NY 178: MASQUERADE -- GAME OVER


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Post Post #4325 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:13 pm

Post by The Fonz »

In post 4313, TierShift wrote:Fonz what is your nero read?


Weak town read. See the above. I suspected him early D1, but he does get more purposeful, even if I didn't like the direction he took. I see no glaring contradictions or anything.
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Post Post #4326 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:14 pm

Post by Boonskiies »

Shiro's been pointing out some contradictions.
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Post Post #4327 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:15 pm

Post by Izariael »

Fair enough. I'll take it as an answer. Thanks.
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Post Post #4328 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:15 pm

Post by Nero Cain »

I'm not sure that Shiro and Axle even know what a contradiction is.
Of all tyrannies,a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

edited c.s. lewis quote b/c limit
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Post Post #4329 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:18 pm

Post by Shiro »

Well excuse me but when you say

He is a claimed VI
and
He is derpy-VI

It kind of does imply you town read him cause of it
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Post Post #4330 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:20 pm

Post by Boonskiies »

@Iz - While targeting you, I had barely any other interaction with anyone else in the game, and hadn't been staying focused. The reason all my scum hunting tools were all about my claim is because that's how I was staying relevant in the game. I had barely put any analysis/effort into the game, and it's all I had. It was the beginning of a large game...my day 1's are always ridiculously bad anyways. I actually start to become a pretty strong town player mid-game.
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Post Post #4331 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:21 pm

Post by Shiro »

which does by definition of
"Contradiction: the statement of a position opposite to one already made"
This
Nero wrote:I don't think I ever said anything about him being read as a VI.


Heck the argument you had with Axl was the fact that Axl was saying Boon shouldnt take a free pass because of VI meta
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Post Post #4332 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:26 pm

Post by Nero Cain »

no. He's a claimed VI is a statement 'cause he claimed he was a VI and he is a derpy VI is a statement 'cause he is or atleast pretends like one.

I prob have argued that he might be less likely to be scum 'cause of his claimed role but I don't think I've ever argued that he's undoubtedly town 'cause he's a VI. If that was my logic then I'd be town reading the whole game.
Of all tyrannies,a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

edited c.s. lewis quote b/c limit
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Post Post #4333 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:30 pm

Post by Izariael »

In post 4330, Boonskiies wrote:@Iz - While targeting you, I had barely any other interaction with anyone else in the game, and hadn't been staying focused. The reason all my scum hunting tools were all about my claim is because that's how I was staying relevant in the game. I had barely put any analysis/effort into the game, and it's all I had. It was the beginning of a large game...my day 1's are always ridiculously bad anyways. I actually start to become a pretty strong town player mid-game.


Ugh, it pains me somewhat to say this but... it makes sense. I don't agree with it, but it makes sense. I would suggest putting in a stronger effort to stay attentive on day 1 rather than just going "well I suck at them anyways so what's the point of trying?"... it's a defeatist attitude and doesn't really excuse that you aren't actively contributing. That attitude helps scum to sweep scummy actions under the rug that you may have caught if you were attentive.
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Post Post #4334 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:32 pm

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So the fact you see him as a VI didn't infulence your read ? Cause what I am saying is your posts gave the assumption(at least to me) that the fact you see him as a VI infulenced your read on him not that you see him as undoubtedly town cause of it.
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Post Post #4335 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:33 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

In post 4312, Shiro wrote:@Nero wasn't it kinda your bases on your defence of him against Axl ? At least that is the idea I got

@Axl What up with the naked vote ?



I got bored with posting reasons when I vote, theyre in the thread. Just read my ISO. (LOL)

people I most want to lynch over Thor today
VOTE: Garmr (but the rest of the wagon ran away, one person I penciled in for it fly said meh explictly)
VOTE: dave (Just noticed tier ran away from this one... rats)
VOTE: GM
VOTE: Nero (because its currently funniest. vote vote!! !!!) (If I count right a 3 man wagon on Nero.)

(BTW Fonz don't ask the obv question, I probably wont tell you. Just assume i could post 500 words of waffle that look like reasons(because they are) . kthx)
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Post Post #4336 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:36 pm

Post by Boonskiies »

In post 4332, Nero Cain wrote:no. He's a claimed VI is a statement 'cause he claimed he was a VI and he is a derpy VI is a statement 'cause he is or atleast pretends like one.

I prob have argued that he might be less likely to be scum 'cause of his claimed role but I don't think I've ever argued that he's undoubtedly town 'cause he's a VI. If that was my logic then I'd be town reading the whole game.



You basically are already.
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Post Post #4337 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:36 pm

Post by Boonskiies »

Also, Iz, I know I should have. I just fell behind, and never caught up. I tried to stay caught up D2 beginning, but eh. I'll be fine from now on. I've gotten the basis on the player list now.
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Post Post #4338 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:38 pm

Post by Shiro »

In post 4337, Boonskiies wrote:Also, Iz, I know I should have. I just fell behind, and never caught up. I tried to stay caught up D2 beginning, but eh. I'll be fine from now on. I've gotten the basis on the player list now.

Does that mean we will be seeing some Boon action from now on ?
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Post Post #4339 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:47 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

In post 4243, Shiro wrote:ok wait was the hammer fake ???
Unvote



Err yeah ..duh. (it would be suicide as any alignment to do that without the claim, unless you hit scum, and he hadnt been certain thor was scum before so whered the certainty come from. AKA non-sense)

Ok.
next step. Thor will still get lynched at dead line unless there is another wagon.
So vote some one, like dunno...., maybe the guy you are scum reading?
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Post Post #4340 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:52 pm

Post by Shiro »

In post 4339, AxleGreaser wrote:
In post 4243, Shiro wrote:ok wait was the hammer fake ???
Unvote



Err yeah ..duh. (it would be suicide as any alignment to do that without the claim, unless you hit scum, and he hadnt been certain thor was scum before so whered the certainty come from. AKA non-sense)

Ok.
next step. Thor will still get lynched at dead line unless there is another wagon.
So vote some one, like dunno...., maybe the guy you are scum reading?


Well I got fooled >.>

Well We tried Gamr slot ->Didnt work out
I tried Slandar->Didnt work out

Next is Beast Tier is voting for him could go for that but I am not seeing light there either

Might as well give it a shot though lucky number 3 ?

VOTE:BEAST
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Post Post #4341 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:24 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

actually cant help myself
Spoiler: nero reasons links
Early D1. reasons (ask fonz what awas decent at (IIRC I saw stuff but did say anything (was busy))


weak kneed limp wristed pushes.

Contrary to his memory he argued several points in defence of Boon. has a spoiler with links back to what he said. and it just keeps going....

discrepancy between how bad NC claims the pereV case is today (horrible) and how much he said or did anything about that.
<< example of explicit (convenient) shift in how the PereV case was viewed. (
Scummy ground shifting Bullshit.


and then there is the intent to hammer stuff (for the purpose of getting a claim(intent)) from just before

(oh and PS. once scum start flipping try checking out my ISO for chainsaw action)
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Post Post #4342 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:25 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4239, Slandaar wrote:So, lets say we massclaim later down the road near/at lylo. There is no cop or gunsmith or anything like that. We just decided not to lynch scum for however many days because there might be a cop etc who can investigate him?

Even if he was town. They don't even have to deal with him, they can just leave him and laugh as you waste a cop investigate on him etc.

1. I consider it a pretty safe assumption that we have some sort of alignment investigative type role in this game. If we don't then we can discuss Boon at that stage. I oppose his lynch Day 2 on the current case on him because I feel there are multiple people being derpy/scummy in similar manners who are not claimed PRs.

In post 4240, Nero Cain wrote:I've been willing to pl you since d1 and I still don't care if you die but getting you to hurry up and claim is moving the game along.

My bad, that sounds super pro-town when you explain it like that.
:neutral:

In post 4240, Nero Cain wrote:What have I done?

It's more 'what haven't you done'?
To which I would answer - scumhunt and offer a fair spread of reads.

In post 4243, Shiro wrote:ok wait was the hammer fake ???

:neutral:

In post 4243, Shiro wrote:Thor can you tell exactly what you found scummy on dave ? HIs first conv with you when he voted you was Smurfy and made no sense whatsoever is that the reason ?

Go back a bit, there was a point where I finally got him to state his case on me. His case made no sense at all and did not show any awareness that he had read the game, and I pointed this out to him.
He then went 'aw, shucks - you're right' and unvoted me.
Then, later, he re-voted me.

I had actually mildly town read him for the admission that he was talking out of his backside. But to then re-vote me with no new calls or thoughts? Yeah, he's not scumhunting at all and was just sliding on. It was very scummy. Pair that with pushing a case while (and note that he admits this is true) having no frame of reference or understanding of the case. Who the hell pushes a case they don't understand? Hint: not town.

In post 4244, Josh_B wrote:It didn't have any affect.- unless you feel like a third NK is missing. But even then it's 50/50 on whether or not you blocked her or saved her, so that's null.
The claim has no use at this point other than saying that you're a named townie.

I wasn't aware I had claimed the opposite of any of this.

In post 4247, Scripten wrote:How about we both start now so you don't get derphammered before giving some reads. ;)

I'm not going to be derphammered at this stage, as it would take at least 2 to manage it.
As I said, you do it and then I will.
Surely if you want to see my thoughts you're willing to offer your own - why are you so nervy about this? Just do it and get your question answered.
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Post Post #4343 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:28 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

In post 4340, Shiro wrote:Next is Beast Tier is voting for him could go for that but I am not seeing light there either

Might as well give it a shot though lucky number 3 ?


but why that wagon?
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Post Post #4344 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:31 pm

Post by Izariael »

Ehhh... I'll get behind this. He's had enough grace period to pull something together and has procured nothing.

VOTE: beastcharizard
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Post Post #4345 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:36 pm

Post by Shiro »

In post 4343, AxleGreaser wrote:
In post 4340, Shiro wrote:Next is Beast Tier is voting for him could go for that but I am not seeing light there either

Might as well give it a shot though lucky number 3 ?


but why that wagon?


He was always my third pick. He lurked the whole game and the little he spoke coincidentaly when mentioned/votes was meh
Btw it seems I was remembering right that he defended Boon. He did defend him when you said town shouldn't give him a free pass on the VI meta right ? Cause if so we do have a contradiction here.


@Thor Yea I remember you saying that scum is unlikly to admit mistake in such manner or something along those lines. He then voted GM and then revoted you. It was kinda odd
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Post Post #4346 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:40 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

In post 4342, Thor665 wrote:

In post 4240, Nero Cain wrote:I've been willing to pl you since d1 and I still don't care if you die but getting you to hurry up and claim is moving the game along.

My bad, that sounds super pro-town when you explain it like that.
:neutral:


BTW The PL since D1 is more
scummy ground shifting bullshit
.
Earlier when i called him out for wanting to PL you for a case on PereV that was (on D2 according to him) all sorts of horrible...

his best case point was, he voted you D1, {no mention of PL at all.....}
his D1 evaluation of the case was
In post 1295, Nero Cain wrote:ok well...TBH that case doesn't sway me but ok, lets say that I'm wrong and PV is scum. Who are the non PV scum in this game?



yet on D2 he is beating the bushes looking for PL voters for thor (over a case that was described as "doesnt sway me")
In post 3373, Nero Cain wrote:I'd pl this slot
<thor>
. His case on PV yesterday was all sorts of horrible


more scummy ground shifting bullshit.
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Post Post #4347 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:41 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4256, Boonskiies wrote:Was caught up in the moment. Sorry for actually trying to Smurfing help. I'll go back to doing nothing.

Oh boo-hoo.
Replace out or play the game - stop whining so much that people don't agree with your play.

In post 4279, TierShift wrote:Let's add josh to the shaky category.

I would be most happy with a beastcharizard lynch right now. He is actively not trying to contribute.
VOTE: beast

I so hope gm somehow confirms thor's claim s we can flashwagon this

Where the heck was this activity and decision even 24 hours ago and why the sudden shift to Beast?

In post 4290, T S O wrote:I would be up for a Nero Cain lynch on policy basis alone.

Not sure about Boon though.

And why are you suddenly here now with opinions and willingness to vote when I've been yelling at you for three days straight about the same?

In post 4297, The Fonz wrote:Also, Thor: make a smurfing case.

I did - what part of it confuses you?

In post 4302, The Fonz wrote:(If Boon survives today, I will not be voting for him later on barring the aforementioned awesome case).

So basically you barely buy into the reason for your vote in any case.
Meh.
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Post Post #4348 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:42 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4345, Shiro wrote:@Thor Yea I remember you saying that scum is unlikly to admit mistake in such manner or something along those lines. He then voted GM and then revoted you. It was kinda odd

Expand on what you mean by 'odd'.

Because I am calling it straight up scummy.
What's your read?

In post 4344, Izariael wrote:Ehhh... I'll get behind this. He's had enough grace period to pull something together and has procured nothing.

VOTE: beastcharizard

:neutral:
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Post Post #4349 (ISO) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:45 pm

Post by Shiro »

In post 4348, Thor665 wrote:
In post 4345, Shiro wrote:@Thor Yea I remember you saying that scum is unlikly to admit mistake in such manner or something along those lines. He then voted GM and then revoted you. It was kinda odd

Expand on what you mean by 'odd'.

Because I am calling it straight up scummy.
What's your read?

In post 4344, Izariael wrote:Ehhh... I'll get behind this. He's had enough grace period to pull something together and has procured nothing.

VOTE: beastcharizard

:neutral:

Sure by odd I mean the fact that he claimed he suppodly voted GM to make you push a case and test you to see how legit you were. It seemed like a fake reason to put his vote back on you without having to explain how bad his case was(since he had a new reason now)
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