NY 164: Maniacal Street Mafia (Anticlimatically finished.)

[Human Destroyer]

I have read and understand the role I was doled by a mole in a hole that doesn't have another thing that rhymes with role.

[Human Destroyer]

I have read and understand the role I was doled by a mole in a hole that doesn't have another thing that rhymes with role.

Sole, pole, cajole?

>mole with a pole

oh god just stop

[Human Destroyer]

I'll be in here when the game ACTUALLY starts.

^this but I'm probs going to hydra with om

[Human Destroyer]

Human Destroyer, why the vote with no comment on the role claim? Your ISO has you saying that fuzzy was useless and shouldn't make it to endgame, but you don't say anything about why Rena was a good lynch, particularly in light of being an un-CC'd PR.

awkward interactions with red ryu day 1

wrt PR: wait what? fuck now I actually have to read

[Human Destroyer]

I'm claiming because I'm pre-emting the 3 people who will vote me in the next hour while I'm setting up my newbie game.

Claim: Watcher.

I've crumbed multiple times.

Having been awake for 56 hours (nothing happened of interest

unless you count getting a puppy and passing my karate grading, I conclude that sleep deprivation is boring) you guys aren't my priority. I'll do posts and stuff when I wake up.

I've been watching the OmDes hydra, though, they seem protown to me.

Kublai makes my gut scum-o-metre tingle though. Not enough to go reaction hunting but enough to make me slightly uneasy.

The wagon on me is probably scum driven.

I targetted Bacde last night due to his Vig claim. Originally intended on watching Thor after establishing the multiple scumteam thing. That point is made here:

Hey bacde, who did you target last night, as vig?

I'm actually not vig, I was trying to draw the nightkill

I'm a reflexive night-vengeful townie

I don't believe you. Only idiot scum would target Thor over you.

That's why I was pissed off at Bacde. Had I targetted Thor as I originally planned, we'd have caught scum.

And here's the last one:

Sorry, unfortunately I'm not a mind reader,

I can only watch you all

, analyse you all and vote you all. I SEE WITH MY EYES DAMMIT, NOT MY INNER EYE.

I'm not caught scum. I'm mildly irritated that site meta has descended to epicmafia standards.

Now which of you picked up my massive breadcrumbs and tried to force a lynch over it.

um woah

didn't see that coming

I've seen scum watchers though so this doesn't really reassure me in the slightest; going with the read over the claim here.

[Human Destroyer]

rena who did you target night 1

I can guess but I want a straight answer

[Human Destroyer]

Still waiting on Rena to claim those results...

[Human Destroyer]

oh wait ThAd is Dan's slot?

VOTE: ThAd

Om told me he had a super-sexy meta scumread on Dan before he left me.

[Human Destroyer]

Finals are basically over, so activity should be going up starting Friday.

I don't believe ThAd's vig claim and I trust Om's meta read, so let's lynch ThAd.

[Human Destroyer]

Fun fact: The last time there was a crash that resulted in data loss, I was also modding a game. Is this a sign from above, that I should never mod again? Heck no! It's merely a sign of how awesome my games are; they're so volatile, the site crashes trying to handle them!

I love you sometimes.

<<< Only

some

times? >>>

Not sure I'm particularly interested in the Seanald wagon, but I'll freely admit I haven't read due to lack of time.

Someone want to explain/quote a post explaining?

[Human Destroyer]

Desperado posted a case a few pages ago.

Alternatively ISO Seanald yourself, it's not like he has a lot of posts.

Read the case, considering the vote.

I suppose of the options to lynch among the neighbors, I'd rather lynch one whose own co-neighbor finds him scummy, although the PeregrineV-ThAdmiral mutual admiration society still makes me leery.

And I don't see how Seanald voting someone for something he finds annoying rather than scummy is town-motivated.

UNVOTE: PeregrineV
VOTE: Seanald

Why is it scum-motivated though?

[Human Destroyer]

The Nero Cain wagon bores me. Let's lynch ThAdmiral.

[Human Destroyer]

Fun fact: The last time there was a crash that resulted in data loss, I was also modding a game. Is this a sign from above, that I should never mod again? Heck no! It's merely a sign of how awesome my games are; they're so volatile, the site crashes trying to handle them!

I love you sometimes.

<<< Only

some

times? >>>

Not sure I'm particularly interested in the Seanald wagon, but I'll freely admit I haven't read due to lack of time.

Someone want to explain/quote a post explaining?

Thoughts on Seanald over ThAdmiral if you've seen more about that argument?

I wouldn't cry if he was lynched, and I'll compromise to him if necessary. ThAd is still a better lynch though.

(No Mastin, all the time )

<<< <3 >>>

[Human Destroyer]

My thoughts from the vote history:
Red Ryu was either killed because Red Mafia was looking to kill Blue Mafia, or Red Mafia wanted to get rid of a strong townie.
The fact that his wagon got to 6(?) votes at one point means he couldn't have been too townie, so he was probably killed while being scumhunted by Red Mafia.

Since I think that rather than waste thier kill on the Blue mafia team if they can help it, Red Mafia would first try, in some way shape or form, to lynch Blue mafia if they can.

This means, common sense-wise, one of the following is

Red Mafia

:
Bulbazak
penguin_alien
Kublai Khan
Human Destroyer
ArcAngel9

Why these 5?

[Human Destroyer]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Bulbazak

Flash wagon anyone?

[Human Destroyer]

V/LA from Wednesday until at least Saturday. I will do my best to let you know if it goes longer than that.

I know at least one person asked me something, just give me a sec.

<<< Noted. >>>

[Human Destroyer]

HD, why are you not the least bit interested in lynching Nero-scum?

Oh, here it is.

I had a strong early townread on him for whatever reason, so did Om when he was playing. I could lie and make up some bullshit about "hidden reasons" or w/e, but honestly I just don't remember why; we both just took it for granted that we thought he was town and didn't discuss it.

[Human Destroyer]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... er_sort=Go

ffery, I read this game and I don't think Seanald is scum here.
Do you agree or am I reading too much into his approach?

...then why are you voting him?

[Human Destroyer]

also

V/LA is most likely through Sunday, not Saturday.

<<< Gotcha. >>>

[Human Destroyer]

GOD DAMNIT HD YOU FUCKING RUINED EVERYTHING

Then I succeeded.

[Human Destroyer]

VOTE: Bulbazak

Why did we lynch Slandaar while I was gone

whywhywhy

[Human Destroyer]

Y'know Bulb, the posts I see there wrt Nero "setting up lynches" are more "If CTD flips town, Slandaar is scum", not the other way around like you claim.

[Human Destroyer]

Townzorz are Nero, CTD, Bacde, AK, Ceph

Scumzorz are Bulbazak, ThAd, Rena

The rest of you wish you were cool, but really aren't so much.

[Human Destroyer]

The fact that neither of these are reaching full majority bugs me.

@Mastin- I hate deadline lynches. Just so you know.

<<< Would you rather have a failure to reach majority result in a no-lynch today? How 'bout day one? This game's long enough as it is already, no-lynching would make it go on for even longer. Plus...If you couldn't tell...I hate deadline no-lynches, just so you know. >>>

@Slandaar-I searched your Iso for "Crash" and "CTD" and QT, just to see if you mentioned anything regarding it.
You didn't, except to say Crash is town a few times.

Since I don't know why you feel this way, it's either real, or artificial.

Since your cases on other players seem artificial, this townread is looking the same way too. How is it not "worth" your time to explain why your neighbor is town?

Requesting ThAd, ArcAngel, Bacde or Desp moves their vote to Slandaar.

Hey Peregrine why were you working so hard to herd votes onto Slandaar yesterday?

- f

I'm interested in the response to this.

[Human Destroyer]

@Bulb

"+ there's atleast one scum in the neighborhood

s

and Slandaar makes a good bet. CTD might be scum afterall. He's ignoring discussing his neighborhood big time."

That's clearly 2 biggest scumreads from all 3 neighborhoods, hence the bolded pluralization.

As Nero pointed out here...

"I also specifically said “there’s atleast one scum in the ‘hoods.” There are 3 hoods its not like I ever said "if Slan flips town then it makes CTD scum" and I have no clue how you would get that."

"So again you seem to be buddying/defending CTD here. Just like you were doing yesterday."

^This is Slandaar-scum is buddying up to CTD-town, undeniably.

[Human Destroyer]

oh wait he was saying that to you

I blame you for messing up the quotes, disregard the last point

[Human Destroyer]

HD I'm coming to really appreciate you in my games man

I mean, I already did, but I can see that you are somewhat changing your playstyle and I love it

I can't handle all these walls

This is the most sus post you've made so far. Why did you feel the need to make this?

[Human Destroyer]

You don't think he's buddying CTD?

It's very possible; I just misread that particular part of the post.

Bulb did a lot of buddying of the BatB/ffullisade slot earlier too.

[Human Destroyer]

I've been pondering whether EddieFenix breadcrumbed his N1 rolecop results on day 2.

I kinda think he did. And I kinda don't think they were incriminating.

Townzorz are Nero, CTD, Bacde, AK, Ceph

Scumzorz are Bulbazak, ThAd, Rena

The rest of you wish you were cool, but really aren't so much.

I agree with some of this.

- f

I'd like to know what you agree and disagree with without having to search through your posts.

[Human Destroyer]

I think if Slandaar gets lynched and flips town, CTD will more likely be scum.

This is what Bulb is pushing me for but he's ignoring this?

There's also that pusedo-vig Thad wanted to shoot Bulb and told PV in the qt (right?) and then was blocked

Thad, did PV ask you who you wanted to shoot?

Now

that's

interesting.

[Human Destroyer]

The fact that neither of these are reaching full majority bugs me.

@Mastin- I hate deadline lynches. Just so you know.

<<< Would you rather have a failure to reach majority result in a no-lynch today? How 'bout day one? This game's long enough as it is already, no-lynching would make it go on for even longer. Plus...If you couldn't tell...I hate deadline no-lynches, just so you know. >>>

@Slandaar-I searched your Iso for "Crash" and "CTD" and QT, just to see if you mentioned anything regarding it.
You didn't, except to say Crash is town a few times.

Since I don't know why you feel this way, it's either real, or artificial.

Since your cases on other players seem artificial, this townread is looking the same way too. How is it not "worth" your time to explain why your neighbor is town?

Requesting ThAd, ArcAngel, Bacde or Desp moves their vote to Slandaar.

Hey Peregrine why were you working so hard to herd votes onto Slandaar yesterday?

- f

I'm interested in the response to this.

Look up. post 4915 on this page. e.g.

Easier to list the parts I'm not sure about. Of the town list, I'm not sure about Ceph. To a lesser extent, I'm not sure about AK. mollie has some serious concerns about them. We're working on a consensus. Of the scum list I disagree with ThAd. I'm null-ish about Bulbazak. And I'd add Peregrine as a person of concern.

Oh, whoops.

I'd like to look into PV a little more if Bulbazak flips scum (I'm decently confident he will) now that you and Nero have brought some things up regarding the two of them. Or maybe I'll just look at him for the hell of it. IDK.

Ceph is an old read that both myself and Om had earlier in the game, and I'm hoping to god early me is right. Om had told me that he was sure this is Mala's town meta, so that's where the AK read comes from.

[Human Destroyer]

@HD:

Is there any way you can explain on the Mala meta part more? Did he give you specifics or was it just a gut feel?

1. No
2. He didn't give me specifics, but didn't specify whether it was gut or not.

[Human Destroyer]

Rena
bulb
ctd
Cephir
nacho
bacde
^
the last 4 scum be in there

Replace Ceph with Peregrine and Nacho with ThAd and I'm happy with this list.

[Human Destroyer]

thoughts on Bulb, please dear.

Eh, not a strong town read, but he seems to have decent intentions even if he's a bit paranoid.

Rena, do you agree that both you and ThAd are claiming to have unsuccessful night actions? Do you think you were both blocked? If you're town, wouldn't you be massively suspicious of ThAd and/or Bulbazak?

then again, penguin might be scum too

[Human Destroyer]

Townzorz are Nero, CTD, Bacde, AK, Ceph

Scumzorz are Bulbazak, ThAd, Rena

The rest of you wish you were cool, but really aren't so much.

Rena
bulb
ctd
Cephir
nacho
bacde
^
the last 4 scum be in there

Replace Ceph with Peregrine and Nacho with ThAd and I'm happy with this list.

Explain Bacde/CTD.

I missed you were on there, actually.

Bacde because one of his posts made me drop the townread, and I'm too lazy to dig it up.

[Human Destroyer]

So you're agreeing that a scum/scum neighborhood is more likely than both scum in different neighborhoods?

???

No, I haven't said that. I'm saying he had both players as scumreads.

A scum/scum neighborhood between two scum teams

is

possible though, I hadn't really thought of that.

In any case, one of them flipped town already, so that isn't even relevant.

[Human Destroyer]

Desperado just shot up on my townlist.

@ human destroyer: so you want me and peregrine lynched. Do you think that we are scum that claimed neighbor together - therefore making us possibly the dumbest pair of scum-partners ever to play mafia? Or do you think we are two scum from opposing factions, forced to live together in a neighborhood like the original fucking odd couple?

The latter.

[Human Destroyer]

I don't really care about the neighborhoods. For all I know you and Thad are scum together and are just claiming that you're a neighborhood.

That would be the best scum play of all time.

@ human destroyer: so you want me and peregrine lynched. Do you think that we are scum that claimed neighbor together -

therefore making us possibly the dumbest pair of scum-partners ever to play mafia?

Or do you think we are two scum from opposing factions, forced to live together in a neighborhood like the original fucking odd couple?

Sarcasm

UNVOTE:
VOTE: ThAdmiral

[Human Destroyer]

You say he's buddying CTD; is there anything independent of neighborhood issues that you find scummy in his play?

^ +scumpoints for penguin

[Human Destroyer]

Rena did you ever answer my question about who your N1 action was?

[Human Destroyer]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Bulbazak

ThAd goes tomorrow.

[Human Destroyer]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Bulbazak

ThAd goes tomorrow.

goes where?

[Human Destroyer]

Human Destroyer, how are you going to feel about ThAd if an extra kill shows up?

then I guess he could be a serial killer?

I don't think he is though, and I don't think an extra kill will show up.

[Human Destroyer]

HD, if you don't think that ThAd is the vig., are you saying that he's lying about targetting me, and if so, for what purpose? What does that tell you about my alignment?

1. Yes.
2. To pretend he's a vig. Duh.
3. Nothing.

[Human Destroyer]

So you're saying that you think ThAd is lying about being the vig (i.e. scum) and is therefore lying about who he targetted, yet that tells you absolutely NOTHING about his target? I understand we're in multiball and everything, but you should still be able to come to some conclusion via PoE.

Yes, that tells me actually nothing about the target. I'm not sure why you're so set on the fact that it does.

[Human Destroyer]

Serious question: How isn't Bulba hammered already?

[Human Destroyer]

So you're saying that you think ThAd is lying about being the vig (i.e. scum) and is therefore lying about who he targetted, yet that tells you absolutely NOTHING about his target? I understand we're in multiball and everything, but you should still be able to come to some conclusion via PoE.

Yes, that tells me actually nothing about the target. I'm not sure why you're so set on the fact that it does.

Because I'm trying to understand your thought process. I would think there would be some line of reasoning that would allow you to reach one conclusion or the other, but you're claiming that your line of reasoning would lead to no conclusion whatsoever. Essentially, you threw something out there that would lead to, you claim, no reasonable set of conclusions. This bothers me, because you are one of the few in the game that I'm still trying to figure out what your motivation is. You were very active on d1 and were at least able to voice your reasoning for your thoughts. You dropped a little on d2, but still, you were making well crafted arguments. However, you've seemed to be coasting since then. I'm just trying to make sense of all of this, hence why I'm asking about your line of reasoning.

Translation: I am trying to distract you from lynching me by subtly hinting that scum-ThAd saying he targeted me means that I am town even though it is multiball and inherent WIFOM.

[Human Destroyer]

like that is the weakest thing you could possibly push me on right now

also, saying you were going for "my thought process" is sorta nullified by the fact that you were trying to push me to say it

did

affect something

that's not trying to understand my thought process, that's trying to influence it

[Human Destroyer]

@HD: I'm not trying to push anything. I'm just saying that you should have some line of reasoning behind your actions. Whether you think I'm town or scum, you should have some line of thought that led you to that conclusion in conjunction with ThAd's actions, who you are claiming is scum. I'm just curious about your thought process, because you have been hiding in the background since d2.

No.

There's a difference between "Do you believe ThAd's claimed kill choice affects my alignment?" or "C'mon, you

must

think ThAd's kill choice affects my alignment

somehow

!"

[Human Destroyer]

All I'm trying to do is understand your thought process, especially since you've been coasting since d2. However, all you're doing is trying to squelch discussion, which is a humongous scumtell for me.

Seriously, what is it with people lately not wanting to discuss their motivations?

I'd hardly call accusing you of lying a "squelching of discussion" as you put it.

[Human Destroyer]

In fact, I'm not really sure why people are ignoring the fact that Bulbazak is outright lying about his intentions.
I'm going to point this out for those of you that might have missed this exchange:

Bulbazak: "Do you think ThAd-scum claiming I was his kill target is relevant to my alignment?"
Me: "No."
Bulbazak: "But you must have

something

related to that that is relevant to my alignment!"
Me: "No. Why are you trying to subtly imply you're town on this nonsensical line of reasoning?"
Bulbazak: "I'm not, I'm scumhunting!!!!"
Me: "No, you're doing what I just said you were."
Bulbazak: "You're quashing discussion, you're scum!"
Me: ":neutral:"

[Human Destroyer]

Me: You claim that ThAd is lying, both about his role and targetting me. For what purpose would he do so, and how does that effect your read on me?
You: It tells me nothing.
Me: So you think he's lying, and it does not inform your read whatsoever?
You: No.
Me: Walk me through it. You must have some line of reasoning that led to your conclusions. What were they?
You: I'm not scum! Quit trying to push me! You are trying to influence me! Scum! Scum!
Me: I'm not accusing you of anything. I'm just trying to understand your thought processes and motivation, especially since you have been in the background since d2.
You: I'm not telling you anything.
Me: I just want to understand your thought process. Why don't you want to discuss your motivation?
You: Liar!

Really? Let's check the quotes on this.

HD, if you don't think that ThAd is the vig., are you saying that he's lying about targetting me, and if so, for what purpose? What does that tell you about my alignment?

Bulbazak: "What does ThAd-scum claiming to target me tell you about my alignment?"

HD, if you don't think that ThAd is the vig., are you saying that he's lying about targetting me, and if so, for what purpose? What does that tell you about my alignment?

1. Yes.
2. To pretend he's a vig. Duh.
3. Nothing.

Me: "Nothing."

That part you got right. But here's where you start to twist the truth:

HD, if you don't think that ThAd is the vig., are you saying that he's lying about targetting me, and if so, for what purpose? What does that tell you about my alignment?

1. Yes.
2. To pretend he's a vig. Duh.
3. Nothing.

So you're saying that you think ThAd is lying about being the vig (i.e. scum) and is therefore lying about who he targetted,

yet that tells you absolutely NOTHING about his target? I understand we're in multiball and everything, but you should still be able to come to some conclusion via PoE.

What you said you said: "So you think he's lying, and it does not inform your read whatsoever?"

What you actually said: "You

must

be able to come to some conclusion about my alignment using this!"

That's called "implying you must be town on nonsensical reasoning".

So you're saying that you think ThAd is lying about being the vig (i.e. scum) and is therefore lying about who he targetted, yet that tells you absolutely NOTHING about his target? I understand we're in multiball and everything, but you should still be able to come to some conclusion via PoE.

Yes, that tells me actually nothing about the target. I'm not sure why you're so set on the fact that it does.

"Why are you so set on the fact that it affects your alignment?"

So you're saying that you think ThAd is lying about being the vig (i.e. scum) and is therefore lying about who he targetted, yet that tells you absolutely NOTHING about his target? I understand we're in multiball and everything, but you should still be able to come to some conclusion via PoE.

Yes, that tells me actually nothing about the target. I'm not sure why you're so set on the fact that it does.

Because I'm trying to understand your thought process. I would think there would be some line of reasoning that would allow you to reach one conclusion or the other,but you're claiming that

your line of reasoning would lead to no conclusion whatsoever. Essentially, you threw something out there that would lead to, you claim, no reasonable set of conclusions.

This bothers me, because you are one of the few in the game that I'm still trying to figure out what your motivation is. You were very active on d1 and were at least able to voice your reasoning for your thoughts. You dropped a little on d2, but still, you were making well crafted arguments. However, you've seemed to be coasting since then. I'm just trying to make sense of all of this, hence why I'm asking about your line of reasoning.

Now here's where it gets really twisted.

What you said you said: "Walk me through it. You must have some line of reasoning that led to your conclusions. What were they?"

What you actually said: "You threw out that ThAd was a vig without saying it had something to do with my alignment? It must have

something

to do with it! BTW this is totally to try and understand your thought process I'm not implying anything at all!"

And it's weird because you called it

my

line of reasoning when I never said that was my line of reasoning for calling you scum, ever. Wassup?

So you're saying that you think ThAd is lying about being the vig (i.e. scum) and is therefore lying about who he targetted, yet that tells you absolutely NOTHING about his target? I understand we're in multiball and everything, but you should still be able to come to some conclusion via PoE.

Yes, that tells me actually nothing about the target. I'm not sure why you're so set on the fact that it does.

Because I'm trying to understand your thought process. I would think there would be some line of reasoning that would allow you to reach one conclusion or the other, but you're claiming that your line of reasoning would lead to no conclusion whatsoever. Essentially, you threw something out there that would lead to, you claim, no reasonable set of conclusions. This bothers me, because you are one of the few in the game that I'm still trying to figure out what your motivation is. You were very active on d1 and were at least able to voice your reasoning for your thoughts. You dropped a little on d2, but still, you were making well crafted arguments. However, you've seemed to be coasting since then. I'm just trying to make sense of all of this, hence why I'm asking about your line of reasoning.

Translation: I am trying to distract you from lynching me by subtly hinting that scum-ThAd saying he targeted me means that I am town even though it is multiball and inherent WIFOM.

like that is the weakest thing you could possibly push me on right now

also, saying you were going for "my thought process" is sorta nullified by the fact that you were trying to push me to say it

did

affect something

that's not trying to understand my thought process, that's trying to influence it

I accuse you of lying and trying to force me to call you town using a nonsensical line of reasoning.

@HD: I'm not trying to push anything. I'm just saying that you should have some line of reasoning behind your actions.

Whether you think I'm town or scum, you should have some line of thought that led you to that conclusion in conjunction with ThAd's actions, who you are claiming is scum.

I'm just curious about your thought process, because you have been hiding in the background since d2.

This

is

trying to influence me again, despite your claims that you're not trying to influence me. If I had already given you an answer of no, no town player would expect me to change the answer. It doesn't make any sense.

All I'm trying to do is understand your thought process, especially since you've been coasting since d2. However, all you're doing is trying to squelch discussion, which is a humongous scumtell for me.

Seriously, what is it with people lately not wanting to discuss their motivations?

"You're squelching discussion! Scum!"

Let's not forget that the only thing you've actually asked me about was how ThAd's actions affected your alignment, which I specifically said they didn't. So y'know.

To bring up your post again:

Me: You claim that ThAd is lying, both about his role and targetting me. For what purpose would he do so, and how does that effect your read on me?
You: It tells me nothing.
Me: So you think he's lying, and it does not inform your read whatsoever?
You: No.

Me: Walk me through it. You must have some line of reasoning that led to your conclusions. What were they?

You: I'm not scum! Quit trying to push me!

You are trying to influence me! Scum! Scum!

Me: I'm not accusing you of anything.

I'm just trying to understand your thought processes and motivation, especially since you have been in the background since d2.

You: I'm not telling you anything.

Me: I just want to understand your thought process. Why don't you want to discuss your motivation?

You: Liar!

The bolded are twists of the truth or don't actually exist. Mostly the latter except for the first bolded line.

[Human Destroyer]

after reading that wall, everyone should be voting bulbazak

[Human Destroyer]

I'll hammer out of boredom after I respond to Bulbazak

p-edit: or that

[Human Destroyer]

I really am in no condition to play mafia right now, tomorrow I promise

(yes I know this is against the spirit of the rules but I wanted to make sure people didn't think I died or something)

<<< Tomorrow as in Sunday would have been fine. However, "tomorrow" has come and gone, and it's Monday, two days after you made this post. That is not. >>>

[Human Destroyer]

VOTE: ThAd

oh please

you're telling me he's gone 4 nights without a single successful kill?

I call bullshit

[Human Destroyer]

I'm not willing to lynch AK, the end of 5527 seals it for me.

Bulbazak making up reasons to lynch people who want to lynch him is cute. Poor scum.

[Human Destroyer]

Pretty terrible post. We've firmly established that there's a scum roleblocker.

So wait.

Not only did they block ThAd every night, they somehow managed to

a) know he was a vig before he claimed it (didn't he claim like Day 3 or something? I could be wrong on this)
b) roleblock Rena at the same time for, at the very least, Night 3

[Human Destroyer]

"ThAd is town because there is a scum roleblocker" isn't an argument.

Especially when someone else has claimed roleblocked on the same night as them.

[Human Destroyer]

I've been pretty clear about why I think certain people are scum. Trying to discredit my position by dismissing it as OMGUS just solidifies my read of you.

I'd prefer to call it "tactical counterattacks" rather than "OMGUS", if that's okay with you.

What read? The one that was made when I called you out on lying and you cried about how I was trying to stop discussion...even though we...continued discussing?

Erm...right...

[Human Destroyer]

Human Destroyer wanting to jump on ThAd when Rena's flip implies he's not a good lynch for today makes me really uneasy.

1. Are we ignoring the fact that I've wanted the ThAd slot dead since Day 1 now?

2. Weird...I find the Rena flip implicates him as scum, not town. Why do you think otherwise?

[Human Destroyer]

"ThAd is town because there is a scum roleblocker" isn't an argument.

Especially when someone else has claimed roleblocked on the same night as them.

I'm not up for the quote wall, but didn't ThAd say his lack of kill didn't count against his shots this time? Implying the failed kills had different causes? And that he had limited shots in the first place?

<<< That should fix the tags. >>>

you really think mod would telegraph different causes for a kill not going through?

I sure as hell don't. OTOH, with no other claimed X-Shot PRs, the fact that there might be a difference ia fairly easy to fake.

[Human Destroyer]

assuming 3-3

I think nacho is red scum that went for the easy seanald bus, thad is his buddy

nacho was so quick to back the fuck off the moment thad claimed, started claiming that thad was a more likely scum roleblock target than rena but when rena flips town he doesn't seem to consider thad? unless I really missed something there

thad is on like super-survival mode, that x-shot distinction thing is sketchy as fuck, om was fairly sure dan was scum D1, he lacks towniness to a scary degree...omg just kill it already

Bulb is last blue scum, though if thad is somehow town, I guess he could be a BP SK? He's scum though, I'm pretty certain. he has evaded the lynch like twice somehow, even after being called on blatant lying. he also feels so damn mechanical this game, and he was so obv-town in other games I've played with him, I just don't see him being town in any reality.

PV I am not confident in my ability to read, I always seem to get it wrong, and I'm lazy, so I'm not even trying there

baezu slot troubles me but maybe it's 4-4 or maybe an SK? if it's 4-4 I'm fucking stumped as to who the last scum is, I'd probably entertain PV at that point tho

I think I'm comfortable with at the very least ctd, ffullisade, and desp, ceph I'm a little less sure of now

ps phoneposting sucks

[Human Destroyer]

Bulb is defintely town

why are your reads so fency?

~Mara

Which ones?
The only ones you could argue I'm fencing on are PV and Baezu really.

And no, Bulb is definitely 100% scum.

Human Destroyer wanting to jump on ThAd when Rena's flip implies he's not a good lynch for today makes me really uneasy.

1. Are we ignoring the fact that I've wanted the ThAd slot dead since Day 1 now?

2. Weird...I find the Rena flip implicates him as scum, not town. Why do you think otherwise?

1. OK...doesn't mean it's town-tunneling.

2. Rena's flip tells us that scum does have the ability to roleblock, as I seriously doubt KK JK'd Rena, nor has anyone suggested such a thing. Town (almost) never lies about being blocked. (yes, I've seen it happen to my extreme annoyance, not relevant here) That night, scum shot KK and AA9. AA9 wasn't active enough to be a serious threat; KK was in a death spiral grip with AK. Maybe scum were PR hunting. But there was a claimed PR right there. Why block and not kill? Hoping town would take her out.

1. I'm aware, but you're presenting the situation as if I didn't think ThAd is scum until suddenly "OMG Rena died kill it!"

2. Okay but that still doesn't explain how both were roleblocked at the same time.

Time out. You're right, this doesn't make sense. Three scenarios: A: ThAd is town, B: ThAd is scum on a team with a roleblocker, C: ThAd is scum on a team without a roleblocker.

A: Scum leaves ThAd free to shoot his target, as neither team apparently cares that he declared he was aiming for CTD. Never mind that this leaves him having confirmed himself. Still, not sure why scum wouldn't kill him before he could go for any of their own people if they were letting him shoot with the hopes that he'd eliminate CTD for them. B: ThAd knows that his team will block Rena. He hopes to 1v1 her on the blocking issue. C: ThAd expects one of the claimed PRs to be dead by Day Four and be able to claim that he was the target of a block if he survives.

What does make me uneasy is that I was questioning all this Day Four, albeit thinking that Rena was opportunistic scum. Yet no one jumped on it, even though last night's kill demonstrates that at least one scum team wanted her dead in the end. It seems like scum could be trying to get us to lynch ThAd for them, like they seem to have tried with Rena.

A. Roleblocking works just as well? This doesn't really explain a) how both Rena and ThAd were roleblocked (I'm assuming she made the correct move and didn't lie here) or b) why scum are killing random players to find VTs. If scum is going PR fishing, killing the claimed PRs makes a ton more sense than what they've been doing.

B. Alternatively, he IS the roleblocker. I'm not sure how likely that is though.

C. But they weren't and he still claimed it? I don't think it works then...

"ThAd is town because there is a scum roleblocker" isn't an argument.

Especially when someone else has claimed roleblocked on the same night as them.

I'm not up for the quote wall, but didn't ThAd say his lack of kill didn't count against his shots this time? Implying the failed kills had different causes? And that he had limited shots in the first place?

<<< That should fix the tags. >>>

you really think mod would telegraph different causes for a kill not going through?

I sure as hell don't. OTOH, with no other claimed X-Shot PRs, the fact that there might be a difference ia fairly easy to fake.

I had an X-Shot role cop PR as scum once. I made sure to clarify whether it counted against my shots if I was blocked. It didn't. I assume that if I'd ever been blocked, I would have been informed that I didn't use up a shot. I've also seen set-ups where only one town PR was X-shot and others were perpetual. So I do think the mod would have to inform the player in this situation how many shots he has left, but you're also right that it's easy to fake.

Hm...

@Mod: In a theoretical situation where there is an X-Shot Vigilante, would he lose a shot if his target was protected? If he was roleblocked?

<<< Question answered in post 5664. >>>

assuming 3-3

I think nacho is red scum that went for the easy seanald bus, thad is his buddy

nacho was so quick to back the fuck off the moment thad claimed, started claiming that thad was a more likely scum roleblock target than rena but when rena flips town he doesn't seem to consider thad? unless I really missed something there

thad is on like super-survival mode, that x-shot distinction thing is sketchy as fuck, om was fairly sure dan was scum D1, he lacks towniness to a scary degree...omg just kill it already

Bulb is last blue scum, though if thad is somehow town, I guess he could be a BP SK? He's scum though, I'm pretty certain. he has evaded the lynch like twice somehow, even after being called on blatant lying. he also feels so damn mechanical this game, and he was so obv-town in other games I've played with him, I just don't see him being town in any reality.

PV I am not confident in my ability to read, I always seem to get it wrong, and I'm lazy, so I'm not even trying there

baezu slot troubles me but maybe it's 4-4 or maybe an SK? if it's 4-4 I'm fucking stumped as to who the last scum is, I'd probably entertain PV at that point tho

I think I'm comfortable with at the very least ctd, ffullisade, and desp, ceph I'm a little less sure of now

ps phoneposting sucks

UNVOTE: Human Destroyer

HD is approaching this way better than the people piling on PV for the reason of, 'must be scum somewhere in the neighborhoods.' I don't know that I agree that we should lynch ThAd today, but I get the case now, which is more than I can say for the PV lynch. CTD makes some good points, but it seems like most of the other people still on the wagon don't have much more than a plan to fish with dynamite. Which is what scum would want right now. So I'm not so excited about it.

I'm approaching it better by saying I'm not trying to read him???

Nacho did say that if we don't get evidence of a scum roleblocker, ThAd should be lynched. Yet Rena's claim of being blocked would seem to indicate one exists. Not sure how to reconcile that.

VOTE: Baezu

For starting the PV wagon with a hypocritical reason and not seeming to care about figuring out where scum is if it's still among the neighborhoods.

It means Nacho is scum that doesn't want to follow through.

mollie and I will not be going there PA, because Bacde.

Funny, I actually thought Bacde was getting pretty scummy later on. I'm not sure why you think he was such a paragon of town?

[Human Destroyer]

You seem to be missing a lot actually...

Oh, I know there's stuff from yesterday.

But what happened to all that stuff today, with Rena actually dead and flipped town? Where's the follow-through on his statements?

[Human Destroyer]

First, a SK AND multiball? Seriously? You are seriously suggesting that in a game where we've had 2 kills every night and that there is confirmation of 2 teams, just so you can push your horribad case on me? I'm disappointed...

I've seen SK + multiball before, at the very least, on a different site.

Your kill count thing is actually a fair point though, I concede that.

One of the primary reasons that I have found you scummy all game is that you don't even try to address or counter arguments made against you. You just automatically shout "misrep" or "liar" as a way to discredit what is being said and then try to get people to follow your BS case. This is the main reason why I also have a residual scumread on PA's slot (The BS case on Nacho that Syry so wonderfully dismantled.). I really don't think you're trying and hoping that people will just follow your lead without looking at the arguments too closely.

Firstly (regarding your quote above this that I forgot to address), it's funny because that's not what you asked me at all. You asked me what I thought about ThAd and how it related to your alignment, not what my "thought processes" are. I mean don't get me wrong, you put the words "thought process" in there...but it isn't what you were asking. Not at fucking all.

You'll have to show me these counter arguments I don't appear to be answering, cause I don't really see them.
Hint: Repeating the same, addressed point over and over and saying it slightly differently is NOT a new counter-argument.

Finally, that obv-town statement from you is piece of fiction and you know it. We've only been in 2 games together, and at no point in either of those did you call me obv-town. In fact, in Voided I was mislynched by the town, and in Bad Apples you showed extreme suspicion of me up until your cop claim. You also were better logic-wise in those games than you are here. I'm not getting any sense of town HD here (Yes, I know you were scum in Voided. But I'm also considering that you forgot that you were scum in that game, which makes that game more in line with your town meta than scum meta.), and I think town HD would know better than to make a weak argument such as that.

What the fuck?

In voided you were obv-town and I was fighting against your lynch like crazy. Did you forget this already?

Bad Apples I also remember you being one of my strong townreads so...what up? I'll check it again if it's really that fething important, but I like to think I know when you're fething town.

[Human Destroyer]

just checked, I flip-flopped a lot, but after the initial suspicion early on, I was fairly confident you were town

it's day 5 now, whereas I figured out you were town day 1 in that game (or maybe day 2?).

my confidence in my ability to read you as town remains.

[Human Destroyer]

Aw, now that I got interested in the game everyone left.

[Human Destroyer]

By my interpretation, any X-shot role being roleblocked will not lose their shot, vigilantes included.

By my interpretation, a vigilante shooting at someone being protected expends their bullet.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Baezu

[Human Destroyer]

Say that I haven't been asking about your thought process and motivation. I dare you.

You haven't been asking about my thought process and motivation.

Boom goes the fireworks.

[Human Destroyer]

okay, I said that wrong, let me clarify it for you

and I'm only going to say this one more time because seriously the first time should have been enough

You are

not

asking for all my thought processes and motivation. You

are

asking for what I think your alignment is and thought processes are based around ThAd scum that influenced in your alignment...which I said there were none...3 times...and you kept insisting on asking the same question...right...

[Human Destroyer]

I shot hd last night. I was blocked again, obviously, but this time it didn't cost me one of my x-shots. So I guess I was blocked in a different way?

By my interpretation, any X-shot role being roleblocked will not lose their shot, vigilantes included.

By my interpretation, a vigilante shooting at someone being protected expends their bullet.

thad = scum arguments officially make no fucking sense whatsoever

[Human Destroyer]

Time out. You're right, this doesn't make sense. Three scenarios: A: ThAd is town, B: ThAd is scum on a team with a roleblocker, C: ThAd is scum on a team without a roleblocker.

A: Scum leaves ThAd free to shoot his target, as neither team apparently cares that he declared he was aiming for CTD. Never mind that this leaves him having confirmed himself. Still, not sure why scum wouldn't kill him before he could go for any of their own people if they were letting him shoot with the hopes that he'd eliminate CTD for them. B: ThAd knows that his team will block Rena. He hopes to 1v1 her on the blocking issue. C: ThAd expects one of the claimed PRs to be dead by Day Four and be able to claim that he was the target of a block if he survives.

What does make me uneasy is that I was questioning all this Day Four, albeit thinking that Rena was opportunistic scum. Yet no one jumped on it, even though last night's kill demonstrates that at least one scum team wanted her dead in the end. It seems like scum could be trying to get us to lynch ThAd for them, like they seem to have tried with Rena.

This, coupled with the fact that ThaD just voted for PV, simply because I asked him to:

C'mon guys

Get towncred

Jump on the PV wagon

All aboard!

Alright

vote: pv

Pretty terrible post. We've firmly established that there's a scum roleblocker.

So wait.

Not only did they block ThAd every night, they somehow managed to

a) know he was a vig before he claimed it (didn't he claim like Day 3 or something? I could be wrong on this)
b) roleblock Rena at the same time for, at the very least, Night 3

I chose not to shoot nights 1 and 2 you dullard.

"ThAd is town because there is a scum roleblocker" isn't an argument.

Especially when someone else has claimed roleblocked on the same night as them.

yeah

and I told him I wanted to talk to him and he never responded

VOTE: thadVOTE:

Well you could have, you know, asked me a question or something.

As well as this most recent reason for why pv over ctd:

So why PV over CTD?

I know this question wasn't directed at me, but I'm going to answer it anyway. From my perspective at least.

Why pv over ctd? Because he is more likely of the two to be lynched right now.

Confirms in my mind that ThaD is scum.

VOTE: Thad

+

how about this - if you help me lynch pv I'll actually try tomorrow.

Looking forward to seeing that!

VOTE: PV

=

Baezu is scum.

[Human Destroyer]

Either way, I think both instances show that I definitely wasn't obv. town.

except I thought you were in both those games

you can argue it took me a while in bad apples but I still didn't need to investigate you to figure it out

voided it's pretty hard to argue that I was calling you obv-town all game, even if you don't remember me defending you all game

(this is the last of the posting flurry I think)

[Human Destroyer]

This is your fucking argument? It's total shit. wtf? At least if you want us to think you're town you could try a little harder...

wow overreaction much?

I just pointed out two posts that contradict each other on a very basic level. If you want to say it's shit, at least explain why it's shit.

[Human Destroyer]

okay, I said that wrong, let me clarify it for you

and I'm only going to say this one more time because seriously the first time should have been enough

You are

not

asking for all my thought processes and motivation. You

are

asking for what I think your alignment is and thought processes are based around ThAd scum that influenced in your alignment...which I said there were none...3 times...and you kept insisting on asking the same question...right...

I asked about my relationship in regards to your ThAd read twice. Overall, I've been focused on trying to understand your lines of reasoning. This is the backbone of EVERYTHING I ask.

When you sheeped Nero's line of reasoning, I questioned you on the validity of said reasoning, to which you didn't respond.

I've since tried to get you to shed light on why X or Y is scum or why X is more likely to be scum over Y, essentially, your entire line of thought. If you think X and Y are scum, I want to know WHY you think they are scum and how/if they are connected. The same goes for WHY X is more likely to be scum over Y and vice versa. You haven't been providing any of that, which is alarming, since you tend to be a bit more logical as town. You are essentially trying to skate by in this game and avoid any line of questioning related to your thought process and motivation. To be perfectly honest, I could care less WHO you think is scum. I'm more interested in WHY you think they are scum, as that is the easiest way to judge your intentions and motivations.

Bolded: what reasoning and where

The rest: You have not asked me why I think people are scum. I do find it quite interesting that you ignored my post on Page...226 I think? explaining exactly who I think is scum and why though.

[Human Destroyer]

Vote: Human Destroyer

ffullisade, with me!

Huzzah!

Vote: Human Destroyer

[Human Destroyer]

In both of her town games, she looked unsure, hesitant, and kinda looking around for a direction to take. In her scum game she looked more confident. Compare the cases she made in her scum game to her cases in her town game. And to here.

It's like the difference between town you and scum you sometimes. Not as much *lately*, but. Plus Bacde was incredibly fucking town how can you say anything else???

ahahahaha

no

[Human Destroyer]

In both of her town games, she looked unsure, hesitant, and kinda looking around for a direction to take. In her scum game she looked more confident. Compare the cases she made in her scum game to her cases in her town game. And to here.

It's like the difference between town you and scum you sometimes. Not as much *lately*, but. Plus Bacde was incredibly fucking town how can you say anything else???

ahahahaha

no

if you don't have a witty retort, then don't say anything at all

>implying I need one

[Human Destroyer]

HD I'm coming to really appreciate you in my games man

I mean, I already did, but I can see that you are somewhat changing your playstyle and I love it

I can't handle all these walls

This is the most sus post you've made so far. Why did you feel the need to make this?

oh hey this is why hd suspects bacde
i am fairly disgusted in myself for even looking this up

this was around the time where my posting was sparse due to me being busy

the fact that he chose to compliment this supposed "playstyle" combined with the fact that he always tries to get on my good side when he's scum is sus as fuck

[Human Destroyer]

yeah this wagon is retarded x20

[Human Destroyer]

just got a "Surprise vacation!"

technically v/la till sunday, should be able to do stuff by later tomorrow though

<<< Noted. >>>

[Human Destroyer]

He's not my preferred lynch, is what I'm saying, and I suspect there's scum on his wagon. Scum on his wagon doesn't make him town though and I could see him as scum based on the case presented and his reaction to it.

I'm curious as to what "case" you're talking about, since the closest thing I see to one is coming from someone that isn't even off the wagon (Bulbazak).

The reasons as far as I've gathered mostly pertain to my suspecting an already replaced out player because I reacted to a post I thought was suspicious?Baezu didn't even seem to realize I existed till I voted them, no one on my wagon has actually voiced suspicion before this game day (except maybe Nacho idr for sure, but I'm 99% sure no one else has).

[Human Destroyer]

HD I'm coming to really appreciate you in my games man

I mean, I already did, but I can see that you are somewhat changing your playstyle and I love it

I can't handle all these walls

This is the most sus post you've made so far. Why did you feel the need to make this?

oh hey this is why hd suspects bacde
i am fairly disgusted in myself for even looking this up

this was around the time where my posting was sparse due to me being busy

the fact that he chose to compliment this supposed "playstyle" combined with the fact that he always tries to get on my good side when he's scum is sus as fuck

he complimented your playstyle and that is scummy? why?

meanwhile, you town against bacde scum:
Gonzo Mafia - Called you town, buddied up to you a little.

Banjo Kazooie - Had you claim after him, no other interaction.

So what do you mean, he always tries to get on your good sign when he's scum?

Soft pushed you until he had to convince you were town in the face of a cop guilty.

Alright, maybe I'll word this differently.

He only tries to get on my good side as scum, never as town.

[Human Destroyer]

I'm curious as to what "case" you're talking about, since the closest thing I see to one is coming from someone that isn't even

on

the wagon (Bulbazak).

ebwop

[Human Destroyer]

V/LA Tuesday-Thursday. Hershey Park wooooooo

<<< Got it. >>>

Since I'll be popping in for modding purposes, I'll try to post in my games as well.

[Human Destroyer]

will take care of this after I get my modded game set up and/or I eat dinner

[Human Destroyer]

going to sleep in 10 minutes but let's see what I can figure out in that amount of time

[Human Destroyer]

...but then I think of the flips and I get annoyed at this game because in the past 2 game days I've only had one right read out of the flipped despite there being like 7 people dead (that being Nero Cain)

I really don't want to think I'm going at this game completely ass backwards, I really don't

[Human Destroyer]

I really don't see PV as scum for everything that went down yesterday. HD was reading townish yesterday, but his stance on PV could have been blue scum not wanting to touch the neighborhoods. Looking at his vote history since the neighborhoods came out, the only neighbor he's voted is ThAd, who claimed a town PR.

Y'know, you never answered why you found my stance on PV townish in the first place. It'd be cool if you did.
Also I outright declared a townread on CTD (a neighbor) and a scumread on ThAd (a neighbor) so...what was I avoiding?

Bulbazak was townish yesterday, but with ThAd confirmed, I keep going back to the failed shot on him with a red scum doc. If HD is the last blue (and so the only likely source of a roleblock) he could have blocked ThAd's shot on him, hence the two different failure types ThAd claimed.

And then proceed to ask a question involving said roleblock that confirms the mislynch I want to push as town?
Sounds like a great idea.

[Human Destroyer]

eh fuck it, I really just don't want to think about this game right now

maybe tomorrow

[Human Destroyer]

Bulbazak was townish yesterday, but with ThAd confirmed, I keep going back to the failed shot on him with a red scum doc. If HD is the last blue (and so the only likely source of a roleblock) he could have blocked ThAd's shot on him, hence the two different failure types ThAd claimed.

And then proceed to ask a question involving said roleblock that confirms the mislynch I want to push as town?
Sounds like a great idea.

Yes, because scum wouldn't do townie things to look town.

Irrelevant; the point is that it's a legitimately bad move as a scum roleblocker to do this in the first place.
There's a difference between trying to look town and being flat-out counterproductive to a goal.

[Human Destroyer]

ugh, I'm just going to sheep desperado at this point

VOTE: Nacho

[Human Destroyer]

Why? Are you that convinced by a Nacho-scum case? Or are you just trying to skate by for as long as possible?

Honestly? Both.

The first one has a much nicer ring to it though, so I'll stick with it if you don't mind.

[Human Destroyer]

also, completely off-topic, but mastin I am totally stealing your votecount style because it is the sexiest thing ever

<<< I noticed. It would appear, in fact, that a lot of your mod posts on the front page of your game seem heavily inspired by this game...
But yes. My votecounts are sexy. I put a lot of work into them to make sure of it. >>>

[Human Destroyer]

Which mislynch would you have wanted to push as town?

I meant "confirms the person I am supposedly trying to mislynch to be town".

(i.e. ThAd)

[Human Destroyer]

PA picked up on something awesome that I'm going to quote again.

So ffery.

You really think Nacho is town?

Because...this is really shitty.

Really

shitty.

[Human Destroyer]

PA picked up on something awesome that I'm going to quote again.

So ffery.

You really think Nacho is town?

Because...this is really shitty.

Really

shitty.

Oh

My

God


A reach-out. Why didn't this happen on day 5? Or before that?

Because it didn't.

[Human Destroyer]

HD, there's something I'd like to talk about when you are around. One of our mutual past games.

I don't have a very consistent schedule, but I'm here right now.

Which one?

[Human Destroyer]

Which mislynch would you have wanted to push as town?

I meant "confirms the person I am supposedly trying to mislynch to be town".

(i.e. ThAd)

My theory is that you're blue scum and the source of ThAd not being able to kill Night Four. You came into Day Five, and your first content post was this:

VOTE: ThAd

oh please

you're telling me he's gone 4 nights without a single successful kill?

I call bullshit

Which is you using the fact that he claimed his kill didn't go through as a reason to think he was lying scum and push for his lynch.

Can you quote exactly what question you're talking about here, because I'm not following:

And then proceed to ask a question involving said roleblock that confirms the mislynch I want to push as town?

@Mod: In a theoretical situation where there is an X-Shot Vigilante, would he lose a shot if his target was protected? If he was roleblocked?

This one.

And again, if my whole strategy revolves around coming out swinging & trying to mislynch ThAd, why would I go confirm ThAd as town?

[Human Destroyer]

We evidently have 3 scum left. Who else would you lynch today?

Forgot about this.

Eh, I'm less sound on lynching Bulbazak, but I'd still go for it. Other than that...I don't have much of a clue. I still want to talk to penguin more, maybe PV? Not touching Desperado or you though.

I wouldn't cry if mara/mala was lynched, but at the same time it's not my preferred lynch at all.

[Human Destroyer]

Blue.

[Human Destroyer]

Yes.

A stalled HD wagon that people are getting cold feet on isn't going to do Nacho much good in the long run.

[Human Destroyer]

Not to mention the two people remaining he could probably get to go on the wagon were too busy lynching CTD to care (Bulbazak & ThAd).

[Human Destroyer]

I think my wagon was played out in that not enough people were willing to join it. It might not have been played out in terms of people actually wanting to lynch me, but as it was, it definitely wasn't growing anytime soon.

I'd go read that Mafia QT again, but I'm mildly lazy. Elaborate a bit more?

I understand that he went after me from the very beginning in that game, but that was a 9 player game. This started with what, 24 players? It also probably helps that, at least early on, you couldn't really call me (+ Om) an easy mislynch.

[Human Destroyer]

I think my wagon was played out in that not enough people were willing to join it. It might not have been played out in terms of people actually wanting to lynch me, but as it was, it definitely wasn't growing anytime soon.

I'd go read that Mafia QT again, but I'm mildly lazy. Elaborate a bit more?

I understand that he went after me from the very beginning in that game, but that was a 9 player game. This started with what, 24 players? It also probably helps that, at least early on, you couldn't really call me (+ Om) an easy mislynch.

He very quickly sorted the players into that game into lynchable/not, and figured how to keep a townbloc from forming effectively - e.g., working together on day 1. (and it worked. jesus christ did it work as far as any chance of getting him lynched on day 1). And he coached his scum partner on how to take you apart via the contrast in your posting styles. They faced insurmountable odds in that game, but the plan nacho came up with was really the best plan I can think of for stopping that town, and they executed it well.

I admit, it was a very good plan.

We still won and that game was fun as hell though.

[Human Destroyer]

Mk.

[Human Destroyer]

I'm not seeing where HD didn't work really hard to discredit ThAd and push his lynch in a way that lines up with scum playing on town paranoia. And him saying his reaction was towny, well. The posts I've seen just don't support that. He also avoided the neighborhoods aside from ThAd, like he didn't want to start whittling away at them outside of the claimed PR who wasn't on his team. With two decent town reads also reading him as scum, I'm willing to bet on HD being scum, very likely blue.

VOTE: Human Destroyer

like see the fact that you're ignoring everything I'm saying to push something that makes entirely no sense is scummy

[Human Destroyer]

His push on ThAd --> Push on Baezu when ThAd became obviously town.

I read back through that. The only thing that gives me a little pause is his not voting (e.g. bussing) CTD when the momentum shifted so hard. But, it could have been the speed of the shift.

It doesn't give me enough pause to change my mind.

For the record, my alignment shouldn't be relevant to whether I voted CTD or not; I had barely any access during that time and didn't post at all.

I also still stand by that I probably wouldn't have voted CTD.

[Human Destroyer]

VOTE: penguin_alien