NY 178: MASQUERADE -- GAME OVER

The Fonz
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Post Post #1275  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:35 am

In post 1273, goodmorning wrote:Oh, just one relevant post. OK.


Again. Brand new replacement. Not sure what is difficult to grasp here.

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Post Post #1276  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:36 am

In post 1270, The Fonz wrote:
In post 1267, goodmorning wrote:If you just got caught up then why not post some reads? An opinion on Thor vs Pere? An opinion on TSO vs Anen? Literally anything but a weak question about a joke post?

Erm, I did.


You did? I must be missing it - quote?
"i have the sickest grossest feeling that even if it's my lynch today, my townflip still won't lead to a tso lynch, and then he'll find some bullshit way to reason either shooting or lynching gm tomorrow because if there's anyone who can strongarm a mislynch despite his reads or cases being proved wrong time and again it's tso" -Marquis

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Post Post #1277  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:40 am

Ahahahaha, never mind. Thought I'd missed a useful post but really I just missed a post full of WORDS and devoid of much substance.
EFFORT IS NOT INDICATIVE OF ALIGNMENT
Calling On Dragons coming eventually!

Get to know a very pleasant AM.

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Post Post #1278  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:42 am

In post 1272, The Fonz wrote:
In post 1267, goodmorning wrote:
I've run reaction tests way longer than 5 days. That said, it won't work, but that's because the player in question is gone.

Right. So now you can tell us who that player was, what parts of your play were the 'reaction test', and what reactions you expected from scum vs those you expected from town. Get to it.

OH, SASSY EH?

FUCK OFF.

(For anyone else who might be curious, you may want to attempt ISOing me and searching "Toby".)
EFFORT IS NOT INDICATIVE OF ALIGNMENT
Calling On Dragons coming eventually!

Get to know a very pleasant AM.

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Post Post #1279  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:56 am

In post 1271, goodmorning wrote:I literally cannot even begin to describe how hard this pinged.

I'm sorry that agreeing with you that your post was useless "pings" me.

In post 1271, goodmorning wrote:I have no real idea what you're talking about, but if this is an attempt to discredit me then I just got about 10000% more certain that I'm actually right.

I sort of feel you're discrediting yourself - you just admitted that your last five days have generated nothing.
I'm asking if you're suffering from out of game issues or if this is what we should expect from you.

That said, it is probably a discredit - because it's my stance that you are capable of playing better.

@TSO - just iso him, he only has one wall-ish post and that's the one.

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Post Post #1280  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:58 am

In post 1278, goodmorning wrote:Toby

I did.
It was...three results, and I don't follow the point.

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Post Post #1281  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:02 am

This is what I found.
Walk me through what I'm supposed to see?
I'm pretty sure you got the word wrong though or something.

Spoiler: Toby
In post 206, goodmorning wrote:
In post 134, TobyLoby wrote:goodmorning, do you think Csareo is scummy, maybe townie, or null? I'm getting an everything from you.

It's pretty Null. I've seen this particular brand of play before, though I haven't played with this particular player, and it is not indicative imo. At least, not yet. Could be getting there.


In post 365, goodmorning wrote:
In post 359, TierShift wrote:
In post 346, Garmr wrote:I'm going to be honest I'm lost now and don't know what to think.
UNVOTE: toby

I don't like this post and I'll research you now.

Good, maybe you'll figure out what it is then.

Looking forward to Izariael's post.

I seem to have concluded that TSO is Town.


In post 1278, goodmorning wrote:(For anyone else who might be curious, you may want to attempt ISOing me and searching "Toby".)

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Post Post #1282  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:06 am

In post 1227, The Fonz wrote:
In post 861, T S O wrote:that readslist is realllly surface deep, goes through just about every cliche there is and fencesits on some people
in other words, Aneninen is still scum.

Do you expect a readlist on day one of a large to have non-fencesitty opinions on everyone? I mean, LOATPs are kinda generally bad unless doing PoE. But still.of content, but doing nothing to advance the game.


Clearly I'm still missing it - this is all I can see, and I sure as hell don't count that as a read.

I am going to look so fucking stupid if I've missed a post or something
"i have the sickest grossest feeling that even if it's my lynch today, my townflip still won't lead to a tso lynch, and then he'll find some bullshit way to reason either shooting or lynching gm tomorrow because if there's anyone who can strongarm a mislynch despite his reads or cases being proved wrong time and again it's tso" -Marquis

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Post Post #1283  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:08 am

In post 1278, goodmorning wrote:
In post 1272, The Fonz wrote:
In post 1267, goodmorning wrote:
I've run reaction tests way longer than 5 days. That said, it won't work, but that's because the player in question is gone.

Right. So now you can tell us who that player was, what parts of your play were the 'reaction test', and what reactions you expected from scum vs those you expected from town. Get to it.

OH, SASSY EH?

FUCK OFF.

(For anyone else who might be curious, you may want to attempt ISOing me and searching "Toby".)


GO FUCK YOURSELF.

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Post Post #1284  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:08 am

In post 1282, T S O wrote:
In post 1227, The Fonz wrote:
In post 861, T S O wrote:that readslist is realllly surface deep, goes through just about every cliche there is and fencesits on some people
in other words, Aneninen is still scum.

Do you expect a readlist on day one of a large to have non-fencesitty opinions on everyone? I mean, LOATPs are kinda generally bad unless doing PoE. But still.of content, but doing nothing to advance the game.


Clearly I'm still missing it - this is all I can see, and I sure as hell don't count that as a read.

I am going to look so fucking stupid if I've missed a post or something


This is me asking you a question because I'm trying to get a read. How about you not be a dick and answer it?

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Post Post #1285  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:10 am

In post 1282, T S O wrote:Clearly I'm still missing it - this is all I can see, and I sure as hell don't count that as a read.

You are misunderstanding the question here.

He was not asked to give a rock solid read on you/Anem.
He was challenged because he had not offered "reads".
In that post he did offer many reads and opinions.

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Post Post #1286  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:19 am

In post 1278, goodmorning wrote:
FUCK OFF.

(For anyone else who might be curious, you may want to attempt ISOing me and searching "Toby".)


In post 206, goodmorning wrote:
In post 134, TobyLoby wrote:goodmorning, do you think Csareo is scummy, maybe townie, or null? I'm getting an everything from you.

It's pretty Null. I've seen this particular brand of play before, though I haven't played with this particular player, and it is not indicative imo. At least, not yet. Could be getting there.


In post 365, goodmorning wrote:
In post 359, TierShift wrote:
In post 346, Garmr wrote:I'm going to be honest I'm lost now and don't know what to think.
UNVOTE: toby

I don't like this post and I'll research you now.

Good, maybe you'll figure out what it is then.

Looking forward to Izariael's post.

I seem to have concluded that TSO is Town.


These are all the times 'Toby' shows up in GM's ISO, btw. So unless she's going to claim that *not* mentioning Toby at all was a reaction test, then... what?

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Post Post #1287  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:20 am

Oops - just said the same thing as Thor's spoilered stuff.

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Post Post #1288  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:25 am

In post 1279, Thor665 wrote:I sort of feel you're discrediting yourself - you just admitted that your last five days have generated nothing.

Really.


Reeeeeallly.


In post 1281, Thor665 wrote:Walk me through what I'm supposed to see?

You're not supposed to see anything. That's the point.

In post 1285, Thor665 wrote:In that post he did offer many reads and opinions.

I disagree.
EFFORT IS NOT INDICATIVE OF ALIGNMENT
Calling On Dragons coming eventually!

Get to know a very pleasant AM.

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Post Post #1289  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:36 am

Whatevs. You're wrong.

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Post Post #1290  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:38 am

I could go through it and explain why I find it underwhelming but 1. WORDS and 2. Thor would probably butt in afterwards.
EFFORT IS NOT INDICATIVE OF ALIGNMENT
Calling On Dragons coming eventually!

Get to know a very pleasant AM.

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Post Post #1291  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:46 am

In post 1288, goodmorning wrote:
In post 1279, Thor665 wrote:I sort of feel you're discrediting yourself - you just admitted that your last five days have generated nothing.

Really.


Reeeeeallly.

Yes.

In post 1288, goodmorning wrote:
In post 1281, Thor665 wrote:Walk me through what I'm supposed to see?

You're not supposed to see anything. That's the point.

You wanted us to iso you to show your lack of interaction with Toby, to show how you're on hold in trying to scumhunt him?
When did you decide you wanted to scumhunt him and why?

In post 1288, goodmorning wrote:
In post 1285, Thor665 wrote:In that post he did offer many reads and opinions.

I disagree.

Why?
Because "offering reads" is not really a matter of opinion, it is a factual state.

In post 1227, The Fonz wrote:Muffin's PerV push feels like the best push I've seen in this game. It rubs me up the wrong way that you attack another player's vote on the wagon you're on in a way that explicitly calls the attacking player scum, but then bend over backwards to point out this doesn't weaken your vote on the wagon in any way./quote]

In post 1227, The Fonz wrote:On that note, think PerV is scummy, mostly on the basis of the muffin case, not the Thor case.


In post 1227, The Fonz wrote:It is mildly suspicious that PerV pointed out the potential 'slip' in Thor then admitted he didn't think slipping is something Thor would do as soon as he's challenged on it.


In post 1227, The Fonz wrote:Scripten's gut town. I think Izariael is town who genuinely believes a 'strong null read' is a thing (LOL). Davesaz is really glaringly posting lots of IIoA. Newbie though. Consider this a warning to be more proactive. Nero's playing a very safe game, wouldn't have a problem lynching him, but PerV is better.

Also - I will offer a hearty smirk about he Izariel thing.

In post 1227, The Fonz wrote:On Boon, the point is that if he's town, scum now knows he's not vanilla anyway. But there's the risk that if he's scum, he's sliding by on a non-specific power claim. I'd lean no claim, just because I think he seems like a bad enough player that not knowing whether he has a major or minor PR if he's town is a significant problem for scum. Bullets to the face of people who have hinted power are bad. *Cough*Thor*Cough*


He then goes into a deeper Pere explanation.
However, what I see here is;

Pere = scum (plus multiple reasons)
He does call TSO v. Anemian 'nullish' via inference and openly questions the value of the case whether or not you like inference.
Scripten - town.
Izariel - town.
Dave - newb with potential to be town or scum but is considering him. (a fancy null read, basically)
Nero - scummy for reason stated, but a lesser read than Pere.
Boon - poor play, but don't want to lynch or see dead at this point and concider it worse play for scum (ergo - leaning town to some degree)

That is 5-7 reads depending how you want to qualify reads.
That is a post that contains reads - fact.
I suppose you can debate "many" but you can't really debate 25% of playerlist given reads on.
And at that point, what is your specific issue with him only having provided reads on around 25% of the player list?

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Post Post #1292  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:46 am

In post 1290, goodmorning wrote:I could go through it and explain why I find it underwhelming but 1. WORDS and 2. Thor would probably butt in afterwards.

I'll butt un beforehand - maybe that will help :lol:

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Post Post #1293  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 11:01 am

In post 1284, The Fonz wrote:
In post 1282, T S O wrote:
In post 1227, The Fonz wrote:
In post 861, T S O wrote:that readslist is realllly surface deep, goes through just about every cliche there is and fencesits on some people
in other words, Aneninen is still scum.

Do you expect a readlist on day one of a large to have non-fencesitty opinions on everyone? I mean, LOATPs are kinda generally bad unless doing PoE. But still.of content, but doing nothing to advance the game.


Clearly I'm still missing it - this is all I can see, and I sure as hell don't count that as a read.

I am going to look so fucking stupid if I've missed a post or something


This is me asking you a question because I'm trying to get a read. How about you not be a dick and answer it?


I wasn't being a dick - I was just pointing out my opinion (which was wrong but let's not talk about that now.)

In post 860, Aneninen wrote:Thor – Thor is just being Thor. Is it easy to get annoyed by his style? Yes. Does that mean that he's scum? No. What I see is a town-Thor (though I've played with him only twice). But, there is something else. Somehow I can feel that he's nervous. But since there's no wagon against him this must be a town-frustration, in my opinion. Probably town.


This is one of Aneninen's reads. I do not understand how the bolded adds up whatsoever.

He's nervous ---> but he's not being voted ---> frustrated town. Maybe you can see it, Fonz, I can't.
"i have the sickest grossest feeling that even if it's my lynch today, my townflip still won't lead to a tso lynch, and then he'll find some bullshit way to reason either shooting or lynching gm tomorrow because if there's anyone who can strongarm a mislynch despite his reads or cases being proved wrong time and again it's tso" -Marquis

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Post Post #1294  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 11:32 am

He's nervous -> but he's not in the kind of position that would cause scum to be nervous -> therefore, it's town frustration.

I mean, nervousness and frustration aren't precisely synonyms. But you can replace either with 'on edge.' You should be getting a Thor/Anen negative connection if you're reading it the way I think you are. Is that true?

My take on Anen is that his read on you is wrong but town motivated. He's modelling you as being capable of rationally capable of seeing that csareo is a VI, not worth engaging with, but doing it anyway because you're scum and you know that arguing with him will make the thread unreadable and harm town morale, which suits your end as scum. I think this is an interesting and original insight (I had a 'Hey, I never thought of it that way, but it could make sense' kind of reaction) but that he's wrong because he's underestimating the extent to which you're annoyed and can't help yourself - the 'Someone is wrong on the internet' phenomenon. Then he's starting to show similar frustration towards you later on, hence the 'nothing but pooping pigeons' post. I agree with him that you saying he couldcould vouch for you off one abandoned game's meta is silly, I don't think it's contradictory though (because it's possible to think 'My play is so different to my scumplay any competent player who's seen my scumplay should be able to tell this isn't it' while not classing Csareo as a 'competent player.')

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Post Post #1295  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 11:56 am

In post 1268, Thor665 wrote:
In post 1258, Nero Cain wrote:your case on PV is that:
he has bad reads
you feel he lied to you
and he thought you were scummy for bringing up MB?

My case is more eloquent, but, yes, you have functionally simplified it down - though I think the third and the first point are the same point - as the only read I cited as bad enough to be scummy is the read involving multiball, and I have no other scumtell associated with the multiball point other than inability to defend his belief in it being scummy. I also would note the lie is one I said he directed at town in general, not me in particular, though I will agree I was amongst those he lied to.

ok well...TBH that case doesn't sway me but ok, lets say that I'm wrong and PV is scum. Who are the non PV scum in this game?

In post 1291, Thor665 wrote:Nero - scummy for reason stated, but a lesser read than Pere.

What made me go from townish to your second highest scumread?



Fonz also needs to explain why 385 from PV is scummy.
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https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=80085

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Post Post #1296  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 12:01 pm

@ thor
In post 1254, Nero Cain wrote:Why is fonz town?
Why is scrip town?
Why is Dave town?
Why is gamr town?
Why is hephaestus town?
Why is Muffin town?
Why is Tier town?
Join the Fantasy Football league today!
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=80085

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Post Post #1297  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 12:08 pm

In post 1295, Nero Cain wrote:
Fonz also needs to explain why 385 from PV is scummy.


^ Clear evidence Nero isn't bothering to read the thread

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Post Post #1298  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 12:13 pm

ok, so what post was it?
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Post Post #1299  (ISO)  » Sat Oct 11, 2014 12:18 pm

The one where I explain in detail my problem with PerV? The one Thor broke down on this very page?

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