Mini 1500:Narnia- The Lion,the Witch,and the Wardrobe Mafia

[killerjester]

yo whadup

[killerjester]

Ok I read like a few pages and all I got was that JKLM is town. His early reaction testing of Skelda-scum felt like a very genuine one. Go read it. Isn't that EXACTLY the feeling you get when you recognize someone's scum-meta? That's all for now. Gotta jet, peace.

[killerjester]

Personality testing now? ESTP

[killerjester]

How are you saying my play is devoid of substance when I've given a read on JKLM? I realize it's not an encyclopedia but it's certainly more than you misrep me for in #377. Also did you just pull that alienBRO scumread out of your magic hat? You've hardly mentioned the kid.

[killerjester]

Not to blow my load prematurely, but mnemonic is definitely scum.

A real town would fully claim in a position like his.

Including

name. Including all his bullshit reads that he's still withholding from us even at L-1. Like why the fuck is Broken Aquarium the ice queen? "For reasons untold," he tells us!

Hammertime.

VOTE: mnemonicdevice

How'd I do?

[killerjester]

Now why would you go and ruin a perfectly good reaction test.

[killerjester]

What is premature about it?

[killerjester]

Vote Counting guide for Noobs: He's at L-2

Starting to think both BA and MD are scum

[killerjester]

Actually L-3. I missed Hermy's unvote.

[killerjester]

Wait yea that is a little weird. Why did Hermy switch wagons?

[killerjester]

Wait yea that is a little weird. Why did Hermy switch wagons?

I switched wagons because, at this point, BA is certainly more scummy to me. His previous action of unvoting, and not putting his vote back when things were explained looks like mafia feebly trying to defend a scumpartner. Therefore I changed wagons. I'd still be happy with an MD lynch, but BA is definitely scummier to me.

(If it would help or be convenient in any way, then I will change my vote back. Just tell me to do so.)

See here's the problem. To insist that BA is scummier because of MD-scum, you must first show that MD is indeed scum. Furthermore, given that you thought they were both scum,

why would you take your vote off the scum that BA is clearly trying to protect?

When MD flips scum, Hermy dies next.

[killerjester]

(If it would help or be convenient in any way, then I will change my vote back. Just tell me to do so.)

This is surprisingly town. Kinda TOO helpful for scum, I think. She doesn't look worried or self conscious about just following the herd/trying to please people.

Last time I checked this was still a scumtell. Towns vote their biggest scumreads.

[killerjester]

The character is not "a Rumblebiffin giant." His name is Rumblebiffin. He is a giant. IF he had a town role PM, it might appear as

"Rumblebiffin" - Vanilla Townie

, and the flavor pertaining to him being a giant would be below, in the flavor text. And if this were the case, MD would supply us with the name "Rumblebiffin" when asked for his character's name. The answer we received, "a Rumblebiffin giant," might be indicative of a scum who googled his fakeclaim to see if he could add any flavor that might help sell his fakeclaim.

I won't be moving my vote.

[killerjester]

Flavor arguments are not very strong in the sense of whether the moderator would/would not include the role in the setup. I have seen more than a few games where a player was given an obscure character, and indeed was mislynched under the premise of outguessing the mod. In this scenario, you should turn your attention toward the

manner

of which MD claimed his flavor. I don't know about you, but my role PM uses the following structure.

"Name" - role + alignment

<pic>

Flavor/Abilities/Wincon

For MD to provide name AND flavor when he was only asked for his name feels unnatural.

[killerjester]

Using PM formatting to catch scum makes me feel very uncomfortable, especially when no sample PM was apparently given, at least publicly (I hadn't bothered to look before this moment).

I've never had an issue with it before.

Wait is pm formatting a trust tell???.

No. Trust telling is when a player states they always act one way as a certain alignment (eg: I never claim VT as scum). This leads to an increasing trust each game that if that player claims VT, they must be town. It's against the rules because it uses an out-of-game influence, namely previous games. Paraphrasing the PM format is perfectly okay because PMs are part of the game.

@JKLM, he was only explicitly asked to claim his name. That's what makes it so weird that he would claim being a giant as well, especially when that flavor information would not be located directly next to the name in his role PM.

[killerjester]

Flavor arguments are not very strong in the sense of whether the moderator would/would not include the role in the setup. I have seen more than a few games where a player was given an obscure character, and indeed was mislynched under the premise of outguessing the mod.

Actually fuck it. As long as you're willing to lynch MD I won't complain. Just try not to bring bad stigma onto the win wagon.

[killerjester]

UNVOTE

Claim is ok, I guess. Jester is really reaching with his legalistic arguments. Guy was asked to claim, and he did. If he had just said "Rumblebiffin" it would not have been at all helpful. So to lynch the guy for actually being helpful seems wrong headed.

What exactly is unhelpful about providing a name when asked for a nameclaim?

[killerjester]

If he had just said "Rumblebiifin", I for one -and almost certainly everyone else - would have said "Right, who the hell is that then?"
For the record I think you are town, but I just think you're over analyising and reaching here.

Ironically players still had to check Google because they had no fucking clue who Rumblebuffin was. Because, "I'm a Rumblebuffin giant!" isn't as helpful as you'd like to think it is. Maybe,

maybe

if he had provided more paraphrased flavor like, "I'm Rumblebuffin, the giant who broke the fuck out of the door to the witch's fortress," then I'd buy your story that he was actually trying to help us understand who his character is.

[killerjester]

I'm simply saying that he he wasked for a nameclaim and he gave it. The fact that he gave a bit more information seems a nonsense reason for lynching him.

Mafia is all about looking at actions and analyzing the varying motivations that might lead to them. As it stands, I can't fathom any town motivation for including information that would not naturally accompany a nameclaim.

This guy is scum. If you want me to look back and point out scummy things he's done then I'm positive I'll be able to find some, but it might look like confirmation bias since it's not the controlling reason I think he's scum.

[killerjester]

Ugh.... I misread my pm. I haven't seen narnia in a while, so I thought that there was a group of people called "rumblebuffin giants" and that I was one of them. I am a vanilla townie though.

No.

No no no no

Nono

No

No

No

There is no way you misread something like that. Flavor is nowhere near name.

Lynch it with fire. Please. Someone. Anyone. I'm not crazy I swear.

[killerjester]

Lynching MD is very much NOT a problem

[killerjester]

It's like this. You thought he was town because he was being helpful, right? Now that he has claimed this is not the case, what is your read on him? Do you seriously think that if you looked at your own rolename in your PM that you'd include flavor by mistake? I don't know how big the picture in his PM is, but I'd reckon its big enough that the two aren't side by side.

[killerjester]

Sweet can we get a hammer

[killerjester]

The last thing that goes through his head should be a fucking hammer. It's quite long overdue.

[killerjester]

Alright. Here are my thoughts: JK has pushed way too much on this case and he should die next.

Die "next"? Don't you mean die "instead"? This is a scumclaim if I ever heard one

[killerjester]

Ok yea anyone who unvoted Hermy really needs to rethink their life.

VOTE: Hermy

Distancing from the MD lynch
Trying to appear overly helpful
Seriously fucking bad wagon switch

Ah right Garmr didnt put him at L-1. He is now at L-1 though. Someone unvote.

And why exactly does somebody need to unvote? We'd like to see his reaction.

You're confirming my suspicions of a BA, Moz, Mnemonic scumteam.

*5 posts earlier*

Broken Aquarium unvotes his scumpartner when there is a strong possibility of him getting lynched. The vote is then not put back. Noted.

[*implied unvote of MD*]

VOTE: Broken Aquarium

[killerjester]

1. It's called my playstyle.

2. Yea of course I wanted my scumread lynched.

3. Please listen.

4. What do you want me to say? That you're a fucking moron?

5. Post 283? This?

vote gamr

Like actually, what?

6. She offered to change her vote if the town thought it would be helpful. She offered to change her vote. SHE OFFERED TO CHANGE HER VOTE. Why the fuck would town ever offer to stop voting their biggest scumread. That is the point I was making.

7. Post 544? This?

Can't really see it myself. BA has been scum hunting quite hard all game. Hammer was fair enough since most of us had given up on MD.

No offense but are you just making these post numbers up?

8. Actually I was offering to go find some more reasons to vote MD if someone were to ask for them.

[killerjester]

1. >implying you know a goddamn thing about my scum meta

2-5. Really bad opinions

6. Time was not running out (7 days remained at the time of Hermy's statement) and BA was not in danger of being lynched.

7. The context is different. In mine, my top scumread dies

first

, and Hermy dies next. In MD's context JK (later correct to KJ) dies next. So then who dies

first

? Presumably himself. So then the question came to me, why would town ever agree to be lynched first? They know themselves to be town. It's like as bad as self-hammering as town.

8. Can you explain how this even remotely relates to a point I've made against Hermy.

[killerjester]

Can't tell is Skelda is scum or just really bad town.

[killerjester]

Garmr's town tho. I'm working on this new towntell called "Uhh HELLO! I'm VOTING you!"

Prod received.

I wonder why KJ hasnt reacted to my vote.

DP was town in this game.

Compare to this

Hold it

KillerJester what the fudge. I just voted you and gave my reasons why you were scum and you blatantly ignored my post.

[killerjester]

Simple. If Hermy flips town then matt dies. We lynch a scum either way.

[killerjester]

It's possible they could both be scum

Then we STILL lynch a scum, maybe two

they could both be town.

I've never seen town fake a PR for anything other than reaction testing.

[killerjester]

yo matt what's the latest

[killerjester]

Or now. That's good for me.

[killerjester]

Preliminary, I'd be willing to lynch anyone besides JKLM, Garmr, and projectmatt. I'm hoping last night's investigation can help my PoE.

Where the fuck are you matt?

[killerjester]

Ok matt might be scum.

[killerjester]

Ok matt might be scum.

That seems super unlikely to me. It does, however, seem like what scum would want us to think.

In that case it would also be what we want scum to think we think.

He's not a good lynch for today, but I'm curious why he waited to reveal his investigation, and why he hasn't told us the reasons for checking BA over other players

[killerjester]

If you answer questions not meant for you one more fucking time I will toss my townread on you out the goddamn 12th story window.

[killerjester]

Who the fuck is the votestealer

[killerjester]

Yeah, probably best not to fake results as cop as people might then doubt your claim. But anyway, I'm 99% sure your town so it doesnt matter.
I've continued my meta research, and KJ is now in the 99% certain town camp.
So I refuse to lynch Garmr and KJ today.
be good to increase activity, low activity is great for scum.

Cards on the table time, I'm suspicious of KJ.

VOTE KJ

lol okay

Please explain how this makes sense.

[killerjester]

Which town game put me in the "99% certain" camp? What made you so sure? List specific similarities if you can

[killerjester]

I think it was the last completed game you were town in? Not sure, I'll dig it out later.
But I note how you STILL haven't given any thoughts on whats going on.

My current thoughts are that you're making the laziest, opportunistic push onto an easy target. You haven't provided any examples of why you thought I was "99% town", though one might think such a strong opinion would be more memorable. And for some reason you're so uptight about my lack of reads (though I've given no less than three) that you seem to forget I'm scumhunting to clear up my position on the other five players.

You want another read? I have one. You are scum.

VOTE: mozamis

[killerjester]

I think it was the last completed game you were town in? Not sure, I'll dig it out later.
But I note how you STILL haven't given any thoughts on whats going on.

My current thoughts are that you're making the laziest, opportunistic push onto an easy target. You haven't provided any examples of why you thought I was "99% town", though one might think such a strong opinion would be more memorable. And for some reason you're so uptight about my lack of reads (though I've given no less than three) that you seem to forget I'm scumhunting to clear up my position on the other five players.

You want another read? I have one. You are scum.

VOTE: mozamis

You expressed no suspicion of mozamis until he voted for you?

OMGUS much?

You shouldn't use big words if you don't know what they mean.

How about you address the actual points in my post?

[killerjester]

Hey mozamis what's with you? You had a pretty big hardon for my reads, but now that I've given one you completely glossed over it.

[killerjester]

But you see I'm not voting you because of your vote on me, I'm voting you because of the manner of which you have done so. It's a delicate difference, easily mislabeled as OMGUS by lazy/bad/scum players, but it's distinct. It's also to date what you have failed to address.

So I'll ask you again.

Where the fuck is this town-game you can't see to find?
Though you've looked at it on two separate occasions

@ KJ yeah I thought you were a town based on 1 game I read where you were town, and thought you were pretty similar here. But I think you must be scum, partly due to P.O.E.

And when I looked at that game again,

I noticed how you were less aggresive, and how you gave more content.
And I note you left out my other quote, asking for your reads and analysis.
You have had virtually nothing to say all day about the game.

And,

Yeah, probably best not to fake results as cop as people might then doubt your claim. But anyway, I'm 99% sure your town so it doesnt matter.
I've continued my meta research, and KJ is now in the 99% certain town camp.
So I refuse to lynch Garmr and KJ today.
be good to increase activity, low activity is great for scum.

Cards on the table time, I'm suspicious of KJ.

VOTE KJ

Where the fuck did the 99% town come from? Be as specific as you can.

Where the fuck did your suspicions originate? Cite your original read changes that led to POE and show how the posts listed for your meta research no longer hold true.

[killerjester]

Are you a fucking idiot?

[killerjester]

You realize the votestealer is going to hammer me with smarg's vote the moment he logs on, don't you?

[killerjester]

UNVOTE: KJ

I want to be sure.

Cool Skelda's town.

[killerjester]

A scumplayer would
1. Know which alignment controls the votestealer
2. Not have a need to "be sure" about the unvote if the votestealer is scum. Ff for some reason the unvote failed and I was hammered anyway, he could play it off as, "Everyone saw that I tried to unvote!"
and 3. Not give a fuck if I was hammered by a town votestealer

To answer your question Skelda, votestealer could be either alignment.

[killerjester]

Yea fuck it lynch me I'm just a VT. Literally no one thinks I'm town so even if I survive the lynch today I'll probably get us fucked down the road. My flavor is that I'm Susan Pevensie and Father Christmas made me a real badass at archery.

Lost my townread on JKLM because of his disappearing act. He could very possibly be scum. PeaceBringer as well. They both snuck onto my wagon and vanished into thin fucking air.

Mozamis is probably town, he's responded well to my pressure and is generally active and pushing the game forward despite all the active lurking going around.

Skelda's still town.

Garmr's still town.

I want Matt to be town but his investigation on BA last night was pretty fucking bad considering his STILL hasn't claimed WHY he chose BA.

Rach is tough to read. I'd say lynch her if we haven't won after lynching JKLM/Peace/Matt.

Is that everyone? Oh, smargaret. Probably town. Gut I guess.

UNVOTE:

Good luck fuckers

[killerjester]

Yo matt did you miss your cue?

I want Matt to be town but his investigation on BA last night was pretty fucking bad considering his

STILL

hasn't claimed

WHY

he chose BA

.

[killerjester]

I was having trouble reading him. If you have any interest in staying alive today you should probably vote JKLM.

Get better at being a cop noob

VOTE: JKLM

[killerjester]

Yea seriously smarg. Mozamis is like 99% town.

[killerjester]

Well I mean at this point JKLM is getting lynched. The only question now is if he wants to give us his reads instead of running around in circles wondering why there's rope around his neck.

[killerjester]

That's 2 confirmed town, right up there^

I agree with this post, even if JKLM isn't some ridiculously overpowered bomb.

[killerjester]

I'm lol'ing at the Matt-kill. Game-solved.

smargaret
RachMarie
PeaceBringer

2 of these 3 are scum because Skelda, Garmr, and mozamis are all town. And we have one mislynch available to us.

VOTE: PeaceBringer

If you guys prefer smarg or Rach to die first just let me know and we can do that.

[killerjester]

^ Oh reasoning being that if smarg were scum she'd be in a bad position to bus today, and if she's town then the scumteam is Peace/Rach. PeaceBringer is scum in either scenario.

[killerjester]

Hmm

UNVOTE:

Should we just mass claim? It could help identify which alignment holds the votestealer (eg: if no one claims votestealer then we can safely assume it is a scumrole). Would let us know if we're in LyLo or not.

[killerjester]

I've already claimed. Here it is once more for posterity.

Yea fuck it lynch me

I'm just a VT

. Literally no one thinks I'm town so even if I survive the lynch today I'll probably get us fucked down the road. My flavor is that I'm Susan Pevensie and Father Christmas made me a real badass at archery.

[killerjester]

smargaret - Edmund Pevensie, Miller

alienBRO - Father Christmas, VT

Garmr - Mrs. Macready, VT
Skelda - Tumnus, Town Tracker
mozamis - Mrs. Beaver, VT
killerjester - Susan Pevensie, VT
RachMarie - Peter Pevensie, 1-shot Votesteal

Broken Aquarium - Lucy Pevensie, Town Doctor

Hermy - The White Witch, Mafia JOAT

PeaceBringer - The Wardrobe, Odd-night Jailer

JKLM - Mr. Beaver, VT
mnemonicdevice - Rumblebuffin Giant, VT
projectmatt - Aslan, 1-shot Sane Cop

[killerjester]

VOTE: PeaceBringer

[killerjester]

Yea scum smarg would probably just claim VT since the cop is dead and no one else claimed a coplike role.

[killerjester]

If Rach is scum she's probably something like an even-night votestealer so it might be smarter to lynch her, but honestly I can't think of a single scenario where Peace is town. I dunno I'm cool with lynching either what do you guys think?

[killerjester]

I'm lol'ing at the Matt-kill. Game-solved.

smargaret

RachMarie
PeaceBringer

2 of these 3 are scum

because Skelda, Garmr, and mozamis are all town

. And we have one mislynch available to us.

VOTE: PeaceBringer

If you guys prefer smarg or Rach to die first just let me know and we can do that.

She pretty had a probably town read on smarg in her only other post of her. I think there is some subconscious play as well. Smarg is always listed first when she's mentioned as a scum read but last when she's a town read. This could mean he knows she's scum but is distancing himself away from Smarg. The scum read doesn't last long how ever

I enlarged the reason why smarg was in my lynchpool for the reading impaired. That doesn't mean I read smarg as scum, that means I read everyone else stronger as town.

Additional reasons why you're wrong:
- Votestealer, Cop, Tracker, Doctor, Jailer is fucking STACKED for town. Unless you're doing role madness (as in, everyone has a PR), you don't give beneficial PRs to half the town players
- If town DID have all those roles, scum would have to be packing some SERIOUS heat. However, smargaret was tracked going nowhere last night. That means 1. She did not submit the scumkill, 2. She does not have an activated-PR, and 3. Her scumpartner does not have an activated-PR (otherwise she would have submitted the kill, allowing her partner to use their PR).

[killerjester]

I'm sorry but (1-shot Cop, Tracker, Doctor, Miller vs JOAT, Odd-Jailer, Even-Votestealer) makes waaaaaaaay more sense than (1-shot Cop, 1-shot Votestealer, Tracker, Doctor, Odd-Jailer vs JOAT, Ninja, ???)

Garmr I don't know why you're trying so hard to throw a won-game but try looking at it this way. If Rach is the even-night votestealer for scum then today is LyLo. This possibility MUST be addressed TODAY by either lynching Rach or her most-likely scumpartner (imo Peace).

[killerjester]

Moz are you fucking serious. If you're calling smarg scum then town DOESN'T have a miller. And I've already detailed why it's unlikely that smarg is scum of any kind, if town doesn't have a miller to balance out the PRs then scum probably has a lot of PRs. And unless you think smarg is the widely underused Ninja (if so, what's really the point of clogging up a game already chock-full of PRs with the nullifying Tracker/Ninja combo?) then she has to be town.

Garmr's definitely town. He's just also wrong.

[killerjester]

If

you guys prefer smarg or Rach to die first just let me know and we can do that.

I'd rather lynch Peace first. I am most confident that he is scum.

[killerjester]

Righto

one scum

? Does that mean the second scum is off the wagon? Peace himself?

[killerjester]

While this man is concerned about how he appears to town, and is keeping all his eggs in a line to make sure his claimed PR agrees with his reads, notice how he is not currently scumhunting. It's clear as day where his priorities lie.

[killerjester]

Skelda get yo ass in here

[killerjester]

smarg/Rach prob

[killerjester]

I don't really read skelda as scum. You're 100% town tho so I'd be cool with a smarg lynch simply because of how unlikely a skelda/rach team seems. Thoughts?

[killerjester]

Is there a big difference in lynching smarg first? I see the points against Skelda but I'm much more confident that smarg HAS to be scum.

[killerjester]

Yea Skelda is pretty towny with those last few posts. Let's axe smarg, we all seem to agree on her.

[killerjester]

It's lylo bro.

[killerjester]

I'll vote when I'm good and ready.

[killerjester]

Well today's easy, you can just sheep me and you'll do fine. But once scum see that I'm a fucking God at LyLo they'll realize they should have killed me much earlier. So you might have to pull-through for us once I'm gone.

Here's why we're lynching smarg today.

She states suspicions on Skelda due to night-kill analysis.
She furthers suspicions on Skelda due to setup speculation.
She defends herself with setup speculation.

What do all of these things have in common?

*entire classes raises their hands*

Yes, Jimmy?

"There's no scumhunting in any of them!"

Very good!

[killerjester]

I'm prepared to vote smarg if this game doesn't start moving somewhere soon

[killerjester]

If you expect to live long enough to "hash out" the other scum tomorrow I suggest you give us your

full

readlist today.

[killerjester]

I want Rach's reads then we can end the day.

[killerjester]

I got prodded? Disappointed as goddamn fuck with this game

VOTE: smarg

[killerjester]

Make sure you follow me tonight so I can be confirmed town tomorrow, or at least force scum to kill someone who isn't Garmr.