Scummies Ideas, Suggestions and Comments Thread

[GuyInFreezer]

The person who makes games more fun to play in, not just funny or nice or whatever but people that make the game better by their presence.

The person who makes the site a better place just by posting
The funniest poster
The most intelligent poster

Aren't these basically the same thing?

[GuyInFreezer]

The game that had the most original idea behind it

The moderator who comes up with the most original ideas

These are basically the same too.

The game that used power roles the most effectively

And this I think should be included in the teamwork part.

[xRECKONERx]

My proposed changes would see a breakdown something like this:

Player Awards

Paragon of Mafia Hunters:

BoW award for best overall town player for the year

Don Corleone:

BoW award for best overall scum player for the year

Rising Star:

BoW award for the player who had the most prolific rise/breakout year (could be newbie, could be a veteran who went unnoticed until now)

Best Replacement

:

BoW award for the player who has been the most positive contributor in replacing into games

Most Enjoyable Player:

BoW award for the funniest or just the most pleasant player to be around

in game

Best Town:

Single game award for best town group performance in one game

Best Scumteam:

Single game award for best scum group performance in one game

Best Third Party:

Single game award for best third party performance in one game

Kodak Moment:

Most memorable moment from a game (fakeclaim, funny post, hilarious sequence of events, etc)

Moderator Awards

Smooth Operator:

BoW award for best overall moderator for the year

Best Flavor:

Single game thread award for best written flavor

Best Mutation:

This could be a new role, new mechanic, or something in between that you felt really stood out this year and was a great addition to the game of mafia

Best Setup:

Single game award for strong setup design; balance, ingenuity, role interaction, theme integration, etc will all be considered

Site Awards

Professor Mafia:

BoW category awarded to the person who did the most to help teach/explain/theorycraft the game of mafia; this could be a single big MD post, or the sum of all of a person's MD posts for the year, or someone's work as an IC

Community Contributor:

BoW category awarded to the person who made the site a better place to be through their efforts; this can be related to social events such as RadioScum or hosting a meet, but can also relate to actual work done on the forums to improve the overall community experience on the site, IE updating a big section of the wiki, writing an app to do votecounts, engaging in mass data collection efforts & presenting said data

Outstanding Mish Mash Game:

Best game run for the year in the Mish Mash Subforum

Name in Orange:

Only handed out certain years when the reds/admins see a particular user do a lot of unseen work backstage

Game of the Year:

The replacement for Most Enjoyable Game; while enjoy-ability is still a factor, judges will also consider every aspect of the game. How well did the town play? How well did the scum play? Was the setup good? Was it balanced? How timely was the mod with VCs/deadlines? Was the flavor good? How about replacements? This award won't go to anyone in particular but will instead just title that game as "Game of the Year 20__".

[xRECKONERx]

I have Best Replacement highlighted because I'm not sure it's even really needed (but I'm fine with it staying).

I feel this set of awards and the descriptors included is broad enough to encompass every aspect of the site, but each category is narrow enough to not be redundant against another category. I also feel the number of Player Awards vs Mod Awards vs Site Awards is a little more appealing, as twice as many player awards over mod awards makes sense when there are where more players than mods. Professor Mafia / Community Contributor cover literally all out of game activity on the site; Mish Mash/NiO aren't even the purview of the SSC; and GotY fixes some of the big problems with Most Enjoyable Game.

Plus, this will give the judges sixteen categories to judge which is manageable. If we go with mine/Faraday's idea of having rolling judging all year for non-BoW categories, then only eight categories will need to be judged at the end of the year which will make the judging process much easier.

[quadz08]

I like it, generally. I'd like to still have a mish-mash award in there, but otherwise, I like it.

[zoraster]

1. To those saying the things I said were similar, yeah. But as I said, the point was to brainstorm the things I think would be nice if we could recognize and then from there decide one what actually works as an award category. It wasn't "all these should be separate categories."

2. Is there any way we can get at the difference between "Best Mutation" and "Best Setup." I think in our heads we can understand how they differ, but when it comes to actually judging they're often hard to separate. I know this might be controversial, but because the Best Mutation/Mechanic is so often a large theme (only once has it been awarded to a Mini, Magua's original Marketplace Mafia), maybe just explicitly say that Best Setup should go to a Mini, Micro, Open, Newbie (if someone designs a better newbie setup, for example) or Large Normal game? This would cut down on overlap a lot.

Right now, my focus is kind of on trying to find better demarcations between awards. Trying to make it so that fewer times do we go "well. It's okay as a ______ but it also would work as a _______" The Best Mutation category is a good start. I don't mind if a game or player wins multiple awards, but I'd like to be able to look at the person or game in question and say, "yeah they did both these distinct things so well they deserved the award" rather than "this idea was so cool that it bled over into two categories where it dominated"

[quadz08]

I don't like the idea of making games that are only Theme because they have non-mafia flavor ineligible for Best Setup. We could do Best New Open Setup, Best Normal, and Best Theme, and not necessarily give them all out every year?

Or maybe a better idea: Best Non-Theme Setup Design, which includes everything that could be considered normal if it weren't for flavor?

[zoraster]

i wasn't discounting mini themes from the best setup, just large themes. Even flavored theme games are difficult to analyze from a setup perspective when they're large. There's just so much that can go on. But Mini Themes are often indistinguishable from Mini Normals except they have some flavor attached and they're run by somewhat more experienced moderators. I think it'll be a lot easier to make apples to apples comparisons if large themes are excluded.

How about two categories:

1. Best Setup and/or Mutation - Theme Category
2. Best Setup - Non-Theme Category

This way, there's no argument that something is a mechanic and isn't really the setup or whatever because that's all supposed to be considered. Frankly, as a moderator that focuses on mechanics, I think the setup is PART of the mechanic. I don't design a game with a new mechanic and think "okay. Now what power roles do i throw in here?" I craft the power roles to use the mechanic and the mechanic to use the power roles and so forth.

The downside to the proposal above is that I think it'll make flavored but not themed games less likely to win the award, but that's probably okay with me. We could probably even include a clause that says games that are normal but for flavor (i.e. the game would fit normal guidelines BUT FOR the flavor, nothing else) can be considered in the non-theme category.

Mostly I'm just trying to get rid of this idea that the mutation and the setup are distinct things when in a well designed game they're not.

[quadz08]

I'm fine with those two categories

[Faraday]

Relatively normal theme games are probably going to be ignored, with that.

[Faraday]

I know this might be controversial, but because the Best Mutation/Mechanic is so often a large theme (only once has it been awarded to a Mini, Magua's original Marketplace Mafia),

Is this a problem? How often has best setup also gone to large themes? (I think if that was also high it might be worth looking in to?). A large is more likely to try new mechanics, because they're hard to fit in small games.

[quadz08]

Mechanic/Mutation will pretty much always to go to either a large or a micro because of balance constraints

[Venmar]

Mechanic/Mutation went to a Mini Theme this year (Mind Reader)

[zoraster]

I know this might be controversial, but because the Best Mutation/Mechanic is so often a large theme (only once has it been awarded to a Mini, Magua's original Marketplace Mafia),

Is this a problem? How often has best setup also gone to large themes? (I think if that was also high it might be worth looking in to?). A large is more likely to try new mechanics, because they're hard to fit in small games.

no, it's not a problem. I'm just recognizing the realities of the situation and trying to get at different things that can be recognized while still making our life easier by giving more distinct categories.

My point isn't to limit mechanic to large themes. It's to remove them from consideration from best setup. But I think my second suggestion was better.

[Eleven]

I'd say the bigger problem is that good normal games tend to be overlooked, but is "Best Normal/Open" a thing we need?

(Like, looking through it, best setup goes to a mini theme majority of the time)

Or "Best theme" "Best Normal/Open" and have "Best Mechanic/Role" seperate? Dunno.

[zoraster]

my concern with something like best normal/open is that it won't get nominations, not that it isn't deserving of an award.

[Venmar]

I don't really think splitting Large Games from Smaller games for Best Setup and Best Mechanic is really necessary? If we do that, we might as well also make one for Micros and Normal games and then it gets out of hand if you keep splitting it.

[zoraster]

that wasn't the suggestion, was it? anyway, slippery slope is a logical fallacy. If it got the point where it "got silly" we stop splitting.

I'll be honest: I don't think a Mini-Normal game should win a scummy for best setup. I just don't think there's enough to differentiate one mini-normal from another to make judging meaningful. I don't want to disqualify mini-normals from a category because of that -- why bother and i'm willing to be proven wrong -- but I'm not really willing to put much emphasis on increasing their nominations or wins.

[xRECKONERx]

1. Best Setup and/or Mutation - Theme Category
2. Best Setup - Non-Theme Category

dear god no

Like, Best Setup is Best Setup. This year's best setup went to a mini theme but it was a very normal mini theme. Last year it went to a large theme that was crazy. You're basically trying to shoehorn nominations for normal games because BUT NORMAL SETUPS ARE PEOPLE TOO when it's totally up to the people who nominate these games. If there's a standout normal game or open setup that comes down the pipes, then it can be submitted. It's not like we disallow it right now.

[xRECKONERx]

I'll be honest: I don't think a Mini-Normal game should win a scummy for best setup.

I agree with this, though.

Normal games are pretty identical to each other at a glance, and I guarantee if you look at one hard enough you can find another one that has already been run that's exactly the same. This is because normal games only have so much freedom in their design process due to the whitelist/blacklist.

I do, however, want to see more Open Games get nominated for best setup, as I think there are some cool new ideas for open setups that could easily win if they were nominated.

Basically, I expect Best Setup to go to a non-normal game (Open/Theme/Micro)... "Best Mutation", in my new ideal world, would be given to a new role -or- a new mechanic that added a lot to the game. It has nothing to do with Best Setup, actually.

[Eleven]

Last year it went to a large theme that was crazy.

Didn't it go to hito? (The abarat that won was a mini, think that was last year, right?)

[Faraday]

Not that it really matters, I think best setup is fine as is, is my point.

[xRECKONERx]

i thought abarat was a large, mb

[xRECKONERx]

Hey guys -- the call for SSC members is up! Think about applying if you want to help out!

[Scummies]

Scummies Steering Committee announces 2014 changes

First off, the Scummies Steering Commitee is proud to announce that

Untrod Tripod

and

Venmar

have joined our ranks! We're very excited to have some new blood on the crew and hope it'll allow us to keep on making the Scummies a great MafiaScum tradition! We'd like to think

Cogito Ergo Sum

,

AGar

, and

SpyreX

for their work these past couple of years and want to make sure everyone recognizes that without them, the Scummies wouldn't have been completed.

Second off, after deliberation and discussion among the current SSC members (Untrod Tripod, zoraster, xRECKONERx, Faraday, and Venmar), we're announcing the following changes/clarifications for the upcoming year (and following years):

Spoiler: Award Changes

Best New Role

&

Best Mechanic / Mutation

are being merged into a singular category, encapsulated by the name

Best Mutation

. We felt this change was a healthy one to keep the viability of the categories alive. Sometimes, it is hard to distinguish where a mechanic ends and a role begins. A great example of this would be the winner of Best Mechanic / Mutation this year, OhGodMyLife's Mind Reader Mafia. While the way the setup works is actually hinging on a special

mechanic

, the Mind Reader itself could have been nominated as best role... but, the role wouldn't work without the mechanic being considered. Similarly, in 2010, while the Tentaculat won Best Role, it was such a heavy role integrated into the mechanics of the game that it couldn't be separated form the core structure of the game itself. The aim of both categories was simple: award brilliant innovation in the game of mafia. We feel this new merged category will encourage healthy competition for the award, as well as unifying the two categories under a more concrete ideal goal.

The

Best IC Player

category is being rolled into

Professor Mafia

, and the definition for the award is changing. The change for this award was two-fold. Number one, we saw a dearth of nominees and competition in the Best IC category and realized it was mostly the same one or two players being nominated every year. We didn't want the award to get stale, as we felt putting in time to help people learn to play the game was valuable and should be rewarded. But... number two, Professor Mafia was already a role that, in essence, rewarded people for contributing to the mafia community by helping people learn or understand the game better! With Professor Mafia being a Body of Work award anyway, we think allowing contributions as an IC in a newbie game to be considered in the judging process will allow for a wider array of nominees and keep the judging for the category away from being a contest of "Whose one-off theory thread was bigger this year?"

In addition

, we are stripping the following from the "Professor Mafia" award:

• Best Contribution to Mafia Discussion/The wiki
  -> Best Teacher & Contributor to Mafia Discussion
  
• Contribution to the wiki will no longer be considered for the award
  
• Judges will focus on body of work more than a single individual thread or post

We are stripping out the wiki portion of Professor Mafia, because we are expanding the scope of

Community Contributor

. We felt focusing this award previously on the purely social atmosphere on the site was a bit too narrow. Now, the award will focus on contribution to the site in any way. This can mean someone who does a bunch of work updating wiki pages; or, it can mean someone who creates a really great discussion thread (see: Ether giving out avatars); or, it can mean a community member who hosted a meet and provided a home for wayward scummers; or, it can mean someone who organized Skype or chat mafia games to keep the community playing. We feel this change was probably

intended

when we designed the award, but not communicated well enough since we did not want to step on the toes of Professor Mafia. Both awards will be healthier now.

The last big award change is that of changing

Most Enjoyable Game

to a more fitting title... the

Game of the Year

! Watching the judges gnash their teeth in judging this category every year was painful, to say the least. If you did not play in a game, how much can you

really

judge whether a game was enjoyable or not? Did the players say it was enjoyable? Well, of course they did, they nominated the award... which means the category comes down to a very broad, loose, subjective quality that nobody has ever been able to really define. This award was supposed to be the "big one"... it's the award that finishes off our ceremony every year, and it's supposed to be our Scummies equivalent of "Best Picture". This new category will certainly consider if a game was enjoyable or not in the judging process, but it will consider EVERYTHING. How well did the players perform? Was the flavor written well? Did the setup fire on all cylinders? Were there any new/interesting mechanics introduced during this game? Was the moderator efficient with vote counts and prods? Did the activity level stagnate? How well did the reviewers balance the setup? Were there memorable moments in the game? Every aspect of a game will be considered... think of it as the catch-all award. It doesn't have to be the BEST at every category, but it has to do enough things right to warrant a victory. Maybe another game won Best Flavor... but the Game of the Year's flavor is still good, AND this game had fantastic performances, whereas maybe the Best Flavor game didn't. This will be the game we point back to and re-read for years to come when we want to see the best that MafiaScum had to offer that year.

Third, we're going to try and streamline the process for judging and writing the Scummies so we do not have another emergency last-minute ceremony. We've found that judging these categories has been immensely time consuming and even giving a group of people two months to deliberate sometimes isn't enough. We are aiming to find a group of

year round judges

, assisted by the Scummies Steering Commitee, to judge new nominations as they arrive. While this will not be possible for the Body of Work categories, it will make the judging for single-thread categories much simpler. I.E., Game1 is nominated for Best Scum Team. They are the de facto winners, until Game2 is nominated. The year-round judging crew will decide between the two games right then and put one through as the "finalist". When Game3 comes in, it will be judged against whichever of the previous two games was found to be better. Not only will this break up the judging process into small, bite-sized chunks and make it easier to manage, it will also make the process a lot more structured and less vague. Similarly, we are attempting to devise a system to write small portions of the ceremony throughout the year to keep the end year workload to a minimum.

Thanks for reading, and if you have any thoughts, or questions, we'd love to hear them!