Open 295 -- Island Paradise Mafia -- Game Over

[DeathRowKitty]

Gosh, I could be scum lurking right now and no one would even notice me! (prod-dodge and promise to maybe theoretically post tonight possibly)

[cjdrum]

Wait. This whole farside/havingfitz thing... What?

After the last post by each of them, I have to believe havingfitz.

No one

keeps a calm and level head at that stage... Unless they were constantly Previewing and checking how scummy they sounded with their outburst!

No. If farside was more angry, or confused, or something... Currently, it's as if she's got it all under her control. Like she's driving this, and it's all going to plan. havingfitz is, IMHO, just another person who's gotten one or two of their posts torn apart by someone who's going down anyway, so has to make a mess of it all.

vote: farside22

PEdit: Also, ftr, I don't like "And now fitz has gone to ranting scum".

1. You turned away from your argument, like it didn't matter.
2. In doing this, you make us look at his post in a worse light than it really is in.
3. He's not ranting, he's been picked at and picked at and picked at until he couldn't take it any more - not ranting scum, just sick and tired [alignment*].

* Not figured out yet, but less likely to be scum after all that.

[farside22]

1. You turned away from your argument, like it didn't matter.
2. In doing this, you make us look at his post in a worse light than it really is in.
3. He's not ranting, he's been picked at and picked at and picked at until he couldn't take it any more - not ranting scum, just sick and tired [alignment*].

1. No, I explain things over and over even in my last post.
2. I'm using his quotes and asking questions. So you agree with his view on Jora and his vote and reasoning?
3. No he shut down because he has no out that = scum.

I even rationalized why his vote and reasoning for voting Jora is opportunistic and he flipped out but to the same song and dance. That is not rational or town reaction. That is scum that got put on the grill and burned.

[ToastyToast]

I also listed other various reason I find you scum in my last post. And yes when I ask someone twice for

other

reason's they find a person scummy and I get nothing but the same garbage over and over I will accuse that player of not reading and skimming the game.

Other various reasons? You mean "'not reading" [misrep] and "fluff" [opinion...misrep].

For continuing to push a non existent case and misrepping my actions...which are there for all to see.
VOTE: farside22
Don't ask me for more reasons becuase the ones mentioned above are all I have atm.

If fluff is an opinion, how can it be a misrep?
Farside made her case, so I can argue that "non-existent case"=a misrep too
I also don't like the last line. You don't have anymore reasons for a vote other than farsides accusation for you.
Pushing a case that no one else is on is not scummy. TBH, you are an active player but I haven't clearly understood your reasons for votes. In your defense, I can tell that you are reading.

@cjdrum: Why exactly is keeping things under control scummy?

[cjdrum]

@cjdrum: Why exactly is keeping things under control scummy?

Keeping the topic of the thread to one specific thing

,

making havingfitz look really bad by drawing on him so much

, and

kind of... herding the argument so that it's always exactly what she wants (or feels comfortable) to talk about - which'd be the less scummy things

. This is:

• [*]Looking like you're actively participating in every discussion, while really not
[*]Drawing attention away from oneself by being so obvious about doing it - so much so that it looks like scumhunting, rather than drawing attention away from themself.
[/*]
[*]Always making sure that they don't run out of non-scummy things to say. Simple as that.
[/*]

And if you mean my "calm and level head" comment... Town are more likely to slip up and make mistakes - scum are constantly previewing and checking that they're not being reckless and outrageous. With such a dismissive post (#224), it feels like farside is trying to herd the argument so as not to outburst; trying to move away from a topic that's likely to be slipped up in.

[farside22]

cjdrum: I have my town reads. The only people I have no read or a vague feeling of less then stellar are Strat and Bv310. Also I'm still keeping my eye on Yabba. Many people so far have made post that I don't see anything scummy about.
Do you find something said by anyone that is worth mentioning?
Also the looking like you actively participating has got to be a joke....I mean really fitz and I have been arguing for over a page now with no one else saying much of anything.
What point has fitz made that you feel I ignored?

[Jora]

@ cjdrum At psesent moment I have the equal reads on farside22 and havingfitz. May be they are not perfect, but I recommend you to unvote. Also, Imo being consistent and calm is not always means being scum. You wrote "Drawing attention away from oneself", is this really so? If she had stopped earlier, then no one would have voted for her.

Btw, I don't understand people who think that eventually startransmission will come and post something different. The only possibility to get something from him is to push him.

[cjdrum]

Yep. I see what you mean - neither have actually been more scummy than the other. I've looked back, and there's been a moment or two, but they kind of balance each other out.

unvote: farside22

And waiting for scummy.

[startransmission]

I'm here, will post soon. Very sorry about my inactivity.

[farside22]

Vig Kill: startransmission

[yabbaguy]

[post later]

Procrastinated on a project- have to complete that first.

[farside22]

Active lurking note:
Yabba is posting in MishMash and another game but continues to post little to nothing here.
Same with Bv and Strat minus playing MM. Strat is not as active in MS as Yabba or BV

FOS: Yabba and BV

mod: Prod BV with a big stick

[yabbaguy]

I care more about Optimize than a sluggish game on D1.

Again, [post later]. I've only broken one of those posting promises ever.

[Nobody Special]

Prodding bv310 with a big stick.

Votecount in a moment.

[Nobody Special]

Votecount 1.08

startransmission - 2 - DeathRowKitty, }|{opa
havingfitz - 1 - farside22
farside22 - 1 - havingfitz
Sundy - 1 - startransmission

Not Voting: Sundy, bv310, yabbaguy, ToastyToast, cjdrum

With ten alive, it takes six to lynch.

Deadline: April 15.

V/LA: cjdrum, April 13-18; Sundy, through Monday, April 4

[cjdrum]

So... Farside

doesn't

have a DayKill?

[havingfitz]

1. You turned away from your argument, like it didn't matter.
2. In doing this, you make us look at his post in a worse light than it really is in.
3. He's not ranting, he's been picked at and picked at and picked at until he couldn't take it any more - not ranting scum, just sick and tired [alignment*].

1. No, I explain things over and over even in my last post.
2. I'm using his quotes and asking questions. So you agree with his view on Jora and his vote and reasoning?
3. No he shut down because he has no out that = scum.

I even rationalized why his vote and reasoning for voting Jora is opportunistic and he flipped out but to the same song and dance. That is not rational or town reaction. That is scum that got put on the grill and burned.

1. As do I. You keep making blatant misrepresentations of my actions. Then I explain why they are blatent misrepresentations...and you continue to make blatant misrepresentations of my actions. Then I explain why they are blatent misrepresentations...and you continue to make blatant misrepresentations of my actions. Then I explain why they are blatent misrepresentations...and you continue to make blatant misrepresentations of my actions.
2. Gold star for you. The fact you are quoting me (without comprehending what I've said or coupled with your misrepresentations) means nothing.
3. I haven't shut down. I'm just tired of you not getting it. We're both voting each other (you for your crap reasons and me for your crap reasoning) so great.


And how did I flip out? Was it the

READ!

comment? That wasn't flipping out. That was urging you to actually read what I am writing since continued repitition of the same points seems to be evading you. Scum getting burnt on the grill....whatever.

WTF is ~everyone else?

[yabbaguy]

@farside & havingfitz: bullet point case on each other, please, you've both lost me. Also havingfitz, your --->maddening<---- use of

EMPHASIS

is

totally unnecessary.

And now fitz has gone to ranting scum. Just when I was starting to think I was wrong in my initial read.
There is stubborn and then there is ranting for no reason which is exactly how fitz last post reads.
You again made no point in your post. Rambling, pissy comments that don't all fit together.

'splainy?

painting my vote as hypocritcal and opportunistic (which you have not responded to my question of) is bumping you up into contention on my suspect list.

Is she doing this on purpose, or do you think she's misguided? There's a very gigundo difference between the two, and I don't buy this.

Call it pot-kettle-black all you want, but I'm still of the belief that scum are in the mega-lurkers. 'Cause there is no pot-kettle-black, that's the tu quoque fallacy. Trouble is, I don't know which lurker 'cause they haven't done anything actively scummy. ._.

[havingfitz]

@farside & havingfitz: bullet point case on each other, please, you've both lost me. Also havingfitz, your --->maddening<---- use of

EMPHASIS

is

totally unnecessary.

Ummm...I will not stop bolding words or comments when I want to

emphasize

them...and I do not think I have overdone the use of bold font in this game.

Bullet points....sure, 1)

tl:dr;

@farside...you have asked for the reason/s why I voted }|{opa. I have provided my reasons for my vote and IMO I have provided more reason for my }|{opa vote (combined with subsequent post-vote suspicions) then most of the other people with votes out. I'm not convinced }|{opa is scum by any means and I'm on the fence as some of his posts give me a town feel. However, I do not like not having my vote in play and until someone passes him I will keep it where it is. That said...your continued disdain of my vote (for whatever reason) and painting my vote as hypocritcal and opportunistic (which you have not responded to my question of) is bumping you up into contention on my suspect list. I.e.

FoS farside.

And...
2) my ISO 21
and...
3)my ISO 22.

Is she doing this on purpose, or do you think she's misguided? There's a very gigundo difference between the two, and I don't buy this.

Call it pot-kettle-black all you want, but I'm still of the belief that scum are in the mega-lurkers. 'Cause there is no pot-kettle-black, that's the tu quoque fallacy. Trouble is, I don't know which lurker 'cause they haven't done anything actively scummy. ._.

On purpose....looking back on my games with her I find other instances of her carrying on silly arguments like this...but not to this extent. I'm giving her intellect the benefit of the doubt when I say I think she is doing it on purpose because I have made my points very clear. I therefore have to assume she is either town trying to fock with me to get some sort of reaction or she is scum legitimately trying to push a mislynch and/or distract the rest of the players/lurkers from contributing to any worthwhile scumhunting. Either way fmpov I'd like to see her go atm. As for there being scum amongst the lurkers...I think that's pretty much a given. is how many?

[farside22]

Fitz: What question did I miss?

Yabba:Here are my points

At the time of Fitz's vote he placed the vote on Jora: Reasons here
I called the vote weak, opportunist and hypocritical.

After some more talks I retract the hypocritical talk realized it was inacurate.

The vote is weak because the reason's fitz had for DRK were stronger then Jora's vote.
Opportunistic because of the BW forming.
I pointed out the reason's why I found fitz vote weak (the leading the cop) and why Jora's vote on DRK wasn't scummy.
The why vote for a theory over someone floating by.
Fitz reaction and still calling my case scummy is in my view scum caught with no way out.

I don't have time for all the links to each of these points. I thought for a moment my read on fitz was wrong as he was communicating back and arguing his points but when someone ignores the views of another player and still calling them scum and ranting I feel it's caught scum who has no way out.

[Nobody Special]

bv310 has 12 hours and 7 minutes to post before I replace him.

[havingfitz]

Fitz: What question did I miss?

...at the time of the

tl:dr

quote above....you hadn't responded to my question about opportunistic votes. You eventually got around to touching on it.

At the time of Fitz's vote he placed the vote on Jora: Reasons here
I called the vote weak, opportunist and hypocritical.

You did not mention "weak" when you placed your vote on me but that is hardly an indictment of anyone that places an early D1 vote and only has 2 reasons for doing so. And one of the reasons for my vote I would still maintain was not "weak"...at least not for a 1st vote (by me) out of RVS.

After some more talks I retract the hypocritical talk realized it was inacurate.

I didn't realize you had come to your senses regarding your hypocrisy accusation. Bravo to you. My bad.

Since the basis of your opportunistic vote accusation was the fact that my vote was hypocritical...shouldn't that undermine your continued stance that the vote was opportunistic?

1) The vote is weak because the reason's fitz had for DRK were stronger then Jora's vote.
2) Opportunistic because of the BW forming.
3) I pointed out the reason's why I found fitz vote weak (the leading the cop) and why Jora's vote on DRK wasn't scummy.
4) The why vote for a theory over someone floating by.
5) Fitz reaction and still calling my case scummy is in my view scum caught with no way out.

1- I did not think my thoughts re: DRK outweighed my suspicions of }|{opa. I have explained this. Apparently this is a difference in opinion. Why do you think the points I brought up regarding DRK are stronger than the ones I brought up (actually I think TT brought it up) re: }|{opa?
2- Opinion. I disagree. Also...you were basing opportunitic on hypocritical. One point is gone now...why not the other?
3- I would agree that the suspicion for potentially leading an investigation is minor....it was not the reason I placed my vote...it only contributed to it. What does }|{opa's vote on DRK have to do with any of this?
4- I do not understand what you are talking about here. Voting for theory instead of

for someone floating by?

5- Do you know how I usually react to false and inaccurate accusations? Hmm? And you admit the hypocritical part was wrong...and it formed both the basis for your vote on me and for the continued reaction I gave.

I thought for a moment my read on fitz was wrong as he was communicating back and arguing his points but when someone ignores the views of another player and still calling them scum and ranting I feel it's caught scum who has no way out.

I haven't ignored anything. I see your views and do not agree with them because i know they are wrong. Are you saying you would feel better about me if I agreed with your views???? The views that support your "theory" that I am scummy? That makes a lot of sense (not).

[bv310]

I don't know why I agreed to replace in to a game at the start of my exams, but I've caught up now. Catch-up incoming once I format it and such.

[startransmission]

I'm thought I asked you, but in case i didn't, did you have any scum suspects? I note your votes is on Sunday. Any reason it's on Sunday? What is your view on Jora?

My vote on Sundy was random. My thoughts on Jora I touched on in my last post. I'm not leaning town now as much as I was then, but my sentiment mostly remains the same.

Do I have scum suspect(s)? Mmm. If I did I would probably be a lot more involved in the game. But then, if I were more involved in the game I might have one. I suppose one has something to do with the other.

@startransmission. Where did you found "invisible text"?
"I have been lurking..." yes, "hard for me" not my problem - be good or replace out, "policy lynches" So what with policy lynches? Where did you saw one?
"Puzzled by this" - and thats all what you got?

By invisible text I meant the tiny text. I regret the error.
It being hard for me to get involved in this game is my problem, not yours. I agree. It's not a matter of me being good, when inspired I usually am, it's a matter of actually getting inspired. If I felt that doing that was impossible, I would replace out.
By policy lynches I meant focusing on lurkers. Which I should've worded better. And I was wrong anyways,

The actives aren't really being that scummy, to be honest. There are lurkers abound (no Jora, I'm not one) and I'm starting to think there could be something to find from those who are saying little-to-nothing.

^I kinda agree. I'm one of those lurkers, and pressuring me and other lurkers is justified.

I've read and reread this thread. I'm going to continue to read it until I find something to pursue. I don't know how much analyzing the quick wagon on Jora is going to yield, but I'll look at it again anyways. I also need to form an opinion on the farside/HF debate, and that'll likely come first. Whether I offer the game any service before the day is done remains to be seen, but my posting will go from non existent to consistent.

If he dies after first stab it means he was a Jewish lurker.

Hilarious.

[farside22]

1- I did not think my thoughts re: DRK outweighed my suspicions of }|{opa. I have explained this. Apparently this is a difference in opinion. Why do you think the points I brought up regarding DRK are stronger than the ones I brought up (actually I think TT brought it up) re: }|{opa?
2- Opinion. I disagree. Also...you were basing opportunitic on hypocritical. One point is gone now...why not the other?
3- I would agree that the suspicion for potentially leading an investigation is minor....it was not the reason I placed my vote...it only contributed to it. What does }|{opa's vote on DRK have to do with any of this?
4- I do not understand what you are talking about here. Voting for theory instead of for someone floating by?
5- Do you know how I usually react to false and inaccurate accusations? Hmm? And you admit the hypocritical part was wrong...and it formed both the basis for your vote on me and for the continued reaction I gave.

1. I just didn't see it that way. DRK in you view may have been minor, but there were many various minor reasons. Jora had 2 points. (1) minor and the other you are saying was scummy above all else
2. I don't see how this is an opinion. Opportunist is jumping on a bw with weak reasoning in my view
3. You stated that Jora's not voting for DRK for the his theory was scummy. And yes it's theory because unless Jora is scum with DRK and calling him the GF trying to lead the cop to an investigation on DRK is theory. I saw no reason for Jora to vote DRK for a theory? Why do you?
4. see 3
5. I recall a bit of our last game. I would have to really go back and reread that game to recall how you reacted because it's been a bit and my mind can't remember every game. I do remember some of your actions........

For the final comment.
Your reason for you vote was thus:

For continuing to push a non existent case and misrepping my actions...which are there for all to see.

VOTE: farside22

Don't ask me for more reasons becuase the ones mentioned above are all I have atm.

I've shown why I believe everything I stated. You called my case non existent and misrep, but I explained my reasoning and your still calling me scum, which doesn't make sense to me.
No I don't say you need to agree with me but calling me scum for those reason's is inaccurate in my view.