Open 420: Medical Mafia - That's all, folks!

[Mortontfrh]

Didn't make sense to hide that information? How so? Town shouldn't care whether or not I was withholding information or not considering they had no reason to do anything other than claim their night action out right. Scum on the other hand could only benefit from having more information when deciding what they should claim.

[Venmar]

Okay. Both me and FuDuzn targeted Morton. Here's a couple of scenarios that could have happened. Morton, your reason for stalling is weak, but i can understand it was to make sure you don't claim. and screw yourself over since you targeted a now dead person. I would like to know what was your motivation behind a Jackal protect, i think he was agreed by the majority to be town, and wasn't really deemed to be too important to be protected. Were you hoping to kill him? In which case you did? I am sceptical of scum trying to kill Jackal.

First things first, neither me nor FuDuzn were roleblocked. We also both know that we aren't weak doctors since no one targeted us and we lived through targeting Morton. We also should not forget that 1 doctor has died and the other has been taken over by Rach.

I am a Insane Doctor, Fuduzn is a normal doctor, FuDuzn saves.
I am a normal Doctor, FuDuzn is a Insande Doctor, Venmar saves.
Fuduzn is scum, I am a Doctor/CPR Doctor, Venmar saves.
I am scum, FuDuzn is a Doctor/CPR Doctor, FuDuzn saves.
FuDuzn is a Doctor, I am a CPR Doctor, We both save.
FuDuzn is a CPR Doctor, I am a Doctor, We both save.
FuDuzn is a Paranoid Doctor, i am a Doctor, We both save. ( In this scenario, Morton gets roleblocked. Possibly explaining Jackals death with a failure of protection )
FuDuzn is a Doctor, i am a Paranoid Doctor, We both save. ( In this scenario, Morton gets roleblocked. Possibly explaining Jackals death with a failure of protection )
FuDuzn is a Naive Doctor, I am a Normal Doctor, Venmar Saves.
FuDuzn is a Normal Doctor, I am a Naive Doctor, FuDuzn Saves.
FuDuzn is a Paranoid Doctor, I am a Naive Doctor, FuDuzn Saves. ( In this scenario, Morton gets roleblocked. Possibly explaining Jackals death with a failure of protection )
FuDuzn is a Naive Doctor, I am a Paranoid Doctor, Venmar Saves. ( In this scenario, Morton gets roleblocked. Possibly explaining Jackals death with a failure of protection )
FuDuzn is any Doctor, I am any Doctor, Scum attempts to kill Morton, We both save.
---
There are probably more possible outcomes, but that is what i got so far.

[Zachrulez]

Updated for personal reference and otherwise.

Robocopter - No action
RachMarie - No action
YellowBounder - Rach
Zachrulez- Yellowbounder
Fuduzn - Morton
Morton - Jackal
Venmar - Morton

[yellowbounder]

Not really sure we can work out much about our sanities from one night's round of protections. Lots of ifs and buts. Another night would be more conclusive.

[Zachrulez]

First things first, neither me nor FuDuzn were roleblocked. We also both know that we aren't weak doctors since no one targeted us and we lived through targeting Morton. We also should not forget that 1 doctor has died and the other has been taken over by Rach.

I uhhhh, don't follow how you eliminated weak doctor as a possibility.

[Robocopter87]

Didn't make sense to hide that information? How so? Town shouldn't care whether or not I was withholding information or not considering they had no reason to do anything other than claim their night action out right. Scum on the other hand could only benefit from having more information when deciding what they should claim.

As a town we decided that a popcorn mass actionclaim was the way to go.

Instead of following our predetermined path, you resisted. This is where the problem lies.

You should have simply claimed your action when you were popcorned. You had no reason to not claim the action.

Understand what I'm saying? Personally I think you are telling the truth. But you not claiming your action was a problem with no town motivation.

Not really sure we can work out much about our sanities from one night's round of protections. Lots of ifs and buts. Another night would be more conclusive.

I couldn't agree more.

[Venmar]

I did not take an action. I did not find anybody town enough to be protected and knew someone else would protect Rach, also I figured that the less amount of actions flying around the more likely it would be to sort through them to figure out the vary degrees of sanity of our doctors.

- I'd like to say that your reason for not using your action is not satisfactory for me. In this post you seem to hint that you thought RachMarie was worth protecting, but you decided to not do just that. and instead went on the hope that she was protected by someone else, even though she was deemed to be a unlikely choice for a scum-kill. The fact you made this excuse AFTER Yellowbounders claim is also shady, but this was popcorn'd so I can't pin you for that really, but it so does look convenient to use YB's claim to make an excuse for yourself.

- The second part in your post is mostly true, but not we have to make connections while keeping in mind a possible doctor who didn't use his power. Meaning, you could have been a Paranoid Doctor or a Quack Doctor and not using your power might leave me and FuDuzn thinking one of us is one and the other saved Morton. ( This is thinking in the sense that me and him don't think the other is scum. ) I think if you made an action, it could have been more useful for us. These are after all just 1 round of results, and another round would really help.

PEdit: Reading.

[Venmar]

First things first, neither me nor FuDuzn were roleblocked. We also both know that we aren't weak doctors since no one targeted us and we lived through targeting Morton. We also should not forget that 1 doctor has died and the other has been taken over by Rach.

I uhhhh, don't follow how you eliminated weak doctor as a possibility.

- Okay. Neither of us were targeted, thus we weren't roleblocked. Meaning our "protection" reached Morton. That also means no one could have saved us from dying due to targeting a mafia. So, should Morton have been a scum, me or FuDuzn would have died should we have been a weak doctor. This, however, doesn't clear Morton and is just speculation of course. Just because we aren't weak doctors doesn't mean that Morton is town, we just know what doctor we probably aren't.

- Although from your post and tone i think i am missing something, aren't I...?

[RachMarie]

I have to admit I can see why people would be suspicious of you Mort for the way we had to pull teeth to get you to claim your action and I could see scum motivation, however I think it is more likely that you drew a bad doc role instead. Scum probably targeted someone who had good protection.

Based on my experiences in other games with Mort, I am inclined to believe him. Stubbornness is quite common from town-Mort.
Tonight I will make sure I do an action and hopefully I did not inherit one of the bad doc roles.

[Venmar]

- Yeah, sorry Zach i just realized Morton could have been town and our protection went through. Sorry about that. It does, however, mean that if me or FuDuzn are a Weak Doctor, Morotn isn't scum. But we don't know if we are, so assuming Morton is town is not in order.

[Zachrulez]

- Yeah, sorry Zach i just realized Morton could have been town and our protection went through. Sorry about that. It does, however, mean that if me or FuDuzn are a Weak Doctor, Morotn isn't scum. But we don't know if we are, so assuming Morton is town is not in order.

I'm not assuming he is on that basis, I'm just pointing out the fact that your basis presumed he was scum.

[Robocopter87]

Nobody was town enough to protect except for Rach. Even though it was deemed that she would not be a likely choice for a scum kill. I had no fear in Rach's death and did not find anybody else worthy of my protect. (I was correct in my assumption that Rach would not die.)

However, like all actions there is repercussions. The downfall of me not taking an action is that we cannot figure out my sanity easily.

I think that PoE will solve that problem, anywho.

Also, I would like to point out the possibility of scum not killing anyone in an attempt to screw with us figuring out our sanities.

Like yellow said, we can't know anything for sure just yet. But more nights will solve that problem. We should focus on scumhunting as well.

(Man this game is fun)

[Robocopter87]

I was hardcore ninja'd, I began writing that post in response to post 331

[Zachrulez]

I would have preferred everyone sent in an action, mostly due to the possibility of effectively getting vig kills on scum, but I don't think Robo claims no action as scum.

[Venmar]

@Zachrulez - Who is scum?
@Robocopter- Who is scum?

[Venmar]

- Yeah, sorry Zach i just realized Morton could have been town and our protection went through. Sorry about that. It does, however, mean that if me or FuDuzn are a Weak Doctor, Morotn isn't scum. But we don't know if we are, so assuming Morton is town is not in order.

I'm not assuming he is on that basis, I'm just pointing out the fact that your basis presumed he was scum.

- I think on my basis i was saying he WASN'T scum, should FuDuzn or I be a weak doctor. Also, the part in the above post where it said

"But we don't know if we are, so assuming Morton is town is not in order."

, wasn't aimed at you, just to the game in general.

[FuDuzn]

Robo makes a good point, we should still focus on good ol'fashoined scumhunting and not spend the whole day trying to figure out exactly who did what. In fact he brought up another good point, scum could very easily be using this set up against us and could very well be pushing this talk about who did what as a sort of smokescreen(Venmar and Zach I am looking in your direction).

[Zachrulez]

Robo makes a good point, we should still focus on good ol'fashoined scumhunting and not spend the whole day trying to figure out exactly who did what. In fact he brought up another good point, scum could very easily be using this set up against us and could very well be pushing this talk about who did what as a sort of smokescreen(Venmar and Zach I am looking in your direction).

I'm not really that interested in trying to figure out doc actions too much, the tree of possibilities is simply far too complex. (Venmar's speculation was based on some false premises that I felt the need to debunk.)

I don't think scum can possibly can get that much control over the setup anyway, but you've just helped my POE by showing me paranoia that's more likely to come from a town perspective than from a scum one.

That makes me more comfortable with the idea of today's lynch being between Yellowbounder and Venmar. (I have town reads on Mort and Robo.)

Vote: Venmar

[Venmar]

Yellowbounder? What made you so suspicious of him all of the sudden?

[Zachrulez]

Yellowbounder? What made you so suspicious of him all of the sudden?

There really isn't an all of the sudden. I've never had better than a null read on the slot and if you read 338, it's pretty clear that I considered him to be a worthy vig target. Popcorning to Rach is also at least moderately scummy, there's no reason from a town perspective to do that especially given that he seemed to be aware of the value of popcorning in the first place. (Popcorning to Rach has a 0% chance of forcing a scum to fakeclaim.)

[Venmar]

Robo makes a good point, we should still focus on good ol'fashoined scumhunting and not spend the whole day trying to figure out exactly who did what, (Venmar and Zach I am looking in your direction).

- I've been scumhunting Robocopter a little bit. The speculating on night actions was just a plus that i quickly did regarding you and me.

[Robocopter87]

@Zachrulez - Who is scum?
@Robocopter- Who is scum?

Very good question.

However I think that a better question is, who is town?

In which case I would say (In a top to bottom in towniness level)

Me - Obv reasons. (Because I'm so sexy of course)
Rach- More obv reasons (Not as sexy though, but she does a mean dance)
Zach - I have felt overall town vibes from Zach and have him not in my scumpool right now
Venmar - Has done some scumhunting, I would've questioned me not doing an action as well. Has done some thought and even if it is false(Which I don't know yet), then he still attempted. And I believe the attempt was genuine.

Null

Mort - His refusal to not send in an action intrigues me. I would like to see his response before categorizing him. I think he is town though.

Scum

Yellow - PoE
Fu - PoE

[FuDuzn]

So no real reason that myself(and yellow for that matter) are scum besides PoE? And Venmar really is a town read for you?

Ok then.

[Robocopter87]

No no. I never said that it was only PoE. I just didn't give more reasons than PoE.



(I'll give more soon, I was just kinda pressed for time)

[FuDuzn]

Convenient.