Mini Normal 1707 - Frog Mafia! - GAME OVER - TOWN WIN!

[notscience]

VOTE: singer

[notscience]

I have nothing to tell.

[notscience]

I'm posting this last response to tell you I'm not going into stupid discussions that do nothing but clutter the thread.

If you want to ask me questions about the game thus far, you can do so.

But if you want to do a "Who's on first base" type thing, expect a non-response, and if it persists, expect to be lynched.

[notscience]

I'm not being a smart aleck, I'm telling you how it's going to be.

I voted singer as RVS, which is why I have nothing to tell.

I debated voting Mala, but nah.

[notscience]

Because I vote mala a fair amount already.

And she's going to probably RVS me, so.

[notscience]

PSA: also I know some people quite enjoy RVS.
So when people turn up feel free to just ignore us and get on with erudite RVS votes as per normal.
Well still be here when your done, but do remember its a 10 day cycle so dont dawdle.

Mala what are your thoughts on this post?

[notscience]

I think singer is likely town.

VOTE: mala

Your turn.

[notscience]

I disagree with zakk regarding axle. I dont think malas posted enough to be sure, but I cant argue against his scumread on her.

Veegee might be town.

[notscience]

*insert waffle on mala here because I chose to waffle instead of whiteknight the fuck out of her which I would not get any flak for at all because I'm me*

I'm not sure how I feel about that sonic quote. On the one hand, he's constantly one of the people making the game unmanagable, so the hypocrisy bugs me, but he isn't trying to make it unmanagable here but on the same note, scum-sonic would know by now if he did that shit singer and I would run him into the ground.

[notscience]

Well I sure am giving you a lot of ammunition for a push.

Are you going to keep shooting at me or actually try to push me?

[notscience]

You know, it's possible to reply to multiple things in one post rather than fill the thread.

Just a tip.

Also, @BBT- Veegee is just gut, I like how laid back he sounds.

I liked singer's early probing. It's nothing that will stop the presses, but for the time being it makes me think she's town.

[notscience]

Hey singer, you know who zakk is reminding me of?

You know what solution I have to this dilemma?

[notscience]

Zakk, this is an invitation to calm down the posting.

That's the carrot.

You don't want the stick.

[notscience]

I'm not so much scared of you as I know your 'playstyle' is inherently antitown and is on the fast track out of the site. So, you either change it, or you get lynched! It's that simple.

But you're right, maybe I should drop my bravado, because I forgot the only bravado allowed is based off of your reads!

I'll stop trying to control how other people play, because I forgot only you can do that!

But sure, you think the threat is empty and I don't have the influence?

Keep it up.

[notscience]

Axle are you ESL?

[notscience]

Can you elaborate on your VCA data?

[notscience]

A big part of my scumgame is breaking up TvTs an redirecting them on a third townie.

So maybe that's what scum would do in this instance, but I'm not sure they are as calculating as you anticipate.

[notscience]

Nah.

[notscience]

MS, do I need to warn you too?

[notscience]

I'm rather disappointed.

I expect better baiting from you, MS.

[notscience]

VOTE: Shiro

Let's do this.

[notscience]

Also Mala, I'm rather excited to see zakk try and convince singer I'm scum.

While yes, I think sonic has more experience with me I would expect singer's read to be a bit more reliable as I've talked to her about my approach to the game whereas I've never really had that with ms, but meh.

[notscience]

Spoiler: For zakk

The reason I want to wagon shiro is because I think Axle is town, I think you are town, I think Veegee is town, I think BBT is probably town, I think zakk is sadly town, and I'm okay with a leantown on mala atm.

I'm letting scorpious catch up.

I'm wary of MS.

i'm wary of shadow.

[notscience]

VOTE: nos

Because I didn't see you already had one.

[notscience]

Why should we not lynch you?

[notscience]

I understand that.

But I'm trying to understand why nos thinks this is acceptable behavior.

[notscience]

I think Metal Sonic's town.

I disagree. I think that he looks WAY too unattached to this game. I think it looks like scum-ms who is so used to jumping to the same tactic again and again but KNOWS he can't because we will run him up.

[notscience]

Because he hasn't actually /done/ anything. Like, he's been posting once a day. This level of posting is completely atypical of MS- his activity in saki was better, and even though he was going on about the drinks and whatever, he still had thoughts.

Here literally all he's done is whiteknight you and be snarky, with a side of fluff.

[notscience]

Because I think it's MS-scum unsure of how to perform when he can't spam.

How is it indicative of ms-town?

Like literally all he's done is buddy you and the snarkiness so I don't see why thats remotely town.

[notscience]

I can understand that but it also opens up the avenue for scum-ms to just hide under your wing and absolve himself of any blame for anything.

[notscience]

It's not a high priority read for me, I'm willing to leave it on the backburner for a while, but he is a concern for me.

[notscience]

I'm not sure scum has the reckless indignation nos gave.

[notscience]

That replace out is null.

[notscience]

Because his play here feels much more laid back than it did in 1625.

[notscience]

His posts there sounds a lot more forced versus here they felt more organic.

But sure, I could be scum for townreadig him.

[notscience]

Then why are you scumreading me?

[notscience]

singer, check the list in display posts by user.

[notscience]

I think the up arrows denote something he finds town and the down denote something he finds scummy.

[notscience]

I've thought their play to be pretty protown. I know they had a scumread of you, and I don't remember the current status of that read, but beyond that my memory is not giving me anything and I doubt an ISO would change anything by itself if my initial readthrough of notscience didn't hit my scumdar.

I had an isssue with his playstyle.

Not a scumread.

[notscience]

If you really want people to consider your stance on me, you might want to try convincing them that you aren't just butthurt I called your playstyle antitown.

[notscience]

I think Mala is town.

This is good.

[notscience]

I am catching up shortly.

[notscience]

I find them more similar than you do, but I can see where you're coming from. My main concern would be MS just slipping by at this point by just sheeping Mala and not providing any real content.

He's sheeping singer, not mala.

However if someone LOl hammers and deprives me of twilight (where i expect will have things to say)(on the off chance)
lynch their scummy arse tomorrow...

Do you expect to be killed early?

Can you talk about these reads please?

Veegee is primarily gut based off of experience with him.

I liked your early push on him, I don't think I could see scum-BBT going for lowhanging fruit this early in the game.

Singer's early approach to the game felt town.

MS I've talked about.

Shadow's push on Veegee is really lame.

I don't get it.

Why are you not voting MS or Shaddow?

I don't remember why I didn't vote them tbh.

[notscience]

I think I'm going to

VOTE: Mala

[notscience]

I think it's Mala/MS/someone.

[notscience]

All hail queen singer!

Oh ffs, are you fucking scum?

I think it's Mala/MS/someone.

[notscience]

Hey Singer, can we swing the wagon on mala or MS instead?

I'll elaborate on them in a bit.

[notscience]

A lot of the reason for my mala vote is based on her play this game being centered on why people are scumreading her and trying to subvert that. I read through her ISO a few times before I voted her because I wasn't going to make this push unless I was fully confident.

She immediately tries to shaft blame on me when I push her. All game its been "Why are youscumreading me" to the point where it feels like that's allthat matters to her.

MS is doing nothing and mala's trajectory on him goes from a weak townread to a soft bus that just sits wrong with me (granted preflip associatives are bad, but ms isn't exactly a shining pinnacle of town)

I want a Mala lynch today and while I understand you really want Max dead I feel confident in Mala flipping scum.

She's going to have a flip out response to this post.

[notscience]

I don't know.

You know I was following it and I wouldn't be trying to start something on my own if I wasn't confident in it, especially if it's on someone like Mala.

The reason I really want Mala or MS is because I'm worried you die tonight, I probably won't be able to get one of them lynched tomorrow without the other's flip.

Maybe max is the third scum, but right now this is the course I feel is the best.

[notscience]

I'm just more confident in a Mala scumflip. If I have to I'll settle, but.

[notscience]

That sure sounds a lot more tense than you did in 1674.

[notscience]

Yeah, Notty...I'm actually not really liking trying to get a new wagon that has support but is still far inferior to either Max or VeeGee at this point.

I'm not voting Veegee.

The more mala responds the more confident I am she's scum.

Like this is kinda what she does as scum.

[notscience]

Singer, do you not see what she's doing

"BUT THEY ARE SOOOOOOO USELESS GET THEM INSTEAD"

[notscience]

So, what's your stance on me now?

[notscience]

Hypocrisy isn't a scumtell.

pedit-

Are you sure that my flip wasn't just convenient based on catching up? What changed your mind?

What about my push is crap? Are you not playing overly defensive and flipping out, demanding reasons when people scumread you?

pedit-

SINGER

[notscience]

Except there it was a more gradual buildup in response to a tunnel. Here, its snap-panic because that read blindsided you.

But I'm sure you don't try to call past games to discredit or make people change their scumread on you as scum, either.

pedit-

VOTE: Max

But tomorrow is Mala.

[notscience]

Axle, zakk isn't scum.

The way he responded to me bruising his pride was town as fuck.

[notscience]

Rather, why does scum-zakk keep repeatedly pushing me when I'm a non-popular wagon, when it is blatantly obvious that his pride is bruised. As scum he can just use that as a copout to slink off somewhere.

[notscience]

Also, I'd like to note that I preemptively called her flip out on me.

[notscience]

Add in MS and that's mine.

[notscience]

You may read scum really well but your not reading me too well. Im not agreeing to disagree, because you have been winning?

She doesn't want to fill up the thread with meaningless arguments. You aren't on her shortlist. She just doesn't want a thread full of stupid TvT arguments.

Hence, agree to disagree.

[notscience]

Also, I'd like to note that I preemptively called her flip out on me.

so i must have missed it, but what is the nature of your relationship?

We're best friends.

[notscience]

VOTE: mala

[notscience]

Dude, no you aren't.

[notscience]

I mean holy fuck you should have, if you were town, called me out on trying to start a wagon on you at the end of the day as a coubterwagon to confirmed scum. But you didn't. Youre just trying to make me ignore you and leave you alone because I'm onto you.

[notscience]

Her reaction was more "it isn't feasible" and "dont lynch me over these lurkers" which was abyssmal.

Like there's no "why is he making this push on me" its "this push on me is bad and blahblahblah"

I can understand that hammer, and it definitely could be "I'm just going to quickhammer for towncred" after a quick discussion in the pt. I can understand the expressed sentiment at the end of the day too though.

Pedit
Except im not.

[notscience]

This post is not an unvote.

[notscience]

I've explained why mala is scum.

Dont act like I haven't.

[notscience]

You know who doesn't insult your play, who does in fact know you and how you play,who doesn't dismiss you every time you make a comment, who is always willing to work with you if you're town, yet you act unchilled every time I cast a skeptical eye your way?

[notscience]

...

[notscience]

You could try to quantify some of those stances so it doesn't look like you just RNG'd a bunch of random reads to call it a day?

[notscience]

^

[notscience]

why is Mala town?

Don't give me the lurker bs.

[notscience]

Do tell, what did you hope to accomplish with the capslock rage?

And if my reasons are shit, you should have no issue refuting them? Yet you didn't seem to comment on them once, the entire game.

Are you magically hoping that I see your caps lock rage and know the fault in my ways?

[notscience]

Wow, consider me convinced!

[notscience]

You aren't trying to convince me, all you've said is that she lurks as scum and isn't lurking here and that's such a huge fucking copout

Guess whose meta used to only be if they lurk they're scum?

Guess who then topped the fucking postcount to break said meta?

The amount she posts isn't as important as what she posts. (that being said I do think hyperlurking and overposting are shitty, but)

[notscience]

Are you fucking kidding me

Her entire iso is "I'm not sure Max will flip scum"

"I'm sheeping singer on this one"

Its not her read it's singers.

[notscience]

Like its just her waffling trying to keep him in the null which I don't understand why you're making it out like this is her stance to scumread her when she very blatantly said it wasn't

[notscience]

Ika there was literally 0 fucking chance of anyone else getting lynched yesterday.

[notscience]

I don't think scum/mala's that stupid to not get the towncred when the lynch was inevitable.

Do you?

[notscience]

Agreeing to disagree then.

Do you have any reason that the points I brought up are wrong other than you disagree with them?

[notscience]

Why is mala town?

[notscience]

Can you elaborate on it for me?

I'm looking back trying to see but it really just feels like a weak distance from Max while Mala blows what he said out of proportion.

[notscience]

Also-

Whoever made the coaching claim, when we have a flipped encryptor, is laughable.

[notscience]

But he wasn't really trying in any way to get her lynched.

Other than the second quote there was no real push on her, its just like "yeah she's kinda scum" and we had a ton of people yesterday having her in the PoE/scumread section of their reads.

So I kinda see what you're saying but at the same time I don't feel confident she's town and I'm worried about everyone just having these magical townreads on her for no apparent reason.

[notscience]

Her approach to the game seems to be "lash out at whoever is scumreading me" like she was worried about being on her back foot from the start. When Zakk engaged her she made an excuse that she lashed out because he was putting her down or something like that and then she's doing the exact same to me who didn't do anything remotely like that once.

It overall feels like she came into this game worrying more about people thinking she's town (see her jumping on everyone for scumreading her). At the end of day 1 when I suggested she get wagoned she blew up because "there are lurkers who are a better lynch than me" rather than try to work with me and say 'hey this is what you are seeing but no its actually this" she just flat out was like "THIS IS AN INSULT THAT YOU WOULD LYNCH ME OVER A LURKER" and that just feels fake. It feels like she's faking emotional outbursts for no apparent reason, and regarding Ika's reason for townreading her, she was hardly scumreading him. And I understand your point that her post to max seems unlikely scum/scum but if she'd done that to other players to and not them that would be a pretty big smoking gun.

[notscience]

See I can't go to meta now because you're you.

It's just the force behind it feels more like she expected to be scumread and its the one thing she cares about this game.

[notscience]

What about Notty lining up my lynch regardless of how Max was flipping?

You mean where I stopped pushing against singer's wagon on the agreement we'd heavily consider you today?

Oh yeah.

[notscience]

@Scorpi: Normally I don't curse that much. I'm just overly sensitive this game because people aren't playing the game, scum has called me a better lynch than a lurker yet people aren't seeing that. The person who knows me the most in this game can't read me correctly and my play has been insulted numerous times by someone who doesn't know me. So yeah calll me sensitive this game because it's frustrating as all hell because it's like pulling teeth to get stuff happening.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 8#p7153878

...

[notscience]

Except I've made it abundantly clear I am in fact reading your posts.

I sat back for the majority of day 1 and let you did your thing.

I think you're scum.

I am going to keep voting you.

[notscience]

For someone accusing me of not reading your posts, you sure pick and choose which posts to freak out at!

I mean, if someone provides something you /can/ lash out at you respond

But if someone provides a reasoned read you blatantly ignorei t and proceed to accuse them of not reading your posts.

Uh huh.

[notscience]

Where has she explained it, ika?

[notscience]

Meta and guts says otherwise bbt

[notscience]

Why are you reading these people the way you are reading them?

meta and guts

[notscience]

So Ika is town reading Mala based on meta and you're scum reading Mala based on meta?

That sounds fun...

Yep.

[notscience]

We aren't though.

He says that mala's town because she isn't lurking and never scumreads her buddies, whereas I say she's scum for doing all of those things I have highlighted repeatedly

[notscience]

For someone accusing me of not reading your posts, you sure pick and choose which posts to freak out at!

I mean, if someone provides something you /can/ lash out at you respond

But if someone provides a reasoned read you blatantly ignorei t and proceed to accuse them of not reading your posts.

Uh huh.

[notscience]

Right, but both cases hinge on meta which is too subjective.

PEdit - Mala, NS can usually read you pretty accurately, no? Why do you think he has got it wrong?

Yes, mine is based on meta, however it also is based on her gameplay this game, totally out of the realm of meta.

Look at it from a purely play based perspective-

She has played blatantly defensive

She lashes out and demands to know why people are scumreading her but when they present reasons she blatantly ignores them

She repeatedly tries to discredit people pushing her

Are these town or scum indicative?

[notscience]

I never onced wavered on the town read on you. I had doubts because of the two days you weren't posting here, but posting on MS.

You're trying to jam another wagon with 2-3 left on the DAy. Not to mention there are a few other people that deserve fire before me hint: the one I'm voting.

Im overly defensive because you know me so I don't exactly know why you are scum reading me. You did this in FG's game too and you got the same reaction out of me, but you are forgetting that game apparently.

Maybe discrediting was the wrong term, which I rescind.

Throwing shade maybe?

Like it's just constantly been "You are wrong" "Knock it off" "You forget this game where I acted this way!" and then 581 seems like it's setting up a discredit or scumread with absolutely 0 follow up

[notscience]

Can I unrescind my discredit bit?

[notscience]

Well that would probably be because people are realizing you're only replying to reasonless accusations.

[notscience]

Also-

Whoever made the coaching claim, when we have a flipped encryptor, is laughable.

That was me

I don't think it's laughable

I used to call out coaching all the time

if he wanted to coach he would have used the pt

[notscience]

we aren't SO's, Zakk.

[notscience]

I say we push him out of a tree.

[notscience]

Bonjour.

[notscience]

Nope I'm just deeply convinced and moved by your meta and guts, I find myself speaking french.

[notscience]

That was rather rude, my apologies.

I disagree vehemently with the "just listen to mala" and was referring to the commercial that says you can't trust what you read over the internet.

[notscience]

Yes, I was and am scumreading Mala hard.

But singer asked me to jump back on the wagon and said we can deal with her today, so I wasn't going to push her again.

[notscience]

Also, I did see her "crumb" but if you look at mini 1674 that I linked earlier- she was a town Joat there, made the same type of claim, only was way more aloof about it. Aka I didn't believe it.

[notscience]

Subject: Mini 1674: A Minimalist Text Adventure (Fire's Out)

Ua ya ya

I'm not likely being lynched this game, but you are welcomed to try.

I'll be off after this 12 shift for the next two days. I just haven't had much time to give to the thread right now but I will then.

There she was a lot more challenging about it, like she actually has this reserved confidence because she knows she's town and knows she's a pr and won't get lynched. Here it looks like her trying to emulate it but not really pulling it off. Overall her play there feels more relaxed than it did here but I don't recall many if any people in that game truly townreading her, but I could be wrong so I'll check tonight.

[notscience]

character assassinate

No.

[notscience]

No.

I'll get to it tomorrow after class.

[notscience]

Mala, OuaT is back.

This was a pleasant surprise for the day.

[notscience]

VOTE: Shiro

Mala's still scum.

[notscience]

hypocrisy isn't a scumtell

And ika's probably town.

[notscience]

I'm not sure scum/ika has that big of a temper regarding my stance on mala.

Plus sans when he was awol sitewie he's been relatively here which is a good sign.

[notscience]

You can't just fakeclaim cop every game.

And being distant isn't always alignment indicative.

[notscience]

I just expect a full readslist when you're caught up.

[notscience]

Can we just hurry up and lynch Shiro after pistachio is caught up?

[notscience]

I just expect a full readslist when you're caught up.

[notscience]

I would love reasonings behind pretty much every read on that list.

[notscience]

Mala's reaction to which wagon was townie and why?

[notscience]

That read doesn't fly with me.

I have-

an RVS vote.

A change in RVS vote after the subject of my RVS vote looked town.

A vote on shiro which arguably fits what you're describing

A vote because I was asked to join a wagon

Another vote that arguably fits that description but then I later provide reasons to

Another vote because I was roped back onto the wagon

And then a vote that I had explained the day before and went into more detail regarding

I don't understand why those two votes stuck out. Especially considering with the second, yes I was looking for a reaction, but it makes no sense how that is scummy. Like I was pretty transparent that I expected her to react a certain way.

[notscience]

Not a single counter wagon. Well, that's worrying.

NS joining Mala on the wagon feels all kinds of wrong. What is going on here...

The day needs to end.

For the same reasons you aren't pushing a wagon, I'm not.

[notscience]

I'm following singer, not her.

[notscience]

I normally wouldn't.

But today needs to end.

[notscience]

This is why we should have lynched you already.

[notscience]

VOTE: Mala

[notscience]

Can we please lynch Mala now?

[notscience]

Mala, BBT.

[notscience]

Singer I know you initially thought mala-town because of the softs- but without said softs do you still think she is? Why?

[notscience]

If you're going to CC do it.

Because Shiro's first post today is calling singer conftown and that looks a lot like what she said happened.

[notscience]

VOTE: shiro

[notscience]

There's really no need to do that.

[notscience]

Really. You just told me to CC it.

Because why would I take the word of the person in my highest scumread slot that a joat claim was a lie?

[notscience]

I would very much like a massclaim.

[notscience]

Well, duh.

[notscience]

VOTE: bbt

[notscience]

Scum just having a backup rolecop is way too weak.

[notscience]

Even backup rolecop and encryptor.

[notscience]

I am not lynching mala.

I want to talk to singer.

[notscience]

Have we totally passed the conclusion the scum-scorpi would target BBT because he was one of the big pushers of him day 2, totally ignoring that mala was assured to target him?

Because that's my conclusion.

[notscience]

I've kind of been reading but I feel like either Scorpious is scum, or scum are no-killing to frame him in order to avoid a confirmed town.

Notty what did you want to talk about?

I don't think Mala's scum, and I'm having a hard time believing Scorpious is, either...

pretty much this.

I'm kinda lost right now.

I don't think scorp-scum is that stupid to try and kill bbt or no kill with a claimed JK that was obviously targetting bbt

Like literally the only person in thsi game I think would be that ballsy as scum is me

But I'm not scum so

[notscience]

No.

[notscience]

Zakk are you a specific backup

[notscience]

[notscience]

Do you think scorp-scum is dumb enough to have targetted bbt yesterday

also whoever said I was conftown- why

[notscience]

Because there's one scum left that can probably be caught by roles?

[notscience]

Maybe I'm also scared that the last scum is smart and is no killing on purpose. :\

Literally the only person in this game who would do tha tis me.

[notscience]

Yes.

[notscience]

Where the fuck have your results been going then

[notscience]

IM DELIRIOUS IM SORRY

[notscience]

I am leaning more pistachio but i will follow you!

[notscience]

Wait pistachio is veegeeslot

Huh.

[notscience]

I don't really see a crumbed innocent in his iso.

[notscience]

I mean like

Earlier.

Like, come into a day and sneak an innocent in there in case you die.

[notscience]

MS, why are you delaying your claim?

VT.

[notscience]

...

Does he think people didn't read yesterday?

[notscience]

VOTE: Shadowwez

[notscience]

UNVOTE:

[notscience]

These nokills are bugging the fuck out of me.

[notscience]

Ika's not scum, Singer's not, Mala's not, zakk's not, MS needs to fullclaim.

[notscience]

VOTE: shadowwez

Wooooooooo blind faith.

[notscience]

shadowez claimed an innocent on me, zakk.

So, unless you think

A) Town-shadowez is a liar

B) THe mod is a bastard who made it 4v9

or

C) I'm a godfather

Why am I in your pool.

[notscience]

I for one think gunsmith/amnesiac cop sounds too OP to both be in the setup, whichi s why I'm voting shadowez.

[notscience]

What do you think fits a role with two investigatives, a jk, and a named townie?

[notscience]

VOTE: ika

[notscience]

VOTE: Zakk

I don't really think he'll flip scum.

[notscience]

I think I hammered with only a few hours left until DL.

[notscience]

baaaaaaaaaaaaaaah.