NY 178: MASQUERADE -- GAME OVER


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Post Post #3539 (isolation #400) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:59 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3537, Scripten wrote:
In post 3531, Izariael wrote:
It is based on his constant stalling and limiting of the exchange of information.

It is based on his voting habits, which appear to be sheer OMGUS on PeregrineV, Muffin and myself. Woe be unto those who question the mighty Thor and his infallible gameplay...

It is based on my belief that he is not genuinely scumhunting, as nearly all of his scumreads have come from reactivity rather than proactivity.

Sure, I'm game, let's do these one by one.

1. I "stalled" explaining what I meant by the word "thoughts" when Muffin thought it meant "names"
No - that is Muffin wasting time with a stupid bit of...I dunno. I also did n't stall anything, i said immediately that it wasn't what I meant. I didn't realize I needed to define the word "thoughts" I think it's STUPID AND UNREASONABLE to suggest I should have - and it would have been even more insulting, frankly. I actually gave him the benefit of the doubt by calling him scum.

2. I specifically didn't OMGUS Pere and it's silly to suggest I did - but I guess I need to address this, I probably need to ask what he means by OMGUS to see if it's the same as what I mean, I also didn't OMGUS Shiro either. SO I OMGUSed two people thus far...except I didn't unless you take the most basic meaning of the term as "voted someone who was voting him".
Sorry I slowed things down by not addressing something that is provably not true and acting as if it didn't need to be justified - how sloppy of me.

This is actually sort of the second point again, and other than that is just an empty point. What do I even say to this? I am scumhunting - so either he doesn't take what I consider to be scumhunting as scumhunting, or he does and is scum. In neither situation can I convince him I'm scumhunting - and he hasn't really shown lack of scumhunting, he's just saying it. I think if you look at my votes and questions it screams scumhunting...but...what, am I supposed to say "read my ISO?" Yeah, brilliant rebuttal there. it's a dumb and empty accusation that cannot be functionally challenged due to its empty nature. it's his opinion - other people will agree o disagree with it but *debating* it? That's stupid and wasteful.


Wow - amazing points.
How shameful of me not to have addressed the *meaningful* ones instead of just dismissing the case.
Silly, really.
Mah bad!

This is weird. Why are you asking me to do this - none of those points were impressive, non were supported by facts, and a few are blatantly incorrect if you bothered to look for the info yourself. Why do I need to waste my time addressing that?
Did my addressing it change anything?
Because all you have now is my opinion on his opinions and you *still* need to go do the research yourself and draw your own conclusions - which you were capable of doing without my providing of a detailed response.
Also - a non-detailed response, which I gave, was just as functional. I calimed the case was silly. When I got specific all I did was state *why* I thought it was silly.
But the only thing that matters is whether people think it is or is not silly - that's the info that matters. the why is just detail work if you're confused by their conclusions.
Are you confused by my conclusion that the case is silly?
Like, you think the case holds water? You think I did OMGUS on Pere? You think being dismissive is a scum only trait and town never do it? You think I'm 'stalling' in some manner that hurts town?
Meh - then say so and back up your own words. Because I didn't, it isn't, and I'm not, and this is silly.
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Post Post #3540 (isolation #401) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 2:03 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3537, Scripten wrote:I wouldn't summarily dismiss the entire case because I feel myself above it, since that would probably distract from finding actual scum.

Hint: Many times - you *are indeed* above the case on you.
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Post Post #3546 (isolation #402) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:24 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3542, Flubbernugget wrote:
In post 3519, Thor665 wrote:

In post 3516, Flubbernugget wrote:Thor what are you trying to showcase on your wagon?

You found a bunch of names highlighted in green, including Muffin, while others are in black, including the person I'm voting, to be confusing as to my point?
I must be making another quantity vs. quality commentary - I'm so hard to understand and I never realized it.


THE NUMBERS THOR. WHAT DO THEY MEAN.

What numbers?
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Post Post #3547 (isolation #403) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:25 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3493, Thor665 wrote:
In post 3490, AxleGreaser wrote:goodmorning, [
Muffin
]
TierShift
, Izariael reinoe
Flubbernugget davesaz garmr

My thoughts.

@Flubber - I thought you were asking about this.

I have no idea what the "numbers" thing is.
Quote it and I'll explain what I meant.
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Post Post #3549 (isolation #404) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:47 pm

Post by Thor665 »

I'm guessing COD is some other game and this si some vague joke reference that he tagged onto the answer of his question to reward me by showing he was going nowhere with his question then?
Joy.

You gonna go anywhere with that *brilliant* set of case points you had me address, since now I'm not just waving them away...or rather am waving them away in a specific as opposed to generic sense? Or is that going nowhere also?
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Post Post #3550 (isolation #405) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:48 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3539, Thor665 wrote:This is weird. Why are you asking me to do this - none of those points were impressive, non were supported by facts, and a few are blatantly incorrect if you bothered to look for the info yourself. Why do I need to waste my time addressing that?

At least answer my question - even if you are planning to go nowhere with my answers.
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Post Post #3556 (isolation #406) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:01 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3551, Flubbernugget wrote:I don't understand what's so special about having townreads on your wagon.

You know I suck at VCA.

I never said it was special nor did I ask you to analyze and offer opinions on my wagon analysis.
You started the conversation1 because you were somehow confused by what I was saying (something I find mildly confusing...but then again people think I need to define 'thoughts' nowadays, so what the hell do I know?)2. I just supposed that once you knew what I meant you might go somewhere with it - I suppose it simply was just a "I have no idea what a list of player names with some in green including a flipped town could mean" which...frustrates3 me, but...whatevs. Carry on.

1.
Conversation -the informal exchange of ideas by spoken words.

2.
Know - to be aware of through observation, inquiry, or information.

3.
Frustrate - cause (someone) to feel upset or annoyed, typically as a result of being unable to change or achieve something.
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Post Post #3561 (isolation #407) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:13 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3557, Scripten wrote:I thought that Izar's point on you stalling was not only limited to your 1v1 with Muffin.

That's the only one that, with a squint, I could see the argument of stalling even being a thing. I think I spent basically 100% of day 1 on attack mode - you don't stall while you're in attack mode because it's a defensive maneuver. I certainly didn't stall in stating my issue with Pere, nor in stating it with Shiro. I can see the argument that I stalled in answer Muffin's questions about my case on Shiro...except that I didn't then either. i did "stall" if my only applicable answer was to define what I meant when I said a very basic comment and had it translated back to me in crazy speak - that said, I didn't stall in saying he was wrong, nor did I stall in pressing him for info. Functionally I stalled in saying "hey, when i said he talked about him more...oh, look. I meant more - here's proof...because apparently no one else but me is able to read his few posts and be able to spot a 3 to 1 quantity difference...) But I still have no fething clue why I even needed to say that.

What else do you think I stalled on?
What else do you think Iz thinks I stalled on?

This is feeling pretty empty as a response to the points you thought needed a response to - are you just trying to make noise or are you trying to sort something here? Because you're coming at me like the case and points make sense, but they don't, and you aren't showing me any actual buy in - even Iz is at least trying to act like he means what he says and believes it's an actual scum case, why aren't you?

In post 3557, Scripten wrote:How come you seem to have a town read on Garmr's slot, Thor? You didn't find his play today to be suspect?

No, not really. I found his Day 1 play quite townish, I find the case on him confusing and not really telling, and I find the replace out to be more likely to come from town Garmr (though he needs to reexamine his style quite seriously after pulling that weak gak). I've said all of this before, albeit spread out, and I haven't seen anything to change my mind.
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Post Post #3562 (isolation #408) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:15 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3559, Flubbernugget wrote:WHAT DID YOU HIGHLIGHT THE PEOPLE ON YOUR WAGON FOR AND SMURFING WHY

To offer my thoughts on my wagon - as I said when I did it.
Why does everyone need me to constantly re-state things I say the first time around?

In post 3560, Flubbernugget wrote:Thor I can't even tell if I'm legitimately Smurfing stupid right now because of how much better than everyone else you are right now.

Sheep me till you figure it out.
Or man up and declare that your play is fine and advance things and be able to cope with it when people disagree with you or find your points lacking. Then analyze their commentary and decide whether they have a point or don't. If they do - adjust yourself. If they don't, ignore them.
But complaining that I don't give you warm fuzzies for the awesomeness of your play is a meaningless post right now.
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Post Post #3563 (isolation #409) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:16 pm

Post by Thor665 »

I get the feeling that if I had played this game as Squirrel Girl there wouldn't even be a wagon on me right now.
People always took her disagreements with much less personal pain.
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Post Post #3565 (isolation #410) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:49 pm

Post by Thor665 »

How was me dismissing points via specifics remotely more townish than doing so in a general sweep?
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Post Post #3567 (isolation #411) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:50 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3561, Thor665 wrote:What else do you think I stalled on?
What else do you think Iz thinks I stalled on?

I'd also still like this fielded.
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Post Post #3568 (isolation #412) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:52 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3566, Flubbernugget wrote:Thor Smurf you for assuming I was looking for someone's approval and then telling me to man up over it.

Then i really missed the point of that post, I suppose.

In post 3566, Flubbernugget wrote:And I highly doubt the majority of this thread has synesthesia so the colors you used to describe your thoughts are meaningless if you refuse to explain their representation.

I did use the generic mafiascum color for town - green - which is also the one the Mod is using in this very game.
It would be like if I had just highlighted names in red for scum reads - it would never occur to me that I would need to translate that because it's the default 'scum' color used in basically all games.
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Post Post #3569 (isolation #413) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:54 pm

Post by Thor665 »

If I had used fuscia or something I would not have responded with snark.
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Post Post #3571 (isolation #414) » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:57 pm

Post by Thor665 »

Why are anyone's reads on anyone of any significance to be stated?
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Post Post #3597 (isolation #415) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 4:37 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3572, Flubbernugget wrote:
in the context of which you brought them up

What is the context?
Can you give a rough example of how you'd like this question answered?
Because currently all I'm getting as the question is 'why are you offering reads?' to which my reply is "because that's how the game is played...what are you smoking?".

In post 3574, AxleGreaser wrote: and BTW nope GM never did dig out the
In post 1648, goodmorning wrote:but I'll go back through tomorrow and pull some quotes for him while I'm doing the Fonz thing for Thor.

:lol:
GM should definitely get angry at me next time I call her useless then.

In post 3592, goodmorning wrote:Stop trying to distract from the Thor lynch.

Wow, the Thor *lynch*? Wooosh, GM, aren't we going with wishful thinking.
In case you didn't notice, the Thor *wagon* (much less the lynch) is dead in the water now. People are starting to notice the reasoning is slim to none (or slim to dumb - hot'cha!) and others are starting to establish that they want to hear and understand the case before voting it, so the wave of derp and scum voters is already over.

If you want the wagon (or lynch :lol: ) to keep going...well, now is the time to pick it up on your shoulders and run with it for a while.
Can you do that with this wagon?
I'm here - and I'm relatively embracing of the evidence against me, I've certainly admitted to some of it (albeit while questioning how it's even scummy in the first place) so you've got a reasonable base to work from. All you have to do is explain how what I did is scummy and talk to some people to convince them you're right.
I actually do not believe you're capable of this, so doing it would be mud in my eye - so you have extra incentive ;)

But - hint: just sitting back and going 'oh the Thor lynch!' that isn't going to carry the ball any further than it is right now (because, functionally, you're leaving Iz to do it - you think Iz can out debate me?). So it's really just a question of how much you want this lynch to happen.
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Post Post #3598 (isolation #416) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 4:38 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3594, goodmorning wrote:
In post 3593, Slandaar wrote:Do you, GM, think Iz slipped or not? (yes or no answer only please) Then: Why do you think this?

It's a little more complicated than a yes or no answer, so I'm afraid I thusly cannot answer.

Why not just add in a few words of explanation if your answer is 'depends'?

C'mon, Thor is scum for stalling, right? :lol:
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Post Post #3600 (isolation #417) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:12 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3599, reinoe wrote:Why are you boasting that the wagon on you has stalled?

Well, I'm not boasting about it - but I am stating my belief - and why is it an issue that I am? Why would it be an issue if I was boasting?

In post 3599, reinoe wrote:The wagon formed on you totally legitimately.

Well...sure, all wagons do, because if they are formed illegally the mod should do something about it.

In post 3599, reinoe wrote:Also if you flip scum, the reason why the wagon could be stalling would be because one or more of your buddies is running interference.

There is already interference being run - are they my scumbuddies or no?

In post 3599, reinoe wrote:Your "this wagon has stalled" excuse is poor.

It's not an excuse - it's a statement.

In post 3599, reinoe wrote:Also to re-emphasize the point...Muffin is conftown and was highlighting many of the things other players have pointed out and mentioned.

So?

In post 3599, reinoe wrote:You've repeatedly tried to denounce or discredit the people voting you but the case on you is solid.

No - it is not.
Describe the case on me please. I think that will showcase my point.
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Post Post #3602 (isolation #418) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:25 am

Post by Thor665 »

I still would like you to state the case that I am painting as scummy.
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Post Post #3607 (isolation #419) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 8:05 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3603, Flubbernugget wrote:Thor I don't just randomly decide I'm going to out reads but apparently thats a thing so okay

So the concern was that I was randomly offering my reads and opinions on people?
How odd of me.
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Post Post #3612 (isolation #420) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 10:24 am

Post by Thor665 »

Tier, 3507
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Post Post #3613 (isolation #421) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 10:29 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3609, Aegor wrote:[7]Thor665: goodmorning, TierShift, Izariael, reinoe, Flubbernugget, davesaz, Garmr
[4]Garmr: Scripten, AxleGreaser, Slandaar, Shiro
[2]Flubbernugget: Nero Cain, The Fonz
[1]Boonskiies: T S O
[1]Izariael: Thor665
[1]reinoe: Boonskiies

[1] Not Voting: beastcharizard

It's frustrating to me looking at this - because Iz is really the only person with votes on them I suspect is scum.
Flubber looks like derpy town. Boon looks...well, derpy, but as far as I can tell the wagon on him is mostly 'you play bad, so you should die to answer our confusion'.
Here's another thought - he's actually a perfect cop investigate because you know he won't get NK targeted and if he comes up clean it's a wonderful FU to scum. Or...y'know...we could lynch him...for reasons?
Garmr looks town off the replace out and for Day 1 play and I couldn't really describe the case on him (story of the day)
The wagon on me is a joke - pick some scum off it.
Reinoe...eh, actually i guess I'm mildly okay with this one, but I don't think there's a case there either.

Beast should get into play, and anyone not on the Thor wagon should start selling their current vote or join the Thor wagon and make your intent clear.
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Post Post #3617 (isolation #422) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 11:20 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3616, TierShift wrote:Thor I'm totally not interested in either iza or shiro. What do you think of slanderman?

I am undecided.

The defense of me was weird (and I actually agree with the concept that probably one of my defenders was scummy, and he certainly came at it in a weird way)
I also didn't like his interactions right around the end of yesterday.
The thing is that I don't particularly have any issues with him beyond those two points. He's looked reasonably fighty with 'big names', appears to have somewhat unique reads that are not just sheeping of the core, and looks willing to express his thoughts.

I don't really think any of that particularly screams scum. I'd generally oppose his lynch methinks.
Why do you think Iz is a poor lynch choice? If you think I'm town then it's basically assured at least one scum is on my wagon at this stage, and probably more than that. So?
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Post Post #3625 (isolation #423) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 12:38 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3624, Shiro wrote:He was contradicting himself

What was said contradiction?
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Post Post #3631 (isolation #424) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 12:57 pm

Post by Thor665 »

I'm going to go on record and state that none of those are contradictions.
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Post Post #3659 (isolation #425) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 5:59 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3632, Shiro wrote:
In post 3631, Thor665 wrote:I'm going to go on record and state that none of those are contradictions.


What are those then ?

The first one is a change of opinion after some major stuff happened as far as the Thor case goes, the second one is either bluster like he said or just indifference, the third one I'm forgetting already off the top of my head and am too lazy to go back and find, but it's not a contradiction either.

In post 3646, Scripten wrote:but [Thor] has a habit of being super opaque and stubborn that bugs me.

I am stubborn - I am not being opaque though. At all.

In post 3650, goodmorning wrote:So this Thor quote from MN1517 reminded me of Thor in this game.
[snip]
No prizes for guessing his alignment there.

:neutral:
So me being attacked for not pushing and noting that I was pushing is like this game where I was not attacked for not pushing?
Okay...?

Here's me in another game;
In post 738, Thor665 wrote:We are down to basically 24 hours to figure a lynch.
Mafia is playing poorly.
Wolf is playing well.
Town is playing meh.

So, pretty much, at this stage we're going for a wolf win.
Huzzah.

I was annoyed at people playing like derps.
What was my alignment there?
You are being an utter derp.

I would support the GM wagon, if people want to get on that - but just due to the utter waste that is the slot. I honestly think Iz is a more questionable player right now.
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Post Post #3662 (isolation #426) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:24 pm

Post by Thor665 »

@Reinoe - just to get in here. You do realize that I wasn't calling his case on me scummy, I was saying that his weird inability to communicate with me was scummy.

He was failing to communicate - I don't care that he was town, he was playing badly and communicating worse.
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Post Post #3663 (isolation #427) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:27 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3661, reinoe wrote:1)thor's misleading comments
2)thor's effort to try and discredit the person instead of the argument.
3)thor's weird wordplay

1. My comment was not misleading - Muffin read it like a derp and then demanded I defend it. Go quote my comment and explain how it's misleading - it is not.
2. You are quoting me attacking his arguments in the very post you make this claim.
3. I am sorry I use words in a weird way?
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Post Post #3664 (isolation #428) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:27 pm

Post by Thor665 »

^^^
Like, is that the case in your mind?
It's a joke.
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Post Post #3666 (isolation #429) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:29 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3083, Thor665 wrote:That said. You did take forever to say anything of worth - and then voted Pere out of the blue with no justification despite making a wall on Anen. That feels wonky to me.

@Reinoe - here is the initial commentary that Muffin took exception to - please explain how it is "misleading"?
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Post Post #3667 (isolation #430) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:31 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3665, AxleGreaser wrote:I don't buy it, maybe not a literal contradicition. It certainly not is towny flow of thought.

Don't argue semantics in a silly way.
It *isn't* a contradiction.

Now, sure, maybe it was an un-towny flow of thought and if someone wants to argue that - more power to them. But I was told it was a contradiction and was pointing out that it wasn't.
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Post Post #3668 (isolation #431) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:33 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3666, Thor665 wrote:
In post 3083, Thor665 wrote:That said. You did take forever to say anything of worth - and then
voted Pere out of the blue with no justification
despite making a wall on Anen. That feels wonky to me.

@Reinoe - here is the initial commentary that Muffin took exception to - please explain how it is "misleading"?

Let's even note, the bold is basically the major point made there.

Muffin then came after me with "I ISOed Shiro and the number of times Pere's name comes up in Ctrl+F is 1 more than Anen - so your case is a misrep!"

It was ridiculous for him to say that.
It is ridiculous that I have been having to discuss it with multiple people.
I never said names, I never said anything unclear - I offered a very straight to the point comment and Muffin went full derp on it.
Go ahead, talk me through the horrible confusion of the statement. i want to understand this.
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Post Post #3680 (isolation #432) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 7:57 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3674, goodmorning wrote:(Example: this happened to Muffin when he pointed out that Thor's version of events was incorrect as Shiro's scumread on Anen was decreasing; Thor responded by moving the posts to the amount of discussion rather than the content of said discussion.)

Quote me calling out the content and not the amount - even Muffin understood from the get go that I was talking amount --> he then claimed I "moved the goalposts to quantity"

So at least one of you is a total derp who got it backwards because you claim opposite things.

In post 3674, goodmorning wrote:@Thor: Did I say the situation was the same? No. Stop putting words in my mouth.

So...you brought up something that was different to show how I am in this game, and I was scum in the different game...?

@Reinoe - there is nothing there that disproves the point I made. He felt that the conversation showed a logical progression about Anen - I claimed that it was weird that he voted Pere without discussion considering how much he had said about Anen. Where is the missed angle there?
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Post Post #3681 (isolation #433) » Tue Nov 11, 2014 7:59 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3680, Thor665 wrote:he then claimed I "moved the goalposts to quantity"

He claimed I moved to "quality"

So Muffin claimed I had meant quantity and moved to quality.
You claim I started at quality and moved to quantity.

I am pretty sure one of you is insane.
Sort it out and get back to me.
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Post Post #3738 (isolation #434) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 4:24 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3686, davesaz wrote:
You refused to do so, and continue to do so.


This is what is scummy. The bolded thing. Someone asks you to prove your point, and
you ask them to prove the counter point
.

"Someone asks me to prove my point isn't scummy and I ask them to prove it's scummy first".

I don't think that's weird at all, and certainly not scummy.

In post 3697, TierShift wrote:Thor, scum on your wagon is probably dave.

Why Dave?

In post 3700, Izariael wrote:
In post 3108, Thor665 wrote:
I find it dishonest of you to act like a number of name mentions qualifies the same as degree of mention.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Note that this is the statement that Muffin says shifts the goalposts from quantity to quality
:up: :up: :up:

That shifted the goalposts? (though, hey, at least you and I agree that Goodmorning was the insane one)
Okay - can you define 'degree' as you think i used it here?

Because I'm pretty sure 'degree of mention' is not longhand for 'quality' especially since I note that it is not 'number of name mentions'.

In post 3707, TierShift wrote:iza is town. he is. thor, look elsewhere.

Is this read for the wall/effort=town or anything else?
Because earlier he did a cop out on the case and now he's champion of the case, and I can't read the shift as easily as you apparently do.

In post 3714, Izariael wrote:You've clearly missed the entire point of the issue if you think
Thor's factual accuracy
is what I have issue with. Yes, his stumbling over getting his story straight led to the events at hand, but the accuracy of the statement has no bearing on his reluctance to clarify and his insistence of making others bring the harvest to him when he's sowed no seeds. Thor is a clever player. I'm sure that he will make the facts work for him regardless of his alignment, and so I don't think factual accuracy is a strong scum measure for Thor. Nor on anyone really. Being wrong doesn't make you scum. I'm not sure what gave you the impression that I was scumreading him for being factually incorrect, but no. That's not what it's based on.

So I'm good enough scum to twist any fact to my favor.
That said, I'm going to avoid doing so for a long time because...I will...spend time...haha! I have wasted town's time by letting them focus on me being scum longer rather than dismissing the case asap and working a mislynch!
???

In post 3715, Izariael wrote:She made it perfectly clear why she voted PV over Anen. What she didn't make clear is why she voted PV over Thor.

So you're agreeing with me now that her unexplained Pere vote was weird and needed question (albeit for different reasoning) or are you just randmly attacking my name in a generic sense?

In post 3720, Slandaar wrote:I worded that badly I knew it wasn't the sole reason, still, all your scumreads voted PV. It's quite an easy way to play - accuse those who voted the mislynch.

I actually find that perfectly acceptable and normal Day 2 play. You don't?
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Post Post #3743 (isolation #435) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 4:35 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3742, davesaz wrote:I have not looked at whether "avoid no-lynch" is the reason in this case. I have not looked at placement. If someone feels these factors are actually relevant (cough Thor cough Slandaar cough) then provide the evidence yourself.

Read the game - Shiro later clarified that the vote was made to 'avoid no lynch' but did not do so initially.
Why are you even asking this?
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Post Post #3745 (isolation #436) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 4:46 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3744, davesaz wrote:If you have the oft-stated "I'm Thor and nobody is going to lynch me haha" attitude, then doing this as scum looks pretty realistic to me. It is far easier to bait people into attacking you so you can twist their words to discredit them, or break the communication path by shifting your stance, than it is to manufacture a case which doesn't match the evidence.

That's not legit though - all I am asking from them is to state their issue. When I am attacked for something that i cannot conceive of as scummy my first instinct isn't 'well let me explain that for you a whole bunch' my first instinct is 'why do you find this scummy?'

Like, say I attacked you for your use of 'oft-stated' and was like, ha! He used oft-stated! Total scum move, why would you even do that!
Now, I suppose your first instinct *could* be - well, allow me to explain why 'oft-stated' is in my vocabulary and why I use it.
But I know I, and probably some others, would tend to respond with 'how is that at all scummy?'
And if the reply was 'defend your use of it, I don't need to explain!' we would not decide that we should bend first.

In post 3744, davesaz wrote:Pedit: It is not unusual for town to avoid saying at the time that they are only voting to avoid a no-lynch. Precisely because the scum can latch onto that kind of statement to press a bogus case for a mislynch.

:neutral:
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Post Post #3747 (isolation #437) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 4:54 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Dave - like, here's my conversation with Muffin as I perceived it at the time;

1. I state I find Shiro scummy for the vote switch between Pere and Anen considering how much he talked about each.
2. Muffin asks me to defend that stance.
3. I ask him to look at the posts and tell me if he feels it was a legit switch.
4. He says he counted the number of times each name was mentioned and Pere was mentioned more - and apparently didn't care that, blatantly, there was more Anen conversation than Pere conversation.
5. He then asks me to defend my stance again.
6. At this point he has looked at the posts (by his own admission) and chosen to use an odd metric (number of times a name was mentioned) instead of "oh - look, he posted a whole lot about Anen and almost nothing about Pere" which is the actual situation.
7. I point out that I find his metric dumb.
8. He responds by posting all the comments and noting the size of the posts - that said he is including in the Pere quotes huge sections not discussing Pere, which make them appear larger.
9. At this point I am starting to believe he isn't reading anything and is attacking me weirdly.
10. I point out that the post size compare he did is not legit due to the padding.
11. He claims I am moving the goalposts to quality and again is demanding that I back up my case.
12. I claim I never moved the goalposts and ask him how he came to the conclusion I did.
13. He claims I am moving the goalposts to quality and again is demanding that I back up my case.
14. Other people agree with him.
15. I point out what is obvious if you read the posts - that Shiro talked about Anen far more than Pere and did an unexplained vote move.
16. Everyone claims that my delay in pointing out something that is obvious to anyone who reads the posts is scummy and that muffin's name count thing was somehow a legit reaction because saying "amount they were discussed" is somehow a vague statement that apparently can mean "amount a given word appears in an Iso as opposed to amount of words spent on a given subject"

And here we are.
Where do you think my above narrative differs from reality?.
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Post Post #3754 (isolation #438) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 5:23 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3750, davesaz wrote:Not only did Muffin adjust his analysis of the number of mentions according to your revised criteria, he also provided a specific analysis of the trend in the quoted posts. "Not to mention if you go through them chronologically there is a clear progression of reads."

I will agree Muffin did these things.
I will disagree that they had anything to do with my point.
He notes that Anen moved toa town read which justifies the Anen unvote, sure. But Pere was *already* a town read - and so we have a lot of conversation to unvote a town read and no conversation to vote a town read - and thus my case remains. Basically Muffin was debating something I never called scummy and pointing out that it wasn't scummy. It was a non-starter for me as a conversation.

In post 3750, davesaz wrote:You go on to attack him on the last sentence of the post. Which is pointing out, ahead of your reply to it, that the section that I pulled out proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that Muffin
was
taking quality into account! And you continued to attack him for the number of mentions, after he had already shown that the actual content of the Shiro quotes disproves your case.

I'm not sure I follow this. It should not have excited me that he took quality into account - because I never noted quality as any part of my case and never did and never accussed him of not doing so.
He also did not show the content difference, except by the specific metric of 'number of times a name was mentioned' which - as I mentioned, was weird and not about what I said.
I would note that Shiro, the writer of the posts, agrees with me insofar as my claim that he talked about Anen more than Pere - why does no one else?

In post 3750, davesaz wrote:Also, you complain that the "filler" in the PereV posts was commentary about you. Which, as scum, you want to discredit.

You are aware that Shiro was claling me town in that commentary, right?
So my desperation was to disprove a case suggesting I was town?
What?
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Post Post #3755 (isolation #439) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 5:25 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Dave - honestly, your answer shows that you didn't really read my post, and that you didn't read the Shiro posts that the debate is about. yet you have a strong opinion on me for misrepping, discrediting, and dodging?

How can you draw that conclusion without reading?
And if you did read - how can you think i was annoyed at Muffin for not discussing quality or was trying to discredit someone for town reading me?
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Post Post #3756 (isolation #440) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 5:26 am

Post by Thor665 »

Unvote: Iz
Vote: Dave
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Post Post #3758 (isolation #441) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 5:42 am

Post by Thor665 »

That's not actually an answer to my raised issue.

I will agree I attacked Muffin for the word quality after he suggested I was using it - but that has nothing to do with you being proud of pointing out that he used it. You doing that actually shows a total lack of understanding of what the 'quality' issue even was, and it's such a departure from it that I believe it shows that you haven't read anything and are only debating the topic with the most superficial of understanding of it.

Why are you doing that?
And if you're not doing that - please justify the beliefs you held that I expressed as nonsensical for someone who had read them.
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Post Post #3759 (isolation #442) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 5:46 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3750, davesaz wrote:10. I point out that the post size compare he did is not legit due to the padding.
11. He claims I am moving the goalposts to quality and again is demanding that I back up my case.

Even in the post of mine you quoted you have the timeline of the quality thing explained - did you read this and then decide that the issue was that I didn't think muffin had brought up quality and that you needed to show that he had? That makes no sense.

I mean, when you say my narrative is missing the point or misrepping it - but you don't even understand the case...how do you justify saying that I'm misrepping it?
Yeah, I guess I am misrepping it if the case is the made up one in your head, but...what the hell, you don't vote people over that. That's crazy talk.

Oh, snap, GM, look, I'm dissing on people again.
Hey, Iz, look, I'm calling a case dumb again.
Soooo scummy Thor!
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Post Post #3761 (isolation #443) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 6:08 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3760, davesaz wrote:You attacked him for anticipating that you would discredit his new point, and the way you actually attacked him was by discrediting the anticipation (i.e. the use of the word quality).

When and where did I do this?
Because I didn't.

Post 3130 is when he attacks me based on quality.
Show me my attack on him as regards that prior.
Because you're noting 3159 - which is a response to his attack. Anyone who read that should be able to tell since, y'know, I quote his attack.

In post 3760, davesaz wrote:Or to put that another way, you made a bad case, someone debunked it, and instead of working to prove your case by adjusting to the debunk (town motive) you tried to discredit the debunker (scum motive).

He did not debunk my case - please refer to my timeline to show me where you think I leap off the rails.

In post 3760, davesaz wrote:BTW, that first sentence in this post. :up: :up: :up: That is what town do when someone misunderstands them. They don't merely fling their hands and try to discredit the poor sod who chooses to interact with them.

Well, yeah, except you flat out are saying things that don't make sense - whereas I am not. So it's kind of a conversation difference.
You also haven't explained why I was trying to discredit someone for town reading me - I also don't understand that.
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Post Post #3764 (isolation #444) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 6:48 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3762, davesaz wrote:To summarize, you say there is filler
about you
. I find the bolded part to be scummy regardless of the content of the filler.

So, when complaining that when comparing amount of talk between two players I point out that muffin is using posts talking primarily about someone other than the two people we're discussing then, because the conversation is about me, it's discrediting towards Shiro for me to mention that?

Do I have that correct?

In post 3763, davesaz wrote:And I'm not saying your posts don't make sense, or that they're wrong. I'm saying that they don't show town motivation.

However I will openly admit that I often write things that others have a hard time reading. Typically it is because I clearly see the logic and assume that others must also see it.

So my posts are correct and make sense but they are scummy because they lack town motivation.
How do they lack town motivation?

Also, you did not provide the quote or example about the 'quality' thing.
I flat out called you wrong/liar about that one - am I going to get a quote showing that it is, in fact, I who am wrong/lying or no?
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Post Post #3765 (isolation #445) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 6:50 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3763, davesaz wrote:And I'm not saying your posts don't make sense, or that they're wrong.

Also, weren't you claiming I was misrepping and discrediting?
Don't those two words kind of require me to not make sense or to be wrong?
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Post Post #3791 (isolation #446) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 5:36 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3771, davesaz wrote:Thor says something.
Someone disagrees with it.
Thor attacks the person who disagreed with him.

Disagreeing with things that others post is not scummy.
Attacking people who disagree with you is scummy, if you do it to the degree that Thor is doing it.

I don't see any way this position can be unclear. You're welcome to disagree with it.

I'm going to address this one because, like others - I track it better than your other response.

I'm also going to note that I feel you're re-setting your read on me. You stilla re calling me scum but now there's a different set of criteria than when I started talking to you, and I don't like it.

Now addressing the actual point - you say I attack the people not the argument. I claim I attack the argument, and, if I find the argument to be nonsensical - I state as such.
At some point, i am willing to agree that this can blur the line.
That said - as far as the people I've actually called scum (and I'm using that language to rule out both GM in specific (who I *have* directly attacked her playstyle as opposed to her case...of course the case doesn't exist, but...hey ;) ) and also I have attacked...well, *everyone in the game* for how they push lynches (or - more accurately...don't).
But besides those - no, I actually dispute your call that I'm attacking players over case.

I have called cases dumb, stupid, nonsensical, unsupported, and lies.
But I have called the cases that.
I have called lines of questioning obtuse, meaningless, and boring.
But I have called the questions that.

I'm allowed to do that.
It *is* attacking.
It is *not* attacking players - because if you want to claim I'm attacking them...I'm attacking them *through* their case, questions, attacks, et al.
That is called attacking a case.
I am doing that.
It is so far and away from being scummy that I will admit I, again, find your case shallow and lacking.

Basically you appear to be complaining that I'm mean and want to suggest that's scummy - while also overlooking that 90% of my mean-ocity is directly addressed towards cases and situations within the game - which you, at the same time, are claiming attacks on as okay.

Back up your claim - I'm calling this (like some previous things that you have failed to back up and fled on) to be more lies.
Note that I am calling your claim a lie there. Try not to freak out and claim this as more "downplaying" or something.
Because it is a downplay - but it's a downplay on a case, and a stance, and something I am openly calling a lie.

I also would like to reiterate that you haven't backed up some of your other whoppers.
I believe this is because you are scum.
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Post Post #3792 (isolation #447) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 5:44 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3772, goodmorning wrote:
In post 3083, Thor665 wrote:You did take forever to say anything of worth - and then
voted Pere out of the blue with no justification despite making a wall on Anen
. That feels wonky to me.

In post 3089, Muffin wrote:Here's the "wall" in question, about Anen. I note without surprise that
the first line explicitly shows Shiro's diminishing scumread on Anen.
Given the proximity of deadline I do not see any internal inconsistency there.

You took a question of content (was Pere vote justified? suspicion of Anen was dropping) and turned it into quantity (so much more thought on Anen).

So that was about content huh?
I guess I just included that note about a wall as random window dressing and what I really meant was not 'the compare and contrast of the effort for the opinion shift' but rather 'is it possible to suggest there was a presented thought flow on at least 50% of the equation I'm complaining about"

Yeah - that's what I meant.
:neutral:

In post 3773, goodmorning wrote:What is this, the second OMGUS vote today?

Or third or still zero depending on how you count them.
What's this? An empty buzzword lobbed at a case to try to act like scumhunting :lol:

If you find my votes unsupported - come at me. Don't snipe from the sidelines like scum.

In post 3788, Izariael wrote:
@Thor:
what are your thoughts pon this statement by Slandaar? He was in immediate support of your scumread on Shiro's vote, yet suggests votimg for a townread as a valid play provided the reason stated is sufficient. How does it read to you?

I will admit I do not fully track this question. I'm going to answer a couple and hopefully that will answer yours.

1. If Shiro had offered reasoning for voting Pere would you have found her vote objectionable?
2. Would you have found it less objectionable?
3. Do you find hypocrisy/contradiction in Slandaar's statement (which is sort of what I think you're asking...but it's really weirdly stated if so)

------------

1. Yes. Voting a town read is screwy - period.
2. Yes. I find it to be terrible play but am uncomfortably aware that some people consider it okay for reasons...that escape me.
3. No, since I can also hold the belief that the vote would have been less screwy if it had been discussed more I do not find it unusual that Slandaar appears to share this thought, which from what I'm reading of him appears to be what he's saying.
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Post Post #3793 (isolation #448) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 5:47 pm

Post by Thor665 »

Thor's quick primer on game advice


Hey, guys, it's less than a week till deadline.
Do we all remember how awesome the Pere wagon went?

Probably if you support the wagon on me and/or would "vote me to avoid a no lynch" then...well, ruddy vote me now, get behind your play, and put me at L-1 with hammer intent so this game can advance.

If you *don't* support me as scum/lynch to avoid no lynch then you need to get in, move your vote around and/or start pushing your case in any way at all - because otherwise you're voting for me via lazy derp rather than just liking a silly wagon.

You should all pick one.

I really like the Dave wagon right now - I will happily accept further sheep.

Hint: any wagon that isn't me or a wagon someone is actively pushing (currently that would be a wagon on Dave, as no one else is pushing gak) is a wasted vote.

Further hint: that's like half of you -stop failing at Mafia please.
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Post Post #3796 (isolation #449) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 7:27 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3794, Izariael wrote:I'm mostly curious about #2. It just seems strange that you seem to be scumreading Shiro, who evidently DOES buy into the idea of voting a lesser townread to avoid no-lynch, and yet are not calling out another player who is suggesting that that same idea would be viable with slightly different execution.

Oh, was it a lesser town read now? That's info Siro never clarified. I'll agree that makes sense to presume but...I think you're starting to notice part of the issue.
I do not agree the issue would be "viable" with a different execution but I do agree it would look 'less scummy' with a different execution.
I've been asked this before and answered already - I almost want to say you asked me this before, so this is kind of annoying now.

In post 3794, Izariael wrote:Also, why do you find Shiro's vote scum-motivated if you are fully aware that townies may be in support of avoiding no-lynch by any means necessary (such as voting a townread/nullread)?

Well...maybe it's for the reasons I stated as my issue with it a few dozen pages ago.
Cue reason #129847 that Thor is being
tetchy
scummy!

As I said already, many times, the issue is that Shiro went into this vast revelation where Anen went from scum to town, to the point that he was worthy of an unvote. Followed quickly by a vote for another town read.

The flow makes very little sense, and screamed out for deeper explanation. If you're going to go into a wall explaining why Anen is a town read now than probably the town read you're voting deserves, y'know, a sentence of conversation. An explanation? At least maybe a mention of 'he's town, but I have a stronger read on Anen and Thor to be town, huzzah!' something? The amount of extroversion of the Anen explanation paired with the lack for Pere made the expressed attitude and vote feel faked.

I have said this all before.
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Post Post #3804 (isolation #450) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:13 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3802, davesaz wrote:And before anybody goes like "ooh, AtE". It's real folks. NOBODY calls me a liar. Even when I'm scum, I do my best not to lie. I'm WRONG a lot, but I avoid LYING at all costs.

Then I would have preferred more admission of your multiple mistakes early on as opposed to drawing it out and calling me a Smurfhole for pointing out that you had very questionable awareness of the case you were pushing on me.

Y'know, when someone says stuff that 'is not correct' I will point out that I'm actually giving you the benefit of the doubt by calling you scum because I don't believe town would push something they are aware that they have a questionable grasp of.

Who do you think is scum now that I'm just a jerk?

@Axle - do you think that Garmr wagon has any real traction?

What's your read on Dave, Iz, and GM?
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Post Post #3805 (isolation #451) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:15 pm

Post by Thor665 »

Though actually I have to admit that Dave's AtE is working on me.
Admission of utter wrong is not something scum usually care to do to themselves.

Unvote: Dave
Vote: Goodmorning


How many OMGUS votes is that for me now? :lol:
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Post Post #3806 (isolation #452) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:16 pm

Post by Thor665 »

@Dave - is there any other game on this site or another where someone called you a liar and you had a similar reaction?
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Post Post #3807 (isolation #453) » Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:17 pm

Post by Thor665 »

If the answer is 'no' I may just reverse this town read - let's call you a 'balancing on null' read instead.
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Post Post #3843 (isolation #454) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 7:00 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3808, davesaz wrote:
Pedit - is suggesting scanning my posts for a phrase a mention of events in an ongoing game? I know that I clearly can't post a link... I will refrain from saying anything further. And TBH it could be in one of two games, one of which is finished...

So...could you provide me a link to any of those or no?

In post 3811, AxleGreaser wrote:I think it had more votes and traction than any wagon except the one on you appeared to have.
I think it has good basis. That it has had so little impact makes me wonder how i should have explained it.

It has votes, but it has no traction. Currently your wagon mates are Slandaar (who is not pushing the wagon at all) Scripten (who is a lurksack) and Shiro (who, again, is not pushing it at all). That wagon is going nowhere and it's going there fast. Most other people seem to either a. not understand the case b. have a town read on Garmr or c. both. Would you like to unvote and vote Goodmorning? You also scumread her and it's pretty clear that Garmr wagon isn't getting any new votes anytime soon, so sitting on it is basically a Thor vote.

@Nero
@Fonz

Free hint - you lurksacks are sitting on a useless wagon. Why? WHat are you accomplishing down there? Why not vote me or GM?

@Tiershift - Dave wagon is dead unless he fails to produce some meta on his liar wail - how about voting GM for a time with me. Or at least moving to help a wagon doing *anything at all*.

@Boon - dear gawd, how many lursacks are in this game? Yo, sack face - pretend to be town, vote somewhere useful and stop posting prod dodges like a fail player scum face.

@Beast - are you kidding me?

@Dave - provide the link, also get your vote back in play and be a man.
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Post Post #3844 (isolation #455) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 7:00 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3842, Aegor wrote:
Upon player request, the deadline is not being suspended. At the deadline, either/both of the two slots that remain(s) unfilled will simply be modkilled. There may be a deadline extension if I get replacements.

Hey, everyone - Thor is now mod confirmed town.

Shock.
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Post Post #3845 (isolation #456) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 7:01 am

Post by Thor665 »

This is actually hilarious.
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Post Post #3849 (isolation #457) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 7:50 am

Post by Thor665 »

I was able to follow that but, as you must be aware, that doesn't help me much at this juncture and we can't discuss it further.

Did you ever do anything of the sort in a completed game?
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Post Post #3851 (isolation #458) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 8:37 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3850, The Fonz wrote:Iz/Slandaar is making me feel better about both of them.

In post 3738, Thor665 wrote:
In post 3707, TierShift wrote:iza is town. he is. thor, look elsewhere.

Is this read for the wall/effort=town or anything else?
Because earlier he did a cop out on the case and now he's champion of the case, and I can't read the shift as easily as you apparently do.


Thor, can you explain this? I don't need a wall, and Iz has been giving me some gut scumvibes, but when I look in detail I can't pin down anything specific.

I'm not sure what there is to explain - I'm asking Tier a question there and describing two things that Iz did and asking for Tier's conclusions.

In post 3850, The Fonz wrote:
Thor, will you consider wagoning Flubber?
There's very little to like there. Goodmorning just sucks. She's unlikely to be scum.

Eh, if you can get that wagon bigger I'll move. But honestly I'm not feeling it. I'd probably rather lynch a lirksack like you or TSO than Flubber, frankly.
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Post Post #3856 (isolation #459) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:36 am

Post by Thor665 »

I scumread Haep - but I seem to recall getting some blowback on that point, so I'm thinking some people town read him.
Why, wanna make a sudden rush wagon there?
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Post Post #3858 (isolation #460) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:07 am

Post by Thor665 »

That's bull-hooey - you'd also have his wagon to analyze and who joined or didn't.
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Post Post #3863 (isolation #461) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:35 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3859, TierShift wrote:
In post 3843, Thor665 wrote:@Tiershift - Dave wagon is dead unless he fails to produce some meta on his liar wail - how about voting GM for a time with me. Or at least moving to help a wagon doing *anything at all*.

Sry, bit disconnected atm.

V/la from tomorrow till sunday

:neutral:
:neutral:
:neutral:
:neutral:
:neutral:
:neutral:
:neutral:
:neutral:

In post 3862, Izariael wrote:
In post 3858, Thor665 wrote:That's bull-hooey - you'd also have his wagon to analyze and who joined or didn't.


I don't think voting a Hephaestus wagon would be as alignment-indicative as voting a more active player's wagon, and would therefore not be as informative. You are welcome to disagree, but my stance on this is not likely to change.

You have perfectly described why lurking is a scum strategy.
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Post Post #3865 (isolation #462) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:44 am

Post by Thor665 »

...and why you apparently oppose the idea of lynching it.
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Post Post #3900 (isolation #463) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 6:31 pm

Post by Thor665 »

This page needed more vote activity.

Beast was scummy prod dodging - that is literally the only worthwhile thing that happened.
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Post Post #3901 (isolation #464) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 6:31 pm

Post by Thor665 »

:lol:
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Post Post #3903 (isolation #465) » Thu Nov 13, 2014 6:53 pm

Post by Thor665 »

Stuff like what you just posted is a good example.

Seriously? With no vote in play, deadline looming, and people offering cases *this* is what you want to talk about?
That's a prod dodge and scummy.

So was saying hello last page.

So was popping up the instant you were voted and saying 'sorry, lazy and forgot about game, lulz!'

You are scummy prod dodging. Do you consider what you're doing to resemble town-anything?
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Post Post #3946 (isolation #466) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 5:50 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3940, reinoe wrote:Axle is trying really hard to distract from the thor wagon. And the people saying thor is town have done a rather poor job of explaining how he's town.

Well, the people calling me scum have also failed.

That said, I think *everyone* is doing a pretty good job of distracting from the Thor wagon (including you and this weak nothing post) because STILL NO ONE HAS PUT ME TO L-1 OR BOTHERED TO WORK ON CREATING A COUNTERWAGON.

What the hell is wrong with all of you?
It's like you're *TRYING* to make a deadline wagon?

Screw you all and the horse you rode in on.

Claim: Power role - I'll claim the rest if someone can put me to L-1 with a hammer intent *or* we can start up a counterwagon and pretend we know how to play the game.
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Post Post #3947 (isolation #467) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 5:51 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3945, Flubbernugget wrote:I see a compromise lynch on thor come deadline.

Oh wow, no, really?
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Post Post #3955 (isolation #468) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 6:47 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3953, goodmorning wrote:FTR I don't believe that Thor is a Town PR.

Good - so engage people and push the wagon on me to L-1 to back up your stance.

Repeat Claim because people are still derping around.
I CLAIMED TO BE A PR.
Let's make a wagon happen lackwits.
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Post Post #3959 (isolation #469) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 7:01 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Slandaar - would you support a GM or Beast wagon and will you move your vote? If not, could you explain by specifically stating th ename, what player you expect to get to join the Garmr wagon due to your efforts of convincing them to move their vote?
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Post Post #3964 (isolation #470) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 7:11 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3961, goodmorning wrote:Prolonged pushing of a wagon on a player who's better than me is tiring.

Then you should have enough oomph for about 48 hours since you haven't been pushing me in any meaningful way at all yet this game.
Get moving - pick someone who isn't voting me and convince them why I'm scum.

In post 3960, davesaz wrote:I'd be in favor of a TSO lynch as an alternative, since we're having so much trouble getting any of the existing wagons going. TSO failing to provide an Anen case D1 is the kind of behavior I'd expect from scum who discover their case holds no water. And a NK makes perfect sense as a way to silence that subject forever. Lurking / soft replacing out also fits the profile of almost caught scum who want to lay low.

So you town read Beast, GM, and Thor?
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Post Post #3966 (isolation #471) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 7:18 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3964, Thor665 wrote:pick someone who isn't voting me and convince them why I'm scum.

@GM

You aren't even needing to debate me to do this - c'mon, this is townplay 101. Make it happen.
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Post Post #3975 (isolation #472) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:13 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3968, davesaz wrote:Regarding Beast, I don't think we have time to force enough interaction to accurately read. Lynching TSO would give us the ability to associate either way the flip goes, while Beast gives us next to nothing on associations. IIRC...

This is a bad reason not to vote Beast.
You also had all day today to try to force interactions - how about we force an L-1 counterwagon and see what we learn from that, you're always allowed to move if he makes you read him as scum during that period.

In post 3971, Shiro wrote:@Thor In case I am musreading this. Did u feel like slander was trying to be your buddy during day 2 ?

No, clearly when I openly called out that he was buddying and defending me in a weird way what I meant was 'I am not getting any buddying or defending vibes from him in any way'

Why are you talking about Slandaar when voting Garmr?
Do you scumread me - if so you should be voting me now.
Do you town read me? If so you should be doing something to advance your Garmr case or be getting off of him and doing "anything at all" with your vote.

In post 3972, The Fonz wrote:I want you to expand 'did a cop out' and how you think his attitude appears to have changed, and what you think that implies.

He did a cop out - I called it a dodging a question when he did it. We had a discussion for about a page on it.
His attitude changed because then he started fighting me.
I personally think it shows poor play, but am asking Tier about it because he townread it.

In post 3972, The Fonz wrote:Please don't call me a Smurfing lurksack.

Then stop being one.

In post 3972, The Fonz wrote: For one, I've provided more actual content than Flub.

Congratulations, you are less of a lurksack than another lurksack?

In post 3972, The Fonz wrote:But mostly, when you're absurdly pressed for time and spending half your waking, non-working hours on a game, it's annoying as Smurf. I'm obviously giving my Smurfing everything to scumhunting here, and other people having more free time does not make me a godSmurf lurksack.

It is not obvious that you are giving everything.
The game day is almost over, you are on a useless wagon, and you are not doing anything to advance an L-1 situation or to press the action, or to affect a deaadline lynch of a player you claim to read as town.
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Post Post #3978 (isolation #473) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:21 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Scripten - nice case. That wagon is dead though. Please react to the current pushes.

WOuld you be willing to vote Thor, Slandaar, GM, or Beast?
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Post Post #3980 (isolation #474) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:26 am

Post by Thor665 »

The Garmr wagon last had life about a week ago - if that doesn't make it dead I don't know what does.

How about you vote GM just to see what happens?
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Post Post #3984 (isolation #475) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:38 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3983, davesaz wrote:Can you refresh the case against GM? I want to see what you point out and compare that to other material where alignment is known.

For me, I just find the slot useless and a better lynch than me due to useless.
That's also my case on Beast.
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Post Post #3985 (isolation #476) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:39 am

Post by Thor665 »

If I voted TSO - it would also be my case on him.
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Post Post #3987 (isolation #477) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:44 am

Post by Thor665 »

Nah. I am mild town on Slandaar.
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Post Post #3990 (isolation #478) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 9:03 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3988, Shiro wrote:And if so can u tear my case to pieces so I can consider joining yours instead ?

He claimed a while ago that he has been pushing wagons and hard at that. Do u think that is true ?

Do u think he is being usefull "pushing" the gamr wagon ?

1. I didn't say I had a strong town read on him. I don't find your case telling but I have little desire to go to bat for the slot either based on my read.

2. Not really, but then I don't think that's true of basically anyone in this game so maybe my standards are insane.

3. No - but I would paint everyone, including yourself, who was voting Garmr with that same brush, so I don't think it's a valid issue to call someone scum over.
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Post Post #3996 (isolation #479) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 9:33 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3991, Shiro wrote:1 Eh at least direct me as to why it is not telling or at least not better than anything else

2. Your standar are pretty high then. I mean there is a wagon on u and Axl pushed gamr pretty hard

3.Sure but Axl.Scripten and I at least tried to push and although admitidly I was late to switch my vote I pushed Sland. He did nothing of that sorts.

1. The case is basically 'he is wuss pushing' to which my reply is 'so is basically everyone'.

2. The wagon on me is based on idiocy and no one is pushing it and the only reason it is a threat is it's sitting there as the biggest with no one doing anything else with their vote. that wagon is dead too - but by dint of deadline is currently the most likely to happen.

3. Sure.

In post 3992, AxleGreaser wrote:
In post 3980, Thor665 wrote:The Garmr wagon last had life about a week ago - if that doesn't make it dead I don't know what does.

being the largest wagon apart from the one on you.

That doesn't make it a healthy wagon.

In post 3994, AxleGreaser wrote:and yeah while I am prepared to vote GM today, for the reasons I posted in the thread.

Then vote her - or tell me the 1-2 people you see as about to vote Garmr. Either response is viable in my opinion.
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Post Post #4005 (isolation #480) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 10:08 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3999, davesaz wrote:Really? And you expect anyone to vote that?
Tell me again, what are your contributions other than yelling very loudly?
I mean, is it really that much of a distinction that people listen? Last I heard by way of vote count, fewer were listening to you than GM. :lol:

My contributions are not sitting around doing nothing and acting like it means something.

In post 3998, AxleGreaser wrote:
How about you post a nice case on GM and see what happens.

I gave my case on GM.
You gave *your* case for GM.
Your current wagon is a load.

Wake up - be proactive.
Hell, be proactive on that load - again, who are the people about to vote it? Go get them if they exist.
If not, move and compromise.
This game is stall derp city.

In post 4001, Scripten wrote:I don't understand why Thor just refuses to vote Garmr when his scumreads are based on such weak criteria.

Because I have weak criteria town reads.

Why not vote GM now and make the game more exciting?
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Post Post #4007 (isolation #481) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 10:31 am

Post by Thor665 »

Board frustration.
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Post Post #4008 (isolation #482) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 10:31 am

Post by Thor665 »

Bored - even.
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Post Post #4010 (isolation #483) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 10:51 am

Post by Thor665 »

I'm not kidding.
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Post Post #4013 (isolation #484) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 11:22 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4011, AxleGreaser wrote:You appear to be telling me I should play my town game, like some people play scum, and find some wagon that is popular and park my vote there.

I'm actually encouraging you to unpark last I checked.
And, yes, I am encouraging you to work to get scum reads lynched as opposed to not doing that.
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Post Post #4015 (isolation #485) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 11:26 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4014, reinoe wrote:3) the case on Thor is solid.

Remind me what it is again - because I'm still pretty sure everything I've heard is 'playstyle'.
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Post Post #4024 (isolation #486) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 1:17 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4016, reinoe wrote:
In post 4015, Thor665 wrote:
In post 4014, reinoe wrote:3) the case on Thor is solid.

Remind me what it is again - because I'm still pretty sure everything I've heard is 'playstyle'.

You can hear what you want, but what's been said and what you choose to hear are not the same thing.

So in other words - yes, I'm correct.

In post 4022, The Fonz wrote:No-one's trying Thor? Really? What the hell do you think I was trying to do in ask if you'd join me on Flubber? Have a nice chat?

Who else did you ask?

Want to vote GM, Beast, Slandaar, or me now?
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Post Post #4025 (isolation #487) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 1:21 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4023, The Fonz wrote:Given that your stated preference for me or TSO (who's requested replacement) over Flub is that 'You'd rather lynch a lurksack like me' that the alternative I'm pressing is more of a 'lurksack' is at least somewhat relevant.

I was actually pointing out that if your ability to defend your lurksackiness is based off saying you're better than another player who isn't saying or doing much - it's not a defense.

In post 4023, The Fonz wrote:Ex-Smurfing scuse me? Why is my wagon useless? It isn't a one-man vanity wagon, and the only clearly more viable counterwagon is Josh.

So it's 3rd wagon - who was the last person to vote for it and when?
That's why it's useless.
I shouldn't need to explain to you what rain looks like - you've been around the block a few times. Stop acting shocked that you're wet.
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Post Post #4030 (isolation #488) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 1:38 pm

Post by Thor665 »

If people were being as aggressive about it as I was about Pere I would not be calling it dead.
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Post Post #4040 (isolation #489) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 3:10 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4033, davesaz wrote:Thor, as a result of my epiphany, I was
really
expecting a different kind of answer.
If you really have no confidence that GM is scum, then kindly pick someone who is actually scummy instead of useless.
Staying on a no confidence and no reason wagon leads me to believe your "power role" is non-town. That impression can still be fixed.

:neutral:

In post 4034, AxleGreaser wrote:@Thor
What if the GM wagon just wont go/fly.
Who would be your second best lynch? (Well get to why if there is any common ground.)

Dave - since he ducked backing up the AtE.

In post 4039, goodmorning wrote:Thor happened to come up with a trumped-up semantic case on Pere and not only forced his lynch through but also did so in a way that would make Pere look a fool.

:neutral:
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Post Post #4043 (isolation #490) » Fri Nov 14, 2014 4:02 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4012, Josh_B wrote:I would still easily support a Thor lynch if fonz wagon doesn't pick up in the next couple of days.

Vote me now then you lackwit.
That Fonz wagon is assuredly going nowhere with you hemming and hawing like that.
Also, people should, theoretically, have forced my claim about two days ago.
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Post Post #4074 (isolation #491) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 4:36 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4053, davesaz wrote:Thor has basically been begging to be put at L-1 so he can feel justified in full claiming. I don't get the mentality on this site that says it's scummy to claim earlier than L-1, but whatever. Though there is a double standard on that, few people seem to think that Boon's claim is terribly scummy. Though that is possibly just due to how silly the claim is.

I don't find claims prior to L-1 to be scummy.
That said - I also see no reason to claim with the case on me being what it is until I get to L-1, and frankly I was just so bored I wanted to provide *something* for people to either vote me or unvote me for.
It managed neither.

In post 4053, davesaz wrote:@ALL: What are we going to do if Thor claims something we can't/shouldn't lynch?

Since that will probably happen about 4 hours till deadline - I hope what you will do is recognize how bad your play has been ;)

In post 4055, The Fonz wrote:@Thor - GM is a town read. I'd prefer Josh. Beast has literally no votes. I'm not sure why I should compromise onto a
less
viable wagon. Give me 3 votes, and we'll talk.

Heck, get me 1 on Garmr and we'll talk. I'm working GM, not Beast - I thought that was obvious.
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Post Post #4076 (isolation #492) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 4:49 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4075, Shiro wrote:If I vote Garmr again would you consider voting him as well ?

No, because;

1. You would be a sideways gain as they just lost you a little bit ago.

2. I would still town read the slot.
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Post Post #4077 (isolation #493) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 4:58 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4048, Aegor wrote:
Votecount 2.12


[5]
Thor665:
goodmorning, Izariael, reinoe, Flubbernugget, davesaz
[3]
Josh_B:
Scripten, AxleGreaser, Slandaar
[2]
Flubbernugget:
Nero Cain, The Fonz
[1]
Boonskiies:
T S O
[1]
davesaz:
TierShift
[1]
goodmorning:
Thor665
[1]
reinoe:
Boonskiies
[1]
Slandaar:
Shiro
[1]
The Fonz:
Josh_B

[1]
Not Voting:
beastcharizard

With 17 alive, it takes 9 to lynch.

Day 2 deadline:
(expired on 2014-11-19 18:27:52)

Mod Notes

TierShift V/LA until Sunday
Boonskies, Nero Cain, T S O prodded.

So we have Boon, Nero, and TSO who are all just sucking at the game - though at least Boon has his claim to skate on.

We have the Thor derp wagon which is becoming weaker for...no apparent reason, I dunno, maybe people are noticing it is derp? Though Dave is back - shock.
The Garmr/Josh wagon is still desperately holding onto 2nd while *also* becoming weaker - again, shock.
A 2 vote wagon is sitting in solid 3rd place with FOnz acting like that means anything right now beyond derp.
6 wagons that can't get any support.
And Beast trying hard to suck worse than Nero, Boon, and TSO.

Deadline is in 4 days and we haven't even managed a claim yet.

The hell, people?
This is Day 1 except even more embarrassing.

Unvote: GM
Vote: Dave


There.
@Fonz - oooh, fear my equally powerful wagon on Dave - good thing you're so active that you'll get stuff done!

@Shiro - come join us on Dave, his actions read pretty fake to me - what about to you?
@Josh_B/Garmr wagon - you are noticing how Dave has been working every new wagon except yours, right? So if we want to go on the theory that your wagon is the most brilliant thing ever and people just aren't noticing - heck, sounds like a reason to flip Dave, because if he's scum than Garmr looks worse.
@Boonskies - vote Dave - it's vastly more useful than your current useless vote.
@TSO - vote Dave - it's vastly more useful than your current useless vote.
@Josh - you should be voting me, as you said. It's 4 days y'know. Really now.
@Thor wagon - I'm actually pushing harder for you guys to get votes on me than you are. Why do all of you fail at the basic concept of "I caught scum and want to lynch them"?
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Post Post #4079 (isolation #494) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:19 am

Post by Thor665 »

Beast sucks too, but Dave has more votes on him.
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Post Post #4080 (isolation #495) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:20 am

Post by Thor665 »

Frankly, with the utter fail of people to do anything about them today;

Beast, TSO, and Nero are all optimal Vig targets.
They're also not bad targets for any SK who wants to pretend to be a Vig later.
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Post Post #4083 (isolation #496) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:28 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4082, AxleGreaser wrote:
In post 4079, Thor665 wrote:Beast sucks too, but Dave has more votes on him.

and I dont see
your reasons
for voting that wagon , except some cool kids popularity meme

:facepalm:

Allow me to save us some time;

I presented my reasons when I analyzed my wagon at its peak.
You will now go and look at it and say 'those aren't reasons enough' ignoring that the way you and I make cases is drastically different.
You will write a long and boring post that I will skip past showing off your case on somebody and will have bullet points and colored words.
You will then ask me for a "real" case and I will refuse to make a case remotely resembling yours.

Where would you like to go from here now that we've had that conversation for the third time?
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Post Post #4087 (isolation #497) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 6:33 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4085, davesaz wrote:Furthermore, Thor saw Boon claim a PR and get away scot free, so he did it too. At the time I thought that this, along with the steadfast GM vote for "uselessness" was crumbing cop or tracker. But then Thor refused to answer when I asked him about confidence. It's a fake claim, and we should lynch it.

Yes, because when, as cop or tracker, I would open the day with a vote on Shiro, then move to you, and then shift to GM when I have a guilty.
That makes sense.
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Post Post #4088 (isolation #498) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 6:34 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4086, reinoe wrote:Six vanity wagons!!! What a display of hubris!

There's only five now.
You should be pushing the Thor wagon more.
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Post Post #4090 (isolation #499) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 6:49 am

Post by Thor665 »

So ignore them and pay attention to the 3 man wagon and the two 2 man wagons.
Your wagon on me is still the biggest, but currently I'm at L-4 which isn't exactly cause for pants-wetting fear last I checked.
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Post Post #4092 (isolation #500) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 7:15 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Slandaar - what's your read on Dave?

I have shown that he pushed a case on me while he had no idea of what the case was, got him to admit that and unvote me, and then he kind of slides back onto me because he thought I was pushing some cop thing when nothing I had said or done remotely suggested that I was. So he's proven as not reading the thread while pushing cases based on things he doens't understand and being okay with that - that's a pro-town lynch regardless and sounds like lazy scum to me. What's your read?
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Post Post #4096 (isolation #501) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 8:26 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4095, The Fonz wrote:TL/DR: It feels like by having Thor and GM wagons, it's just the people who disliked the PV push yesterday and the Thor push today scapegoating the most vocal/passionate advocate of each wagon, when I think it's more likely scum are more somewhere less prominent in either case. Flubber's 'Blame Thor AND Peregrine for NOISE' stuff feels scum-motivated.

Though there hasn't been a GM wagon, really. The biggest it got was...three? It definitely made two.
Does that affect this read?
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Post Post #4100 (isolation #502) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 8:52 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4098, The Fonz wrote:Nope. It probably means I should have been less passive aggressive and directed it straight at you, tho.

I feel like you are not paying attention that I have switched to Dave and he is currently tied for third largest wagon.
Not that this is saying that much, but it is in the context of what you're saying here.
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Post Post #4124 (isolation #503) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 1:00 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4109, Shiro wrote:@Thor You are voting people on the premise that they are better targets than you. That can apply to josh and too add to that you yourself admitted that you found his thought process un-towny

I am also not voting people I vaguely town read in any way at all - it still leaves me a lot of latitude.
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Post Post #4136 (isolation #504) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 2:54 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4134, Josh_B wrote:Considering the recent play, Thor seems to be holding onto to a claim the closer we get to deadline, the harder it will be to reverse a wagon if it goes higher.

:roll:
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Post Post #4138 (isolation #505) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 3:16 pm

Post by Thor665 »

No - do you scum read it?
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Post Post #4142 (isolation #506) » Sat Nov 15, 2014 4:44 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4139, Josh_B wrote:Squirell, you aren't really giving me much to work with here.

Sorry, maybe in my next 500 posts I'll say something alignment indicative?

In post 4139, Josh_B wrote:YOu don' seem to be interested in actually starting another wagon even though it's your head that on' the chopping block.

...I really disagree with this statement and would note I have attempted multiple wagon pushes.
Hell, I've half started pushing the wagon on *me*.
This game is filled with people horrified by the idea of standing behind a vote.
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Post Post #4164 (isolation #507) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 6:53 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4144, AxleGreaser wrote:I dont get consistent feel for his flow of thought from him,
so yeah its another bit,
Its certainly not a towny feel.

You have identified that his reads for me are unclear - that was clear the instant he indicated he'd vote me for a deadline reason and I bullied him into doing it now.
I don't think that makes it scummy.

In post 4153, Shiro wrote:@Thor Dave wagon is going to oblivion and it is going there fast. Like u said to us either sell the wagon so people sheep it or vote someone that might go anywhere other than nowhere.

And yet it is tied for third largest wagon in the game right now.
It is not going to oblivion, it has gotten stronger within the past 24 hours. if you moved to it then it would be the solidly third largest wagon and a strong contender for 2nd place (or tied for second? I forget)

Why not move and reinvigorate it?
It's less dead than your wagon of choice at the moment.

In post 4160, davesaz wrote:Does anyone know Thor's meta to know well enough to say whether his drop in interest / reduced push is alignment indicative?

:neutral:
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Post Post #4165 (isolation #508) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 6:55 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4150, Aegor wrote:Day 2 deadline: 3 days, 4 hours, 34 minutes

Also, people - you *still* haven't forced a claim from me. Why do all of you fail?
If no one is willing to vote me from the non-voting mass maybe you should move.
The Dave wagon is accepting applicants.
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Post Post #4167 (isolation #509) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:09 am

Post by Thor665 »

I do not deny it is weak.
But in the context of this game it is of above average size.
And, again, by the sheer act of you moving a vote it would become tied for 2nd strongest wagon - and the Thor wagon has been sitting at 'someone man up' for some time now and no one is stepping up, meaning that the only way that one is happening is deadline. Which means, if you think I'm town, you might as well shake things up. And if you don't think I'm town, then work to put me at L-1 with a hammer intent and stop wasting time.
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Post Post #4168 (isolation #510) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:11 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4167, Thor665 wrote:Which means, if you think I'm town, you might as well shake things up. And if you don't think I'm town, then work to put me at L-1 with a hammer intent and stop wasting time.

Really, this is my boggle at the moment.
Everyone not moving a vote is functionally voting for me...except they are refusing to do it till deadline for some stupid reason.

So either move votes - or vote me. Pick one you narf-heads.
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Post Post #4171 (isolation #511) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:48 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Boon - dude - you vote sucks. What are you even doing there while posting empty gak?
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Post Post #4174 (isolation #512) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:56 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Boon - thank you for finding a set.

I'm now at L-2.

Again, people should either vote me to force the claim or move their votes somewhere useful.
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Post Post #4192 (isolation #513) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 9:37 am

Post by Thor665 »

I don't think I'm hammered and found it comical to watch people acting confused.

If I am I wish you all to have to read my posts for my reads.

I'll claim at hammer intent.
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Post Post #4198 (isolation #514) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:04 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4194, Nero Cain wrote:
intent to hammer

Cool - why do you find me worthy to hammer?

Claim: 1-shot JKer

Target - GM
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Post Post #4199 (isolation #515) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:05 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 2532, Thor665 wrote:Hey, GM, I'm keeping you in mind.

Crumb.

Not that this should come as a shock since besides claiming VT when being a scum PR - the only thing I ever lie about in claims is alignment.
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Post Post #4200 (isolation #516) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:07 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4197, Slandaar wrote:Yeah.

You were.

Reinoe was town.

VOTE: Boon

Shouldn't that make Reinoe scum, not Boon?
What am I missing here?
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Post Post #4205 (isolation #517) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:10 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4201, Boonskiies wrote:Oh, was he?

I was also town there, Thor.

So?

You said he was town and had the same reaction I had.
He just called my reaction a scum reaction.

So...what do you think that says about him? That he doesn't remember his town reactions or that he thinks what he does as town is scummy, or what?

Also - vote Dave please.
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Post Post #4208 (isolation #518) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:12 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4206, Slandaar wrote:Boon: 'I have seen someone do this before hammer them!' ... said person was town.

That suggests Boon had enough man parts to make a call on what he thought.
He didn't.

Of more interest is Reinoe - who did exactly what you're saying there.
So even if you think boon is scummy for it - certainly Reinoe is too, yes?
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Post Post #4218 (isolation #519) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:20 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4193, reinoe wrote:Guys this is a scum claim...

Doesn't know if he's hammered or not but doesn't post final thoughts.
While not explicitly denying town info, saying "my reads are in my other posts" is inconvenient.


In post 4195, Boonskiies wrote:I believe I've been in a game where Reinoe did the exact same thing as Thor is doing now. And I was in Reinoe's spot with the fake hammer.

In post 4196, Boonskiies wrote:So yes, hammer Thor.


As usual in this game, i am starting to feel like I am insane.

Both of these derfs both expressed the same thought - if one of them is scummy then both of them are scummy.
Why are we only talking about one of them?

Why are more people not voting Dave?
Even if you hate Boon for his derptitude play - Dave was doing the same things and kind of being shifty about it at the same time.
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Post Post #4219 (isolation #520) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:20 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4215, Josh_B wrote:Thor, I don't understand why you would want a GM lynch earlier if you Jailkept her. What were the results?

The results were that I submitted a JK on GM.
How do you think I should have read it?
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Post Post #4223 (isolation #521) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:22 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4214, Nero Cain wrote:I mostly wanted you to claim.

Then you are a pro-scum player.

In post 4214, Nero Cain wrote: I'm also agreeing with reinoe that it was silly to wait and claim until you were at l-1 and then not give your final reads.

My reads are out there, just not in a neat format.

In post 4214, Nero Cain wrote:So why'd you target GM?

Gut.
Why shouldn't I have?
Who should I have targeted instead?
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Post Post #4224 (isolation #522) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:24 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4221, Scripten wrote:
Thor:
Agreeing with the sentiment being shown here. If you're a one-shot JKer and you've expended your power already, why wait to claim?

Because an L-1 wagon is more useful for town later for analysis purposes.

In post 4221, Scripten wrote:And why use your power this early in the game?

Because I am town in a large - Thor don't live till later too often.

In post 4221, Scripten wrote:It seems like waiting until at least one scum had flipped would have been better play, but I'm a newbie, so maybe I'm not seeing it.

It's a JK in a limited fashion in a large - it was functionally useless anyway.
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Post Post #4232 (isolation #523) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:43 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4225, Nero Cain wrote:I disagree. Its 3 days till deadline and you were NOT going to claim until intent was declared so I declared intent so you'd claim and town would have the option to do something else if we wished.

Oh, my bad, normally when people play pro-town and offer hammer intent they consider the intent to be offered on a scummy player.
You hedged away from that and went with 'role reveal' aka rolfishing aka a pro-scum move.

In post 4225, Nero Cain wrote:Your biggest townread, who you thought the scum would shoot at.

For that I would have needed a shining town read in a game I had repeatedly been describing as full of poor town play.

@Slandaar - he's a claimed BP. Please let's just have a cop or a weak doc or a gunsmith or something check him first. I would *love* it if he's an actual BP town player and it's a laugh on scum who need to deal with him. Heck, at that point I'll sit around and rile at him until he becomes useful or replaces out. I'm not going to lynch him on a concept of 'cruddy play' on Day 2 with a PR claim sitting on him in a large.

Pick another option.

Hey Dave is right here.
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Post Post #4234 (isolation #524) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:44 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4229, Scripten wrote:
In post 4224, Thor665 wrote:
Because an L-1 wagon is more useful for town later for analysis purposes.


Thor665:
goodmorning, Izariael, reinoe, Flubbernugget, davesaz, Josh_B, Boonskiies, Shiro, Nero Cain(Intent)


Okay, can you give highlights from your wagon for us?

Sure, of course I already have given my opinion on them
How about you go first and then I'll do another immediately thereafter?
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Post Post #4236 (isolation #525) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:45 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4233, Boonskiies wrote:Can you guys pay the Smurf attention at all? I unvoted. Smurf damn ignorance. I don't want Thor lynched. Stop being held up on something completely irrelevant, and actually read what happened.

They did.
It does matter.
It doesn't matter that you unvoted later.
Stop playing poorly and people will stop questioning your sloppy and scummy looking moves.

Who would you like to lynch now?
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Post Post #4238 (isolation #526) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:46 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4235, Boonskiies wrote:Is anyone else but me leaning scum on Nero?

I am.
Not a lot though.
I am also scum on Dave - why don't you vote Dave?
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Post Post #4342 (isolation #527) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:25 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4239, Slandaar wrote:So, lets say we massclaim later down the road near/at lylo. There is no cop or gunsmith or anything like that. We just decided not to lynch scum for however many days because there might be a cop etc who can investigate him?

Even if he was town. They don't even have to deal with him, they can just leave him and laugh as you waste a cop investigate on him etc.

1. I consider it a pretty safe assumption that we have some sort of alignment investigative type role in this game. If we don't then we can discuss Boon at that stage. I oppose his lynch Day 2 on the current case on him because I feel there are multiple people being derpy/scummy in similar manners who are not claimed PRs.

In post 4240, Nero Cain wrote:I've been willing to pl you since d1 and I still don't care if you die but getting you to hurry up and claim is moving the game along.

My bad, that sounds super pro-town when you explain it like that.
:neutral:

In post 4240, Nero Cain wrote:What have I done?

It's more 'what haven't you done'?
To which I would answer - scumhunt and offer a fair spread of reads.

In post 4243, Shiro wrote:ok wait was the hammer fake ???

:neutral:

In post 4243, Shiro wrote:Thor can you tell exactly what you found scummy on dave ? HIs first conv with you when he voted you was Smurfy and made no sense whatsoever is that the reason ?

Go back a bit, there was a point where I finally got him to state his case on me. His case made no sense at all and did not show any awareness that he had read the game, and I pointed this out to him.
He then went 'aw, shucks - you're right' and unvoted me.
Then, later, he re-voted me.

I had actually mildly town read him for the admission that he was talking out of his backside. But to then re-vote me with no new calls or thoughts? Yeah, he's not scumhunting at all and was just sliding on. It was very scummy. Pair that with pushing a case while (and note that he admits this is true) having no frame of reference or understanding of the case. Who the hell pushes a case they don't understand? Hint: not town.

In post 4244, Josh_B wrote:It didn't have any affect.- unless you feel like a third NK is missing. But even then it's 50/50 on whether or not you blocked her or saved her, so that's null.
The claim has no use at this point other than saying that you're a named townie.

I wasn't aware I had claimed the opposite of any of this.

In post 4247, Scripten wrote:How about we both start now so you don't get derphammered before giving some reads. ;)

I'm not going to be derphammered at this stage, as it would take at least 2 to manage it.
As I said, you do it and then I will.
Surely if you want to see my thoughts you're willing to offer your own - why are you so nervy about this? Just do it and get your question answered.
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Post Post #4347 (isolation #528) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:41 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4256, Boonskiies wrote:Was caught up in the moment. Sorry for actually trying to Smurfing help. I'll go back to doing nothing.

Oh boo-hoo.
Replace out or play the game - stop whining so much that people don't agree with your play.

In post 4279, TierShift wrote:Let's add josh to the shaky category.

I would be most happy with a beastcharizard lynch right now. He is actively not trying to contribute.
VOTE: beast

I so hope gm somehow confirms thor's claim s we can flashwagon this

Where the heck was this activity and decision even 24 hours ago and why the sudden shift to Beast?

In post 4290, T S O wrote:I would be up for a Nero Cain lynch on policy basis alone.

Not sure about Boon though.

And why are you suddenly here now with opinions and willingness to vote when I've been yelling at you for three days straight about the same?

In post 4297, The Fonz wrote:Also, Thor: make a smurfing case.

I did - what part of it confuses you?

In post 4302, The Fonz wrote:(If Boon survives today, I will not be voting for him later on barring the aforementioned awesome case).

So basically you barely buy into the reason for your vote in any case.
Meh.
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Post Post #4348 (isolation #529) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:42 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4345, Shiro wrote:@Thor Yea I remember you saying that scum is unlikly to admit mistake in such manner or something along those lines. He then voted GM and then revoted you. It was kinda odd

Expand on what you mean by 'odd'.

Because I am calling it straight up scummy.
What's your read?

In post 4344, Izariael wrote:Ehhh... I'll get behind this. He's had enough grace period to pull something together and has procured nothing.

VOTE: beastcharizard

:neutral:
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Post Post #4391 (isolation #530) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 5:13 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4349, Shiro wrote:Sure by odd I mean the fact that he claimed he suppodly voted GM to make you push a case and test you to see how legit you were. It seemed like a fake reason to put his vote back on you without having to explain how bad his case was(since he had a new reason now)

So why is he less of a scumread than Beast?

In post 4351, Scripten wrote:
Thor665:
goodmorning, Izariael, reinoe, Flubbernugget, davesaz, Josh_B, Boonskiies, Shiro, Nero Cain(Intent)


If Thor is town:
- davesaz, Josh_B, and Boonskiies are in the prime scum slots on a wagon (If those slots are similar to smaller games.)
- Nero Cain's push for Thor to claim and immediate backing off is a little suspicious. Reads like rolefishing rather than pushing the game state.
- Goodmorning is likely scum, since she started the wagon, but hasn't pushed it nearly as hard as others on it.

[snip]

Thor? Your turn, if you would please.

In post 3493, Thor665 wrote:
In post 3490, AxleGreaser wrote:goodmorning, [
Muffin
]
TierShift
, Izariael reinoe
Flubbernugget davesaz garmr

My thoughts.

The above still holds except I drop my town read on Dave for pushing a case while not understanding it and then hopping back on for no apparent reason after realizing he was pushing a case while not understanding it.

Of the new names; Boonskiies, Shiro, Nero Cain
I think Boon is a derp who I won't support lynching today, Shiro is...meh, townish, Nero is scummy.
My reads on the above three were already quite clear in the thread already.
Shockingly my wagon was highly stagnant.
Glad to have enlightened you.

In post 4374, Nero Cain wrote:I AGREE! but like, you refusing to claim until there was intent on you is stalling.

I was trying to push people to put me to L-1 for days.
That is - i was pushing people to advance the wagon enough so I could get the claim out of the way - forcing both wagon accontability *and* a claim.
That is BLATANTLY THE OPPOSITE OF STALLING.
So, yeah, what's your issue with my stall specifically?

In post 4374, Nero Cain wrote:TOWN reading me yesterday. So what has changed?

Well...in the over 2,000 posts since I last indicated you were a town read you decided to drop off the face of the map and then come back with a really scummy rolefishing bit of pro-scum play, and that didn't sit well with me.
Yeah, shocking reversal from me, really. Pretty amazing that I could possibly change my mind so suddenly and strangely.
:neutral:

In post 4377, reinoe wrote:Compare that to all the discrediting coming from thor earlier this DP. That Smurf was not town.

You kind of keep latching on to this.
We have played gams where I was town.
Are you honestly claiming I don't "discredit" like that when town? I don't think there's even remote support for that stance.
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Post Post #4392 (isolation #531) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 5:14 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4390, Nero Cain wrote:
vote:Thor

Finally remembered that you still found me scummy, eh?
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Post Post #4402 (isolation #532) » Sun Nov 16, 2014 6:37 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4393, Nero Cain wrote:
In post 4391, Thor665 wrote:i was pushing people to advance the wagon enough so I could get the claim out of the way - forcing both wagon accontability *and* a claim.

So...you wanted to get the claim out of the way and so did I but I am some how scummy for wanting the same thing you did?

Yours is the only viable wagon that I support unless an Axle or TSO wagon pops up *hint hint* or if the Josh B wagon grows.

Oooh, I'm sorry, i thought we were talking about my stalling.

Okay, so now you *agree* that I wasn't stalling and that what you were doing was advancing what I was advocating and advancing the game?
Okay good.

The difference was, it's not like I voted myself. I wanted people to vote me because they wished to lynch me.
If you had said 'I find you scummy' then we wouldn't have been having this conversation.
But you said you voted me to force a claim, no more, and no less - and *now* you apparently also find my lynchworthy even though the claim is about as alignment null as a claim can be.
Both reasons are reasons to find you scummy - which I do.

In post 4398, Izariael wrote:I don't understand your reaction given that we were in agreement earlier that the way he's lurking is scummy. Has your opinion on beast changed? I would have thought you of all people would be pleased to see this wagon take traction.

It's more just that, apparently, he's your second top read.
I was pushing him as a potential compromise when I was trying to see if I could get a counter going to myself (I couldn't).
That you leap from top scumread Thor to compromise lurker equates to a :neutral: face, yes.

In post 4401, AxleGreaser wrote:Sorry I missed it
@Thor

When did he say that?

I was actually calling his late vote in at that stage scummy because he "remembered" that he found me scummy.
Either he should have found me scummy for the claim, or for some explanations about the claim and voted me then.
Instead he sort of randomly waited some period of time and then voted me - that's feth weird.
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Post Post #4478 (isolation #533) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:54 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4408, Izariael wrote:Yes. This. Do you remember our earlier conversation? We came to (what I think) was an agreement that his lurking was scummy and yet others were willing to let it slide. However, I said that I was hesitant to support a lynch on him. The reason why is exactly as you said: I felt you were trying to get him going as a counter to yourself. (Which I did not state) Scum and Town-Thor would both have reason to push for the beast lynch, though scum-Thor moreso. The other reason being that I felt his lynch would be far less informative of the overall game state than that of a more active player (which I did state)

:neutral:

In post 4412, AxleGreaser wrote:@Thor so do actually think the dave wagon is a goer?

Hard to say - my wagon is still at L-3 right at this second, and only a tiny fragment of it (reinoe and GM) have actually clarified that they are still okay with their current vote.
Meanwhile most of the rest of the town is likewise doing feth all at this stage.
You can't read that very well - or at least I cannot.

In post 4436, Nero Cain wrote:Thor, who was your second biggest scumread on d1?

Probably Goodmorning.

In post 4469, beastcharizard wrote:I thought someone already hammered.

I will be caught up by day tomorrow for sure and then I can be useful. I promise.

:neutral:
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Post Post #4479 (isolation #534) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:57 am

Post by Thor665 »

For the record, because no one else was apparently willing to read (skim) it and offer a thought.

I found the Axle/Nero thing obnoxious.

That said, though I find Nero's logic derpy (still) I do have to agree with him that Axle was parsing it weirdly when he was making claims about what Nero did or didn't say vis-a-vi suspecting me and the PL derp talk.
That is not a defense of Nero's bad reads towards my slot - but he does have the more valid push in that matter, and in my opinion is basically winning the argument.
Axle was correct though in that Nero chose some creative copy paste to try to prove the point...but ignores that in some of them Nero didn't do that.

I mostly read it as "annoying"

Meh.
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Post Post #4493 (isolation #535) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:16 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4485, reinoe wrote:
In post 4391, Thor665 wrote:

In post 4377, reinoe wrote:Compare that to all the discrediting coming from thor earlier this DP. That Smurf was not town.

You kind of keep latching on to this.
We have played gams where I was town.
Are you honestly claiming I don't "discredit" like that when town? I don't think there's even remote support for that stance.

TBH, I don't think I've ever played with you as town. I'll have to check later.

I look forward to this.

Here is some help, these are quotes by town me in a game you were in with me.

In post 530, Thor665 wrote:Greetings.

So, one or more of the people voting me (that would be Not_Mafia and Majiffy) should really present a brilliant case for why mneumonic was scum that *doesn't* have to do with lurking. Otherwise I'm going to call both the wagon and you derptastic failsacks.

What's the rest of the gamestate besides a pretty lolfail lurker wagon that's about to fall apart?

Here's one where I was talking to you.
In post 548, Thor665 wrote:I claim on hammer intent - not on scummy opportunist demand.

You haven't addressed your slip as requested. Could you do so now? I mean, I know it's freaking you out and you're trying to bully and advance my lynch in desperation now, but, honestly, if you'd like to claim wolf, it would be helpful in allowing me to puzzle out mafia easier.



Tell me again about how I don't attack the quality of cases or actions unless I'm scum.
I look forward to this deep meta knowledge of me you have while admitting that you can't even remember if you've played with me as town.
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Post Post #4495 (isolation #536) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:20 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 620, Thor665 wrote:You are so bad at this right now. If you are town you really need to tone down the pride and pay attention to stuff. If you are scum...well, you should probably fake doing so.

Oh Thor, why do you do all this anti-town attacking of people - clearly it is your scum play. I, Reinoe, know this!
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Post Post #4497 (isolation #537) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:22 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4492, davesaz wrote:I believe that Thor's claim is fake, and he's scum.

I would point out in my meta that I've never fakeclaimed a role except to claim VT.
So, the claim is real - the actual debate is whether I am a scum JKer or a town one.

What's your case on me again?
I know it's none of the earlier stuff because you already admitted to basically making up the value of half of that. So what is the current case? I honestly have no idea.
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Post Post #4498 (isolation #538) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:22 am

Post by Thor665 »

I take back the above, I've also fakeclaimed SK in the past - I do that also.
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Post Post #4499 (isolation #539) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:23 am

Post by Thor665 »

I actually won a game fakeclaiming SK - thought that one would nail me the Scummy that year...no luck.
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Post Post #4503 (isolation #540) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:22 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4502, goodmorning wrote:I really don't like the way Thor is dancing around reading me.

What else do you expect, I am calling you nullish with a scum lean and I support the idea of lynching you for playing so terribly.

You, meanwhile, have tunneled me since Day 1 on a case of 'gut' and done little else than that.

What exactly am I supposed to get a read off of you for? The bad case, the tunnel, or the whine that I haven't read you?
And how much more of a read do you need than 'terrible play - would lynch'?

This is further weird from you.
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Post Post #4508 (isolation #541) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:43 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4504, davesaz wrote:"Have never" as a meta claim is a handy defense the first time you do someting.
"Would never", which you're not saying here, would be trust tell territory for me.
Therefore it proves nothing about this claim.

It does mean that if your case has any obligation for me lying about my role that you would need to justify why you think I would break a meta that I have held for *years* (a meta I hold because I think it is good play) and explain what changed my mind.

If not - then at least just explain how I'm scum who is a 1-shot JKer and work from there.

In post 4504, davesaz wrote:Your overall behavior looks like scum motivation to me. Taking up the majority of D1 with the multiball argument.

I did not do that.

In post 4504, davesaz wrote:The linguistic technicalities -- whether you scum read Muffin for using, or not using, or talking about "quality" (whatever the detail is) the attack
was
connected to the word "quality". And when someone jumps you for that technicality, that person is scum too.

:lol:
No - it doesn't work like that. You are still spouting off about something while making no sense about what was actually said.
Yes, in a made up world where I attacked him in some made up form maybe I'm scum - but if that didn't happen then what the hell is your case?
He attacked me for using the word quality when I never did and I asked him to back up the claim. That was the "attack". It's not really an attack. It also isn't scummy to ask someone to back up something they made up about you - it's actually a normal response and now you're calling it scummy.

In post 4504, davesaz wrote:I think you're the type of player who could plan to get yourself run up to L-1 so that you can make a fake claim and then skate for the rest of the game. That should be flattering, since not many people would have the cajones to try to pull it off. But I believe that's exactly what you're doing.

I probably could do that.
It would literally be a first for me - and I've won praise on my scum game without playing as poorly as that and have explicitly never shown a desire to ever skate on any sort of claim - so I'm not sure why I would decide to do this now.
It actually is the opposite of what I consider both good town and good scum play, so it's kind of weird if that's my plan.

In post 4504, davesaz wrote:I tried to get you to respond specifically to having a magic feeling that GM is scum, and you not only blew it off but actively discouraged it -- then you came right back and claimed that GM was indeed the target of your ability. How convenient that the target of your flake claim is the player I thought you had to mean, from earlier comments.

:neutral:
Whut?

You're claiming you read me as an investigative of some stripe (illogically) that I denied this - and then I revealed that I was not an investigative, and that somehow this is scummy because the target was the same?
No.

In post 4504, davesaz wrote:Why use that ability at all, before we know how many kills to expect?

Because we learn that info Day 3 regardless of which order I do it in - so this is meaningless.

In post 4504, davesaz wrote:If you meant it to be protection

I didn't.

In post 4504, davesaz wrote:The claim can't be real -- a player of your stature would not use an ability this way.

Yeah, apparently I would either randomly wait a day for no gain, or would use it as a protective shot in a game I lacked town reads.
It's silly I didn't do either of those, really - super scummy too.

This case is very empty and haphazardly put together.
Basically i went from not voting to voting due to claiming a PR - a PR claim that is pretty darn neutral in the grand scheme. Even your raised issues are, at best, that you disagree with how I played it. Well...how does that actually make me scum as opposed to someone who plays differently than you? Also, if you think I'm such a brilliant player - why aren't you questioning if maybe it's you who play badly and I'm doing exactly the most solid option play?

The case doesn't make sense.
You're also still pegging me for "tone" while clearly not having read my posts.
That's screwy as hell and I read it as scummy.
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Post Post #4509 (isolation #542) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:46 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4506, goodmorning wrote:
In post 4503, Thor665 wrote:
In post 4502, goodmorning wrote:I really don't like the way Thor is dancing around reading me.

What else do you expect, I am calling you nullish with a scum lean and I support the idea of lynching you for playing so terribly.

You, meanwhile, have tunneled me since Day 1 on a case of 'gut' and done little else than that.

What exactly am I supposed to get a read off of you for? The bad case, the tunnel, or the whine that I haven't read you?
And how much more of a read do you need than 'terrible play - would lynch'?

This is further weird from you.

Again with the misrepping?
1. My case on you has never included gut.
2. My case on you has expanded since D1 and now includes more than tone evidence.
3. I've expressed reads on multiple players and the desire to lynch people who aren't you. That's not really a tunnel any way you look at it.
4. You have yet to point out exactly how my play has been "terrible" or why you find that a "lean Scum". In fact, I don't think you've actually assigned any alignment stance to me until now; you've previously hidden behind "would lynch" which is in no way the same thing.
5. Please answer Nero's question: who
was
your second-place scumread D1?

@Josh: There were 2 kills last Night. This doesn't tell us whether multiball, SK, or Vig, nor does it tell us whether there could be a third killing role which we have not yet seen.

1. Tone = gut - feel free to switch the words, it makes absolutely no difference.
2. "Evidence" is a pretty awkward word to use - the "evidence" is you quoting posts and going 'see! Thor wouldn't do this as town!" Then when I question you on them you get awkward and mumble a lot while clarifying nothing.
3. I look at it as a tunnel, you may feel free to disagree. I don't even care to describe tunneling as scummy - but you have spent so much time locked on your
gut
tone
read that there is basically nothing else to read from you.
4. I have pointed it out many times - you can disagree, but to claim it doesn't exist is a lie or idiocy. "Would lynch" is very much a claim on alignment - and I offered a read on you back on Day 1.
5. I already answered this - thank you for proving you're not reading my posts and instead are emptily attacking me.
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Post Post #4513 (isolation #543) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 8:50 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4510, goodmorning wrote:In that case, it's pretty Smurfing interesting he never said so, eh?

Yeah, I was super secretive about my issue with your play in this game - I should learn to express loathing more clearly in the future.
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Post Post #4517 (isolation #544) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:14 am

Post by Thor665 »

Actually seems to back my statement pretty strongly, really.
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Post Post #4522 (isolation #545) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:40 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4519, goodmorning wrote:
In post 4517, Thor665 wrote:Actually seems to back my statement pretty strongly, really.

"Could be town or scum" is what you say about your second-strongest scumread?

hahahahahahahahahahahaha

You make a lot of mocking noises without actually showcasing that I suggested I had a strong secondary read other than you.
Yeah, sure, I didn't use fire and brimestone to suggest how strong of a read I had on you...I will accept that makes it a weak read.
But, what does that say? That I lacked a strong secondary scumread - no more, no less.

You can write down as much laughter as you want and it still fails to make it scummy.
Oh, and look, on Day 2 when I developed other reads and formed alternate scum cases I advanced them as more desirable than voting you - again, supporting my words with actions.

So, basically, you're whining that I didn't have a better read on your pathetic play.
Sorry, I didn't.

What else?

@TOWN


Tick-tock, tick-tock.

Seriously guys, where the hell do you think we're going right now?
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Post Post #4530 (isolation #546) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 12:10 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4523, goodmorning wrote:@Thor: In a 21 player game, you claim to have lacked a strong secondary scumread. 21 players. Only 1 scumread.

Well, you're already twisting words int hat example so I will re-state; Only 1 strong scumread - yes.
Would you like to repeat it back to me a third time and try to act shocked yet again?

In post 4528, reinoe wrote:@thor...
I played with you when you were scum more recently in mini 1584. You were scum in that game. You'll forgive me for having a better memory of that game since it was more recent. Also I ended my participation in that game with dramatic flair.

So?
I fail to see what that has to do with your stated issue with me and my question about your familiarity with my town play which, as already shown, mirrors the action you're championing as your reason for scumreading me.
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Post Post #4541 (isolation #547) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:22 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4531, goodmorning wrote:Given that I was your second strongest scumread and you never called me Scum, one scumread is the most accurate truth.

Okay - now feel free to advance this from incredulity to a scum case point - I have total faith that you can. [/sarcasm]
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Post Post #4542 (isolation #548) » Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:26 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4532, Flubbernugget wrote:I don't understand the issue with having a gut read on tone.

My issue i that it's hard to read.
GM's issue is that it's wacky that I don't have a clearer read on her. She is also peeved that I called her tone read a gut read instead of a tone read. :roll:
You're not even talking about what either of us are talking about, so...?

In post 4534, Flubbernugget wrote:And why are all these new wagons popping up right before deadline? Because Thor fakeclaimed/halfclaimed?

Lovely.

Maybe you should explain the scum case on me again and direct it at some of the people who aren't buying it.
Or you can stand to the side wringing your hands.
Or you could vote Dave or Nero - do you town read both of them?
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Post Post #4592 (isolation #549) » Tue Nov 18, 2014 5:14 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4550, Nero Cain wrote:Well Thor, you are effectively doing what you did to me in InuYasha. Getting you to claim and move the gamestate forward was the correct play. Not really sure what you think is "scummy" unless you think I'm faking pro-town play which is just lol. Perhaps instead of calling everyone elses play bad you should look at your own.

What do you think I am doing that is 'bad play' specifically?

In post 4551, beastcharizard wrote:I only said game day tomorrow because I thought someone had already hammered.

@Mod - I would like to request force replacement for this slot - it is blatantly not playing the game and I am offended having to "read" someone not playing the game. It is horse-hooey


@Beast - you, as a player of this game, suck.

In post 4568, Nero Cain wrote:Can someone give me the TL:DR case on Dave?

Sure.
In post 4508, Thor665 wrote:This case is very empty and haphazardly put together.
Basically i went from not voting to voting due to claiming a PR - a PR claim that is pretty darn neutral in the grand scheme. Even your raised issues are, at best, that you disagree with how I played it. Well...how does that actually make me scum as opposed to someone who plays differently than you? Also, if you think I'm such a brilliant player - why aren't you questioning if maybe it's you who play badly and I'm doing exactly the most solid option play?

The case doesn't make sense.
You're also still pegging me for "tone" while clearly not having read my posts.
That's screwy as hell and I read it as scummy.
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Post Post #4594 (isolation #550) » Tue Nov 18, 2014 5:41 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4593, AxleGreaser wrote:And that is why every time in a post game chat when Thor says you are bad for misreading him and mislynching him he is quite possibly just full of it

I only say that when I'm town and am being lynched for paranoia reasons/no reasons I'm pretty sure.
Those are bad reasons to lynch me.
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Post Post #4597 (isolation #551) » Tue Nov 18, 2014 9:04 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4595, Nero Cain wrote:
In post 4592, Thor665 wrote:What do you think I am doing that is 'bad play' specifically?

misreading me for 1!!! We had 3 days to deadline. Getting you to claim and move the game along was the correct play. If you want to OMGUS attack me like you did in Inyusa then fine but you are wrong and should stop doing that.

:neutral:
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Post Post #4620 (isolation #552) » Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:36 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4609, TierShift wrote:Dave, you're the leading wagon with <1 day to DL. If you've got a big claim, better claim it now.

I actually do not support this.
I'd rather get it to L-1, at least, for a claim.

In post 4614, goodmorning wrote:I won't vote dave but I would vote Nero or beast.

However, Thor needs lynching.

Hint: Thor isn't happening by any stretch of the imagination now, not even via deadline pressure.
So, y'know, live the life and get your vote in play?

In post 4616, Nero Cain wrote:o Thor. You are arguing that rolefishing is scummy. Why ignore Tier wanting Boon to full claim on d1 and all the players that jumped off of you as soon as you claimed?

1. His claim was theoretically about confirming multiball, and is something he offered as a thought - I can understand wanting that discussed and it is markedly different for voting a non-scum read to force a claim.
2. I do not see what players hopping off of my wagon due to a claim has to do with rolefishing.
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Post Post #4623 (isolation #553) » Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:54 pm

Post by Thor665 »

I agree with Reinoe, he's actually pressuring you on an issue I agree with - it is odd that you went from 'hammer intent - claim' to 'I'll clarify I just wanted to force the claim' to 'Thor is the scummiest player and I'm voting him now'

it was a really gakked up progression and makes no sense.

Beyond that, I fail to understand your point - requesting a claim from someone you intend to lynch barring a claim is not the same as rolefishing. They are different and have different goals. You openly admitted to rolefishing - I don't even understand why you have an issue with me saying that's what you did - you already admitted it was. The only question is whether it was scummy intentioned or not. I find, paired with your follow up actions, that it is scummy.
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Post Post #4695 (isolation #554) » Wed Nov 19, 2014 4:48 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4627, TierShift wrote:Why is everyone always so uptight about claiming before L-1 when close to DL?

Well, I would point out that I alo like to get the first claim with 1-2 weeks until deadline to help avoid that. But there is still a thing called wagon analysis - I'm a fan.

Not a lot of time left, people should probably be making a play for Dave methinks.
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Post Post #4700 (isolation #555) » Wed Nov 19, 2014 5:00 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4696, goodmorning wrote:Scum don't usually like to draw attention to themselves like that

Is this your opinion of Nero scum or generic scum?
Because I know you wouldn't use that as a town tell for me, so...?
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Post Post #4741 (isolation #556) » Sat Nov 22, 2014 5:57 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4740, goodmorning wrote:Oh, and also dave was obvtown so everyone really really needs to stop being in thor's cult of personality or joindate awe or hero worship or whatever the Smurf it is.

Mostly it's that I try to make things happen - people sheep that as opposed to lazy not doing that.
We're also even more likely in multiball at this stage, so unless one of the scumteams grows a brain - the current town losses are more theoretical than practical as an issue for town loss.

Vote: Beast
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Post Post #4751 (isolation #557) » Sun Nov 23, 2014 8:47 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4742, Izariael wrote:Thor, given that Scripten was voting beast at end of day yesterday, why are you still pointing at beast? What about the night events points to beast as scum?

Scripten.
Fonz.
Tier.

I can easily see Tier as a scum shot.
Both Fonz and Scripten strike me as slightly unusual scum shots considering the pushes they made and the attention they had.

Do you think we have a Vig or no?

Also, I am totally interested in your thoughts about Goodmorning - considering I claimed a JK on her Night 1 and we are missing a kill from that night with three tonight. So either we have some limited Vig/limited SK action, or a chance that an unclaimed protective role did something or a chance that I saved GM/prevented her kill action.

Thoughts?
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Post Post #4752 (isolation #558) » Sun Nov 23, 2014 8:47 am

Post by Thor665 »

V/LA - Nov 24-27
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Post Post #4758 (isolation #559) » Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:06 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4753, T S O wrote:wait when did you claim a JK?

Replace out?
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Post Post #4797 (isolation #560) » Mon Nov 24, 2014 3:37 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4774, Boonskiies wrote:@Nero - ^ This is why I think Iz is scum.

Can you clarify that?
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Post Post #4800 (isolation #561) » Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:13 am

Post by Thor665 »

@GM - why do you think we're +1 kill last night from what we were the first night? Do you think Boon was a target? Do you think you were a target? Talk to me.
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Post Post #4943 (isolation #562) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 7:07 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4842, goodmorning wrote:Eminently possible, given Thor's role.

So what I'm doing is a bus then, yeah?

@Beast
@Reinoe

Can both of you tell me why you opted not to target Boon with your investigation?
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Post Post #4944 (isolation #563) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 7:07 am

Post by Thor665 »

I also skipped a few pages there - that was a lot of catchup and I got bored.
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Post Post #4947 (isolation #564) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 7:55 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 3183, reinoe wrote:
In post 3179, TierShift wrote:so...you're assuming boon truthfully claims his role as SK?


If he's already pm'ed the mod and know he's immune to cops sure why not? He's immune to gunsmiths. His BP claim will look legit to rolecops. A SK can last a long time in a large by just being UTR and by claiming BP he can avoid scum kills. My concern is that he claims BP in order to draw a NK. That makes 0 sense even from a VI p.o.v. It's all WIFOM but I want Boon to explain it with an excuse besides "oh yeah I'm a VI lolz". Town BP have every incentive to deliberately draw kills. That's literally a town BP's job. Attempt to draw a NK. Now I'm not sure how someone actually does that but "herp a derp I'm VI lolz" is not one of them.

@Reinoe - what changed your opinion from this point vis-a-vi investigating Boon?
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Post Post #4955 (isolation #565) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:40 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Slandaar - I'm reading that and I don't think it's as clever as you seem to think it is - he would have done the investigation prior to knowing about the three kills - so how is that any sort of catch?

Let's consider what we do know.

Beast is scum for hemming and hawing about multiball after werewolf awareness but prior to claim.
Reinoe is scum because he claimed second.
While we're at it - GM is scum for derping with a vote on me, while also claiming I'm Beast's partner and ignoring that I'm bussing him and that there is a 50/50 shot as scum as opposed to the usual 66/33 with me.

I have to admit, despite the later claim, I am actually leaning reinoe as the less scummy of the either/or pair.
Both are lurksack players and all, and both claims have some oddness, but I think Beast's has an actual hole while Reinoe's just has an odd coincidence.

Your thoughts?
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Post Post #4956 (isolation #566) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:46 am

Post by Thor665 »

Actually, on re-read Beasts' claim and actions seem to line up better than I had recalled.

@Slandaar - different question. Go read Beast, and don't just skim him like I was doing.
Then pay attention to GM's derp responses to him.

If Reinoe flips scum would you help me lulz lynch GM immediately thereafter?
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Post Post #4957 (isolation #567) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:02 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4839, goodmorning wrote:I don't believe you either, though if either of you is one it's definitely not beast.

I think this should be expanded on.
Wow us GM.
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Post Post #4960 (isolation #568) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:32 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4958, reinoe wrote:
In post 4956, Thor665 wrote:Actually, on re-read Beasts' claim and actions seem to line up better than I had recalled

I find that nothing he's said lines up. For example he's claiming that the reason he found me suspicious is that I asked someone "who's town". However that's a similar question he asked when replaced into the game. And he never followed up and interrogated me about it.

And lately he's been saying that he was only been pretending to lurk to stay under the radar, but he's been caught active lurking and posting right after someone makes an accusation at him.

Please describe why, as scum, he would claim a false result on you at a point where he didn't even really look to be in that much risk of being lynched and at a point in the game where any non-Werewolf faction (which, by definition you claim to know exists) would have just been given a leg up on the wolves, or, if he's a wolf, had just lost a member and was down on the scorecards.

The scum plan literally is 'I'mma screw over my slot to deal with the threat of Reinoe!'
And the only way that works is if he's a two shot role cop or something. I dunno, if they have daytalk maybe he's the chosen sacrifice - but, still - it's a sacrifice play. Why do you think he did it?

GM can try to field that one too from within her cloud of wonders.
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Post Post #4961 (isolation #569) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:35 pm

Post by Thor665 »

At the time of claim he was L-5 with three votes on him and multiple wagons at 2 votes.
I actually think i had three votes on me at that stage also, so I don't think he was even the frontrunner.

In unrelated news; The Mod should do more regular VCs.
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Post Post #4971 (isolation #570) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 2:05 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4970, beastcharizard wrote:If I am lynched for some dumb reason, yall are going to flash lynch Reinoe tomorrow right?

If you flip even night cop - clearly yes.
If not - clearly no.

Why even ask this?
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Post Post #4973 (isolation #571) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 2:18 pm

Post by Thor665 »

That one makes more sense to me than this one.
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Post Post #4981 (isolation #572) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 3:22 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4974, beastcharizard wrote:Because I am upset that reinoe isn't lynched yet. I don't care if I am taken down first, I just need a guarantee that reinoe is going down with me.

Wow, it's almost as though being an utter lurksack for an entire phase destroys your credibility enough that you are having to resort to this in fear of a claimed cop result on Day 2 not going through?
I will sit here with (vain) hope that this translates to an improvement in your play moving forward.

In post 4980, Boonskiies wrote:(I fully accept that toDay's lynch is either Reinoe or Beast, and I will join back on the wagon when I make a decision.)

:neutral:
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Post Post #4983 (isolation #573) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 3:47 pm

Post by Thor665 »

On the presumption that you are town - it was only not a complete failure because you drew a PR and pegged your shot right - and even then you were still obligated to claim to even get traction on your wagon because you had no ability to drive a wagon without said claim.

And this even ignores other ways you could have played it - but, meh, I think you could have done a lot better sans 'yay lurkage!' as an intentional plan, yes.
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Post Post #4990 (isolation #574) » Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:12 pm

Post by Thor665 »

@Beast - I will say I'm curious why you haven't engaged on this guilty/not guilty v. mafia/not mafia matrix.

Why doun't you clarify your role for us as specifically as you can?
What was your specific result?
What does your role say/not say as regards your ability to detect Werewolf v. Mafia?

I'm mildly confused why I'm the first one pushing for this clarification.
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Post Post #5021 (isolation #575) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 7:08 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 4991, reinoe wrote:This all screamS gambit to me...

Why pick you though? No offense meant - but of all the available people to choose to 1 v 1 with as a gambit risk - why would you be amongst the top three choices?

In post 4993, beastcharizard wrote:It doesn't say anything about detecting mafia or werewolves it just says I choose someone to investigate and get back said results.

Please go, pull up your role PM, re-read the entire thing, and then clarify that this is correct.
What do you detect for? The role PM should say - I am fine if the result is guilty/not guilty but "guilty of what?" should be in the role PM.
Please get me that info.

In post 4994, AxleGreaser wrote:I have been struggling with just how to do it?

Do what I did - ask him a direct question.
It's a secret and magical way of forcing a direct answer.

In post 5001, beastcharizard wrote:Forgot to address this. I only played this way BECAUSE I am a PR. I was trying to preserve my life as long as possible to be able to use my ability.

Show me all the games you got nightkilled Night 1 by scum for being too functional as town and I'll accept that as a valid move on your part.
Otherwise I do not, and consider it poor play.

In post 5007, goodmorning wrote:I've said both of these sentences before:
beast has been utterly useless.
reinoe has made more good points this game than I have.

That fails to address why you think both of them are lying - especially with you then voting neither if you do believe this.
Walk me through that one.

In post 5012, T S O wrote:I had a thought over the night which could be wrong:

Would leaving them both alive do anything? It makes scum waste a nightkill on potentially both of them, and only 1 faction can actually shoot the real Cop, which would then get their teammate quicklynched.

It's a pretty 'meh' plan in my view, it only draws off one scum kill (regardless of whether there will be four or two between here and there) and by the time it sorts it - we could have already had a scum lynch even if picking wrong first, which would be more valuable.

Why do you think it has any value at all as a plan?
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Post Post #5025 (isolation #576) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 8:42 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5023, beastcharizard wrote:It doesn't say guilty for what. It just says I can choose someone and get the stated result. I looked at my role PM when I was first asked to clarify.

So how do you even know guilty = scum then?
Maybe guilty = town. I mean, if it doesn't say, who is to know what it means - right?

@Mod - in a theoretical game with multiple scum factions of differing names, would you, as a mod, be likely to fail to inform a faction cop if he was a faction cop in his role PM?
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Post Post #5026 (isolation #577) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 8:43 am

Post by Thor665 »

It would actually be hillarious if Beast was a Werewolf who was also a Cop.
If that happens I'll even restrain myself from mocking GM's play at the end of this game - otherwise it is open season on that sack of fail.
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Post Post #5027 (isolation #578) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 8:44 am

Post by Thor665 »

Though even if that as the situation, Beast is playing poorly.
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Post Post #5029 (isolation #579) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 8:54 am

Post by Thor665 »

I find his play poor - but the only thing that fails to make sense to me is his description of his role PM.
I am working on that.

If I find it convincing I'll oppose your lynch - otherwise, to my mind, you are for the chop today.

Do you have any other reads you'd like to discuss while I'm working through this? Maybe get out a last reads offering prior to potential death?
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Post Post #5030 (isolation #580) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 8:56 am

Post by Thor665 »

I will admit to doubt vis-a-vi running a sacrifice play to tag an even night cop.
I would feel bad for his scumbuddies if that was what he was doing - of course I feel sympathy for anyone aligned with him in this game...though that applies to a number of players.
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Post Post #5035 (isolation #581) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 9:34 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5025, Thor665 wrote:So how do you even know guilty = scum then?
Maybe guilty = town. I mean, if it doesn't say, who is to know what it means - right?

Hi Beast.
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Post Post #5038 (isolation #582) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 9:46 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5036, beastcharizard wrote:In what universe does guilty mean town?

A universe where the role PM doesn't tell you what 'guilty' means.
Guilty of what?
Maybe you're a gunsmith and only detect guns, it would explain Reinoe's claim and your result - your role PM doesn't seem clear.
I'm glad you're getting some clarification.
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Post Post #5041 (isolation #583) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 10:53 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5039, beastcharizard wrote:I am a pro-gunsmith btw.

I think I would be called a gunsmith if I were one though.

Also, if I got a guilty on reinoe and I am a gunsmith that means...THEY HAVE A FREAKING GUN! What COP has a gun in mafia? Gun = can kill.

You are clearly the opposite of a pro-Gunsmith, because everyone knows that Gunsmiths get positive results on Cops as well as Mafia - that's how that role works.

I'm still waiting for your clarification from the mod.
I need to know what this theoretical "guilty" equates to.
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Post Post #5043 (isolation #584) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 11:30 am

Post by Thor665 »

That is nothing - you should see AP's fakeclaim he ran on me. it literally made no sense at all and was provably wrong. Town mislynched me anyways because town is dumb and sheeps PRs whenever they get the excuse to shut down their brains and not do that painful "thinking" business.

That said - I think Slandaar looks pretty townish and is approaching the situation fairly.
Your secondary in time claim would be silly to take at face value - the only way it even makes sense is if there is a rolecop in Beast's faction, and, frankly, a lynch of you could work for me just to help learn that.
Also, I'm really starting to doubt a suicide play run on you - because that is also required to have you be town (and, heck, the whole rolecop/suicide play applies equally if you're scum, really, so it's a very thin defense you're sitting on)

You being town gives us confirmed BP town in Boonderp though - which is at least amusing as scum lose that easy as pie mislynch.
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Post Post #5046 (isolation #585) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 11:48 am

Post by Thor665 »

As you work on your pro skills - make sure to remember that cop part. it's important.
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Post Post #5049 (isolation #586) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 1:30 pm

Post by Thor665 »

You basically used a lot of words to say very little there.
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Post Post #5052 (isolation #587) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 2:47 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5051, goodmorning wrote:...nooooo, it would be confirmed not-Mafia Boon who could still be SK or WW or whatever.

BP WW? :igmeou: Tell me more about how you think that makes sense.
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Post Post #5055 (isolation #588) » Sat Nov 29, 2014 3:39 pm

Post by Thor665 »

I actually addressed one, and the other is such a long specific longshot it more comfortably falls within another scenario that I also already discussed - and you bringing up both of those considerations has nothing to do with my presented conclusions as neither actually changes the logic I'm using to consider the proper lynch today.
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Post Post #5064 (isolation #589) » Sun Nov 30, 2014 3:04 am

Post by Thor665 »

@Slandaar - you seem wholly bought into the Beast claim, and I can see that angle - that said, what are your thoughts on the specifics of his roleclaim around the guilty/not guilty business and my conversations with him thereupon?
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Post Post #5065 (isolation #590) » Sun Nov 30, 2014 3:04 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5063, T S O wrote:Smurfdamn it I don't even care

Why do you suddenly not care?
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Post Post #5067 (isolation #591) » Sun Nov 30, 2014 3:12 am

Post by Thor665 »

Why not just play better then?
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Post Post #5068 (isolation #592) » Sun Nov 30, 2014 3:12 am

Post by Thor665 »

I am not fond of the new meta trend of hanging a hat on bad play and then acting like it's okay because 'ah-ha, I'm self aware!'
That is like the opposite of making it okay.
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Post Post #5177 (isolation #593) » Mon Dec 01, 2014 3:50 pm

Post by Thor665 »

@Beast - what sort of clarification did you need to ask about in order to say what your 'guilty' means? I mean, obviously paraphrase it to avoid modkill, natch, but what other clarification is there?
Can you describe the boggle?
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Post Post #5196 (isolation #594) » Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:43 am

Post by Thor665 »

Mod has posted since Beast claimed asking of second question.
Continued delay of answer is currently making me fine with my vote where it sits.
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Post Post #5197 (isolation #595) » Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:44 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5181, AxleGreaser wrote:@thor I often find some direct questions to be bad play as they contain implicit information.
Here is direct question that i think gets at what i want to know indirectly.

On number of occasions (games) i have seen you hold the view that needlessly prolonging the day is waste of time and it just lets stuff get clouded/tired/bored/unfocussed/....

In your opinion, Is time being usefully used at the moment or should the day end.
one of these answers is sufficient.
yes day ought end
or
no stuff is happening.

The best way I can answer this within your desired concept is; "no stuff is happening" which grammatically makes my toes curl and also doesn't really express my thoughts, but is a loose concept of my current desires.
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Post Post #5199 (isolation #596) » Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:11 am

Post by Thor665 »

That's a pretty empty post.

@Iz - your vote isn't in play. Discuss why with me?
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Post Post #5202 (isolation #597) » Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:34 am

Post by Thor665 »

How are you evaluating them?
I see no effort in that regard and would love to see you show your work.
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Post Post #5209 (isolation #598) » Tue Dec 02, 2014 6:32 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5204, AxleGreaser wrote:I dont regard Reinoes fake claim as automagically synonymous with scum. What should town with fake red check on them do? Even if that is what you claim town ought do, what do you think Reinoe would do?

:neutral:

@Beast - so you're saying you would get a 'guilty' on a Werewolf?
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Post Post #5214 (isolation #599) » Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:51 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 5210, goodmorning wrote:
why is thor saying things i agree with????

Shouldn't matter - my tone hasn't changed.

In post 5211, beastcharizard wrote:It is not out of the realm of possibility. From my understanding I am an anti-town cop. Which means I only get not guilty on town. This could still be SB technically.

I want a WTF smilie.
Lacking that, I will use this; :igmeou:

The mod has posted since you last asked for clarification of what you could claim. Did he just tell you to sod off or something?
If not you really ought to be talking us through as much as you can - because your current claim and actions are making my toes curl - and I don't find Reinoe town at all, so a claimed guilty on him *should* be an easy sell on me.
Currently you are not marketing well.

Your next post should be as much of an info dump as you can manage with a goal to be as clear as you can within the confines of the rules.
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