Karma Mafia (Game Over!)

[Seraphim]

Unvote
Vote: Faraday

Read him in iso.

Faraday seems unable to take a stance in the game and reminds me of the play of my scumbuddy in a newbie game who pretty much lurked through the entire damn thing without taking any sort of stance except bussing me. He seems to definitely be coasting the game and he's the only player who I don't have a read on.

Ugh I'm leaning towards BV being a VI more than scum at the moment. I think Richard's scummier, and more likely to be scum than Bv who (no offense) seems to play like this every game from a couple of his games I've read.

I think Espeonage is more likely to be scum than Sando at this venture.

If Faraday flips scum, this is pretty good evidence of Esp's innocence right here.

These next two quotes are days apart but I find them noteworthy because they both comment on the same window of posts. I'll explain why once you see the quotes.

Amished's case on Seraphim is quite good, and I can buy that. I found seraphime's early game behaviour noteworthy. Essentially his exaggerations reluctance on who to vote, it loooked fake at the time and I think it makes a lot of sense from Seraphim scum POV.

I don't see Sera as the most likeliest candidate for scum atm.

He's quite vehment and constant with his BV hate once he does jump on. I did think he was playing both sides of the fence with his 'I reaaaaaally wanna vote bv' early on in the game, but I'm not sure that's the type of thing he'd post if he was buddies with Bv, I know it's not something I'd ever do with a scumbuddy, that's for sure, so I think looking back it's more likely he did find them both genuinely scummy as opposed to making sure he could be seen to be suspicious of Bv.

I'm not sure what changed here. So I'd like an explanation. A lot of Amished's initial case on me revolves around the same window so I'm not sure what changed between then and now.

[dybeck]

While I'm doing isos, I've just looked Espeonage up, and there's not really much of me that can see him as scum.

Sera, maybe. Tempted to give him a pass while he's on board the Faraday wagon, though...

[boberz]

Apparently I am scum bet the actual reasons seem very far and few between. The main one is my praise of Javert when he was attacking Amished, and this not looing good. Unfortuantly before I can answer this somebody is going to have to tell me why this wasnt good.

There are still soome good points on Sera.

A couple of people have been suggesting Sera's activity with BV cleares him. Tbh I dont see it. Admittedly it isnt scummy either but I am not really seeing it myself.

Of course I could be scum because I am "weird" and "feel off", Or I might be like Nick, who play cannot be shaken.

Aha, Farside thinks that Dybeck (one of the more suspected players) is right when he raises suspicion of me. Of course I explained in detail and debated this very point at the time. Explaining clearly I thought the claim was true. It would not serve my ends (if I were scum) to change my mind so vehemently in one post after one claim of vT.
After this half sentence accusing me he makes another two points why dybeck is scum. Silly silly post from Faraday I think. #1610

---

I kind of feel that people have been able to piece together the gut scum read I had on dybeck and I like that. I am not a fan of us moving of sera like this. I am by no means convinced by the idea that dybeck has beeen cleared.

It was interesting to see how quickly sera jumped on faraday.

[Patrick]

Votecount

Faraday (2) -- dybeck, Seraphim
Espeonage (4) -- Faraday, NickF227, Jahudo, farside22
Seraphim (4) -- boberz, Javert, Albert B. Rampage, Espeonage
dybeck (1) -- Amished

Not voting: Ojanen, curiouskarmadog
13 alive, 7 to lynch.

Deadline: 26th of May

[Albert B. Rampage]

Seraphim and bobberz are probably the last 2 scum.

[dybeck]

Seraphim and bobberz are probably the last 2 scum.

Is this the result of another cop investigation? Or are you a tracker now? Or the mod? Or Henry VIII?

Or is this another brainwave like your vendetta against Pom?

[boberz]

It is not a cop investigation that is for sure.

ABR sees mafia as more of a personal game I think, so he only reveals what he wants to when it suits him rather than when it suits town. Atleast that is what I have picked up over this game.

suprisingly enough boberz (one 'b') is not the last scum. NB I only wrote that so I could correct the spelling.

[Faraday]

These next two quotes are days apart but I find them noteworthy because they both comment on the same window of posts. I'll explain why once you see the quotes.

Amished's case on Seraphim is quite good, and I can buy that. I found seraphime's early game behaviour noteworthy. Essentially his exaggerations reluctance on who to vote, it loooked fake at the time and I think it makes a lot of sense from Seraphim scum POV.

I don't see Sera as the most likeliest candidate for scum atm.

He's quite vehment and constant with his BV hate once he does jump on. I did think he was playing both sides of the fence with his 'I reaaaaaally wanna vote bv' early on in the game, but I'm not sure that's the type of thing he'd post if he was buddies with Bv, I know it's not something I'd ever do with a scumbuddy, that's for sure, so I think looking back it's more likely he did find them both genuinely scummy as opposed to making sure he could be seen to be suspicious of Bv.

I'm not sure what changed here. So I'd like an explanation. A lot of Amished's initial case on me revolves around the same window so I'm not sure what changed between then and now.

I changed my mind, basically. Having gone back and read them I don't think they're more likely to come from Sera scum than town, as I think you as scum would be more careful about being so ...well obvious about your obvious reluctance to the wagon.

I know my activity's been rather meh, but I've posted as much as I could for the most part, I've had exams which have sucked the life out of me.

[Faraday]

Town/Prob town
1) Amished (replacing My Milked Eek)
2) farside22
4) boberz (replacing Snow_Bunny)
15) Javert (replacing Bio Hazard)
18) Faraday
6) Seraphim
20) Albert B. Rampage

Leaning town:
Ojanen
CKD although this is mostly meta based, I feel he's playing differently than I've seen him as scum in the past.

Neutralish:
3) Jahudo

Scummyish
5) dybeck
14) NickF227

Scum:
Espeonage

[Faraday]

Just realised that there is a massive flaw in my logic regarding my reasoning for voting Albert.

What was the flaw that you just realised now, that you'd overlooked before?

[Faraday]

ugh v/la next 2 days. hopefully no more. shit just came up. sorry. :/

[curiouskarmadog]

ok, back for my drinking weekend..skimmed slightly...will update tomorrow.

also, if you are town, no town lists..if you make one, keep me off of it, lets paint a target on my back shall we.

[Jahudo]

Soooo, do you like any of the current wagons CKD?
What parts of the Espy wagon is bad to you?
Maybe there's a point or two you missed.

[Seraphim]

Jahudo, why is Espeonage scum? Convince me.

[Amished]

Oh whatever, ckd. You'd rant at anybody so you're not a threat.

@OJ (I think): After actually getting a reasonable explanation for the two night kill; I abandoned my thought that there was an SK out there. From there, I could use connective tells as a reliable source of finding scum since all evidence points to only one scumteam anyways. Also, if you read my case; what I felt to be my strongest point against dybeck is a solo tell (inside information). Power roles (especially after getting scum d1) would be stupid to give scum any type of power if it works the way that dybeck said it probably would. We'd be one up on them and can then just work on getting more scum without having to rely on desperate measures of giving a scummer any more power than they have.

More detailed post later when I'm not ninja'ing internet from a neighbor.

[Jahudo]

Espy backtracked on why he voted Anon during day 1. Here's the vote, then the reasoning, and later in the day he switched the reasoning to this.

He also made MME look good here for MME's post here, even though half of that post (about Richard being an easy target for scum) had previously been the opinion of Anon here. The scummy thing about this is Espy generalized both posts, saying Anon's was terrible and MME's was full of win. But half of MME's was in Anons.

[Seraphim]

Is that it or is there more?

[Jahudo]

His BV vote doesn't mean much to me. It was a hop with no specific reasons, and he lurked on it most of the day without adding anything.

If Espy subscribes to the theory that an L-2 vote is scummy, then why did it take him ~8 days and Sando being put to L-1 for him to bring it up? It looks fake.

So I don't think he was scumhunting the scum we've already caught, and hasn't done much besides hop on other wagons so far. Plus Seraphim is a bad lynch, which I've already brought up. Maybe I could switch for a boberz-lynch, but nobody else right now.

[Espeonage]

There are stronger cases out there. If you guys really thought I was scum for those points early in the game that you brought up I would be dead by now. Go on one of the wagons with a better case or find someone that you can make a better case against. I don't equal a good lynch.

[Seraphim]

Esp, what are the stronger cases?

The fact that your lynch was derailed does not equate to you not being scum. Jahudo's case is fairly damning...I was thinking you might be VI but there are some major inconsistencies in your play. Not to mention you have yet to address any of the points against you.

Unvote
Vote: Espeonage

This time I'm putting him at L-2 purposefully. I want a claim.

[Espeonage]

VT

[Seraphim]

Also, Esp, what are the "stronger cases" out there? The case on me? Answer to the case posed upon you by Jahudo.

[Seraphim]

Also, I don't think I buy the claim but that's just me.

[Espeonage]

1. I consider my vote and unvote on Anon to have been good reasoning.
2. There was one point in MME's post that was a good bit.
3. I saw no reason to stop voting for bv. Turned out a was right to keep my vote there.
4. There was a case on Sando already. I looked for something I could add. You're bringing up stuff I did day 1. Am I not allowed to bring up stuff from a few days ago?
5. Why do I need to scumhunt when the other members of the town get in before I can and already have the cases built on people I too think of as scummy. Why should I have to make a completely new case when there is a case on the person I want to vote for. I have tried to add stuff to the wagons I have joined. Point 4 is me doing exactly that.

I don't see how my case is holding water tbh.

[dybeck]

unvote, vote: Seraphim

.

Today, to you, seems to be all about survival. There's no real case on Espeonage, and you've forced a claim from someone without actually addressing the points against you.

It was one thing having you buddy up to me on the Faraday wagon (which is still the play, by the way), but now you just seem to be desperate for any lynch that is not your own (which likely means Espeonage).

Earlier on this page you didn't seem at all convinced that Espeonage was scum, yet you had a multi-paragraph case against Faraday.