Open 585: Jungle Republic (ended)

[Metalcyanide]

Vote Lalendra

she keeps killing me in games for no good reason

[Metalcyanide]

VOTE: metalcyanide

What not even a joke reason lol

[Metalcyanide]

I know Lalendra irl. I'll tell her to check in

[Metalcyanide]

Ok what's the background story between all you people who know each other so I'm not flying blind

Lalendra and myself have been friends since 8th grade, hang out just about every week etc etc.

Also, I talked to her about not checking in. She said she will post today she's currently at work.

[Metalcyanide]

Hey all sorry for my lack of posts I was with Lalendra all day and my phone doesn't seem to like this site. Also,

Unvote:Lalendra

that was just a D1 joke vote.

So anyways after catching up on things I'm going to side with Ari with wanting to see an explanation from orcinus_theoriginal for his random votes.

Vote:orcinus_theoriginal

[Metalcyanide]

VOTE: UNvote: orcinus_theoriginal aside from missing a post which answered my question his post since then don't seem especially scummy. But I'm having trouble with this 3 team thing so he could still be scum but just hunting the other scum. Who knows at this point.

I would like to see more from people before really coming up with anything definite.

[Metalcyanide]

aside from missing a post which answered my question his post since then don't seem especially scummy.

which post did i miss?

You didn't miss a post, I did and if I saw it I wouldn't of backed Ari on his questioning of your random votes

[Metalcyanide]

Okay, so I guess I should actually partake of this game a bit more than I have been, so here are my thoughts on everyone that I have actually formed an opinion on thus far (if a person isn't listed I haven't gotten a good read on them):
acryon & orcinus_theoriginal: feels like they are on the same team I don't know if that is town, mafia, or wolf but they seem to be on the same page.
Aristophanes: As others have pointed out Ari has just seemed scummy. From playing with him I don't ever recall him being as sloppy with his posts as he has been (who does he think he is me lol).
farstefan - Has this person posted yet? Are they being replaced
Ginko - So far Cheet being Cheet. I really need to learn how to read him better.
Lalendra - Needs to participate. Your 30th birthday was 3 days ago now come on old lady lets go (I'm so dead IRL)

To address some things that were addressed towards me:
I removed my vote from orcinus because I no longer needed the "pressure vote" (as someone called it) and 63 gave me an answer I was looking for why he was just throwing around the random votes
Orcinus you said I'm "self-concerned and not legitimately curious". I am self concerned, I'm not sure who to trust yet and I don't want to be lynched so I can keep playing. I am curious about things but I know the questions to ask, I'm not very good with my wording.
And the reason why I was waiting so long to really post is because I was waiting for some of the people who haven't posted or at least significantly posted to post on the current events, but to keep things moving here you go

So my biggest Scum read is Ari
Acryon has my best town read and to stick with my reasoning above puts Orcinus in the town category as well.
VOTE: Aristophanes

Feel free to ask me anything I missed.

[Metalcyanide]

I'm not sure who to trust yet and I don't want to be lynched so I can keep playing.

How are these two ideas related? How does being careful who you trust lead to you surviving?

How does being careful not lead to surviving longer? I don't want to be voting off town because I sided with mafia or warewolf. And if I do that people will vote for me. At least that makes sense to me.

[Metalcyanide]

@Metal:

acryon & orcinus_theoriginal: feels like they are on the same team I don't know if that is town, mafia, or wolf but they seem to be on the same page.

Acryon has my best town read and to stick with my reasoning above puts Orcinus in the town category as well.

Can you expand on your first quote? While I can understand feeling like a couple of players are possible allies, I'm not sure I get how this can also apply to townies on a game without masons or anything like that. Associative read aside, why is Acryon a town-read to you in the first place?

My town read on Acryon comes more after he and Orc were going back and forth during post 125-127. He had just said prior that he had a town read on Orc but was still mostly disagreeing with someone he has cleared for at least D1.
Acryon and Orc being teammates is from their interactions, they were getting some good discussion from each other instead of the typical accusation and defensive statements I've usually seen.

Can you tell me exactly which of Ari's posts or points are sloppy to you?

Ari seems to be joking around more, his posts just don't read right to me. Sorry I know that's not super helpful but I'm going off the way I'm reading it and it's hard to explain.

[Metalcyanide]

Sorry for lack of posts.

Lyserg seems towny

Neutral on everyone else.

I think Metalcyanide is scummy bandwagoner.

UNVOTE: VystePresident
VOTE: Metalcyanide

Care to expand at all on why Lyserg is town, I'm your scum read, and everyone else is neutral?

[Metalcyanide]

@Mod I've reminded Lalendra to actually post something. She should be posting tonight

[Metalcyanide]

Sorry for my absence I'll fully catch up and respond to everything after work tomorrow (11pm ish EST)

[Metalcyanide]

Lal's only played one game on our site. The "always killing me" was exaggeration from Metal, who knows her irl.

She killed me in two games. Once as a mafia bomb once as the hammer vote. Sorry it was a bit of an exaggeration, she is still new to mafia.

[Metalcyanide]

Care to expand at all on why Lyserg is town, I'm your scum read, and everyone else is neutral?

I think Lyserg is actively scumhunting. You on the other hand seem to jump to whatever popular bandwagon is going. First with orcinus_theoriginal, next with Aristophanes. The reasoning behind your votes amounts to "seems scummy" with no further elaboration. It just seems like someone who wants a fast lynch to me.

A) The orcinus_theoriginal vote was to get the reason for his random votes. I missed a post which if I had seen would of made the vote unneeded.
B) Ari has felt off to me and this being a game of mafia especially in D1 sometimes relies on a gut feeling based off of the past. And I am keeping my vote on him unless someone can convince me otherwise.

But on another note: You have had 4 posts (thank you orcinus_theoriginal) 1)voting for Vyse 2)Saying Lyserg is town / I'm scum 3) voting for me 4) quoted. Why the lack of posts? You've been on the site and commenting on other subjects are you trying to just lurk through D1? Also, are the other people who voted for Ari after me (farside and lal) just looking for a quick lynch? Also, your town read is still voting for Ari what does that say to you? We need some info out of you man

[Metalcyanide]

@Prawneater I read the vote list incorrectly your town read is not voting for Ari, sorry. But we still need more info out of you in general.

[Metalcyanide]

Okay so big post time. But I've decide to rework how I'm looking at everything . So I'm going to post reads and/or question based off of peoples current votes (also @Mod your vote count is wrong prawn is voting for me not Vyste)

People voting for Ari:
West: What is your current thoughts on Ari? Your vote started as a joke, then you later justified it by analyzing his wording (post 102). You also suggested an Ari&myself team, can you elaborate on this more if you still think so. (we are voting for each other as of this post). For everyone else I think West is flying under the radar a bit. Not based on the number of posts but the substance. Most posts have to do with Ari. I'm leaning slightly towards nontown on West atm.

VysePresident: Well based off Vyse comments so far, real life has apparently prevented him from participating. However, before he left he was also wary of Ari's town and wording. Null read just not enough there right now.

Metalcyanide: I don't belive Ari is playing his typical town game but some of his recent posts have been a return to form. Not sure if that's because he is just more focused or trying to fix tone.

Farside22: I really like post 166. It really sums up his and other peoples vote/suspicion of Ari. He also is pushing for a Lalendra scum read but no vote on her yet, no comments after myself and others confirm she is new to mafia so this may change. My read on Far is null, not enough there for me to theorize on teammates

Quick note: Just to address Lal, myself or others being biased towards friends it won't happen. In a competitive game Lal would sell me out for a nickle just to "beat" me, as for everyone else I've seen them go after each other for the smallest of things. I forget who brought it up but please don't worry about that. So onto

Lalendra: Scum, the scummiest of scum, so scummy the scrubbing bubbles can't get rid of her. Okay but seriously, she is playing a very noob or very elaborate game (damn English major). I've read her posts several times am having trouble following her train of thought. She oddly defends me from Ari by voting for Ari. Justifies the vote more by pointing to West's reasons. Lal, has anything changed for you since Ari has answered your question? Who is your next scum read. My read on lal is noob town atm

Just a side note, this group of voters doesn't fill me with the most confidence. I do believe we are all after a scum player but my vote is most likely is aligned with a mix of town & mafia or wolf players (not both).

People voting for Lal:
Ari: He is voting for her based off of his reaction test that really only she responded to. The post between his "Vote Metal" and his next post were Lal's vote on him and people questioning Lal. So the following doesn't make much sense to me as he had one reaction in a reaction test

Of the responses, I like Lalendra's the least. I actually had a kind of scum inkling on Metal, but this is much better than I expected.
VOTE: Lalendra
She switched so quickly to a scum read on me and her best argument thus far was "West made a good point, I just didn't see it before" which just sounds off to me. I feel like she was just waiting for a good moment to pounce, and I gave it to her.

Anyways my thoughts on Ari I feel like are well documented at this point. Scum read.

Acryon & Orcinus_theoriginal: I'm grouping these guys together because I still think they are working together knowing they are on the same them. One of them basically reminded the other to vote post 219, post 222 and post 223 to try to distance themselves a bit. I know I said town on them earlier but they are still doing more of the same and it's not because they can't conversation out of anyone else. Feels like they are trying to steer the game. Scum team read.

Voting for Glinko:
YYR is easy. Not enough to go off of. Only 2 posts one which he says people aren't giving enough info and votes for Glinko because of reasons I can't see.

It's 530 am and I've been going over each post way longer then I wanted to. I'll finish up on everyone else after I look at some house tomorrow. (people I need to comment on are lyserg, glinko, and prawn)

[Metalcyanide]

@Acryon: No you are not necessarily going after low hanging fruit but at the moment if you wanted to I think there are others to look at. Also the sell me out thing was mostly a joke because Lal doesn't like to lose to me in anything (eg Monopoly and video games). She is a noob to this and I think would try to get me lynched if she thought it would make her look better. There is always the possibility of her just being wrong like our last game.

Also, I'm going to stop with my Lal jokes she is not reacting to them at all and it's just disappointing and I think I may end up confusing people more than I normally do.

[Metalcyanide]

Okay so for the reads I owe sorry for the delay on these I've been distracted by real life:

Lyserg-Zeroz - I'm liking what I've seen from Lyserg. Some good break downs of his thoughts on people and questions towards everyone. Town read

To anwser some of the questions you've asked me: Lal's scum game and town game were read completly differently to me and this is reading like her town game. Who knows maybe she learned some things though. Thats a much of an agruement I have for newbtown on Lal.

Ginko - A little less active than I remember Cheet normally being, don't know if this has to do with him hydraing with Johnny (whos game I can't really recall), otherwise they have had some good posts. town lean I guess I've never been able to read Cheet in D1.

prawneater - I don't really have a good read on prawn, the posts he has are decent and convey what his current thoughts are but there still isn't a lot there. I've already pointed this out and he acknowladged he is "low content poster" but I would like to see something more significant from him. leaning town based off what we have.

Ginko wrote:What's your general perception of Ari's towngame?

Sorry I thought I've anwsred this already, apperently I'm stupid and haven't. Ari's general town game, as I've seen it, has been that of leader of town and trying to get people to follow him. I haven't been getting that this game. I also don't think town Ari is as bad as he has been.

I'm also going to be V/LA til Monday. I may check in, Lal will let you all know if I have a heart attack and die during the Patriots game.
Yell questions at me that I'm sure I missed. I'll get to them. Bye Bye

[Metalcyanide]

Also, what did you mean Ari only got one reaction? West, Orci and I reacted too. Why do you think Lalendra was "defending you" with her reaction to Ari's vote? She even sort of implied that Ari might've been doing a scum-distancing-vote, you two scum buddies 0o0? Also, I'm not sure I get the newbtown read, when I was going through your Lal-read I just really didn't see it concluding with that (I mean, you say things like she's using West reasons to vote, or that she is "oddly defending you"...).

So I think these are the questions I owe you Lyserg. I swear I've gone to answer these like 10 times and only to get distracted but anyways:
Basically after Ari made the Metal vote the post between that and his next post were Lal's vote on him and people questioning and talking about Lal's vote on Ari. Looking back it only really looks like Orc made a mention of Ari's vote post 176.

they figured out Ari and I are scum buddies , no but seriously if Ari was going for a reaction vote his vote could really only be on me since I was the latest person to vote for him and his reasoning was I jumped on a bandwagon.

This should answer Farsides question from post 295
My noobtown read on Lal comes from playing with her while she has been in both roles. When she was mafia she tried to stay focused on just certain people and follow a trend and when she was town she was kind of all over the place. She has seemed to be all over the place here thus explaining my noobtown vote.

[Metalcyanide]

@orcinus/acryon/metalcyanide would you mind posting your town/scum lists?

Scum lean:
Aristophanes
acryon / orcinus_theoriginal
West9

Null:
Lalendra
farside22
Ginko
prawneater
VysePresident

Town:
Lyserg-Zeroz
Metalcyanide

Unknown:
YYR

[Metalcyanide]

they figured out Ari and I are scum buddies , no but seriously if Ari was going for a reaction vote his vote could really only be on me since I was the latest person to vote for him and his reasoning was I jumped on a bandwagon.

Why are you defending Ari? Why are you defending Ari's scumread on you? Why are you using reasoning that doesn't exist anywhere in Ari's ISO? Why are you even answering this question? What the ACTUAL FUCK is this?

I read the scum distancing thing as Ari trying to distance himself from me not Lal and me being scum buddies so let me try that sentance again the way you read it they figured out

Ari

Lal and I are scum buddies

Anyways, who said I was defending Ari. If you haven't noticed I'm still voting for him and have him as my best scum read. The rest of it was just me analyzing his move. Also, I didn't defend his scum read on me I just said he used me as the reaction bait. And I anwsered it because I wanted to.

[Metalcyanide]

(^@Metal: When I asked "you two scumbuddies?" I actually meant Lal and you, but carry on with that discussion).

Sorry, what I wrote was the beggining and end of the discussion. I'm not buddies with anyone.

[Metalcyanide]

@Metal

, didn't you say Lalendra and Acryon were leaning town?
-Cheetory6

Changed my mind on Acryon with post 263
Yes I did say I was leaning town with Lal and I placed her in the wrong list. But honetly whatever on that one null read town read just basically means I'm not interested in her at the moment.

[Metalcyanide]

What do you mean when you say you placed me in the wrong list? Just a typo? Also I think there’s a significant difference between null read and town read.

Yes it was a typo. I don't focus well at 1am (or ever) but ya you ended up in the wrong list. I don't belive you are scum at this time.

Right now in D1 I don't think the differance between null and town is all that important if you have other scum reads. Going forward in the game I should have reads on everyone and a null read will actually be a bad thing.

[Metalcyanide]

End of D1 is 3:00 EST, right?

[Metalcyanide]

That was 7 hours from 8 am though.

[Metalcyanide]

I'm not sure what time zone Honey Bee is posting from though.

[Metalcyanide]

Well that solves that problem.

[Metalcyanide]

Lal is right that wasn't a hammer vote she is still L-1

[Metalcyanide]

Oh missed Farsides vote.......yep, sorry Lal your dead.

[Metalcyanide]

Checking in will post something later tonight

[Metalcyanide]

So Lal was scum and Orc was town......wooo glad I got those reads right

West 9:

In post 377, Metalcyanide wrote:Anyways, who said I was defending Ari. If you haven't noticed I'm still voting for him and have him as my best scum read. The rest of it was just me analyzing his move. Also, I didn't defend his scum read on me I just said he used me as the reaction bait. And I anwsered it because I wanted to.

I think you've played long enough to know about the no-no that is answering questions directed at someone else before they do, so I'm gonna need a real answer: why did you think your insight into Ari's play there was valuable enough to chime in before he answered the question himself?

I anwsered this to add to the game that's it. You should know I'm not really someone who does what he is supposed to do. Sorry if I gave him some kind of out.

Metal was around at the end of yesterday, but instead of pushing the Ari wagon, did jack shit and asked about timezones. I don't like that, especially for someone who went out of their way to say that they didn't think Lalendra was scum.

Yep I was around and I was trying to figure out when the day was going to end by the time we got I figured it out Lal was hammered. Also, I had already made my points about the Ari wagon and I wasn't a huge fan of the other wagons.

West 9:

B) Orci is not from our dumb other site, which feels like a more likely kill from one of Lyserg, Metal, Aristophanes, West, or Young, as they'd be more uncomfortable killing someone that points to them.

Orc being killed does point directly at me as I thought he and Acryon could be a team.

Ginko (Johnny version):

The idea that D2 people would be less likely to kill D2 people is silly.

If anything I would think people would try to kill off the people who know thier play style

Vote: VOTE: Ari because it's still my best read. But other scum reads are West, Vyse and Ginko. I can't see wolf voting for wolf on D1.

[Metalcyanide]

Also glad you feel better Ari and anyone who is in the NorthEast good luck with the blizzard. I'll be at work the next 3 days because of it

[Metalcyanide]

Lyserg and Ari asked me about Acryon. Yes, my opionion of Acrycon has changed since Orc flipped town. It truely looked like thier interactions were teamed based but since Orc could not have known what team Acryon is on the interactions look more innocent. So I'm taking Acryon off my scum list for the time being.

Ari:

Metal again, why would it matter what timezone Honeybee is in??

Yes this was a stupid question on my part and I realized it well after the day ended. It is quite possible the dumbest thing I've asked in a week.

West:

Why do you still have a scumread on me? Are you still thinking that I'm flying under the radar?

No you are no longer under the radar but you are one of the few not to vote for Lal. So as far as I'm concerned a 2 man team wouldn't vote for each other on D1, espically when there was 2 other wagons there was a chance of happening.

[Metalcyanide]

Lyserg:

@Metal: You said you didn't like the two other wagons going on at the time, I get you didn't like the Lal one, but what about the Acryon one Ginko and Vyse tried to start?

Even though I had Acryon on my scum list at the time I was and currently am more on bored with the Ari wagon. Also the Acryon wagon kind of came out of left field so I was a little wary of jumping on bored right then.

Farside:

Metal: did you ever wonder why lal wasn't attacking you? I believe you 2 played 2 games prior to this. If so was lal scum in both, town in both or town and scum?

Lal was scum in her very first game and I called her out on it (she then blew me up because she was a bomb). In her second game she and I were town and she hammered me on D1 because I messed up a play that made me look like scum (I still don't think so but whatever). She didn't attack me in either game of those games so not attacking me here wasn't something I payed attention to. She definitely was acting like her town game againn though, so I think she just used her noobness and my analysis to her to try to keep me off of her. Fooled me this time.

Also West I'm not forcing a scum read. At the time I still thought you were a bit under the radar. You've obviously been more involved since then, your just on the scum list for different reasons.

[Metalcyanide]

@Metal: Like, I can understand liking the Ari wagon more and that Acryon wagon seemed like out of nowhere to you, but I'm more concerned about the fact that you didn't address or voice your thoughts on the points against Acryon at all (or maybe at least on farside's townread on Acryon). The Ari wagon was losing traction in favor of the Lal one, but you didn't really push the Ari one more, nor took note of the alternative wagon on one of your suspects (as opposed to the leading one on one of your townreads). It makes me agree with West's comments on how you were doing nothing and feel like you were being too sideline-y by the end of last phase and not genuinely pursuing your Acryon suspicion.

So I may have seemed sideline-y because I had just gotten to work at the end of the D1 and as has been discussed I was stupid with the time stuff. It's also hard to post with your boss looking over your shoulder.
I was trying to figure out how long I would have to post so I could throw in my 2 cents about the Lal and Acryon wagon but the hammer came down and we found out my reads were wrong so as far as I’m concerned it was a good thing I didn’t get to talk.

[Metalcyanide]

Hey checking in and wow I've seemed to miss alot. I'll catch up and get out a post tonight/early morning.

[Metalcyanide]

Ok so catching up and answering/responding to things that I see.

From Lyserg post 536

@Metal: But you don't have to be mad about it :C, sorry for continuing to harp on this: I think you are referring to your posts starting from 420, right? My impression of sideline-y-ness...sidelineness(?), starts from before those, for example, when Ginko asks you about your change of reads on Acryon would've been a good time to chime in on the Acryon wagon. Also, I didn't realize the mod posts had that cool timer thing until after the dayphase had ended xP... and thou it made me feel really dumb at first, I do echo Ginko's questioning of Ari questioning you on that

.

Wasn't mad about anything and don't worry about harping me someone needs to. Anyways maybe I should have said more but I thought the way I responded to Ginko was okay, I'm going to try to be less sideline y (spell check said that was correct lol) going forward I hate not being a part of the game but damn real life (exception is the Super Bowl I need to watch the Patriots kick ass and celebrate or cry if that doesn't happen)

From Vyse post 542:

Like, for what it's worth, I'm not so sure that the NK was directed at Orc. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I gather TTH has a fairly positive sitewide reputation, and I know from playing with her that she a fairly decent player. This would indicate a veteran, not a D2er.

So you're saying that Orc/TTH was killed because whoever the other wolf is has played with TTH before.....interesting theory

From Farside post 547:

Acryon: who do you see as scum together and why?

I'm looking for ari, ginko and metal to anwser that as well.

I'm still thinking our other wolf is either West, Ginko or Vyse this is entirely based on the voting from D1.

@West

you've brought up you have a problem with this more than anyone else. Why? I making a read based off of the votes how is this "fake and dishonest". I guess you can call it lazy but at the same time you've gotten real upset about it.
For Mafia I'm still aboard the Ari train but may have to put this on hold. YYR could also be since he hasn't been around could be going for a lurking strategy. I liked Acyons arguments about Vyse

I'm going to vote VOTE: West. You being bothered by my reads so much is telling to me.

ninja by Ari need to read that

[Metalcyanide]

That last post from Ari is more the Ari I've come to know. No questions at this time.

[Metalcyanide]

First off: SO... about this prods and V/LAs

Spoiler:

I love you guys, don't leave me

No one is leaving you we just got stuff to do unless you know something we don't

Spoiler:

[Metalcyanide]

Farside:

Metal: why is what west did scummy above everything else.

West has been the only person harping on the fact I put him in my possible wolf list based off the D1 votes. I feel like I didn't make this a secret that he was there only because of it. He has been over reacting to it and I feel like he is trying to just get his name off any scum list.

Lyserg:

@Metal: Metalpls, answer my question about your standing on previous points against Acryon during D1 (or well, at this point you can also tell me about the points about Acryon that are in play right now, considering the wagon and all), I feel like you are avoiding giving any meaningful opinion on him >.<.

Okay so here is everything about Acryon that comes to mind when I think about him so far this game: I have obisously gone back and forth on my read of Acryon, first he was townish, then he was scum, then back to town after the Orc night kill. All of that was based on D1 interactions with Orc, who I misread. They were playing off each other really well and I thought it was possible they were a scum team trying to get town to go in a particular direction. That still could of been the case had Orc not been night killed and revealed as town. Since then I've liked his agruements against Ari, even though I switched my vote. I hope this has anwsered your question.

Farside:

Metal: how did you know lal was gimme?

She's used the name in other nonmafia games before. And I asked her over a text message. Just to be clear we did not discuss any other aspect of the game and that was prior to D1 start.

[Metalcyanide]

Don't know but you are 38.46% done at least

[Metalcyanide]

@Farside so a lot of re-explanation here:

I don't see the logic he is coming from with those changes at all even with Acyron/Orc.

So I'm not sure why you couldn't see my D1 logic on a possible Acryon/Orc team as they were, at least to me, interacting with each other more than anyone else. Post 221-223 really make my argument. I dropped the argument after Orc flipped town.

Next he voted for Orc because Ari asked Orc a question and then Metal has a vague reason to suddenly scum read Ari that he didn't mention prior.

I voted for Orc to get him to explain his random voting with no explanation. I missed a post that did explain it however so I retracted my vote. Then I voted for Ari because of his play.

Then finally my recent West vote is because he has been the only one to care that I put a weak wolf read on him. And he wouldn't drop it even though I had Ari as my vote.

Can you explain your Acryon case? Is it anything more than just him having a town read on me?

Completely unrelated to anything above but something I'm wondering, does anyone have a good read on Prawn. I feel like no one has talked about him at all and he only has 20 posts in the 2 days

Can you explain your Acryon case? Is it anything more than just him having a town read on me?


Completely unrelated to anything above but something I'm wondering, Does anyone have a good read on Prawn. I feel like no one has talked about him at all and he only has 20 posts in the 2 days

[Metalcyanide]

V/LA until Monday. I'll check in if possible but it's going be a busy weekend and I'm already stressing about the Superbowl. Go Patriots!!!!!!!

[Metalcyanide]

West:

lol ok.
Hey, remember last D2 game? With PandoranPsycho? How I "overreacted" to that? That wasn't an isolated incident. It wasn't just because he was fake-claiming a cop read on me. That's how I respond to people to view me as scum for reasons that I don't understand and that they can't back up.
I can understand acryon not really getting that part of my meta. But you don't really have that excuse.

No I don't remeber this I was the first lynch and didn't keep up with the game afterwards.

[Metalcyanide]

Whoops, I forgot that there was another game I didn't play. I meant Kai/Young's game. When gimme bombed you.

I'm going to have to go look back at it. But honestly it's not ringing a bell.

[Metalcyanide]

I also want to know why you'd think I'd care about me not being your "main target"

Sorry this confuses me. I didn't say, or at least mean to infer, that you cared about being my "main taget" which you weren't at the time. All I said was that you were focused on being on my possible wolf list. Someone please let me know if I'm missing something here.

[Metalcyanide]

West:

It's Day 2 and there are two scumteams. That you're relying solely on the votes for your reads and not at all on interactions is sketchy when you consider those two things.

I wasn't focusing on only 1 team at the beginning of the day. I had you, Ginko and Vyse as possible wolfs. I was voting for Ari as I think he is scum as well. I did say I thought he would be mafia along with YYR (now Jordan but that read was based of YYR lurking I need to see more from Jordan to come up with a proper read now).

West:

On the subject, the whole "you didn't vote Lal thing" is pretty dumb, and mischaracterizes my attempts not to put Lal at L-1 at inappropriate times with an attempt to defend her. This interpretation of my actions is completely wrong.

This still falls into the harping on it category . But anyways, I never really talked about your actions or anyone else’s I only brought up the votes. I think people would go back and look at the interactions themselves if they wanted to push any of you. I didn't even have an argument against any of you (aside from the, you didn't vote for Lal thing) until our last few interactions. I was just putting it out there as a possibility.

[Metalcyanide]

Farside:

Metal: who are your scum reads based on game play? And why?
No this does not include the west read.

Best scum reads right now besides West are:
- Ari; he is reading off to me I'm sorry I can't link something significant but my gut won't let me drop it
- Jordan; see below but basically lurking
- Maybe Prawn; he's kinda disappeared D2, I don't like that he just saying Ari is town when others still have questions, he's also done the same with Lyserg.

Farside:

Why is lurking all you have on this?

Because the 3 people who have had the role Jordan is currently in have not said much. I find it highly unlikely that all 3 people would be using a lurking strategy but I find it weird all 3 people haven't talked. So I'm chalking this up to lurking for now until Jordan says more than he has. I also don't like his only "substantial" post was to jump on my wagon and Acryon's wagon but not vote.

Farside:

Metal: why is ari still a scum read?

Gut, and still don't like his play

if ari where to not flip scum who would you look at and why

As much as i currently like him I would have to look at Acryon. He is pushing hard on the Ari wagon.

Metalcyanide wrote:
In post 668, West9 wrote:
I also want to know why you'd think I'd care about me not being your "main target"

West

You said that I kept "harping on the wolfWest read" despite the fact that you had Ari as your vote. This is implying that you think I should have dropped it because I wasn't your main target, which in turn implies that you think I should care that I'm not your main target.

I don't mind being questioned on something so if something strikes you as off I would expect you to ask about it. What is getting me is how much you were bringing it up. Curious, did I not originally not explain myself well or did you just not like what I said?

[Metalcyanide]

@Mod Honey Bee can you please fix the quote in the above post. Should be from Metalcyanide wrote - main target.

Sorry, I can't really tell what you're exactly going for there. I suggest you repost that section fixed if you want to clarify your meaning there. -hb

[Metalcyanide]

@Lyserg I did consider there was more to it. In post 680 I was saying I thought YYR was lurking but he subbed out so I wanted to see more from Jordan. We're almost a full 48 hours since I said that and he has posted the following:

curses

I'll just go into skim mode tonight. Close reading is always a bad idea.

Sometimes I just wanna
get away

So Jordan has been here and has at least had the ability to say something about the game. While I don't know what was happened with YYR or Gliffie I'm leaving my lurking suspicion on Jordan.

[Metalcyanide]

So we need to hear from Jordan, need a replacement for Ginko and now Acryon. This game has slowed down quite a bit

[Metalcyanide]

Feel better soon Acryon

[Metalcyanide]

Lyserg:

@Metal's last response to me: It was one of your last posts about the slot that made me yell at you about the lurkscum thing again (where you say that it's unlikely the 3 would do the same but that it's "weird" or whatever anyways, in that that feels like still using the "triple lurkscum" idea to cast suspicion on the slot without addressing the fact that if two of those got replaced then there's great reason to think that was no scumlurking from Gliff and Young).

Yep I know the triple lurkscum argument doesn't make a ton of sense (has it ever happened?) but what else is there to think of when no one in that slot has said anything. If you want to argue that the others replaced out hence why they didn't post that is fine, but we are on our 3rd person who hasn't talked. So either A) this one is lurking B) he isn't saying anything because that is what his predecessors did C) he is going to replace out or D) he is being a dick.

[Metalcyanide]

@Ari Some quick answers for you:

So, all I have to do is post a wall and all is well?

No but I can still like a post or two especially with the 3 team set up.

Why not just say it was the coding thing

The coding error was just something funny since I almost always screw them up but your wording fells off. I can only say its a gut feeling so many times, sorry.

Also, his read on the first quote says Acryon and Orc are likely on the same team, whether that be Town, Scum, or Werewolves. Why the sudden backpedal?

I don't feel like I backpedaled here I said that Acryon and Orc were most likely the same team. Orc died and was town, so I put Acryon in the town category and chalked up their back and forth together as good banter since Orc could not have known what Acryon is

You've liked some of my posts, yet no change to this gut?

No change on gut, see above why.

I feel like you're just pushing my lynch because it should be an easy one.

I don't feel like you are an easy lynch right now. There are a handful of people that don't like your play but only 2 are voting for you. If it came to a hammer yes I would do it but I don't see the votes heading that way no matter what. If I wanted to push an "easy" lynch I would push Jordan whose slot has just been dead weight to the entire game.

[Metalcyanide]

VOTE: pisskop
I don't like this vote but I dislike no lynch days Sorry pisskop.

[Metalcyanide]

Prod dodging I'll be on late tonight.

[Metalcyanide]

Metal

Why were you Sorry to vote me? Did you think you were hammering?

No I knew I wasn't the hammer but I assumed that you would be killed. I don't think you are scum but I dislike no lynch days. Honestly glad to still see you in the game.

[Metalcyanide]

So the wolf got a nice kill last night but it was probably the best move for him/her. Jordan/YYR/Gliffie haven't really played this game and very few of us began to talk about the slot until late D2. There is no way to trace the kill back to the wolf. The fact that Jordan was mafia is 100% dumb luck imo

[Metalcyanide]

Ari:

Metal
Currently you and I have two votes each. These are based, partially, off of analysis of Young and Jordan's posts.
Why are you not addressing the votes on you or the points brought up, yet still commenting on the kill.

So I reread Gliffie/YYR/Jordan posts. Nothing is to be gained from Gliffie or Jordan imo. Young however seems to try distancing himself from you in a couple posts. Such as:

YYR:

Aristophanes is lynch bait quite frankly

I like the Lalendra wagon because it's not the Ari wagon, and she's scummy.

Because its going to be brought here is my thought on Jordan putting me and Acryon(Pisskop) in the same boat. It means nothing to me, I believe Jordan was just saying things and that he didn't really care about the game up to that point because he knows who the other scum are. So he said that 2 different wagons were okay and left again.

You were pushing the Jordan Trio as scum for lurking in the past. How is it "dumb luck" that they were scum?

I call it dumb luck because from my point of view it was. Aside from my theory that 3 people were scum lurking, which is now a thing I guess, I don't recall anyone else really bringing that slot into question.

Your posts there basically tell us nothing and are active lurking, despite appearing topical. Why no content in them?

[/color]
Not to make excuses but I made my posts after pulling a 10 year old out of an icy river while at work I wanted to get my mind off it by looking at this for 2 seconds.

Pisskop:

For metal, his reads have been fairly superficial and his opinion of Gliffie was such that gliffie wasn't even mentioned until YYR was in, and it took him waffling until 592, and after that quite sparingly.

Gliffie had exactly 3 posts. 1 of which was him asking to be replaced what did you want me to say about him?

[Metalcyanide]

So my spoiler didn't work the long black line to the little black line was supposed to be in a spoiler. sorry about how it looks

[Metalcyanide]

Well, don't I feel like a jerk now!
Good work, Metal! Hope the kid is alright!

So, basically all you got from the Trio was a bit of possible scum distancing with Young and I, and a lack of anything from Jordan in mentioning you and Acryon/Pisskop's lynches being alright?

Do you find me scummy or think we're barking up the wrong tree here?
Do you have a current reads list? I'd be interested to see where your head is at since, from what I can see, I'm your main/only scum lean right now.

Also, I had the same problem with the spoiler tag (luckily previewed first).
You have to use the

Spoiler:

one it seems for it to work.

No reason to feel like a jerk how the hell would you have known. Also the kid seemed okay. He was responsive just really cold when they took him to the hospital. He was lucky he didn't go all the way under and there were people around to help. These snow banks have been the death of people in MA we really need to get rid of them.

Anyways, back to the game and less depressing stuff. Ya the trio held very little for me to read into and really it was YYR that held anything worth reading into.

I think your second 2nd question "do you find me scummy..." is really 2 questions. Yes I do find you scummy still. As far as "barking up the wrong tree" (was this some kind of wolf joke?) I don't think you're the wolf, but do believe you are mafia, so if your asking if the current vote count is getting the wolf yes we are barking up the wrong tree. Asking about scum in general well half the votes are right and they're not the ones on me

My scum list consist of you and West atm. I'm not sure who the 3rd scum could be.

Also, why no vote?
Or are you as unsure where your reads stand as I am?

I thought about throwing a vote down on you in my last post but I'm going to hold it for the moment and let more discussion take place. I hope my reads are right but I feel like anything could be possible.

[Metalcyanide]

@Ari: Yes 3rd scum = wolf or mafia. I'm thinking West as wolf still so more the 2nd mafia than wolf.

If you are town I would still like to take a look at West, town ari doesn't clear him imo. If not west I'll put the names on a dart board and whoever I hit will be who I look into more lol.

I'm heading into work so I'll be back later guys.

[Metalcyanide]

I'm looking back at the game and trying to theorize who the last scum could be. I'll try to have something late tonight/early morning

[Metalcyanide]

So here is what I've come up with for other possible scum:

Vyse: Vyse could be scum

assuming Ari flips mafia

. He does some a bit of distancing himself from Ari early on, defended Ari later, and when there was sizable wagon on Ari in D1 he unvoted.

Cheet (Ginko) - Has been really wishy washy this game. Not sure if due to IRL stuff, the result of being hydra first half of the game or trying to stay under the radar.

Prawn: Another possible scum lurk. 28 total posts in the 3 weeks we've been playing. Does some distancing from Ari as well. An interesting line from post 660 "I find it very hard to come up with a 3-man scum team with Ari on it." I think Prawn could be scum no matter how Ari flips but if Ari flips scum it's more convincing. I find it hard to believe that we would have 2 scum slots just lurking but then again I still can't believe we had one that was a 3 person lurk.

[Metalcyanide]

(Damn it Ari, "9ish" means nothing if I don't know your time zone xD)

I think Ari is on the East Coast. I remembering him complaining about the snow the same time I wanted to
Anyways I'm confident in the Ari lynch and will hammer him after his post tonight.

[Metalcyanide]

Cheet (Ginko) - Has been really wishy washy this game. Not sure if due to IRL stuff, the result of being hydra first half of the game or trying to stay under the radar.

Can you explain what you mean by this? >.>
I'm not really sure if I understand how I've been wishy washy.

Sorry missed this, thanks Lyserg for pointing out a question was asked.

Anyways, Cheet after going back to reread you you have had a lot of null reads, been on & off the Ari wagon more than anyone (by this I mean the number of times you voted/unvoted for him) and you've been okay with a few different lynch options but haven't realled pushed them (aside Ari).

Question to everyone but Cheet. Does anyone agree with that or am I off base?

[Metalcyanide]

Lyserg:

@Metal: The "on and off Ari" point feels kinda exaggerated, wasn't it just the one RVS-ish vote the one he unvoted? I'm feeling his vote on Ari now as a combo of an extension of his vote on D2 and the info provided by the flip. The null reads point is meh if only because I can empathize with that, are you reading that as scummy in general or just from Cheet and how do your own reasons for having lots of nulls D1 and only focusing on Ari and West most of the rest of the game factor into this point when thinking about Cheet's reasons for having nulls?

I guess it was a little exaggerated he (& Johnny) had 4 different votes on D1 (counting the RVS) West, Ari, West and Acryon.

Null reads are not scummy in general, as you said I have my own still and you are one of them. If this was a 2 team gaem I would have you peg as town but there is no way to be 100% sure until a lynch/NK. I'm used to Cheet having more certain reads but I've never been in a multi team game with him. I haven't been only focused on Ari and West, I was also focused on Orc and Acryon (Pisskop) D1, West became a thing D2, Ari has been the constant.

[Metalcyanide]

I still scumread Metal, but you must remember that since this is a 2scumteam game and he is a lurker he has every incentive to push for the werewolf lynch too.

How am I a lurker?

[Metalcyanide]

You aren't as involved in many of the discussions as others. You have more posts than Prawn, but are less town.

I've posted more this game than any other game I've ever played except my very first game but that got weird because everyone stopped talking

[Metalcyanide]

Vote count 2.08

pisskop (4):

prawneater, West9, Aristophanes, Lyserg-Zeroz

Metalcyanide (2):

farside22, pisskop

West9 (1):

Metalcyanide

Aristophanes (1):

Cheetory6

Not voting: VysePresident, ~Jordan`
With 10 alive It takes 6 to lynch. Day ends in: (expired on 2015-02-08 08:07:00)

I have 2 theories going.

Theory 1

The fact that we did not get a lynch yesterday is suspicious.

I don't buy that people simply forgot about it. I believe not hammering pisskop was deliberate anti-town play.

Who would not want to vote pisskop there? His scumpartners of course - ~Jordan`and one other.

We should look very closely at the people not on pisskop's wagon.

pisskop and someone not on his wagon are our remaining scum.

The people not or came late to pisskop's wagon are: farside22, Metalcyanide, Cheetory6, VysePresident

Unfortunately, unless there's some pretty hard bussing, I find it hard to come up with a scumpair for Acryon/pisskop

- farside22 is town

- Cheetory6 is town assuming pisskop is scum, as it is unlikely that Cheetory6 is paired with him based on post 740

- VysePresident is town assuming pisskop is scum, it is unlikely that VysePresident is paired with him based on his D1 vote and push

- Metalcyanide is town assuming pisskop is scum, as Acryon attacked him pretty hard D1

Which leads me to:

Theory 2

If pisskop is not scum and we truly did no lynch by accident, I'd say

West9 or Metal are scum.

In which case there's a West9 or Metal (not both), ~Jordan`, some other dude triscumverate.,
Any thoughts on this?

Theory 1 is interesting.
Cheet and Far why didn't you guys vote for Pisskop? I would ask Vyse but whoever replaces him won't know.

[Metalcyanide]

Proddodge be on later

[Metalcyanide]

Cheet and Far why didn't you guys vote for Pisskop?

Schoolstuff/fell asleep earlier than I thought I would. Zzzzz
Not sure why you're asking this question given that you weren't here either.

I at least got my vote in and a quick explanation for it. I'm not going to fault anyone for RL stuff but it's something that had to be asked..

[Metalcyanide]

Farside:

I wasn't around at the end of the day. I got a bit busy and thought i would be back if needed.

Same thing I said to Cheet, I'm not going to fault you for RL stuff so I guess this question is now useless. Oh well

[Metalcyanide]

I've thought about this for a bit.
I was bothered that ari wasn't around day 2 very much and now that there is pressure he is posting.
Either way I look at it I see metal as scum or wolf so I'm going to go this way.

Vote: metal

Wait so your bothered by how Ari is playing but vote for me? Explain please or am I not understanding?

[Metalcyanide]

@Metal: Active-lurker is a closer definition. I feel like your game is way too on the reactionary side of things (where it is mostly question answering or doing things out of others prodding you to) and it's strengthening the feeling of you being on the sidelines.

I agree, that describes my play style since I started playing mafia to the T. I really need to change it up.

I know it's still basically a prodded response but I'll give my thoughts on Cheet vs Pisskop in a separate post.

[Metalcyanide]

So I was hoping to have more of a post for this but there is nothing I'm seeing that convinces me that Pisskops theory on Cheet is correct. I'm not seeing how you think Cheet is wolf or was coaching Lal at all. The only thing I see is that Lal jumped on a few of his points and he wanted her to get an avatar.

[Metalcyanide]

Well, I think pisskop is scum and that we should start with him.

Care to provide any evidence? A quote, an interaction with someone, or is this just a gut feeling?

[Metalcyanide]

Fair enough.

Got anything on everyone else even if its just more gut reads.

[Metalcyanide]

It was fair game until the 2nd 1 sentence answer. I didn't question it because I do a lot of gut reads myself and he just got here so I was going to give it a pass. The 2nd answer made me hit my head against my desk.

[Metalcyanide]

ABR please expand on both things.

[Metalcyanide]

I don't have a lot of time to explain. I will only be voting ari, metal or pisskop.

Metal having a scum read on acryon and not wanting to vote pisskop makes no sense

I had changed my mind on Acryon and applied that to Pisskop.

[Metalcyanide]

@Metal: What is your read of farside?

Far has seemed okay to me this game. Off the top of my head I can't think of anything scummy I'll take a look later when I'm not at work

[Metalcyanide]

@Metal: What is your read of farside?

Far has seemed okay to me this game. Off the top of my head I can't think of anything scummy I'll take a look later when I'm not at work

So I went back and read up on Far. He's playing a very good game. Lots of interaction & questions, staying consistence with his questions and responses. I have to say that he town, or really really good scum

[Metalcyanide]

Bigger post coming later

Curious about that bigger post if you have the time

[Metalcyanide]

So I was hoping to have more of a post for this but there is nothing I'm seeing that convinces me that Pisskops theory on Cheet is correct. I'm not seeing how you think Cheet is wolf or was coaching Lal at all. The only thing I see is that Lal jumped on a few of his points and he wanted her to get an avatar.

Why so dismissive?

I didn't see anything to the case, I'm open to a scum Cheet (previously mentioned) but this wasn't something that convinced me of it.

So I went back and read up on Far. He's playing a very good game. Lots of interaction & questions, staying consistence with his questions and responses. I have to say that he town, or really really good scum

her

Oops my bad. Sorry Far

[Metalcyanide]

Metal, I feel like we somehow stopped talking about how you were spinning my not voting for Lal as a defense of her so that you could justify your scumread on me. Let's get back on that.

Hey, that reminds me, I still think you did this.

And I still think it's a good theory on why you didn't vote for Lal, along with the rest of the conversation we had that I really don't feel like repeating.

[Metalcyanide]

1003 actually makes the case of Cheet not coaching Lal more for me

Ginko:"Is she really going back against your points if she later admits to this here or do you think she would blatantly backtrack like this?"
Why would anyone point this out if you're scum buddies? Answer you wouldn't, or at least shouldn't.

When did I ever say you defended Lal?

[Metalcyanide]

Mostly a prod dodge here.
I see I'm at L-1
VOTE: Ari because of previously mentioned reasons and the hope you guys come to my side on this. But if you don't see you guys later

[Metalcyanide]

Sorry for being MIA this weekend. Catching up and responding to things in order that I see them

[Metalcyanide]

When did I ever say you defended Lal?

I thought that was your theory about why I didn't vote Lal. That I was trying to defend a wolfmate.

No the whole thing started from me saying you just didn't vote for her and that you were defensive for me listing you with others as the possible wolf.

[Metalcyanide]

Mostly a prod dodge here.
I see I'm at L-1
VOTE: Ari because of previously mentioned reasons and the hope you guys come to my side on this. But if you don't see you guys later

You think that Cheetory is town?

Most likely he is.

[Metalcyanide]

Hmm West wagon. Interesting, unexpected, I like it, and I'm alone on Ari right now. I'm okay with this lynch as much as an Ari lynch so VOTE: West

[Metalcyanide]

I'm okay with this lynch as much as an Ari lynch

Why?

My case for West is his over defensiveness of me putting him on a possible wolf list and the conversations that went on D2 between me and him. Like most everyone else Ari has seemed scummy to me. If we lynch one or the other I would be okay with it.

I'm also looking to actually get a lynch this day cycle so we aren't letting the wolf pick his opponent. I would prefer to get someone I think is scum (mafia Ari or wolf West) instead of going with either a vote I don't like (pisskop D2) or someone I don't have a good read on.

Lets all lynch ABR.

vote: ABR

doesnt take a scientist. Take back our town.

I feel like this could be an opportunistic vote since ABR just got banned. You're my hard town read so please tell us why ABR, over anyone else.

[Metalcyanide]

Sorry, I assumed him getting banned from joining new games meant he would get banned from current games.

[Metalcyanide]

Great job Cheet.

Honey bee, go ahead and release scum chat no prob.