[REVIEW] Open Setup Reviews

[hitogoroshi]

Mos Eisely:

I'm out the door very soon and can't do the numbers, but it seems altogether too likely that dayplay or a PR will get the goon killed D1/D2, leaving the GF in a

very

unsatisfying 4:1 (or 5:1 if a Jailkeep is what found the goon.) no nightkill endgame. (I know balance is our chief goal, but I think we need to seriously consider fun as well.) Maybe I'm just being paranoid, but that seems like a problem.

True Love:

I'd especially like players who have played lovers games without talking to your lover to weigh in. The fact that some players have to deliberately advocate their own suicide to get their lover lynched, and are doing so without the benefit of the QT, just seems like it would be not-fun to play. This isn't a balance criticism (and adding lovertalk might swing it towards town heavily - QTs are a good way to scumhunt), but a scummy-ish lover partner makes it hard to figure out exactly how to play to your wincon, and I think lacking that privileged information makes it hard.

I also think we only need 1-2 C9 variants, and I'm not sure My Name is Earl would be one I pick, but we can save that discussion until we've looked at all the small opens.

Those are the only issues I can find with the small ones you picked.

[hitogoroshi]

While we're approving small setups, I'd like to forward my own Scumhunter's Speed 8p. I can make a wiki page if we're alright with approving it.

As for the rest on the list:

• 3 of 5: Waaaaaay too swingy based on starting conditions. Cop/Doc/VT and RB/VT/Miller are possible distributions from the same game? Yeah no. Bin it.
  
• Baby Too Much Scum: Too dependent on night-kills. It's basically a game decided by the Serial Killer. Bin it.
  
• Double Cop: I'm not gonna comment on this. I just don't like the concept, but I haven't looked into whether or not it's balanced. Just consider my vote an "abstaining" here.
  
• Even/Odd C9: I say don't bother with Alternating 9p already approved. Nothing is terribly WRONG with it per se, but I just don't think it's worth keeping.
  
• My Name is Earl: I've had a bit of a change of heart. I think we should hold on to this. It's a good Open setup to "skin" (I think theming Open setups is just fine as long as you put themed PMs in the first post with non-themed.)
  
• No Lynching Town: I like it.
  
• Pie E7: Balancing high-power against high-power in a small game basically puts the whole game on the back of the first lynch, and unless you're in a speed game (or a theme with a d1 conversation started) the first lynch is often fairly arbitrary. Bin it.
  
• SCIENCE: So basically a 2:5 with daytalking scum and daytalking masons. I think it can probably stay.
  
• Trendy and Subversive: I like it. I don't know what the balance difference is between the three versions (this is a no-running-the-numbers carpet bombing review session) but if it's not balanced I think it's one to tweak. Remember my complaint back up in the Pie E7 review? This is how you fix that issue.
  
• Twin Trap: I love "guilties are definitive, innos are not" as a design principle. I agree with Hoopla it could stand to be bigger. If it's balanced with just 2 townies added, I'm all for adding that tweaked setup.
  
• Two of Four: Oh lordy lou a town RB with cop and doc just seems like a recipe for HEADACHES. For both factions. I think it should be binned just on the "not-fun" principle. IF someone else thinks it's fun and is/can be balanced, we can talk about it.
  
• Vengeful 7p: Sure, let's keep it.

[hitogoroshi]

Twin trap seems horrid. I'm not sure 3 VT, 1 watcher, 1 tracker, 2 goons is town sided. Making the PRs only catch one of the two scum turns it into a joke. Maybe as a 9 player. MAYBE.

Remember, innos from one PR become definitive when one scum dies. And named PRs become essentially on-demand confirmed (unless scum force 50/50). It's a pretty well balanced setup imo (as a 9p).

While we're approving small setups, I'd like to forward my own Scumhunter's Speed 8p. I can make a wiki page if we're alright with approving it.

I like it, with the exception of the Lynch All Lurkers rule built in. I think that's not a particularly wise idea - I'd hate for a game to decided/influenced by a scum lurking. It also unfairly incriminates someone who goes on V/LA. The game is 8p - it isn't going to go that long. Using a mechanic to try and speed the town up probably isn't required in such a small game. If anything, such a rule is probably not fostering a perfect scumhunting environment, as most "speed" games tend to be reckless and swift, and occasionally devoid of thought.

Fair enough, I can take the LaL bit out. I'll go ahead and make a wiki page.

[hitogoroshi]

Wiki page is done for Scumhunter's Speed 8p.

[hitogoroshi]

Remember, designing and balancing setups Open setups goes here. I think we're mostly looking at current setups until the backlog is looked at. (That being said, if a setup has two or more nominations in the Open setup thread, feel free to send me a PM and I can talk about it/post it here if it's up to snuff. But I want setups that have already been through some vetting.)

Hoopla, are there any setups I'm supposed to be looking at? I'm afraid I kind of lost where we're at in the thread here.

[hitogoroshi]

I know Rusty Guillotine got some questions raised about its mechanic - it'd be nice to have hito come in and talk about that setup.

Some people think it's balanced in favor of scum. I disagree (it's one of those opens where each role is also basically an on-demand innocent child), but I do think that it isn't fun and it should probably be binned. Delayed flips are one of those things that can be balanced but can't really be made entertaining. And it only REALLY works when people on guillotine are really working to influence the game, which is a bit optimistic of a goal.