Open 228 - Mafia in KyleVille - Game Over!

[PaltryExcuse]

Hey Kyle. Just an idea, but a mass prod may be in order to tell everyone the forum's back and the game has started.

In other news:
I don't believe in karma.
VOTE: Karma

[PaltryExcuse]

We're watching you, Emp -_-

We? Is this a hydra and I know one of you (or you know me)?
The only person I can remember who used the smiley there was Tororingu-chan from my first game on MafiaScum. But I'm probably wrong... meh.

VOTE: PaltryExcuse

What about now?

It's only karmic retribution if I've done something morally wrong. Like vote a member of town. Do you know something I don't?

[PaltryExcuse]

@Oopid: Vote-hopping is generally more of a town-tell for me in most circumstances, but obviously there are exceptions; so it wasn't for that. However, it looked to be the best "tell" to try to draw out any scum seeing a nice early wagon and pushing for a claim. Obviously that didn't happen, but them's the breaks. I was also seeing if you would do anything stupid as both of us are notoriously bad at reading newbies, so if you firm up our read one way or another that's also beneficial.

Just curious, but how is that a town tell versus just a null as I was thinking. (A.k.a. his posts read as inexperienced with MafiaScum... not indicative of role.)

So what I'm getting here is that everybody was all like, LOLVOTE HIM LOLVOTE HER LOLVOTE EVERYONE!!!!
Seriously, can we get out of RVS and start playing? Like seriously.

UNVOTE: Whoever I was voting.
VOTE: Merkabah

There. This should work.

These contradict each other slightly. It seems you are tired of people random voting but then you vote sans reason?

VOTE: Robocopter87

---

@Mod: Muthaa is voting for me, I believe.

[PaltryExcuse]

@Robo: What's a good reason to vote someone at this stage and if you've seen it why haven't you voted for it? Would you describe yourself as a player who is normally aggressive early on?

@Muthaa: I have no idea what you're trying to get at with Oopidstay.

@Merkabah: Izzat a serious vote? I mean, have you caught scum along those lines before?

[PaltryExcuse]

@PE: Yes, it's a serious vote. I (Amished) rely on linquistics a fair amount; but it's not the only reason that I'm voting for Robo.

Look at his posts: First one can draw out PR's when in this setup it's much more beneficial to keep them hidden (as the only protective role would make the other PR absolutely useless. Second is fluff. Third is bitching about RVS without doing anything (and fluff). Fourth was "lolreactions" vote on us after being called out on not doing anything to advance out of the RVS. Fifth was "reasoning" (still not advancing the game). Sixth is explaining why his lolreactions is stupid (still not advancing the game) and seventh doesn't feel townie (overly defensive).

So, you tell me who's been more active and less helpful to the game than he is.

Mod: Empking needs a prod, been 3 days now

As I've been caught recently as scum on linguistics... (wonder when that was?)... I can believe it. The reasoning below that is definitely why my vote is already on him, plus a little meta-ing in his newbie games shows me that town-Robo would have a semi-case on someone right now.

In other news, gut also says Muthaa at this point, as his attacks on Oopidstay read as 'this person might be an easy lynch'.

[PaltryExcuse]

@PE: So.. why haven't you pushed for more votes on Robo if you feel that strongly?

I voted him. And the meta thing is me pushing for votes.

[PaltryExcuse]

I have never played with Robocopter87, so it's just the bit of reading I did. And in the games he started in, he mainly only has town games (there is the one scum game). However, in the one scum game he seemed to joke with RayFrost in my eyes for awhile, similar to the continuing lolbuzzword thing he's doing now.
Match this with scumhunting by post 2 of his in one game, post 4 in another, by post 4 in another... it just doesn't say town to me.

That's why I probably should've waited until he responded to the aggressive question I asked earlier. His town play is aggressive and he is scumhunting early on. I haven't seen it in this one.

[PaltryExcuse]

@Muthaa: "srs bsns" is serious business. Basically, you're holding onto your vote pretty tightly and everyone would like to know why.

As for your stance on "just throwing votes", having a vote on someone makes you take a stance. Not voting anyone (except in certain circumstances) does the town little good. My take on it, at any rate. Anyone else agree with me?

Having a vote on someone makes it so the town knows where your suspicion most lies. However, that last question is a little bit rallying and raises some concern.

@Robocopter97: Your main problem with the meta part of the case on you is that I haven't played any of those games with you. I have to ask then: why do you have a link to them in your sig? Am I inaccurately representing you here? It's hard to believe I am considering how you normally are so gung-ho to get scumhunting started.

@Oopidstay: Empking came back. As your vote was on him earlier, do you think the post suffices the time away? Secondly, you're leading a charge against Muthaa. Is that enough to vote him over Hershey / Empking who are lurking? I'm getting the impression by your posts you suspect Muthaa to some degree but I wonder why your vote is not on him instead.

@Kthxbye & Hershey Kiss: Post moar.

@Mod: Please prod these two. Preferably with something like a cattle prod.

[PaltryExcuse]

@Robo: WHY is my meta evidence null? Or why is the case against you (detailed by Merkabah) invalid?
Let's see if I get your Empking case: He voted for you weakly, and lurked a bit. Okay. Problem is, I'd expect that of bussing partner. It doesn't sway my opinion in the slightest, and I actually feel that Emp is a likely partner to you in this mess.
On you, a player appeals to the rest to start the game and persists with joking behaviour, and then just complains and insults at the town is not someone who I'd describe as 'pro-town'. More like lost scum. The fact that you are normally an early scumhunter and had to be attacked in order to scumhunt compounds the issue at hand.
I'm with Merk. Claim and lynch please and thanks.
Give me a #2 scum other than Empking, Robo.

@Karma:

@Merk: I like adding pressure. If anyone quickhammers him they can face my fiery wrath tomorrow.

This bothers me as I feel like you

know

you'll be alive tomorrow. I feel like the comment wards people from the Robo-wagon more than it encourages the lynch of someone you claim to believe is scum.

[PaltryExcuse]

On the Doc-Congratulating: I've played one game, IIRC, where the doc kill was 'celebrated'... a tell akin to the doc congratulating one. The person who commented on that was lynched in LYLO and scum (me) won. It's the only time I've ever seen it, and it led to a town loss. Many experienced MS players know of the tell, and it is a new player tell. Not a scum one.

On HK: Oopid brings up a good point, but I really feel it is hard to get anything on HK's alignment at this point. He posts infrequently and in small doses. The days inbetween each post could easily amount to him changing his opinion, or not giving town all of his thoughts. Pro-town? No. He needs to get in here and post more.

Personally, I'm more concerned with Karma. His-doesn't-want-the-day-to-end-yet-I'm-gonna-put-them-near-lynch seems counter intuitive. I figured it was maybe a scum buddy wagon hop, but it is scummy to me.

@Karma:

:@Merk: I like adding pressure. If anyone quickhammers him they can face my fiery wrath tomorrow.

This bothers me as I feel like you know you'll be alive tomorrow. I feel like the comment wards people from the Robo-wagon more than it encourages the lynch of someone you claim to believe is scum.

This still rings true for me.
Karma is experienced (read: alt) and has attacked for three things: RVS votehopping, putting pressure on Robo, and now a doc congratulation vote. 2 of which aren't scummy IMO, and the second was hopping on a case built by others.
His argument of semantics (definitions) is just a masking play.

VOTE: Karma

[PaltryExcuse]

What I mean by masking it is that it looks like you have something to hide. You're masking productive play with semantic-talk and null tells.

[PaltryExcuse]

@MOD: I'm gonna be V/LA until Monday.

[PaltryExcuse]

On Empking: There's no way your play is pro-town right now. Instead of scumhunting you challenged Merk to prove they were. For better or worse, Merk was the heaviest on the Robo-lynch, one you just supported. If it's anyone who needs to do a little investigating it is you. What exactly is suspicious about Merk's behaviour? Right now I don't see it and you're coming out worse in my eyes.

Either way,

@MOD: Please send a prod in the direction of Karma, he hasn't posted since I was V/LA. I suggest using a heavy boot or shoe. Maybe cleats.

Hershey Kiss, you need to provide some sort of reasoning in your posts because I don't see that either.

What does everyone think of Karma's disappearance? Relevant? I think so as I'd say he's getting some flak from yours truly now. Karma says an insane amount of null-talking and just dances around the obvious. I'm having trouble not seeing scum from there.

@Everyone: I'll try to post as much as possible, but I am currently fixing up the basement after it flooded a bit.

[PaltryExcuse]

Hey, I'm back. Basement flooding sucks.

I'm still hundreds of times more confident with a Karma lynch than any other. His most recent post, in which he votes for a wagon with no explanation, hint of Karma's suspicion of Empking before... I feel like Karma has run his course.

@Hershey Kiss: What do you think of the case on Karma / Karma in general?

@Empking: His comment on you made you look scummy because it was accurate. I think Merk showed that they weren't doing what they thought was scummy. In other words, (as the previous sentence is confusing and I can't find a way to re-word it) I don't see hypocritical play in the slightest.

[PaltryExcuse]

1. Nobody debated the acuracy but its ireelevance to finding scum (y'know the fact that nobody could answer it satifactory.)
2. If Merkabh's answer was acceptable to Merkabh he wouldn't have stalled and tried not to answer it.
3. Again nobody said it was hypocritical. I saidf it was scummy.

I am so confused as to what you are trying to say then. If Merk couldn't answer his own question, his reasoning for thinking you were scummy would be somewhat out the window. I don't feel he stalled, but that is more personal opinion than anything else. Hypocrisy is something I have found scum having done previously, but is not excruciating reliable.

@Empking: What do you think of Karma at this point in time? His opportunistic vote on you? Also, are there any previous behaviours of Merk that you find scummy or is it that singular comment?

@ Paltry: Is Empking an acceptable lynch for you?

Empking is number three lynch for me at this point. I don't understand his case on Merk in the slightest... and his scumhunting consists solely of catching Merk on something I don't understand. Karma has been more inherently scummy though in my eyes. However, the vote by Karma makes me think he may be a town lynch accelerated by scum.

To pre-empt the question: Number 2 would probably be Hershey Kiss. It's hard to put into words, but the start to this day of both jumping on Muthaa so quickly seems off. HK seems lost and hasn't really provided any explanation for any of his thoughts. This 'lostness(?)' has translated from the null read I had earlier to a scummier one.

BTW Karma, if you're still around, please claim.

@Mod: Prod Karma. I know I just came back, but we have two replacements incoming, one absentee... Any progress on the replacement front? More than a July 12th extension? Both would be awesome-sauce.

[PaltryExcuse]

Merk? Could I have some reassurance that a lynch will happen today? Anyone else who isn't voting Karma?

@Empking: What do you think of Karma at this point in time? His opportunistic vote on you? Also, are there any previous behaviours of Merk that you find scummy or is it that singular comment?

^^
Answers please. What exactly am I looking for in Merkabah?

[PaltryExcuse]

I disagree about Emp. I have played with him before, have seen him multiple times are scum (as mod and as player), and this is not his scumplay.

His actions aren't pro-town. I'd like links to compare with his scum game please. I just finished a game with Empking (I replaced in after his death) and Empking was immensely pro-town D1 and got NK'd N1. That is not this game in the slightest (even in terms of activity).

For a partner, I'm looking at Muthaa / Mykonian. Why? The way Empking goes after Merk/VP is ridiculous. I still don't understand it, and his reasoning is lacking in my eyes. Oopid is a strong town read from Day 1.

The problem with Muthaa stems from the lack of kill night 1. The JK was successful, one way or another, and it looks like he targetted Muthaa. However, the 'congratulating the doc tell' is a crappy one and one I will never subscribe to. Muthaa hasn't played an aggressive game in the slightest, but still comes across as very new.

Mykonian replaced in for someone who was constantly away until they got replaced. With a null read, as in NOTHING to actually read, everything remains to be seen.

I think Empking should be the next lynch.

About the massclaim: why aren't we NLing and then claiming to give tracker another chance? Mafia has a 1/4 possibility of hitting him and that little bit of extra info may well be worth it. If we aren't NLing, massclaiming is obvious.

@Oopid: Who is #2 scum?

[PaltryExcuse]

If someone can give me a decent reason to not NL, I'm all ears. Until that point:

VOTE: No Lynch

[PaltryExcuse]

Oh! Crap. I didn't realize this was back on. Will post later today.

[PaltryExcuse]

VOTE: No Lynch

Theory has been discussed, I give my full support.

[PaltryExcuse]

V/LA until Monday.

[PaltryExcuse]

VOTE: Oopidstay

No longer camping FTW.

[PaltryExcuse]

Ya, I wish I had participated more in this game than I did. I'm blaming my basement flooding whole-heartedly (insurance companies suck). It's more fulfilling when you work for the scum win than just watch town implode.

Anyways, thanks to Mykonian for replacing in and being a partner I never really had to that point. Also, thanks to the mod for the game. No need to re-iterate what everyone else has said about prodding.

@Robocopter: Going for your lynch was less a matter of trying to get rid of someone who called both me and kthxbye out, and more going for a lynch I believe I could get. You really weren't playing to your meta, and your play during early day 1 was scummy. But I will admit I was immensly scared for a couple secs you were going to build a case on me (the only one of the two scum whom were active).

Thanks for the compliments everyone. Hopefully I'll play with you all in a more active game sometime soon.