Why that number?
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Post Post #526 (isolation #60) » Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:34 am

Post by Seraphim »

While bv has not done much to decrease his scumminess, I think he is more likely to be town than I originally thought. I think both the Espeonage and Nick wagons warrant further investigation.

Seeing as the Nick wagon is based on a really strange contradictory statement he made, I will wait for him to explain himself. In the meantime, time to check up on this Espeonage guy...
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Post Post #528 (isolation #61) » Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:50 am

Post by Seraphim »

farside22 wrote:
Seraphim wrote:While bv has not done much to decrease his scumminess, I think he is more likely to be town than I originally thought. I think both the Espeonage and Nick wagons warrant further investigation. ...
Why would you think that?
Nick's post is bizarre. I don't know if he's scum, but it's definitely bizarre.

I'm looking back at Espeonage too, and he looks like serious scum. I'll be posting some questions for him in a little bit.

I'm not letting bv310 off the hook...I'm just ensuring that I'm not ignoring what else is happening in the game. Also, I've been looking at the bv wagon and a lot of the scummier players in the game are on it. This has caused me to doubt the wagon's validity.
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Post Post #532 (isolation #62) » Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:22 am

Post by Seraphim »

What exactly do you mean? I said that I felt Espeonage was most likely to be bussing if he was scum. I now am considering him to be a possible candidate for scum. Have you read over his play? It's riddled with contradictions and passive play.

Richard, Espeonage, or bv310, one of these, maybe even two, is scum, I'm sure of it.
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Post Post #535 (isolation #63) » Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:57 am

Post by Seraphim »

Though I said I feel like Richard is more VI, I don't know how much I trust him...perhaps anti-town is a better word? Scummier? Bleah.

Basically, it's how my two other suspects are on the wagon of my main suspect.

Does that make sense?
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Post Post #538 (isolation #64) » Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:04 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Sando wrote:Anyone else you'd like to fence-sit on Sera? That's 3 this page already...
If I had three votes, I'd be voting for all of them. It's not a matter of whether or not I feel they are scummy, it's a matter of which one is scummiest.

And Farside, it's not overall wagon composition. It's those two players in particular that bothers the shit out of me.

That being said, I think I like my vote again. Espeonage can wait for the time being.
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Post Post #540 (isolation #65) » Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:17 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Yeah, I did have some questions for you.

In your first "serious" post, you put a vote down on CKD. Why?

Also, I'm interested to know why you voted Anon despite him holding similar view to MME which you said was a post full of win. It seems like you're contradicting yourself.
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Post Post #542 (isolation #66) » Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:26 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I have another question for you:

Can I have your thoughts on the following players?

ABR
RichardGHP
bv310
dybeck
NickF227
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Post Post #545 (isolation #67) » Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:32 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I find your view on Richard and bv lacking. Expand on those thoughts from your last page.
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Post Post #551 (isolation #68) » Thu Apr 01, 2010 5:30 am

Post by Seraphim »

also, I think people might want to know that deadline is in less than a week if I remember correctly. So, Richard should get off his lazy butt and lay down some posts.
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Post Post #576 (isolation #69) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 2:52 am

Post by Seraphim »

Espeonage, stop making pointless comments about post counts and answer my questions.

Richard, stop whining and start posting.

I'm really getting tired of MME's lurking and not posting content. It doesn't even really feel like he's been in the game at all...it's been two weeks, dammit. Either post something or replace out, this is getting ridiculous.
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Post Post #584 (isolation #70) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 6:07 am

Post by Seraphim »

He's saying that bv is useless and he would rather have him lynched than Richard, which is the other major competing wagon.
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Post Post #596 (isolation #71) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 7:42 am

Post by Seraphim »

Farside is voting bv310.
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Post Post #601 (isolation #72) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 7:45 am

Post by Seraphim »

Albert B. Rampage wrote:
Seraphim wrote:Farside is voting bv310.
I am not unaware. Farside said she doesn't like the people on Richard's wagon, and pom is among them. I think it is you who misunderstood.
Then maybe you should be voting those people and not Richard. Like pomegranate.
It read to me like you were saying that Farside was voting Richard.
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Post Post #605 (isolation #73) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 7:53 am

Post by Seraphim »

Albert B. Rampage wrote:
Seraphim wrote:It read to me like you were saying that Farside was voting Richard.
And now you know you're wrong so quit making excuses, I don't care.
I think you should care. You state you don't want the wagon on bv to be derailed
What pro-town motivation is there to derail a bv bandwagwon at this point?
yet you want farside to vote Pomegranate instead.
Then maybe you should be voting those people and not Richard. Like pomegranate.
I don't understand your logic. If I'm wrong, tell me WHY I'm wrong.
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Post Post #607 (isolation #74) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 7:56 am

Post by Seraphim »

boberz wrote:In fact I dont think BV is scum after that. He definately tried to not claim anything he wrote role
s
. He was considering it. I think he has never seen any roles and thought every protown role was a VT. How could he do that as scum???

Take a step back everyone.
I don't understand your logic.
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Post Post #609 (isolation #75) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 8:07 am

Post by Seraphim »

It's assumed, ABR, from your question and its partner that you want bv310 lynched.

I'd like to believe you're some sort of cosmic genius, playing twenty steps ahead of us, and that your master plan will somehow save all of us, but your insults detract from the points you are trying to make which I still don't fully understand.

Pretend I'm an idiotic retard. What the fuck are you trying to say?
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Post Post #612 (isolation #76) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 8:13 am

Post by Seraphim »

Yeah, I agree with Farside. boberz, you're scum with bv.
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Post Post #615 (isolation #77) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 8:17 am

Post by Seraphim »

boberz wrote:I am not guys. And if I was why on earth would I be pushing this quite so hard. I am not that much of a noob.
Because you think you have a legitimate argument and are trying to save your scumbuddy's ass?
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Post Post #619 (isolation #78) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 8:35 am

Post by Seraphim »

Pom, I think you missed the point of what boberz was trying to say.
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Post Post #626 (isolation #79) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 8:54 am

Post by Seraphim »

Albert B. Rampage wrote:
Seraphim wrote:I'd like to believe you're some sort of cosmic genius, playing twenty steps ahead of us, and that your master plan will somehow save all of us, but your insults detract from the points you are trying to make which I still don't fully understand.
Insults? bv is a G.
I'm not even going to bother with you anymore. We can lynch you after we lynch your buddies.
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Post Post #632 (isolation #80) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:11 am

Post by Seraphim »

RichardGHP wrote:ckd doesn't care about being funny.
If you have time to make smartass remarks, then you have time to post some content. GET TO IT.
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Post Post #642 (isolation #81) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:33 am

Post by Seraphim »

bob's 640 looks like IIoA to me.

thanks for clarifying your alignment, scum.
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Post Post #645 (isolation #82) » Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:37 am

Post by Seraphim »

boberz wrote:I analyse every single post and you accuse me of IIoA???
I don't see any conclusion. I don't see any real content, either. You're just commenting on the posts.

I hate PBPAs, BTW.
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Post Post #682 (isolation #83) » Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:15 am

Post by Seraphim »

I can definitely see a case on Nick and would not be sorry if he were to be lynched. Same with Espeonage.

bv310 needs to be lynched.

Richard needs to post content.

Welcome to the game, Amished!

Other than that, there is really nothing that I feel is worth saying except that some people need to come out of their hideyholes and post, dammit.
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Post Post #696 (isolation #84) » Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:27 am

Post by Seraphim »

Allow me clarify: when I labeled boberz's PBPA, I called it IIoA or "information instead of analysis" because I felt it was a term that covered what I was trying to convey.

bob's post is useless or IIoA or whatever not because it doesn't contain analysis(which technically, I guess it does) but because the post itself is useless without cross-checking Richard's actual posts with the PBPA. Sure, he does analyze the posts but it doesn't change anyone's mind on Richard...he has brought nothing new to the table precisely because PBPAs are bulky and difficult by nature. He doesn't link or quote posts, simply talks about them.

I am reminded of the play of a player named Lynch who would write walls upon walls of text that talked and talked and talked. He was scum. Pro-town is concise and PBPAs are anything but.

Perhaps I'm throwing around the term 'IIoA'. But I feel that boberz's post is useless regardless even if it isn't strict IIoA.
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Post Post #705 (isolation #85) » Sun Apr 04, 2010 7:48 am

Post by Seraphim »

boberz wrote:Ok so Seraphim has announced that the post he said was information instead of analysis had little info and had some analysis. Yet he still thinks it fits into the category. I am expected to answer this?
boberz, your post was unhelpful. IIoA was the label I applied to it even though it wasn't technically IIoA because IIoA is the sort of post PBPAs tend to be.

I still find the post scummy because it is not useful like PBPAs tend to be.
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Post Post #706 (isolation #86) » Sun Apr 04, 2010 7:53 am

Post by Seraphim »

Also, Amished, while I appreciate the fact that you have already participated more than your predecessor, if you're going to attack me and call me scum and call a wagon, I would like to know why.
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Post Post #710 (isolation #87) » Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:52 am

Post by Seraphim »

@Amished

Do you think boberz is town? Why?
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Post Post #713 (isolation #88) » Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:59 am

Post by Seraphim »

Alright. Show me an example of a PBPA that was helpful to town.
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Post Post #715 (isolation #89) » Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:22 am

Post by Seraphim »

But I only have to point at one of the thousands of games to show that PBPA are not scummy.
This is your exact wording. Yet you are not able to give me an example. Do you know why?

PBPAs are an excellent way for scum to "contribute". It's a lot of text but it's still style over substance. Not all of a player's posts are scummy or contribute to him being scum...it's a culmination, it's a big picture thing, a number of posts that form a picture. A PBPA does not give this.

Think of a game of Connect-the-Dots. If you connect the right dots in the right order, they make a picture, pointing out scum. A PBPA is like coloring in the space between the dots. Reading in iso is great and can help form a case on scum. But the rest of the town can't see what you are seeing unless you point it out and formulate it in a way that everyone else can understand!

That's why I called it IIoA...it's information about his posts...but it's not
helpful
, you don't prove a point because you've colored in all the dots and all that's left is a mess. You don't formulate
why
you think he's scum.

That's why I don't like PBPAs.

As for anti-town vs. scummy...anti-town is actions against the town. Anti-town by definition is going to not always be scum...town perform "scumtells" too. Self-voting is anti-town but town still do it. I think it's important to look at the context of the anti-town action to determine whether or not it's scummy.
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Post Post #733 (isolation #90) » Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:41 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Aw fuck not a wall of text.
What differentiates a scum pbpa from a town pbpa? Why are all pbpa's scummy?
There is no difference. They are all scummy because it is completely unhelpful to town while still appearing as "content".

"You're talking but you're not saying anything!"

Alright, first things first. I'm going to try and avoid this becoming a wall of text. Amished, you seem to enjoy twisting my words. Your case seems convoluted and forced and relies on faulty assumptions.

I'm not going to refute ALL of your points(because that would be stupid), just the crucial ones, so let's start with the conclusion.
Amished wrote:Sera is scum because he pushed hard on somebody he truly didn't believe was scum (Richard) and flip-flopped on bv for absolutely no reason other than he doesn't want his partner bv lynched. He also doesn't believe in boberz being scum.
The first part is important. It's the beginning of the game and someone does something completely ridiculous and stupid. Well, I want to find out why. So I vote them and pressure them. I never "pushed hard" for his lynch. In fact, I stated that I didn't want him lynched.

And I flip-flopped on bv. Well, sorta. I wanted to expand my horizons, so to speak, check out the other cases. And in the end...nothing came of it. Well, where's my vote? It's still on BV. I'm still
pushing for his lynch
. I still want him lynched, BTW. I'm still the second vote on the wagon.

You say I'm looking for reasons not to lynch bv310, but if that were true, wouldn't I be pushing any number of other juicy wagons, like the Richard wagon, or the Nick wagon, or the Espeonage wagon, or the boberz wagon, or the Porochaz wagon, or the dybeck wagon? They can't ALL be scum, after all, there's bound to be town SOMEWHERE in the there, right?

From my viewpoint, seems like you're the one trying to save bv's bacon.
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Post Post #734 (isolation #91) » Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:48 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Also, I forgot this, but I don't understand the last point of your conclusion at all. I don't "believe in boberz being scum"? Huh?

I'm calling it: Amished-Pom-bv310-boberz scumteam. That is all. I'll cover some more of the individual points tomorrow so that I don't dominate the page.
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Post Post #749 (isolation #92) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 3:16 am

Post by Seraphim »

Alright, I'm afraid this is going to be a long post so bear with me.
Amished wrote:Does anyone else see the dichotomy here? Sera doesn't want Richard lynched, but does want more votes on him (???) and Richard said he was pulling a gambit which Sera says scum are more likely to do (so why doesn't Sera want Richard lynched again?)
I didn't want Richard lynched because it was page 10(IIRC), two or three days into Day 1. At this point, I thought there was a high likelyhood of him being scum but I wasn't going to push on him being scum.
Amished wrote:Ooooookaaaaay, Richard does deserve to be lynched.
How do you get this from the post quoted above it?

About my FoS post: I was sick and tired of the players who were using their votes to hunt lurkers when there were other players to vote and discuss. I'm not saying lurking is a good thing but focusing on inactive players is the mod's job especially on Day 1. We need to hunt scum and we're not going to be able to hunt scum among the players who haven't posted yet. We are uncapable of hunting what doesn't exist.

And yes, I confuse anti-town and scummy. I will try to be more succinct in the future.

Amished, do you think it's possible for players to go after more than one player at a time? You apparently don't think so as when I try to multitask, I get attacked.
He's {bv} absolute scum, Sera's head and gut are in agreement, but he's likely to be town.....
Read the original quote again. Nice misrep, BTW. I said he was MORE LIKELY. Not LIKELY. I said MORE LIKELY. Big difference does that modifier make.
Yes, read that last line again. Attacking richard a lot is now a scumtell (apparently).
I never said it was a scumtell. But last I checked, getting onto a easy wagon was when pressured to tends to be done by scum more than town.
o if there's no difference between a scum PBPA and a town (admittedly anti-town) PBPA, how do you really justify a vote based on that?
I'm, ah, not voting boberz. There are other points to make against him as well...you seem to have completely missed where he tries to derail the bv lynch because he made a "townslip".
I ISO'd you pretty hard and you didn't even talk about boberz until the pbpa thing. It's because of this that I feel that you don't really think that boberz is scum since you can't differentiate between town and scum pbpa's and you're now going after somebody regardless of their alignment over one isolated incident.
I have other reasons to attack boberz besides the PBPA, that's just the icing on the cake. Since you've ISO'd me, I suggest you ISO Boberz and you should find what pinged my scumdar originally.
As to Richard, (estimation here); I'd say most of your posts that were over one line were in relation to him for the longest time. I've documented your changes of heart over "he's doing scummy behavior, but he's a VI, but every time I've seen this behavior before it's been by scum" crap that you had throughout the day.
I've been keeping track of him. He's scummy, he's anti-town, he's whatever. He warrants suspicion. Just like Espeonage and Nick, and definitely like bv310, who is scum.

@Javert

I'm sorry that we disagree on theory, but I have never found PBPAs helpful and pro-town. The fact that boberz did one increases my suspicion on him for reasons I have already stated. He's scum because he tried to derail the bv310 wagon by saying he made a "townslip". The PBPA, as stated earlier, is
not the crux of my argument against him
but just an extension of it.

As to your second point...the longer a wagon exists and the more popularity it gains, the more likely that scum will jump on it. That's all I can really say.
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Post Post #755 (isolation #93) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 6:00 am

Post by Seraphim »

Alright, come on people, if you weren't voting for bv now, I think this would be a great time to do so.
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Post Post #757 (isolation #94) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 6:05 am

Post by Seraphim »

bv310 wrote:Hey guys, sorry for the lack of contributions.
Life's been hectic lately, with no likelihood of getting better.
I'm going to have to cut down my Mafia playing, so I'll be replacing out. Hopefully you guys will get someone who can be useful.
That game's not starting for
another week or so at least, which is when exams are over.
Yep, yep, whatever.
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Post Post #765 (isolation #95) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 8:14 am

Post by Seraphim »

Amished: I meant to say that there was a greater likelihood of him being town than I had originally accounted when I stated he was scum. I was
not
saying that I thought he was town like he you seem to be believe.

I don't think there's a contradiction there, the wagon posts. Both states are not mutually exclusive...Espeonage and Richard, some of the game's more anti-town/scummy players, and Anon to a degree, however, town is still in the majority of that wagon...I believe Papa Zito, farside, CKD, and myself to be town.
what motivation would boberz scum have in saying what he did if bv were his partner? Is he trying to protect a fake-claim with that? Something that no scum team ever sets up for day 1? I'm not buying it at all and that is the exact reason why I'm not voting for boberz. The more I think about it I'm getting less and less willing to vote for bv as well.
My argument was that boberz was trying to save his buddy, bv, from the gallows by citing a supposed "townslip". I don't see any deeper motivation than that...I think he made a newbscum mistake.
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Post Post #767 (isolation #96) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 8:23 am

Post by Seraphim »

boberz wrote:How much of a newbie do you think I am Sera. I accept I am a newbie, but the things you accuse me of are below even the most basic slips.
This is why I'm not voting you right now.
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Post Post #778 (isolation #97) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 11:13 am

Post by Seraphim »

I'd switch my vote to a Pom lynch.
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Post Post #780 (isolation #98) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:13 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Richard, what do you think of the Pom case? The bv case? something besides boberz?
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Post Post #810 (isolation #99) » Tue Apr 06, 2010 9:52 am

Post by Seraphim »

Given that deadline is in two days, I suggest all town players get on a bv310 lynch. Scum, you can vote whoever, I really don't give a fuck.
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Post Post #812 (isolation #100) » Tue Apr 06, 2010 10:06 am

Post by Seraphim »

Also, happy scumday, Zito Daddy.
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Post Post #817 (isolation #101) » Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:06 am

Post by Seraphim »

Hey, people voting Pom, we can lynch Pom tomorrow, bv lynch is today.
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Post Post #827 (isolation #102) » Tue Apr 06, 2010 12:56 pm

Post by Seraphim »

bv310, you are at L-1. Claim?
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Post Post #861 (isolation #103) » Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:34 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Javert, if you don't mind, I'm going to hold off answering your questions until tomorrow, tomorrow being the next gameday.

Anyone can hammer whenever.
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Post Post #863 (isolation #104) » Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:45 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Given the case on me, I find it very unlikely I will be NKed. Then again, I don't tend to think about being NKed, it's just in my nature. If I do get NKed, the answers to the questions Javert posed me do not matter. So, the questions are only relevant if I am alive tomorrow.
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Post Post #865 (isolation #105) » Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:09 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I'm sorry you feel that way, Amish.
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Post Post #867 (isolation #106) » Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:15 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Trust me, yes I am. I'm not looking forward to tomorrow, if I'm still alive. :roll:
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Post Post #889 (isolation #107) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:59 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I think I'm easily the most pro-town player in the lot. But first, I want to take a look at the voting record and look for bussage. I definitely agree that Pom looks like scum but I want to double-check some things before I do so.

Also, I think Papa Vito may have been holding onto his shots because of the theme...the Karma element of it. It's really vaguely described and there might be more to his role that suggested that shooting might be a bad thing.
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Post Post #890 (isolation #108) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:01 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Farside, do you think Jahudo is scum?
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Post Post #892 (isolation #109) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:12 pm

Post by Seraphim »

So, ABR, do you think boberz and Richard were bussing each other?
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Post Post #896 (isolation #110) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:18 pm

Post by Seraphim »

ABR, have you been reading the game? When Richard started posting content late in the day, he first started attacking Boberz and dissecting his PBPA. They got into a huge text wall fight...I don't see two scum doing that.

Pom is high on my scum list, but I want her to check in first.

Pom: why was hammering bv310 the best choice for the day?
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Post Post #898 (isolation #111) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:28 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Alright, Javert had some questions for me so I'm going to answer them.

1) In my experience, scum are less likely to commit their votes at the beginning of a wagon. As the wagon progresses, scum are more likely to jump onto a wagon. This reasoning might be completely wrong but this is how I feel.

2) There are a lot of players I would like to lynch right now, Richard among them. I find it easy to find town players in my play(and if you say this makes me more likely to be scum because I already know who the town is because I'm scum, heads will roll) but hunting scum is difficult for me. If I could kill off all the anti-town, VI characters, I would do so in a heartbeat.

It is also one thing to attack and create a case on a player and completely another to jump onto a wagon with little reasoning.
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Post Post #900 (isolation #112) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:29 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I seriously doubt no one will surprise hammer her on the first day of Day 2. Bleah. Alright, fine.

Vote: Pom
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Post Post #901 (isolation #113) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:31 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Also, Javert, we simul-posted. I answered your questions, I hope.
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Post Post #905 (isolation #114) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:59 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Javert: I would like to lynch Richard, not because I think he is scum currently, but because I feel his play is detrimental to the town. I also think he's town and a VI but that doesn't mean I don't want him lynched. I certainly hope he's not around for LYOL.

And we have a difference in opinion, and that's fine. I don't think it's a particularly good scumtell because town are so likely to do it too and, as you have pointed out, scum are just as likely to do the inverse. It's more like the icing on the cake.

Also, the point is mostly moot since bv flipped scum which is really cool.
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Post Post #908 (isolation #115) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:22 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Javert, I think you are misunderstanding me or I am not stating what I want to state in a manner that is easy to understand. Probably the former.

I think Richard is town but if I had a chance to kill him, I would. I'm not supporting his lynch. I don't think I would vote for him even if he was wagoned now. What I'm trying to say is that...gaaaah...how do I put this?

It involves how I play the game. I find town players and try to find scum though I don't always succeed in that regard. Richard is a VI, a player I personally will always have nagging doubt about. While I have a town read on him, it's a weak read. His actions are not pro-town but he's not scum. This is a terrible paradox for me.

Do you understand what I'm trying to say?
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Post Post #909 (isolation #116) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:23 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Esp: why do you agree with the lynch of Pom? Why is boberz town? Also, you never did your analysis of the major wagons of the last day. You have been away quite a bit and have not contributed a lot to the game.
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Post Post #913 (isolation #117) » Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:44 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I'm sorry Javert, it's just how I perceive the game.
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Post Post #954 (isolation #118) » Sun Apr 11, 2010 2:17 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Pom, claim now. Seriously. Beating around the bush doesn't help the town.

Actually, I agree with ABR. Probably even a claim won't help you, so you might as well claim vanilla like your partner and get it over with. Coming up with a fakeclaim won't help you. Nothing will help you.
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Post Post #957 (isolation #119) » Sun Apr 11, 2010 2:48 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Yeah, Pom is scum.
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Post Post #962 (isolation #120) » Sun Apr 11, 2010 3:08 pm

Post by Seraphim »

As far as I can tell, her weak and strong are the same ability.
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Post Post #982 (isolation #121) » Mon Apr 12, 2010 10:49 am

Post by Seraphim »

Pomegranate wrote:K, rechecked my Role PM.

Weak Mode:
-I die if the person I hide with is targeted with a kill.
-I die if I hide with scum. This therefore confirms farside, because I hid with her last night.
-I die if I'm targeted with a kill.
There seems to be absolutely no point to this role besides "confirming" town which is strangely convenient.

Not to mention Hider is a favorite scum fakeclaim.

Can someone lynch this lying scum?
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Post Post #988 (isolation #122) » Mon Apr 12, 2010 11:56 am

Post by Seraphim »

Jahudo wrote:
unvote


I want to hear her serious post, and I also think we should keep her alive at least another day. The confirms she gives us are valuable if she can later be killed, cleared as town or caught as scum. And there's likely a few ways to test her role.
Oh? How do you suggest testing her role?
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Post Post #990 (isolation #123) » Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Yeah, I don't buy the claim and want her lynched unless there's a definite way to prove her role.
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Post Post #1004 (isolation #124) » Mon Apr 12, 2010 3:43 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I want to remind people of a few things:

1. The theme of the game. Each role has a weak and a strong mode. We knew this already. But I also want people to take note of the name of the game, which is KARMA MAFIA. And Karma is a BITCH. There is no doubt some sort of penalty for using the strong version too often. Therefore, if we have Pom hide using strong mode, she endangers the town from what we know of the theme.

2. How often Hider is used as a scum claim. Hell, I've used it myself, in OGML's Bleach Mafia. It's almost as common as doctor, and probably would be as common if it wasn't such a rare role.

3. I'm still not sure what we stand to gain from not lynching her today.
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Post Post #1033 (isolation #125) » Tue Apr 13, 2010 3:02 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I see what you're talking about, CKD, but I still think that Pom is the better lynch today. I see no benefit to keeping her alive besides a shitton of WIFOM and no one has convinced me otherwise.
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Post Post #1047 (isolation #126) » Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:30 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I agree with Amished. seriously, folks, why aren't we lynching Pom? Why are we being dissuaded so quickly and so easily?
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Post Post #1091 (isolation #127) » Sat Apr 17, 2010 3:21 am

Post by Seraphim »

I'm back and still pushing for a Pom lynch with a vengeance. I was gone due to Knowledge Bowl state which was a two-day affair, but I'm back now and I feel like I'm reasonably caught up.
CKD wrote:I had a town read on you, but dont understand why you dont see a benefit to [keeping Pom alive].
There are benefits, certainly, but I think the benefits we get from lynching scum are much greater especially when it turns out that she is, in fact, scum and all we're left with is her "results" aka scum WIFOM.

I am not convinced of any of the current wagons, though I definitely don't like Nick's play and might be swung that way.

Also, Amished: you came in swinging yesterday, attacking me. Today, that's all but stopped. Why? Do you still think I'm scum? If not, who do you think is scum?
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Post Post #1101 (isolation #128) » Sat Apr 17, 2010 11:03 am

Post by Seraphim »

I have a question that I want everyone to answer: do you think Pom is lying about her claim? I don't want to hear "maybe"s or "let's wait a night"s, I want to hear what everyone's black and white opinion is.
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Post Post #1217 (isolation #129) » Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:42 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Sorry for not posting in a while, RL has been pretty freakin crazy.

My position has not changed. Pom is still scum and if I could hammer, I would. Prozac's attempts to disarm the Pom wagon are really strange and possibly scummy if she flips scum. He seems to throwing shit against the wall and hoping it sticks.

We can find other scums tomorrow after we lynch the scum in front of us.
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Post Post #1249 (isolation #130) » Sat Apr 24, 2010 1:10 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I am going to reread him but I think, based on my impressions yesterday, Nick is scum.

Vote: Nick
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Post Post #1253 (isolation #131) » Sat Apr 24, 2010 3:49 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Someone explain the Faraday wagon because I'm not seeing it.
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Post Post #1292 (isolation #132) » Mon Apr 26, 2010 9:38 am

Post by Seraphim »

Alright. A couple of things I've noticed about Nick's play:

1. An obsession with ABR
Nick wrote:And, in my opinion and my experience, player's like ABR aren't scum, they're just annoying. They'll probably be killed by a vig first night just so they don't accidentally pick off a useful townie because of a false read. Still, he shouldn't really be listened to because he's just screwing with people for fun.
First, he tries to discredit him and tell people to ignore him based on nothing besides being "annoying".
Nick wrote:I think both Richard and Albert are scummy. Albert is just dicking around, making inane posts, either he's scum or just doing it to be a douchebag.
Nick on ABR wrote:This is pretty...outta left field? I mean, there's Pom's weird claim and then there's...THIS. Just, wtf.

Nick wrote:
Vote: ABR


Really, people? I think last day's spectacle is enough reasoning
2. A bizarre attack
Nick wrote:Saying that farside looks town in one post and then voting for her in the next post is pretty....well, do I really need to explain this? Its self-explanatory.
No, it's not. It's not even based in reality as, mentioned earlier, it never happened.

3. Bizarre and unhelpful play
Nick wrote:
Ojanen wrote:Any comment on my post, Nick?
tl;dr
Um...lolwut

4. A WIFOM defense...several times
Nick wrote:I did give bv's vote the lead and all, and he did turn out to be mafia...soo..... Yeah.....If I was mafia, wouldn't I have waited until people actually jumped off the Richard bandwagon and bv was close to being lynched?

Nick wrote:Wouldn't I have hammered or at least voted for Pom if I was scum? And thne just say 'Oops she was so scummy and everyone else was doing it?'


5. a strange roleclaim out of nowhere
Nick wrote:I know I'm a villager
6. Setting up ABR's lynch while supporting a Pom lynch
Nick wrote:I definitely think here claim is fake, since when do hider's die when they hide? And the weak and strong are basically the exact same thing. I'm not sure if she is actually scum though, she could be a cop who doesn't want to reveal their actual role, since to me she doesn't act too scummy compared to other people.
Alright, this is incredibly wishy-washiness while still looking like he agrees with the town. So, the claim is definitely fake. But she's still town. So go ahead and lynch her, but I'm definitely not on the wagon so don't attack me if she comes up town kthxbai
ABR wrote:IMO, ABR is scum if Pom turns up town. He's all tunnel vision about lynching her, and he seems more scummy to me than Pom does.
Nice setup for tomorrow's lynch.

So, what I'm saying is this: Nick's play reeks, especially his opinion on Pom's claim. I can understand not suscribing to LAL but Nick is unable to put out good reasoning for why Pom would lie as town. Wouldn't a claim like cop or something keep her alive longer, rather than a common scum claim like hider? I think that Nick was trying to escape being on the wagon while still agreeing with the majority of the town.
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Post Post #1293 (isolation #133) » Mon Apr 26, 2010 9:39 am

Post by Seraphim »

That being said, I can see the Sando case but I think Nick is much more scum.
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Post Post #1299 (isolation #134) » Mon Apr 26, 2010 12:39 pm

Post by Seraphim »

None of those are conventional scumtells, but rather a summary of his play. A lot of it reeks, as stated earlier. Point 1, I don't know what to make of his obsession with ABR...yet.

Point 2, this is why a lot of people voted him earlier and I still don't know what to make of it. I'm almost willing to put it down as a newbie mistake if it wasn't coupled with point 3.

Point 3, I don't think it it pro-town in ANY way to simply ignore a case on you, especially when the player in question specifically asked your opinion on it.

Point 4, WIFOM is one thing, WIFOM defenses are scummy and invalid a large percentage of the time. "lulz, guis, if I wuz scum, would I do THIS?" Sometimes, it is valid. This is not one of those occasions.

Point 5, I missed the explainer there. Sorry.

Point 6 is what I find most scummy. He easily sets up for a told-ya-so and follows up on it.

I might be willing to put Nick off as newbtown but I want to hear what Nick has to say on the case.
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Post Post #1314 (isolation #135) » Tue Apr 27, 2010 12:02 am

Post by Seraphim »

I don't have time to post much else, but Javert, I have no idea who the fuck Andrew is. I'm trying to wrack my brains. I think it may be Richard but I have NO idea what I was thinking there.
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Post Post #1338 (isolation #136) » Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:21 am

Post by Seraphim »

been prodded.

Nothing has changed. I still want to hear from Nick before I change my vote.
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Post Post #1341 (isolation #137) » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:09 pm

Post by Seraphim »

NickF227 wrote:Prodded! I'm sorry, I've been so sick the past few days, I've been having trouble getting on.
I posted a case on you a few pages back. If you could read and comment on it, that would be great.
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Post Post #1371 (isolation #138) » Sat May 01, 2010 3:32 am

Post by Seraphim »

4 is WIFOM and if you're saying it isn't, you have no clue what you're talking about.

I already said 5 was invalid earlier.

1 may not be a legitimate scumtell but you seem to be tunneling almost exclusively on him.

2 isn't dumb...you tried to attack a player based on absolutely nothing. Same with 3, the dicking around is not helpful.

Nick, who else besides ABR is scum? Why?
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Post Post #1375 (isolation #139) » Sat May 01, 2010 12:51 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Unvote
Vote: Sando


I can go after Nick tomorrow.
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Post Post #1388 (isolation #140) » Sat May 01, 2010 3:00 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Esp: why does 1376 make you feel like hammering?
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Post Post #1431 (isolation #141) » Wed May 05, 2010 8:02 am

Post by Seraphim »

I think Espeonage, barring results forthcoming results from ABR, is the lynch today. It's been thrown around for a while but the way he was looking to jump onto the Sando bandwagon towards the end of the day, when it was fairly clear he was being lynched.
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Post Post #1437 (isolation #142) » Wed May 05, 2010 10:33 am

Post by Seraphim »

Fuck, I hate WIFOM which this is a steaming pile of.

I feel like ABR's play, if he's scum, just isn't good play for scum at all. Why would he bus his buddy so hard with a FAKE COP CLAIM and then say "well folks, I lied", shooting his credibility to hell and almost guaranteeing his lynch? It doesn't make any sense, unless that's the point...bleagh.

I want to see how this plays out....ABR, you have some explaining to do. What made you so sure of Sando being scum that you would fake a cop claim to get him lynched?
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Post Post #1440 (isolation #143) » Wed May 05, 2010 10:59 am

Post by Seraphim »

What would you have done if Sando had flipped town and cop?
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Post Post #1442 (isolation #144) » Wed May 05, 2010 11:03 am

Post by Seraphim »

ABR, do you have any strong scum reads today?
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Post Post #1444 (isolation #145) » Wed May 05, 2010 11:09 am

Post by Seraphim »

If a player other than yourself attempted what you yourself just attempted, what would your reaction be?
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Post Post #1447 (isolation #146) » Wed May 05, 2010 11:16 am

Post by Seraphim »

I'm thinking ABR is town at the moment. I'll let someone else interrogate.
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Post Post #1456 (isolation #147) » Wed May 05, 2010 11:50 am

Post by Seraphim »

ITT, ABR lives up to his namesake.
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Post Post #1464 (isolation #148) » Thu May 06, 2010 12:26 am

Post by Seraphim »

Vote: Espeonage


The question is, state the case against Sando in your own words. Own words.
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Post Post #1471 (isolation #149) » Thu May 06, 2010 9:48 am

Post by Seraphim »

Bullshit. Your logic is flawed.

First of all, Sando lynch was stagnating. His cop claim threw a monkey wrench into the lynch...Sando's lynch was no longer a foregone conclusion. ABR's cop claim defib'd the situation and got Sando lynched.

Second, admitting to lying was not his only remaining option. He was going to get attacked for his confession WAY harder than if he simply rode out a few more days. He can fake results as much as he wants because, if he was scum, he would know everyone's alignment, or at least who was scum or not.

Third, the idea of him doing this because his scummates told him to goes against everything I know about ABR.

I'll need to take a good hard look at dybeck now.
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Post Post #1482 (isolation #150) » Thu May 06, 2010 11:30 am

Post by Seraphim »

Hey, Nick, why the sudden 180 on ABR? I totally expected you to be hitting him hard today after the backtrack.
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Post Post #1493 (isolation #151) » Thu May 06, 2010 3:01 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Esp, he was fairly obviously joking.
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Post Post #1519 (isolation #152) » Mon May 10, 2010 9:37 am

Post by Seraphim »

Prodded. I don't know how much more there is to say.

Unvote
Vote: NickF227


I still support a Nick lynch, possibly more than an Espy lynch given Javert's new evidence.
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Post Post #1527 (isolation #153) » Mon May 10, 2010 11:12 am

Post by Seraphim »

That's right, shit, Nick was the counter wagon yesterday, I forgot.

Unvote
Vote: Espeonage
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Post Post #1539 (isolation #154) » Mon May 10, 2010 4:10 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I forgot it because I have had other things on my mind besides this game and my involvement has honestly been half-assed. This game has been moving at the speed of molasses and it seems like the town has not been moving in a worthwhile direction for a while now.

Hopefully some rereads on key wagons will change that.

I still think it's possible for Nick to be scum...it's entirely possible that Sando's vote was distancing/bussing rather than just a simple counter-wagon.

Espy...I need to reread Espy, I'm starting to wonder if he's town.

dybeck might be scum too...same with Amished.

I think I will reread all of them and post an analysis of their play once I am done testing, possibly even tomorrow depending on my time constraints. Try and get myself back in this game.
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Post Post #1545 (isolation #155) » Tue May 11, 2010 12:04 am

Post by Seraphim »

I'm hardly desperate, boberz. Also, I didn't push anyone's lynch because I want to make a reread first on the people listed above. ALL of them are not scum, obviously. I'm actually starting to think that Espeonage might be town, but that's what the ISO read is for.
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Post Post #1560 (isolation #156) » Tue May 11, 2010 9:13 am

Post by Seraphim »

Unvote


@CKD

I didn't unvote Espy immediately because my uncertainity was not enough at that particular moment in time to unvote him...also, I didn't realize he had so many votes.
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Post Post #1564 (isolation #157) » Tue May 11, 2010 12:04 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I guess I deserve it if I get lynched for being lazy. I can't really muster up a defense given that there really isn't a case on me so I guess I'll just point this out:

I was on the bv wagon basically all day yesterday. I had plenty of time to try and derail it but I stayed on it and defended it against multiple attempts to derail it. Why, as bv's partner, would I do that?
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Post Post #1590 (isolation #158) » Wed May 12, 2010 10:03 am

Post by Seraphim »

boberz...wrong game?
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Post Post #1607 (isolation #159) » Thu May 13, 2010 12:35 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I agree and apologize for my shitty play today. School has gotten brutal these last few weeks but I think I'm in the clear now that my testing is just about over.

State of the Game:

Unbelievably Town

farside22 - for fairly obvious reasons
Amished - I thought he was scum for a while but I think there was a point either today or yesterday where I suddenly realized he was town
ABR - duh
CKD - CKD sometimes makes me lynch but when I read him iso, I got a strong pro-town read from him.

Pretty Town

Ojanen - I have a fairly good pro-town read from her in iso.
Javert - I'm pretty sure Javert is town but there are some points in his iso where I just get weird vibes.
Jahudo - see Javert

Neutral

Faraday - Faraday just hasn't posted enough for me to get a good read on him.
NickF227 - I'm leaning town on him right now but I can't shake his play.

Pretty Scummy

Espeonage - Espeonage seems to keep flip-flopping in my mind. I put him down here because a lot of his play has been bad but it might just be newbtownishness.
boberz - I just don't like his play. He's about at the same as Nick except I just don't get the newbtown vibes I get from Nick

Scum

dybeck - Alright, I might have to post a full case but I think it should be pretty obvious at this point

Vote: dybeck
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Post Post #1609 (isolation #160) » Thu May 13, 2010 12:52 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I also noticed that you attempted to derail the bv310 wagon pretty actively.
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Post Post #1618 (isolation #161) » Fri May 14, 2010 12:05 am

Post by Seraphim »

Dude, I did put my vote down. And you think I'm bussing dybeck...?

WTF?

Javert, I'm 'deflated' because I've had RL issues including lots of testing and lots of homework leading up to aforementioned testing. I am done with testing. I am ready to game on again. Is there any specific point you would like me to address?
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Post Post #1625 (isolation #162) » Fri May 14, 2010 3:39 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Unvote
Vote: Faraday


Read him in iso.

Faraday seems unable to take a stance in the game and reminds me of the play of my scumbuddy in a newbie game who pretty much lurked through the entire damn thing without taking any sort of stance except bussing me. He seems to definitely be coasting the game and he's the only player who I don't have a read on.
Faraday wrote:Ugh I'm leaning towards BV being a VI more than scum at the moment. I think Richard's scummier, and more likely to be scum than Bv who (no offense) seems to play like this every game from a couple of his games I've read.
Faraday wrote:I think Espeonage is more likely to be scum than Sando at this venture.
If Faraday flips scum, this is pretty good evidence of Esp's innocence right here.

These next two quotes are days apart but I find them noteworthy because they both comment on the same window of posts. I'll explain why once you see the quotes.
Faraday wrote:Amished's case on Seraphim is quite good, and I can buy that. I found seraphime's early game behaviour noteworthy. Essentially his exaggerations reluctance on who to vote, it loooked fake at the time and I think it makes a lot of sense from Seraphim scum POV.
Faraday wrote:I don't see Sera as the most likeliest candidate for scum atm.

He's quite vehment and constant with his BV hate once he does jump on. I did think he was playing both sides of the fence with his 'I reaaaaaally wanna vote bv' early on in the game, but I'm not sure that's the type of thing he'd post if he was buddies with Bv, I know it's not something I'd ever do with a scumbuddy, that's for sure, so I think looking back it's more likely he did find them both genuinely scummy as opposed to making sure he could be seen to be suspicious of Bv.
I'm not sure what changed here. So I'd like an explanation. A lot of Amished's initial case on me revolves around the same window so I'm not sure what changed between then and now.
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Post Post #1638 (isolation #163) » Sun May 16, 2010 11:59 am

Post by Seraphim »

Jahudo, why is Espeonage scum? Convince me.
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Post Post #1641 (isolation #164) » Sun May 16, 2010 12:32 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Is that it or is there more?
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Post Post #1644 (isolation #165) » Sun May 16, 2010 1:14 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Esp, what are the stronger cases?

The fact that your lynch was derailed does not equate to you not being scum. Jahudo's case is fairly damning...I was thinking you might be VI but there are some major inconsistencies in your play. Not to mention you have yet to address any of the points against you.

Unvote
Vote: Espeonage


This time I'm putting him at L-2 purposefully. I want a claim.
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Post Post #1646 (isolation #166) » Sun May 16, 2010 2:03 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Also, Esp, what are the "stronger cases" out there? The case on me? Answer to the case posed upon you by Jahudo.
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Post Post #1647 (isolation #167) » Sun May 16, 2010 2:05 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Also, I don't think I buy the claim but that's just me.
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Post Post #1658 (isolation #168) » Mon May 17, 2010 12:50 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Javert wrote:Seraphim, why don't you “buy” Espeonage's claim?
A vanilla town claim was not what I reading from him at all. I thought he might have been VI doctor if anything. Usually vanilla town aren't cautious about how they wheel and deal, even if they're lurking it out. Esp's play has been very muted, similar to that of a power role/scum trying to avoid attention or at least not giving a shit. I don't get that vibe from Esp's play at all.
CKD wrote: Do you feel like you should claim now you are at -2? why or why not?
I'm willing to claim. L-2 to L-1 is general good claiming range unless there's a pressing reason to claim or not to claim. No one has asked for it.

Also, I have a question for Esp: what do you think about Amished?
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Post Post #1662 (isolation #169) » Mon May 17, 2010 1:02 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Amished wrote:@Sera: Do you have any previous experience with Espy?
No, I do not. It's my general idea of a town player. I might be more inclined to think he was town and more of a VI if he wasn't so damn cautious. Look at Nick and Richard. Richard was whiny, sure, and Nick is annoying, but they are obviously so. Esp is not doing this. I'm not just willing to write him off as a VI after extensive reading and Jahudo's case.
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Post Post #1666 (isolation #170) » Mon May 17, 2010 2:40 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Amished wrote:Have you thought that it could be a personality difference? Especially after ckd (and others, iirc) making a fuss about Richard's playstyle early on? (which Richard fulfilled this game)
I, in fact, looked over one of his past games.

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=13390

It's very enlightening. I urge everyone to take a look. Here, he seems much more forthright. Sure, it could just be the game in general and I tend to take meta with a grain of salt but the difference between that game and this one is somewhat disconcerting.
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Post Post #1668 (isolation #171) » Mon May 17, 2010 3:05 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Without quoting your role PM, what did the difference deal with?
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Post Post #1692 (isolation #172) » Tue May 18, 2010 2:55 pm

Post by Seraphim »

What exactly do you mean?
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Post Post #1695 (isolation #173) » Tue May 18, 2010 3:14 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I think Day 1 and this day to some extent were my strongest. It's not surprising, I tend to burn out easily and start coasting regardless of my alignment. This game has managed to keep my attention and I think my play has been pretty average this game comparatively to other games.
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Post Post #1702 (isolation #174) » Wed May 19, 2010 12:10 am

Post by Seraphim »

Javert: you raise some good points. I had forgotten BV's reaction to the role fishing incident which definitely strikes me as odd and not scummy.

However, I just don't see any other wagon forming today besides Esp's and my own and I do not exactly relish being lynched if there's an alternative. Certainly if deadline swings around and nothing is changing, I will self-vote and prevent a no lynch. But otherwise...well...

Javert: do you think I am a worthy alternative to the Espeonage lynch?
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Post Post #1737 (isolation #175) » Wed May 19, 2010 2:18 pm

Post by Seraphim »

farside22 wrote:Finally read Espy in iso and all I have to say is useless. This guy has done nothing but follow one bw after another with no actual view of his own in so far as who he believes is scum.
In short there will be a cold day in hell when I unvote this guy.
He's not scum hunting he's scum flying under the radar hoping to go unnoticed.
Farside, what exactly made you change your mind from this? I'm curious because two players I have good town reads have started this wagon up again.
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Post Post #1752 (isolation #176) » Thu May 20, 2010 9:58 am

Post by Seraphim »

Unvote
Vote: Faraday


Let's swing the wagon this way, please...
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Post Post #1755 (isolation #177) » Thu May 20, 2010 10:38 am

Post by Seraphim »

I wanted to know if there was another larger reason for Farside suddenly jumping from "cold day in hell when I unvote this guy" to starting the Faraday bandwagon. It must have been something I missed because I made a case on you earlier.

Basically, it's part self-preservation, part stronger read, part "blind faith", and part chickening out on lynching Espeonage.

I will admit that my Esp vote was almost completely based on self-preservation.
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Post Post #1757 (isolation #178) » Thu May 20, 2010 11:07 am

Post by Seraphim »

boberz.

and Espeonage, probably.
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Post Post #1764 (isolation #179) » Fri May 21, 2010 11:35 am

Post by Seraphim »

You can't have refuted my arguments to nothing because I haven't made a proper argument against you yet.

If I'm still alive tomorrow, we'll talk then.
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Post Post #1796 (isolation #180) » Mon May 24, 2010 9:05 am

Post by Seraphim »

I am a vanilla townie.
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Post Post #1798 (isolation #181) » Mon May 24, 2010 9:47 am

Post by Seraphim »

Go for it. Just don't come whining to me when I flip town.
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Post Post #1801 (isolation #182) » Mon May 24, 2010 10:16 am

Post by Seraphim »

The main reason I'm not making a case on boberz is this: I don't see the point. I was at L-3(now L-2) and frankly with less than a week to deadline, there wasn't a snowball's chance in hell of any case I make, however damning, will swing the wagon that way. Tomorrow, maybe, once we've lynched someone, but I don't want to make the effort if it's going to fall on deaf ears.
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Post Post #1821 (isolation #183) » Mon May 24, 2010 3:13 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I didn't go after it because I wasn't completely sure if he was making it up or not. I took some time to consider it which is why I didn't unvote immediately.

Also, the reason I am not pushing boberz is that I am fairly sure that Faraday is scum over boberz. I definitely have a stronger scum read on him than on boberz.

Looks like I'm getting strung up. Here's what you should look at tomorrow:

I am now almost 100% that Espeonage is town, so going after him will be a waste of time come tomorrow.

Look for scum in Faraday, dybeck, Nick, and boberz. Given that the scum aren't scrambling yet, I'm willing to bet that there's an experienced scum player left so I am fairly sure that Nick and boberz aren't scum together.

One of Faraday and dybeck is almost certainly scum.

I get the nasty feeling that nothing is going to be gained from my lynch...almost all the players I have a town read on are on it...so either I'm dead wrong or the scum are probably laughing right now.

Perhaps I haven't put 100% into this game and I have only myself to blame for that. But lynching me now is not going to win the game and it certainly isn't lynching scum. The Faraday wagon built up steam but then died abruptly. It's not too close to deadline to switch it up now but I feel my lynch is a forlorn conclusion.

If you have any final questions to ask me, ask them now because I won't be much more chance to answer them.
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Post Post #1822 (isolation #184) » Mon May 24, 2010 3:19 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I've considered the claim over numerous times, trying to figure out if he got the confirming bit from a VT PM or a scum PM. I did think he was scum at one point but sometime before the Faraday wagon took off, I definitely started to reconsider. I was ready to change my vote to Faraday or dybeck when it came around

If I've learned anything from this game, it's that honesty is not the best policy as ANY role of ANY alignment. If you don't fit preconceived notions of pro-town, you get lynched. I'll have to remember that when I play next...
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Post Post #1824 (isolation #185) » Mon May 24, 2010 3:25 pm

Post by Seraphim »

In what way?
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Post Post #1835 (isolation #186) » Tue May 25, 2010 9:09 am

Post by Seraphim »

How much longer do we have until deadline?
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Post Post #1837 (isolation #187) » Tue May 25, 2010 9:42 am

Post by Seraphim »

Alright, still time to try and swing this then. I'll give it my best shot once I finish writing my essay.
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Post Post #1844 (isolation #188) » Tue May 25, 2010 10:55 am

Post by Seraphim »

Farside: what precisely makes me a better lynch than Faraday today?
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Post Post #1846 (isolation #189) » Tue May 25, 2010 11:36 am

Post by Seraphim »

Alright.

When I followed up CKD's questioning with questions of my own and got the answer, I wanted to consider over some time. I never followed up because I was definitely still considering it. As Jahudo(I think) stated earlier, all PMs should have that last line on it so it should be immaterial and mean nothing. However, the blunt honesty and correct information in the PM also lent himself to a town credence.

I went back and read through Esp's posts because I was going to make DAMN sure before I moved my vote. In the current deadlock state in the game, I knew anyone moving their vote ANYWHERE was going to, more than likely, kill the wagon. By unvoting Esp, I was likely going to kill the Esp wagon at best, get myself lynched at worst. I was the only competing wagon at the time so if I unvoted, I was likely sealing my fate.

In this state of deadlock, I knew I, as a major suspect, had a doubtful chance of starting a wagon and having it stick. I knew this from personal experience...I attempt to wagon both Faraday and dybeck early in the day, to no avail. Which means, if my vote is going to count for something, it needed to be on a wagon with popular support on it or at least some chance of getting off the ground.

In other words, unless I was pretty damn sure Esp was not scum, I was going to vote him to keep my chances alive. That is what I meant by self-preservation. This is why I did not immediately unvote Espeonage. I'm still not 100% as to Esp's towniness but I am sure of Faraday being scum. This is why I jumped on the wagon.
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Post Post #1850 (isolation #190) » Tue May 25, 2010 11:57 am

Post by Seraphim »

Let's get this clear: I thought he was scum, coming off of Jahudo's case on him. After CKD and I questioned him, however, I had major doubts about whether or not he was scum, or rather, whether or not he was scummy enough to fabricate the part concerning confirmation.

I don't think he is scum now. I am fairly sure he is VI.

I posted a case on Faraday here: http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 78#2270178

I'm trying to find the scum but it's getting very difficult when I only get the shitty points of my play looked at at all. No one has commented on the case(I think) and boberz dismissed it by saying that I was quick to jump on the wagon.
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Post Post #1851 (isolation #191) » Tue May 25, 2010 12:08 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Here, is the topic back now?
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Post Post #1854 (isolation #192) » Tue May 25, 2010 12:18 pm

Post by Seraphim »

boberz 1625 wrote:It was interesting to see how quickly sera jumped on faraday.
Nothing more is said on the case by him. It seems to be he dismisses it not because my points are invalid or anything, but because "there are good points on Sera".

It's very frustrating.
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Post Post #1859 (isolation #193) » Tue May 25, 2010 4:02 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Oh well.

Adios.

Have fun finding the scum.
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Post Post #1864 (isolation #194) » Wed May 26, 2010 12:04 am

Post by Seraphim »

in b4 town flip

I am town, you know.
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Post Post #2405 (isolation #195) » Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:11 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Wow. GG scum.
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