Mini 368: Town Of Suspicion - Game over!

[petroleumjelly]

Let's see.

12-player game. 11 replacements. One modkill. One replaced mod. And it has taken about five months to finish two days. The players who have died most recently (Alko and TSQ) both

wanted

to die because they disliked the game so much, and there are still players in the game who would rather not be eating nails (see: me). There seem to be completely improbable roles for something which is supposed to be a Mini Regular game.

Why

has this game not been abandoned? This is disgusting. It is more of a chore than anything to force myself to even look at this game, since all it does is distract me from doing other things I actually enjoy.

Vote: Town of Suspicion

. DIE SCUM DIE.

[Kelly Chen]

I've decided this game won't be abandoned. I'm sorry if I was not clearer about this. This decision is one I do not want questioned in-thread. Feel free to PM me.

[petroleumjelly]

Would you modkill me if I continued to complain, Kelly?

[LuckayLuck]

PJ, wanna just lynch mith quickly now? Then we can play the decide-if-thok-is-scum or not game for the win

[petroleumjelly]

What's that one word?

Oh yeah. "No". Mass-claiming is clearly the best option here.

[Thok]

Not particularly happy with LL's last post. There are likely three scum here, not two.

PJ-what do you think of M4yhem, given how the alko wagon went?

[petroleumjelly]

Thok -

To be honest, I cannot tell the difference between M4yhem1 and M4yhem2; they both seem erratic, and I think I find his posts annoying (if not scummy) regardless of his alignment (since I found M4yhem1 scummy, and he turned out to be town, so I imagine I would get the same impression even if he were scum). I would have to reread the game in order to see if I can find a discernable difference.

But I guess that doesn't answer your exact question. I'm not completely sure what to think of it - I can understand that M4yhem might have a vendetta against the player he thought was "responsible" for his lynch (besides you, since he asserted that he believed his role-claim, if I'm remembering correctly). But I can also see that being an absurdly simple shield to hide behind to excuse his actions [note: this is one reason why I have decided that players should not rereplace into games where they have already died. Either the town wanted them dead, or some scum wanted them down; either way, somebody is not going be happy with them coming back, especially since they are not coming into the game with a tabula rosa).

I realize I am pretty much sitting on the fence here, but this is primarily because I can see absolutely any player as being scum in this game, and it's not a comforting feeling. I usually have about one or two people I think are very likely to be town, but I do not have that luxury here.

[Thok]

You don't think M4yhem was a lot more consistent on day 2? It was basically "Thok is scum/alko is scum/Thok is scum/alko is scum/alko is scum/alko is scum".

M4yhem day 1 had much more interest in lurkers. M4yhem day 1 would change his mind at a drop of a hat. M4yhem day 1 was suspicious of everybody. M4yhem day 2 didn't even mention mith or CTD except as a chance to press attacks on me/alko.

[petroleumjelly]

Hmm. Although people normally

do

have a better idea on who they want to lynch once there have been three deaths and revealings of alignment (although M4yhem already

knew

his own alignment, and I'm not sure what, if anything, he said/thought about Norinel off the top of my head), I didn't precisely think of it in that manner.

Is this town even deader than usual? Who is up for mass-claim, and how do we propose to go about it? There are a couple of tried-and-true methods:

1.) Going down/up the sign-up list (I would discourage this one the most)
2.) Popcorn method (choose one person to claim, then that person chooses the next, etc)
3.) Randomly, by a dice roll feature. I actually think a popcorn dice-roll would be preferable in this case, so that the choosing is still random, but scum can't anticipate when they have to claim.
4.) Try to have everybody on the site at the same time, and claim at the same time

I think I like #3 - I have seen #4 tried in at least one other game, and I'm pretty sure people "had something come up" so they couldn't post, blah blah (although I don't currently recall if those people were scum). Of course, Thok's target claim still has to be decided on when he is to claim that: before we claim, while we're claiming, or after we're done claiming. We would also need to decide whether or night people should claim night-targets/results while claiming, or simply their role.

Lots to do.

[pablito]

I would've expected M4yhem II to press further on Thok's claim. I've been thinking mostly since D2 that one of Thok-M4yhem II must be scum based on the claims and all. However, it's not a good idea to set up any dichotomies ever. But I'm still evaluating both of them anyway.

[petroleumjelly]

^ I realize you must have been posting while I posted. Please answer questions.

[pablito]

I can be good with #3.

[pablito]

Oh, and I just saw your last post as I just did that last post. I should start previewing all posts, not just the long ones.

Addendum: I want roles. I know it would be good to decide beforehand if we want people to give night choices, but I'm a bit undecided at the moment and kinda want to take it on a case-by-case basis. But if I have to give up my vow of ambivalence, then I'd have to go with reveal both role and night choices simultaneously.

[Thok]

I've said that I'm happy with either 3 or pablito choosing the order (since pablito/Relyte/LML has claimed vanilla townie already).

If you want, you can have me go first, have me go last, or just include me in the dice roll if it comes to that.

[al_kohaulec]

Gah! I've been missing posts. Gotta catch up

[al_kohaulec]

Ignore me, reading the wrong thread again

[pablito]

Be gone, vanilla spirit! Be gone!

[M4yhem]

On massclaiming: I honestly don't see what difference any of these methods will make. We've been talking about it so long that any scum paying attention will have thought of a claim already: that's assuming they weren't given safe claims to begin with. So, let's just get it over with. I volunteer to go first; or, pablito can choose. Whatever.

On the Alko wagon: My role is pretty easy to define. I was second to vote for him, and I loudly and frequently encouraged others to vote for him, because I thought he was scum. Turns out I was wrong. I've gotten used to being wrong, hence my lack of reaction.

On PJ: PJ, please stop complaining. We all know how you feel; you will not get your own way by repeating yourself and it shows a lack of respect for the mod when she has already made her choice. If you really hate it so much,

ask to be replaced

. You are a victim of your own stubborness and nothing else.

^--- No more of this content please.

On CES and Mith:
I find both of them pretty hard to read, actually. Could be scum, could be town.
I haven't yet seen a case which justifies lynching either of them before Luckay/Thok.

PJ has already said what I would have said in response to Luckay, so I think that's all for now. If you have any specific questions, ask away.

[pablito]

I'll start thinking of a list-order in case people want me to do make one.

[LuckayLuck]

I'm indifferent; fine to whatever order appears.

[Thok]

M4yhem, why do you find Luckay more suspicious than CTD (Now Channeldelibird)?

[mith]

Since other players have expressed equal hatred of the game and TSQ made no efforts to protect them in such a manner, this leads me to believe Alky would have been TSQ’s investigation.

I don't recall anyone else being

attacked

over apathy, at least at that time. Tsq had also voted for Thok earlier in the day; this could have been an attack on Thok's reasoning more than a defense of al. Like I said before, it's possible he did have a result on al, but I simply don't see it as anything near a sure thing, and I'm surprised that you do.

If nobody brought it up, that would certainly have worked to your advantage.

(WIFOM, I know) And you think I would count on that, if I thought it was as obvious as you're claiming?

Mith is nearly a lock to be mafia.
Townie consensus + I feel like the mafia tried to bandwagon him yesterday.

...

I'm tempted to not even bother with this, because it's so stupid, but there's a point to be made here. LL, yesterday you put out a theory that the scum planned to bus me, and it backfired by "having al_koh be the scum who ended up getting lynched". Now, after al has turned up innocent... you're using the same theory as half of your case against me. Is there

any

logic to your accusations, or are you just overeager scum who thinks I'm an easy target?

PJ & Pablito I'm considering town. Due to several posts.

How very vague. Would you care to go into any detail?

753 has already been commented on. Congrats, LL, you are now at the top of my list.

Be gone, vanilla spirit!

I could do with some vanilla spirits right now... or any spirits, for that matter...

I'm still reading as I can, and I'll probably hold back on a long analysis until there's claims to look at, but some quick thoughts on everyone:

LL - See above. Suggesting a quick lynch in a situation like this is the scummiest thing in the game so far. Probably the scummiest thing I've seen anywhere in a while, for that matter. That he's going after

me

is just icing on the scummy cake from my point of view.

CB - Hasn't moved down so much as LL has moved way up. Aside from attacking me with a couple of weak arguments and defending comments made against him, what did CTD really do? I don't recall him commenting that much on the players that actually got lynched.

Thok - Suspicious, though the WIFOM argument I mentioned yesterday still has me doubting. Aside from the hammer, his behavior early yesterday was questionable (his stance on answering pj's questions, his repeated misinterpretation of one of my posts). I could see him being linked with LL or CB (or both), but I'll save that analysis for later.

M4yhem - His behavior after replacement, especially today, has seemed a bit off. M4yhem1 was aggressive with votes and with arguments. M4yhem2 was aggressive in pushing for al to be lynched, but otherwise he has been more... acquiescent? I'm not sure if that's the word I'm looking for. Also, the "tell" I mentioned yesterday still bothers me, though apparently I am the only one that thinks anything of it.

pj - I've thought he was most likely innocent all game, and he's still low on the list, but the whole apathy thing is starting to feel like it might be a ruse. It doesn't exactly fit with his participation level. He's also been fence-sitting (though he has be very honest about doing so).

pablito - I found Relyte suspicious day 1, even after the claim, but since pablito came in my suspicions have lessened. It's possible he's just playing a great game as scum, but he's firmly at the bottom of the list.

Mass claim: I dislike the use of dice tags in Mafia games. I'm fine with pablito making a list. Whatever though, as long as we have a method and everyone sticks to it.

After 735, I'm satisfied we'll be able to tell whether the breadcrumb is legit. Thok should go last.

[Thok]

Since other players have expressed equal hatred of the game and TSQ made no efforts to protect them in such a manner, this leads me to believe Alky would have been TSQ’s investigation.

I don't recall anyone else being

attacked

over apathy, at least at that time. Tsq had also voted for Thok earlier in the day; this could have been an attack on Thok's reasoning more than a defense of al. Like I said before, it's possible he did have a result on al, but I simply don't see it as anything near a sure thing, and I'm surprised that you do.

For what it's worth, the fact that PJ has a decent guess on TSQ's target may be a weak scumtell for him; PJ would be more likely to deduce that fact if he was cophunting as scum last night.

(I also think he was bringing on certain of his comments [not explicitly menioned in deference to the mod] a little too strong.)

[petroleumjelly]

I have asked to be replaced. Good luck to the town, etc.

[Kelly Chen]

I'm on it. If anybody knows anybody...