Standard Roles for Newbie Games?

[Mr. Flay]

Whoa, cool. Is that my most recent iteration (328), Stoof? I think I've worked out most of the bugs by then...

I agree with mith that some of the wording is still shaky - I'm especially displeased with "But, you do have a vote, which is quite powerful (though no more powerful than anyone else's vote).", but it's been in my Townie PM

forever

. MeMe should chime in here too, if possible, as she's run twice as many newbies as I have.

Also, is it worth wikilinking the role names, the word Quack, etc, or is that just confusing?

[Mr. Flay]

I added those clauses because a) I was getting a lot of Docs who wanted to protect themselves, and b) Cops in Newbies should know that they are sane/reliable, but not try to extrapolate that to every other game they play.

I agree with CES' change from Scum to Mafia. That's my default because I tend to make (non-newbie) games with multiple factions, and the townie PM thus references Scum by default.

[Mr. Flay]

Another question is whether it's standard or not for mods to allow NG Mafia to talk during confirmations. Thanks for the updates Stoofer.

[Mr. Flay]

Hi PJ, that's Not Very Helpful. They've already got the same setup and flavor (or should); titles are irrelevant, and the rest is gameplay, which mods

shouldn't be interfering with

.

If you see anything in what we're trying to do that DOES impact gameplay, please let us know. Personally, I'd

like

to see a sitewide discussion on deadlines, as i think we sometimes let games linger on too much, but that's for another thread...

Stoofer, I like that change too. "(if that someone is not your partner or yourself, that will make things much easier)" is probably an unnecessary clause, but I find many people have NEVER been scum before...

[Mr. Flay]

I'm down with a checklist and some samples as being a good compromise, for the record. All I was saying earlier is that if mith wants to enforce the Normal means Normal for New York & The Road to Rome, I will support that.

[Mr. Flay]

I'm seeing a lot of Straw Man and Slippery Slope fallacies in this thread ; aside from the initial title of the thread (which mith rapidly changed), no one is talking or even

hinting

about standardizing anything but Newbie games, and only

certain

aspects of those.

[Mr. Flay]

Hmmm, first post in this thread was Wednesday, April 11th. First post in the Normal Game thread was Sunday, April 8th. Search is down so I can't prove it, but mith's firm word that Newbie Games were to be Normal was at least as far back as last fall, but I'm pretty sure it was before that. Stoofer's opening post for New York games was last edited Wednesday Feb 28th, 2007. The

old

wiki page for Normal Games of all sizes was last edited 2006-07-20 18:55 UTC by mith, and includes the language about setting and flavor.

What was your point again?

[Mr. Flay]

[necro]Since I'm going to start using Pie E7 in Newbie Games, I want to vett a standard description of Mafia Roleblockers (and by extension, modify the Goon slightly).[/necro]

How does this sound?

You are a

Mafia Roleblocker

, along with your partner _________ (who is simply a Goon). Your goal is to eliminate the pro-town players so that only your side remains; you win if this happens. During the Day, try to blend in with the rest of the players, and get someone lynched (if that someone is not your partner or yourself, that will make things much easier).

You may talk with your partner when it is not Day, and send me choices via PM of who your team would like to kill and who to roleblock (if only you live, you may choose to do one or the other, but not both).

Note: You may talk with your partner privately during confirmations to plan strategy, but no night actions will take place until Night One.

You are a

Mafia Goon

, along with your partner _________ (who is also a pro-Mafia Roleblocker). Your goal is to eliminate the pro-town players so that only your side remains; you win if this happens. During the Day, try to blend in with the rest of the players, and get someone lynched (if that someone is not your partner or yourself, that will make things much easier).

You may talk with your partner when it is not Day, and send me choices via PM of who your team would like to kill and who to roleblock (if only you live, you may only kill, of course).

Note: You may talk with your partner privately during confirmations to plan strategy, but no night actions will take place until Night One.

[Mr. Flay]

Yeah, I'm probably relying too much on paralleling the structure with the examples Stoof has in the first post. Mith's Mafia Roleblocker role PM has been used universally in all three Pie E7/C9 games that have been run so far, to my knowledge:

You are a

Mafia Roleblocker

. Your partner is XXXX.

You may talk to your partner during Night. Each Night, you (as a group) may attempt to kill someone by sending a PM to the Moderator containing the name of that player.

In addition, you may target another player each Night. This player will be blocked from using any abilities during the same Night.

You win when you have eliminated the Town, or when nothing can prevent this.

I'm not crazy about the "you as a group" description, because it seems to imply that the mafia RB would have the ability to perform two actions at night even if the Goon dies, which seems decidedly non-standard to me...

TSQ: C9 win ratios are dropping, not rising, and I've become convinced that a 20-30% win rate is more discouraging than instructive.

[Mr. Flay]

Uhm, because it still only has 7 players, yet avoids the massclaim problem of the Original Newbies?

I actually think I'll run about ten Pie E7 and ten C9+2s, but I'm open to other setups that might be viable...

[Mr. Flay]

Here's what I used for 518. Comments are welcome before we get to our next game...
2

Mafia:

You are a

Mafia Roleblocker

, along with your partner _________ (who is simply a Goon). Your goal is to eliminate the pro-town players so that only your side remains; you win if this happens. During the Day, try to blend in with the rest of the players, and get someone lynched.

You may talk with your partner at Night, and send me a choice via PM of who you would like to kill/roleblock (your team can do both if both of you live; if only you survive, you must choose one action or the other).

Note: You may talk with your partner privately during confirmations to plan strategy, but no night actions will take place until Night One.

You are a

Mafia Goon

, along with your partner _________ (who is a pro-Mafia Roleblocker). Your goal is to eliminate the pro-town players so that only your side remains; you win if this happens. During the Day, try to blend in with the rest of the players, and get someone lynched.

You may talk with your partner at Night, and send me a choice via PM of who you would like to kill (if your partner also lives, they can send in a separate choice to roleblock someone).

Note: You may talk with your partner privately during confirmations to plan strategy, but no night actions will take place until Night One.