Open 276- Friends and Enemies Mafia (OVER)

[Albert B. Rampage]

Unvote

Don't out your partner Hoopla what is wrong with you???

[Albert B. Rampage]

Just kidding.

Vote Hoopla

Hammer please

[Hoopla]

Well, as much as I wanted to keep the last mason alive until end-game, it is a worse result for the town to be lynched today. I'm going to have continued suspicion until I manage to prove myself as a mason, so here is the post I was holding back;

Because you are the one under pressure now. It doesn't make sense for Fate to "claim" scum at this juncture just to lynch you.

It certainly was a foolish play either way when you think of the possible best/worse case scenarios for him - I think what happened was he was all-set on driving home a Hoopla lynch, he didn't think too much about the consequences when he saw I claimed mason. Now he's scrambling to get it done, by trying to get as much information out of me as possible (ie; my partner), which I was hopeful of trying to save, because a mason in late-game would be super useful.

So be it.

My mason partner is Andrew

, we all left a matching breadcrumb in our fifth post;

But there are more people in this thread than you and I.

Stop

it. You're voting for me too. Don't try and be on my side if you're going to indulge in Nacho's silly fantasy.

look

, its newbie 1016 = =

Listen

, I'm actually largely in agreement with the sentiment towards Andrius, but I don't feel it's healthy to just have zero pressure on the remainder of the game. I'd feel pretty disappointed in retrospect if I let e.g. NS slip through today without doing anything ever. Having said that, Andrius wasn't doing much and is now lurking too, my patience is expiring and eventually I'll just kill whoever. I'm going to leave my vote on Andrius in light of what Danny just said; I didn't know NS was like this regardless of alignment, though I'm not inclined to let him off the hook on that basis. UNVOTE: Nobody Special, VOTE: Andrius

...

<snip>

Stop/Look/Listen.

Prior to the game, we were devising possible breadcrumb ideas, and I came up with this because it is easy to diguise and still very recognisable - the idea for this set of three came when googling "famous trios", with Stop/Look/Listen appearing on this page, which was the first hit. This should be enough to confirm me as a mason, even more so when Andrew confirms this too.

[Hoopla]

Unvotes are welcome when you're ready.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Unvote, vote Fate

Who did Elmo suspect?

[Albert B. Rampage]

I am a mason, and Hoopla is not in my qt.

Hammer at will.

Actually, this seems like some type of shit that I would do 3 years ago. Are you fakeclaiming Fate?

[LimMePls]

@Hoopla: That seems like a pretty sterling breadcrumb, but if you all discussed it prior to the game, then why did you not do it in your first posts, why the "5th" ones? It's a massively vague enough breadcrumb that it's not like anyone would have noticed that. Also, why would scum-Fate counter claim here? Is losing another scum worth taking out another mason? Why?

[LimMePls]

Unvote

pending answers to 606.

[Hoopla]

I'll get to that all in a minute ABR, but this is how we're going to play today (and tomorrow):

Myself and Andrew and confirmed town, Fate is confirmed scum. But we are not lynching Fate today. By lynching Fate today, we are wasting our advantage of having two confirmed innocents to direct traffic. Think about it this way; if we lynch Fate today, myself or Andrew will die tonight, and we still have the exact same amount of possible suspects, just with one less confirmed townie. It makes far more sense to try and lynch Fate's buddy today, and then cash in the Fate-scum lynch tomorrow or the next day.

I think the town will have better odds of finding (and successfully wagoning) the third scum today than tomorrow or the next day.

[LimMePls]

^^The "Fate is confirmed scum but we're not lynching him today" makes me very nervous that Hoopla doesn't want Fate to flip Mason.

[LimMePls]

If Fate can't produce a partner that is willing to claim as his mason buddy, then I might agree with that plan. But if Fate produces a mason buddy, we lynch Hoopla, and if Hoopla flips town we lynch the last two obv-scum.

[Hoopla]

@Hoopla: That seems like a pretty sterling breadcrumb, but if you all discussed it prior to the game, then why did you not do it in your first posts, why the "5th" ones? It's a massively vague enough breadcrumb that it's not like anyone would have noticed that. Also, why would scum-Fate counter claim here? Is losing another scum worth taking out another mason? Why?

Because clever scum should be trying to catch potential breadcrumbs - you can never be too sure. It's a reasonable assumption that the most scrutinised posts are going to be the first one or two in the day, so choosing the 5th was a way of spreading our posts out enough (I got my crumb out on Page 2, while Elmo was 5 pages later).

I don't know why Fate-scum would counterclaim me here - he obviously thought it was a worthwhile play in some way. Maybe he thought if he let me be confirmed, the lynch would come back around to him anyway? Maybe he thought getting myself outed AND my partner was worth it (with the possibility of getting me lynched instead of him) - you'll have to ask him at the end of the game what his real motivations were. Either way, he is confirmed scum until he provides a mason partner willing to back him up.

[Hoopla]

^^The "Fate is confirmed scum but we're not lynching him today" makes me very nervous that Hoopla doesn't want Fate to flip Mason.

That's because you didn't read the post properly. The only difference between trying to find the third scum tomorrow rather than today, is one less confirmed innocent alive to keep the silly townies like you in check.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Hoopla why did you defend Empking so hard as if he was your mason partner?

[LimMePls]

@Hoopla: You really expect me to believe that the scum would have noticed that the first word from you three is Stop/Look/Listen and that somehow that magically meant you were the masons together? That is preposterous. Also, you sidestep the issue that your "lets not lynch Fate today" is an attempt to keep us from seeing a Fate flip. Your response is completely lackluster.

[LimMePls]

I'd like to add that insulting me will get you absolutely nowhere.

[Nobody Special]

Hoopla why did you defend Empking so hard as if he was your mason partner?

She never said Empking was her partner. That was Elmo.

I'm not so sure about Hoopla really being a mason. I can't explain the nifty breadcrumb, though.

[Albert B. Rampage]

LynchMePls, it's clear to me that their breadcrumb is optimizing covertness. If Andrew confirms what Hoopla said, they are the masons. There isn't the shadow of a doubt of it.

Hoopla why did you defend Empking so hard as if he was your mason partner?

She never said Empking was her partner. That was Elmo.

Maybe it's getting late and you didn't read my question properly.

[Nobody Special]

Oops. Missed the "as if." Yeah, I should get to bed.

[Albert B. Rampage]

So you don't believe Hoopla, NS?

[Hoopla]

Hoopla why did you defend Empking so hard as if he was your mason partner?

Well ABR, in the QT I've been extremely ticked off with how the VT's have been playing, especially Day 1. There were literally no VT's that stood out as trying to soak up the nightkill with supreme scumhunting or activity - it gave the masons very little space to hide. We really needed to play one level lower, or three levels higher to avoid the kill. Our game plan centered on surviving, because we knew how powerful 2 or 3 masons on Day 3/4 could be, that even if we hadn't lynched scum yet, we could still have a really good shot at locking the game down with process of elimination.

At the start of Day 2, I was actually leaning town on Empking, and my defense on him was a calculated play to either prevent him being lynched and get

my way

with who I wanted to be lynched, or if he flips scum, being the sole dissenter would secure my survival to Day 3, which was very important. Basically I thought this play would ensure I wasn't NK'ed, because I was capable of being seen as scummy (and being seen as a potential mislynch for scum) no matter what happened.

[Hoopla]

@Hoopla: You really expect me to believe that the scum would have noticed that the first word from you three is Stop/Look/Listen and that somehow that magically meant you were the masons together? That is preposterous. Also, you sidestep the issue that your "lets not lynch Fate today" is an attempt to keep us from seeing a Fate flip. Your response is completely lackluster.

Dude, unless Fate drops a mason partner that confirms he is a mason with him, or Andrew doesn't confirm being my partner, I am proven as a mason, and Fate is proven as scum (barring a outside chance of this being a reckless, pigheaded town gambit).

The fact you're trying to spin this as scummy is so ridiculous, when I'm almost certainly proven town now.

[Nobody Special]

So you don't believe Hoopla, NS?

Well, as with everything, it's not exactly black and white. I mean, her play so far has been terrible. Looking through a Mason-Hoopla lens, it could almost be justified. Looking through a Scum-Hoopla lens, though, it could have the best of intentions that unfortunately went awry.

Before I really settle on specifically how I feel about Hoopla now, I'd really like to hear from Fate.

But I'm leaning toward Scum-Hoopla. For now.

[Hoopla]

What the fuck? How can you guys not get this? If Andrew confirms that we are indeed masons together, then that means we're the remaining town masons. This is an OPEN set-up, there are no tricks, no escapes, and no grey area. The only way I could

possibly

be scum is if Fate also gets a buddy that confirms he is a mason with him - but he won't be able to do this, as a 2 vs. 2 situation is an autolose for whoever the scum is of those pairs.

This is like the most basic and fundamental pieces of logic you're ever going to get in a game of mafia.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Yeah but you were so scummy that we're having a difficult time just accepting that you're not scum lol